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Zebra crossings - seems optional to stop now
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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Zebra crossing I take each morning on way to work (near a school) only about 50% of drivers stop these days to let you cross, With certain ethnic groups being the worse offenders
Is this just a London thing ? |
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By *B2016Man
over a year ago
and around |
"Zebra crossing I take each morning on way to work (near a school) only about 50% of drivers stop these days to let you cross, With certain ethnic groups being the worse offenders
Is this just a London thing ?"
London is one of the worst for this. Plus many people don't say thank you anymore. Really gripes me when I've stopped and someone doesn't say thank you. A nod, hand wave, smile, they don't cost much now days. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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well if it is just a London thing at the moment god help us in 20 years time here in the mids, as when I last drove round London 30 years ago red traffic light seemed to mean go on quick oh just 1 more oh go on then just another one,and that's been happening here in the mids last 10 years or so. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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its been like this for ages up here. best thing i've found to do is stare at the cars heading towards you (on the side you are wanting to cross from), then they notice you're waiting to cross. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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No its not a London thing at all I've seen it everywhere I travel (including Southampton) I think part of the trouble is in lots of countries zebra crossings don't mean shit and they adopt the same approach here,it's also the same in reverse these guys will walk out in front of you when your driving past.
However for me the worst still has to be the cyclists who think redlights are for motor vehicles only. I work near euston square and quite often a cyclist will fly past the pedestrian crossing while its red for vehicles (one day i'll just stop dead and sue the fucker. |
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"Zebra crossing I take each morning on way to work (near a school) only about 50% of drivers stop these days to let you cross, With certain ethnic groups being the worse offenders
Is this just a London thing ?
London is one of the worst for this. Plus many people don't say thank you anymore. Really gripes me when I've stopped and someone doesn't say thank you. A nod, hand wave, smile, they don't cost much now days."
You're supposed to stop. THEY have right of way. You haven't done THEM a favour? Where's this attitude that you must be thanked for driving correctly?
Thank you for stopping at a red light.
Thank you for not parking on a hill.
Thank you for not driving the wrong way down a road.
Thank you for having wing mirrors
Thank you for driving the right way round a roundabout.
You are supposed to stop at a crossing. |
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Rule 195
Zebra crossings. As you approach a zebra crossing
look out for pedestrians waiting to cross and be ready to slow down or stop to let them cross
you MUST give way when a pedestrian has moved onto a crossing
allow more time for stopping on wet or icy roads
do not wave or use your horn to invite pedestrians across; this could be dangerous if another vehicle is approaching
be aware of pedestrians approaching from the side of the crossing.
I think point one makes it ( muddily ) clear you should stop anyway. |
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By *elson61Man
over a year ago
WELWYN GARDEN CITY |
"
You're supposed to stop. THEY have right of way. You haven't done THEM a favour? Where's this attitude that you must be thanked for driving correctly?
Thank you for stopping at a red light.
Thank you for not parking on a hill.
Thank you for not driving the wrong way down a road.
Thank you for having wing mirrors
Thank you for driving the right way round a roundabout.
You are supposed to stop at a crossing. "
No, you are not supposed to stop. The Highway Code says you MUST give way when a pedestrian has moved on to a crossing. It also says you should be ready to slow down or stop to let them cross, but nowhere does it say you have to stop when a pedestrian is standing on the pavement.
If I am driving towards a zebra crossing and I see a pedestrian there I look to see what traffic is coming towards me and behind me. If I have traffic behind me and coming towards me I will stop to let them cross, but if there is nothing coming towards me or behind me I carry on as I know the pedestrian will be able to carry on once I have passed them. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Zebra crossing I take each morning on way to work (near a school) only about 50% of drivers stop these days to let you cross, With certain ethnic groups being the worse offenders
Is this just a London thing ?
London is one of the worst for this. Plus many people don't say thank you anymore. Really gripes me when I've stopped and someone doesn't say thank you. A nod, hand wave, smile, they don't cost much now days.
You're supposed to stop. THEY have right of way. You haven't done THEM a favour? Where's this attitude that you must be thanked for driving correctly?
Thank you for stopping at a red light.
Thank you for not parking on a hill.
Thank you for not driving the wrong way down a road.
Thank you for having wing mirrors
Thank you for driving the right way round a roundabout.
You are supposed to stop at a crossing. "
I was about to say! It's not a courtesy - it's the fucking law. |
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By *B9 QueenWoman
over a year ago
Over the rainbow, under the bridge |
"Zebra crossing I take each morning on way to work (near a school) only about 50% of drivers stop these days to let you cross, With certain ethnic groups being the worse offenders
Is this just a London thing ?
London is one of the worst for this. Plus many people don't say thank you anymore. Really gripes me when I've stopped and someone doesn't say thank you. A nod, hand wave, smile, they don't cost much now days.
You're supposed to stop. THEY have right of way. You haven't done THEM a favour? Where's this attitude that you must be thanked for driving correctly?
Thank you for stopping at a red light.
Thank you for not parking on a hill.
Thank you for not driving the wrong way down a road.
Thank you for having wing mirrors
Thank you for driving the right way round a roundabout.
You are supposed to stop at a crossing. "
Exactly. Do you thank other drivers for stopping at red lights when they are supposed to?
Incidentally, pedestrians are the only road users who can have right of way. All others may have priority but never right of way according to my instructor. |
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"
You're supposed to stop. THEY have right of way. You haven't done THEM a favour? Where's this attitude that you must be thanked for driving correctly?
Thank you for stopping at a red light.
Thank you for not parking on a hill.
Thank you for not driving the wrong way down a road.
Thank you for having wing mirrors
Thank you for driving the right way round a roundabout.
You are supposed to stop at a crossing.
No, you are not supposed to stop. The Highway Code says you MUST give way when a pedestrian has moved on to a crossing. It also says you should be ready to slow down or stop to let them cross, but nowhere does it say you have to stop when a pedestrian is standing on the pavement.
If I am driving towards a zebra crossing and I see a pedestrian there I look to see what traffic is coming towards me and behind me. If I have traffic behind me and coming towards me I will stop to let them cross, but if there is nothing coming towards me or behind me I carry on as I know the pedestrian will be able to carry on once I have passed them."
Wonderful. Just the same way of saying Rule 195 above.
No one needs to thank you for stopping at a Zebra crossing. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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It's not quite reached my part of London yet,although most of our crossings have lights now. There is one busy road I cross frequently at a crossing that doesn't have the stripes (I think it may be a puffin crossing? Someone enlighten me please) and drivers often stop to let me cross. It's rare that a car doesn't stop at a zebra crossing. |
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By *kgeminiMan
over a year ago
Southampton |
"Zebra crossing I take each morning on way to work (near a school) only about 50% of drivers stop these days to let you cross, With certain ethnic groups being the worse offenders
Is this just a London thing ?
London is one of the worst for this. Plus many people don't say thank you anymore. Really gripes me when I've stopped and someone doesn't say thank you. A nod, hand wave, smile, they don't cost much now days.
You're supposed to stop. THEY have right of way. You haven't done THEM a favour? Where's this attitude that you must be thanked for driving correctly?
Thank you for stopping at a red light.
Thank you for not parking on a hill.
Thank you for not driving the wrong way down a road.
Thank you for having wing mirrors
Thank you for driving the right way round a roundabout.
You are supposed to stop at a crossing. "
Yes you are supposed to stop and you don't have to say thank you, but it's still polite to say thank you. This is the same when you have let someone out or held a door open for someone it's polite to say thank.
It's not the law it's just etiquette |
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"Zebra crossing I take each morning on way to work (near a school) only about 50% of drivers stop these days to let you cross, With certain ethnic groups being the worse offenders
Is this just a London thing ?
London is one of the worst for this. Plus many people don't say thank you anymore. Really gripes me when I've stopped and someone doesn't say thank you. A nod, hand wave, smile, they don't cost much now days.
You're supposed to stop. THEY have right of way. You haven't done THEM a favour? Where's this attitude that you must be thanked for driving correctly?
Thank you for stopping at a red light.
Thank you for not parking on a hill.
Thank you for not driving the wrong way down a road.
Thank you for having wing mirrors
Thank you for driving the right way round a roundabout.
You are supposed to stop at a crossing.
Yes you are supposed to stop and you don't have to say thank you, but it's still polite to say thank you. This is the same when you have let someone out or held a door open for someone it's polite to say thank.
It's not the law it's just etiquette"
Thank you for posting a reply to my post. You haven't said thank you to me for posting mine tho .... please thank me in your next post. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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This is the current government legislation for Precedence of pedestrians over vehicles at Zebra crossings
25.—(1) Every pedestrian, if he is on the carriageway within the limits of a Zebra crossing, which is not for the time being controlled by a constable in uniform or traffic warden, before any part of a vehicle has entered those limits, shall have precedence within those limits over that vehicle and the driver of the vehicle shall accord such precedence to any such pedestrian.
(2) Where there is a refuge for pedestrians or central reservation on a Zebra crossing, the parts of the crossing situated on each side of the refuge for pedestrians or central reservation shall, for the purposes of this regulation, be treated as separate crossings.
Clear as mud? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I don't live in London so I can't speak for there. But when I lived in NYC I think my hand would fall off if I thanked every car that stopped for me on my way to work. 
As for the OP, people are really great about stopping for you at zebra crossings in Leeds. Marc always tells me he prefers Yorkshire drivers to those anywhere else in the country. |
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"This is the current government legislation for Precedence of pedestrians over vehicles at Zebra crossings
25.—(1) Every pedestrian, if he is on the carriageway within the limits of a Zebra crossing, which is not for the time being controlled by a constable in uniform or traffic warden, before any part of a vehicle has entered those limits, shall have precedence within those limits over that vehicle and the driver of the vehicle shall accord such precedence to any such pedestrian.
(2) Where there is a refuge for pedestrians or central reservation on a Zebra crossing, the parts of the crossing situated on each side of the refuge for pedestrians or central reservation shall, for the purposes of this regulation, be treated as separate crossings.
Clear as mud? "
No that's pretty damn crystal. Thank you. Where's it from.
Simply - Pedestrians have right of way. STOP for them.
You'd be surprised how many people think if you mowed them down it's their fault for being in the road.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"This is the current government legislation for Precedence of pedestrians over vehicles at Zebra crossings
25.—(1) Every pedestrian, if he is on the carriageway within the limits of a Zebra crossing, which is not for the time being controlled by a constable in uniform or traffic warden, before any part of a vehicle has entered those limits, shall have precedence within those limits over that vehicle and the driver of the vehicle shall accord such precedence to any such pedestrian.
(2) Where there is a refuge for pedestrians or central reservation on a Zebra crossing, the parts of the crossing situated on each side of the refuge for pedestrians or central reservation shall, for the purposes of this regulation, be treated as separate crossings.
Clear as mud?
No that's pretty damn crystal. Thank you. Where's it from.
Simply - Pedestrians have right of way. STOP for them.
You'd be surprised how many people think if you mowed them down it's their fault for being in the road.
"
It was from legislation.gov.uk
Unfortunately we do live in a society where some people do believe that cars should have the right of way in the road, regardless of a crossing in place or not. |
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By *elson61Man
over a year ago
WELWYN GARDEN CITY |
"
I was about to say! It's not a courtesy - it's the fucking law."
It's only the law when a pedestrian has started to cross. When the pedestrian is standing on the pavement and a driver decides to stop it's a courtesy, there is no legal requirement for a driver to stop while the pedestrian is still on the pavement. |
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"
I was about to say! It's not a courtesy - it's the fucking law.
It's only the law when a pedestrian has started to cross. When the pedestrian is standing on the pavement and a driver decides to stop it's a courtesy, there is no legal requirement for a driver to stop while the pedestrian is still on the pavement."
So why would they give someone a ticket was a £30 fine for not stopping? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"
I was about to say! It's not a courtesy - it's the fucking law.
It's only the law when a pedestrian has started to cross. When the pedestrian is standing on the pavement and a driver decides to stop it's a courtesy, there is no legal requirement for a driver to stop while the pedestrian is still on the pavement."
You'd fail your driving test if you don't stop for waiting pedestrians though.
The whole point in these crossings is that people have somewhere where pedestrians are a priority on the road and a safe place to cross. |
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You'd fail your driving test if you don't stop for waiting pedestrians though.
Really? And your source for that is? "
Mines my driving instructor also someone already posted the government legislation on the matter |
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"Rule 195
Zebra crossings. As you approach a zebra crossing
look out for pedestrians waiting to cross and be ready to slow down or stop to let them cross
you MUST give way when a pedestrian has moved onto a crossing
allow more time for stopping on wet or icy roads
do not wave or use your horn to invite pedestrians across; this could be dangerous if another vehicle is approaching
be aware of pedestrians approaching from the side of the crossing.
I think point one makes it ( muddily ) clear you should stop anyway. "
see rule 19 |
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It's a pity that driving standards have dropped so much. It seems that unless there are traffic lights drivers can't think for themselves. Look how many roundabouts and junctions have traffic lights now when they were fine without them.
Zebra crossings are far better than pelican crossings. The traffic doesn't have to stop for so long so there is less congestion. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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worries me does this - when kids start walking to school by themselves and you plan a safe route for them to follow - including crossing at the zebra - fortunately the one mine had to cross had a lollypop man there |
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By *elson61Man
over a year ago
WELWYN GARDEN CITY |
"
You'd fail your driving test if you don't stop for waiting pedestrians though.
Really? And your source for that is?
Mines my driving instructor also someone already posted the government legislation on the matter "
Your driving instructor is talking rubbish then. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Zebra crossing I take each morning on way to work (near a school) only about 50% of drivers stop these days to let you cross, With certain ethnic groups being the worse offenders
Is this just a London thing ?
London is one of the worst for this. Plus many people don't say thank you anymore. Really gripes me when I've stopped and someone doesn't say thank you. A nod, hand wave, smile, they don't cost much now days."
I don't say thankyou anymore at crossings because I had some poor experiences with guys shouting comments after I smiled at them to say thank you.
Now I just keep my head down and keep on walking. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"
You'd fail your driving test if you don't stop for waiting pedestrians though.
Really? And your source for that is?
Mines my driving instructor also someone already posted the government legislation on the matter
Your driving instructor is talking rubbish then."
I was also told that when I took my test.
I was always under the impression that zebra/flashylight crossings were mandatory for you to stop as a car driver *when safe to do so*. That's why you're taught when you're doing driving lessons that you should never speed up if you can see a crossing. |
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"
You'd fail your driving test if you don't stop for waiting pedestrians though.
Really? And your source for that is?
Mines my driving instructor also someone already posted the government legislation on the matter
Your driving instructor is talking rubbish then."
No the law is to stop the government legislation is on the .gov website |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Zebra crossing I take each morning on way to work (near a school) only about 50% of drivers stop these days to let you cross, With certain ethnic groups being the worse offenders
Is this just a London thing ?"
No it's clearly not just a London thing and what ethnic groups are the worst offenders ?
You obviously think it's relevant or you wouldn't have said so. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"
You'd fail your driving test if you don't stop for waiting pedestrians though.
Really? And your source for that is? "
if there's someone waiting to cross that is. obviously they won't expect you to stop if nobody is there.
because you are supposed to 'look out for pedestrians waiting to cross and be ready to slow down or stop to let them cross'.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I walk a good chunk of my journey to work and I have had so many drivers continue to dive across one local zebra crossing when I am already on it that I now wack the car as it passes me. So far this year its happened 4 times. Taxi drivers for me are the worst offenders. The most recent being on last Friday afternoon where a car that had a slow moving queue in front of it actively moved across the zebra crossing when I had already walked onto it. The driver to my right had stopped to let me cross, the driver to my left just carried on. |
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We went to London last week and I felt like a proper Boy Scout helping all the tourists cross the road. 
They'd all be standing patiently while car after car drove past happily thinking "I'm *prepared* to stop, but I'm not actually going to until you put one foot on the crossing". I just step out and, whilst being *prepared* to flee back to the pavement squeeling if necessary, I never let that show on my face.
And I always give a cheery wave, it takes some of the sting out of the fact that I've forced them to stop, and it makes them remember that we're all human beings.
Mr ddc |
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By *elson61Man
over a year ago
WELWYN GARDEN CITY |
"
You'd fail your driving test if you don't stop for waiting pedestrians though.
Really? And your source for that is?
if there's someone waiting to cross that is. obviously they won't expect you to stop if nobody is there.
because you are supposed to 'look out for pedestrians waiting to cross and be ready to slow down or stop to let them cross'.
"
But where does it say that in law that you have to let them cross if they are not actually on the crossing but standing on the pavement by the crossing? How would it be classed as a serious fault by the driving test examiner if a test candidate sees a pedestrian by the side of the road at a zebra crossing, slows down, but decides to carry on without letting the pedestrian cross? |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"Zebra crossing I take each morning on way to work (near a school) only about 50% of drivers stop these days to let you cross, With certain ethnic groups being the worse offenders
Is this just a London thing ?
No it's clearly not just a London thing and what ethnic groups are the worst offenders ?
You obviously think it's relevant or you wouldn't have said so."
I make a point of checking
Worse offenders
1. White/Asian men under 25
2. All Chinese male/female any age (and beep you most if you step out)
3. All black men don't stop (all black women do stop)
Is my observation
Call the daily mail if you are offended
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By *elson61Man
over a year ago
WELWYN GARDEN CITY |
"
Mines my driving instructor also someone already posted the government legislation on the matter
Your driving instructor is talking rubbish then.
I was also told that when I took my test.
I was always under the impression that zebra/flashylight crossings were mandatory for you to stop as a car driver *when safe to do so*. That's why you're taught when you're doing driving lessons that you should never speed up if you can see a crossing."
It is mandatory to stop when a pedestrian has stepped on to the zebra crossing, not when they are standing on the pavement.
Pelican, puffin and toucan crossings are much more straightforward as they are controlled by traffic lights. |
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"
You'd fail your driving test if you don't stop for waiting pedestrians though.
Really? And your source for that is?
if there's someone waiting to cross that is. obviously they won't expect you to stop if nobody is there.
because you are supposed to 'look out for pedestrians waiting to cross and be ready to slow down or stop to let them cross'.
But where does it say that in law that you have to let them cross if they are not actually on the crossing but standing on the pavement by the crossing? How would it be classed as a serious fault by the driving test examiner if a test candidate sees a pedestrian by the side of the road at a zebra crossing, slows down, but decides to carry on without letting the pedestrian cross?"
As I've said if you don't and you're caught it's a £30 fine they generally don't fine people for not breaking the law |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Try driving down abbey road. Fuck me that's a nightmare I stopped some Japanese family started to walk than changed their mind then changed again and started walking again then stopped again. I would have been fucking livid should I had got a fine for that. Also what about people who just walk our regardless of oncoming traffic I was always bought up to stop look and listen and cross when safe to do so, remember the green cross code? |
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By *elson61Man
over a year ago
WELWYN GARDEN CITY |
"
But where does it say that in law that you have to let them cross if they are not actually on the crossing but standing on the pavement by the crossing? How would it be classed as a serious fault by the driving test examiner if a test candidate sees a pedestrian by the side of the road at a zebra crossing, slows down, but decides to carry on without letting the pedestrian cross?
As I've said if you don't and you're caught it's a £30 fine they generally don't fine people for not breaking the law "
You have said its a £30 fine, but what is the specific offence? You haven't detailed that yet, just repeated "it's a £30 fine". It is an offence not to stop when the pedestrian is on the crossing, are you saying it is also an offence not to stop when the pedestrian is not on the crossing? |
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By *HaRiFMan
over a year ago
Beyond the shadows. |
"
Mines my driving instructor also someone already posted the government legislation on the matter
Your driving instructor is talking rubbish then.
I was also told that when I took my test.
I was always under the impression that zebra/flashylight crossings were mandatory for you to stop as a car driver *when safe to do so*. That's why you're taught when you're doing driving lessons that you should never speed up if you can see a crossing.
It is mandatory to stop when a pedestrian has stepped on to the zebra crossing, not when they are standing on the pavement.
Pelican, puffin and toucan crossings are much more straightforward as they are controlled by traffic lights."
So they shouldn't stand there waiting for the car to stop. They should put a foot on the crossing and if the car doesn't stop. Take a pic of the car driving off on your phone and report it to the police? |
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No, it is a nation thing.
In Liverpool I saw a car get kicked by a pedestrian who was halfway across the crossing, needless to say the car never stopped.
In Brighton you take your life in your own hands on any crossing, as red lights don't mean an awful lot either. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Having to drive practically everyday in central London it appears that the more fragile you are the more ignorant you are to your own safety. Unfortunately not many pedestrians know how to use a zebra crossing. Most seem to think it's an excellent place to stop and have a phone call making drivers stop for no apparent reason. The other problem is their own safety. Pedestrians feel that as soon as they step onto the zebra crossing they are in some kind of protective tunnel until the other side. Therefore they don't bother looking to see if traffic is coming and stop, look and listen. They will wander along the path and dart onto the crossing without any consideration to other users or their own well being.
If you think drivers are worse. Consider cyclists who don't stop at crossings or lights and go the wrong way up a one way street. The most ignorant of the lot. Then bleat about why some big shiny piece of metal has just hit them.
Yes drivers have to be careful. I understand. We all passed a test the others didn't. However self preservation starts from the most fragile. Not the other way around. |
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It makes me really angry as these crossings are less inconvenience than ones with lights for motorists. I'd love to be carrying something that would damage their cars if im crossing and they don't stop. |
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The Highway Code is a set of guidelines, not rules. It's only when the Highway Code specifically says" you MUST", that it is referencing a legal requirement.
If it says " you should", then it's not a legal requirement.
So, if you read the wording, it's quite clear, motorists/cyclists only have to stop if a pedestrian is on the crossing, though it's a foolhardy pedestrian who deliberately steps out into flowing traffic to assert this right. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"It makes me really angry as these crossings are less inconvenience than ones with lights for motorists. I'd love to be carrying something that would damage their cars if im crossing and they don't stop. "
What so then get arrested for criminal damage all because a car didnt stop. Sounds like a sensible way of thinking. As you said yourself less inconvenient so waiting for less than a second to cross is worth being sued? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"
You'd fail your driving test if you don't stop for waiting pedestrians though.
Really? And your source for that is?
if there's someone waiting to cross that is. obviously they won't expect you to stop if nobody is there.
because you are supposed to 'look out for pedestrians waiting to cross and be ready to slow down or stop to let them cross'.
But where does it say that in law that you have to let them cross if they are not actually on the crossing but standing on the pavement by the crossing? How would it be classed as a serious fault by the driving test examiner if a test candidate sees a pedestrian by the side of the road at a zebra crossing, slows down, but decides to carry on without letting the pedestrian cross?"
the highway code. you aren't allowed to legally drive a vehicle unless you understand road safety and the highway code, so yeah it is law in a roundabout way.
be no point in having driving tests otherwise.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"
You'd fail your driving test if you don't stop for waiting pedestrians though.
Really? And your source for that is?
if there's someone waiting to cross that is. obviously they won't expect you to stop if nobody is there.
because you are supposed to 'look out for pedestrians waiting to cross and be ready to slow down or stop to let them cross'.
But where does it say that in law that you have to let them cross if they are not actually on the crossing but standing on the pavement by the crossing? How would it be classed as a serious fault by the driving test examiner if a test candidate sees a pedestrian by the side of the road at a zebra crossing, slows down, but decides to carry on without letting the pedestrian cross?
the highway code. you aren't allowed to legally drive a vehicle unless you understand road safety and the highway code, so yeah it is law in a roundabout way.
be no point in having driving tests otherwise.
"
also, the highway code still applies after passing your test. |
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"
But where does it say that in law that you have to let them cross if they are not actually on the crossing but standing on the pavement by the crossing? How would it be classed as a serious fault by the driving test examiner if a test candidate sees a pedestrian by the side of the road at a zebra crossing, slows down, but decides to carry on without letting the pedestrian cross?
As I've said if you don't and you're caught it's a £30 fine they generally don't fine people for not breaking the law
You have said its a £30 fine, but what is the specific offence? You haven't detailed that yet, just repeated "it's a £30 fine". It is an offence not to stop when the pedestrian is on the crossing, are you saying it is also an offence not to stop when the pedestrian is not on the crossing?"
I've also said the legislations been quoted on this thread sorry you don't understand the big words in it |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Zebra crossing I take each morning on way to work (near a school) only about 50% of drivers stop these days to let you cross, With certain ethnic groups being the worse offenders
Is this just a London thing ?
No it's clearly not just a London thing and what ethnic groups are the worst offenders ?
You obviously think it's relevant or you wouldn't have said so.
I make a point of checking
Worse offenders
1. White/Asian men under 25
2. All Chinese male/female any age (and beep you most if you step out)
3. All black men don't stop (all black women do stop)
Is my observation
Call the daily mail if you are offended
"
I'm certainly not offended I just wanted to know how you came to such a conclusion.
As soon as the daily mail is mentioned I know it's unreliable and biased, most people know that. |
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By *elson61Man
over a year ago
WELWYN GARDEN CITY |
"
I've also said the legislations been quoted on this thread sorry you don't understand the big words in it "
When you have to resort to making personal comments, it undermines your opinion and speaks volumes about you.
Your failure to answer my questions also undermines your viewpoint. The law is clear, when the pedestrian is within the confines of the zebra crossing i.e. actually on the crossing, if a driver fails to stop they commit an offence. If the pedestrian is not within the confines of the zebra crossing i.e. not on the crossing, and the driver fails to stop, the driver does not commit an offence.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I think common sense needs to be used by all road users, pedestrians alike if stepping into and crossing. If a pedestrian is not giving any intention to cross but then darts out with out any regard to themselves or other road users more fool them. However the repercussions must be commensurate as the driver who hits them will also suffer psychological trauma.
Yes the Highway Code is there, but as well as pedestrians waiting for when it's safe to do so. Current road users must be aware of potential hazards such as pavement pedestrians approach or walking past a crossing who may have every intention to cross. Awareness and communication is the key. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"So that's zebra crossings covered.
Shall we discuss who speeds up when the light goes yellow. "
No let's discuss people who use, disabled and family parking bays when they shouldn't. |
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"
I've also said the legislations been quoted on this thread sorry you don't understand the big words in it
When you have to resort to making personal comments, it undermines your opinion and speaks volumes about you.
Your failure to answer my questions also undermines your viewpoint. The law is clear, when the pedestrian is within the confines of the zebra crossing i.e. actually on the crossing, if a driver fails to stop they commit an offence. If the pedestrian is not within the confines of the zebra crossing i.e. not on the crossing, and the driver fails to stop, the driver does not commit an offence.
"
No I'm merely telling you to read the legislation fm for yourself which you've still failed to do, if you don't want to educate yourself what's the point in me doing it for you?
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It's bad where I am. They have had to put up signs by the lollipop crossings to tell drivers it's the law they have to stop for the lollipop!! People new to the country don't know and just ignore them.  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"
I was about to say! It's not a courtesy - it's the fucking law.
It's only the law when a pedestrian has started to cross. When the pedestrian is standing on the pavement and a driver decides to stop it's a courtesy, there is no legal requirement for a driver to stop while the pedestrian is still on the pavement."
Do that on a driving test and you will probably fail. |
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"
I've also said the legislations been quoted on this thread sorry you don't understand the big words in it
When you have to resort to making personal comments, it undermines your opinion and speaks volumes about you.
Your failure to answer my questions also undermines your viewpoint. The law is clear, when the pedestrian is within the confines of the zebra crossing i.e. actually on the crossing, if a driver fails to stop they commit an offence. If the pedestrian is not within the confines of the zebra crossing i.e. not on the crossing, and the driver fails to stop, the driver does not commit an offence.
No I'm merely telling you to read the legislation fm for yourself which you've still failed to do, if you don't want to educate yourself what's the point in me doing it for you?
"
You're also the only guy on here claiming it's not a law surely that alone should tell you something?
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"
You're also the only guy on here claiming it's not a law surely that alone should tell you something?
"
To be fair, he isn't, I too pointed out the difference between being 'compelled' to stop and 'prepared' to stop.
In your test it is important to demonstrate your consideration for other road users: stopping at a pedestrian crossing ticks this box. |
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"
You're also the only guy on here claiming it's not a law surely that alone should tell you something?
To be fair, he isn't, I too pointed out the difference between being 'compelled' to stop and 'prepared' to stop.
In your test it is important to demonstrate your consideration for other road users: stopping at a pedestrian crossing ticks this box."
Yes but if you don't stop when the pedestrian is clearly waiting in the eyes of the law you weren't prepared to stop and are legally liable for not doing so |
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"
You'd fail your driving test if you don't stop for waiting pedestrians though.
Really? And your source for that is?
if there's someone waiting to cross that is. obviously they won't expect you to stop if nobody is there.
because you are supposed to 'look out for pedestrians waiting to cross and be ready to slow down or stop to let them cross'.
But where does it say that in law that you have to let them cross if they are not actually on the crossing but standing on the pavement by the crossing? How would it be classed as a serious fault by the driving test examiner if a test candidate sees a pedestrian by the side of the road at a zebra crossing, slows down, but decides to carry on without letting the pedestrian cross?
the highway code. you aren't allowed to legally drive a vehicle unless you understand road safety and the highway code, so yeah it is law in a roundabout way.
be no point in having driving tests otherwise.
"
Seeing how bad people drive, I thought we had abolished it years ago. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"
You'd fail your driving test if you don't stop for waiting pedestrians though.
Really? And your source for that is?
if there's someone waiting to cross that is. obviously they won't expect you to stop if nobody is there.
because you are supposed to 'look out for pedestrians waiting to cross and be ready to slow down or stop to let them cross'.
But where does it say that in law that you have to let them cross if they are not actually on the crossing but standing on the pavement by the crossing? How would it be classed as a serious fault by the driving test examiner if a test candidate sees a pedestrian by the side of the road at a zebra crossing, slows down, but decides to carry on without letting the pedestrian cross?
the highway code. you aren't allowed to legally drive a vehicle unless you understand road safety and the highway code, so yeah it is law in a roundabout way.
be no point in having driving tests otherwise.
Seeing how bad people drive, I thought we had abolished it years ago."
there's way too many idiots in cars now.
i've had people beep their car horn at my kids for standing on the pavement (waiting for me to catch up with them so they can cross the road) because they wanted to park on the pavement. my kids were toddlers the first time this happened as well. not sure why they expected my kids to go into the road so they could park illegally. i always go a bit mad at the driver. |
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By *B9 QueenWoman
over a year ago
Over the rainbow, under the bridge |
I don't care about the highway code or what the law says. If you can see a zebra crossing coming up and people waiting to cross slow down , stop safely and don't be a twat. It's the decent thing to do regardless of the law. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Zebra crossing I take each morning on way to work (near a school) only about 50% of drivers stop these days to let you cross, With certain ethnic groups being the worse offenders
Is this just a London thing ?
London is one of the worst for this. Plus many people don't say thank you anymore. Really gripes me when I've stopped and someone doesn't say thank you. A nod, hand wave, smile, they don't cost much now days."
 |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I don't care about the highway code or what the law says. If you can see a zebra crossing coming up and people waiting to cross slow down , stop safely and don't be a twat. It's the decent thing to do regardless of the law."
Missed you. x |
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By *B9 QueenWoman
over a year ago
Over the rainbow, under the bridge |
"I don't care about the highway code or what the law says. If you can see a zebra crossing coming up and people waiting to cross slow down , stop safely and don't be a twat. It's the decent thing to do regardless of the law.
Missed you. x"
Aw thanks! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I don't care about the highway code or what the law says. If you can see a zebra crossing coming up and people waiting to cross slow down , stop safely and don't be a twat. It's the decent thing to do regardless of the law."
Big thumbs up. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Just today a van nearly mowed me down on a crossing...I wasn't impressed....neither was the police officer in the car behind...stopped the miscreant and have him a ticket...laugh?? Well.yes I did.actually.
X |
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"
...
Yes but if you don't stop when the pedestrian is clearly waiting in the eyes of the law you weren't prepared to stop and are legally liable for not doing so "
Sorry, but you're wrong, as you've been told several times.
Read the law, it's on a legislation gov site.
It may be the decent thing to do, but it's not incumbent on a motorist/cyclist to stop at a Zebra crossing just because someone is waiting to cross.
If however, they step on to the crossing, the pedestrian has right of way and the motorist/cyclist must stop.
I don't know why you keep trying to argue a point over which you are totally and irrefutably wrong, and where there is definitive documentation which if you would read, you would see confirms this. |
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Lots of people saying they don't need to stop if the pedestrian is still on the pavement, the crossing starts at the pavement where the big yellow Lollypop lights are not on the road. So if a ped is standing at the curb between those lights their intention to cross is already evident and you have to stop. Or that's what I've always believed. |
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"Lots of people saying they don't need to stop if the pedestrian is still on the pavement, the crossing starts at the pavement where the big yellow Lollypop lights are not on the road. So if a ped is standing at the curb between those lights their intention to cross is already evident and you have to stop. Or that's what I've always believed."
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"Lots of people saying they don't need to stop if the pedestrian is still on the pavement, the crossing starts at the pavement where the big yellow Lollypop lights are not on the road. So if a ped is standing at the curb between those lights their intention to cross is already evident and you have to stop. Or that's what I've always believed."
Nope - read the legislation, the crossing starts on the road, not the kerb |
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"I don't care about the highway code or what the law says. If you can see a zebra crossing coming up and people waiting to cross slow down , stop safely and don't be a twat. It's the decent thing to do regardless of the law.
Big thumbs up. "
|
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A d*unk trying to cross the street was knocked down by a bus.
A policeman helped him to his feet and said,
“There’s a zebra crossing a few yards away from here.”
“Well, I hope he is having better luck than I am,” replied the d*unk. |
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The devout cowboy lost his favorite Bible while he was mending fences out on the range. Three weeks later, a zebra walked up to him carrying the Bible in its mouth. The cowboy couldn't believe his eyes. He took the precious book out of the zebra's mouth, raised his eyes heavenward and exclaimed, "It's a miracle!" "Not really," said the zebra. "Your name is written inside the cover."
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Lots of people saying they don't need to stop if the pedestrian is still on the pavement, the crossing starts at the pavement where the big yellow Lollypop lights are not on the road. So if a ped is standing at the curb between those lights their intention to cross is already evident and you have to stop. Or that's what I've always believed."
But they should at least show that they want to cross. In this day and age it's a worry that some knobhead is just out to make money by making a fake claim also as I whiteness once a woman going fucking crazy at a car because she was too busy chatting to another woman to notice the car had stopped he got bored and drove off she went mad I pointed out to her he waited and drove off because she was chatting, then I received a mouthful.
"ped = pedestrian
cos if it was pedophile we'd mount the kerb"
Nope I don't do murder or want to damage my car regardless of what the person has done. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"No but the problem with zebra crossings is the pedestraian has to step onto the crossing before the traffic is obliged to stop
ooooooooo I dispute that. I'll have to check tho."
no that is correct |
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By *elson61Man
over a year ago
WELWYN GARDEN CITY |
"
No I'm merely telling you to read the legislation fm for yourself which you've still failed to do, if you don't want to educate yourself what's the point in me doing it for you?
"
I've read the legislation, I am fully aware of it. I have been aware of the legislation for a very long time
You, on the other hand, are not aware of it. You quote this £30 ticket but don't back it up with any facts or links. You have moved on to personal comments instead of backing up your dubious claims. |
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By *elson61Man
over a year ago
WELWYN GARDEN CITY |
"
Yes but if you don't stop when the pedestrian is clearly waiting in the eyes of the law you weren't prepared to stop and are legally liable for not doing so "
Really? Now you are going into the realms of crystal ball gazing. What part of the motorist is not legally obliged to stop until a pedestrian is actually on the crossing are you having problems with? |
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By *elson61Man
over a year ago
WELWYN GARDEN CITY |
"
I've also said the legislations been quoted on this thread sorry you don't understand the big words in it
When you have to resort to making personal comments, it undermines your opinion and speaks volumes about you.
Your failure to answer my questions also undermines your viewpoint. The law is clear, when the pedestrian is within the confines of the zebra crossing i.e. actually on the crossing, if a driver fails to stop they commit an offence. If the pedestrian is not within the confines of the zebra crossing i.e. not on the crossing, and the driver fails to stop, the driver does not commit an offence.
No I'm merely telling you to read the legislation fm for yourself which you've still failed to do, if you don't want to educate yourself what's the point in me doing it for you?
You're also the only guy on here claiming it's not a law surely that alone should tell you something?
"
What this tells me is that you are totally clueless and don't know what you are talking about. I'm not the only guy on here making such a claim. What I am saying is backed up by other posters and also the legislation.
You are the one who has made the claim about getting a £30 ticket for not stopping and letting a pedestrian cross, but without telling us what offence.
A bit of advice.......when in a hole, stop digging. |
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"
...
Yes but if you don't stop when the pedestrian is clearly waiting in the eyes of the law you weren't prepared to stop and are legally liable for not doing so
Sorry, but you're wrong, as you've been told several times.
Read the law, it's on a legislation gov site.
It may be the decent thing to do, but it's not incumbent on a motorist/cyclist to stop at a Zebra crossing just because someone is waiting to cross.
If however, they step on to the crossing, the pedestrian has right of way and the motorist/cyclist must stop.
I don't know why you keep trying to argue a point over which you are totally and irrefutably wrong, and where there is definitive documentation which if you would read, you would see confirms this."
Well by all means come to my nice little town and tell the police officers that are ticketing people for that exact reason they aren't doing their jobs right |
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"
...
Well by all means come to my nice little town and tell the police officers that are ticketing people for that exact reason they aren't doing their jobs right "
You still haven't said what offence the ticket was for. Failing to stop at a Zebra crossing is not an offence, as the law quite clearly states.
So, the ticket must have been for something else, but you continually decline to state what for? |
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"
...
Well by all means come to my nice little town and tell the police officers that are ticketing people for that exact reason they aren't doing their jobs right
You still haven't said what offence the ticket was for. Failing to stop at a Zebra crossing is not an offence, as the law quite clearly states.
So, the ticket must have been for something else, but you continually decline to state what for?"
I have said in my first post at this particular crossing they are doing it for people failing to stop when people are clearly waiting not just when people have already started to cross |
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"
...
Well by all means come to my nice little town and tell the police officers that are ticketing people for that exact reason they aren't doing their jobs right
You still haven't said what offence the ticket was for. Failing to stop at a Zebra crossing is not an offence, as the law quite clearly states.
So, the ticket must have been for something else, but you continually decline to state what for?
I have said in my first post at this particular crossing they are doing it for people failing to stop when people are clearly waiting not just when people have already started to cross "
But you still haven't said what the offence is (sigh).
There is no legal offence of failing to stop at a Zebra crossing. If that was the wording on the ticket, it's a made up charge that would be thrown out by any magistrate.
So, what offence are they ticketing them for? |
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"
...
Well by all means come to my nice little town and tell the police officers that are ticketing people for that exact reason they aren't doing their jobs right
You still haven't said what offence the ticket was for. Failing to stop at a Zebra crossing is not an offence, as the law quite clearly states.
So, the ticket must have been for something else, but you continually decline to state what for?
I have said in my first post at this particular crossing they are doing it for people failing to stop when people are clearly waiting not just when people have already started to cross
But you still haven't said what the offence is (sigh).
There is no legal offence of failing to stop at a Zebra crossing. If that was the wording on the ticket, it's a made up charge that would be thrown out by any magistrate.
So, what offence are they ticketing them for?"
A lot of people would pay up rather than go to court and risk a larger fine... |
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"
...
A lot of people would pay up rather than go to court and risk a larger fine..."
Some would, but some would check the law. Then they'd challenge it and it would be found to be either a made up charge, or a misapplication of an existing charge. Then they'd go to the Daily Fail, and there would be an inquiry and all the convictions quashed.
curcymama has repeatedly declined to state what offence they were being ticketed for. Which to me, means she does not know. Which means she's either passing on unsubstantiated hearsay, or misconstruing something she's read, or maybe a news report is inaccurate - but she could post the link to a newspaper story.
Anyhow, as a result of this thread, I educated myself as to the letter of the law, and as I have a dashcam, if I'm ever ticketed, I'll be able to challenge and provide definitive evidence. |
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"
...
Well by all means come to my nice little town and tell the police officers that are ticketing people for that exact reason they aren't doing their jobs right
You still haven't said what offence the ticket was for. Failing to stop at a Zebra crossing is not an offence, as the law quite clearly states.
So, the ticket must have been for something else, but you continually decline to state what for?
I have said in my first post at this particular crossing they are doing it for people failing to stop when people are clearly waiting not just when people have already started to cross
But you still haven't said what the offence is (sigh).
There is no legal offence of failing to stop at a Zebra crossing. If that was the wording on the ticket, it's a made up charge that would be thrown out by any magistrate.
So, what offence are they ticketing them for?"
I've just said they have been doing it for failing to stop while a pedestrian is waiting to cross that is the offence, Good luck on the thread I'm out fed up of repeating myself |
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By *B9 QueenWoman
over a year ago
Over the rainbow, under the bridge |
If you see someone waiting to cross who haven't dared put a foot onto the crossing but don't stop because of your literal interpretation of the law as you see it, then you're a twat!  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
The interpretation of the law will be determine by your position at the time, as the crossings limits are different for both pedestrian and vehicle.
As I interpret the legislation;
The zigzag markings indicate the start of the crossing for a vehicle and if you are inside them before a pedestrian is ready to cross, i.e stood waiting, then you are within the law to continue driving. If the pedestrian is already waiting before you enter the zigzag markings and you fail to stop, you are in breach of the legislation. |
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By *elson61Man
over a year ago
WELWYN GARDEN CITY |
"
But you still haven't said what the offence is (sigh).
There is no legal offence of failing to stop at a Zebra crossing. If that was the wording on the ticket, it's a made up charge that would be thrown out by any magistrate.
So, what offence are they ticketing them for?"
So much for her claim that I was the only person with the same viewpoint as you. Clearly I am not alone. And her "come to my town and tell the police they are doing it wrong" is very lame.
Conclusion? Curvymama doesn't know what she is talking about. |
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By *elson61Man
over a year ago
WELWYN GARDEN CITY |
"If you see someone waiting to cross who haven't dared put a foot onto the crossing but don't stop because of your literal interpretation of the law as you see it, then you're a twat! "
That's very harsh. Your literal interpretation of what people should do at zebra crossings doesn't take into account circumstances that could affect a person stopping, such as a wet road, someone driving very close behind them etc.
And how can you tell from your car that a person standing on the side of the road hasn't dared to put their foot on the crossing? Do they have a placard which tells the driver this? Do they look totally scared? |
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"If you see someone waiting to cross who haven't dared put a foot onto the crossing but don't stop because of your literal interpretation of the law as you see it, then you're a twat!
That's very harsh. Your literal interpretation of what people should do at zebra crossings doesn't take into account circumstances that could affect a person stopping, such as a wet road, someone driving very close behind them etc.
And how can you tell from your car that a person standing on the side of the road hasn't dared to put their foot on the crossing? Do they have a placard which tells the driver this? Do they look totally scared?"
If your driving on a wet road surface surely as a "good driver" you should know you're stoppage time is longer and therefore be slowing down approaching a known crossing in preparation to stop sooner, the drivers behind you should also be slowing in preparation for an up coming crossing too, someone clearly stood waiting at a crossing shouldnt need a placard just to cross on a crossing where they have right of way, unless they are faced with an ignorant driver that thinks he owns the road |
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Rule 195 of the Highway Code updated as of 1st April 2016
Zebra crossings.
As you approach a zebra crossing look out for pedestrians waiting to cross and be ready to slow down or stop You MUST let them cross
you MUST also give way when a pedestrian has already moved onto a crossing
Be aware allow more time for stopping on wet or icy roads
The emphasised use of MUST makes it pretty clear that pedestrians have right of way |
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"Rule 195 of the Highway Code updated as of 1st April 2016
Zebra crossings.
As you approach a zebra crossing look out for pedestrians waiting to cross and be ready to slow down or stop You MUST let them cross
you MUST also give way when a pedestrian has already moved onto a crossing
Be aware allow more time for stopping on wet or icy roads
The emphasised use of MUST makes it pretty clear that pedestrians have right of way "
Some drivers think otherwise it seems |
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"Zebra crossing I take each morning on way to work (near a school) only about 50% of drivers stop these days to let you cross, With certain ethnic groups being the worse offenders
Is this just a London thing ?"
When I finish work I have to cross a zebra crossing that runs through a shopping centre to get to the bus stop, I've lost count of the near misses I've had where drivers just haven't bothered to stop! So no, not just a London thing  |
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"Rule 195 of the Highway Code updated as of 1st April 2016
Zebra crossings.
As you approach a zebra crossing look out for pedestrians waiting to cross and be ready to slow down or stop You MUST let them cross
you MUST also give way when a pedestrian has already moved onto a crossing
Be aware allow more time for stopping on wet or icy roads
The emphasised use of MUST makes it pretty clear that pedestrians have right of way "
Rule 19
Zebra crossings. Give traffic plenty of time to see you and to stop before you start to cross. Vehicles will need more time when the road is slippery. Wait until traffic has stopped from both directions or the road is clear before crossing.
*****Remember that traffic does not have to stop until someone has moved onto the crossing.*******
Keep looking both ways, and listening, in case a driver or rider has not seen you and attempts to overtake a vehicle that has stopped. |
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"Rule 195 of the Highway Code updated as of 1st April 2016
Zebra crossings.
As you approach a zebra crossing look out for pedestrians waiting to cross and be ready to slow down or stop You MUST let them cross
you MUST also give way when a pedestrian has already moved onto a crossing
Be aware allow more time for stopping on wet or icy roads
The emphasised use of MUST makes it pretty clear that pedestrians have right of way
Rule 19
Zebra crossings. Give traffic plenty of time to see you and to stop before you start to cross. Vehicles will need more time when the road is slippery. Wait until traffic has stopped from both directions or the road is clear before crossing.
*****Remember that traffic does not have to stop until someone has moved onto the crossing.*******
Keep looking both ways, and listening, in case a driver or rider has not seen you and attempts to overtake a vehicle that has stopped."
Yeah I see they haven't updated that so now the rules contradict themselves one says the driver must stop the other doesn't wonder if that's an oversight somewhere? |
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"Rule 195 of the Highway Code updated as of 1st April 2016
Zebra crossings.
As you approach a zebra crossing look out for pedestrians waiting to cross and be ready to slow down or stop You MUST let them cross
you MUST also give way when a pedestrian has already moved onto a crossing
Be aware allow more time for stopping on wet or icy roads
The emphasised use of MUST makes it pretty clear that pedestrians have right of way
Rule 19
Zebra crossings. Give traffic plenty of time to see you and to stop before you start to cross. Vehicles will need more time when the road is slippery. Wait until traffic has stopped from both directions or the road is clear before crossing.
*****Remember that traffic does not have to stop until someone has moved onto the crossing.*******
Keep looking both ways, and listening, in case a driver or rider has not seen you and attempts to overtake a vehicle that has stopped.
Yeah I see they haven't updated that so now the rules contradict themselves one says the driver must stop the other doesn't wonder if that's an oversight somewhere? "
there is no contradiction. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Zebra crossing I take each morning on way to work (near a school) only about 50% of drivers stop these days to let you cross, With certain ethnic groups being the worse offenders
Is this just a London thing ?
London is one of the worst for this. Plus many people don't say thank you anymore. Really gripes me when I've stopped and someone doesn't say thank you. A nod, hand wave, smile, they don't cost much now days."
Has anyone suggested that you are suffering from an over active sense of entitlement |
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"Rule 195 of the Highway Code updated as of 1st April 2016
Zebra crossings.
As you approach a zebra crossing look out for pedestrians waiting to cross and be ready to slow down or stop You MUST let them cross
you MUST also give way when a pedestrian has already moved onto a crossing
Be aware allow more time for stopping on wet or icy roads
The emphasised use of MUST makes it pretty clear that pedestrians have right of way "
The last update published on-line by HM Govt is Feb 2016, not Apr.
You have misquoted it to suit your own purposes - here is the exact wording:
look out for pedestrians waiting to cross and be ready to slow down or stop to let them cross
you MUST give way when a pedestrian has moved onto a crossing
allow more time for stopping on wet or icy roads
do not wave or use your horn to invite pedestrians across; this could be dangerous if another vehicle is approaching
be aware of pedestrians approaching from the side of the crossing.
The MUST only applies to when they are actually on the crossing.
It's quite clear
The law itself hasn't changed either, I checked.
The Highway Code is only referencing a law when it uses the word MUST, all other "rules" are guidelines as it clearly states in it's preface.
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So in a nutshell, if you take rule 195 which sates a driver only MUST stop if there is someone on the crossing, and that the legislation states the crossing starts at the carriageway, not the kerb. Then you consider rule 19 which advises pedestrians to remember that drivers do not have to stop unless you are on the crossing.
Then the inescapable, irrefutable, definitive answer to the OP is yes, it is optional for a motorist stop at a Zebra crossing, unless you are already on it.
In practice, if I'm outside the zig zags (which another poster correctly states is the boundary of the crossing for the motorist) when I see a pedestrian waiting to cross, I will always stop if safe to do so. If I'm inside the zig zags, then I use my discretion, depending on proximity, speed, conditions etc.
But hey, don't take my word for it - use a search engine and actually read the highway code and click on the links to the legislation. |
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By *B9 QueenWoman
over a year ago
Over the rainbow, under the bridge |
"If you see someone waiting to cross who haven't dared put a foot onto the crossing but don't stop because of your literal interpretation of the law as you see it, then you're a twat!
That's very harsh. Your literal interpretation of what people should do at zebra crossings doesn't take into account circumstances that could affect a person stopping, such as a wet road, someone driving very close behind them etc.
And how can you tell from your car that a person standing on the side of the road hasn't dared to put their foot on the crossing? Do they have a placard which tells the driver this? Do they look totally scared?"
I'm both a driver and a pedestrian and I'm not stupid. As I said in a previously ignored post, if you see a crossing with people waiting to cross slow down and stop safely. I'm not talking about screeching to a sudden stop when someone approaches a crossing when you are practically on top of it. If can stop safely do so. If you say to yourself 'well they have no foot on the crossing and in my literal interpretation of the law is that I don't have to stop' then fly over the crossing leaving them stood there, then you are a twat. I care not one shit if anyone thinks that is harsh. Be decent to people not selfish and then justify your selfishness by quoting the law ad nauseum. SimplE really.
I manage to stop safely when I see crossings coming up where people are waiting because I SLOW DOWN in plenty of time. It's not fecking rocket science. |
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"...
I'm both a driver and a pedestrian and I'm not stupid. As I said in a previously ignored post, if you see a crossing with people waiting to cross slow down and stop safely. I'm not talking about screeching to a sudden stop when someone approaches a crossing when you are practically on top of it. If can stop safely do so. If you say to yourself 'well they have no foot on the crossing and in my literal interpretation of the law is that I don't have to stop' then fly over the crossing leaving them stood there, then you are a twat. I care not one shit if anyone thinks that is harsh. Be decent to people not selfish and then justify your selfishness by quoting the law ad nauseum. SimplE really.
I manage to stop safely when I see crossings coming up where people are waiting because I SLOW DOWN in plenty of time. It's not fecking rocket science."
I don't think anyone is disagreeing (and just because no-one comments, doesn't mean your post is ignored, but you can take this as evidence that someone at least, reads your posts )
But there was a discussion on a point of law, which I believe I have succinctly and accurately articulated above.
Some people have just spouted made up bullshit, which makes them look stupid as the the actual wording of the law can be easily checked in seconds by anyone who knows how to use a search engine. |
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By *B9 QueenWoman
over a year ago
Over the rainbow, under the bridge |
"...
I'm both a driver and a pedestrian and I'm not stupid. As I said in a previously ignored post, if you see a crossing with people waiting to cross slow down and stop safely. I'm not talking about screeching to a sudden stop when someone approaches a crossing when you are practically on top of it. If can stop safely do so. If you say to yourself 'well they have no foot on the crossing and in my literal interpretation of the law is that I don't have to stop' then fly over the crossing leaving them stood there, then you are a twat. I care not one shit if anyone thinks that is harsh. Be decent to people not selfish and then justify your selfishness by quoting the law ad nauseum. SimplE really.
I manage to stop safely when I see crossings coming up where people are waiting because I SLOW DOWN in plenty of time. It's not fecking rocket science.
I don't think anyone is disagreeing (and just because no-one comments, doesn't mean your post is ignored, but you can take this as evidence that someone at least, reads your posts )
But there was a discussion on a point of law, which I believe I have succinctly and accurately articulated above.
Some people have just spouted made up bullshit, which makes them look stupid as the the actual wording of the law can be easily checked in seconds by anyone who knows how to use a search engine."
I appreciate that but in my view the legal aspect is irrelevant. It's a case of being decent or a twat. Some people may use an interpretation of the law to justify their twattery and that's the only way the law is relevant in this discussion in my opinion.
Do you think you have a moral obligation to be decent to people or not? That's all people need to consider. If you think your don't then you're a twat. In my experience, as a pedestrian, if I stand next to a crossing people tend to stop without me having to step foot on it. Because in general people are decent.
Everyone who doesn't stop is a twat (kind of like that word). If someone is happy to behave like that good for them. But don't moan when you're called a twat. That's the choice you made. |
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"...
Everyone who doesn't stop is a twat (kind of like that word). If someone is happy to behave like that good for them. But don't moan when you're called a twat. That's the choice you made."
Who you calling twat, twat!
If that was aimed at me, then you obviously haven't read my post about what I do in practice 
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By *B9 QueenWoman
over a year ago
Over the rainbow, under the bridge |
"...
Everyone who doesn't stop is a twat (kind of like that word). If someone is happy to behave like that good for them. But don't moan when you're called a twat. That's the choice you made.
Who you calling twat, twat!
If that was aimed at me, then you obviously haven't read my post about what I do in practice
"
I'm not calling individuals twat. If you read what I've said carefully is people have a choice between being decent or being a twat. If they choose the latter then they can't complain when they are referred to as such. |
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Spent a few hours googling and found a few variations of the 195 ruling and even emailed the Highway Code, so I'll apologise for mis quoting an inaccurate source but I didn't amend it to suit my own means as assumed.
However even though you only legally have to stop if they are already on the crossing (which many don't do too ive had a few near misses in that regard) from the email they've sent it doesn't change the fact that a driver should slow down approaching a crossing In plenty of time so they are prepared to stop in the event of a pedestrian waiting, so the gent that claimed that because there's no one behind him means they can cross safely after he's drove by so won't stop for the is essentially in the wrong (in at least a cure our road user way) and the pedestrian should still be given right of way and he should stop his vehicle because he clearly has time to do so in that circumstance as the lady keeps saying him not stopping in that circumstance makes him a bit of a twat.
we all have busy lives but what is one minute waiting at a crossing really going to do you in the grand scheme of things? |
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"...
Everyone who doesn't stop is a twat (kind of like that word). If someone is happy to behave like that good for them. But don't moan when you're called a twat. That's the choice you made.
Who you calling twat, twat!
If that was aimed at me, then you obviously haven't read my post about what I do in practice
I'm not calling individuals twat. If you read what I've said carefully is people have a choice between being decent or being a twat. If they choose the latter then they can't complain when they are referred to as such."
Ah, but now you've re-worded it in the 3rd person, rather than the second person which could be taken as personally accusatory in the context of a direct quoted reply |
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By *B9 QueenWoman
over a year ago
Over the rainbow, under the bridge |
"...
Everyone who doesn't stop is a twat (kind of like that word). If someone is happy to behave like that good for them. But don't moan when you're called a twat. That's the choice you made.
Who you calling twat, twat!
If that was aimed at me, then you obviously haven't read my post about what I do in practice
I'm not calling individuals twat. If you read what I've said carefully is people have a choice between being decent or being a twat. If they choose the latter then they can't complain when they are referred to as such.
Ah, but now you've re-worded it in the 3rd person, rather than the second person which could be taken as personally accusatory in the context of a direct quoted reply "
You know what I don't care. If you want to be pedantic please yourself. I was not directing it at you. Wanna argue every tiny detail? Find someone else. Really can't be arsed. Take offence, take no offence. Up to you.
To me it's clear what I'm saying. Obviously you want to draw me in to something. Not gonna happen. |
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"I wouldn't just assume it's safe to walk straight out on to the crossing without making sure the driver has seen me first."
Defo. You should NEVER just assume it's safe to cross. Wait till traffic has stopped.
Also Goodness knows how many people I seen that just walk right out (with headphones on). Obviously some people think they are on suicide mission or something. |
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