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Falling out - controversial
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"Is she possibly pissed off by the fact that you don't see it as offensive ?" Yes. X | |||
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"Wouldn't bother me personally. I wouldnt find it offensive. Just the same as i wouldn't find it offensive if a black person whitened their face and pretended to be white ? Maybe its because i dont look at people as a skin colour?" This is my exact feeling too. | |||
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"Wouldn't bother me personally. I wouldnt find it offensive. Just the same as i wouldn't find it offensive if a black person whitened their face and pretended to be white ? Maybe its because i dont look at people as a skin colour? This is my exact feeling too. " I do. I see our differences in cultural heritage when I look at a person who is from a different background to myself. I look at their cultural struggles. Their challenges. The way that they have been knocked down over the years. And I see my own privilege, which lets me have the option of choosing not to give a fuck about those things, and say 'I don't see people as a skin colour' when their skin colour has had a huge impact on the person that they are. | |||
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"Wouldn't bother me personally. I wouldnt find it offensive. Just the same as i wouldn't find it offensive if a black person whitened their face and pretended to be white ? Maybe its because i dont look at people as a skin colour? This is my exact feeling too. " Shall we get married ?  | |||
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"Wouldn't bother me personally. I wouldnt find it offensive. Just the same as i wouldn't find it offensive if a black person whitened their face and pretended to be white ? Maybe its because i dont look at people as a skin colour? This is my exact feeling too. I do. I see our differences in cultural heritage when I look at a person who is from a different background to myself. I look at their cultural struggles. Their challenges. The way that they have been knocked down over the years. And I see my own privilege, which lets me have the option of choosing not to give a fuck about those things, and say 'I don't see people as a skin colour' when their skin colour has had a huge impact on the person that they are."  | |||
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"You were right - it is offensive when white people employ "blackface" for comedy, or any purposes really. And your friend was wrong to fly off the handle when you were just asking for opinions. It wasn't you who was considering doing the culturally insensitive thing." being offended is subjective though.don't you think if nobody cared or made a big deal out of it then problem solved.I don't see why anyone black or white should be offended and if they are then tough.genuinly don't understand why anyone could find offence in it.it's time to move on from the racisim it used to mean that u hated someone for there culture/skin colour now it's if someone dressed up as Mr T or dont feel atracted to black guys like a few threads have went on here then u are racist. lol.I like how Morgan Freeman put it."if y'all stop talking about it then it will go away by itself,just stop talking about it." | |||
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"You were right - it is offensive when white people employ "blackface" for comedy, or any purposes really. And your friend was wrong to fly off the handle when you were just asking for opinions. It wasn't you who was considering doing the culturally insensitive thing.being offended is subjective though.don't you think if nobody cared or made a big deal out of it then problem solved.I don't see why anyone black or white should be offended and if they are then tough.genuinly don't understand why anyone could find offence in it.it's time to move on from the racisim it used to mean that u hated someone for there culture/skin colour now it's if someone dressed up as Mr T or dont feel atracted to black guys like a few threads have went on here then u are racist. lol.I like how Morgan Freeman put it."if y'all stop talking about it then it will go away by itself,just stop talking about it."" Agreed. Too many people like to be offended and if they have nothing to be offended about then they will be offended about that too  | |||
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"Why has she fallen out with you? " Well. I can only assume that it's because I said I didn't personally see the 'offence' in it. Or it could be that it was my status she took a bashing on (not by me. There was 'im right. You're not) from both sides. Like I say I reached out with the first 'r u ok?' text but no. Nothing. | |||
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"Wouldn't bother me personally. I wouldnt find it offensive. Just the same as i wouldn't find it offensive if a black person whitened their face and pretended to be white ? Maybe its because i dont look at people as a skin colour? This is my exact feeling too. I do. I see our differences in cultural heritage when I look at a person who is from a different background to myself. I look at their cultural struggles. Their challenges. The way that they have been knocked down over the years. And I see my own privilege, which lets me have the option of choosing not to give a fuck about those things, and say 'I don't see people as a skin colour' when their skin colour has had a huge impact on the person that they are." Thank fuck someone already typed this so I don't have to! | |||
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"Is she possibly pissed off by the fact that you don't see it as offensive ? Yes. X" Then there's no point in apologising unless you have now changed your mind | |||
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"Why has she fallen out with you? Well. I can only assume that it's because I said I didn't personally see the 'offence' in it. Or it could be that it was my status she took a bashing on (not by me. There was 'im right. You're not) from both sides. Like I say I reached out with the first 'r u ok?' text but no. Nothing. " Have you sent any other messages? If it was my friend I'd go round and ask why she was ignoring me. She might be pissed off about something entirely different. Or she may have dropped her phone down the loo and that's why she hasn't replied. | |||
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"I'd go as Al Jolson " | |||
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"i think it can be offensive. if your mate admires mr T and is dressing up as him because of that then it's not really offensive, if she thinks it would be funny to be black then no that's not funny and is offensive. i would text your mate, apologise and ask her to vent her feelings to you so that you understand why she isn't speaking to you. doesn't matter if you find it offensive at this point or not really because she does and this is one of those times your own feelings should be dampened for someone elses feelings." Well this is it isn't it. She genuinely did just like the A-Team. | |||
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"i think it can be offensive. if your mate admires mr T and is dressing up as him because of that then it's not really offensive, if she thinks it would be funny to be black then no that's not funny and is offensive. i would text your mate, apologise and ask her to vent her feelings to you so that you understand why she isn't speaking to you. doesn't matter if you find it offensive at this point or not really because she does and this is one of those times your own feelings should be dampened for someone elses feelings. Well this is it isn't it. She genuinely did just like the A-Team. " i don't see a problem with that personally, but i'm white so might not get it and i'd be ok with someone not white dressing up as a white person. my gut still says you should try to understand her feelings over your own right now. | |||
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"Wouldn't bother me personally. I wouldnt find it offensive. Just the same as i wouldn't find it offensive if a black person whitened their face and pretended to be white ? Maybe its because i dont look at people as a skin colour? This is my exact feeling too. I do. I see our differences in cultural heritage when I look at a person who is from a different background to myself. I look at their cultural struggles. Their challenges. The way that they have been knocked down over the years. And I see my own privilege, which lets me have the option of choosing not to give a fuck about those things, and say 'I don't see people as a skin colour' when their skin colour has had a huge impact on the person that they are." Exactly this | |||
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"she sounds up her own arse couple of my mates are brilliant, one's scottish and one from ghana and now and again when say arriving somewhere like a hotel or through a train station they sort of break into an impromptu 'act' where the scottish one will start barking orders at the other to carry his cases and hurry up as if he was a slave of old, the other bows and won't make eye contact saying only yes sir. folk are so fucking uptight about race now a days that the publics reactions are brilliant, half of them don't know where to look, folk staring, folk looking anywhere but at them, folk open mouthed, it's quite a thing to see so many people out of their comfort zone "I actually lol'd at this. Top mates.  | |||
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"she sounds up her own arse couple of my mates are brilliant, one's scottish and one from ghana and now and again when say arriving somewhere like a hotel or through a train station they sort of break into an impromptu 'act' where the scottish one will start barking orders at the other to carry his cases and hurry up as if he was a slave of old, the other bows and won't make eye contact saying only yes sir. folk are so fucking uptight about race now a days that the publics reactions are brilliant, half of them don't know where to look, folk staring, folk looking anywhere but at them, folk open mouthed, it's quite a thing to see so many people out of their comfort zone "Hes white hes indian black chinese ?? Who gives a fuck. Like i said before i dont see colour or race. I see people for who they are. Too many people making issues where there usually isnt any ? Starting the politically correctness fight when half the time theres no fight to be had in the first place ? Just so they are seen as some delusional crusader. | |||
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"she sounds up her own arse couple of my mates are brilliant, one's scottish and one from ghana and now and again when say arriving somewhere like a hotel or through a train station they sort of break into an impromptu 'act' where the scottish one will start barking orders at the other to carry his cases and hurry up as if he was a slave of old, the other bows and won't make eye contact saying only yes sir. folk are so fucking uptight about race now a days that the publics reactions are brilliant, half of them don't know where to look, folk staring, folk looking anywhere but at them, folk open mouthed, it's quite a thing to see so many people out of their comfort zone
Hes white hes indian black chinese ??
Who gives a fuck.
Like i said before i dont see colour or race.
I see people for who they are.
Too many people making issues where there usually isnt any ?
Starting the politically correctness fight when half the time theres no fight to be had in the first place ?
Just so they are seen as some delusional crusader."I thought you would say turn the other cheek | |||
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"she sounds up her own arse couple of my mates are brilliant, one's scottish and one from ghana and now and again when say arriving somewhere like a hotel or through a train station they sort of break into an impromptu 'act' where the scottish one will start barking orders at the other to carry his cases and hurry up as if he was a slave of old, the other bows and won't make eye contact saying only yes sir. folk are so fucking uptight about race now a days that the publics reactions are brilliant, half of them don't know where to look, folk staring, folk looking anywhere but at them, folk open mouthed, it's quite a thing to see so many people out of their comfort zone
Hes white hes indian black chinese ??
Who gives a fuck.
Like i said before i dont see colour or race.
I see people for who they are.
Too many people making issues where there usually isnt any ?
Starting the politically correctness fight when half the time theres no fight to be had in the first place ?
Just so they are seen as some delusional crusader.
I thought you would say turn the other cheek "My bum cheek  | |||
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"she sounds up her own arse couple of my mates are brilliant, one's scottish and one from ghana and now and again when say arriving somewhere like a hotel or through a train station they sort of break into an impromptu 'act' where the scottish one will start barking orders at the other to carry his cases and hurry up as if he was a slave of old, the other bows and won't make eye contact saying only yes sir. folk are so fucking uptight about race now a days that the publics reactions are brilliant, half of them don't know where to look, folk staring, folk looking anywhere but at them, folk open mouthed, it's quite a thing to see so many people out of their comfort zone
Hes white hes indian black chinese ??
Who gives a fuck.
Like i said before i dont see colour or race.
I see people for who they are.
Too many people making issues where there usually isnt any ?
Starting the politically correctness fight when half the time theres no fight to be had in the first place ?
Just so they are seen as some delusional crusader.
I thought you would say turn the other cheek
My bum cheek "Just wait till I tell your dad | |||
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"Ok, so she's a mum with two mixed race kids who have probably been on the receiving end of racism in one form or another. Blacking up in the past was humour for white people at the expense of people of colour. I can absolutely see why she is offended. It's easy for people to dismiss something as 'pc gone mad' when they don't have first hand experience of regularly being on the receiving end of it. "
I am fed up of being told I am being offended for the sake of it by people who have not had my experiences. Or, given the examples of other black people who are happy to take the piss out of the whole thing and assume that means we should all behave like that. You can guess what I think of that.
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 spoiler .. a heartwarming ending | |||
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"Wouldn't bother me personally. I wouldnt find it offensive. Just the same as i wouldn't find it offensive if a black person whitened their face and pretended to be white ? Maybe its because i dont look at people as a skin colour? This is my exact feeling too. I do. I see our differences in cultural heritage when I look at a person who is from a different background to myself. I look at their cultural struggles. Their challenges. The way that they have been knocked down over the years. And I see my own privilege, which lets me have the option of choosing not to give a fuck about those things, and say 'I don't see people as a skin colour' when their skin colour has had a huge impact on the person that they are." absolutely this. | |||
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"OP, if the friendship is important it will stand the test of time. All friends fall out over silly stuff at different times and you just have to let a bit of time pass and get past it. The closest friends are family you have chosen. Family makes up, often without talking about it all but just getting back to doing the normal stuff together. Make it a big deal and it becomes a big deal. Involving other people who know your friend (who are 'advising' you to not apologise) is a recipe for making this a bigger deal than it needs to be. It's much harder to go back to being normal when people are calling your name behind your back. Stop posting about any of it on Facebook!" | |||
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"she sounds up her own arse couple of my mates are brilliant, one's scottish and one from ghana and now and again when say arriving somewhere like a hotel or through a train station they sort of break into an impromptu 'act' where the scottish one will start barking orders at the other to carry his cases and hurry up as if he was a slave of old, the other bows and won't make eye contact saying only yes sir. folk are so fucking uptight about race now a days that the publics reactions are brilliant, half of them don't know where to look, folk staring, folk looking anywhere but at them, folk open mouthed, it's quite a thing to see so many people out of their comfort zone
Hes white hes indian black chinese ??
Who gives a fuck.
Like i said before i dont see colour or race.
I see people for who they are.
Too many people making issues where there usually isnt any ?
Starting the politically correctness fight when half the time theres no fight to be had in the first place ?
Just so they are seen as some delusional crusader."or it's just funny | |||
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"First Jesus .. then Christos .. anyone on here called holly ghost? "alomost | |||
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"First Jesus .. then Christos .. anyone on here called holly ghost?
alomost"A ghostly (almost) lurker. | |||
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"the play Hamilton had black people playing white people and white people playing black slaves which is contriversal. " No one thought it at all controversial when for hundreds of years white men have played Othello. Double standards even with acting it would seem. Ira Aldridge was driven out of London for being a black man playing a black man. It's acting not making fun of something. There is a difference. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/no-the-hamilton-casting-call-for-non-white-actors-is-not-reverse-racism_us_56fd2c83e4b0daf53aeed9b9 | |||
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"Ok, so she's a mum with two mixed race kids who have probably been on the receiving end of racism in one form or another. Blacking up in the past was humour for white people at the expense of people of colour. I can absolutely see why she is offended. It's easy for people to dismiss something as 'pc gone mad' when they don't have first hand experience of regularly being on the receiving end of it.
I am fed up of being told I am being offended for the sake of it by people who have not had my experiences. Or, given the examples of other black people who are happy to take the piss out of the whole thing and assume that means we should all behave like that. You can guess what I think of that.
". So are you offended by somebody dressing up as Mr t and blacking their face? | |||
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"I proberbly wouldn't talk to someone again if they thought that blacking up for a fancy dress party was acceptable, to be honest." Aye. The fact that so few of you can't see that blacking up in any context disturbs me somewhat | |||
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" We haven't yet become the society where everyone is treated equally so to take skin colour as joke is in very poor taste. " . I don't follow that logic Perhaps you could point me to a law thats racist by definition or intent?. Or are you just talking about people's personal feelings?. In this case of fancy dress, somebody is attempting to impersonate a black guy (they happen to be female) where's the joke? | |||
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" I don't follow that logic Perhaps you could point me to a law thats racist by definition or intent?. Or are you just talking about people's personal feelings?. In this case of fancy dress, somebody is attempting to impersonate a black guy (they happen to be female) where's the joke?" People's personal feelings. We're quite lucky in this country of our equality laws but prejudice and discrimination can creep in. The amount I have to put up with due to my skin colour and ethnicity I wouldn't wish upon anyone. To be profiled on the kind of person you MIGHT be due to your skin colour isn't nice. This is both in my personal life and my time on here. | |||
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" We haven't yet become the society where everyone is treated equally so to take skin colour as joke is in very poor taste. . I don't follow that logic Perhaps you could point me to a law thats racist by definition or intent?. Or are you just talking about people's personal feelings?. In this case of fancy dress, somebody is attempting to impersonate a black guy (they happen to be female) where's the joke?" Ah. You're one of those people who say "laws are equal now, stop complaining" as if changing the law automatically stops people treating others poorly. Well, it's illegal to drive while using a mobile phone, but pricks still do it. Regularly. | |||
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"the play Hamilton had black people playing white people and white people playing black slaves which is contriversal. No one thought it at all controversial when for hundreds of years white men have played Othello. Double standards even with acting it would seem. Ira Aldridge was driven out of London for being a black man playing a black man. It's acting not making fun of something. There is a difference. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/no-the-hamilton-casting-call-for-non-white-actors-is-not-reverse-racism_us_56fd2c83e4b0daf53aeed9b9 " recently Michael Jacksons daughter complained about a comedy where the actor of her father was white. | |||
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"the play Hamilton had black people playing white people and white people playing black slaves which is contriversal. No one thought it at all controversial when for hundreds of years white men have played Othello. Double standards even with acting it would seem. Ira Aldridge was driven out of London for being a black man playing a black man. It's acting not making fun of something. There is a difference. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/no-the-hamilton-casting-call-for-non-white-actors-is-not-reverse-racism_us_56fd2c83e4b0daf53aeed9b9 recently Michael Jacksons daughter complained about a comedy where the actor of her father was white." * actor playing her father was white. | |||
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It sounds like you've a long history and you know if she's took it the wrong way or not. maybe they're a sensitive soul too, and thought you meant something you didn't. Hope you can sort it out. | |||
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"Now I'm aware theres gonna be divided opinion on this subject and its not so much the foundation topic I am interested in your opinions on. Its the 'apologising' Ive fallen out with my best friend of 17 years to the point she is ignoring my texts (she lives on my street but I darent go round!) So in short. A few of us are going to a fancy dress do. The theme is 'the 80s'. One girl (who is white) wanted to go as Mr T and black up her face to match the arms of the costume. To which I said that *I* wouldnt be upset but theres many that would. She wasn't having it and was gonna pay £40 off ebay. So I wrote a fb status saying 'is it wrong for a white person to black up for cool runnings' Well. My mate (white witj two mixed race kids) went MAD. But the general answer from other people was 'no. Its fun not spite and what about that film white chicks, that was the same' Deleted me and now ignoring my text. My other friends have told me not to dare apologise as I only asked a question but I'm a soft soul and feel awful. What would you do? " as your post was clearly apart of and a by product of your chat with your friend you cross a line , op I cant believe you can not see how posting what you did disrespected her and kind of said in a back handed way I'm not happy with what your doing and I'm looking for reassurance of my unhappiness over what your doing in the eyes of others . even this post she could view as a disrespectful act towards her and yes your friendship , a friendship is a friendship it should not be disrespected when its on going nor should it be disrespected when its in trouble or on the rocks . after reading those words op do you think by discussing your friendship with strangers could be seen by the other person in that friendship as disrespectful . I feel your pain op but in my opinion you should have sent a couple of messages when she didn't respond you should have asked her what you did wrong . if that message was unanswered you should have back off for a week or two allowing things to calm down them send one last messaging say hay missed our chats how are you . no response from that message you move on respecting your friends choice to drop you from there circle of friends . this post I'm sorry to say op does you no credit in my opinion for reasons I've already outlined in this post, I wish you all the best and truly hope she can see past the behaviour that has upset her but that's her decision op never yours . | |||
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"Wouldn't bother me personally. I wouldnt find it offensive. Just the same as i wouldn't find it offensive if a black person whitened their face and pretended to be white ? Maybe its because i dont look at people as a skin colour? This is my exact feeling too. Shall we get married ? "Not seeing someone's skin colour is massively disrespectful of their racial and cultural heritage. I'd suffer the OP reads up on the history of 'blacking up' to discover why it is offensive to your friend and many others. | |||
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" I don't follow that logic Perhaps you could point me to a law thats racist by definition or intent?. Or are you just talking about people's personal feelings?. In this case of fancy dress, somebody is attempting to impersonate a black guy (they happen to be female) where's the joke? People's personal feelings. We're quite lucky in this country of our equality laws but prejudice and discrimination can creep in. The amount I have to put up with due to my skin colour and ethnicity I wouldn't wish upon anyone. To be profiled on the kind of person you MIGHT be due to your skin colour isn't nice. This is both in my personal life and my time on here. " . Well yes I agree with you that some people have prejudices and probably some people will forever?, I've felt that myself through my religious beliefs but it brings me back to what I said originally about somebody doing fancy dress as the pope some will be offended some won't, it probably comes down to intent and wether one thinks the person has alternative motives than impersonation | |||
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" We haven't yet become the society where everyone is treated equally so to take skin colour as joke is in very poor taste. . I don't follow that logic Perhaps you could point me to a law thats racist by definition or intent?. Or are you just talking about people's personal feelings?. In this case of fancy dress, somebody is attempting to impersonate a black guy (they happen to be female) where's the joke? Ah. You're one of those people who say "laws are equal now, stop complaining" as if changing the law automatically stops people treating others poorly. Well, it's illegal to drive while using a mobile phone, but pricks still do it. Regularly." . No I don't think I wrote anybody should stop "complaining"?. "Your one of those people"  | |||
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"Wouldn't bother me personally. I wouldnt find it offensive. Just the same as i wouldn't find it offensive if a black person whitened their face and pretended to be white ? Maybe its because i dont look at people as a skin colour? This is my exact feeling too. Shall we get married ?
Not seeing someone's skin colour is massively disrespectful of their racial and cultural heritage.
I'd suffer the OP reads up on the history of 'blacking up' to discover why it is offensive to your friend and many others. "I disagree with your opinion that seeing people as people and not a skin colour is disrespectful. But you're entitled to your opinion and thought process as others are theirs. | |||
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" We haven't yet become the society where everyone is treated equally so to take skin colour as joke is in very poor taste. . I don't follow that logic Perhaps you could point me to a law thats racist by definition or intent?. Or are you just talking about people's personal feelings?. In this case of fancy dress, somebody is attempting to impersonate a black guy (they happen to be female) where's the joke? Ah. You're one of those people who say "laws are equal now, stop complaining" as if changing the law automatically stops people treating others poorly. Well, it's illegal to drive while using a mobile phone, but pricks still do it. Regularly.. No I don't think I wrote anybody should stop "complaining"?. "Your one of those people" "If you weren't one of those people, you wouldn't have pointed out that the law says we're equal, while seemingly suggesting that peoples feelings aren't valid. | |||
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"Depends on the value you place on the friendship. If it's important, you should do everything in your power to fix it. Try and explain what you meant face to face rather than by text/email. People who say you should never apologise are talking bollocks, sometimes you need to do whatever is right for the bigger picture..." Anything can be sorted out if a friendship is strong. | |||
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"Wouldn't bother me personally. I wouldnt find it offensive. Just the same as i wouldn't find it offensive if a black person whitened their face and pretended to be white ? Maybe its because i dont look at people as a skin colour? This is my exact feeling too. Shall we get married ?
Not seeing someone's skin colour is massively disrespectful of their racial and cultural heritage.
I'd suffer the OP reads up on the history of 'blacking up' to discover why it is offensive to your friend and many others.
I disagree with your opinion that seeing people as people and not a skin colour is disrespectful.
But you're entitled to your opinion and thought process as others are theirs. "I don't recall suggesting people were not 'entitled' to an opinion. I also don't recall asking for Mine to be validated by anyone. Not seeing the differences in people is not the solution to discrimination. We should celebrate differences. Learn about them and understand them. Not seeing skin colour is the equivalent if sweeping history under the rug of life. For a lot of people the history of their skin colour is hugely important to them and so to say it doesn't register with you is disrespectful whether you agree with it or not. You may think you are being all modern and accepting of differences but you really aren't. | |||
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"Wouldn't bother me personally. I wouldnt find it offensive. Just the same as i wouldn't find it offensive if a black person whitened their face and pretended to be white ? Maybe its because i dont look at people as a skin colour? This is my exact feeling too. Shall we get married ?
Not seeing someone's skin colour is massively disrespectful of their racial and cultural heritage.
I'd suffer the OP reads up on the history of 'blacking up' to discover why it is offensive to your friend and many others.
I disagree with your opinion that seeing people as people and not a skin colour is disrespectful.
But you're entitled to your opinion and thought process as others are theirs.
I don't recall suggesting people were not 'entitled' to an opinion. I also don't recall asking for Mine to be validated by anyone.
Not seeing the differences in people is not the solution to discrimination. We should celebrate differences. Learn about them and understand them.
Not seeing skin colour is the equivalent if sweeping history under the rug of life. For a lot of people the history of their skin colour is hugely important to them and so to say it doesn't register with you is disrespectful whether you agree with it or not.
You may think you are being all modern and accepting of differences but you really aren't."Sorry I dissagree with your views. But their your views and you are entitled to them | |||
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"Wouldn't bother me personally. I wouldnt find it offensive. Just the same as i wouldn't find it offensive if a black person whitened their face and pretended to be white ? Maybe its because i dont look at people as a skin colour? This is my exact feeling too. Shall we get married ?
Not seeing someone's skin colour is massively disrespectful of their racial and cultural heritage.
I'd suffer the OP reads up on the history of 'blacking up' to discover why it is offensive to your friend and many others.
I disagree with your opinion that seeing people as people and not a skin colour is disrespectful.
But you're entitled to your opinion and thought process as others are theirs.
I don't recall suggesting people were not 'entitled' to an opinion. I also don't recall asking for Mine to be validated by anyone.
Not seeing the differences in people is not the solution to discrimination. We should celebrate differences. Learn about them and understand them.
Not seeing skin colour is the equivalent if sweeping history under the rug of life. For a lot of people the history of their skin colour is hugely important to them and so to say it doesn't register with you is disrespectful whether you agree with it or not.
You may think you are being all modern and accepting of differences but you really aren't."I think that's maybe a little harsh to assume that just because people choose to not see colour that they're somewhat in the wrong. | |||
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"Wouldn't bother me personally. I wouldnt find it offensive. Just the same as i wouldn't find it offensive if a black person whitened their face and pretended to be white ? Maybe its because i dont look at people as a skin colour? This is my exact feeling too. Shall we get married ?
Not seeing someone's skin colour is massively disrespectful of their racial and cultural heritage.
I'd suffer the OP reads up on the history of 'blacking up' to discover why it is offensive to your friend and many others.
I disagree with your opinion that seeing people as people and not a skin colour is disrespectful.
But you're entitled to your opinion and thought process as others are theirs.
I don't recall suggesting people were not 'entitled' to an opinion. I also don't recall asking for Mine to be validated by anyone.
Not seeing the differences in people is not the solution to discrimination. We should celebrate differences. Learn about them and understand them.
Not seeing skin colour is the equivalent if sweeping history under the rug of life. For a lot of people the history of their skin colour is hugely important to them and so to say it doesn't register with you is disrespectful whether you agree with it or not.
You may think you are being all modern and accepting of differences but you really aren't.
I think that's maybe a little harsh to assume that just because people choose to not see colour that they're somewhat in the wrong."Thankyou | |||
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"Wouldn't bother me personally. I wouldnt find it offensive. Just the same as i wouldn't find it offensive if a black person whitened their face and pretended to be white ? Maybe its because i dont look at people as a skin colour? This is my exact feeling too. Shall we get married ?
Not seeing someone's skin colour is massively disrespectful of their racial and cultural heritage.
I'd suffer the OP reads up on the history of 'blacking up' to discover why it is offensive to your friend and many others. "When I sat on interview panels I'd always mark down anyone who responded to the equality question with "I treat everybody the same regardless" as it showed lack of understanding. That means they'd be unable to provide reasonable adjustments as they'd treat everyone the same. Not provide braille for the blind, vegetarian options for catering, check meetings are not scheduled during school holidays etc. | |||
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"Wouldn't bother me personally. I wouldnt find it offensive. Just the same as i wouldn't find it offensive if a black person whitened their face and pretended to be white ? Maybe its because i dont look at people as a skin colour? This is my exact feeling too. Shall we get married ?
Not seeing someone's skin colour is massively disrespectful of their racial and cultural heritage.
I'd suffer the OP reads up on the history of 'blacking up' to discover why it is offensive to your friend and many others.
When I sat on interview panels I'd always mark down anyone who responded to the equality question with "I treat everybody the same regardless" as it showed lack of understanding.
That means they'd be unable to provide reasonable adjustments as they'd treat everyone the same. Not provide braille for the blind, vegetarian options for catering, check meetings are not scheduled during school holidays etc.
"exactly, or facilitate leave for different religious festivals that dont fit with this countries 'traditional' ones. When i was a manager i had staff who celebrated Eid. I always allowed them to take leave at that time regardless of who else was off because i understood how important it was to them. they also repaid the favour by working over Christmas to allow their colleagues to have time off (we worked 24/7, 365 days a year). | |||
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" We haven't yet become the society where everyone is treated equally so to take skin colour as joke is in very poor taste. . I don't follow that logic Perhaps you could point me to a law thats racist by definition or intent?. Or are you just talking about people's personal feelings?. In this case of fancy dress, somebody is attempting to impersonate a black guy (they happen to be female) where's the joke? Ah. You're one of those people who say "laws are equal now, stop complaining" as if changing the law automatically stops people treating others poorly. Well, it's illegal to drive while using a mobile phone, but pricks still do it. Regularly.. No I don't think I wrote anybody should stop "complaining"?. "Your one of those people"
If you weren't one of those people, you wouldn't have pointed out that the law says we're equal, while seemingly suggesting that peoples feelings aren't valid.". I pointed that out because as a society we are equal before the law, individually some are flawed with prejudice?. There's some proper racism out there in society I agree, white/black black/white white/Asian Indian/Pakistani etc etc etc. We are all still equal before the law though!. For most black people equality problems are not in the main racial but economical, it seems to me that instead of bringing black people up economically were just dragging white people down and creating equality that way. Whoop whoop were all equal in poverty. If you travel through the third world you hardly ever encounter racism | |||
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"Wouldn't bother me personally. I wouldnt find it offensive. Just the same as i wouldn't find it offensive if a black person whitened their face and pretended to be white ? Maybe its because i dont look at people as a skin colour? This is my exact feeling too. Shall we get married ?
Not seeing someone's skin colour is massively disrespectful of their racial and cultural heritage.
I'd suffer the OP reads up on the history of 'blacking up' to discover why it is offensive to your friend and many others.
I disagree with your opinion that seeing people as people and not a skin colour is disrespectful.
But you're entitled to your opinion and thought process as others are theirs.
I don't recall suggesting people were not 'entitled' to an opinion. I also don't recall asking for Mine to be validated by anyone.
Not seeing the differences in people is not the solution to discrimination. We should celebrate differences. Learn about them and understand them.
Not seeing skin colour is the equivalent if sweeping history under the rug of life. For a lot of people the history of their skin colour is hugely important to them and so to say it doesn't register with you is disrespectful whether you agree with it or not.
You may think you are being all modern and accepting of differences but you really aren't.
I think that's maybe a little harsh to assume that just because people choose to not see colour that they're somewhat in the wrong."is it? It is my opinion and as Jesus himself says, i am perfectly entitled to it, in fact he has graciously validated my right to an opinion twice on this thread alone. others on this thread have said that the OP's friend is overly sensitive and over re-acting because she feels that someone blacking up is offensive. i think they are somewhat harsh. | |||
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"Racism is racism. There's no such thing as 'proper' racism. The fact that it appears that some things are acceptable to some individuals because they aren't "that bad" on a subjective sliding scale is quite concerning. This isn't about being soft or sensitive, it's about sticking up for what's right and wrong. OP, sorry to hear about your friend and the misunderstanding about your post. Hope your friend listens to your explanation and things get patched up quickly "Whats your take on the OP's situation? Would you find offence to it or would you class it as innocent fun? | |||
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"Wouldn't bother me personally. I wouldnt find it offensive. Just the same as i wouldn't find it offensive if a black person whitened their face and pretended to be white ? Maybe its because i dont look at people as a skin colour? This is my exact feeling too. Shall we get married ?
Not seeing someone's skin colour is massively disrespectful of their racial and cultural heritage.
I'd suffer the OP reads up on the history of 'blacking up' to discover why it is offensive to your friend and many others.
I disagree with your opinion that seeing people as people and not a skin colour is disrespectful.
But you're entitled to your opinion and thought process as others are theirs.
I don't recall suggesting people were not 'entitled' to an opinion. I also don't recall asking for Mine to be validated by anyone.
Not seeing the differences in people is not the solution to discrimination. We should celebrate differences. Learn about them and understand them.
Not seeing skin colour is the equivalent if sweeping history under the rug of life. For a lot of people the history of their skin colour is hugely important to them and so to say it doesn't register with you is disrespectful whether you agree with it or not.
You may think you are being all modern and accepting of differences but you really aren't.
I think that's maybe a little harsh to assume that just because people choose to not see colour that they're somewhat in the wrong.
is it? It is my opinion and as Jesus himself says, i am perfectly entitled to it, in fact he has graciously validated my right to an opinion twice on this thread alone.
others on this thread have said that the OP's friend is overly sensitive and over re-acting because she feels that someone blacking up is offensive. i think they are somewhat harsh."I think we all know that everyone's entitled to an opinion. No one is saying otherwise, or at least I'm not. I do think that it's sometimes difficult for people to understand other's lives when they've not walked in their shoes. There are far too many people on this forum who, instead of nicely explaining things, seem to tell others off for not having the same view point or for maybe a bit of a misunderstanding. | |||
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"Interesting thread. As a result of certain life experiences, friendships and relationships, I am very aware of racial issues, as well as different cultures and people's heritage. I'm not black though and don't claim to know what its like to be black. I'm aware of certain expressions being offensive to due racism, though I have not to date heard of the expression 'blacking up'. I am aware of it now. Obviously as it is an offensive expression, that the OP was not aware of, then she should oppologise for causing that offence. With regards to fancy dress, I wouldn't have thought that it is offensive to dress up as a celebrity who happens to be a different race, and try and make yourself look like that person as best as possible. Mrs" The act of black face (or blacking up ) is offensive not the expression | |||
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"Whats your take on the OP's situation? Would you find offence to it or would you class it as innocent fun?" 'Blacking up' is a lot of things but "innocent fun" it certainly is not nor will it ever be. Offence might be a strong word, but I would certainly think someone that went through a thought process and implemented it was either: a) completely ignorant and someone I wanted to avoid or b) trying to draw attention to themselves/create a backlash and thus someone I wanted to avoid. I might have misunderstood the OP but it appears her friend took offence regarding a hypothetical situation posed on FB. I'd hope her friend was willing to listen to her explaination, largely based on the nature of their relationship and it would be identified as a misunderstanding. | |||
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"Whats your take on the OP's situation? Would you find offence to it or would you class it as innocent fun? 'Blacking up' is a lot of things but "innocent fun" it certainly is not nor will it ever be. Offence might be a strong word, but I would certainly think someone that went through a thought process and implemented it was either: a) completely ignorant and someone I wanted to avoid or b) trying to draw attention to themselves/create a backlash and thus someone I wanted to avoid. I might have misunderstood the OP but it appears her friend took offence regarding a hypothetical situation posed on FB. I'd hope her friend was willing to listen to her explaination, largely based on the nature of their relationship and it would be identified as a misunderstanding." Do you think its disrespectful of someone see people as people and not a colour? As I don't see people as a colour I see them as people in their own right. | |||
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"Whats your take on the OP's situation? Would you find offence to it or would you class it as innocent fun? 'Blacking up' is a lot of things but "innocent fun" it certainly is not nor will it ever be. Offence might be a strong word, but I would certainly think someone that went through a thought process and implemented it was either: a) completely ignorant and someone I wanted to avoid or b) trying to draw attention to themselves/create a backlash and thus someone I wanted to avoid. I might have misunderstood the OP but it appears her friend took offence regarding a hypothetical situation posed on FB. I'd hope her friend was willing to listen to her explaination, largely based on the nature of their relationship and it would be identified as a misunderstanding. Do you think its disrespectful of someone see people as people and not a colour? As I don't see people as a colour I see them as people in their own right." Why can't you see them as both. A person's skin colour is an integral part of their identity. | |||
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" As I don't see people as a colour I see them as people in their own right." Their skin colour, ethnicity, and culture is part of their person. That goes for white people as well. | |||
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"Interesting thread. As a result of certain life experiences, friendships and relationships, I am very aware of racial issues, as well as different cultures and people's heritage. I'm not black though and don't claim to know what its like to be black. I'm aware of certain expressions being offensive to due racism, though I have not to date heard of the expression 'blacking up'. I am aware of it now. Obviously as it is an offensive expression, that the OP was not aware of, then she should oppologise for causing that offence. With regards to fancy dress, I wouldn't have thought that it is offensive to dress up as a celebrity who happens to be a different race, and try and make yourself look like that person as best as possible. Mrs The act of black face (or blacking up ) is offensive not the expression " How do you mean? In the sense of applying dark face makeup for fancy dress purposes? Or is it offensive to dress up as someone of a different race. I mean would it have been ok to dress up as Mr T but not used dark face makeup? | |||
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" As I don't see people as a colour I see them as people in their own right. Their skin colour, ethnicity, and culture is part of their person. That goes for white people as well." Exactly. Thats why I dont see someone as a colour I see them as an individual in their own right. Everyone has their own beliefs ethnicity and cultures and those arnt necessarily defined by the colour of someones skin. | |||
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"Do you think its disrespectful of someone see people as people and not a colour? As I don't see people as a colour I see them as people in their own right." The 1st two responses to your comment essentially summed up my thoughts. I am a black male. I class myself one and there is no disputing it. That comes with baggage/connotations or whatever you wish to refer to it as. Some of it is positive, and some of it is negative. We should all be proud to identify with who we are. Whether you are a straight white male, a straight white female, a gay female, a black man, a hijabi or whatever. There is beauty in all cultures and races and we should embrace it and seek to learn and appreciate it. When someone says 'I don't see you as black' what that actually says, or implies, to me is "you're not like what I perceive, expect or have experienced black people to be like so I don't see you like that. This allows me to maintain my stereotype in complete comfort. Happy days." | |||
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" As I don't see people as a colour I see them as people in their own right. Their skin colour, ethnicity, and culture is part of their person. That goes for white people as well. Exactly. Thats why I dont see someone as a colour I see them as an individual in their own right. Everyone has their own beliefs ethnicity and cultures and those arnt necessarily defined by the colour of someones skin." No. You don't understand my point. Peoples colour shapes them in our world, to a point. Because of racial oppression. By ignoring their skin colour you are ignoring the struggles that they may have had to overcome to get to that point, which could well be a large part of my culture. It's like you saying to me 'I don't see gender, I see people'. But being born female is something that is crucial to the person that I am. It has affected everything I have done in life. It affects almost every interaction I have with someone. Being born female is a core part of my identity. And so is being white. Being white is something that has shaped my very being from the day I was born. It has opened doors for me. It has gained me preferential treatment. It has allowed me to do things that would not have been possible if I was a person of colour. It is who I am. To ignore things that are such fundamental parts of me and to insist that they're so unimportant that 'you don't see them' is to ignore the very parts of me that make me who I am. | |||
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"When someone says 'I don't see you as black' what that actually says, or implies, to me is "you're not like what I perceive, expect or have experienced black people to be like so I don't see you like that. This allows me to maintain my stereotype in complete comfort. Happy days."" I think there's a difference between someone saying "I don't see you as black" and someone saying they don't see colour. One is offensive, the other is more naive and what many think is the correct way to think. | |||
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"Do you think its disrespectful of someone see people as people and not a colour? As I don't see people as a colour I see them as people in their own right. The 1st two responses to your comment essentially summed up my thoughts. I am a black male. I class myself one and there is no disputing it. That comes with baggage/connotations or whatever you wish to refer to it as. Some of it is positive, and some of it is negative. We should all be proud to identify with who we are. Whether you are a straight white male, a straight white female, a gay female, a black man, a hijabi or whatever. There is beauty in all cultures and races and we should embrace it and seek to learn and appreciate it. When someone says 'I don't see you as black' what that actually says, or implies, to me is "you're not like what I perceive, expect or have experienced black people to be like so I don't see you like that. This allows me to maintain my stereotype in complete comfort. Happy days."" I see people's colour. There's no avoiding it, I have eyes. Peoples skin colour is diffent. It's the way it is. The only time I felt anytype of racial difference myself was in the US. I was in a jam packed tram in Washington. I was the only white guy in my car. Shoulder to shoulder, and I felt different, why, only because of my skin. That was the only difference. It was a very odd feeling. If I hadn't been aware and learnt of the racial hatred people have had to put up with through history, maybe I'd have up in that subway without a second thought. | |||
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"When someone says 'I don't see you as black' what that actually says, or implies, to me is "you're not like what I perceive, expect or have experienced black people to be like so I don't see you like that. This allows me to maintain my stereotype in complete comfort. Happy days." I think there's a difference between someone saying "I don't see you as black" and someone saying they don't see colour. One is offensive, the other is more naive and what many think is the correct way to think. " I'd be keen to understand your perception of the difference (either here or in private) as I don't see them as different figuratively or contextually. I liken it to a female with a predominately male group of friends. Who hypothetically: - Supports a football team, avidly - Is partial to the odd pint or 3 - Has great 'banter' Typically members of that group will say things like 'yeah but I don't see you as a girl, you're one of the lads innit'. What they are essentially saying, IMO, is 'you don't fit my stereotype of a dainty female who drinks slim line tonics, thinks Pele is a type of pasta and is ultra sensitive so of course I don't see you as a bird.' | |||
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"Do you think its disrespectful of someone see people as people and not a colour? As I don't see people as a colour I see them as people in their own right. The 1st two responses to your comment essentially summed up my thoughts. I am a black male. I class myself one and there is no disputing it. That comes with baggage/connotations or whatever you wish to refer to it as. Some of it is positive, and some of it is negative. We should all be proud to identify with who we are. Whether you are a straight white male, a straight white female, a gay female, a black man, a hijabi or whatever. There is beauty in all cultures and races and we should embrace it and seek to learn and appreciate it. When someone says 'I don't see you as black' what that actually says, or implies, to me is "you're not like what I perceive, expect or have experienced black people to be like so I don't see you like that. This allows me to maintain my stereotype in complete comfort. Happy days."" I see you as a person just like me regardless of what colour we are. People have different cultures beliefs faiths etc and thats what makes us all individuals. But when I see someone I see them as a person and an individual in their own right . Not as a colour. Whether people agree with how I see things or not is entirely upto them? But thats how I see things and Im happy with my own personal view on skin colour. | |||
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"I see you as a person just like me regardless of what colour we are. People have different cultures beliefs faiths etc and thats what makes us all individuals. But when I see someone I see them as a person and an individual in their own right . Not as a colour. Whether people agree with how I see things or not is entirely upto them? But thats how I see things and Im happy with my own personal view on skin colour." So for clarity, what defining factors within an individual do you see? For example do you see male and female? | |||
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"Do you think its disrespectful of someone see people as people and not a colour? As I don't see people as a colour I see them as people in their own right. The 1st two responses to your comment essentially summed up my thoughts. I am a black male. I class myself one and there is no disputing it. That comes with baggage/connotations or whatever you wish to refer to it as. Some of it is positive, and some of it is negative. We should all be proud to identify with who we are. Whether you are a straight white male, a straight white female, a gay female, a black man, a hijabi or whatever. There is beauty in all cultures and races and we should embrace it and seek to learn and appreciate it. When someone says 'I don't see you as black' what that actually says, or implies, to me is "you're not like what I perceive, expect or have experienced black people to be like so I don't see you like that. This allows me to maintain my stereotype in complete comfort. Happy days."" Completely agree with everything you've just said. So what is your view with regards to fancy dress and the issue of a white person dressing up as a celebrity who is black. I'm curious as to whether that is something that should be avoided and if so why? | |||
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"Why on earth would you put that on FB except to shit stir for your friend?" Was nothing to do with her though. She wasn't at all involved (she's not going to the do) it was to show to the girl that was contemplating doing it that it would aggregate someone | |||
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"When someone says 'I don't see you as black' what that actually says, or implies, to me is "you're not like what I perceive, expect or have experienced black people to be like so I don't see you like that. This allows me to maintain my stereotype in complete comfort. Happy days." I think there's a difference between someone saying "I don't see you as black" and someone saying they don't see colour. One is offensive, the other is more naive and what many think is the correct way to think. I'd be keen to understand your perception of the difference (either here or in private) as I don't see them as different figuratively or contextually. I liken it to a female with a predominately male group of friends. Who hypothetically: - Supports a football team, avidly - Is partial to the odd pint or 3 - Has great 'banter' Typically members of that group will say things like 'yeah but I don't see you as a girl, you're one of the lads innit'. What they are essentially saying, IMO, is 'you don't fit my stereotype of a dainty female who drinks slim line tonics, thinks Pele is a type of pasta and is ultra sensitive so of course I don't see you as a bird.' " Yes, and I'd find that a little offensive. Whereas when people say, I don't see genders, we're all equal, that's maybe a little naive but not what I'd call offensive. "Pele is a type of pasta"  | |||
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"Completely agree with everything you've just said. So what is your view with regards to fancy dress and the issue of a white person dressing up as a celebrity who is black. I'm curious as to whether that is something that should be avoided and if so why? " Dressing up as a black celebrity isn't necessarily an issue. Black face however should be avoided at all cost. If you dressed with a Mohawk, Beard and fuck loads of gold you'd be pretty recognisable as Mr T. If you had the hair and MJ thriller costume you'd be pretty recognisable. Likewise, if I wanted to dress as Super Mario I'm sure I could make myself easily distinguishable without applying copious amounts of talcum powder to my face or any part of me. | |||
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"Completely agree with everything you've just said. So what is your view with regards to fancy dress and the issue of a white person dressing up as a celebrity who is black. I'm curious as to whether that is something that should be avoided and if so why? Dressing up as a black celebrity isn't necessarily an issue. Black face however should be avoided at all cost. If you dressed with a Mohawk, Beard and fuck loads of gold you'd be pretty recognisable as Mr T. If you had the hair and MJ thriller costume you'd be pretty recognisable. Likewise, if I wanted to dress as Super Mario I'm sure I could make myself easily distinguishable without applying copious amounts of talcum powder to my face or any part of me." I'd never really thought that applying face make up to change skin colour is something that is offensive, largely because I wouldn't find it offensive if you lightened your skin colour with makeup to look more like SuperMario. However my experiences as a white person will be very different, so I'm very happy to accept that a white person darkening their skin for fancy dress purposes could well cause offence, and I respect that. | |||
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" I'd never really thought that applying face make up to change skin colour is something that is offensive, largely because I wouldn't find it offensive if you lightened your skin colour with makeup to look more like SuperMario. However my experiences as a white person will be very different, so I'm very happy to accept that a white person darkening their skin for fancy dress purposes could well cause offence, and I respect that. " It's nice that we can have an exchange of views and it remain respectful. I don't know if you are allowed to link to YouTube etc but there are some decent little documentaries etc on the history of black face which provides the context as to why it is considered inappropriate and unacceptable | |||
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"Racism is racism. There's no such thing as 'proper' racism. The fact that it appears that some things are acceptable to some individuals because they aren't "that bad" on a subjective sliding scale is quite concerning. This isn't about being soft or sensitive, it's about sticking up for what's right and wrong. OP, sorry to hear about your friend and the misunderstanding about your post. Hope your friend listens to your explanation and things get patched up quickly ". By proper i meant nasty there's obviously a sliding scale, otherwise dressing up as mrT is no better than lynching, one is obviously a better out come than the other, I really don't think the woman in question is genuinely trying to offend black people by dressing as Mr T , it doesn't even prove that she's racist, perhaps insensitive at worst. Offense can be taken by anyone about anything, it's subjective!. You might be offended, others might not | |||
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"Now I'm aware theres gonna be divided opinion on this subject and its not so much the foundation topic I am interested in your opinions on. Its the 'apologising' Ive fallen out with my best friend of 17 years to the point she is ignoring my texts (she lives on my street but I darent go round!) So in short. A few of us are going to a fancy dress do. The theme is 'the 80s'. One girl (who is white) wanted to go as Mr T and black up her face to match the arms of the costume. To which I said that *I* wouldnt be upset but theres many that would. She wasn't having it and was gonna pay £40 off ebay. So I wrote a fb status saying 'is it wrong for a white person to black up for cool runnings' Well. My mate (white witj two mixed race kids) went MAD. But the general answer from other people was 'no. Its fun not spite and what about that film white chicks, that was the same' Deleted me and now ignoring my text. My other friends have told me not to dare apologise as I only asked a question but I'm a soft soul and feel awful. What would you do? " Why do you need to do put it on fuck face? Seems to me your causing trouble | |||
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" "I had an Albino ferret as a kid | |||
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"I proberbly wouldn't talk to someone again if they thought that blacking up for a fancy dress party was acceptable, to be honest." | |||
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"By proper i meant nasty there's obviously a sliding scale, otherwise dressing up as mrT is no better than lynching, one is obviously a better out come than the other, I really don't think the woman in question is genuinely trying to offend black people by dressing as Mr T , it doesn't even prove that she's racist, perhaps insensitive at worst. Offense can be taken by anyone about anything, it's subjective!. You might be offended, others might not" Can you give me an example of nice or non nasty racism please? | |||
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" And so is being white. Being white is something that has shaped my very being from the day I was born. It has opened doors for me. It has gained me preferential treatment. It has allowed me to do things that would not have been possible if I was a person of colour. It is who I am. " . What doors or preferential treatment did you get from your skin being white? And really if there's any miniscule difference, does it really override the main factors of income, schooling, parents etc etc. Just saying there's racism or sexisim out there and therefore that's the problem is unhelpful at best,I hate racism and sexism like most people do but can you give me some actual individual problems that you didn't face because you were white and then we can discuss how to change things? | |||
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"I proberbly wouldn't talk to someone again if they thought that blacking up for a fancy dress party was acceptable, to be honest." Why, can you explain why dressing up as a black person for a fancy dress party is so offensive that you would fall out with a close friend ?? | |||
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"By proper i meant nasty there's obviously a sliding scale, otherwise dressing up as mrT is no better than lynching, one is obviously a better out come than the other, I really don't think the woman in question is genuinely trying to offend black people by dressing as Mr T , it doesn't even prove that she's racist, perhaps insensitive at worst. Offense can be taken by anyone about anything, it's subjective!. You might be offended, others might not Can you give me an example of nice or non nasty racism please?" . Very nasty-Nasty -less nasty- slightly perturbing-it's just semantics | |||
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" And so is being white. Being white is something that has shaped my very being from the day I was born. It has opened doors for me. It has gained me preferential treatment. It has allowed me to do things that would not have been possible if I was a person of colour. It is who I am. . What doors or preferential treatment did you get from your skin being white? And really if there's any miniscule difference, does it really override the main factors of income, schooling, parents etc etc. Just saying there's racism or sexisim out there and therefore that's the problem is unhelpful at best,I hate racism and sexism like most people do but can you give me some actual individual problems that you didn't face because you were white and then we can discuss how to change things?" Jamie Kapp's white privilege comic might help you be a little clearer on how advantageous white skin colour is. Also the article "how to explain white privilege to a broke white person". | |||
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"I proberbly wouldn't talk to someone again if they thought that blacking up for a fancy dress party was acceptable, to be honest. Why, can you explain why dressing up as a black person for a fancy dress party is so offensive that you would fall out with a close friend ?? " Can you explain how it isn't? | |||
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"Very nasty-Nasty -less nasty- slightly perturbing-it's just semantics" And 'the line' is where exactly?  | |||
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"Very nasty-Nasty -less nasty- slightly perturbing-it's just semantics And 'the line' is where exactly? "
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"I proberbly wouldn't talk to someone again if they thought that blacking up for a fancy dress party was acceptable, to be honest. Why, can you explain why dressing up as a black person for a fancy dress party is so offensive that you would fall out with a close friend ?? Can you explain how it isn't?" Not dressing up as to represent a 'black person'. She said as Mr T. I can't see how I'd pull that off without putting something on my face to make my skin darker than the pasty grey I have. If Mr t offends you then your a fool. | |||
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"I proberbly wouldn't talk to someone again if they thought that blacking up for a fancy dress party was acceptable, to be honest. Why, can you explain why dressing up as a black person for a fancy dress party is so offensive that you would fall out with a close friend ?? Can you explain how it isn't?" Don't answer a question with a question , it is lazy, explain to me why someone dressing as a black celebrity to attend a fancy dress party is offensive? If you can  | |||
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"I proberbly wouldn't talk to someone again if they thought that blacking up for a fancy dress party was acceptable, to be honest. Why, can you explain why dressing up as a black person for a fancy dress party is so offensive that you would fall out with a close friend ?? Can you explain how it isn't? Not dressing up as to represent a 'black person'. She said as Mr T. I can't see how I'd pull that off without putting something on my face to make my skin darker than the pasty grey I have. If Mr t offends you then your a fool. "I pity the fool | |||
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"I proberbly wouldn't talk to someone again if they thought that blacking up for a fancy dress party was acceptable, to be honest. Why, can you explain why dressing up as a black person for a fancy dress party is so offensive that you would fall out with a close friend ?? Can you explain how it isn't? Don't answer a question with a question , it is lazy, explain to me why someone dressing as a black celebrity to attend a fancy dress party is offensive? If you can "I have personally put in references for people to read and have signposted re cultural appropriation -- others have explained in the post. Who's lazy? Plenty to read | |||
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"I proberbly wouldn't talk to someone again if they thought that blacking up for a fancy dress party was acceptable, to be honest. Why, can you explain why dressing up as a black person for a fancy dress party is so offensive that you would fall out with a close friend ?? Can you explain how it isn't? Don't answer a question with a question , it is lazy, explain to me why someone dressing as a black celebrity to attend a fancy dress party is offensive? If you can
I have personally put in references for people to read and have signposted re cultural appropriation -- others have explained in the post. Who's lazy? Plenty to read "Copy and pasting something you have read on Wikipedia isn't an answer. | |||
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"I proberbly wouldn't talk to someone again if they thought that blacking up for a fancy dress party was acceptable, to be honest. Why, can you explain why dressing up as a black person for a fancy dress party is so offensive that you would fall out with a close friend ?? Can you explain how it isn't? Not dressing up as to represent a 'black person'. She said as Mr T. I can't see how I'd pull that off without putting something on my face to make my skin darker than the pasty grey I have. If Mr t offends you then your a fool. "Cultural appropriation, fool. | |||
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"I proberbly wouldn't talk to someone again if they thought that blacking up for a fancy dress party was acceptable, to be honest. Why, can you explain why dressing up as a black person for a fancy dress party is so offensive that you would fall out with a close friend ?? Can you explain how it isn't? Don't answer a question with a question , it is lazy, explain to me why someone dressing as a black celebrity to attend a fancy dress party is offensive? If you can
I have personally put in references for people to read and have signposted re cultural appropriation -- others have explained in the post. Who's lazy? Plenty to read
Copy and pasting something you have read on Wikipedia isn't an answer. "LOL -- bless you. | |||
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" I'd never really thought that applying face make up to change skin colour is something that is offensive, largely because I wouldn't find it offensive if you lightened your skin colour with makeup to look more like SuperMario. However my experiences as a white person will be very different, so I'm very happy to accept that a white person darkening their skin for fancy dress purposes could well cause offence, and I respect that. It's nice that we can have an exchange of views and it remain respectful. I don't know if you are allowed to link to YouTube etc but there are some decent little documentaries etc on the history of black face which provides the context as to why it is considered inappropriate and unacceptable "The problem white people often have is that they are brought up not necessarily being aware that they are 'white'. I was never told I was white, and I haven't told my children they are white. That's another discussion as to whether that is a good or bad thing. We have however had numerous discussions as to whether our children regard themselves as English, Scottish, British or Canadian. But we've never discussed what race they are. I became racially aware as a young adult due to a number of life experiences, friendships and relationships. I became aware as a young adult that black people grow up knowing they are black, because they are told that by their families, friends and society. I did not grow up with these same awarenesses. Do correct me if I'm wrong, and I'm sure that is a very simplistic way of looking at things. But because many white people dont think too much about what race they are and the significance of it, mistakes get made. It would never have occurred to me that certain things are offensive to black people because in reverse they are not offensive to white people. I have learnt for the first time today that to change face colour with makeup for fancy dress purposes could be offensive. I didn't know that because I was making a judgement based on my own sensitivities. But I don't wish to cause offence so I will learn from that knowledge. | |||
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" I'd never really thought that applying face make up to change skin colour is something that is offensive, largely because I wouldn't find it offensive if you lightened your skin colour with makeup to look more like SuperMario. However my experiences as a white person will be very different, so I'm very happy to accept that a white person darkening their skin for fancy dress purposes could well cause offence, and I respect that. It's nice that we can have an exchange of views and it remain respectful. I don't know if you are allowed to link to YouTube etc but there are some decent little documentaries etc on the history of black face which provides the context as to why it is considered inappropriate and unacceptable
The problem white people often have is that they are brought up not necessarily being aware that they are 'white'. I was never told I was white, and I haven't told my children they are white. That's another discussion as to whether that is a good or bad thing. We have however had numerous discussions as to whether our children regard themselves as English, Scottish, British or Canadian. But we've never discussed what race they are. I became racially aware as a young adult due to a number of life experiences, friendships and relationships. I became aware as a young adult that black people grow up knowing they are black, because they are told that by their families, friends and society. I did not grow up with these same awarenesses. Do correct me if I'm wrong, and I'm sure that is a very simplistic way of looking at things. But because many white people dont think too much about what race they are and the significance of it, mistakes get made. It would never have occurred to me that certain things are offensive to black people because in reverse they are not offensive to white people. I have learnt for the first time today that to change face colour with makeup for fancy dress purposes could be offensive. I didn't know that because I was making a judgement based on my own sensitivities. But I don't wish to cause offence so I will learn from that knowledge." | |||
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"I proberbly wouldn't talk to someone again if they thought that blacking up for a fancy dress party was acceptable, to be honest. Why, can you explain why dressing up as a black person for a fancy dress party is so offensive that you would fall out with a close friend ?? Can you explain how it isn't? Don't answer a question with a question , it is lazy, explain to me why someone dressing as a black celebrity to attend a fancy dress party is offensive? If you can
I have personally put in references for people to read and have signposted re cultural appropriation -- others have explained in the post. Who's lazy? Plenty to read
Copy and pasting something you have read on Wikipedia isn't an answer.
LOL -- bless you."Why don't you give me an answer?? Try and put it in your own words, why is dressing up as a black celebrity to attend a fancy dress party offensive to you ?? | |||
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" And so is being white. Being white is something that has shaped my very being from the day I was born. It has opened doors for me. It has gained me preferential treatment. It has allowed me to do things that would not have been possible if I was a person of colour. It is who I am. . What doors or preferential treatment did you get from your skin being white? And really if there's any miniscule difference, does it really override the main factors of income, schooling, parents etc etc. Just saying there's racism or sexisim out there and therefore that's the problem is unhelpful at best,I hate racism and sexism like most people do but can you give me some actual individual problems that you didn't face because you were white and then we can discuss how to change things? Jamie Kapp's white privilege comic might help you be a little clearer on how advantageous white skin colour is. Also the article "how to explain white privilege to a broke white person"." . No I hate university psycho babble, it's just nonsense on the whole. | |||
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" And so is being white. Being white is something that has shaped my very being from the day I was born. It has opened doors for me. It has gained me preferential treatment. It has allowed me to do things that would not have been possible if I was a person of colour. It is who I am. . What doors or preferential treatment did you get from your skin being white? And really if there's any miniscule difference, does it really override the main factors of income, schooling, parents etc etc. Just saying there's racism or sexisim out there and therefore that's the problem is unhelpful at best,I hate racism and sexism like most people do but can you give me some actual individual problems that you didn't face because you were white and then we can discuss how to change things? Jamie Kapp's white privilege comic might help you be a little clearer on how advantageous white skin colour is. Also the article "how to explain white privilege to a broke white person".. No I hate university psycho babble, it's just nonsense on the whole. " | |||
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"I proberbly wouldn't talk to someone again if they thought that blacking up for a fancy dress party was acceptable, to be honest. Why, can you explain why dressing up as a black person for a fancy dress party is so offensive that you would fall out with a close friend ?? Can you explain how it isn't? Don't answer a question with a question , it is lazy, explain to me why someone dressing as a black celebrity to attend a fancy dress party is offensive? If you can
I have personally put in references for people to read and have signposted re cultural appropriation -- others have explained in the post. Who's lazy? Plenty to read
Copy and pasting something you have read on Wikipedia isn't an answer.
LOL -- bless you.
Why don't you give me an answer?? Try and put it in your own words, why is dressing up as a black celebrity to attend a fancy dress party offensive to you ??"I have answered, using my words earlier. You chose to ignore it, as is your right. Many others have answered in this post too. I'm not sure you're actually interested in listening further, and I can see you're not interested in learning by your disregard for genuine provision of info. Ah well. Carry on | |||
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" And so is being white. Being white is something that has shaped my very being from the day I was born. It has opened doors for me. It has gained me preferential treatment. It has allowed me to do things that would not have been possible if I was a person of colour. It is who I am. . What doors or preferential treatment did you get from your skin being white? And really if there's any miniscule difference, does it really override the main factors of income, schooling, parents etc etc. Just saying there's racism or sexisim out there and therefore that's the problem is unhelpful at best,I hate racism and sexism like most people do but can you give me some actual individual problems that you didn't face because you were white and then we can discuss how to change things? Jamie Kapp's white privilege comic might help you be a little clearer on how advantageous white skin colour is. Also the article "how to explain white privilege to a broke white person".. No I hate university psycho babble, it's just nonsense on the whole. " Ha ha! You're funny! | |||
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"On another topic (no facepaint involved) what about the fashion of summer in the mid 2000's where everyone went mad for Indian style clothing? Do you feel that was wrong? " That still comes up under cultural appropriation -- there's some brill links but we aren't allowed to insert them here. It's really worth reading up about if you're interested | |||
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"I proberbly wouldn't talk to someone again if they thought that blacking up for a fancy dress party was acceptable, to be honest. Why, can you explain why dressing up as a black person for a fancy dress party is so offensive that you would fall out with a close friend ?? Can you explain how it isn't? Don't answer a question with a question , it is lazy, explain to me why someone dressing as a black celebrity to attend a fancy dress party is offensive? If you can
I have personally put in references for people to read and have signposted re cultural appropriation -- others have explained in the post. Who's lazy? Plenty to read
Copy and pasting something you have read on Wikipedia isn't an answer.
LOL -- bless you.
Why don't you give me an answer?? Try and put it in your own words, why is dressing up as a black celebrity to attend a fancy dress party offensive to you ??"
Why can't you accept when people choose to ignore your questions? Do you want a personal row? Where people have provided explanations you don't accept them and just push for your question to be answered. Keep that tactic for the Angry Forum. It's perfectly acceptable here for people to ignore posts. | |||
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"Very nasty-Nasty -less nasty- slightly perturbing-it's just semantics And 'the line' is where exactly? ". What line? What are you on about?. I said it was a sliding scale and by proper racism I meant nasty like the difference between Nasty crime rape and not so nasty crime stealing from a shop and the perturbing crime like tax evasion. What your now asking me is which crime is good | |||
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"On another topic (no facepaint involved) what about the fashion of summer in the mid 2000's where everyone went mad for Indian style clothing? Do you feel that was wrong? " Really? | |||
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"On another topic (no facepaint involved) what about the fashion of summer in the mid 2000's where everyone went mad for Indian style clothing? Do you feel that was wrong? That still comes up under cultural appropriation -- there's some brill links but we aren't allowed to insert them here. It's really worth reading up about if you're interested "I suppose if I started doing yoga that would also be offensive | |||
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"Very nasty-Nasty -less nasty- slightly perturbing-it's just semantics And 'the line' is where exactly? .
What line? What are you on about?.
I said it was a sliding scale and by proper racism I meant nasty like the difference between Nasty crime rape and not so nasty crime stealing from a shop and the perturbing crime like tax evasion.
What your now asking me is which crime is good"You mentioned "really don't think the woman in question is genuinely trying to offend black people by dressing as Mr T , it doesn't even prove that she's racist, perhaps insensitive at worst" -- you do understand that her intent is irrelevant? | |||
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"I proberbly wouldn't talk to someone again if they thought that blacking up for a fancy dress party was acceptable, to be honest. Why, can you explain why dressing up as a black person for a fancy dress party is so offensive that you would fall out with a close friend ?? Can you explain how it isn't? Don't answer a question with a question , it is lazy, explain to me why someone dressing as a black celebrity to attend a fancy dress party is offensive? If you can
I have personally put in references for people to read and have signposted re cultural appropriation -- others have explained in the post. Who's lazy? Plenty to read
Copy and pasting something you have read on Wikipedia isn't an answer.
LOL -- bless you.
Why don't you give me an answer?? Try and put it in your own words, why is dressing up as a black celebrity to attend a fancy dress party offensive to you ??
Why can't you accept when people choose to ignore your questions? Do you want a personal row? Where people have provided explanations you don't accept them and just push for your question to be answered. Keep that tactic for the Angry Forum. It's perfectly acceptable here for people to ignore posts."Did you say something | |||
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"By drawing attention to it and putting a status about it sort of makes it look like you think it's wrong. I don't think it's wrong, I think it's funny. If they were dressing up as the mask or the hulk then I assume they would green up. If they were going as Mr T who is black then I would assume to imitate his look would also involve imitating his skin colour and also wearing a big fuck off gold chain. People look for things to be offended by. I wouldn't have put a status asking about whether it was right or wrong though. " totally agree with this
It's fancy dress. End of. It's not done with malicious intent. Offense is everywhere when it's looked for.
Delete your post on Facebook, and if you feel the need, apologise for any offence.
At the end of the day, you aren't dressing up like it, so it's actually nothing to do with you (please don't take offence at that)x good luck x
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"On another topic (no facepaint involved) what about the fashion of summer in the mid 2000's where everyone went mad for Indian style clothing? Do you feel that was wrong? That still comes up under cultural appropriation -- there's some brill links but we aren't allowed to insert them here. It's really worth reading up about if you're interested
I suppose if I started doing yoga that would also be offensive
"Well if you read about the subject then there are potentially issues there, yes. Well done. | |||
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"On another topic (no facepaint involved) what about the fashion of summer in the mid 2000's where everyone went mad for Indian style clothing? Do you feel that was wrong? That still comes up under cultural appropriation -- there's some brill links but we aren't allowed to insert them here. It's really worth reading up about if you're interested "The idea of ‘cultural appropriation’ sums up everything rotten in today’s intensifying politics of identity. It’s fuelled by the borderline racist idea that to mix cultures is bad. It isn’t only yoga that’s getting it in its supple neck from these new cultural purists: white rappers like Iggy Azalea are slammed for appropriating black culture; students have been banned from wearing sombreros lest Mexicans feel mocked; non-black celebs who try out the cornrow hairstyle can expect to be Twitch-hunted by mobs of these new cultural purists who think black people and white people should stick to their own cultural camps. Copy and pasted | |||
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"On another topic (no facepaint involved) what about the fashion of summer in the mid 2000's where everyone went mad for Indian style clothing? Do you feel that was wrong? That still comes up under cultural appropriation -- there's some brill links but we aren't allowed to insert them here. It's really worth reading up about if you're interested
I suppose if I started doing yoga that would also be offensive
Well if you read about the subject then there are potentially issues there, yes. Well done. " | |||
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" And so is being white. Being white is something that has shaped my very being from the day I was born. It has opened doors for me. It has gained me preferential treatment. It has allowed me to do things that would not have been possible if I was a person of colour. It is who I am. . What doors or preferential treatment did you get from your skin being white? And really if there's any miniscule difference, does it really override the main factors of income, schooling, parents etc etc. Just saying there's racism or sexisim out there and therefore that's the problem is unhelpful at best,I hate racism and sexism like most people do but can you give me some actual individual problems that you didn't face because you were white and then we can discuss how to change things? Jamie Kapp's white privilege comic might help you be a little clearer on how advantageous white skin colour is. Also the article "how to explain white privilege to a broke white person".. No I hate university psycho babble, it's just nonsense on the whole. Ha ha! You're funny!" . It could be worse, we could be letting young people take courses and get degrees in this babble. Yeah I bet those pesky Koreans and Japanese are busy getting their children PhD up in psycho babble so they can take over us economically!. Were all doomed | |||
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"By drawing attention to it and putting a status about it sort of makes it look like you think it's wrong. I don't think it's wrong, I think it's funny. If they were dressing up as the mask or the hulk then I assume they would green up. If they were going as Mr T who is black then I would assume to imitate his look would also involve imitating his skin colour and also wearing a big fuck off gold chain. People look for things to be offended by. I wouldn't have put a status asking about whether it was right or wrong though. totally agree with this
It's fancy dress. End of. It's not done with malicious intent. Offense is everywhere when it's looked for.
Delete your post on Facebook, and if you feel the need, apologise for any offence.
At the end of the day, you aren't dressing up like it, so it's actually nothing to do with you (please don't take offence at that)x good luck x
"Totally agree that from the scenario there is perhaps no malicious intent, that isn't the point as to why it's offensive though. And it is offensive. It's cultural appropriation. | |||
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"On another topic (no facepaint involved) what about the fashion of summer in the mid 2000's where everyone went mad for Indian style clothing? Do you feel that was wrong? That still comes up under cultural appropriation -- there's some brill links but we aren't allowed to insert them here. It's really worth reading up about if you're interested
I suppose if I started doing yoga that would also be offensive
Well if you read about the subject then there are potentially issues there, yes. Well done. "These type of theories actually fuel racism rather than prevent it | |||
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"Now I'm aware theres gonna be divided opinion on this subject and its not so much the foundation topic I am interested in your opinions on. Its the 'apologising' Ive fallen out with my best friend of 17 years to the point she is ignoring my texts (she lives on my street but I darent go round!) So in short. A few of us are going to a fancy dress do. The theme is 'the 80s'. One girl (who is white) wanted to go as Mr T and black up her face to match the arms of the costume. To which I said that *I* wouldnt be upset but theres many that would. She wasn't having it and was gonna pay £40 off ebay. So I wrote a fb status saying 'is it wrong for a white person to black up for cool runnings' Well. My mate (white witj two mixed race kids) went MAD. But the general answer from other people was 'no. Its fun not spite and what about that film white chicks, that was the same' Deleted me and now ignoring my text. My other friends have told me not to dare apologise as I only asked a question but I'm a soft soul and feel awful. What would you do? " That is not your friend, im sorry to say this but it is what it is. X | |||
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"On another topic (no facepaint involved) what about the fashion of summer in the mid 2000's where everyone went mad for Indian style clothing? Do you feel that was wrong? That still comes up under cultural appropriation -- there's some brill links but we aren't allowed to insert them here. It's really worth reading up about if you're interested
The idea of ‘cultural appropriation’ sums up everything rotten in today’s intensifying politics of identity. It’s fuelled by the borderline racist idea that to mix cultures is bad. It isn’t only yoga that’s getting it in its supple neck from these new cultural purists: white rappers like Iggy Azalea are slammed for appropriating black culture; students have been banned from wearing sombreros lest Mexicans feel mocked; non-black celebs who try out the cornrow hairstyle can expect to be Twitch-hunted by mobs of these new cultural purists who think black people and white people should stick to their own cultural camps.
Copy and pasted "Yes, trivialising violent historical oppression, feeling it's ok to take on aspects of a culture whilst allowing a continuation of prejudice against people of that culture, having "cool" things for white people that are too "ethnic" for people of colour, privileged people profiting from less privileged people's labour -- yup, it's an effort when it means you can't wear that hairdo, outfit whatever or perhaps think about who is gaining from that class you're attending. Phew, the compassion is strong here! Poor little you! | |||
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" And so is being white. Being white is something that has shaped my very being from the day I was born. It has opened doors for me. It has gained me preferential treatment. It has allowed me to do things that would not have been possible if I was a person of colour. It is who I am. . What doors or preferential treatment did you get from your skin being white? And really if there's any miniscule difference, does it really override the main factors of income, schooling, parents etc etc. Just saying there's racism or sexisim out there and therefore that's the problem is unhelpful at best,I hate racism and sexism like most people do but can you give me some actual individual problems that you didn't face because you were white and then we can discuss how to change things? Jamie Kapp's white privilege comic might help you be a little clearer on how advantageous white skin colour is. Also the article "how to explain white privilege to a broke white person".. No I hate university psycho babble, it's just nonsense on the whole. Ha ha! You're funny!. It could be worse, we could be letting young people take courses and get degrees in this babble. Yeah I bet those pesky Koreans and Japanese are busy getting their children PhD up in psycho babble so they can take over us economically!. Were all doomed "Nonsense. | |||
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"Interesting thread. As a result of certain life experiences, friendships and relationships, I am very aware of racial issues, as well as different cultures and people's heritage. I'm not black though and don't claim to know what its like to be black. I'm aware of certain expressions being offensive to due racism, though I have not to date heard of the expression 'blacking up'. I am aware of it now. Obviously as it is an offensive expression, that the OP was not aware of, then she should oppologise for causing that offence. With regards to fancy dress, I wouldn't have thought that it is offensive to dress up as a celebrity who happens to be a different race, and try and make yourself look like that person as best as possible. Mrs The act of black face (or blacking up ) is offensive not the expression How do you mean? In the sense of applying dark face makeup for fancy dress purposes? Or is it offensive to dress up as someone of a different race. I mean would it have been ok to dress up as Mr T but not used dark face makeup? " I mean as in putting make up on your face to appear black . Fancy dress or not I don't like it | |||
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"On another topic (no facepaint involved) what about the fashion of summer in the mid 2000's where everyone went mad for Indian style clothing? Do you feel that was wrong? That still comes up under cultural appropriation -- there's some brill links but we aren't allowed to insert them here. It's really worth reading up about if you're interested
I suppose if I started doing yoga that would also be offensive
Well if you read about the subject then there are potentially issues there, yes. Well done.
These type of theories actually fuel racism rather than prevent it "Now you're just being absurd. LOL | |||
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"On another topic (no facepaint involved) what about the fashion of summer in the mid 2000's where everyone went mad for Indian style clothing? Do you feel that was wrong? That still comes up under cultural appropriation -- there's some brill links but we aren't allowed to insert them here. It's really worth reading up about if you're interested
I suppose if I started doing yoga that would also be offensive
Well if you read about the subject then there are potentially issues there, yes. Well done.
These type of theories actually fuel racism rather than prevent it
Now you're just being absurd. LOL"I think cultural appropriation is a load of baloney, based on the most persistent errors in political/social thought: abstraction errors – misunderstanding the relationship between people and labels, between aggregates and concretes. These errors are not only imprecise, but they are counter-productive, divisive, and downright dangerous | |||
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"On another topic (no facepaint involved) what about the fashion of summer in the mid 2000's where everyone went mad for Indian style clothing? Do you feel that was wrong? That still comes up under cultural appropriation -- there's some brill links but we aren't allowed to insert them here. It's really worth reading up about if you're interested
The idea of ‘cultural appropriation’ sums up everything rotten in today’s intensifying politics of identity. It’s fuelled by the borderline racist idea that to mix cultures is bad. It isn’t only yoga that’s getting it in its supple neck from these new cultural purists: white rappers like Iggy Azalea are slammed for appropriating black culture; students have been banned from wearing sombreros lest Mexicans feel mocked; non-black celebs who try out the cornrow hairstyle can expect to be Twitch-hunted by mobs of these new cultural purists who think black people and white people should stick to their own cultural camps.
Copy and pasted
Yes, trivialising violent historical oppression, feeling it's ok to take on aspects of a culture whilst allowing a continuation of prejudice against people of that culture, having "cool" things for white people that are too "ethnic" for people of colour, privileged people profiting from less privileged people's labour -- yup, it's an effort when it means you can't wear that hairdo, outfit whatever or perhaps think about who is gaining from that class you're attending. Phew, the compassion is strong here! Poor little you!
"Poor little me? Patronising? Btw do you know my cultural background?? | |||
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"On another topic (no facepaint involved) what about the fashion of summer in the mid 2000's where everyone went mad for Indian style clothing? Do you feel that was wrong? That still comes up under cultural appropriation -- there's some brill links but we aren't allowed to insert them here. It's really worth reading up about if you're interested
I suppose if I started doing yoga that would also be offensive
Well if you read about the subject then there are potentially issues there, yes. Well done.
These type of theories actually fuel racism rather than prevent it
Now you're just being absurd. LOL
I think cultural appropriation is a load of baloney, based on the most persistent errors in political/social thought: abstraction errors – misunderstanding the relationship between people and labels, between aggregates and concretes. These errors are not only imprecise, but they are counter-productive, divisive, and downright dangerous"I think that's baloney. | |||
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"On another topic (no facepaint involved) what about the fashion of summer in the mid 2000's where everyone went mad for Indian style clothing? Do you feel that was wrong? That still comes up under cultural appropriation -- there's some brill links but we aren't allowed to insert them here. It's really worth reading up about if you're interested
The idea of ‘cultural appropriation’ sums up everything rotten in today’s intensifying politics of identity. It’s fuelled by the borderline racist idea that to mix cultures is bad. It isn’t only yoga that’s getting it in its supple neck from these new cultural purists: white rappers like Iggy Azalea are slammed for appropriating black culture; students have been banned from wearing sombreros lest Mexicans feel mocked; non-black celebs who try out the cornrow hairstyle can expect to be Twitch-hunted by mobs of these new cultural purists who think black people and white people should stick to their own cultural camps.
Copy and pasted
Yes, trivialising violent historical oppression, feeling it's ok to take on aspects of a culture whilst allowing a continuation of prejudice against people of that culture, having "cool" things for white people that are too "ethnic" for people of colour, privileged people profiting from less privileged people's labour -- yup, it's an effort when it means you can't wear that hairdo, outfit whatever or perhaps think about who is gaining from that class you're attending. Phew, the compassion is strong here! Poor little you!
Poor little me? Patronising? Btw do you know my cultural background?? "You're plenty patronising yourself -- my apologies if I offended 'you' though. It was more the universal you in my comment though, just so you know. And no, care to disclose? I'd be interested to know. | |||
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"Should of just gone as Michael Jackson. Sorted." Oh Lib. | |||
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"I proberbly wouldn't talk to someone again if they thought that blacking up for a fancy dress party was acceptable, to be honest. Why, can you explain why dressing up as a black person for a fancy dress party is so offensive that you would fall out with a close friend ?? Can you explain how it isn't? Not dressing up as to represent a 'black person'. She said as Mr T. I can't see how I'd pull that off without putting something on my face to make my skin darker than the pasty grey I have. If Mr t offends you then your a fool.
I pity the fool
"Giggling | |||
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"On another topic (no facepaint involved) what about the fashion of summer in the mid 2000's where everyone went mad for Indian style clothing? Do you feel that was wrong? That still comes up under cultural appropriation -- there's some brill links but we aren't allowed to insert them here. It's really worth reading up about if you're interested
I suppose if I started doing yoga that would also be offensive
Well if you read about the subject then there are potentially issues there, yes. Well done.
These type of theories actually fuel racism rather than prevent it
Now you're just being absurd. LOL
I think cultural appropriation is a load of baloney, based on the most persistent errors in political/social thought: abstraction errors – misunderstanding the relationship between people and labels, between aggregates and concretes. These errors are not only imprecise, but they are counter-productive, divisive, and downright dangerous
I think that's baloney. "It was written by a 'black' man | |||
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"On another topic (no facepaint involved) what about the fashion of summer in the mid 2000's where everyone went mad for Indian style clothing? Do you feel that was wrong? That still comes up under cultural appropriation -- there's some brill links but we aren't allowed to insert them here. It's really worth reading up about if you're interested
I suppose if I started doing yoga that would also be offensive
Well if you read about the subject then there are potentially issues there, yes. Well done.
These type of theories actually fuel racism rather than prevent it
Now you're just being absurd. LOL
I think cultural appropriation is a load of baloney, based on the most persistent errors in political/social thought: abstraction errors – misunderstanding the relationship between people and labels, between aggregates and concretes. These errors are not only imprecise, but they are counter-productive, divisive, and downright dangerous
I think that's baloney.
It was written by a 'black' man "And? | |||
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"I proberbly wouldn't talk to someone again if they thought that blacking up for a fancy dress party was acceptable, to be honest. Aye. The fact that so few of you can't see that blacking up in any context disturbs me somewhat " to both quotes
Blacking up is never acceptable. I find it grossly offensive and likewise disturbing that many of you can't see any problem with it. | |||
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" Well......this has all gone rather political. " Because it is important to call out, IMO | |||
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"H got a bollocking from a black guy with dredds on here the other week. Some people really do need history lessons or at least be able to do an internet search.
S"A bollocking for what? | |||
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"On another topic (no facepaint involved) what about the fashion of summer in the mid 2000's where everyone went mad for Indian style clothing? Do you feel that was wrong? That still comes up under cultural appropriation -- there's some brill links but we aren't allowed to insert them here. It's really worth reading up about if you're interested
The idea of ‘cultural appropriation’ sums up everything rotten in today’s intensifying politics of identity. It’s fuelled by the borderline racist idea that to mix cultures is bad. It isn’t only yoga that’s getting it in its supple neck from these new cultural purists: white rappers like Iggy Azalea are slammed for appropriating black culture; students have been banned from wearing sombreros lest Mexicans feel mocked; non-black celebs who try out the cornrow hairstyle can expect to be Twitch-hunted by mobs of these new cultural purists who think black people and white people should stick to their own cultural camps.
Copy and pasted
Yes, trivialising violent historical oppression, feeling it's ok to take on aspects of a culture whilst allowing a continuation of prejudice against people of that culture, having "cool" things for white people that are too "ethnic" for people of colour, privileged people profiting from less privileged people's labour -- yup, it's an effort when it means you can't wear that hairdo, outfit whatever or perhaps think about who is gaining from that class you're attending. Phew, the compassion is strong here! Poor little you!
Poor little me? Patronising? Btw do you know my cultural background??
You're plenty patronising yourself -- my apologies if I offended 'you' though. It was more the universal you in my comment though, just so you know. And no, care to disclose? I'd be interested to know. "I am 'mixed race' I have decended from many different cultural backgrounds, as I suspect is this case for most people . How do I fit into you cultural appropriation theory?? | |||
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"I proberbly wouldn't talk to someone again if they thought that blacking up for a fancy dress party was acceptable, to be honest. Aye. The fact that so few of you can't see that blacking up in any context disturbs me somewhat to both quotes
Blacking up is never acceptable. I find it grossly offensive and likewise disturbing that many of you can't see any problem with it."Is it "ok" to dress like a Chinaman if you don't do the eyes? | |||
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" I think you've got to be a proper kind of mental if you think putting boot polish on your face and go parading around saying "look at me I'm a black man" is anyway acceptable. " Although, let's not be offensive to those with mental health difficulties whilst pointing out the idiocy and offensiveness of those who think blacking up is harmless, eh? | |||
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"I proberbly wouldn't talk to someone again if they thought that blacking up for a fancy dress party was acceptable, to be honest. Aye. The fact that so few of you can't see that blacking up in any context disturbs me somewhat to both quotes
Blacking up is never acceptable. I find it grossly offensive and likewise disturbing that many of you can't see any problem with it."The problem us is that many white people (including myself) don't know the history that causes this to be offensive, therefore they don't know that it's inappropriate. I think a lot of white will compare it to the reverse i.e. 'whiting up' (if there is such a thing). I didn't have this knowledge before, but I'm not deliberately ignorant. I just didn't know. But I know now. | |||
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"On another topic (no facepaint involved) what about the fashion of summer in the mid 2000's where everyone went mad for Indian style clothing? Do you feel that was wrong? That still comes up under cultural appropriation -- there's some brill links but we aren't allowed to insert them here. It's really worth reading up about if you're interested
I suppose if I started doing yoga that would also be offensive
Well if you read about the subject then there are potentially issues there, yes. Well done.
These type of theories actually fuel racism rather than prevent it
Now you're just being absurd. LOL
I think cultural appropriation is a load of baloney, based on the most persistent errors in political/social thought: abstraction errors – misunderstanding the relationship between people and labels, between aggregates and concretes. These errors are not only imprecise, but they are counter-productive, divisive, and downright dangerous
I think that's baloney.
It was written by a 'black' man "What you've quoted seems to be from an article by a Philosopher called Steve Patterson. Who appears to be white. Not that it particularly matters. | |||
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