FabSwingers.com > Forums > The Lounge > Census forms...
Census forms...
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"I can't be arsed so me for one won't be doing it " They will come around and pee through your letterbox, if you don't fill the form in  | |||
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"I can't be arsed so me for one won't be doing it They will come around and pee through your letterbox, if you don't fill the form in "Hey are you a spy as they have been recruiting..Glad you said pee though and not shit   | |||
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"So does anyone know the purpose of them?" There supposed to keep track of the population I believe and predict statistics for the future... So they say? | |||
"I can't be arsed so me for one won't be doing it " they can fine you £1000 for not filling in the form. | |||
"I can't be arsed so me for one won't be doing it they can fine you £1000 for not filling in the form." They are going to make sure people fill them in this time by the looks of it. | |||
wonder what to put this time | |||
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"Oh for goodness sakes ! 1)the personal information stays secret BY LAW for 100 years 2) they don't sell the information -that is illegal 3) If the results are to be "released" next year it means the overall statistics like "how many people who live here were not born here." 4) without the data they get from the census the govt cannot plan for schools housing health care and everything else Otherwise it really is just guesswork and there is enough of that already. " Thanks! That's what I was after although your "oh for goodness sake" was a tad on the patronising side!
I shall make my entry count! | |||
"Oh for goodness sakes ! 1)the personal information stays secret BY LAW for 100 years 2) they don't sell the information -that is illegal 3) If the results are to be "released" next year it means the overall statistics like "how many people who live here were not born here." 4) without the data they get from the census the govt cannot plan for schools housing health care and everything else Otherwise it really is just guesswork and there is enough of that already. " + 1 | |||
"Oh for goodness sakes ! 1)the personal information stays secret BY LAW for 100 years 2) they don't sell the information -that is illegal 3) If the results are to be "released" next year it means the overall statistics like "how many people who live here were not born here." 4) without the data they get from the census the govt cannot plan for schools housing health care and everything else Otherwise it really is just guesswork and there is enough of that already. " You forgot to add it points out who is paying tax, who isn't and also is used to cross check the benefit system. I don't think they like to voice that it helps catch people on the fiddle. | |||
" You forgot to add it points out who is paying tax, who isn't and also is used to cross check the benefit system. I don't think they like to voice that it helps catch people on the fiddle. " You see this is exactly what my cynical mind is wondering. It says the information will be released next year. Released to whom? | |||
The stats are also useful for figuring out demographics and if there is a lack (or surplus) of services in an area.
[lots more old people in place x, depopulation in a previously populated area etc]. | |||
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"There's nothing wrong with catching people who are fiddling the rest of us either through tax evasion or benefit fraud" Gosh you're touchy about this!! 
I never said there was anything wrong with catching people who are fiddling benefits... I'm asking questions because I'd prefer to know what I'm filling in if that's okay with you!
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"Wonder if the gypsies will get a form? " funny you should say that as I saw a form today and in the section on ethnicity is an option for Romany gypsy/Irish Traveller. Lets face it are they really going to even bother to fill it in. I think not. | |||
"I can't be arsed so me for one won't be doing it " Youve got to do it or aparantly you get a £1000 fine so someone just said in the chatroom | |||
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"Census is carried out every five years the 200th census took place in 2001. Most members of this website will have filled in one or two during their life time. Its no biggie. Go to the office for national statistics website and its all beautifully explained. I don't think anyone was ever persecuted by one but this is Fab Forum - somebody is going to tell me otherwise "The Census as we know it today has been held every ten years since 1841. There were earlier censuses carried out prior to 1841 but they were by no means exhaustive or conclusive of the population of the UK, (the earlier ones only accounted for England I believe), and almost all of the records taken beween 1801-1831 have been lost or destroyed. The only exception to the ten year rule has been 1941 for obvious reasons. The benefits to the govt of carrying out a census doesn't just relate to the population. It also takes into account the state of the govt housing stock and gives a snapshot of employment blackspots and movement of people for economic reasons. As our family's historian the Census has been invaluable in tracking down distant ancestors that have led me to meeting living relatives now, and I'm still in touch with my wider family. I really hope the proposed cancellation of the Census after this one doesn't come to pass as it's value is incalculable, in my opinion. | |||
" You forgot to add it points out who is paying tax, who isn't and also is used to cross check the benefit system. I don't think they like to voice that it helps catch people on the fiddle. You see this is exactly what my cynical mind is wondering. It says the information will be released next year. Released to whom?" Not to the general public, nor to genealogy companies. Census data is protected by a 100-year rule to prevent criminals getting hold of sensitive data and cloning IDs. It is assumed that in 100 years from now most of us will be dead and as such our identification is useless to a criminal. | |||
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"Looking forward to filling in the religion section, last time it was Jedi
wonder what to put this time"You can still put Jedi, as it is now an official religion. (some bloke was on 5 Live the other day talking about it) | |||
" Party at mine on 27th anyone????? I better act now - and erect the marquis!!!! "Thats a huge freudian slip I of course meant marquee | |||
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"I did mine online, took literally 5 minutes. Plus I bet it beats some poor sod having to read my hand writing!
The stats are also useful for figuring out demographics and if there is a lack (or surplus) of services in an area.
[lots more old people in place x, depopulation in a previously populated area etc]."Uhmmmmmmmm Aren't we supposed to wait until March 27th. Or is it alterable. The whole nation is supposed to do it on the 27th. | |||
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 stuck on the individual questions now on the qualifications bit for Steve so got to wait till he's hom e at 8 pm lol | |||
"Oh for goodness sakes ! 1)the personal information stays secret BY LAW for 100 years 2) they don't sell the information -that is illegal 3) If the results are to be "released" next year it means the overall statistics like "how many people who live here were not born here." 4) without the data they get from the census the govt cannot plan for schools housing health care and everything else Otherwise it really is just guesswork and there is enough of that already. Thanks! That's what I was after although your "oh for goodness sake" was a tad on the patronising side!
I shall make my entry count! "Says it on the form...if you have got one? | |||
we not put an add on yet | |||
"we got ours in the post today...we had a right giggle when we got to the very last question on the back of the form "visitors" will you be having a visitor/s staying overnight on the 27th march..how the fook do we know we not put an add on yet "Seeing that we never have visitors, its very unlikley that we will on the 27th March lol | |||
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" Says it on the form...if you have got one?" If I had the form... I'd not be asking!! | |||
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"ruby you must do shit loads of petrol on your travels coz you must be going to them if thay aint coming to you
"Lol well maybe about 2/3 years ago when we used to do a lot of meets but now we rarley ever do these days lol I tend to just meet local guys now | |||
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"has anyone in Scotland received theirs. No-one I have spoken to has yet x" we havent got ours yet x daft question is it one per household or one per person ??x | |||
"has anyone in Scotland received theirs. No-one I have spoken to has yet x we havent got ours yet x daft question is it one per household or one per person ??x" One per houshold to be completed by the head of the household. I don't know how this works in Houses in Multiple Occupancy. | |||
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"what do they do about homeless peeps filling in the forms?" I don't know how you treat the folks who are skippering but those in hostels and models usually get included in the return for the building they're in. | |||
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"I know someone whos living in their van after being reposessed a few weeks ago" Sad...wish them fer better fortune in the future.. | |||
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"is it mainland uk only getting these forms or is it northern ireland aswell !!!" NI and Scotland each get a separate from from the one for England & Wales. | |||
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"Looking forward to filling in the religion section, last time it was Jedi
wonder what to put this time
You can still put Jedi, as it is now an official religion. (some bloke was on 5 Live the other day talking about it) "he was also wrong, Jedi is not an official religion in the UK, whta happend is that so many people put it on the form that it was assigned its own datcontrol number to allow faster processing of the forms. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/1589133.stm | |||
They are every ten years and this will be my second lol
Now im either old or feeling old xx
And i remember off the last one that if ya dont fill it in ya will be fined with a possibility of prosecution as well xx | |||
"Whats surprised me about this thread is many never seem ta have filled one in b4
They are every ten years and this will be my second lol
Now im either old or feeling old xx
And i remember off the last one that if ya dont fill it in ya will be fined with a possibility of prosecution as well xx "I was living with my parents 10 years ago so I'd imagine they filled it in which is why I'd never heard of it before.  | |||
"Whats surprised me about this thread is many never seem ta have filled one in b4
They are every ten years and this will be my second lol
Now im either old or feeling old xx
And i remember off the last one that if ya dont fill it in ya will be fined with a possibility of prosecution as well xx
I was living with my parents 10 years ago so I'd imagine they filled it in which is why I'd never heard of it before. "Complete invasion a privacy in my opinion and just geared ta control of the masses as is everything in this big brother society xx  | |||
" Complete invasion a privacy in my opinion and just geared ta control of the masses as is everything in this big brother society xx "Pretty much what I think too... which is why I shall complete it in a colourful manner! | |||
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" Complete invasion a privacy in my opinion and just geared ta control of the masses as is everything in this big brother society xx
Pretty much what I think too... which is why I shall complete it in a colourful manner! "can I ask why you both feel that way..... i only ask because I actually don't mind it... it serves a useful task in helping collate stats as to how many people are here, and where they are going to have to provide services in the future and since it is only 1 every 10 years and takes 30 minutes to complete, it is hardly an inconvienience... | |||
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"It's not really about it being an inconvenience. I like privacy. I've not seen the form so I'll have a better idea when I have, it may be that it's fine and their questions are non-invasive and whilst it may be important for a population count, what I do for a living or my personal information really has no relevance to that. " they dont attach peersonal data for 100 years after the censsu date, only general non personal staistical data is published I.e, 100099 people do clerical work as a job (numbers and example completely made up) how is that invasive? | |||
"It's not really about it being an inconvenience. I like privacy. I've not seen the form so I'll have a better idea when I have, it may be that it's fine and their questions are non-invasive and whilst it may be important for a population count, what I do for a living or my personal information really has no relevance to that. they dont attach peersonal data for 100 years after the censsu date, only general non personal staistical data is published I.e, 100099 people do clerical work as a job (numbers and example completely made up) how is that invasive? " And like I said, I've not seen the form as yet so I don't know how invasive it is. But thanks for your input! | |||
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"After all there's a big culture of dependency/ expectation in this country - we expect the state to provide personnal private services like the NHS as "a right" we expect a pension (which in some countries ARE entirely your business/ responsibility) so really the state should know what jobs we do etc etc" i dunno, but i pay my contributions every month...well, it's on my wage slip that i pay national insurance anyhow....entitled? | |||
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"After all there's a big culture of dependency/ expectation in this country - we expect the state to provide personnal private services like the NHS as "a right" we expect a pension (which in some countries ARE entirely your business/ responsibility) so really the state should know what jobs we do etc etc" That's half the problem, people just naturally come to expect a lot in this country, they take many things for granted....they are too blinded by their fears and suspicions to realise that the National Census goes a long way towards sorting out the distribution and geographical needs of these services to the population. | |||
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And they're not invasive questions?!
I'll reserve judgement on that till I get my form!!
*waits* | |||
"well i did 3 pages and got bored they say they will phone you for missing info so i gave my landline and said if you want the missing info phone me as i have a one year old who is more important and is unwell to look after let them fine me shows what kind of world we live in today that the goverment think they can be so bloddy pushy " Amongst other things the purpose of the census form is to ensure that there's sufficient NHS provision for that one year old, sufficient nursery provision when they get to 2 or 3, sufficient primary school provision when they get to 5 and so on. The census, either online or hard copy, only needs to be completed 'on or around the 27th' - if your child is unwell, fill in the form some other time but if you don't tell the govt what you, and your families, needs will be in future it's hard to justify complaining when/ if those resources aren't there. Don't vote by all means but don't moan about the government we get. Don't pay tax but don't moan about how the money is spent. | |||
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"How would half of you cope with living in places like France, where you have a random partial census EVERY year. They send out 150,000 census forms on a random basis to various members of the population. You may get one every Ten years, you may get one Three years running....or you may NEVER get one. " Then what's the point of them? Unless everyone gets one and everyone fills it in, then surely the data they do collect is not accurate? I'm just intrigued by it all. There's a bit of a Big Brother thing going on, there's a bit of common sense to it cause it's smart to know about the facilities people need etc. but I'm still reserving judgement on the relevance of some of the questions. By the sounds of it, some are totally irrelevant. I mean really... who's going to admit to terrorist stuff? If you are a terrorist then surely you'd be keeping schtum? | |||
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"From the comments on the BBC News website, it appears that the most use the information gives is for people tracing their family ancestory. Other than it being compulsory, is there actually a point to completing it that I've missed? http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-12661100 " im hoping my cats will be sick over it | |||
"............ I mean really... who's going to admit to terrorist stuff? If you are a terrorist then surely you'd be keeping schtum? "Who mentioned terrorists? | |||
"32 pages asking you the in and outs of everything real annoying why dont they just fit cctv in all our houses and fit us with tags " its not 32 pages It allows for a different set of pages depending on how many are in your house on march 27th if ther is only you its 14 pages or so and even then not all pages apply, the other pages are for otehr people that live with you or are staying with you on that date (if they are staying with you and go on your form then they do not have to fill in their own form apart from saying on it they was at your address) Yes thers a possible £1000 fine for not filing the form in befor ethat happens you get a reminder, and they also employ staff to come visit you and see if there is a problem filling it in Last time in 2001 there was something like 30 ish prosecutions for not doing it and as looking thorgh mien i do not see much differen from the 2001 form, as far as i can remember, there was not this outcry then and for further info, ionly those named on the electoral register get the form, so unfortuantly unless they in a haostel etc it does not account fro homeless people, whos voice should be heard | |||
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"............ I mean really... who's going to admit to terrorist stuff? If you are a terrorist then surely you'd be keeping schtum?
Who mentioned terrorists?"It wasn't mentioned... it popped into my head when the mention of bomb shelters and consipiracy theories came up! Are you always so serious? | |||
"Oh for hevean's sake !!!!! There aren't any intrusive private questions in there ! ( except religion which you don't have to answer) It DOESN'T ASK if you smoke /drink /take drugs/ have a criminal record/ enjoy recreational sex The goverment ALREADY KNOW through the tax system who you work for! They ALREADY KNOW through the registry of births etc how many children you have. It's a check - a stock taking! Oh dear this next won't go down well... Have to say that am starting to suspect that only people with something to hide up to no good - could object to anything on the form" Oh for goodness sakes!!!
Aren't we allowed to debate and discuss? I've loved the chat in here the last couple of days. I don't really do politics or religious topics but I'm nosey so wanted to hear what others thought of it.
No-one is really getting shirty about it... well other than you with your SHOUTY capitals... maybe you should chill out a bit and stop letting it get your goat?
I don't have anything to hide... I'm an open book. I just don't really like convention and I get a kick out of being difficult sometimes. I want to know why they want to know everything and this thread has gone a long way to educting me with that, your posts included. | |||
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"Disagree with you- plenty of people are getting very silly about it saying they are not going to do it that they are going to break the law by refusing to to do it - yes have debate by all means but but some of this has been uninformed daftness " Life is way too short not to have daftness in it.
It's all about personal choice! I'll complete the form, I will make my choice in my answers depending on the question asked. This is my choice. Just like you have yours to complete the form in the manner that you wish.
It's all good. | |||
"Now this could be fun.... "A message to everyone - act now" says the census form in my hot little hands. "Everyone should be included in the census - all people and overnight visitors. It is used to help plan and fund services for your community - services like transport, education and health. Now then I live in a small village with crap facilities. If I have 500 overnight visitors will we get some more services in the future?? Party at mine on 27th anyone????? I better act now - and erect the marquis!!!! "I was curious about this census malarky, not least because it looks as thick as an encyclopedia, but having exausted my way through this thread all thats stuck in my head is happy thoughts of your "hot little hands" Madam....Indeed I'm thinking about them long and hard x | |||
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"Oh for hevean's sake !!!!! There aren't any intrusive private questions in there ! ( except religion which you don't have to answer) It DOESN'T ASK if you smoke /drink /take drugs/ have a criminal record/ enjoy recreational sex The goverment ALREADY KNOW through the tax system who you work for! They ALREADY KNOW through the registry of births etc how many children you have. It's a check - a stock taking! Oh dear this next won't go down well... Have to say that am starting to suspect that only people with something to hide up to no good - could object to anything on the form" my only religion is cock sucking | |||
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"see... this is the point I don't get... If they have been doing the census in its present form every 10 years since 1801, why THIS time do people find it "invasive"? " Part of it is down to the 'data loss' stories a few years back and I suspct there the element of bloody mindedness one contributor has already mentioned. There may even be a bit of 'how dare anyone question me about my life?' which pervades certain parts of society. | |||
"see... this is the point I don't get... If they have been doing the census in its present form every 10 years since 1801, why THIS time do people find it "invasive"? " That's an easy one Fabio....the British people have been relatively 'spoilt' for the last decade....times have been pretty good for most people, we had a government that cared for the masses and not just for the few... Now we have a government that has succeeded in alienating vast swathes of the population in a VERY short time, people are rebellious....they are taking to the streets, not since the Poll Tax riots have we seen so many young people demonstrating. The people are up in arms....this census will just add to the distrust and hatred for the government many of us are starting to feel. This Census could not have come at a worse time for Cameron and Co., the ironic thing is it was drawn up by the previous government and the ONS, but who cares? Bollocks to the Tories, and their Census! | |||
"the census is like a great big stock check / audit For example the CENSUS says there are 1000 kids of five years old living in an area But the Local authority is apparently EDUCATING 1250 or maybe it has 950 in its schools - so what's going on? You could apply this to housing, pensions, health, transport everything about which people say ""they" should do something about that" " And they don`t want to know the state of my health ? How can that make any sense ..an audit of the nations health isn`t relevant then ? | |||
"the census is like a great big stock check / audit For example the CENSUS says there are 1000 kids of five years old living in an area But the Local authority is apparently EDUCATING 1250 or maybe it has 950 in its schools - so what's going on? You could apply this to housing, pensions, health, transport everything about which people say ""they" should do something about that" And they don`t want to know the state of my health ? How can that make any sense ..an audit of the nations health isn`t relevant then ?" So now you are moaning that there are not enough questions on your census form? Just write in your own questions in biro and answer them....will be different. | |||
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"............. This Census could not have come at a worse time for Cameron and Co., the ironic thing is it was drawn up by the previous government and the ONS, but who cares? Bollocks to the Tories, and their Census! "By not completing their census form fully and accurately people are simply playing into Cameron the cutter's hands. He'll be able to point to a reduced need for public services because, 'according to census returns', there are fewer people having fewer kids and so on and he'll seek to use that to cut back further and harder. He'll be able to say there's no need for new hospitals, schools, libraries, college and university places. | |||
"the census is like a great big stock check / audit For example the CENSUS says there are 1000 kids of five years old living in an area But the Local authority is apparently EDUCATING 1250 or maybe it has 950 in its schools - so what's going on? You could apply this to housing, pensions, health, transport everything about which people say ""they" should do something about that" And they don`t want to know the state of my health ? How can that make any sense ..an audit of the nations health isn`t relevant then ?" its been carried out every ten years regardless of teh political state of goverment, and the questions give or take 2 or 3 aere exactly the same the ones that have changed are optional. just like the religion one and also if you live in England there is no question 17 (It was to do with welsh langauge issues and asked in welsh) | |||
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"the census is like a great big stock check / audit For example the CENSUS says there are 1000 kids of five years old living in an area But the Local authority is apparently EDUCATING 1250 or maybe it has 950 in its schools - so what's going on? You could apply this to housing, pensions, health, transport everything about which people say ""they" should do something about that" And they don`t want to know the state of my health ? How can that make any sense ..an audit of the nations health isn`t relevant then ? So now you are moaning that there are not enough questions on your census form? Just write in your own questions in biro and answer them....will be different." hahaha moaning haha Mea extremis culpa ....yeah ....very observational ..unfortunately wide of the mark .... I considered it an " intelligent " question ...one you seem not to share ....By all means make sarcastic remarks ..but treating me as a fool will not gain you much in the way of satisfaction ...but by all means ...proceed with yer best shot .. | |||
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"Thank you....I will....regardless" hahaha ...the pleasures mine mostly ..but I`d be disinclined o insult me at will..especially as I haven`t given you any cause to treat me like that..so I will ask you to behave around me ..thanks .. So can anyone answer the question ....if the opus of facts is necassary fer strategic planning and appropriation of fiscal funds...why isn`t a enquiry made on the state of each households health ..surely de facto this would be of immense value to the guardians of our welfare !! | |||
Yeah Ok | |||
"I think you will find I haven't at anytime insulted you....you have taken it as an insult because you are seriously thin skinned.... You bemoaned the fact that the government have asked you to fill in a census form "I won`t be filling one out .....nope" "Trust a British government with the ins and outs of our lives .....yeah ! ok !.....not a chance ...hell will freeze over before I do ..." Then you bemoan the fact that they are not asking about the health of the householders.....you don't want to be asked, but you moan that you are not asked. Hard to decide if you think it's too intrusive....or not intrusive enough. And behave around you?....
Yeah Ok"ok....yer intent is clear ..I asked politely and I wouldn`t consider it an unreasonable request.. So be it ....very silly btw.. | |||
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"And they don`t want to know the state of my health ? How can that make any sense ..an audit of the nations health isn`t relevant then ? wouldn't that information be available at all times due to hospital/doctor records?? mines just done...i have no problem with filling it in...there's no personal information that they already don't know about me.. i'm a happy chappy "Doesn`t really hold true I think ..its counter intiutive to the percieved arguement made by some on the thread ...yeah ...I know as much if not more on the various ways data is accrued and stored ... Glad yer birdhouse is singing tho ...so is mine ..mostly | |||
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"in 2000 years when they look at the census they're gonna think we killed all the jedis and FSM/pastafarians" i'm a pastafarian...and alive...for now! | |||
. The census helps find out things like number blind/hearing impaired throughout the country- something that's never been known before and helps the charities plan nationally. | |||
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"I won`t be filling one out .....nope" see this is the thing... THIS time round some people are suspicious.. but we all knew this was coming... and guess what... the next one will be in 2021.... its not like they are hiding it from you..... | |||
"I won`t be filling one out .....nope see this is the thing... THIS time round some people are suspicious.. but we all knew this was coming... and guess what... the next one will be in 2021.... its not like they are hiding it from you..... " I didn`t fill out the last one Fabio ...its not like I`m caught up in anyone elses vibe ....its a considered stand ...we`ll see if I get away with it this time .. I`ve a natural aversion to it ..and object to some of the players involved..Lockheed Martin who are conducting the survey on behalf of the ONS ...are unsuitable to be involved in my and others opinion .. | |||
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"Sooo.. With only 30 prosecutions/fines last time round for not filling in the form, I'll wager all those keyboard warriors shouting dissent today will do what they have to do! I fail to see what the problem is with any of it! I have taken a look through and there is nothing that is not already in the public domain. OK, spread far and wide, but still out there... AND.. For you dissenters.. How many of you have Nectar cards, pay by debit/credit card or worst of the lot, have a Tesco Club Card? These companies have way more about your private lives than the Government will ever have! Tesco, for all you Tesco shoppers, will have details of your travelling, entertaining, what sort of diet you have, what clothes you wear and even whether you ladies wear thongs or pants! (This list is not exhaustive!) If you also have their insurance, they will also quote you on life insurance, taking into account your diet and any other factors you log with them! If you have a mobile phone with them and this also goes for any mobile operator, they can tell where you are at any time of the day or night! Who you phone, who you text and even what you have text! Nah! Loyalty cards are way more invasive than the Census, so if you are that worried, cut up ya loyalty cards and only pay cash for everything! "I'm more concerned with the fact tra always knows which pub I'm in | |||
"I won`t be filling one out .....nope see this is the thing... THIS time round some people are suspicious.. but we all knew this was coming... and guess what... the next one will be in 2021.... its not like they are hiding it from you..... I didn`t fill out the last one Fabio ...its not like I`m caught up in anyone elses vibe ....its a considered stand ...we`ll see if I get away with it this time .. I`ve a natural aversion to it ..and object to some of the players involved..Lockheed Martin who are conducting the survey on behalf of the ONS ...are unsuitable to be involved in my and others opinion .. " fine... but then as jane said... your stand has a consequence.... less funds for your local services, less funds for your local hospital, less funds for your local schools, less funds for your local areas... a stand is a stand... but that seems more like cutting your nose of the spite your face from an outside _iew... sorry... but it does.... | |||
"I won`t be filling one out .....nope see this is the thing... THIS time round some people are suspicious.. but we all knew this was coming... and guess what... the next one will be in 2021.... its not like they are hiding it from you..... I didn`t fill out the last one Fabio ...its not like I`m caught up in anyone elses vibe ....its a considered stand ...we`ll see if I get away with it this time .. I`ve a natural aversion to it ..and object to some of the players involved..Lockheed Martin who are conducting the survey on behalf of the ONS ...are unsuitable to be involved in my and others opinion .. fine... but then as jane said... your stand has a consequence.... less funds for your local services, less funds for your local hospital, less funds for your local schools, less funds for your local areas... a stand is a stand... but that seems more like cutting your nose of the spite your face from an outside _iew... sorry... but it does...." Its an outmoded anachorism .....the arguement that councils need it to plan ...begawds ...councils couldn`t plan a piss up in a brewery ... Some of the questions are non of their freaking business ...others are so lackin in any credulity its staggering .. Lastly any lawful authority can request your information is released...whats lawful authority ? And wether Lockheed Martin who have ties to Abu Graib btw, have any power not to release information under the Patriot Law is still unclear ... I`ve dinner to cook | |||
"I think you will find I haven't at anytime insulted you....you have taken it as an insult because you are seriously thin skinned.... You bemoaned the fact that the government have asked you to fill in a census form "I won`t be filling one out .....nope" "Trust a British government with the ins and outs of our lives .....yeah ! ok !.....not a chance ...hell will freeze over before I do ..." Then you bemoan the fact that they are not asking about the health of the householders.....you don't want to be asked, but you moan that you are not asked. Hard to decide if you think it's too intrusive....or not intrusive enough. And behave around you?....
Yeah Ok"okee doke ..I`ve 20 mins free today ..yesterday was a tad busy to convey a sensible arguement ... You have a propensity to ignore the blooming obvious if it suits your arguement ...in this case you seem unable to differentiate between a stated position, an objection, a moral and philosophical arguement and a rhetorical question. To make clear I object ( not moan)to the invasiness of the current census, it was challenged when drafted by the last government but the present one has obviously capitulated to the mandarins of state. However fundamentally I object to the census on moral and philosophical terms. When I and others learnt that Lockheed Martin were contracted to run the census some of us had grave concerns at the moral sagacity of that desicion. I object to the profits from the 480 million cost of the survey going to one of the worlds biggest arms manufacturers..yes Lockheed Martin a defense, security contractor and supplier of advanced technology with worldwide interests. This company only in recent recent years stopped making cluster bombs, those pretty toy like bomblets that continue to maim and kill thousands in Vietnam, South Korea and currently Iraq and Afgan. They maim mostly children given their disadvantage of looking like toys, although thru pressure of investment banks with an ethical trading policy forced LM to stop making cluster bombs they still manufacture the delivery systems. They also manufacture nuclear ballistic missiles, anyone with _iews on these types of weapons is going to find these rent a c***ts being involved in the census difficult to swallow. Big Brother is a hackneyed phrase so overusedto be treated with derision by people desensitised to its implications . Alongside being an arms manufacture, LM are the worlds biggest private detective agency in the world, they really do merit the claim to be the proxy government in America and the closest thing to big brother this world has ever witnessed. Their activities are to diverse and complex to be stated here, anyone wanting a heads up could google..... TheNation-William Hartung- Is Lockheed shadowing you....... It gives a summary of the company running the census.Our forefathers would be appalled that one profit based organisation could be o enveloped in a society, and they`re here in Britain, colluding with GCHQ in a lovely surveillance program called Master the Internet (google it)More rights to privacy shattered, when every phone call, e-mail, message will be monitered , yes every communication and screened, nothing we do will be private. This may not concern you, but to some of us this is massively concerning. lastly LM are no1 on the USA Oversight committee with 54 instances of gross misconduct.Lastly when have recent governments evidenced any ability to look after private data! In summary a suitable organisation to be running the census, in my opinion a resounding no. Theres a maladrous stench to the whole business. Why is a arms manufacturer and private detective agency involved in Guatennamo Bay , Abu Graib and countless other covert government agencies involved. Moralling unsettling and intellectually disturbing.I fucking object. Your arguement that I need to participate or be damned is churlish and laughable. I remember the poll tax of the 80`s. Some of us objected on moral grounds, voiced our opinion. Some of us went to court, some of us went to prison. We felt it a strong enough issue to make a principled stand. Not as you seem to suggest meekly and subserviently kow tow to the government and blithely accept the moral repugnancy of the poll tax and vote in the next election. That strategy wouldn`t of been very efficacious at removing the government given their majority etc. No some of us objected and got it changed!! In this arguement I`ll do the same and fucking object now. Despite being my choice to participate being compromised away with the threat of a heavy fine.I can`t even fucking object! Fine me and millions of others. Think so? You really display the attributes of a follower of fashion. Your argument its essential for planning doesn`t pass muster.An example that I was alluding to with my rhetorical question-why isn`t health a priority? (given the forthcoming explosion in health provision). The question asked in the census is worthy of contempt- Do you rate your health as very good thru to very bad is so subjective as to be rendered almost useless. Its like asking if I feel optomistic for the future? Statistians will have nothing of value to work with, laughable! Furthermore you place great faith in predict and provide, thats the term planners use. Theres far to many instances of Goodwins Law for me to detail them here.Farcical in the extreme.Public trasport being one !!!! I object to them knowing about my private life, visitors to my home. Yeah right!! The context and tenor of census`s have changed over time. Francis Maude wants done with them, who knows but people like me will look at the future census with distrusting eyes, eyes that are wide open to the antics of the political class. Leave me a fucking alone. Lastly you seem to want to garner some credence for reading tea leaves. Evidenced by your amateurish attempt at reading my personality and character. In doing so you revealed more of your own to scrutiny. My posts yesterday were apolitical and non personalised. Just a couple of statements of intent with an allusion to a moral arguement. You however chose to personalise your posts directed at me.A derogatory spiel of being different just to be diferent.Are you implying I`m a spotty teenager without a principle? A refusenik who doesn`t hold a moral stance, albeit with the thin skin ? Jeez! I would suggest you displayed an emotional immaturity. You`ve asserted before that when people resort to trading personal comments they`ve lost the arguement. Au contraire . Empty words, and a shame the possibility of a good debate was ruined by your propensity to act as the thought police , stamp on any opinion that differs from your own. Your arrogance amuses me. Finally I`ll continue to post, its fun to discuss, I learn things sometimes, thats good and it wiles away an odd hour . However I`ve wasted 40 mins of my life with this and as a consequence on yourself. A folly indeed methinks. So will I complete the census. NO. I object morally and philosophically. Lockheed Martin indeed!! Lastly the above is my opinion, others will no doubt have no issues with filling in the form. Fair play...crack on . | |||
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"Thats interesting Jane. Where does the subsidy go if its not paid to the councils? Earmarked for other spending or what?" Nick Clegg's ski holidays. | |||
"Quick questions for those commenting on Lockheed Martin Being involved 1, Did you fill in the 2001 Census? 2, do you realise they were also involved in providing the same service in 2001 " Nope I didn`t fill it in, like alot of people... Yes...I was aware of Lockheed Martins involvement in the 2001 census.. | |||
" Yeah Ok okee doke ..I`ve 20 mins free today ..yesterday was a tad busy to convey a sensible arguement ... ..................... Lastly the above is my opinion, others will no doubt have no issues with filling in the form. Fair play...crack on . " Congratulations. I've read a lot about LM over the years but this is the first I've seen that hasn't mentioned Trident. | |||
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"Not sure, but I do know that the Scots get around £1,600 a head more subsidy than the English, and the people in Northern Ireland around a Thousand pounds more. Central government does need to know how many people live in any given area so that this annual Subsidy can be given out to Councils, as this is only undertaken (The Census) every Ten years then it is all the more important. For example, in a county like Devon where the population has increased by around 23% in the last decade with more and more people moving down here or retiring down here, that Subsidy increase is extremely important for public services and local public transport which are poorly financed by Central Government at the moment. " Its no big deal filling it in and its useful info on that score. I went onto the government website to look at sample benefit forms - its a helluva a lot shorter than the forms scroungers are prepared to fill in to get something for nothing she said tongue firmly in cheek, tinged with a little irony..... | |||
" Yeah Ok okee doke ..I`ve 20 mins free today ..yesterday was a tad busy to convey a sensible arguement ... ..................... Lastly the above is my opinion, others will no doubt have no issues with filling in the form. Fair play...crack on . Congratulations. I've read a lot about LM over the years but this is the first I've seen that hasn't mentioned Trident." I mentioned nuclear missiles in my soliquoy AV
Give us a break mucker ...some things need to be researched by others if theres an interest.. | |||
" Yeah Ok okee doke ..I`ve 20 mins free today ..yesterday was a tad busy to convey a sensible arguement ... ..................... Lastly the above is my opinion, others will no doubt have no issues with filling in the form. Fair play...crack on . Congratulations. I've read a lot about LM over the years but this is the first I've seen that hasn't mentioned Trident. I mentioned nuclear missiles in my soliquoy AV
Give us a break mucker ...some things need to be researched by others if theres an interest.. "Indeed you did. I missed it. | |||
" Yeah Ok okee doke ..I`ve 20 mins free today ..yesterday was a tad busy to convey a sensible arguement ... ..................... Lastly the above is my opinion, others will no doubt have no issues with filling in the form. Fair play...crack on . Congratulations. I've read a lot about LM over the years but this is the first I've seen that hasn't mentioned Trident. I mentioned nuclear missiles in my soliquoy AV
Give us a break mucker ...some things need to be researched by others if theres an interest..
Indeed you did. I missed it."Easily done .. | |||
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"just received this form an its about 28 pages long one of the questions is given if i be in at a certain date why should i answer this this makes me weary " I haven't even opened mine yet! | |||
"just received this form an its about 28 pages long one of the questions is given if i be in at a certain date why should i answer this this makes me weary " its only 28 pages long if there are going to be 6 people in on that date.... if you live by yourself it is only half date.. and only actually takes half hour to do... | |||
"just received this form an its about 28 pages long one of the questions is given if i be in at a certain date why should i answer this this makes me weary its only 28 pages long if there are going to be 6 people in on that date.... if you live by yourself it is only half date.. and only actually takes half hour to do..." was given to forms as well will be leaving at entrance up to them pick it up not me to drop it off | |||
"There is nothing asked about personal statistics on the census form that the government does not already know ... " I'm happy to fill in my census. And be blowed to 'Jedi Knight' ... in the Religion question, I'm gonna put "swinger". I'll let you all know if I get any offers from little men from the council or Lockheed Martin.... | |||
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"Oh for goodness sakes ! 1)the personal information stays secret BY LAW for 100 years 2) they don't sell the information -that is illegal 3) If the results are to be "released" next year it means the overall statistics like "how many people who live here were not born here." 4) without the data they get from the census the govt cannot plan for schools housing health care and everything else Otherwise it really is just guesswork and there is enough of that already. You forgot to add it points out who is paying tax, who isn't and also is used to cross check the benefit system. I don't think they like to voice that it helps catch people on the fiddle. " utter rubbish. Census data is not used in that way. You may be confusing it with the electoral roll. | |||
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" You forgot to add it points out who is paying tax, who isn't and also is used to cross check the benefit system. I don't think they like to voice that it helps catch people on the fiddle. You see this is exactly what my cynical mind is wondering. It says the information will be released next year. Released to whom?" Aggregated data is released, by output area, to anyone who wants to use it. For instance, in a previous job, I would use output area data to identify areas where a local authority should spend money on benefits advice. It works like this; Census data tells me there are lots of elderly people in area X. Published data on pensions credit tells me there are less pensions credit claims in area X than you would expect for an area with that many elderly people. So I dig deeper. Census data tells me more people than average in area X, including the elderly, own their own homes. I check the records for council tax benefit claims. The numbers are below average for that as well. So I have a chat with my mate at the CAB, and we organize a couple of coffee mornings in the village in question with the CAB in attendance - 60+ households, over three months, claim an average of £30 per week in extra benefits they're entitled to do, without me seeing a single piece of personal data, just aggregates. That's one of the things census data gets used for. Want the anecdote about working to predict how many care home beds for the elderly we'll need in my town in fifteen years time do you? Us bureaucrats have our uses... | |||
" You forgot to add it points out who is paying tax, who isn't and also is used to cross check the benefit system. I don't think they like to voice that it helps catch people on the fiddle. You see this is exactly what my cynical mind is wondering. It says the information will be released next year. Released to whom?" The data will be realised 'next year'. Personal data such as names and address will not. Suggest you use google and look it all up, I think you seems to be getting wound up the census... | |||
"The 1st census in England was for the dooms day book in 1086 for tax purposes but it stated in Scotland in the 7th century. The type of census we get today started in 1801 and it is used to count the populace, religions(in 2001 there was a campaign to get Jedi recognised as a religion by everyone putting it as there religion on the census) and supposed to help the government know what each area needs...IE more police, libraries etc lol " Domesday Book was a tax roll, not a census and didn't even cover all of England, since the king's writ, and his taxes, did not run in all of England. | |||
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"Good grief forgot all about this - its somewhere in the pile of things to do... Just wondering why its ended up in my pile...." Do it online much quicker, only took me 10 mins | |||
"Good grief forgot all about this - its somewhere in the pile of things to do... Just wondering why its ended up in my pile.... Do it online much quicker, only took me 10 mins" me too.... was easier than I thought. Albeit, living alone did help | |||
