FabSwingers.com > Forums > The Lounge > Jeremy Corbyn's 'unelectable' Labour Party take Oldham with increased majority

Jeremy Corbyn's 'unelectable' Labour Party take Oldham with increased majority

By *dwalu2 OP Couple over a year ago

Bristol

To the surprise of precisely no-one who hasn't been taken in by the right wing press trying to smear Corbyn left right and centre, of course. Once again, the more the press monster him, the more people like him. We may as well start calling him Teflon Jez.

As this was supposedly the first big test of the popularity of Corbyn's leadership though, we can now expect the media spin machine to go into overdrive to explain how this result didn't really count, for any one of a number of spurious reasons.

And a doubling down from the media to explain why disgusting warmonger Hilary Benn is supposedly the sort of leader the Labour Party needs. Despite no-one in the Labour Party except for Tories and Blairites actually wanting him there, of course.

Smell that delicious fear.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Oldham was already a labour stronghold, it is no surprise they have held the seat. But i very much don't think it is an endorsement of Corbyn's leadership on any way shape or form

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

You sound rankled? Take a moment and chill.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Oldham was already a labour stronghold, it is no surprise they have held the seat. But i very much don't think it is an endorsement of Corbyn's leadership on any way shape or form"

This. As someone whonlives in the area trust me its more about tory hate

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Good on Jim McMahon, he seemed like a good candidate and had the local factor from his role at the Council there

It would be unfair for the central party leadership to claim the credit away from him.

I think more will have to happen than Labour holding existing safer than safe majorities before anyone else starts bricking it for 2020 though. Oldham West & Royton has returned a Labour MP? In other shocking news, bears shit in the woods and the Pope is Catholic.

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By *dwalu2 OP Couple over a year ago

Bristol

Carry on, I'm ticking off my Corbyn bingo card here. That's nearly a line already!

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By *its_n_piecesCouple over a year ago

"Good on Jim McMahon, he seemed like a good candidate and had the local factor from his role at the Council there

It would be unfair for the central party leadership to claim the credit away from him.

i saw a nature documentary a few days ago that clearly showed a bear shitting in the middle of an enormous grassy field..... the pope might want to re-think his life.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Oldham was already a labour stronghold, it is no surprise they have held the seat. But i very much don't think it is an endorsement of Corbyn's leadership on any way shape or form

This. As someone whonlives in the area trust me its more about tory hate

No, no, it's only allowed to be about Corbyn. You're not allowed local views or any kind of opinion that deviates from the one handed down from on high by the OP

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Good on Jim McMahon, he seemed like a good candidate and had the local factor from his role at the Council there

It would be unfair for the central party leadership to claim the credit away from him.

i saw a nature documentary a few days ago that clearly showed a bear shitting in the middle of an enormous grassy field..... the pope might want to re-think his life.

Whaaaa??

I'm going to have to reevaluate my use yes phrases completely

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By *dwalu2 OP Couple over a year ago

Bristol

"Oldham was already a labour stronghold, it is no surprise they have held the seat. But i very much don't think it is an endorsement of Corbyn's leadership on any way shape or form

This. As someone whonlives in the area trust me its more about tory hate

No, no, it's only allowed to be about Corbyn. You're not allowed local views or any kind of opinion that deviates from the one handed down from on high by the OP

Dry your eyes, Ruby! The Corbyn train continues to smash everything in its path.

Of course, being a reasonable free thinker, I'd agree that local issues are what got this fine local candidate elected.

However, you cannot ignore that what has been billed endlessly as the first big test of Corbyn's leadership has not been a rout, as predicted by Fab's Tories and Uskippers as they echo what the terrified right wing press want them to believe, but instead has seen this unelectable party return an increased majority, and a very good by-election turnout.

But spin away, it's delicious!

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By *kindofmagicXXXMan over a year ago

Bristol

Probably anti Tory rather than pro Corbyn

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By *dwalu2 OP Couple over a year ago

Bristol

"Probably anti Tory rather than pro Corbyn "

Of course. But if the Labour vote had gone down, it would have been anti-Corbyn not pro-UKIP or Tory.

That's what the fear game is all about.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Oldham was already a labour stronghold, it is no surprise they have held the seat. But i very much don't think it is an endorsement of Corbyn's leadership on any way shape or form

This. As someone whonlives in the area trust me its more about tory hate

No, no, it's only allowed to be about Corbyn. You're not allowed local views or any kind of opinion that deviates from the one handed down from on high by the OP

Dry your eyes, Ruby! The Corbyn train continues to smash everything in its path.

Of course, being a reasonable free thinker, I'd agree that local issues are what got this fine local candidate elected.

But spin away, it's delicious!

My eyes are clear and dry, but thanks for your concern

Corbyn has been looking very sad of late so I'm pleased something has gone right for the chap.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Oldham was already a labour stronghold, it is no surprise they have held the seat. But i very much don't think it is an endorsement of Corbyn's leadership on any way shape or form

This. As someone whonlives in the area trust me its more about tory hate

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

So the Labour lead went from 55% to 62% of the vote. Despite this those of a more right leaning political persuasion still insist that it is a hollow victory.

If Labour had won with a majority that had dropped by 7%, I feel sure that the same individuals would be making statements about Corbyn's lack of popular support or that Labour are on the slippery slope etc.

If everyone really wants these austerity measures into the Parliament after this, then simply vote Conservative. If the woes of this country are due to immigration, vote UKIP.

I personally will be voting Labour in both local and national elections.

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By *dwalu2 OP Couple over a year ago

Bristol

"Oldham was already a labour stronghold, it is no surprise they have held the seat. But i very much don't think it is an endorsement of Corbyn's leadership on any way shape or form

This. As someone whonlives in the area trust me its more about tory hate

No, no, it's only allowed to be about Corbyn. You're not allowed local views or any kind of opinion that deviates from the one handed down from on high by the OP

Dry your eyes, Ruby! The Corbyn train continues to smash everything in its path.

Of course, being a reasonable free thinker, I'd agree that local issues are what got this fine local candidate elected.

But spin away, it's delicious!

My eyes are clear and dry, but thanks for your concern

Corbyn has been looking very sad of late so I'm pleased something has gone right for the chap. "

It's more than something. Everything is going right for him. Teflon Jez just can't be stopped.

However, you can understand a man of pacifism and principle feeling sad that our country is bombing innocent civilians as we speak in the name of making David Cameron look macho in the papers.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

I think Corbyn is great! Much rather have him than a Tory or ukip. But then I would say no to a green party MP either

Tory hater, Corbyn lover

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I think Corbyn is great! Much rather have him than a Tory or ukip. But then I would say no to a green party MP either

Tory hater, Corbyn lover "

Wouldn't say no to green party **

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By *dwalu2 OP Couple over a year ago

Bristol

"So the Labour lead went from 55% to 62% of the vote. Despite this those of a more right leaning political persuasion still insist that it is a hollow victory.

If everyone really wants these austerity measures into the Parliament after this, then simply vote Conservative. If the woes of this country are due to immigration, vote UKIP.

I personally will be voting Labour in both local and national elections."

You are completely right. There are many of Fab's Tories and Uskips who will be crimson faced today, as they bought the media line that Oldham would be a demonstration of Corbyn's supposed unpopularity hook, line and sinker.

Roll on 2020.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

The media only seem to be focusing on fall in labour voters and Farage and his vote rigging. The right wing media bias is a national disgrace; the head of BBC news worked for Cameron

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Probably anti Tory rather than pro Corbyn

Of course. But if the Labour vote had gone down, it would have been anti-Corbyn not pro-UKIP or Tory.

That's what the fear game is all about."

That is clearly the case. There is no denying that the 'Corbyn factor' would have been blamed by the mainstream media had Labour dropped it's majority percentage.

I do not though think that anyone within Labour should spin the increase in margin as being down to Corbyn. Spin should be shown for what it is and kept away from the new politics.

I think the negative spin faced by Corbyn on what seems to be a daily basis is slowly drawing more people towards his approach. Time will tell.

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By *dwalu2 OP Couple over a year ago

Bristol

There is always a fall in voter numbers for a by-election compared with a general election...but you won't be hearing that on the BBC today. It doesn't fit the 'unelectable Labour' narrative.

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By *ivnwcplCouple over a year ago

liverpool

Dont know why everone is surprised! Oldham is 75% Asian now. Of course Labour were going to win...

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If everyone really wants these austerity measures into the Parliament after this, then simply vote Conservative. If the woes of this country are due to immigration, vote UKIP.

Osborne's austerity plan is dependent on growth figures that can only be realistically achieved with relatively high levels of immigration. That is a huge story in the current environment and yet petty Corbyn bashing dominates the press.

Like him or not, fair minded individuals will begin to dislike how he's being treated and start to listen more to him rather than how he's being portrayed.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Oldham was already a labour stronghold, it is no surprise they have held the seat. But i very much don't think it is an endorsement of Corbyn's leadership on any way shape or form

This. As someone whonlives in the area trust me its more about tory hate

No, no, it's only allowed to be about Corbyn. You're not allowed local views or any kind of opinion that deviates from the one handed down from on high by the OP

Pmsl i used to work with the councillors in the area including miss big tits look at me danczuk its no wonder its one of the most deprived area in the country.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If my face is crimson, I must have put too much blusher on. Outside of the "right wing" media bias - I'm waiting for my daily précis of the contents of the Telegraph and the Mail from you, btw - I can only go by the staunch Labour supporters who I live and work amongst. 99% of them are appalled by Corbyn and McDonnell and Momentum and all of what's going on at the moment at the top of the party. Will they still vote Labour? Of course they fucking will. They always will because hatred of the conservatives is absolutely ingrained up here, and they're not old and angry enough for UKIP.

I saw a really interesting graph the other day of voter flows to and from the various parties since the election...I'll have to search for a link. It had a lot of people moving about (greens and lib dems to labour, ex labour to UKIP etc) but things basically ending up at the same levels of support for the two main parties as in May.

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By *dwalu2 OP Couple over a year ago

Bristol

Your face will only be crimson if you have been spouting off that yesterday's result would be 'interesting', and then adding one of these on the end:

And there are a lot of those around.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I think Corbyn is great! Much rather have him than a Tory or ukip. But then I would say no to a green party MP either

Tory hater, Corbyn lover "

Looks like Mr Corbyn will take our vote.

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By *hetalkingstoveMan over a year ago

London

"Dont know why everone is surprised! Oldham is 75% Asian now. Of course Labour were going to win...

No, it's not 75% Asian. Let's not be silly. The UK population is 5% Asian, do they all live in Oldham?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Your face will only be crimson if you have been spouting off that yesterday's result would be 'interesting', and then adding one of these on the end:

And there are a lot of those around."

I'm sure I probably said that. And it has been interesting. I didn't expect an increased majority. That doesn't mean I'm "afraid" today, or embarrassed, or whatever the choice of emotions you are telling people they are feeling today.

And very remiss of me, it should of course have been

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

In May, Labour won the seat with a 14 738 majority, yesterday the majority was 10 722. Not sure where you went to school, but in my book, that's a loss of 4016, not an increase as you claim.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Dont know why everone is surprised! Oldham is 75% Asian now. Of course Labour were going to win...

No, it's not 75% Asian. Let's not be silly. The UK population is 5% Asian, do they all live in Oldham?

Around 25% of the population in that constituency are Muslim. So 75% is a bit of an exaggeration.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Oldham was already a labour stronghold, it is no surprise they have held the seat. But i very much don't think it is an endorsement of Corbyn's leadership on any way shape or form"

If you stick a red rosette on a pig, they would still vote Labour in Oldham.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Dont know why everone is surprised! Oldham is 75% Asian now. Of course Labour were going to win...

We live in Oldham east and Saddleworth also a Labour controlled district but bet it has more to do with higher levels of poor and general lack of prospects than what the ethic make up for the area is?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Interesting thread as someone who grew up in the 70s and experienced 1st hand intimidation from left wing unions and the like isn't refreshing that along comes Corbyn and it all starts again.oh what joy to be a labour MP or supporter bring back to good old days of strikes etc is that we realy want.

Always find it hypocritical of labour that they like to slagg everyone of but soon someone says something they dont like your racist or you get threats thought they where the party of free speech

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By *its_n_piecesCouple over a year ago

"Dont know why everone is surprised! Oldham is 75% Asian now. Of course Labour were going to win...

No, it's not 75% Asian. Let's not be silly. The UK population is 5% Asian, do they all live in Oldham?

Around 25% of the population in that constituency are Muslim. So 75% is a bit of an exaggeration. "

asians of other religious persuasions are also available

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"In May, Labour won the seat with a 14 738 majority, yesterday the majority was 10 722. Not sure where you went to school, but in my book, that's a loss of 4016, not an increase as you claim. "

The overall count was down the rise was a percentage increase

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

I saw one person yesterday crowing that the result would be interesting. Considering the bashing the Labour Party has taken this week with all the internal strife, bullying and waffle along with the commons vote it's been a bad week.

I find the clinging onto positive very Comical Ali!!

The Tory party have taken a bashing too regarding the nasty bullying so in my eyes they are both as bad as each other.

I wish there was a viable alternative. UKIP can however GTFO!

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Dont know why everone is surprised! Oldham is 75% Asian now. Of course Labour were going to win...

No, it's not 75% Asian. Let's not be silly. The UK population is 5% Asian, do they all live in Oldham?

Around 25% of the population in that constituency are Muslim. So 75% is a bit of an exaggeration.

asians of other religious persuasions are also available "

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Dont know why everone is surprised! Oldham is 75% Asian now. Of course Labour were going to win...

No, it's not 75% Asian. Let's not be silly. The UK population is 5% Asian, do they all live in Oldham?

Around 25% of the population in that constituency are Muslim. So 75% is a bit of an exaggeration.

asians of other religious persuasions are also available "

Of course. But not enough to make the figure up to 75%.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Dont know why everone is surprised! Oldham is 75% Asian now. Of course Labour were going to win...

No, it's not 75% Asian. Let's not be silly. The UK population is 5% Asian, do they all live in Oldham?

Around 25% of the population in that constituency are Muslim. So 75% is a bit of an exaggeration.

asians of other religious persuasions are also available

Of course. But not enough to make the figure up to 75%. "

And Muslims are not all Asian.

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By *anB451Man over a year ago

Reading

[Removed by poster at 04/12/15 09:59:59]

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By *anB451Man over a year ago

Reading

The voter turnout dropped by about 20% from the general election. I know voter turnouts always lower in by-elections but the only thing this one really told us was that people are becoming disillusioned with politics on both sides.

And yes, Saint Corbyn can turn people off politics just as much as the rest of them!

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By *dwalu2 OP Couple over a year ago

Bristol

"In May, Labour won the seat with a 14 738 majority, yesterday the majority was 10 722. Not sure where you went to school, but in my book, that's a loss of 4016, not an increase as you claim. "

Oh dear! You aren't a professor of political science by any chance, are you?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"In May, Labour won the seat with a 14 738 majority, yesterday the majority was 10 722. Not sure where you went to school, but in my book, that's a loss of 4016, not an increase as you claim.

The overall count was down the rise was a percentage increase"

No matter which way you swing it 4000 fewer people voted for Labour yesterday than in May, whatever the reason.

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By *dwalu2 OP Couple over a year ago

Bristol

"The voter turnout dropped by about 20% from the general election. I know voter turnouts always lower in by-elections but the only thing this one really told us was that people are becoming disillusioned with politics on both sides.

I think my bingo card hit full house!

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

And yes, Saint Corbyn can turn people off politics just as much as the rest of them!

They always tend to be lower in the winter too, so it's not really a surprise the turnout was lower.

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By *its_n_piecesCouple over a year ago

"Dont know why everone is surprised! Oldham is 75% Asian now. Of course Labour were going to win...

No, it's not 75% Asian. Let's not be silly. The UK population is 5% Asian, do they all live in Oldham?

Around 25% of the population in that constituency are Muslim. So 75% is a bit of an exaggeration.

asians of other religious persuasions are also available

Of course. But not enough to make the figure up to 75%. "

granted .... but you forgot sikhs, hindus, buddists, taoists, bahai, gnostics, druze, zoroastrians to name but a handfull .... and in the interests of fairness and inclusion ...

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By *dwalu2 OP Couple over a year ago

Bristol

"I saw one person yesterday crowing that the result would be interesting. Considering the bashing the Labour Party has taken this week with all the internal strife, bullying and waffle along with the commons vote it's been a bad week.

There were half a dozen in the Hilary Benn thread alone.

Delicious, salty tears!

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

And yes, Saint Corbyn can turn people off politics just as much as the rest of them!

They always tend to be lower in the winter too, so it's not really a surprise the turnout was lower."

Careful now the Supercilious are watching.

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By *ophieslutTV/TS over a year ago

Central

It's tragic the amount of media spin against him. And it was good on Question Time last night that the Birmingham audience seemed largely anti-war and hadn't been taken in by the spin.

Such a hugely popular man who needs to be allowed to do his job and be measured by his efforts and results.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Dont know why everone is surprised! Oldham is 75% Asian now. Of course Labour were going to win...

No, it's not 75% Asian. Let's not be silly. The UK population is 5% Asian, do they all live in Oldham?

Around 25% of the population in that constituency are Muslim. So 75% is a bit of an exaggeration.

asians of other religious persuasions are also available

Of course. But not enough to make the figure up to 75%.

granted .... but you forgot sikhs, hindus, buddists, taoists, bahai, gnostics, druze, zoroastrians to name but a handfull .... and in the interests of fairness and inclusion ... "

I know, I know! I'm still disputing the original figure though

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By *its_n_piecesCouple over a year ago

"In May, Labour won the seat with a 14 738 majority, yesterday the majority was 10 722. Not sure where you went to school, but in my book, that's a loss of 4016, not an increase as you claim.

The overall count was down the rise was a percentage increase

No matter which way you swing it 4000 fewer people voted for Labour yesterday than in May, whatever the reason."

ok..... in the interests of fairness again .... the labour vote was down from the general election by roughly the anount you mentioned .... the ukip vote was down by roughly 2000 votes and the torys was dwon by roughly 6000 votes.

armed with that info everyone can draw thier own conclusions and continue thier bar fight ...... 3 2 1 go!

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By *dwalu2 OP Couple over a year ago

Bristol

"It's tragic the amount of media spin against him. And it was good on Question Time last night that the Birmingham audience seemed largely anti-war and hadn't been taken in by the spin.

Such a hugely popular man who needs to be allowed to do his job and be measured by his efforts and results."

The simple fact is that Corbyn continues to become more popular as his message gets out through the nonsense that the media promote.

He was on Jeremy Vine on Monday, and every single caller and message was in support of his anti-war view, with the exception of one woman, who couldn't articulate why we should bomb Syria, she just thought we should.

What was interesting is how many of those who agreed with him said 'I don't usually agree with Jeremy Corbyn, but on this issue he is completely right.'

There will be a lot of people who know nothing about Corbyn's views except the misinformation pumped out through the press. When they get to hear him, they realise what he actually represents, rather than what they have been told he represents.

That is only going to build and build. Oldham was the first test, and Corbyn's Labour knocked it clean out of the park. A great result.

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By *dam_TinaCouple over a year ago

Hampshire

Labour retaining Oldham is like the Conservatives retaining Kensington and Chelsea.

I know it's now called Chelsea and Fulham by the way, but that doesn't sound right to me.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Too be honest I've seen tactics by both parties recently which is making politics look ugly. Fillibustering on bills to trolling. How about politicians remember something it's not a popularity contest or about who can shout the loudest but about running the country and looking after it's citizens in the best way possible.

Seeing the north doesn't get anywhere near the money that the government invests in London and the south maybe they voted for Labour as they represent the best bet for the working class? Perhaps they did it because Corbyn is leader or maybe they always have? Maybe they did it because they were Asian or maybe because like a good part of the population of Oldham they were white? To be honest who knows except for those who take the real stastics.

The world doesn't revolve around Corbyn no matter how much right wing or left wing media try to make it.

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By *eavenNhellCouple over a year ago

carrbrook stalybridge

"Dont know why everone is surprised! Oldham is 75% Asian now. Of course Labour were going to win...

"
love to know where you get that figure from ? 75% realy ? More like 25%

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"It's tragic the amount of media spin against him. And it was good on Question Time last night that the Birmingham audience seemed largely anti-war and hadn't been taken in by the spin.

Such a hugely popular man who needs to be allowed to do his job and be measured by his efforts and results."

But when the media is controlled by someone like Rupert Murdoch, they'll only show us the bad side/twisted side. To get a true view of him people need to watch full interviews so they know where the media twists stuff he says

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By *dwalu2 OP Couple over a year ago

Bristol

"Too be honest I've seen tactics by both parties recently which is making politics look ugly. Fillibustering on bills to trolling. How about politicians remember something it's not a popularity contest or about who can shout the loudest but about running the country and looking after it's citizens in the best way possible.

The world doesn't revolve around Corbyn no matter how much right wing or left wing media try to make it.

It's only significant as the result was widely expected by the press and people who swallow their stuff whole to be a disaster for Labour, because Corbyn.

Of course, the main reason for the success in Oldham is down to a strong local candidate. Rubbing the nose of the Tories and giving them yet more reason to fear Corbyn is really just a nice added bonus.

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By *indys loverCouple over a year ago

Stratford on avon

I will be the first to admit im not a labour party supporter but i will also add that i do not live and breath politics like those above me so in my very inexperienced mind was i surprised labour won yesterdays byelection ,,,, no not one bit ,,,,, will J C still be leader for the labour party in just over 4 years , well only time will tell , what will be interesting at the next general election is who will be leading the Tory party and then it will make for some very interesting discussions ,

but can someone please answer me a question ,,,,, there are those who are anti war but are quite happy to murder their MP because he voted in what he belived is right ,,,,, hmmmm , cant get my head around that one

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I think Corbyn is great! Much rather have him than a Tory or ukip. But then I would say no to a green party MP either

Tory hater, Corbyn lover "

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By *indys loverCouple over a year ago

Stratford on avon

"I think Corbyn is great! Much rather have him than a Tory or ukip. But then I would say no to a green party MP either

Tory hater, Corbyn lover

'Hater' and 'Kind' are not two words i would put together to be honest

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Of course Oldham would vote Labour - no matter who is in charge - look at the demographic

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I think Corbyn is great! Much rather have him than a Tory or ukip. But then I would say no to a green party MP either

Tory hater, Corbyn lover

'Hater' and 'Kind' are not two words i would put together to be honest

I find it hard to reconcile people encouraging a kinder style of politics while denouncing Tory scum, showing absoutely vehement hatred and threatening MPs. I do believe Corbyn is committed to trying to make it a better system - but he'd do well to take some of the membership in hand because their behaviour makes them look like hypocrites. At least tories smearing people aren't pretending to be nice, they just do it. Doing it and bashing us all around the head with your moral high ground is what is difficult to swallow.

Alan Johnson made a good point about it in the debate.

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By *iamondjoeMan over a year ago

Glastonbury

What was the turnout?

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I will be the first to admit im not a labour party supporter but i will also add that i do not live and breath politics like those above me so in my very inexperienced mind was i surprised labour won yesterdays byelection ,,,, no not one bit ,,,,, will J C still be leader for the labour party in just over 4 years , well only time will tell , what will be interesting at the next general election is who will be leading the Tory party and then it will make for some very interesting discussions ,

They are the very same people who are happy to use violence for their own aim but then cry foul when they get kettled or whacked with a Police baton.

I laughed when I saw them banging drums and marching outside an MP's house the night before the vote and justified it by saying it's ok she didn't have kids!! Never mind the other family's with kids in the area then.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *its_n_piecesCouple over a year ago

"I find it hard to reconcile people encouraging a kinder style of politics while denouncing Tory scum, showing absoutely vehement hatred and threatening MPs. I do believe Corbyn is committed to trying to make it a better system - but he'd do well to take some of the membership in hand because their behaviour makes them look like hypocrites. "

he might just be giving them time to out themselves before he deals with it. It is a possibility but time wil tell.

Having a night of the long knives so soon after his leadership election would appear churlish.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

he might just be giving them time to out themselves before he deals with it. It is a possibility but time wil tell.

Having a night of the long knives so soon after his leadership election would appear churlish."

True. In the longer term it needs to be tackled though. Some of what's going on in constituency Labour parties is not good at all though, can't be allowed to continue for too long under the banner of being Corbyn-approved.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *iamondjoeMan over a year ago

Glastonbury

"What was the turnout?"

Fuckin' talk to myself, sometimes...

*sighs*

OK, some key points:-

* Jim McMahon (Lab) wins with 11k majority

* This is down on May's nearly 15k majority

* No surprise as by-elections usually see a drop in turnout.

* Importantly, however, Labour ended up with a higher vote share of the turnout than in the general election (62.11% of votes cast).

* UKIP has complained about postal vote fraud

You might say, 'It's Oldham, Labour was bound to win', which is true. What is also apparent is that *people of the left* (I say this rather than Labour voters) are drawn to vote for Corbyn, hence the higher share of the vote.

Bottom line: Corbyn didn't fuck it up.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"What was the turnout?

Fuckin' talk to myself, sometimes...

*sighs*

OK, some key points:-

* Jim McMahon (Lab) wins with 11k majority

* This is down on May's nearly 15k majority

* No surprise as by-elections usually see a drop in turnout.

* Importantly, however, Labour ended up with a higher vote share of the turnout than in the general election (62.11% of votes cast).

* UKIP has complained about postal vote fraud

Bottom line: Corbyn didn't fuck it up."

Not exactly knocking it out the park then

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Oh found something from 2011 census for oldham........

The population of Oldham is 77.5%.........White.

Also demographics show that although we are below the national average on rates of people in employment its not actually the far behind. I'm originally from London but people much more friendier, its cheaper and the transport so much better

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *dam_TinaCouple over a year ago

Hampshire

"the transport so much better

Tubes rule

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *dwalu2 OP Couple over a year ago

Bristol

I wonder how many people who think that there was an 'intimidating' mob' outside Stella Creasy's office, not house, actually saw any footage, rather than just heard about it?

Here's footage of that 'mob'...a peaceful group of men, women, pensioners and children calmly taking part in their democratic right: https://twitter.com/Channel4News/status/671816371148161024?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw

Of course, if you head about this through the BBC, you probably think they were out trying to hang Stella Creasy from a lamp post.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *dwalu2 OP Couple over a year ago

Bristol

"What was the turnout?

Fuckin' talk to myself, sometimes...

*sighs*

OK, some key points:-

* Jim McMahon (Lab) wins with 11k majority

* This is down on May's nearly 15k majority

* No surprise as by-elections usually see a drop in turnout.

* Importantly, however, Labour ended up with a higher vote share of the turnout than in the general election (62.11% of votes cast).

* UKIP has complained about postal vote fraud

Bottom line: Corbyn didn't fuck it up.

Not exactly knocking it out the park then

Delicious, salty tears.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"What was the turnout?

Fuckin' talk to myself, sometimes...

*sighs*

OK, some key points:-

* Jim McMahon (Lab) wins with 11k majority

* This is down on May's nearly 15k majority

* No surprise as by-elections usually see a drop in turnout.

* Importantly, however, Labour ended up with a higher vote share of the turnout than in the general election (62.11% of votes cast).

* UKIP has complained about postal vote fraud

Bottom line: Corbyn didn't fuck it up.

Not exactly knocking it out the park then

Delicious, salty tears.

I voted labour. Turning on your own.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"What was the turnout?

Fuckin' talk to myself, sometimes...

*sighs*

OK, some key points:-

* Jim McMahon (Lab) wins with 11k majority

* This is down on May's nearly 15k majority

* No surprise as by-elections usually see a drop in turnout.

* Importantly, however, Labour ended up with a higher vote share of the turnout than in the general election (62.11% of votes cast).

* UKIP has complained about postal vote fraud

Bottom line: Corbyn didn't fuck it up."

Although less people voted for Labour there than at the general election under Miliband.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *dwalu2 OP Couple over a year ago

Bristol

"I think Corbyn is great! Much rather have him than a Tory or ukip. But then I would say no to a green party MP either

Tory hater, Corbyn lover

'Hater' and 'Kind' are not two words i would put together to be honest

Alan Johnson made a good point about it in the debate."

If you think Alan Johnson made any good points in the debate, that says it all.

What's far more telling though is that you think the prime minister referring to parliamentary colleagues as 'terrorist sympathisers' is totally fine because Tories are awful human beings anyway, and how can they be expected to help themselves? But if some random person sends a mean tweet, somehow that is JC's responsibility.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *dwalu2 OP Couple over a year ago

Bristol

"What was the turnout?

Fuckin' talk to myself, sometimes...

*sighs*

OK, some key points:-

* Jim McMahon (Lab) wins with 11k majority

* This is down on May's nearly 15k majority

* No surprise as by-elections usually see a drop in turnout.

* Importantly, however, Labour ended up with a higher vote share of the turnout than in the general election (62.11% of votes cast).

* UKIP has complained about postal vote fraud

Bottom line: Corbyn didn't fuck it up.

Although less people voted for Labour there than at the general election under Miliband."

Less people always vote at by-elections than general elections.

Please try to keep up.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Oh found something from 2011 census for oldham........

The population of Oldham is 77.5%.........White.

Demographics in the sense that most claim benefits and labour support the subsidy or wealth from rich to poor - so voting anything other than labour for people in Oldham is a bad thing

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *dwalu2 OP Couple over a year ago

Bristol

"What was the turnout?

Fuckin' talk to myself, sometimes...

*sighs*

OK, some key points:-

* Jim McMahon (Lab) wins with 11k majority

* This is down on May's nearly 15k majority

* No surprise as by-elections usually see a drop in turnout.

* Importantly, however, Labour ended up with a higher vote share of the turnout than in the general election (62.11% of votes cast).

* UKIP has complained about postal vote fraud

Bottom line: Corbyn didn't fuck it up.

Not exactly knocking it out the park then

Delicious, salty tears.

I voted labour. Turning on your own.

If you voted Labour at the last election, you and I share nothing in common.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"What was the turnout?

Fuckin' talk to myself, sometimes...

*sighs*

OK, some key points:-

* Jim McMahon (Lab) wins with 11k majority

* This is down on May's nearly 15k majority

* No surprise as by-elections usually see a drop in turnout.

* Importantly, however, Labour ended up with a higher vote share of the turnout than in the general election (62.11% of votes cast).

* UKIP has complained about postal vote fraud

Bottom line: Corbyn didn't fuck it up.

Not exactly knocking it out the park then

Delicious, salty tears.

I voted labour. Turning on your own.

If you voted Labour at the last election, you and I share nothing in common."

Your damn right about that I guess from your stance our personal circumstances are vastly different.

I do admire the way you stand up for yourself though when your not being supercilious.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *iamondjoeMan over a year ago

Glastonbury

"What was the turnout?

Fuckin' talk to myself, sometimes...

*sighs*

OK, some key points:-

* Jim McMahon (Lab) wins with 11k majority

* This is down on May's nearly 15k majority

* No surprise as by-elections usually see a drop in turnout.

* Importantly, however, Labour ended up with a higher vote share of the turnout than in the general election (62.11% of votes cast).

* UKIP has complained about postal vote fraud

Bottom line: Corbyn didn't fuck it up.

Although less people voted for Labour there than at the general election under Miliband."

U sure about that?

BBC says Labour increased it's share of the vote, even though (as stated) turnout usually goes down for a by-election.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I think Corbyn is great! Much rather have him than a Tory or ukip. But then I would say no to a green party MP either

Tory hater, Corbyn lover

'Hater' and 'Kind' are not two words i would put together to be honest

Alan Johnson made a good point about it in the debate.

If you think Alan Johnson made any good points in the debate, that says it all.

I was surprised too. Rare for me to agree with Alan Johnson. But his point about the moral certitude of the finger jabbing activists struck a chord.

I didn't think what Cameron said about terrorist sympathisers was fine, either. He should have apologised. Or better yet not said it in the first place.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Oh found something from 2011 census for oldham........

The population of Oldham is 77.5%.........White.

Demographics in the sense that most claim benefits and labour support the subsidy or wealth from rich to poor - so voting anything other than labour for people in Oldham is a bad thing"

More the case that until recently Tories have never seen the north as worth bothering about so while big businesses were given grants to set up elsewhere we've had little to no investment.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"In May, Labour won the seat with a 14 738 majority, yesterday the majority was 10 722. Not sure where you went to school, but in my book, that's a loss of 4016, not an increase as you claim. "

If his figures are accurate.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"In May, Labour won the seat with a 14 738 majority, yesterday the majority was 10 722. Not sure where you went to school, but in my book, that's a loss of 4016, not an increase as you claim.

If his figures are accurate."

Percentage increase rather than absolute increase

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Oh found something from 2011 census for oldham........

The population of Oldham is 77.5%.........White.

Demographics in the sense that most claim benefits and labour support the subsidy or wealth from rich to poor - so voting anything other than labour for people in Oldham is a bad thing

More the case that until recently Tories have never seen the north as worth bothering about so while big businesses were given grants to set up elsewhere we've had little to no investment. "

Most grants were in poor labour areas

Swansea

Newcastle etc

Unfortunately companies want skilled educated people so base themselves in London or south east where professional services organisations create most wealth

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"In May, Labour won the seat with a 14 738 majority, yesterday the majority was 10 722. Not sure where you went to school, but in my book, that's a loss of 4016, not an increase as you claim.

If his figures are accurate.

Percentage increase rather than absolute increase "

Yes. Less voters. But i accept less turn out for a bi-election. Although if i was a Labour supporter who wanted to prove a point to the BBC i would have made sure i'd have voted...

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *dwalu2 OP Couple over a year ago

Bristol

"I think Corbyn is great! Much rather have him than a Tory or ukip. But then I would say no to a green party MP either

Tory hater, Corbyn lover

'Hater' and 'Kind' are not two words i would put together to be honest

Alan Johnson made a good point about it in the debate.

If you think Alan Johnson made any good points in the debate, that says it all.

I was surprised too. Rare for me to agree with Alan Johnson. But his point about the moral certitude of the finger jabbing activists struck a chord.

I didn't think what Cameron said about terrorist sympathisers was fine, either. He should have apologised. Or better yet not said it in the first place. "

So you are criticising Cameron for not being more like Corbyn then? Well, that's a start.

Also worth noting that it was Tory MPs baying like animals trying to shout down the leader of the opposition in parliament, in fact shouting at him to 'sit down', while he was making the case for not sending British jets out to bomb innocent men, women and children.

The Labour bench were respectful enough to let the Prime Minister make his case without interruption such as it was.

Labour can take the moral high ground with a clear conscience when it comes to political conduct.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Oldham was already a labour stronghold, it is no surprise they have held the seat. But i very much don't think it is an endorsement of Corbyn's leadership on any way shape or form

This. As someone whonlives in the area trust me its more about tory hate

No, no, it's only allowed to be about Corbyn. You're not allowed local views or any kind of opinion that deviates from the one handed down from on high by the OP

Pmsl i used to work with the councillors in the area including miss big tits look at me danczuk its no wonder its one of the most deprived area in the country."

Bring back mumps bridge

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I think Corbyn is great! Much rather have him than a Tory or ukip. But then I would say no to a green party MP either

Tory hater, Corbyn lover

'Hater' and 'Kind' are not two words i would put together to be honest

Alan Johnson made a good point about it in the debate.

If you think Alan Johnson made any good points in the debate, that says it all.

I was surprised too. Rare for me to agree with Alan Johnson. But his point about the moral certitude of the finger jabbing activists struck a chord.

I didn't think what Cameron said about terrorist sympathisers was fine, either. He should have apologised. Or better yet not said it in the first place.

So you are criticising Cameron for not being more like Corbyn then? Well, that's a start.

The Labour bench were respectful enough to let the Prime Minister make his case without interruption such as it was.

Labour can take the moral high ground with a clear conscience when it comes to political conduct."

Don't delude yourself - NONE of the major parties have a clear conscience on political conduct. I don't think Cameron should behave more like Corbyn. I don't think Corbyn should behave more like Cameron either.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"In May, Labour won the seat with a 14 738 majority, yesterday the majority was 10 722. Not sure where you went to school, but in my book, that's a loss of 4016, not an increase as you claim.

If his figures are accurate.

Percentage increase rather than absolute increase

Yes. Less voters. But i accept less turn out for a bi-election. Although if i was a Labour supporter who wanted to prove a point to the BBC i would have made sure i'd have voted..."

You'd think, wouldn't you. Maybe it was just the rain that kept them away...

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *dwalu2 OP Couple over a year ago

Bristol

"I think Corbyn is great! Much rather have him than a Tory or ukip. But then I would say no to a green party MP either

Tory hater, Corbyn lover

'Hater' and 'Kind' are not two words i would put together to be honest

Alan Johnson made a good point about it in the debate.

If you think Alan Johnson made any good points in the debate, that says it all.

I was surprised too. Rare for me to agree with Alan Johnson. But his point about the moral certitude of the finger jabbing activists struck a chord.

I didn't think what Cameron said about terrorist sympathisers was fine, either. He should have apologised. Or better yet not said it in the first place.

So you are criticising Cameron for not being more like Corbyn then? Well, that's a start.

The Labour bench were respectful enough to let the Prime Minister make his case without interruption such as it was.

Labour can take the moral high ground with a clear conscience when it comes to political conduct.

Of course Corbyn shouldn't behave more like Cameron. Lying to parliament, insulting parliamentary colleagues, having a poppy photoshopped onto his photo because he disrespects our war dead so much that he can't even make the effort to wear one?

Though quite what you think Cameron couldn't gain by being more like the most informed and principled member of the House today is anyone's guess.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Unfortunately companies want skilled educated people so base themselves in London or south east where professional services organisations create most wealth "

You are aware there are skilled, educated people all over the country not just London and the southeast?

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Unfortunately companies want skilled educated people so base themselves in London or south east where professional services organisations create most wealth

You are aware there are skilled, educated people all over the country not just London and the southeast?

You are aware that anywhere north of Oxford is Narnia?

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *dwalu2 OP Couple over a year ago

Bristol

"In May, Labour won the seat with a 14 738 majority, yesterday the majority was 10 722. Not sure where you went to school, but in my book, that's a loss of 4016, not an increase as you claim.

If his figures are accurate.

Percentage increase rather than absolute increase

Yes. Less voters. But i accept less turn out for a bi-election. Although if i was a Labour supporter who wanted to prove a point to the BBC i would have made sure i'd have voted...

You'd think, wouldn't you. Maybe it was just the rain that kept them away..."

So you think the people of Oldham should have got together to make a point to the BBC now?

We're through the looking glass, people!

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Unfortunately companies want skilled educated people so base themselves in London or south east where professional services organisations create most wealth

You are aware there are skilled, educated people all over the country not just London and the southeast?

And it all depends on the skill in question. If we didn't have a huge shift from engineering and manufacturing based skills to service based skills the "north" would have a much better level of employment than it does now.......who was it that killed off the engineering sector in the 80's?......

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"To the surprise of precisely no-one who hasn't been taken in by the right wing press trying to smear Corbyn left right and centre, of course. Once again, the more the press monster him, the more people like him. We may as well start calling him Teflon Jez.

Smell that delicious fear.

Really wining one of labour's safest seats? (Labour for 45 years) a place you couple pin a red Rosset on a rabid squirrel and it would win is a major victory to you?

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *its_n_piecesCouple over a year ago

Yes. Less voters. But i accept less turn out for a bi-election. Although if i was a Labour supporter who wanted to prove a point to the BBC i would have made sure i'd have voted...

You'd think, wouldn't you. Maybe it was just the rain that kept them away..."

surely the same goes for the voters of any political persuasion the way that both the left and right wing medias hyped things up as barometer of national opion. after all the ukip vote was down by 25% ish on the general election and the tory vote was down by 80% ish.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Unfortunately companies want skilled educated people so base themselves in London or south east where professional services organisations create most wealth

You are aware there are skilled, educated people all over the country not just London and the southeast?

Globalisation?

Raw material extraction is not really pure engineering.

These days we export lots of true engineering products,heavily militery/intelligence equipment, nuclear reactor components, aviation components, optics and we focus on very high value high quality engineering products.

High wages mean we can't afford to make tat so we make expensive low volume things

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"In May, Labour won the seat with a 14 738 majority, yesterday the majority was 10 722. Not sure where you went to school, but in my book, that's a loss of 4016, not an increase as you claim.

If his figures are accurate.

Percentage increase rather than absolute increase

Yes. Less voters. But i accept less turn out for a bi-election. Although if i was a Labour supporter who wanted to prove a point to the BBC i would have made sure i'd have voted...

You'd think, wouldn't you. Maybe it was just the rain that kept them away...

So you think the people of Oldham should have got together to make a point to the BBC now?

We're through the looking glass, people!

No, I think that people of all political persuasions who are really convinced by the parties or the cause turn out to vote. This applies across the board. There was still a significant proportion who didn't care enough to vote, or who didn't want to vote for what was on offer. That applies to the candidates from all parties, but that has to include Labour. More people were not persuaded to vote for them than in May.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Unfortunately companies want skilled educated people so base themselves in London or south east where professional services organisations create most wealth

You are aware there are skilled, educated people all over the country not just London and the southeast?

For digging holes and going down pit yes - for high end pharma / banking / legal etc - no

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Unfortunately companies want skilled educated people so base themselves in London or south east where professional services organisations create most wealth

You are aware there are skilled, educated people all over the country not just London and the southeast?

Globalisation?

Raw material extraction is not really pure engineering.

High wages mean we can't afford to make tat so we make expensiive low volume things "

Do you think the north is basically a mine?

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *dwalu2 OP Couple over a year ago

Bristol

Smell that delicious fear.

Really wining one of labour's safest seats? (Labour for 45 years) a place you couple pin a red Rosset on a rabid squirrel and it would win is a major victory to you?"

If the party had done worse in any significant way at all, it would have been parroted as a major defeat for Labour. So you can't have it both ways.

Although the nonsense talked above about voter numbers shows that whatever the result, spin, spin and spin again is all the right have to offer.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I think Corbyn is great! Much rather have him than a Tory or ukip. But then I would say no to a green party MP either

Tory hater, Corbyn lover

'Hater' and 'Kind' are not two words i would put together to be honest

Alan Johnson made a good point about it in the debate.

If you think Alan Johnson made any good points in the debate, that says it all.

I was surprised too. Rare for me to agree with Alan Johnson. But his point about the moral certitude of the finger jabbing activists struck a chord.

I didn't think what Cameron said about terrorist sympathisers was fine, either. He should have apologised. Or better yet not said it in the first place.

So you are criticising Cameron for not being more like Corbyn then? Well, that's a start.

The Labour bench were respectful enough to let the Prime Minister make his case without interruption such as it was.

Labour can take the moral high ground with a clear conscience when it comes to political conduct.

Though quite what you think Cameron couldn't gain by being more like the most informed and principled member of the House today is anyone's guess."

This is a pointless argument, because the difference is I think about 50% of what the Conservative party and Cameron do is wrong. But they were the least worst option when applied to my political beliefs, and I think that about 50% is right. I voted differently in the two other general elections I've been old enough to vote in. I don't swallow it whole the way you appear to have done with JC.

I'm already a Christian, maybe that's why I don't have the capacity for unquestioning faith in another aged belief system.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Unfortunately companies want skilled educated people so base themselves in London or south east where professional services organisations create most wealth

You are aware there are skilled, educated people all over the country not just London and the southeast?

Globalisation?

Raw material extraction is not really pure engineering.

High wages mean we can't afford to make tat so we make expensiive low volume things

Do you think the north is basically a mine?"

Disused mine! Skag land lol

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"In May, Labour won the seat with a 14 738 majority, yesterday the majority was 10 722. Not sure where you went to school, but in my book, that's a loss of 4016, not an increase as you claim.

If his figures are accurate.

Percentage increase rather than absolute increase

Yes. Less voters. But i accept less turn out for a bi-election. Although if i was a Labour supporter who wanted to prove a point to the BBC i would have made sure i'd have voted...

You'd think, wouldn't you. Maybe it was just the rain that kept them away...

So you think the people of Oldham should have got together to make a point to the BBC now?

We're through the looking glass, people!

It's not completely un-believable, some people couldn't wait to make their point on a website for swinging! Imagine....

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *dwalu2 OP Couple over a year ago

Bristol

"I think Corbyn is great! Much rather have him than a Tory or ukip. But then I would say no to a green party MP either

Tory hater, Corbyn lover

'Hater' and 'Kind' are not two words i would put together to be honest

Alan Johnson made a good point about it in the debate.

If you think Alan Johnson made any good points in the debate, that says it all.

I was surprised too. Rare for me to agree with Alan Johnson. But his point about the moral certitude of the finger jabbing activists struck a chord.

I didn't think what Cameron said about terrorist sympathisers was fine, either. He should have apologised. Or better yet not said it in the first place.

So you are criticising Cameron for not being more like Corbyn then? Well, that's a start.

The Labour bench were respectful enough to let the Prime Minister make his case without interruption such as it was.

Labour can take the moral high ground with a clear conscience when it comes to political conduct.

Though quite what you think Cameron couldn't gain by being more like the most informed and principled member of the House today is anyone's guess.

I'm already a Christian, maybe that's why I don't have the capacity for unquestioning faith in another aged belief system. "

It's my personal view that anyone with any personal conscience, morality or faith worthy the words could not have voted for David Cameron's government.

I have more respect for people who admit to naked self interest, as I find it honest, which is creditable at the very least.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Smell that delicious fear.

Really wining one of labour's safest seats? (Labour for 45 years) a place you couple pin a red Rosset on a rabid squirrel and it would win is a major victory to you?

If the party had done worse in any significant way at all, it would have been parroted as a major defeat for Labour. So you can't have it both ways.

Although the nonsense talked above about voter numbers shows that whatever the result, spin, spin and spin again is all the right have to offer."

Tbh you're the one spinning this no one else.

It's a safe seat they're called safe seats for a reason.

It's a part of the country where they will vote labour regardless of the politician in the county (which is what they're voting for not the leader) regardless of the leader.

It won't be until you see anything in contested seats you could make any real rational claims.

Take a step back from what you want to belive is happening and objectively look at the situation.

I recommend you check out the voterpower website it roughly calculates how much each vote is worth based on how safe an area is (for all parties without bias before you jump on it) for oldham west it's down to 0.139 which is quite bad but the average is only 0.317 for the country due to the phenomenon of safe seats.

Seriously have a look through it for labour or con or any area if by the time you've read a few pages you aren't in favour of electoral reform I'll be amazed

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Unfortunately companies want skilled educated people so base themselves in London or south east where professional services organisations create most wealth

You are aware there are skilled, educated people all over the country not just London and the southeast?

Globalisation?

Raw material extraction is not really pure engineering.

High wages mean we can't afford to make tat so we make expensiive low volume things

Do you think the north is basically a mine?"

No its the place where we make all those products I just listed.

A place where I live and work for a massive engineering company.

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By *dwalu2 OP Couple over a year ago

Bristol

Smell that delicious fear.

Really wining one of labour's safest seats? (Labour for 45 years) a place you couple pin a red Rosset on a rabid squirrel and it would win is a major victory to you?

If the party had done worse in any significant way at all, it would have been parroted as a major defeat for Labour. So you can't have it both ways.

Although the nonsense talked above about voter numbers shows that whatever the result, spin, spin and spin again is all the right have to offer.

Tbh you're the one spinning this no one else.

It's a safe seat they're called safe seats for a reason.

It's a part of the country where they will vote labour regardless of the politician in the county (which is what they're voting for not the leader) regardless of the leader.

It won't be until you see anything in contested seats you could make any real rational claims.

Take a step back from what you want to belive is happening and objectively look at the situation.

Seriously have a look through it for labour or con or any area if by the time you've read a few pages you aren't in favour of electoral reform I'll be amazed "

I am already in favour of electoral reform.

As much as I view UKIP and their supporters as the very worst sort of people, who would benefit this country immeasurably if they were all fired into the sun, I think it is a scandal that their party can win four million votes and receive practically zero representation as a consequence in our parliament.

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By *ammskiMan over a year ago

lytham st.annes

Unfortunately companies want skilled educated people so base themselves in London or south east where professional services organisations create most wealth

You are aware there are skilled, educated people all over the country not just London and the southeast?

For digging holes and going down pit yes - for high end pharma / banking / legal etc - no"
. He,s probably never visited the North,thank god,W!";:let !!