FabSwingers.com > Forums > The Lounge > EU confusion
EU confusion
Jump to: Newest in thread
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
 | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Important question. Will we still get champions league football if we vote no? "Being as you are from Cannock, and it's highly likely that you support wolves, I wouldn't worry about champions league too much Apologies if you don't support Wolves lol | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I vote to be in, cos it is to big of a leap into the darkness and as well in the current situation we are in. It is best to have it as it is, one of the good things is the trading with eu." This is the kind of response I was looking for  | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"i want to vote to stay in but the tories want me to vote for that so i'm worried i shouldn't vote to stay in. i don't hold any political power so it makes no difference to me personally which way the vote goes." Yeah it's not sitting well with me agreeing with a Tory either | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Ok, I don't know enough about the EU to make an informed decision as to if we should stay or go. I am on the fence with this one, but my legs are dangling in the "in" side. I'd realy like to have some informed opinions on this, but no slagging each other off, it just confuses matters, and you get 10 genuine posts of credible reason, and 160 of argument resulting in the thread being closed and half of the participants not being heard from for 48 hours. Why should we stay, why should we go" You will be financially better off if you stay in because no country can negotiate decent trade deals with other countries that are 3-7 times bigger than it (i.e US and China). | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Important question. Will we still get champions league football if we vote no?
Being as you are from Cannock, and it's highly likely that you support wolves, I wouldn't worry about champions league too much
Apologies if you don't support Wolves lol"Your assumptions are correct and that scares me a little haha. You should apologise for the fact that I do support Wolves lol. Im not worried for that but would feel bad for Leicester city  | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I'm thinking leave. Either way there will be good and bad points. But I'd rather we were in control over issues such as immigration, sovereignty and legislation. Which we aren't while we are within the European Union. There seems to be much emphasis on trade deals as to the case to remain. But while we are paying into the EU, in reality we are paying a tariff to trade as we are paying for membership. " This is why we are voting out. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I'm thinking leave. Either way there will be good and bad points. But I'd rather we were in control over issues such as immigration, sovereignty and legislation. Which we aren't while we are within the European Union. There seems to be much emphasis on trade deals as to the case to remain. But while we are paying into the EU, in reality we are paying a tariff to trade as we are paying for membership. This is why we are voting out." I will probably vote to leave too. I don't claim to be an expert in economics but I don't understand why we call the existing set up as free trade while we are paying for membership? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"We need migrant workers to do the jobs that the natives dont seem to want to,as long as they get paid the same as natives then there should be no problem the ones we need to limit are the ones that are coming for non work reasons and who want to turn our country into something its not, (not sure how many there are of this type) . As far as economic benefit then only time will tell, we buy twice as much from the EU than they buy from us so they will lose more if a trade war breaks out, we will still need to meet any regulations as we do now just as they will need to meet any we put in place. If we were going back to the old EEC or common market which for the youngsters amongst you was just a trading block I would vote for that tomorrow, but and it is a big but if we vote to stay then I fear a headlong rush to a united states of europe where we will have hardly any control over any aspect of our lives, just look at the mess that is the euro, the level of bureaucracy costs huge amounts of cash that could and should be spent on health and education, it is one huge gravy train that will grow out of all proportion, remember the old USSR and how crap that was, we can never live in one state with the different cultures between the north of europe and the south plus the eastern block members and the likes of turkey who want to join, we are just so different in culture, religion, work ethics etc . For that reason I have to conclude that I am voting out, if we do then I am sure a much better deal will be forth coming, if it isnt then we are still the 4/5th biggest economy in the world, we can and will survive and thrive, lets face it our economy has recovered far better than the rest of europe( largely due IMVHO to the vast sums that have been spent keeping the Euro alive " It's not the EU trading you need to worry about, it's American and China. Yes Britain is the 5th largest, but it's not a normal distribution. The top 2 are bigger than the bottom 161 combined!! How does being 5th compare to being 2nd? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I'm thinking leave. Either way there will be good and bad points. But I'd rather we were in control over issues such as immigration, sovereignty and legislation. Which we aren't while we are within the European Union. There seems to be much emphasis on trade deals as to the case to remain. But while we are paying into the EU, in reality we are paying a tariff to trade as we are paying for membership. This is why we are voting out." But say we do leave, and there will be a period of uncertainty, who is going to lead the country through that? Is there anyone in politics that you can trust wit that mammoth task of keeping it all together while small to medium businesses fail, and foreign investors look at us as somewhere that used to be a viable place to expand to. We're not the Britain that once was, we don't own great swathes of the world any more, we only just held on to Scotland, and the more I think about it, the more I think we should stay | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"We need migrant workers to do the jobs that the natives dont seem to want to,as long as they get paid the same as natives then there should be no problem the ones we need to limit are the ones that are coming for non work reasons and who want to turn our country into something its not, (not sure how many there are of this type) . As far as economic benefit then only time will tell, we buy twice as much from the EU than they buy from us so they will lose more if a trade war breaks out, we will still need to meet any regulations as we do now just as they will need to meet any we put in place. If we were going back to the old EEC or common market which for the youngsters amongst you was just a trading block I would vote for that tomorrow, but and it is a big but if we vote to stay then I fear a headlong rush to a united states of europe where we will have hardly any control over any aspect of our lives, just look at the mess that is the euro, the level of bureaucracy costs huge amounts of cash that could and should be spent on health and education, it is one huge gravy train that will grow out of all proportion, remember the old USSR and how crap that was, we can never live in one state with the different cultures between the north of europe and the south plus the eastern block members and the likes of turkey who want to join, we are just so different in culture, religion, work ethics etc . For that reason I have to conclude that I am voting out, if we do then I am sure a much better deal will be forth coming, if it isnt then we are still the 4/5th biggest economy in the world, we can and will survive and thrive, lets face it our economy has recovered far better than the rest of europe( largely due IMVHO to the vast sums that have been spent keeping the Euro alive It's not the EU trading you need to worry about, it's American and China. Yes Britain is the 5th largest, but it's not a normal distribution. The top 2 are bigger than the bottom 161 combined!! How does being 5th compare to being 2nd? " According to google we had a 1.4billion $ trade surplus with the US in 2015, I am sure it is pretty poor against china but I am not sure what your point is about dealing with either of them, are you suggesting that if we leave the EU then we wont sell to these two ? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"It's bad enough being dictated to by our elected leaders, non elected beurocrats dictating to me really gets my goat" Yes, however, don't you think we have more influence by remaining in? Or do you think that's not that important? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I'm thinking leave. Either way there will be good and bad points. But I'd rather we were in control over issues such as immigration, sovereignty and legislation. Which we aren't while we are within the European Union. There seems to be much emphasis on trade deals as to the case to remain. But while we are paying into the EU, in reality we are paying a tariff to trade as we are paying for membership. This is why we are voting out. But say we do leave, and there will be a period of uncertainty, who is going to lead the country through that? Is there anyone in politics that you can trust wit that mammoth task of keeping it all together while small to medium businesses fail, and foreign investors look at us as somewhere that used to be a viable place to expand to. We're not the Britain that once was, we don't own great swathes of the world any more, we only just held on to Scotland, and the more I think about it, the more I think we should stay" The same government we have now. Until we vote another in the next general election. It's not in the current governments interest to see our country struggle more than is absolutely necessary. Who is to say that the current EU won't face tough challenges should we vote to remain? Like issues with mass immigration from Asia and Africa and the ongoing issues with the Euro x | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"hmm...one thought i've had is that the EU has offered to bail the uk out twice this decade (that i know of) and the government turned that down. one time it was funding for food banks, can't remember what the other time was for. so right now we are in the state we're in and have not had help from the EU that we could have had." They also offered funding after major floods that the government declined in at least two years. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I vote to be in, cos it is to big of a leap into the darkness and as well in the current situation we are in. It is best to have it as it is, one of the good things is the trading with eu. This is the kind of response I was looking for "Nice one | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"We need migrant workers to do the jobs that the natives dont seem to want to,as long as they get paid the same as natives then there should be no problem the ones we need to limit are the ones that are coming for non work reasons and who want to turn our country into something its not, (not sure how many there are of this type) . As far as economic benefit then only time will tell, we buy twice as much from the EU than they buy from us so they will lose more if a trade war breaks out, we will still need to meet any regulations as we do now just as they will need to meet any we put in place. If we were going back to the old EEC or common market which for the youngsters amongst you was just a trading block I would vote for that tomorrow, but and it is a big but if we vote to stay then I fear a headlong rush to a united states of europe where we will have hardly any control over any aspect of our lives, just look at the mess that is the euro, the level of bureaucracy costs huge amounts of cash that could and should be spent on health and education, it is one huge gravy train that will grow out of all proportion, remember the old USSR and how crap that was, we can never live in one state with the different cultures between the north of europe and the south plus the eastern block members and the likes of turkey who want to join, we are just so different in culture, religion, work ethics etc . For that reason I have to conclude that I am voting out, if we do then I am sure a much better deal will be forth coming, if it isnt then we are still the 4/5th biggest economy in the world, we can and will survive and thrive, lets face it our economy has recovered far better than the rest of europe( largely due IMVHO to the vast sums that have been spent keeping the Euro alive It's not the EU trading you need to worry about, it's American and China. Yes Britain is the 5th largest, but it's not a normal distribution. The top 2 are bigger than the bottom 161 combined!! How does being 5th compare to being 2nd? According to google we had a 1.4billion $ trade surplus with the US in 2015, I am sure it is pretty poor against china but I am not sure what your point is about dealing with either of them, are you suggesting that if we leave the EU then we wont sell to these two ?" Perhaps you should also Google what happened to British company BAE Systems when they had a trade disagreement with America. I'm saying that the terms and conditions an independent Britain will get can't possibly compare to the terms the EU gets. In simple terms, the walk away position of any trade negotiation is "ok fuck you, enjoy our tariffs". The threat of tariffs on the British market alone is nothing compared to the EU which is why BAE Systems got shafted but Airbus happily competes with Boeing. The latter case is another good example of what happens when your companies threaten to take market share away from American exporters. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"hmm...one thought i've had is that the EU has offered to bail the uk out twice this decade (that i know of) and the government turned that down. one time it was funding for food banks, can't remember what the other time was for. so right now we are in the state we're in and have not had help from the EU that we could have had. They also offered funding after major floods that the government declined in at least two years." thanks. there's probably even more i don't know about as well. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"We need migrant workers to do the jobs that the natives dont seem to want to,as long as they get paid the same as natives then there should be no problem the ones we need to limit are the ones that are coming for non work reasons and who want to turn our country into something its not, (not sure how many there are of this type) . As far as economic benefit then only time will tell, we buy twice as much from the EU than they buy from us so they will lose more if a trade war breaks out, we will still need to meet any regulations as we do now just as they will need to meet any we put in place. If we were going back to the old EEC or common market which for the youngsters amongst you was just a trading block I would vote for that tomorrow, but and it is a big but if we vote to stay then I fear a headlong rush to a united states of europe where we will have hardly any control over any aspect of our lives, just look at the mess that is the euro, the level of bureaucracy costs huge amounts of cash that could and should be spent on health and education, it is one huge gravy train that will grow out of all proportion, remember the old USSR and how crap that was, we can never live in one state with the different cultures between the north of europe and the south plus the eastern block members and the likes of turkey who want to join, we are just so different in culture, religion, work ethics etc . For that reason I have to conclude that I am voting out, if we do then I am sure a much better deal will be forth coming, if it isnt then we are still the 4/5th biggest economy in the world, we can and will survive and thrive, lets face it our economy has recovered far better than the rest of europe( largely due IMVHO to the vast sums that have been spent keeping the Euro alive It's not the EU trading you need to worry about, it's American and China. Yes Britain is the 5th largest, but it's not a normal distribution. The top 2 are bigger than the bottom 161 combined!! How does being 5th compare to being 2nd? According to google we had a 1.4billion $ trade surplus with the US in 2015, I am sure it is pretty poor against china but I am not sure what your point is about dealing with either of them, are you suggesting that if we leave the EU then we wont sell to these two ? Perhaps you should also Google what happened to British company BAE Systems when they had a trade disagreement with America. I'm saying that the terms and conditions an independent Britain will get can't possibly compare to the terms the EU gets. In simple terms, the walk away position of any trade negotiation is "ok fuck you, enjoy our tariffs". The threat of tariffs on the British market alone is nothing compared to the EU which is why BAE Systems got shafted but Airbus happily competes with Boeing. The latter case is another good example of what happens when your companies threaten to take market share away from American exporters. " So being in the EU didnt help BAE did it? Lots of british companies supply components to boeing so they(boeing) can sell to BA etc and I am sure plenty of US companies supply stuff to Airbus when they sell into the US market | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"i want to vote to stay in but the tories want me to vote for that so i'm worried i shouldn't vote to stay in. i don't hold any political power so it makes no difference to me personally which way the vote goes." Boris Johnson, Alistair Darling (both tories) to name two are in favour of leaving!  | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"i know they fund housing as well. so long as we stick to EU building regulations (that are supposed to keep heating bills down and are good for the environment) they will pay for that stuff." We pay 50 million or thereabouts more to the EU everyday than we get back so we will have that each day to spend on what WE decide to not some faceless EU bod | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"i want to vote to stay in but the tories want me to vote for that so i'm worried i shouldn't vote to stay in. i don't hold any political power so it makes no difference to me personally which way the vote goes. Boris Johnson, Alistair Darling (both tories) to name two are in favour of leaving! "The Alistair Darling who was in Labour? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"We need migrant workers to do the jobs that the natives dont seem to want to,as long as they get paid the same as natives then there should be no problem the ones we need to limit are the ones that are coming for non work reasons and who want to turn our country into something its not, (not sure how many there are of this type) . As far as economic benefit then only time will tell, we buy twice as much from the EU than they buy from us so they will lose more if a trade war breaks out, we will still need to meet any regulations as we do now just as they will need to meet any we put in place. If we were going back to the old EEC or common market which for the youngsters amongst you was just a trading block I would vote for that tomorrow, but and it is a big but if we vote to stay then I fear a headlong rush to a united states of europe where we will have hardly any control over any aspect of our lives, just look at the mess that is the euro, the level of bureaucracy costs huge amounts of cash that could and should be spent on health and education, it is one huge gravy train that will grow out of all proportion, remember the old USSR and how crap that was, we can never live in one state with the different cultures between the north of europe and the south plus the eastern block members and the likes of turkey who want to join, we are just so different in culture, religion, work ethics etc . For that reason I have to conclude that I am voting out, if we do then I am sure a much better deal will be forth coming, if it isnt then we are still the 4/5th biggest economy in the world, we can and will survive and thrive, lets face it our economy has recovered far better than the rest of europe( largely due IMVHO to the vast sums that have been spent keeping the Euro alive It's not the EU trading you need to worry about, it's American and China. Yes Britain is the 5th largest, but it's not a normal distribution. The top 2 are bigger than the bottom 161 combined!! How does being 5th compare to being 2nd? According to google we had a 1.4billion $ trade surplus with the US in 2015, I am sure it is pretty poor against china but I am not sure what your point is about dealing with either of them, are you suggesting that if we leave the EU then we wont sell to these two ? Perhaps you should also Google what happened to British company BAE Systems when they had a trade disagreement with America. I'm saying that the terms and conditions an independent Britain will get can't possibly compare to the terms the EU gets. In simple terms, the walk away position of any trade negotiation is "ok fuck you, enjoy our tariffs". The threat of tariffs on the British market alone is nothing compared to the EU which is why BAE Systems got shafted but Airbus happily competes with Boeing. The latter case is another good example of what happens when your companies threaten to take market share away from American exporters. So being in the EU didnt help BAE did it? Lots of british companies supply components to boeing so they(boeing) can sell to BA etc and I am sure plenty of US companies supply stuff to Airbus when they sell into the US market" Defence deals have exemptions from normal EU regulations. It's still a good example of things to come if you want to try negotiating with larger, more powerful governments. Airbus also won a $40bn contract in America until their politicians realised that they'd prefer it if Boeing won, so they reversed the decision. Again, good luck negotiating with that. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"i want to vote to stay in but the tories want me to vote for that so i'm worried i shouldn't vote to stay in. i don't hold any political power so it makes no difference to me personally which way the vote goes. Boris Johnson, Alistair Darling (both tories) to name two are in favour of leaving!
The Alistair Darling who was in Labour? "Please just refer to him as 'Eyebrows'
From my limited knowledge, I am leaning towards the exit, I just can't side with Cameron as a Tory leader and feel a fresh challenge will deliver us better strength over the long term in relation to the economy. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"We need migrant workers to do the jobs that the natives dont seem to want to,as long as they get paid the same as natives then there should be no problem the ones we need to limit are the ones that are coming for non work reasons and who want to turn our country into something its not, (not sure how many there are of this type) . As far as economic benefit then only time will tell, we buy twice as much from the EU than they buy from us so they will lose more if a trade war breaks out, we will still need to meet any regulations as we do now just as they will need to meet any we put in place. If we were going back to the old EEC or common market which for the youngsters amongst you was just a trading block I would vote for that tomorrow, but and it is a big but if we vote to stay then I fear a headlong rush to a united states of europe where we will have hardly any control over any aspect of our lives, just look at the mess that is the euro, the level of bureaucracy costs huge amounts of cash that could and should be spent on health and education, it is one huge gravy train that will grow out of all proportion, remember the old USSR and how crap that was, we can never live in one state with the different cultures between the north of europe and the south plus the eastern block members and the likes of turkey who want to join, we are just so different in culture, religion, work ethics etc . For that reason I have to conclude that I am voting out, if we do then I am sure a much better deal will be forth coming, if it isnt then we are still the 4/5th biggest economy in the world, we can and will survive and thrive, lets face it our economy has recovered far better than the rest of europe( largely due IMVHO to the vast sums that have been spent keeping the Euro alive It's not the EU trading you need to worry about, it's American and China. Yes Britain is the 5th largest, but it's not a normal distribution. The top 2 are bigger than the bottom 161 combined!! How does being 5th compare to being 2nd? According to google we had a 1.4billion $ trade surplus with the US in 2015, I am sure it is pretty poor against china but I am not sure what your point is about dealing with either of them, are you suggesting that if we leave the EU then we wont sell to these two ? Perhaps you should also Google what happened to British company BAE Systems when they had a trade disagreement with America. I'm saying that the terms and conditions an independent Britain will get can't possibly compare to the terms the EU gets. In simple terms, the walk away position of any trade negotiation is "ok fuck you, enjoy our tariffs". The threat of tariffs on the British market alone is nothing compared to the EU which is why BAE Systems got shafted but Airbus happily competes with Boeing. The latter case is another good example of what happens when your companies threaten to take market share away from American exporters. " BAE systems is historically British but just as much a US company now | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"i know they fund housing as well. so long as we stick to EU building regulations (that are supposed to keep heating bills down and are good for the environment) they will pay for that stuff. We pay 50 million or thereabouts more to the EU everyday than we get back so we will have that each day to spend on what WE decide to not some faceless EU bod" The UK has never paid £50 million per day for membership of the EU. The amount that leaves the treasury is the amount less the rebate which is still a large number (about £35 million per day). One of the reasons I never trust the Brexit campaign is that they don't even try to get the most basic of the numbers involved right. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/eureferendum/12176663/EU-Facts-how-much-does-Britain-pay-to-the-EU-budget.html | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"i want to vote to stay in but the tories want me to vote for that so i'm worried i shouldn't vote to stay in. i don't hold any political power so it makes no difference to me personally which way the vote goes. Boris Johnson, Alistair Darling (both tories) to name two are in favour of leaving!
The Alistair Darling who was in Labour? "And is in favour of staying...  | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"We need migrant workers to do the jobs that the natives dont seem to want to,as long as they get paid the same as natives then there should be no problem the ones we need to limit are the ones that are coming for non work reasons and who want to turn our country into something its not, (not sure how many there are of this type) . As far as economic benefit then only time will tell, we buy twice as much from the EU than they buy from us so they will lose more if a trade war breaks out, we will still need to meet any regulations as we do now just as they will need to meet any we put in place. If we were going back to the old EEC or common market which for the youngsters amongst you was just a trading block I would vote for that tomorrow, but and it is a big but if we vote to stay then I fear a headlong rush to a united states of europe where we will have hardly any control over any aspect of our lives, just look at the mess that is the euro, the level of bureaucracy costs huge amounts of cash that could and should be spent on health and education, it is one huge gravy train that will grow out of all proportion, remember the old USSR and how crap that was, we can never live in one state with the different cultures between the north of europe and the south plus the eastern block members and the likes of turkey who want to join, we are just so different in culture, religion, work ethics etc . For that reason I have to conclude that I am voting out, if we do then I am sure a much better deal will be forth coming, if it isnt then we are still the 4/5th biggest economy in the world, we can and will survive and thrive, lets face it our economy has recovered far better than the rest of europe( largely due IMVHO to the vast sums that have been spent keeping the Euro alive It's not the EU trading you need to worry about, it's American and China. Yes Britain is the 5th largest, but it's not a normal distribution. The top 2 are bigger than the bottom 161 combined!! How does being 5th compare to being 2nd? According to google we had a 1.4billion $ trade surplus with the US in 2015, I am sure it is pretty poor against china but I am not sure what your point is about dealing with either of them, are you suggesting that if we leave the EU then we wont sell to these two ? Perhaps you should also Google what happened to British company BAE Systems when they had a trade disagreement with America. I'm saying that the terms and conditions an independent Britain will get can't possibly compare to the terms the EU gets. In simple terms, the walk away position of any trade negotiation is "ok fuck you, enjoy our tariffs". The threat of tariffs on the British market alone is nothing compared to the EU which is why BAE Systems got shafted but Airbus happily competes with Boeing. The latter case is another good example of what happens when your companies threaten to take market share away from American exporters. BAE systems is historically British but just as much a US company now " Nice attempt to dodge the central issue. You can tell that to the 35,000 people who work for BAE in this country, many of them in economically deprived areas. When you vote out, have a nice think about whether you prefer the taste of licking American arse or sucking Chinese dick because that's what will be happening. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Remember the Scottish referendum? They'd have been in the shit by now if they'd left since all their projections assumed $120 for a barrel of oil. Same principle. " don't go there.... the brexiters will accuse you of "project fear" the same way as the scots nats did if you spoke out at their figures....  | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Remember the Scottish referendum? They'd have been in the shit by now if they'd left since all their projections assumed $120 for a barrel of oil. Same principle. don't go there.... the brexiters will accuse you of "project fear" the same way as the scots nats did if you spoke out at their figures.... "I'd rather spread fear than nonsense to be honest. Perhaps people should remember how we used to negotiate with China when we had am empire and the trade size difference was reversed. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"i know they fund housing as well. so long as we stick to EU building regulations (that are supposed to keep heating bills down and are good for the environment) they will pay for that stuff. We pay 50 million or thereabouts more to the EU everyday than we get back so we will have that each day to spend on what WE decide to not some faceless EU bod" funny enough a lot of the EU money that comes back is spent in places the UK govt seem not to care about... south wales for example is a net benefiter.... so is north east england..... so is scotland...... so is northern ireland....... so | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"i know they fund housing as well. so long as we stick to EU building regulations (that are supposed to keep heating bills down and are good for the environment) they will pay for that stuff. We pay 50 million or thereabouts more to the EU everyday than we get back so we will have that each day to spend on what WE decide to not some faceless EU bod funny enough a lot of the EU money that comes back is spent in places the UK govt seem not to care about... south wales for example is a net benefiter.... so is north east england..... so is scotland...... so is northern ireland....... so" Yeah that Northern Powerhouse (snigger). Most people on here bitch constantly about our government and then come out with statements that we should 'take back sovereignty' (i.e give them more power) | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"It looks to me that the amount that we would be better off by would be marginal but one thing is for certain, if we leave, even if we do eventually do well out of it, there is going to be years of financial upheaval, and I think that there will be a lot if business failing, and a lot of redundancy before we see any benefit, the system we have at the moment while not perfect, has to be a more solid foundation for a better fairer Britain than throwing ourselves into a sea of uncertainty. I'm also doubtful because this week I have heard two separate conversations about once we are out we can get rid of all the migrants and asylum seekers, I hope that most people don't think that this is the way it's going to work because it's not is it" Nice to hear a clear level headed debate and discussion is wanted by somebody else and other's are thinking along the ideas of weighing up pro's vs con's on here. Personally I've been reading about it a lot recently, and I'm thinking of voting to stay. It is a big gamble, with no real guarantee of a pay off. That said I don't like the EU currently as it is and how it's not adapting with the times, along with the notion that Tusk is trying to push though TTPI. But if we left Parliament would most likely push it through to sign us up to it regardless, at least with the Tories in. Ultimately, I think we are better off in, and joining the majority of the European population in urging MEP's to push for a reformed EU. That said, I am still listening to the leave argument.Though Farage's refusal to publish his tax papers somewhat discredits him and his desires for me. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"i know they fund housing as well. so long as we stick to EU building regulations (that are supposed to keep heating bills down and are good for the environment) they will pay for that stuff. We pay 50 million or thereabouts more to the EU everyday than we get back so we will have that each day to spend on what WE decide to not some faceless EU bod funny enough a lot of the EU money that comes back is spent in places the UK govt seem not to care about... south wales for example is a net benefiter.... so is north east england..... so is scotland...... so is northern ireland....... so" do we get more back than we pay in? didn't wanna derail this topic by asking but i think a new topic asking this would get shut down coz it's another EU topic. i did google as well but can't find anything. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"i want to vote to stay in but the tories want me to vote for that so i'm worried i shouldn't vote to stay in. i don't hold any political power so it makes no difference to me personally which way the vote goes. Yeah it's not sitting well with me agreeing with a Tory either" same here | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"i know they fund housing as well. so long as we stick to EU building regulations (that are supposed to keep heating bills down and are good for the environment) they will pay for that stuff. We pay 50 million or thereabouts more to the EU everyday than we get back so we will have that each day to spend on what WE decide to not some faceless EU bod funny enough a lot of the EU money that comes back is spent in places the UK govt seem not to care about... south wales for example is a net benefiter.... so is north east england..... so is scotland...... so is northern ireland....... so" Agreed, that said the Stay campaign really has failed to capitalise on this I feel | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"i know they fund housing as well. so long as we stick to EU building regulations (that are supposed to keep heating bills down and are good for the environment) they will pay for that stuff. We pay 50 million or thereabouts more to the EU everyday than we get back so we will have that each day to spend on what WE decide to not some faceless EU bod funny enough a lot of the EU money that comes back is spent in places the UK govt seem not to care about... south wales for example is a net benefiter.... so is north east england..... so is scotland...... so is northern ireland....... so Yeah that Northern Powerhouse (snigger). Most people on here bitch constantly about our government and then come out with statements that we should 'take back sovereignty' (i.e give them more power) " Agreed. The whole, we leave and save money for the NHS thing is hilarious too, I can't see Osborne agreeing to that. Oh and Farage harping on about how the EU put fishing and coastal communities out of work - no, British Industrial sized fishing fleets and poor investment and development of coast regions led to that. If anything the EU's quota scheme is the only reason why our fish stocks are recovering. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Ok, I don't know enough about the EU to make an informed decision as to if we should stay or go. I am on the fence with this one, but my legs are dangling in the "in" side. I'd realy like to have some informed opinions on this, but no slagging each other off, it just confuses matters, and you get 10 genuine posts of credible reason, and 160 of argument resulting in the thread being closed and half of the participants not being heard from for 48 hours. Why should we stay, why should we go" The worst aspect about this debate is that the politicians are trying to turn us all into mini economists when really the single over-riding question (and answer) should be..... How will my day to day life materially change whether in, or out? That is what is important and that is what people should be voting about. Talk of securing our borders is complete nonsense as long as we share an open land border with Ireland and that will never change. I went on to the Vote Leave Facebook page the other day in search of some facts but unfortunately about 80% of the comments are anti-foreigner and the rest are emotionally charged rants by "patriots" looking to "get are kuntry bak" / Independence / Freedom etc etc I know what the EU has done for me and so I think I could have a pretty good guess at what the future may hold if we stay in. I have nothing concrete on which to measure the "It will be alright on the night" promises made by the Brexit camp. We need facts not emotional rhetoric from the Brexit camp because at the moment the £GBP is falling like a stone against all major currencies at the prospect of a Brexit. Even the Euro is gaining on the £GBP which kind of throws the argument that "they need us more than we need them" argument in to the long grass. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I will be looking into what sort of deal other European countries have that isn't in the eu. " What country are you going to look at that is comparable though? It's all very well saying that there are tiny countries of 3 million or so people that have some sort of niche that other countries want, Norwegian Oil or Swiss corruption, sorry banking but Britain is too big to thrive on niche industries and too small to support its companies in the head to head shenanigans of international trade (reference Boeing & Airbus). Gotta compare apples with apples buddy. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I think we should stay in for trading and travel" And hot women. I fucking love Eastern European women. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Ok, I don't know enough about the EU to make an informed decision as to if we should stay or go. I am on the fence with this one, but my legs are dangling in the "in" side. I'd realy like to have some informed opinions on this, but no slagging each other off, it just confuses matters, and you get 10 genuine posts of credible reason, and 160 of argument resulting in the thread being closed and half of the participants not being heard from for 48 hours. Why should we stay, why should we go The worst aspect about this debate is that the politicians are trying to turn us all into mini economists when really the single over-riding question (and answer) should be..... How will my day to day life materially change whether in, or out? That is what is important and that is what people should be voting about. Talk of securing our borders is complete nonsense as long as we share an open land border with Ireland and that will never change. I went on to the Vote Leave Facebook page the other day in search of some facts but unfortunately about 80% of the comments are anti-foreigner and the rest are emotionally charged rants by "patriots" looking to "get are kuntry bak" / Independence / Freedom etc etc I know what the EU has done for me and so I think I could have a pretty good guess at what the future may hold if we stay in. I have nothing concrete on which to measure the "It will be alright on the night" promises made by the Brexit camp. We need facts not emotional rhetoric from the Brexit camp because at the moment the £GBP is falling like a stone against all major currencies at the prospect of a Brexit. Even the Euro is gaining on the £GBP which kind of throws the argument that "they need us more than we need them" argument in to the long grass. " I had this discussion with my parents as my mum is on the fence and my dad is slightly in the leave camp. But lets consider for a moment, we leave, the EU losses money, other countries receive less, we want to trade with them - eg, fruit and veg from Spain, Greece, the Netherlands, meat and cheese from Italy, all of which are common in UK household, you can't tell me that these products will not go up in price, and that would impact on business and the price we pay. I'm sure we'd all feel it either short or long term. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I think we should stay in for trading and travel And hot women. I fucking love Eastern European women. " Yeah :P though I'm more of a Mediterranean/Nordic kinda guy :P | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"i want to vote to stay in but the tories want me to vote for that so i'm worried i shouldn't vote to stay in. i don't hold any political power so it makes no difference to me personally which way the vote goes. Boris Johnson, Alistair Darling (both tories) to name two are in favour of leaving!
The Alistair Darling who was in Labour?
And is in favour of staying... "Indeed he is. That's a fact I wasn't questioning. I was merely pointing out that a previous poster had allocated him another political party. I found that to be amusing on a thread full of 'facts'. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"hmm...one thought i've had is that the EU has offered to bail the uk out twice this decade (that i know of) and the government turned that down. one time it was funding for food banks, can't remember what the other time was for. so right now we are in the state we're in and have not had help from the EU that we could have had. They also offered funding after major floods that the government declined in at least two years. thanks. there's probably even more i don't know about as well." Leaving will leave us in the incompetent hands of Dodgy Dave and the economic fuckwitt disaster that is George Osborne. Once out, we're fucked! It will take decades to recover (if we ever do). Any rights you have currently will be eroded, so expect to work longer for less and give up planning for retirement. Boris Johnson and Rupert Murdoch are both in favour of leaving, good enough reason to stay in. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
" Boris Johnson and Rupert Murdoch are both in favour of leaving, good enough reason to stay in. " So is Jeremy Corbyn... | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
" Boris Johnson and Rupert Murdoch are both in favour of leaving, good enough reason to stay in. So is Jeremy Corbyn..." He wishes to remain for the reasons I stated about rights erosion | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
" Boris Johnson and Rupert Murdoch are both in favour of leaving, good enough reason to stay in. So is Jeremy Corbyn... He wishes to remain for the reasons I stated about rights erosion " His voting record would suggest otherwise, unless you seriously believe his little road to Damascus conversion story | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"i want to vote to stay in but the tories want me to vote for that so i'm worried i shouldn't vote to stay in. i don't hold any political power so it makes no difference to me personally which way the vote goes." But labour wants you to vote in as well! | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"i want to vote to stay in but the tories want me to vote for that so i'm worried i shouldn't vote to stay in. i don't hold any political power so it makes no difference to me personally which way the vote goes. Yeah it's not sitting well with me agreeing with a Tory either same here" If you're going by that logic, Farage wants out so... | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I vote to be in, cos it is to big of a leap into the darkness and as well in the current situation we are in. It is best to have it as it is, one of the good things is the trading with eu." Other EU countries supply more to us than we supply to them. Particularly in the current economic climate, d'you really think they won't want to continue supplying us? And allowing their side of the deal, they'd have to allow our side of the deal too. Simple! | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Ok, I don't know enough about the EU to make an informed decision as to if we should stay or go. I am on the fence with this one, but my legs are dangling in the "in" side. I'd realy like to have some informed opinions on this, but no slagging each other off, it just confuses matters, and you get 10 genuine posts of credible reason, and 160 of argument resulting in the thread being closed and half of the participants not being heard from for 48 hours. Why should we stay, why should we go The worst aspect about this debate is that the politicians are trying to turn us all into mini economists when really the single over-riding question (and answer) should be..... How will my day to day life materially change whether in, or out? That is what is important and that is what people should be voting about. Talk of securing our borders is complete nonsense as long as we share an open land border with Ireland and that will never change. I went on to the Vote Leave Facebook page the other day in search of some facts but unfortunately about 80% of the comments are anti-foreigner and the rest are emotionally charged rants by "patriots" looking to "get are kuntry bak" / Independence / Freedom etc etc I know what the EU has done for me and so I think I could have a pretty good guess at what the future may hold if we stay in. I have nothing concrete on which to measure the "It will be alright on the night" promises made by the Brexit camp. We need facts not emotional rhetoric from the Brexit camp because at the moment the £GBP is falling like a stone against all major currencies at the prospect of a Brexit. Even the Euro is gaining on the £GBP which kind of throws the argument that "they need us more than we need them" argument in to the long grass. I had this discussion with my parents as my mum is on the fence and my dad is slightly in the leave camp. But lets consider for a moment, we leave, the EU losses money, other countries receive less, we want to trade with them - eg, fruit and veg from Spain, Greece, the Netherlands, meat and cheese from Italy, all of which are common in UK household, you can't tell me that these products will not go up in price, and that would impact on business and the price we pay. I'm sure we'd all feel it either short or long term." And why would the prices of these items go up ? After all they would still want to sell their goods if they out price them selves there are others who manufacture/produce the same things that will be willing to sell at a cheaper price and also if the Euro is stronger that is better for European importers ? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I vote to be in, cos it is to big of a leap into the darkness and as well in the current situation we are in. It is best to have it as it is, one of the good things is the trading with eu. Other EU countries supply more to us than we supply to them. Particularly in the current economic climate, d'you really think they won't want to continue supplying us? And allowing their side of the deal, they'd have to allow our side of the deal too. Simple!" RTFT  | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Ok, I don't know enough about the EU to make an informed decision as to if we should stay or go. I am on the fence with this one, but my legs are dangling in the "in" side. I'd realy like to have some informed opinions on this, but no slagging each other off, it just confuses matters, and you get 10 genuine posts of credible reason, and 160 of argument resulting in the thread being closed and half of the participants not being heard from for 48 hours. Why should we stay, why should we go You will be financially better off if you stay in because no country can negotiate decent trade deals with other countries that are 3-7 times bigger than it (i.e US and China). " And your factual evidence for this is...........??? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Ok, I don't know enough about the EU to make an informed decision as to if we should stay or go. I am on the fence with this one, but my legs are dangling in the "in" side. I'd realy like to have some informed opinions on this, but no slagging each other off, it just confuses matters, and you get 10 genuine posts of credible reason, and 160 of argument resulting in the thread being closed and half of the participants not being heard from for 48 hours. Why should we stay, why should we go You will be financially better off if you stay in because no country can negotiate decent trade deals with other countries that are 3-7 times bigger than it (i.e US and China). And your factual evidence for this is...........??? "Again Read The Thread | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I'm thinking leave. Either way there will be good and bad points. But I'd rather we were in control over issues such as immigration, sovereignty and legislation. Which we aren't while we are within the European Union. There seems to be much emphasis on trade deals as to the case to remain. But while we are paying into the EU, in reality we are paying a tariff to trade as we are paying for membership. " Exactly! | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
" Boris Johnson and Rupert Murdoch are both in favour of leaving, good enough reason to stay in. So is Jeremy Corbyn... He wishes to remain for the reasons I stated about rights erosion His voting record would suggest otherwise, unless you seriously believe his little road to Damascus conversion story " So you're saying he doesn't have the political skill to gauge a complex situation and decide that his ideal preference would play into the hands of those he's fighting against and that the best solution for the country as a whole is to choose the opposite path and not just do what's suits him best......Or is there only a choice of black and white- pick your side and never adapt? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"......the system we have at the moment while not perfect, has to be a more solid foundation for a better fairer Britain than throwing ourselves into a sea of uncertainty." You, like many, seem to be missing the bigger picture. The simple fact is that if we stay in the EU, there will be no Britain as we know it. The great EU plan is for one country/state, ruled by a bunch of unelected bureaucrats in Brussels. You might not always agree with whatever party is in power in the UK, but at least the British people put it there, and the British people can replace it. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
" Boris Johnson and Rupert Murdoch are both in favour of leaving, good enough reason to stay in. So is Jeremy Corbyn... He wishes to remain for the reasons I stated about rights erosion His voting record would suggest otherwise, unless you seriously believe his little road to Damascus conversion story So you're saying he doesn't have the political skill to gauge a complex situation and decide that his ideal preference would play into the hands of those he's fighting against and that the best solution for the country as a whole is to choose the opposite path and not just do what's suits him best......Or is there only a choice of black and white- pick your side and never adapt?" It does appear to be the only thing he has changed his mind about since 1982. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Remember the Scottish referendum? They'd have been in the shit by now if they'd left since all their projections assumed $120 for a barrel of oil. Same principle. " The UK economy depends on oil?? That's new to me. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I'm thinking leave. Either way there will be good and bad points. But I'd rather we were in control over issues such as immigration, sovereignty and legislation. Which we aren't while we are within the European Union. There seems to be much emphasis on trade deals as to the case to remain. But while we are paying into the EU, in reality we are paying a tariff to trade as we are paying for membership. This is why we are voting out. But say we do leave, and there will be a period of uncertainty, who is going to lead the country through that? Is there anyone in politics that you can trust wit that mammoth task of keeping it all together while small to medium businesses fail, and foreign investors look at us as somewhere that used to be a viable place to expand to. We're not the Britain that once was, we don't own great swathes of the world any more, we only just held on to Scotland, and the more I think about it, the more I think we should stay" I'm sorry, but we need some positive thinking, negativity gets you nowhere. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Ok, I don't know enough about the EU to make an informed decision as to if we should stay or go. I am on the fence with this one, but my legs are dangling in the "in" side. I'd realy like to have some informed opinions on this, but no slagging each other off, it just confuses matters, and you get 10 genuine posts of credible reason, and 160 of argument resulting in the thread being closed and half of the participants not being heard from for 48 hours. Why should we stay, why should we go The worst aspect about this debate is that the politicians are trying to turn us all into mini economists when really the single over-riding question (and answer) should be..... How will my day to day life materially change whether in, or out? That is what is important and that is what people should be voting about. Talk of securing our borders is complete nonsense as long as we share an open land border with Ireland and that will never change. I went on to the Vote Leave Facebook page the other day in search of some facts but unfortunately about 80% of the comments are anti-foreigner and the rest are emotionally charged rants by "patriots" looking to "get are kuntry bak" / Independence / Freedom etc etc I know what the EU has done for me and so I think I could have a pretty good guess at what the future may hold if we stay in. I have nothing concrete on which to measure the "It will be alright on the night" promises made by the Brexit camp. We need facts not emotional rhetoric from the Brexit camp because at the moment the £GBP is falling like a stone against all major currencies at the prospect of a Brexit. Even the Euro is gaining on the £GBP which kind of throws the argument that "they need us more than we need them" argument in to the long grass. I had this discussion with my parents as my mum is on the fence and my dad is slightly in the leave camp. But lets consider for a moment, we leave, the EU losses money, other countries receive less, we want to trade with them - eg, fruit and veg from Spain, Greece, the Netherlands, meat and cheese from Italy, all of which are common in UK household, you can't tell me that these products will not go up in price, and that would impact on business and the price we pay. I'm sure we'd all feel it either short or long term. And why would the prices of these items go up ? After all they would still want to sell their goods if they out price them selves there are others who manufacture/produce the same things that will be willing to sell at a cheaper price and also if the Euro is stronger that is better for European importers ? " Many European food producers, like ours, are supported by European subsidies, these will most likely decrease if we leave, therefore production cost will increase, which will drive up consumer cost. We might be able to find producers who will sell cheaper in the longer term, maybe - baring in mind the UK does ban some trade if it does not meet British trading standards in both quality and ethical production. So the big question is, how quickly will we find a cheaper seller who we can trade with, and how long will it take us to negotiate a trade treaty with? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"It's bad enough being dictated to by our elected leaders, non elected beurocrats dictating to me really gets my goat" | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"It's bad enough being dictated to by our elected leaders, non elected beurocrats dictating to me really gets my goat Yes, however, don't you think we have more influence by remaining in? Or do you think that's not that important? " We have influence?? Have you not followed Cameron's recent pathetic attempts at re-negotiation?? I'm sorry, but your suggestion is laughable. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"What makes me laugh is david cameron saying that if he didnt get the deal he wanted he woukd have opted for out but now he has the worthless deal he is in and keeps warning us of inpending doom. Does that mean he would have walked us to are doom if he had received no crums at all instead of the few he got. " Sadly, David Cameron is a pathetic joke! | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"i want to vote to stay in but the tories want me to vote for that so i'm worried i shouldn't vote to stay in. i don't hold any political power so it makes no difference to me personally which way the vote goes. Boris Johnson, Alistair Darling (both tories) to name two are in favour of leaving! "Alistair Darling is a Tory??? I don't think he'd be too impressed with that!!! | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
" We pay 50 million or thereabouts more to the EU everyday than we get back so we will have that each day to spend on what WE decide to not some faceless EU bod" Exactly! | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"i want to vote to stay in but the tories want me to vote for that so i'm worried i shouldn't vote to stay in. i don't hold any political power so it makes no difference to me personally which way the vote goes. Yeah it's not sitting well with me agreeing with a Tory either same here" This is far above party politics! | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
" From my limited knowledge, I am leaning towards the exit, I just can't side with Cameron as a Tory leader " So instead you will side with Gove, Grayling, Farage and Johnson. Wow you know how to pick'em
If I was going to make the decision on such a basis the people leading the Brexit campaign would gaurantee I voted to stay in.
On the basis of economics I would vote stay.
On the fact that European regulatory harmonisation has meant it is easier than ever to market and sell products without further certification or taxation anywhere in the EU I would vote yes.
EU membership is responsible for what little legal protection workers have in the UK, increased civil freedoms and the fact that the CIA cannot without recourse to a European court view European citizens personal data.
I will be voting STAY | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
" Boris Johnson and Rupert Murdoch are both in favour of leaving, good enough reason to stay in. So is Jeremy Corbyn... He wishes to remain for the reasons I stated about rights erosion His voting record would suggest otherwise, unless you seriously believe his little road to Damascus conversion story " Jeremy Corbyn is a joke, he changes his mind more often than a woman! | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
" We pay 50 million or thereabouts more to the EU everyday than we get back so we will have that each day to spend on what WE decide to not some faceless EU bod Exactly! "Check my comments above. We do not pay £50 million a day. It's more like £18 million. Every Brexit backing politician knows this but never mentions it. Better to withhold the truth and have us vote the way they wish than tell us the facts and have us make an informed decision. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
" We pay 50 million or thereabouts more to the EU everyday than we get back so we will have that each day to spend on what WE decide to not some faceless EU bod Exactly! Check my comments above. We do not pay £50 million a day. It's more like £18 million. Every Brexit backing politician knows this but never mentions it. Better to withhold the truth and have us vote the way they wish than tell us the facts and have us make an informed decision.
"Shit, don't go bringing facts into the debate now. Next you'll be telling us that immigrants make a net contribution to the economy! | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
" We pay 50 million or thereabouts more to the EU everyday than we get back so we will have that each day to spend on what WE decide to not some faceless EU bod Exactly! Check my comments above. We do not pay £50 million a day. It's more like £18 million. Every Brexit backing politician knows this but never mentions it. Better to withhold the truth and have us vote the way they wish than tell us the facts and have us make an informed decision.
Shit, don't go bringing facts into the debate now.
Next you'll be telling us that immigrants make a net contribution to the economy! "Shhh... The brexit campaign doesn't want anybody to know that! | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
" We pay 50 million or thereabouts more to the EU everyday than we get back so we will have that each day to spend on what WE decide to not some faceless EU bod Exactly! Check my comments above. We do not pay £50 million a day. It's more like £18 million. Every Brexit backing politician knows this but never mentions it. Better to withhold the truth and have us vote the way they wish than tell us the facts and have us make an informed decision.
Shit, don't go bringing facts into the debate now.
Next you'll be telling us that immigrants make a net contribution to the economy!
Shhh... The brexit campaign doesn't want anybody to know that! "Yeah, pull up the fucking draw bridge already | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I've just seen tomorrows daily mail headline on fb. it says the EU is going to force us all to eat halal meat. i'm pretty sure it's real and not a joke anyway." It's a joke post, think it's the poke | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I've just seen tomorrows daily mail headline on fb. it says the EU is going to force us all to eat halal meat. i'm pretty sure it's real and not a joke anyway. It's a joke post, think it's the poke "aw, thanks. it was pretty funny, but most news is these days so it's hard to tell. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Remember the Scottish referendum? They'd have been in the shit by now if they'd left since all their projections assumed $120 for a barrel of oil. Same principle. " That was the SNP who got it wrong on the oil price. It's the same SNP now who want us to stay in the EU. They can't be trusted they were wrong then and they are wrong now. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"i know they fund housing as well. so long as we stick to EU building regulations (that are supposed to keep heating bills down and are good for the environment) they will pay for that stuff. We pay 50 million or thereabouts more to the EU everyday than we get back so we will have that each day to spend on what WE decide to not some faceless EU bod funny enough a lot of the EU money that comes back is spent in places the UK govt seem not to care about... south wales for example is a net benefiter.... so is north east england..... so is scotland...... so is northern ireland....... so do we get more back than we pay in? didn't wanna derail this topic by asking but i think a new topic asking this would get shut down coz it's another EU topic. i did google as well but can't find anything." Answer is no we don't get back what we pay in. We are being short changed by the EU, and the short change we do get back they tell us how to spend it. I think it's better to leave, take control of that money and spend it how we decide. If you don't like how the government spends it you can vote for someone else at the next general election and get rid of them. That is how democracy works. There is no mechanism in place for the people of Europe to remove the EU commission, they are unelected and unaccountable eurocrats it doesn't matter how they behave you can't get rid of them. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"hmm...one thought i've had is that the EU has offered to bail the uk out twice this decade (that i know of) and the government turned that down. one time it was funding for food banks, can't remember what the other time was for. so right now we are in the state we're in and have not had help from the EU that we could have had. They also offered funding after major floods that the government declined in at least two years. thanks. there's probably even more i don't know about as well. Leaving will leave us in the incompetent hands of Dodgy Dave and the economic fuckwitt disaster that is George Osborne. Once out, we're fucked! It will take decades to recover (if we ever do). Any rights you have currently will be eroded, so expect to work longer for less and give up planning for retirement. Boris Johnson and Rupert Murdoch are both in favour of leaving, good enough reason to stay in. " Dodgy Dave and the economic fuckwit disaster (your words) you just mentioned called George Osborne want us to stay in, good enough reason to leave I say. If you need more undesirables who want us to stay in though how about Nicola Sturgeon and Alex Salmond of the SNP and Gerry Adams and Martin McGuinnnes of Sinn Fein. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
" Dodgy Dave and the economic fuckwit disaster (your words) you just mentioned called George Osborne want us to stay in, good enough reason to leave I say. If you need more undesirables who want us to stay in though how about Nicola Sturgeon and Alex Salmond of the SNP and Gerry Adams and Martin McGuinnnes of Sinn Fein. " | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
" I cant believe that people would vote in to be ruled by the very people we fought two world wars against. " lol yeh, bloody Germans. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"You can just imagin all of the countries that the UK buys from EU countries being told that they can no longer sell to britain because they are not in the special club anymore? try telling that to the French farmers LoL" But coversley... Tell that to Honda in Swindon, Nissan in Sunderland for example where most of the cars produced there are for export... Where is the incentive for them to stay...... The thing that exiters like to forget is that in a lot of industries... The U.K. Needs Europe more than the other way round.... For example... With the low oil price, the U.K. Is actually a net importer at the moment.... | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I'll narrow it down to (a) EU corruption (auditors have not cleared EU accounts once in twenty years) (b)an inability to control mass illegal immigration and (c) when Oxbridge personal wealth-accumulators/crooks like Cameron, Osborne, Blair, Kinnock and Mandelson spend all their time threatening us that we'd better stay in, I know they've either been bought and/or it's in their personal interest to remain. We managed quite well for 2000 years without the EU indeed built an Empire so we can manage quite well without it. And let's not confuse our love for Europe with our contempt for the a corrupt, dysfunctional organisation known as the EU. " Unfortunately, building an empire means you rely on other countries to gain the resources you need. With that in mind, we didn't manage on our own, we relied on other countries resources, as we do now. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
" I cant believe that people would vote in to be ruled by the very people we fought two world wars against. " The French ? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
" I cant believe that people would vote in to be ruled by the very people we fought two world wars against. " We fought 2 world wars against Brussells? Must have missed that. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"A great many of the international companies here (esp the financial and legal ones) are in Britain not because of Britain but because of Europe. They base European head quarters here as English is the international language. Who is gonna keep open headquarters in Britain if it leaves the EU? Why on earth would you?" HSBC said they intend to keep international headquarters in London even if Britain leaves the EU. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I gonna vote leave ... Read somewhere that it will take 2 yrs to implement a full exit due to existing law .... Surely we would know wat the pros and cons are by then" That is correct when we leave we invoke article 50 which gives 2 years for things to remain the same while we sort out new alternative arrangements, trade deals, etc. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
 | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"You can just imagin all of the countries that the UK buys from EU countries being told that they can no longer sell to britain because they are not in the special club anymore? try telling that to the French farmers LoL" Or German car manufacturers like BMW, Mercedes, Audi and VW, they would all be banging on Angela Merkels door saying Germany must have free trade with Britain if we leave. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Rupert Murdoch wants us to leave which to me is a good reason to stay!! "Tony Blair the war criminal wants us to stay in, good enough reason to leave. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Ok, I don't know enough about the EU to make an informed decision as to if we should stay or go. I am on the fence with this one, but my legs are dangling in the "in" side. I'd realy like to have some informed opinions on this, but no slagging each other off, it just confuses matters, and you get 10 genuine posts of credible reason, and 160 of argument resulting in the thread being closed and half of the participants not being heard from for 48 hours. Why should we stay, why should we go" Personally I think we're better in, hammered home by a trip to Switzerland at the weekend there and trying to get papers signed for musical gear I was taking in and out was a nightmare. One involved 150km detour on my route. Not sure if we would see 'physical' borders again and end to Schengen but for me, the prospect of having to do that in every country tipped me to stay. I was genuinely undecided. Funny watching the campaigns though. Almost identical to the Scot Ref, word for word - even though all the 'No's are now arguing the case for Independence that they were so viciously pushing against up here. Latest headline is 'households to be £3500 worse off is we leave' (where they pull these figures from God only knows). Scots were to be £1400 a head worse off if we left. Lol F | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"You can just imagin all of the countries that the UK buys from EU countries being told that they can no longer sell to britain because they are not in the special club anymore? try telling that to the French farmers LoL Or German car manufacturers like BMW, Mercedes, Audi and VW, they would all be banging on Angela Merkels door saying Germany must have free trade with Britain if we leave. " as previously stated get independent informed information. Less than 10% of German GDP is exported to the UK - not that significant & less than 5% of French GDP comes to UK. Whilst it would hurt them - it's not catastrophic! | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Remember the Scottish referendum? They'd have been in the shit by now if they'd left since all their projections assumed $120 for a barrel of oil. Same principle. "
I take it you have a major in north sea oil economics for that statement above
I guess you also forget the years of 1999 / 2000 when oil was as low as $12 a barrel
the Economics of Independence were worked out without oil, oil was over and above the figures due to the Volatility
and for the record, there is a further 50+ years of North sea Oil, then if we get rid of trident we can start on the capped off reservoirs on West coast (BP) and also further exploration
With Scotland still remaining in UK, where is the "bed of roses" that was promised?
Best not to to quote the Scottish Independence referendum in this EU debate as it will open a can of worms with all the lies, deceit & scaremongering from Westminster
good luck to everyone in their decision on whether to opt in or out of the EU
. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"For some reason, I don't entirely trust what I'm told by George Osbourne when it comes to figures, after all, he's been wrong before. I'm still undecided and no one has come up with any resounding reason to stay in or leave. I don't like 'Project Fear' because fear of the unknown is not, in my opinion, a good reason to give. I think a good reason should be substantiated with facts and I haven't seen any that aren't argued the other way. " the latest UK current account is the worst it's ever been. We rely on being able to borrow from the international markets, we no longer have a triple A credit rating, and if our inability to borrow at decent interest rates then our cost of borrowing will cripple us. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
" Personally I think we're better in, hammered home by a trip to Switzerland at the weekend there and trying to get papers signed for musical gear I was taking in and out was a nightmare. One involved 150km detour on my route. Not sure if we would see 'physical' borders again and end to Schengen but for me, the prospect of having to do that in every country tipped me to stay. I was genuinely undecided. " why was that? what was the confusion or was it type of wood? strange how easy it is to fly to USA with skydive canopies with fitted AAD's (a small pyrotechnic charge) what !!! an explosive device on an aircraft - yes I think the increase of border control which you experienced is more a plus to leave than a minus to stay border protection is essential | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I vote to be in, cos it is to big of a leap into the darkness and as well in the current situation we are in. It is best to have it as it is, one of the good things is the trading with eu. This is the kind of response I was looking for "When we first went in, 60% of our trade was with the common market countries, 6 of them. Now, 45% of our trade is with the rest of the EU... 27 countries. VAT rates are set by the EU.. a minimum of 15% on most goods, 5 % on some limited items (like energy) , and zero on others. Two years ago the EU commission produced a report recommending that VAT is put in all goods and services, including children's clothes and food, and that all VAT should be a minimum of 15% on everything. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Can anyone tell me please if we leave the eu how will that effect people wanting to move to Spain /France ? " Or those who have live in Spain for 10 years plus | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"For some reason, I don't entirely trust what I'm told by George Osbourne when it comes to figures, after all, he's been wrong before. I'm still undecided and no one has come up with any resounding reason to stay in or leave. I don't like 'Project Fear' because fear of the unknown is not, in my opinion, a good reason to give. I think a good reason should be substantiated with facts and I haven't seen any that aren't argued the other way. the latest UK current account is the worst it's ever been. We rely on being able to borrow from the international markets, we no longer have a triple A credit rating, and if our inability to borrow at decent interest rates then our cost of borrowing will cripple us." George Osborne said he would eliminate the deficit and run a surplus before the next general election, if he achieves that we won't necessarily need to worry so much about the cost of borrowing and our credit rating would go back up. It remains to be seen if he does achieve a surplus though, can Osborne's economic forecasts really be trusted? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Can anyone tell me please if we leave the eu how will that effect people wanting to move to Spain /France ? Or those who have live in Spain for 10 years plus " Googled it and you should be okay unless Spain get nasty and demand you pay more tax and for health care .they can't throw you out which is good news. I only asked as a customer is selling up to move to Spain ,their retired. Everyone is telling them to wait and see what happens after vote.doubt their listen | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Can anyone tell me please if we leave the eu how will that effect people wanting to move to Spain /France ? Or those who have live in Spain for 10 years plus Googled it and you should be okay unless Spain get nasty and demand you pay more tax and for health care .they can't throw you out which is good news. I only asked as a customer is selling up to move to Spain ,their retired. Everyone is telling them to wait and see what happens after vote.doubt their listen " this is a very interesting point for us expats. But if you are paying tax in your "host nation" then you will probably be ok on some matters such as health etc. If we leave, then we may have to accept that our UK state pension will lock in at the current rate - no inflation increase. Driving licence will have to be obtained, and here in France a Carte Sejour obtained with all it's implications. Best advice is prepare for out as that is the most hassle for us lol. Also be prepared for the Fx rate to drop like a stone - already lost 26 cents.  | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
" Personally I think we're better in, hammered home by a trip to Switzerland at the weekend there and trying to get papers signed for musical gear I was taking in and out was a nightmare. One involved 150km detour on my route. Not sure if we would see 'physical' borders again and end to Schengen but for me, the prospect of having to do that in every country tipped me to stay. I was genuinely undecided. why was that? what was the confusion or was it type of wood? strange how easy it is to fly to USA with skydive canopies with fitted AAD's (a small pyrotechnic charge) what !!! an explosive device on an aircraft - yes I think the increase of border control which you experienced is more a plus to leave than a minus to stay border protection is essential" Sorry man, you've completely fucking lost me there lol For the record, difficulty is papers must be stamped in and out for import/ export - even if items are not for sale, if you don't and you get stopped you get fined the total of what's in your vehicle - this was learned by £7500 experience last year. Getting a border point that will have both countries sides staffed to complete that is not so easy, hence the diversion. Border protection being essential? If people who should t be 'here' want to be here, they'll get here. No matter what you have in place. Bit like banning guns. Folk who want them but aren't meant to have them, they'll get them. F | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Can anyone tell me please if we leave the eu how will that effect people wanting to move to Spain /France ? Or those who have live in Spain for 10 years plus Googled it and you should be okay unless Spain get nasty and demand you pay more tax and for health care .they can't throw you out which is good news. I only asked as a customer is selling up to move to Spain ,their retired. Everyone is telling them to wait and see what happens after vote.doubt their listen this is a very interesting point for us expats. But if you are paying tax in your "host nation" then you will probably be ok on some matters such as health etc. If we leave, then we may have to accept that our UK state pension will lock in at the current rate - no inflation increase. Driving licence will have to be obtained, and here in France a Carte Sejour obtained with all it's implications. Best advice is prepare for out as that is the most hassle for us lol. Also be prepared for the Fx rate to drop like a stone - already lost 26 cents. "Good news is they can't force you out otherwise we are entitled to do the same ,but if vote out will be a hassle. If voted out it will be a case of how spiteful the eu countries want to be to our expats .sorry for simple terms I'm too tired to use long words | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"For some reason, I don't entirely trust what I'm told by George Osbourne when it comes to figures, after all, he's been wrong before. I'm still undecided and no one has come up with any resounding reason to stay in or leave. I don't like 'Project Fear' because fear of the unknown is not, in my opinion, a good reason to give. I think a good reason should be substantiated with facts and I haven't seen any that aren't argued the other way. the latest UK current account is the worst it's ever been. We rely on being able to borrow from the international markets, we no longer have a triple A credit rating, and if our inability to borrow at decent interest rates then our cost of borrowing will cripple us. George Osborne said he would eliminate the deficit and run a surplus before the next general election, if he achieves that we won't necessarily need to worry so much about the cost of borrowing and our credit rating would go back up. It remains to be seen if he does achieve a surplus though, can Osborne's economic forecasts really be trusted? " lets hope he does achieve his goal, as the surplus can go towards paying off the national debt, thereby an improvement on the current account, therefore quite right cheaper borrowing. Lots of if's here, but fingers crossed... | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Can anyone tell me please if we leave the eu how will that effect people wanting to move to Spain /France ? Or those who have live in Spain for 10 years plus Googled it and you should be okay unless Spain get nasty and demand you pay more tax and for health care .they can't throw you out which is good news. I only asked as a customer is selling up to move to Spain ,their retired. Everyone is telling them to wait and see what happens after vote.doubt their listen this is a very interesting point for us expats. But if you are paying tax in your "host nation" then you will probably be ok on some matters such as health etc. If we leave, then we may have to accept that our UK state pension will lock in at the current rate - no inflation increase. Driving licence will have to be obtained, and here in France a Carte Sejour obtained with all it's implications. Best advice is prepare for out as that is the most hassle for us lol. Also be prepared for the Fx rate to drop like a stone - already lost 26 cents. "Thats because it was artificially high. There may be extra capital gains tax to pay or stuff like that for for foreigners but can't see things changing much in Spain for example, why would they want to damage their own economy? And one of the biggest markets for property in Spain now comes from the Russians and last time I looked they weren't in the EU | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Can anyone tell me please if we leave the eu how will that effect people wanting to move to Spain /France ? Or those who have live in Spain for 10 years plus Googled it and you should be okay unless Spain get nasty and demand you pay more tax and for health care .they can't throw you out which is good news. I only asked as a customer is selling up to move to Spain ,their retired. Everyone is telling them to wait and see what happens after vote.doubt their listen this is a very interesting point for us expats. But if you are paying tax in your "host nation" then you will probably be ok on some matters such as health etc. If we leave, then we may have to accept that our UK state pension will lock in at the current rate - no inflation increase. Driving licence will have to be obtained, and here in France a Carte Sejour obtained with all it's implications. Best advice is prepare for out as that is the most hassle for us lol. Also be prepared for the Fx rate to drop like a stone - already lost 26 cents.
Thats because it was artificially high. There may be extra capital gains tax to pay or stuff like that for for foreigners but can't see things changing much in Spain for example, why would they want to damage their own economy? And one of the biggest markets for property in Spain now comes from the Russians and last time I looked they weren't in the EU "Rich Russians buy a lot of property in London too, again Russia not in the EU. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
" HSBC said they intend to keep international headquarters in London even if Britain leaves the EU. " That's because it's their international HQ, not their European HQ. They said the European devision of the London HQ (around 1000 staff) will be taken to Paris in the event of Brexit. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
" HSBC said they intend to keep international headquarters in London even if Britain leaves the EU. That's because it's their international HQ, not their European HQ. They said the European devision of the London HQ (around 1000 staff) will be taken to Paris in the event of Brexit. " Now who is deliberately trying to mislead people. The exact words the HSBC chief executive used were "could be moved" not "will be moved" so that kind of language is more vague than the kind of certainty you just tried to put on it. As the HSBC international headquarters will remain in Britain in we Leave though i would say that is a vote of confidence in Britain. The German Deutsche Borse recently tried to buy the London stock exchange so why would they do that if they think a possible Brexit would be bad for Britain. They must know Brexit is a real possibility yet they still tried to buy it. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Ok, I don't know enough about the EU to make an informed decision as to if we should stay or go. I am on the fence with this one, but my legs are dangling in the "in" side. I'd realy like to have some informed opinions on this, but no slagging each other off, it just confuses matters, and you get 10 genuine posts of credible reason, and 160 of argument resulting in the thread being closed and half of the participants not being heard from for 48 hours. Why should we stay, why should we go" this is getting pretty dull now. i'm past caring anymore to be honest. i just want it all to be over and the idealistic utopia hunters that seem to be mostly made up of rabid righties frothing at the mouth to go away. i'll go through the motions of going to the polling station and registering my turnout in respect for the sacrifices made by the chartists etc. but i think that when i'm in the booth i'll close my eyes turn round three times and make like it's pin the tail on the donkey and end up scrawling an X on the wall. then i'll go home and wait for whichever armageddon that both sides are promising. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
" HSBC said they intend to keep international headquarters in London even if Britain leaves the EU. That's because it's their international HQ, not their European HQ. They said the European devision of the London HQ (around 1000 staff) will be taken to Paris in the event of Brexit. Im certainly not trying to mislead anyone. I read a transcript of the interview with CEO Stuart Glover who said he believes that a Brexit would result in a "significant impact" resulting in the leaking of around 20% of the 5000 uk jobs to Paris. Now who is deliberately trying to mislead people. The exact words the HSBC chief executive used were "could be moved" not "will be moved" so that kind of language is more vague than the kind of certainty you just tried to put on it. As the HSBC international headquarters will remain in Britain in we Leave though i would say that is a vote of confidence in Britain. The German Deutsche Borse recently tried to buy the London stock exchange so why would they do that if they think a possible Brexit would be bad for Britain. They must know Brexit is a real possibility yet they still tried to buy it. " | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Ok, I don't know enough about the EU to make an informed decision as to if we should stay or go. I am on the fence with this one, but my legs are dangling in the "in" side. I'd realy like to have some informed opinions on this, but no slagging each other off, it just confuses matters, and you get 10 genuine posts of credible reason, and 160 of argument resulting in the thread being closed and half of the participants not being heard from for 48 hours. Why should we stay, why should we go this is getting pretty dull now. i'm past caring anymore to be honest. i just want it all to be over and the idealistic utopia hunters that seem to be mostly made up of rabid righties frothing at the mouth to go away. i'll go through the motions of going to the polling station and registering my turnout in respect for the sacrifices made by the chartists etc. but i think that when i'm in the booth i'll close my eyes turn round three times and make like it's pin the tail on the donkey and end up scrawling an X on the wall. then i'll go home and wait for whichever armageddon that both sides are promising." I suspect in the secrecy of the polling booth Jeremy Corbyn will vote Leave. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I'll be doing more reaserch but I'm going to say "in" Many of us on here have been through a divorce at some point, this is the same but on a bigger scale, I know personally that it took a lot longer for me and my ex to get financial normality back after the split, it was complicated and stressful, leaving a body that we have been financially tied to for so long is going to leave scars, and wounds that will never heal. " I went through a rather messy, long-winded and stressful divorce. It did take a while to get back some kind of normality, especially financially, as I had to pay through the nose for quite some time after. But, to be honest with you I'm now much better off, both emotionally and financially... there's no way I would be in anywhere near as good a financial position now if I was still married to her. And since the divorce I have gained so many more friends than I had while I was married. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Ok, I don't know enough about the EU to make an informed decision as to if we should stay or go. I am on the fence with this one, but my legs are dangling in the "in" side. I'd realy like to have some informed opinions on this, but no slagging each other off, it just confuses matters, and you get 10 genuine posts of credible reason, and 160 of argument resulting in the thread being closed and half of the participants not being heard from for 48 hours. Why should we stay, why should we go this is getting pretty dull now. i'm past caring anymore to be honest. i just want it all to be over and the idealistic utopia hunters that seem to be mostly made up of rabid righties frothing at the mouth to go away. i'll go through the motions of going to the polling station and registering my turnout in respect for the sacrifices made by the chartists etc. but i think that when i'm in the booth i'll close my eyes turn round three times and make like it's pin the tail on the donkey and end up scrawling an X on the wall. then i'll go home and wait for whichever armageddon that both sides are promising. I suspect in the secrecy of the polling booth Jeremy Corbyn will vote Leave. " After a rendition of The Hokey Cokey | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Ok, I don't know enough about the EU to make an informed decision as to if we should stay or go. I am on the fence with this one, but my legs are dangling in the "in" side. I'd realy like to have some informed opinions on this, but no slagging each other off, it just confuses matters, and you get 10 genuine posts of credible reason, and 160 of argument resulting in the thread being closed and half of the participants not being heard from for 48 hours. Why should we stay, why should we go this is getting pretty dull now. i'm past caring anymore to be honest. i just want it all to be over and the idealistic utopia hunters that seem to be mostly made up of rabid righties frothing at the mouth to go away. i'll go through the motions of going to the polling station and registering my turnout in respect for the sacrifices made by the chartists etc. but i think that when i'm in the booth i'll close my eyes turn round three times and make like it's pin the tail on the donkey and end up scrawling an X on the wall. then i'll go home and wait for whichever armageddon that both sides are promising." And its all come to this..when I saw the st george,s flags hanging from the walls of our village shops and the queens 90th on friday it all brought a tear to my eye..  | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"How did we survive making our own rules for100s of years before joining the EU " We just used the rules of every nation that invaded us on big ships like the Vikings and the Romans, other European countries in other words | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"How did we survive making our own rules for100s of years before joining the EU " A fuck-off big Navy and gunboat diplomacy  | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
" I saw the st george,s flags hanging from the walls of our village shops and the queens 90th on friday it all brought a tear to my eye.. "sounds horrible | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"As with every debate, people concentrate on the extremes of the discussion not the middle ground which is where the decisions need to be made. Lots of "how did we cope before" and "we got in fine without them" stuff. No one is suggesting we won't cope or that it will bring about the downfall of the nation, that's not the debate. The debate is which is more be beneficial. "Trouble is anyone has a different opinions on that and no one knows for sure what will happen if we leave, it all guess work | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Important question. Will we still get champions league football if we vote no? "Russia, Ukraine, Turkey, Norway, Switzerland, and many other non EU countries qualify for champions league and europa league. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I'll be doing more reaserch but I'm going to say "in" the problem I have is that people seem to be seeing it as an excuse to get rid of foreign nationals and keep out refugees, that's not going to happen. " A very lame basis for your decision. Nevertheless you must be proud of the company you keep. Let's see now there's Alex Salmond, Gerry Adams, Martin McGuinnnes, Baron Mandelson, David Cameron, George Osborne, Neil Kinnock and last but not least our very own and favourite war criminal...Tony Blair! Blood and treasure dripping from their dirty paws. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"hmm...one thought i've had is that the EU has offered to bail the uk out twice this decade (that i know of) and the government turned that down. one time it was funding for food banks, can't remember what the other time was for. so right now we are in the state we're in and have not had help from the EU that we could have had." One reason why we do not get such funding from the EU is due to the conditions attached such as match funding. The economics & conditions do not make sense | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"From a public health perspective, staying in allows us to explore the free market in drugs meaning we can continue to get medicines on the NHS free of charge. A Brexit would mean a closed market for pharmaceuticals, rocketing the market prices up and pulling our NHS apart faster than the tories could ever. " TTIP is one of the biggest threats to our Nhs and could pull the NHS apart faster than the tories ever could. Obama will come to the UK this week and tell us all to vote to stay in, but the only reason he wants us to stay in is because of the TTIP deal between the USA and the EU. TTIP could see large chunks of our NHS being bought up by private American companies, corporations and conglomerates, TTIP could lead to the privatisation of the NHS. If people want a free NHS then they need to vote Leave, don't listen to the hypocrite Obama who would never dream of giving away American sovereignty and his only motivation for keeping us in the EU is TTIP. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I think we should stay in for all sorts of reasons, some economic and some political (with a soupçon of my emotional gut instinct thrown in). I also think that if you genuinely don't know how you feel about staying in or leaving then you are better off voting to stick with the status quo rather than voting to change something you have no strong feelings about and bringing in a period of instability." There is no status quo. The EU is changing and in a few years we (as we are not in the eurozone will be on the outside of the changes looking in. There is just as much uncertainty about staying in as there is about leaving. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"ok, i know this isn't joke news but george osbourne is trying to slip more cuts in by saying if we leave the EU people will end up poorer." George Osbourne is predicting what will happen now in the year 2030 telling us we'll be worse off then. Its ridiculous, if he wants to make predictions that far into the future maybe he should leave the government and apply for Mystic Meg's job. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"ok, i know this isn't joke news but george osbourne is trying to slip more cuts in by saying if we leave the EU people will end up poorer. George Osbourne is predicting what will happen now in the year 2030 telling us we'll be worse off then. Its ridiculous, if he wants to make predictions that far into the future maybe he should leave the government and apply for Mystic Meg's job. " lol. we're already worse off now, i can predict we're gonna be worse off in the future also. whether we stay in or not. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"As with every debate, people concentrate on the extremes of the discussion not the middle ground which is where the decisions need to be made. Lots of "how did we cope before" and "we got in fine without them" stuff. No one is suggesting we won't cope or that it will bring about the downfall of the nation, that's not the debate. The debate is which is more be beneficial. "First you bring facts, now you introduce logic. You know you've come to the wrong place right? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I am a little naive when he comes to this, I don't understand any of it and when someone asks my view I have an overwhelming urge to run away because I don't want to admit that I haven't got a clue, the only thing I do kind of know that being in the EU (please tell me if I am wrong here!!) they bought in the employment rights that we have today (again I stress I don't know this for sure) so if I have got it correct I would hate for all those rights to disappear. At the moment because I am obviously a bit thick when he comes to politics etc, I think it would be safer for me to say 'I'm not voting!!' G x" . I have no idea wether the employment rights are exactly the same in the UK as they are in Spain ,Italy, Greece,Hungary or Romania.. Let's look? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
