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Absent fathers...
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By *phrodite OP Woman
over a year ago
(She/ her) in Sensualityland |
"Like all sweeping statements it isn't fair to tar them all with the same brush "
No, I agree with you. But what I found rather disturbing is the fact that absent fathers are linked to the criminal behaviour of drink driving... |
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By *phrodite OP Woman
over a year ago
(She/ her) in Sensualityland |
"what about absent mothers, i know a good few guys who are bringing up their kids as a single parent because the mum did a runner, they doing a very good job of it aswell"
Absolutely... agreed... I am quite bewildered how a top politician can get away with such a statement! |
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By *phrodite OP Woman
over a year ago
(She/ her) in Sensualityland |
Well, I dont like sweeping statements of any kind really.. but what bothered me so much here is the fact that an absent father is automatically assumed to be guilty of something. There are some reasons I can think of where the absent parent has been put in an untenable position (I know a couple myself) and they are absent in order to protect their children. Not ideal but certainly not a always an act of negligence ... one has to see the whole picture I think. |
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By *b430Man
over a year ago
Tayside |
"I suppose its still taboo if a man does a runner rather than the woman.... Its a bold statement to make but then when does politians ever speak to the tune of what we what hear.. "
Not all men do a runner though, some are kept away by the actions of the mother and no matter what the courts say they go against it and get away with it too!   |
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By *phrodite OP Woman
over a year ago
(She/ her) in Sensualityland |
"I suppose its still taboo if a man does a runner rather than the woman.... Its a bold statement to make but then when does politians ever speak to the tune of what we what hear..
Not all men do a runner though, some are kept away by the actions of the mother and no matter what the courts say they go against it and get away with it too! "
Absolutely... that is the case for one of my friends....sad and bitter battle over custody |
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"what about absent mothers, i know a good few guys who are bringing up their kids as a single parent because the mum did a runner, they doing a very good job of it aswell
Absolutely... agreed... I am quite bewildered how a top politician can get away with such a statement! "
to be honest the politicians have used social stigmatisation for years against many sections of society,they see it as a good weapon ,benefit claimants are soap dodging cheats ,drink drivers all fall out the car when you open the door
ohh and all union leaders want to turn us communist and run the country into wrack and ruin or even all tories are uncaring millionaires who dont care about the working man.its just mass stereotyping so we can put them in the box labelled wankers |
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"I suppose its still taboo if a man does a runner rather than the woman.... Its a bold statement to make but then when does politians ever speak to the tune of what we what hear..
Not all men do a runner though, some are kept away by the actions of the mother and no matter what the courts say they go against it and get away with it too! "
That is very true 9 times out of 10 the mother's get the rights in the courts.. I won't go into much detail but not so long ago I was put into a situation where I was going to be a single mother, mother nature took its course on that one but I never hated the man for running away I accepted that the man could not cope with the situation.. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I suppose its still taboo if a man does a runner rather than the woman.... Its a bold statement to make but then when does politians ever speak to the tune of what we what hear.. "
I don't think it's taboo at all: sadly absent fathers are common, absent mothers are less so, but they're there. |
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By *phrodite OP Woman
over a year ago
(She/ her) in Sensualityland |
"what about absent mothers, i know a good few guys who are bringing up their kids as a single parent because the mum did a runner, they doing a very good job of it aswell
Absolutely... agreed... I am quite bewildered how a top politician can get away with such a statement!
to be honest the politicians have used social stigmatisation for years against many sections of society,they see it as a good weapon ,benefit claimants are soap dodging cheats ,drink drivers all fall out the car when you open the door
ohh and all union leaders want to turn us communist and run the country into wrack and ruin or even all tories are uncaring millionaires who dont care about the working man.its just mass stereotyping so we can put them in the box labelled wankers"
really? |
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By *iewMan
over a year ago
Forum Mod Angus & Findhorn |
There are wankers who don't give a stuff about their kids..
then there are heart broken fathers whose lives are devoted to trying to be a part of their kids life.. god bless them.
on the whole Mr Cameron is right..... but as with everything, there are exceptions .......... well except for d*unk drivers...... they are all CU***
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By *phrodite OP Woman
over a year ago
(She/ her) in Sensualityland |
"There are wankers who don't give a stuff about their kids..
then there are heart broken fathers whose lives are devoted to trying to be a part of their kids life.. god bless them.
on the whole Mr Cameron is right..... but as with everything, there are exceptions .......... well except for d*unk drivers...... they are all CU***
"
I agree with you on the subject of drink driving, wholeheartedly - no excuse whatsoever |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"have been likened to drink drivers by David Cameron today. Irrespective of where you are politically... I wonder whether this sweeping statement is very fair...?"
That was my initial reaction. He'd generalised about fathers on Father's Day of all days. His statement should have been celebrating fathers who ARe there for their kids, not condemning those that aren't.
Downing St have commented that his speech was aimed at those men who deliberately do a bunk, not those who don't see their kids through no fault of their own.
It does appear the he stumbles from one gaffe to another and I'm starting to question just who is advising Cameron on his speeches and the timing of them. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I think the thought behind it is fair. It is time that the feckless parents took responsibility for their children. Absent Mothers and Fathers.
Not all absent parents are bad parents. For those who do walk away with not a thought, then they should be tackled.
The sweeping statement he made will win him no favours but there is truth in his madness |
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"have been likened to drink drivers by David Cameron today. Irrespective of where you are politically... I wonder whether this sweeping statement is very fair...?
That was my initial reaction. He'd generalised about fathers on Father's Day of all days. His statement should have been celebrating fathers who ARe there for their kids, not condemning those that aren't.
Downing St have commented that his speech was aimed at those men who deliberately do a bunk, not those who don't see their kids through no fault of their own.
It does appear the he stumbles from one gaffe to another and I'm starting to question just who is advising Cameron on his speeches and the timing of them."
well it used to be the one who was linked to phone tapping government ministers ,celebrities and the royal family on his watch ...but i have no idea who it is now .. |
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Cameron is quite simply a spoilt little rich kid who has no idea how the real world works. Not the only one by the way but as the countries leader he has made some very strange comments. He has shown his true colours with his “calm down dear” and “shut up” comments, amongst others, to anyone who disagrees with him. As for the absent fathers thing im sure there are a thousand reasons, some good some bad, as to why they are absent. As someone happily married for 20 years it’s the kids who will soon be absent when they all leave to start their own journeys. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"well it used to be the one who was linked to phone tapping government ministers ,celebrities and the royal family on his watch ...but i have no idea who it is now .."
Whoever it is needs to be told that his thinking is a tad skewed. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Cameron is quite simply a spoilt little rich kid who has no idea how the real world works. Not the only one by the way but as the countries leader he has made some very strange comments. He has shown his true colours with his “calm down dear” and “shut up” comments, amongst others, to anyone who disagrees with him."
Don't you just love a reasoned discussion. 
Shall we dismiss Brown and his temper tantrums, his throwing stuff about when he didn't get his own way?
Cameron had a severely disabled son, who passed away remember, so I'm sure he's more than in touch with what it is to be a father and I suspect that having lost a dearly beloved son it may well anger him that there are some men who treat fatherhood as though it's a minor inconvenience in their lives.
Much the same way that those families of people killed by drink drivers are scathing about drink drivers, Cameron likened absent (absconded) fathers to drink drivers, and I can understand why he thinks like that. I still question his judgement of saying that on this day of all days though. |
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By *phrodite OP Woman
over a year ago
(She/ her) in Sensualityland |
"Cameron is quite simply a spoilt little rich kid who has no idea how the real world works. Not the only one by the way but as the countries leader he has made some very strange comments. He has shown his true colours with his “calm down dear” and “shut up” comments, amongst others, to anyone who disagrees with him.
Don't you just love a reasoned discussion.
Shall we dismiss Brown and his temper tantrums, his throwing stuff about when he didn't get his own way?
Cameron had a severely disabled son, who passed away remember, so I'm sure he's more than in touch with what it is to be a father and I suspect that having lost a dearly beloved son it may well anger him that there are some men who treat fatherhood as though it's a minor inconvenience in their lives.
Much the same way that those families of people killed by drink drivers are scathing about drink drivers, Cameron likened absent (absconded) fathers to drink drivers, and I can understand why he thinks like that. I still question his judgement of saying that on this day of all days though. "
When I posted this thread I realised it could turn political but I was rather wondering about the human side, and that the sweeping statement (yes, on Father's Day) was quite inappropriate.
I also dont get how the father of a disabled child can cut the benefits to those? I am not being drawn into the debate over Left and Right... just the human side that interests me xx |
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"Cameron is quite simply a spoilt little rich kid who has no idea how the real world works. Not the only one by the way but as the countries leader he has made some very strange comments. He has shown his true colours with his “calm down dear” and “shut up” comments, amongst others, to anyone who disagrees with him.
Don't you just love a reasoned discussion.
Shall we dismiss Brown and his temper tantrums, his throwing stuff about when he didn't get his own way?
Cameron had a severely disabled son, who passed away remember, so I'm sure he's more than in touch with what it is to be a father and I suspect that having lost a dearly beloved son it may well anger him that there are some men who treat fatherhood as though it's a minor inconvenience in their lives.
Much the same way that those families of people killed by drink drivers are scathing about drink drivers, Cameron likened absent (absconded) fathers to drink drivers, and I can understand why he thinks like that. I still question his judgement of saying that on this day of all days though.
When I posted this thread I realised it could turn political but I was rather wondering about the human side, and that the sweeping statement (yes, on Father's Day) was quite inappropriate.
I also dont get how the father of a disabled child can cut the benefits to those? I am not being drawn into the debate over Left and Right... just the human side that interests me xx"
Benefits are being reduced because we as a country have no money as its been sent aboard wasted on crap and spent by the fat cats... |
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My post was not political, when I said Cameron was not the only one I meant on all sides. I still believe when put under pressure he reverts to type and becomes a bully. Im sure there are plenty of absent (absconded was never mentioned) fathers who would love to see their children. |
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" Im sure there are plenty of absent (absconded was never mentioned) fathers who would love to see their children.
Absolutely...that really was my point all along"
More importantly there are a huge number of children who love to see their fathers.
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By *phrodite OP Woman
over a year ago
(She/ her) in Sensualityland |
" Im sure there are plenty of absent (absconded was never mentioned) fathers who would love to see their children.
Absolutely...that really was my point all along
More importantly there are a huge number of children who love to see their fathers.
"
Yes, completely agree there...
and it is sad for the kids as they are invariably not in a position to do anything about it.. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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My absent father (and that of my bro and sis) pretty much ruined 4 people's lives, so yes, just as bad as a d*unk driver who kills someone, in my opinion.
However, my "stepdad", who didn't come into our lives until far too late, was very much loved by all 4 of us, and his stay in our family was far too short (only 12 years). RIP Ron, we love you. |
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A member of my family adores his daughter and is going through a vitriolic divorce where the mother is using the child as a weapon and will not allow him to have any access despite paying 75% of his wages over every month....wicked bitch...
so its not always so clear cut . |
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By *iewMan
over a year ago
Forum Mod Angus & Findhorn |
"A member of my family adores his daughter and is going through a vitriolic divorce where the mother is using the child as a weapon and will not allow him to have any access despite paying 75% of his wages over every month....wicked bitch...
so its not always so clear cut ."
what a bloody shame.. for the kids and him. |
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By *phrodite OP Woman
over a year ago
(She/ her) in Sensualityland |
"A member of my family adores his daughter and is going through a vitriolic divorce where the mother is using the child as a weapon and will not allow him to have any access despite paying 75% of his wages over every month....wicked bitch...
so its not always so clear cut .
what a bloody shame.. for the kids and him."
While the parents sometimes engage ina a bitter power battle.. the kids have no say in this... are the true victims anyway! |
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" Im sure there are plenty of absent (absconded was never mentioned) fathers who would love to see their children.
Absolutely...that really was my point all along
More importantly there are a huge number of children who love to see their fathers.
Yes, completely agree there...
and it is sad for the kids as they are invariably not in a position to do anything about it.."
I have to agree fully with this.. as the children's welfare and interests should always come first..
It's just very unfortunate that I personally have a very distraught daughter today, as her father does not want to know |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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fathers who arent there for their children because a mother has selfishly prevented access shouldnt feel guilty,, but those tossers who just can't be bothered to face up to responsibilities should be castrated 
just my opinion mind |
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"have been likened to drink drivers by David Cameron today. Irrespective of where you are politically... I wonder whether this sweeping statement is very fair...?"
On reflection, it's a little sexist too.
Not all drink drivers are men. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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does any one remember how "fathers for justice" seemed to be always ridiculed for there stunts by press and politicians alike, but would not actually take on board take these men(abcent fathers !?!) just wanted a system that worked that allowed them to see their kids |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Well as a single parent bringing up two children both fathers walked away first walked away when I was 6 months pregnant saw him after my eldest was born showed him a photo and he ripped the photo up in front of me arsehole and the other lives about 5 mins away see him quite often but he dont acknowledge his own daughter if he sees us coming he will cross the street. No csa no nothing they are my girls and they want for nothing my girls my world. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Well as a single parent bringing up two children both fathers walked away first walked away when I was 6 months pregnant saw him after my eldest was born showed him a photo and he ripped the photo up in front of me arsehole and the other lives about 5 mins away see him quite often but he dont acknowledge his own daughter if he sees us coming he will cross the street. No csa no nothing they are my girls and they want for nothing my girls my world."
your girls are clearly better off without their sperm doners xxxxx |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Well as a single parent bringing up two children both fathers walked away first walked away when I was 6 months pregnant saw him after my eldest was born showed him a photo and he ripped the photo up in front of me arsehole and the other lives about 5 mins away see him quite often but he dont acknowledge his own daughter if he sees us coming he will cross the street. No csa no nothing they are my girls and they want for nothing my girls my world.
your girls are clearly better off without their sperm doners xxxxx"
Absolutely and now after all these years I would'nt have it any other way over protective mother talking lol no wonder I am on here looking for nsa lol |
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By *U1966Man
over a year ago
Devon |
I pick my daughter up on a friday evening and take her back to sunday evening every week and still its not enough for me and bastards that can walk away the kids are better off without but the twat cameron cant lump all men in the same boat |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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im an absent parent for reasons of my own and see my kids 3 or 4 times a week but still it not enough but cant live with them but still love them with all my heart and it breaks that i have left them. but no their father does a better job than i could ever do if we were still together with them and him |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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im a single parent have been for 8 yrs mother has no contact whatsoever and although this is a rewarding job its very hard cant understand anybody who refuses contact whatever sex or reason there your kids but this statement is sweeping and not every parent is on 100k plus benifits david cameron is a good parent but has thick blinkers on not sure he put enough thought into this statement but everyone should love an support there kids at whatever level this may be |
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I am not a parent but I do tho.k that more needs to be done about those parents that walk away and don't face up to their responsibilities!
But this has more sides than I can count, what about men who never wanted to have children but got tricked? I guess there is the while it takes 2 to tango line but his choice to be child free was taken away from him without his knowledge.
I know plenty of men who would love to spend time with their children but the mothers think its theory right to use them as a bargaining tool. I think these women should be treated the same as Mr Cameron wants absent fathers to be treated.
There are so many good parents out there and I think we should celebrate these rather than focus on the bad ones x |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I am not a parent but I do tho.k that more needs to be done about those parents that walk away and don't face up to their responsibilities!
But this has more sides than I can count, what about men who never wanted to have children but got tricked? I guess there is the while it takes 2 to tango line but his choice to be child free was taken away from him without his knowledge.
I know plenty of men who would love to spend time with their children but the mothers think its theory right to use them as a bargaining tool. I think these women should be treated the same as Mr Cameron wants absent fathers to be treated.
There are so many good parents out there and I think we should celebrate these rather than focus on the bad ones x "
think by far this is the best all round post on this thread.. nice one evesham!
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I pick my daughter up on a friday evening and take her back to sunday evening every week and still its not enough for me and bastards that can walk away the kids are better off without but the twat cameron cant lump all men in the same boat "
He didn't lump all men in the same boat. I've read the article in the Telegraph and he specifically said 'runaway fathers', but, as usual, the media have twisted what he said and turned it back on him. I posted earlier that I thought he was wrong and based my _iew on what I'd seen on the news and I was wrong because they misrepresented him completely.
Here's what he actually said:
"
"It's high time runaway dads were stigmatised, and the full force of shame was heaped upon them. They should be looked at like drink drivers, people who are beyond the pale.
They need the message rammed home to them, from every part of our culture, that what they're doing is wrong – that leaving single mothers, who do a heroic job against all odds, to fend for themselves simply isn't acceptable."
"
I don't see anywhere in there any refernece to those fathers who do not see there children through no fault of their own but would love to. Maybe he should have acknowledged those guys but I suspect he knew he'd be walking into a political minefield if he did. He chose one issue to talk about and that was runaway fathers who accept no responsibility for their offspring. |
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By *waymanMan
over a year ago
newcastle |
"Cameron is quite simply a spoilt little rich kid who has no idea how the real world works. Not the only one by the way but as the countries leader he has made some very strange comments. He has shown his true colours with his “calm down dear” and “shut up” comments, amongst others, to anyone who disagrees with him.
Don't you just love a reasoned discussion.
Shall we dismiss Brown and his temper tantrums, his throwing stuff about when he didn't get his own way?
Cameron had a severely disabled son, who passed away remember, so I'm sure he's more than in touch with what it is to be a father and I suspect that having lost a dearly beloved son it may well anger him that there are some men who treat fatherhood as though it's a minor inconvenience in their lives.
Much the same way that those families of people killed by drink drivers are scathing about drink drivers, Cameron likened absent (absconded) fathers to drink drivers, and I can understand why he thinks like that. I still question his judgement of saying that on this day of all days though. "
Given the amazing inaccuracies you have come out with in another thread you'd know all about reasoned discussions.
Cameron is trying to create a new breed of scapegoats - it was the last Tory government that visited the abomination that was the CSA upon us in an act of political nastiness dressed up as a child centred solution. Cameron appears to have forgotten everything and learned nothing. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I never bring the fathers up not part of our lives never slag them off either. The door will be left open if they choose to get in touch and hopefully in time my girls can make their own minds up. And I for one have the most amazing girls I could ask for yes its hard sometimes, lonely, heart breaking and yes the hardest job in the world to do solo but I know no differnt. It must be hard when children have parents in their lives then just walk away could not even imagine what goes through the childrens minds. |
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Thumbs up to Erin Pizzey (*) who speaks sense.
Including :
"There are a lot of reasons why [fathers are] not with their children... not least that women won't let them," she said.
.
.
(*) the founder of the first women's refuge, so one would expect to know what she's talking about. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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two sides to every story.
people fall out of love for various reasons and it is not always down to kids.
if i was a father i could no dream of being away from my kids.
having said that i dont think it is easy for anyone bringing up children today.
when a family no longer functions it is the kids who suffer.
dads get maintenance bills and some then do not work so they do not have to part with any earning.
that ends any sort of life they wish to have because they are forever chased for money which they should pay.
mums life ends as some go through depression and just cannot cope on her own.
but its the kids which go without and sometimes sons miss the interaction a dad brings and daughters miss being daddy's little girl.
its just a very sad part of life and i feel for anyone who struggles to bring up children on there own.
it can be heartbreak for mums and dads who for whatever reason are parted from their children.
but harder on the kids growing up without them. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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what a fuckin tit that man is!! think before you speak. mothers and fathers who arnt there..some have good reasons ...some DONT! he makes my fuckin blood boil, with the shit that comes out of his mouth!  |
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"what a fuckin tit that man is!! think before you speak. mothers and fathers who arnt there..some have good reasons ...some DONT! he makes my fuckin blood boil, with the shit that comes out of his mouth! "
so he's not on your christmas card list then  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Given the amazing inaccuracies you have come out with in another thread you'd know all about reasoned discussions."
Care to highlight those inaccuracies so I can correct them. All of them?
"
Cameron is trying to create a new breed of scapegoats - it was the last Tory government that visited the abomination that was the CSA upon us in an act of political nastiness dressed up as a child centred solution. Cameron appears to have forgotten everything and learned nothing."
The CSA was set in 1993, under John Major's premiership, and I'd agree wholeheartedly that it was a govt dept that should never have seen the light of day, so abhorrent that it was in it's relentless pursuit of absent parents (and even parents who were there for their kids). What was most abhorrent of all was that second families lost out to any issue from 1st marriages. Totally unfair and I'm glad it's gone.
It's a shame that Labour took 11 years to do it though. (It was finally abandoned in 2008)
May I suggest that instead of attacking me by making spurious statements about alleged inaccuracies in my posts, that you present some hard facts of your own instead of this ranting that is becoming your trademark.
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By *b430Man
over a year ago
Tayside |
"
It's a shame that Labour took 11 years to do it though. (It was finally abandoned in 2008)
"
The CSA wasn't abandoned in 2008 it is still there doing just as bad a job as it always has done! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"
It's a shame that Labour took 11 years to do it though. (It was finally abandoned in 2008)
The CSA wasn't abandoned in 2008 it is still there doing just as bad a job as it always has done! "
On 1 November 2008 the Child Maintenance and Enforcement Commission took management responsibility for the CSA, effectively replacing the CSA. It may still exist as an entity but it has no real power nor substance anymore. And good riddance to it too. Whether it's replacement/alternative will perform any better is anyone's guess. |
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By *b430Man
over a year ago
Tayside |
"
It's a shame that Labour took 11 years to do it though. (It was finally abandoned in 2008)
The CSA wasn't abandoned in 2008 it is still there doing just as bad a job as it always has done!
On 1 November 2008 the Child Maintenance and Enforcement Commission took management responsibility for the CSA, effectively replacing the CSA. It may still exist as an entity but it has no real power nor substance anymore. And good riddance to it too. Whether it's replacement/alternative will perform any better is anyone's guess."
I think my pay slip every month might say different, oh and the letters I get from them also and lets not forget the letter I received back from the Prime Minister's Office and the subsequent one from the head of the Department of Work & Pensions and ........ nah just lets leave it there; you say it doesn't exist so it can't exist ...... hmmmmmm all those Government Departments are wrong!  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Apologies. My understanding was that the CSA had ceased to function and was replaced by CMEC. Having just visited the CSA website I read the following:
"
The Child Maintenance and Enforcement Commission (The Commission) is a Non-Departmental Public Body that was set up to take responsibility for the child maintenance system in Great Britain. The Commission has responsibility for the statutory maintenance scheme(currently operated by the CSA).
It is expected that a new system for calculating child maintenance will be introduced by the Child Maintenance and Enforcement Commission in 2011. All CSA clients will then be invited to apply to the new scheme or to make a private agreement. It is currently planned this process will take three years.
"
It appears that in three years time the CSA will no longer exist, having been superceded in totality by the CMEC.
Let's hope it's not a case of same service, different name.
I stand corrected. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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perhaps im missing the point of this.. im not interested in money.. my daughter deserves to have a dad in her life.. she wont miss out on the financial side of things, i can provide for her, we get by.
I think its more important to have a relationship with the absent parent rather than some financial contribution. |
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"perhaps im missing the point of this.. im not interested in money.. my daughter deserves to have a dad in her life.. she wont miss out on the financial side of things, i can provide for her, we get by.
I think its more important to have a relationship with the absent parent rather than some financial contribution."
is it though? is it beter to have 2 parents in your life when one makes it obvious they dont want to be or to have one devoted loving parent in your life?
i am lucky, even when my parents split up they both made sure that we saw each of them equally but i know friends who have split from their partners and whilst one of the parents has been keen for their children to see the other parent often they are often let down and dismissed in favour of going out on the lash - how can that be healthy for a child? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"perhaps im missing the point of this.. im not interested in money.. my daughter deserves to have a dad in her life.. she wont miss out on the financial side of things, i can provide for her, we get by.
I think its more important to have a relationship with the absent parent rather than some financial contribution.
is it though? is it beter to have 2 parents in your life when one makes it obvious they dont want to be or to have one devoted loving parent in your life?
i am lucky, even when my parents split up they both made sure that we saw each of them equally but i know friends who have split from their partners and whilst one of the parents has been keen for their children to see the other parent often they are often let down and dismissed in favour of going out on the lash - how can that be healthy for a child?"
my personal frustrations lie with the fact he hasn't even tried.. he is happy to play happy families to his current GF (of 4 months) and her 3 kids but no interest in his own flesh and blood
in 18months he has seen my little one 3 times.. totally about 6 hours
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"perhaps im missing the point of this.. im not interested in money.. my daughter deserves to have a dad in her life.. she wont miss out on the financial side of things, i can provide for her, we get by.
I think its more important to have a relationship with the absent parent rather than some financial contribution.
is it though? is it beter to have 2 parents in your life when one makes it obvious they dont want to be or to have one devoted loving parent in your life?
i am lucky, even when my parents split up they both made sure that we saw each of them equally but i know friends who have split from their partners and whilst one of the parents has been keen for their children to see the other parent often they are often let down and dismissed in favour of going out on the lash - how can that be healthy for a child?"
Yeah! And you turned out normal...  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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My ex left over 3 years ago. In those 3 years he has gotten slowly worse. We arranged between us that he would have every other weekend and 2 evenings a week with the kids.
Six months later he cut out one evening with no explanation. A few months later he cut out the other evening. He then took to cancelling weekends. Now he has cut it to one weekend a month. And even then he cancels a lot of them.
He rarely calls in between visits.
I have even called his new partner and begged her to do speak to him about seeing the kids properly.
In the last 2 months he saw them once. He was supposed to have them for the day. He turned up late and brought them back 40 minutes later.
I have never once in the 3 years refused him access to them. In fact I have often changed arrangements to accomodate him only for him to then let them down.
My boys are only 9 and have started to say they dont want to see him.
My daughter is hitting her teenage years and is now getting to the point where going out with her friends is more important like all other teenagers.
His behaviour is the reason they are starting to not want to see him. When they do see him I have 3 upset kids when he goes which lasts a few days.
To be honest I would rather he just buggered off because he causes more harm than good.
But I won't because then I will be blamed for stopping him seeing them. I will be classed as the devil incarnate.
Fathers that leave should either be in for parenting whole heartedly not just when it suits them.
An before anyone says anything. Yes we were married yes we both wanted children and yes the children were planned. He was not tricked or coerced into having children in any way.
I totally understand what cameron was getting at. Maybe he said it in the wrong way and at the wrong time but I understand the sentiment.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I totally understand what cameron was getting at. Maybe he said it in the wrong way and at the wrong time but I understand the sentiment.
"
I'm glad some of the women Cameron was referring to have come on here and spoken about their experiences. He never mentioned fathers who don't see their kids because the mother refuses to acknowledge access orders.
It gives balance to the usual anti-Tory growlers that always surface on threads like these. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"have been likened to drink drivers by David Cameron today. Irrespective of where you are politically... I wonder whether this sweeping statement is very fair...?"
I do not think it is fair at all.. I worked for a short while with the agency Families need Fathers... and you know how many fathers would give anything to see their kids but the women keep them away.
I think its a disgusting statement if I am honest.
Katie, with her Masters consent..
BTW...Only read first post... and replied to that.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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You should probably read the full article Katie. He only referred to runaway dads, not the sort you worked with. He was right too, those runaway fathers should be stigmatised and forced to provide for their offspring, even if they have no interest in being a part of their lives. |
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By the government I would be classed as an absent father - though I'm far from absent.
2 out of 3 of my kids live with me, the third is being contested still by their mother but wants to live with me.
in the same sweeping statement, she would be an absent mother - but is she to blame for anything??
If anything the government should look at the laws that make absent fathers absent... I had to fight for 3 years to see my kids, and then only succeeded cos their mother wanted somewhere to dump them while she headed to florida for a quickie! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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The problem with mothers not adhering to a court order is that it's very difficult for a court to jail a mother for regular breach of that order. Who'd want to be responsible for taking a mum away from her kids and throwing her into jail?
Cameron's article also placed emphasis on the value of family life but he knew he couldn't create legislation and tax incentives to keep parents together. Some people just don't get on and should separate for the sanity of all and Cameron stated that the govt should be encouraging those people to sort their affairs out privately and not involve organisations like the CSA (soon to be CMEC I should probably add lol).
A perfect example is my 1st wife and I. We have never involved the system in our dealings over our daughter and neither of us would have had it any other way. Regardless of how we felt about each other it wasn't our daughter's fault so why should she be stuck in the middle of it. Sadly, not all warring couples stop to think that the issues between each other are totally separate to the issues surrounding their children. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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i still think chemical castration should be brought in for those parents who just cant be bothered to raise a child...
people who go round sleeping around and then avoiding that persons responsibilities.. makes me sick |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"perhaps im missing the point of this.. im not interested in money.. my daughter deserves to have a dad in her life.. she wont miss out on the financial side of things, i can provide for her, we get by.
I think its more important to have a relationship with the absent parent rather than some financial contribution.
is it though? is it beter to have 2 parents in your life when one makes it obvious they dont want to be or to have one devoted loving parent in your life?
i am lucky, even when my parents split up they both made sure that we saw each of them equally but i know friends who have split from their partners and whilst one of the parents has been keen for their children to see the other parent often they are often let down and dismissed in favour of going out on the lash - how can that be healthy for a child?
my personal frustrations lie with the fact he hasn't even tried.. he is happy to play happy families to his current GF (of 4 months) and her 3 kids but no interest in his own flesh and blood
in 18months he has seen my little one 3 times.. totally about 6 hours
"
I totally agree he did'nt want to know so he stayed away better than in and out of her life as and when he feels like. As for the csa its totally shit. Never had a penny from either although when I claimed income support when my youngest was born I had to go through csa have to disclose fathers name. Gave them details on where he lives where he works etc but still comes back after 8 nearly 9 years that he does not have to pay a penny. He has a good job and a new family youngest being in private nursery expensive. Has a nice fancy car, house etc holidays abroad and yet my youngest gets nothing not bothered about the money but acknowledgment would be nice. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"i still think chemical castration should be brought in for those parents who just cant be bothered to raise a child...
people who go round sleeping around and then avoiding that persons responsibilities.. makes me sick"
Contraception is a 2 way thing. Why not sew up the cunts of women who leave children? Both i think are too drastic but reading thins thread says a lot about some people. |
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"perhaps im missing the point of this.. im not interested in money.. my daughter deserves to have a dad in her life.. she wont miss out on the financial side of things, i can provide for her, we get by.
I think its more important to have a relationship with the absent parent rather than some financial contribution."
Two simple questions :
Would you trade 50% of your total income, benefits including child benefit ( over to the father ) if he had a relationship with the child?
If he cared for the child fully, are you prepared to work full time and hand over the greater part of your earned income? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Contreception I fell pregnant with my eldest whilst on the pill on my 19th Birthday in a serious relationship. And my youngest I blame the vodka 2 minute miricle with my then best friend had none him a life time first and last time we ever had sex could have took the easy way out and had an abortion. But it takes two people to create life. And would never in a million years be without my girls no matter how hard it gets. |
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"The problem with mothers not adhering to a court order is that it's very difficult for a court to jail a mother for regular breach of that order. Who'd want to be responsible for taking a mum away from her kids and throwing her into jail?
"
The law does provide other alternatives than jailing the parent who breaches an Order. rarely, if ever applied though.
I recall a German case where the Judge, in response to the mother insiduously passing her own hatred for the father onto the children and denying contact, was herself removed from the children's lives for three years.
Not the perfect solution by any means but a start. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"As for the csa its totally shit. Never had a penny from either although when I claimed income support when my youngest was born I had to go through csa have to disclose fathers name. Gave them details on where he lives where he works etc but still comes back after 8 nearly 9 years that he does not have to pay a penny. He has a good job and a new family youngest being in private nursery expensive. Has a nice fancy car, house etc holidays abroad and yet my youngest gets nothing not bothered about the money but acknowledgment would be nice."
Something is seriously amiss there. You should push harder. Go to see your MP in his/her surgery. If he has simply denied being the father then that can be disproved quite easily. It is exectly this type of man Cameron was referring to, he might be a good dad to his second family but he still has a responsibility to his first. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"The problem with mothers not adhering to a court order is that it's very difficult for a court to jail a mother for regular breach of that order. Who'd want to be responsible for taking a mum away from her kids and throwing her into jail?
The law does provide other alternatives than jailing the parent who breaches an Order. rarely, if ever applied though.
I recall a German case where the Judge, in response to the mother insiduously passing her own hatred for the father onto the children and denying contact, was herself removed from the children's lives for three years.
Not the perfect solution by any means but a start. "
We don't want any system that jails one parent or forces the mother to lose access to her children. That's not the answer.
Remove her benefits, stop her working tax credit, permit the father to withhold maintenance, hit her financially until she complies with the law. Perhaps the father could be granted custody and she gets the visitation rights and has to find a job and hand over half her salary to him.
Jail most certainly isn't the answer in cases like these but I have heard of women being held in contempt of court and taken to jail for it. It had the desired effect too. |
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By *b430Man
over a year ago
Tayside |
"
We don't want any system that jails one parent or forces the mother to lose access to her children. That's not the answer.
"
Well it is time to get rid of the existing system then as, at present, fathers are threatened with and also sent to prison for not adhering to court orders made through the family courts, so why shouldn't the mothers be sent to prison also? I'm sure the fathers who are fighting with the ex in court for more access to their own kids would be more than happy to keep the kids fulltime while the mother sees the error of her ways in a prison cell.
And yes I do include myself in that! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"
We don't want any system that jails one parent or forces the mother to lose access to her children. That's not the answer.
Well it is time to get rid of the existing system then as, at present, fathers are threatened with and also sent to prison for not adhering to court orders made through the family courts, so why shouldn't the mothers be sent to prison also? I'm sure the fathers who are fighting with the ex in court for more access to their own kids would be more than happy to keep the kids fulltime while the mother sees the error of her ways in a prison cell.
And yes I do include myself in that! "
There are many so called mothers who neglect their children and only have them for the benefits. Its six of one and half a dozen of the other. The system doesn't work as it is. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"
We don't want any system that jails one parent or forces the mother to lose access to her children. That's not the answer.
Well it is time to get rid of the existing system then as, at present, fathers are threatened with and also sent to prison for not adhering to court orders made through the family courts, so why shouldn't the mothers be sent to prison also? I'm sure the fathers who are fighting with the ex in court for more access to their own kids would be more than happy to keep the kids fulltime while the mother sees the error of her ways in a prison cell.
And yes I do include myself in that! "
Prison not the answer maybe parenting classes or something but some are maternal some are not those mothers who choose drugs over children should never be allowed to have more children. I think some where they pay the mothers to get sterilised. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Found it yes they do this in USA.
Not everyone who has a child is capable of taking care of it, of meeting all its needs, emotional and physical. Is it a basic human right to reproduce? Or should some people who are clearly not in a position to have and raise a baby be encouraged not to conceive in the first place? What if these people were paid to be sterilised? Well, so far, 3500 drug addicts in the USA have been – they were all paid to have vasectomies or tubal ligations, rendering them permanently infertile. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"There are many so called mothers who neglect their children and only have them for the benefits. Its six of one and half a dozen of the other. The system doesn't work as it is. "
Benefit Britain created that. It never used to be like that in UK and single mothers with 6 kids by 8 dads were treated as the scourge of society. Women are untouchable in the eyes of the electorate now. What politician is going to publicly state that women should be castigated, ostracised and stripped of all their rights for having kids by different fathers? He'd be committing political suicide. |
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By *b430Man
over a year ago
Tayside |
"
Prison not the answer maybe parenting classes or something but some are maternal some are not those mothers who choose drugs over children should never be allowed to have more children. I think some where they pay the mothers to get sterilised."
My ex has never and probably never will take drugs and doesn't need parenting classes so that has nothing to do with her defying court orders, she was and still is a vindictive ***** who used the kids to get what she wanted i.e. as much cash off me as she could but also to stop me seeing the kids.
Although I won the case after 8 years and £35k later, once a mother spreads her lies about the kids father and uses the police as a threat all the time (albeit I have done nothing wrong) there is very little chance of the dads seeing their kids until they are old enough to see through their mums lies!
I could go on and on but I won't as some will always just see it as the fathers fault that they aren't seeing their own kids no matter what the truth actually is!
Tarring all fathers with the same brush will always be wrong.
* Crap spelling in the first version and quoted the wrong post in the second version * |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Wow, I feel for ya, really. Classic case of the system not working and you getting the shitty end of the stick. How old is your youngest if you don't mind me asking?
It must be comforting to know that when that child reaches 19 you can march up to your ex and tell her to go fuck herself with the last payment. (I'd give it to her in glued together 50p's so she can literally fuck herself with it) |
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By *b430Man
over a year ago
Tayside |
"Wow, I feel for ya, really. Classic case of the system not working and you getting the shitty end of the stick. How old is your youngest if you don't mind me asking?
It must be comforting to know that when that child reaches 19 you can march up to your ex and tell her to go fuck herself with the last payment. (I'd give it to her in glued together 50p's so she can literally fuck herself with it)"
2 kids 14 & 16 and yeah it will be very satisfying to be able to stop handing over the cash every month, and on that note I best get back to work to earn said cash! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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time they upped the amount that absent fathers pay, 15% of wage is shit when at least 80% of mine goes on kiddo. this last statement of camerons may be an indicator of this coming, but a fiver a wk of someones giro is defeating the purpose. what about these ones with 6 kids 6 different mums?? forced sterilisation?? i agreed with his previous statement that caused uproar if u cant feed them dont have them and i really dont care if it offends people its simple common sense i dont see why i should have to pay for the breeding machines when i can only afford to have one child and dont want to bring a child into the world when i couldnt afford to give it everythin it needs as well as stability and parental care as working a 60 hr wk as it is to provide for the first one and thats with regular csa payments although the git didnt pay for 8 years but that was through my stubborness. it takes 2 to make a baby x |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"time they upped the amount that absent fathers pay, 15% of wage is shit when at least 80% of mine goes on kiddo. this last statement of camerons may be an indicator of this coming, but a fiver a wk of someones giro is defeating the purpose. what about these ones with 6 kids 6 different mums?? forced sterilisation?? i agreed with his previous statement that caused uproar if u cant feed them dont have them and i really dont care if it offends people its simple common sense i dont see why i should have to pay for the breeding machines when i can only afford to have one child and dont want to bring a child into the world when i couldnt afford to give it everythin it needs as well as stability and parental care as working a 60 hr wk as it is to provide for the first one and thats with regular csa payments although the git didnt pay for 8 years but that was through my stubborness. it takes 2 to make a baby x"
and absent mums too!! x |
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"
We don't want any system that jails one parent or forces the mother to lose access to her children. That's not the answer.
Well it is time to get rid of the existing system then as, at present, fathers are threatened with and also sent to prison for not adhering to court orders made through the family courts, so why shouldn't the mothers be sent to prison also? I'm sure the fathers who are fighting with the ex in court for more access to their own kids would be more than happy to keep the kids fulltime while the mother sees the error of her ways in a prison cell.
And yes I do include myself in that! "
Well said bb.
I'd even take the kids to visit too lol |
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By *UNCHBOXMan
over a year ago
folkestone |
"have been likened to drink drivers by David Cameron today. Irrespective of where you are politically... I wonder whether this sweeping statement is very fair...?
It does appear the he stumbles from one gaffe to another and I'm starting to question just who is advising Cameron on his speeches and the timing of them."
The daily Mail? |
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