FabSwingers.com > Forums > The Lounge > The Equality Act 2010
The Equality Act 2010
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"I've been thinking of going to a swinging club recently. Now at the moment, due to a massive change in personal circumstance, I'm a bit skint. So I've been looking round for clubs that don't require an extortionate membership fee. However, during my research my mind began to wander. It struck me that I'm being unfairly discriminated against on the grounds of my gender. Now under the equality act of 2010 that, in theory, is illegal. Don't get me wrong, I'm not going to do anything about it, as I'm sure the publicity would blow my quiet world of swinging wide open. But it does seem that the equality act isn't working even at the most basic of levels. Please don't see the as a rant or as me spitting my dummy out. It's just a Wednesday morning muse! Enjoy your Wednesday x" No it's a private club and as such can price according to who they deem appropriate to that. If you consider it as a reduction for single women and couples then it makes far more sense | |||
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 there are ways of being on the scene without forking out loads | |||
"Maternity wards also discriminate on the basis of gender. Better sue them too "I'm unsure as to how they do? I'd imagine that if a man became pregnant he would be treated to the same amount of dignity and care as a female. | |||
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"Maternity wards also discriminate on the basis of gender. Better sue them too
I'm unsure as to how they do? I'd imagine that if a man became pregnant he would be treated to the same amount of dignity and care as a female. "Ofcourse he would be Same as if a man had breasts and a vagina, swinger's clubs will give him a discount same as they do to other women. Prove it and get in at a discount | |||
"I think all single men should take a stand, other than me! "
That will always be the case; until guys are willing to pay higher, swinger's clubs and vanilla nite clubs will continue to give women discounts
When guys start boycotting, clubs will start charging women higher. The few, very few, who go there now, will become even fewer; problem solved | |||
"Maternity wards also discriminate on the basis of gender. Better sue them too
I'm unsure as to how they do? I'd imagine that if a man became pregnant he would be treated to the same amount of dignity and care as a female.
Ofcourse he would be
Same as if a man had breasts and a vagina, swinger's clubs will give him a discount same as they do to other women. Prove it and get in at a discount "That actually poses another question. Do pre-op transsexuals count as male or female, or do they get a 50% discount on what a male would pay? | |||
"Maternity wards also discriminate on the basis of gender. Better sue them too
I'm unsure as to how they do? I'd imagine that if a man became pregnant he would be treated to the same amount of dignity and care as a female.
Ofcourse he would be
Same as if a man had breasts and a vagina, swinger's clubs will give him a discount same as they do to other women. Prove it and get in at a discount
That actually poses another question. Do pre-op transsexuals count as male or female, or do they get a 50% discount on what a male would pay? "They shouldn't Are you after a 50% discount? | |||
"Maternity wards also discriminate on the basis of gender. Better sue them too
I'm unsure as to how they do? I'd imagine that if a man became pregnant he would be treated to the same amount of dignity and care as a female.
Ofcourse he would be
Same as if a man had breasts and a vagina, swinger's clubs will give him a discount same as they do to other women. Prove it and get in at a discount
That actually poses another question. Do pre-op transsexuals count as male or female, or do they get a 50% discount on what a male would pay?
They shouldn't
Are you after a 50% discount? "No I'll openly admit to being a gay woman trapped in a man's body, but I'm quite happy with my danglly bits on the outside. | |||
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"Maternity wards also discriminate on the basis of gender. Better sue them too
I'm unsure as to how they do? I'd imagine that if a man became pregnant he would be treated to the same amount of dignity and care as a female.
Ofcourse he would be
Same as if a man had breasts and a vagina, swinger's clubs will give him a discount same as they do to other women. Prove it and get in at a discount
That actually poses another question. Do pre-op transsexuals count as male or female, or do they get a 50% discount on what a male would pay?
They shouldn't
Are you after a 50% discount?
No I'll openly admit to being a gay woman trapped in a man's body, but I'm quite happy with my danglly bits on the outside. "You are not the guy at my salon, are you? Because he told me that he has always been lesbian and now he suspects that is son his heading that way too | |||
"Maternity wards also discriminate on the basis of gender. Better sue them too
I'm unsure as to how they do? I'd imagine that if a man became pregnant he would be treated to the same amount of dignity and care as a female.
Ofcourse he would be
Same as if a man had breasts and a vagina, swinger's clubs will give him a discount same as they do to other women. Prove it and get in at a discount
That actually poses another question. Do pre-op transsexuals count as male or female, or do they get a 50% discount on what a male would pay?
They shouldn't
Are you after a 50% discount?
No I'll openly admit to being a gay woman trapped in a man's body, but I'm quite happy with my danglly bits on the outside.
You are not the guy at my salon, are you? Because he told me that he has always been lesbian and now he suspects that is son his heading that way too "No I try and avoid going down south. It's too daunting for us uneducated meek northern folk with their flat caps and left wing utopian views on what constitutes a fair society. | |||
"... No I try and avoid going down south. It's too daunting for us uneducated meek northern folk with their flat caps and left wing utopian views on what constitutes a fair society. " True; I agree
xxx | |||
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"This happens almost everywhere in and around the sex industry whenever or wherever it is perceived that a man can benefit from sex they pay more ...some dating sites allow women to join for free and men pay same whit many clubs who will have ladies nights weekly but no males night the fact of the matter is men will always be willing to pay if he thinks he will get pussy" I think swingers's clubs and nite clubs should reverse this policy; the men should be invited to come in for free and the women should pay Or in the very least, should try and charge men and women exactly the same. Gay sauna's do so why shouldn't swinger's clubs and nite clubs do the same. And they don't seem to have any problems attracting men there | |||
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"I've been thinking of going to a swinging club recently. Now at the moment, due to a massive change in personal circumstance, I'm a bit skint. So I've been looking round for clubs that don't require an extortionate membership fee. However, during my research my mind began to wander. It struck me that I'm being unfairly discriminated against on the grounds of my gender. Now under the equality act of 2010 that, in theory, is illegal. Don't get me wrong, I'm not going to do anything about it, as I'm sure the publicity would blow my quiet world of swinging wide open. But it does seem that the equality act isn't working even at the most basic of levels. Please don't see the as a rant or as me spitting my dummy out. It's just a Wednesday morning muse! Enjoy your Wednesday x" the problem i have is that you weren't complaining before your circumstances changed and you now find yourself skint.... so its not really the pricing thats the issue..... its now the fact you can't go as often as you would like..... save.... budget.... just like the rest of us do.... just like you do if you want to go on holiday, or buy new clothes, or buying a house, or a car, or a computer, or a mobile phone.... | |||
 & im classed as newbie friendly  respect to you | |||
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"Swap over into the Fetish scene though and this doesn't happen - everyone is treated equally and charged the same. There's been plenty of discussions on this here - do a search, look in the clubs discussion section, etc. Yes it IS discrimination BUT someone somewhere decided that private members clubs are exempt- most likely all the monied wankers in London, etc that wants the leather chaired males only bastions to remain that way. Ergo - the swingers clubs now fall under that ruling and as such males get ripped off. Considering that swinging exists because originally couples want more bodies involved in their sexual play so need single men and females they can write the rules to suit them. And have done. So it's a case of either boycott the clubs until the couples and owners have no choice but to fall into line with the other lifestyles or suck it up and pay. As I said further up - this only happens in swinging - fet, Alt, etc all are treated equally. Even the clubs that run nights for them both freely admit that they charge differently which to me is a fucking insult but then I won't pander to it and don't use them. Make your own choice." Couples fall into line? We don't make the charging policy. Blame the clubs. Ask one with a profile on here. Mr W | |||
"... Considering that swinging exists because originally couples want more bodies involved in their sexual play so need single men and females they can write the rules to suit them. And have done. ..." I think couples may NEED other couples; they will be able to have sex with other couples. They don't NEED single men and/or single women Single men may NEED single women and/or couples just as single women may NEED single men and/or couples I guess single women could have sex with other single women just as couples do have sex with other couples and just as men too could have sex with other men | |||
"Swap over into the Fetish scene though and this doesn't happen - everyone is treated equally and charged the same. There's been plenty of discussions on this here - do a search, look in the clubs discussion section, etc. Yes it IS discrimination BUT someone somewhere decided that private members clubs are exempt- most likely all the monied wankers in London, etc that wants the leather chaired males only bastions to remain that way. Ergo - the swingers clubs now fall under that ruling and as such males get ripped off. Considering that swinging exists because originally couples want more bodies involved in their sexual play so need single men and females they can write the rules to suit them. And have done. So it's a case of either boycott the clubs until the couples and owners have no choice but to fall into line with the other lifestyles or suck it up and pay. As I said further up - this only happens in swinging - fet, Alt, etc all are treated equally. Even the clubs that run nights for them both freely admit that they charge differently which to me is a fucking insult but then I won't pander to it and don't use them. Make your own choice. Couples fall into line? We don't make the charging policy. Blame the clubs. Ask one with a profile on here. Mr W " Well as just about every club is owned or run by couples.... | |||
" Well as just about every club is owned or run by couples...." well if feel that strongly about it..... you could always put your money where your principles seem to be.....
see..... its easy calling for people to boycott clubs if you don't have any stake in the game? nothing to lose! right?
but remember it is a lot of people's lievelyhood you are potentially affecting...... over something that in law isn't illegal.....
lets put it this way... you don'y always have to blow the doors off to enter a premises.... sometimes a knock will do | |||
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"Maternity wards also discriminate on the basis of gender. Better sue them too
I'm unsure as to how they do? I'd imagine that if a man became pregnant he would be treated to the same amount of dignity and care as a female.
Ofcourse he would be
Same as if a man had breasts and a vagina, swinger's clubs will give him a discount same as they do to other women. Prove it and get in at a discount
That actually poses another question. Do pre-op transsexuals count as male or female, or do they get a 50% discount on what a male would pay? "It varies. If you're living as a specific gender then you should be treated as such, without having to endure intrusive questions about surgery etc. That clubs choose to offer discriminatory prices is their choice and right under their exemptions from law. They should not be intrusive into what for many of us is a very difficult and sensitive personal area. | |||
"I've been thinking of going to a swinging club recently. Now at the moment, due to a massive change in personal circumstance, I'm a bit skint. So I've been looking round for clubs that don't require an extortionate membership fee. However, during my research my mind began to wander. It struck me that I'm being unfairly discriminated against on the grounds of my gender. Now under the equality act of 2010 that, in theory, is illegal. Don't get me wrong, I'm not going to do anything about it, as I'm sure the publicity would blow my quiet world of swinging wide open. But it does seem that the equality act isn't working even at the most basic of levels. Please don't see the as a rant or as me spitting my dummy out. It's just a Wednesday morning muse! Enjoy your Wednesday x" Under what part of the act? With them being private members clubs remember. | |||
"Maternity wards also discriminate on the basis of gender. Better sue them too
I'm unsure as to how they do? I'd imagine that if a man became pregnant he would be treated to the same amount of dignity and care as a female.
Ofcourse he would be
Same as if a man had breasts and a vagina, swinger's clubs will give him a discount same as they do to other women. Prove it and get in at a discount "Well there was that tran male who had the baby... | |||
"Maternity wards also discriminate on the basis of gender. Better sue them too
I'm unsure as to how they do? I'd imagine that if a man became pregnant he would be treated to the same amount of dignity and care as a female.
Ofcourse he would be
Same as if a man had breasts and a vagina, swinger's clubs will give him a discount same as they do to other women. Prove it and get in at a discount
Well there was that tran male who had the baby..."it was only an example; I give up | |||
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"I understand why it is the way it is, but dislike the idea that as a woman I'd be paying less, or nothing at all, as this makes me feel like some kind of bait. So I don't go to clubs." Now that's an interesting perspective / viewpoint. | |||
"I understand why it is the way it is, but dislike the idea that as a woman I'd be paying less, or nothing at all, as this makes me feel like some kind of bait. So I don't go to clubs. Now that's an interesting perspective / viewpoint. " It is however the truth - women get in free for EXACTLY that reason and to say otherwise is a barefaced lie. Club owners have admitted to that on here on several occasions on these discussion threads. | |||
"I understand why it is the way it is, but dislike the idea that as a woman I'd be paying less, or nothing at all, as this makes me feel like some kind of bait. So I don't go to clubs. Now that's an interesting perspective / viewpoint. It is however the truth - women get in free for EXACTLY that reason and to say otherwise is a barefaced lie. Club owners have admitted to that on here on several occasions on these discussion threads." Men in adverts targeted at women are bait for women. Doesn't exactly follow that I can then knock him over the head with a saucepan and drag him by the hair into my bedroom
When I go to a club I dress, provocatively; I wonder why I do that | |||
"I understand why it is the way it is, but dislike the idea that as a woman I'd be paying less, or nothing at all, as this makes me feel like some kind of bait. So I don't go to clubs." so can i ask if you have even been to a club? just interested to know if that statement is based on a perception, or based on actual experience? | |||
"... Which require records of members, which means Data Protection Act - and lets face it the swinging scene isn't exactly awash with people handing over names, addresses and dates of birth! ..." All the clubs I have been to in London (apart from the ones which are run as 'house parties') insist on two forms of ID: 1) Photo ID (Passport, Photo Driver's Licence, etc) 2) Proof of Address (Council Tax Bill, Utility Bill, etc) A membership form then needs to be completed and the membership card needs to be shown at every visit. A log is maintained of each visit to the club | |||
"Doesn't exactly follow that I can then knock him over the head with a saucepan and drag him by the hair into my bedroom
"That makes you a 'pansexual'. | |||
"Doesn't exactly follow that I can then knock him over the head with a saucepan and drag him by the hair into my bedroom
That makes you a 'pansexual'.
"Good one  I always wondered what pansexual meant | |||
"I understand why it is the way it is, but dislike the idea that as a woman I'd be paying less, or nothing at all, as this makes me feel like some kind of bait. So I don't go to clubs. so can i ask if you have even been to a club? just interested to know if that statement is based on a perception, or based on actual experience?" No it's wholly perception - that's why I was careful to say "feel like" rather than that I actually AM being used as bait. It's enough of a perception to be a big factor in putting me off though and nothing I've ever seen on here over the past 18 months has changed that perception for me. I'm sure the clubs will get over me not being there though | |||
"Fabio, You raise some good examples, but you cite 'positive discrimination' under the Equality act, not 'positive action'. Positive discrimination is classed as illegal under the act :- Section 158 of the Equality Act 2010 builds on existing legislation on positive action and extends it to include other “protected characteristics” such as age and disability. It allows, but does not require, “any action” to be taken to support those with a protected characteristic, as long as it is a “proportionate means”. Such actions might include training to enable individuals to gain employment, or health services to address their needs. However, it does not permit “anything that is prohibited by or under an enactment other than this Act” – therefore, positive discrimination, such as quotas, continues to be illegal." okay then... so in this case.... what is the difference between "positive action" and "positve discimination"..... because clubs just could rightly argue that dropping the price for those groups who would otherwise be under-represented is a positive action..... | |||
"... Which require records of members, which means Data Protection Act - and lets face it the swinging scene isn't exactly awash with people handing over names, addresses and dates of birth! ... All the clubs I have been to in London (apart from the ones which are run as 'house parties') insist on two forms of ID: 1) Photo ID (Passport, Photo Driver's Licence, etc) 2) Proof of Address (Council Tax Bill, Utility Bill, etc) A membership form then needs to be completed and the membership card needs to be shown at every visit. A log is maintained of each visit to the club" Do the clubs in question, upon joining, have a copy of their data handling policy available, or made available upon request? Do they tell you what they do with your data and how long they retain it for? Id be more worried about what they do with that information and how its stored than if they charge me extra to get in because I'm a bloke! Or is 'data protection' in swinging clubs classed as having a 'help yourself' jar of condoms on the front desk? Seriously, imagine that data set passed onto, stolen or sold to health insurance companies? | |||
"... Which require records of members, which means Data Protection Act - and lets face it the swinging scene isn't exactly awash with people handing over names, addresses and dates of birth! ... All the clubs I have been to in London (apart from the ones which are run as 'house parties') insist on two forms of ID: 1) Photo ID (Passport, Photo Driver's Licence, etc) 2) Proof of Address (Council Tax Bill, Utility Bill, etc) A membership form then needs to be completed and the membership card needs to be shown at every visit. A log is maintained of each visit to the club Do the clubs in question, upon joining, have a copy of their data handling policy available, or made available upon request? Do they tell you what they do with your data and how long they retain it for? Id be more worried about what they do with that information and how its stored than if they charge me extra to get in because I'm a bloke! Or is 'data protection' in swinging clubs classed as having a 'help yourself' jar of condoms on the front desk? Seriously, imagine that data set passed onto, stolen or sold to health insurance companies?" I have absolutely no idea. I guess there was some small print which I should have read, but I didn't as after they had checked my details on the ID, etc, these were returned to me with making any copies; so, no passport numbers, account number, date of birth, etc were recorded The application form has my full name, full address, email address, telephone number and membership number given by the club and my signature. It is also signed by me and I also sign the log every time I visit the club I see your point about the impact of my name and address being made available to health insurance companies. I would probably become uninsurable or in the very least, my premiums would sky-rocket But other than that, I cannot see this having any detrimental effect on my life as I would not be in breach of my employment contract. If that were the case then I would have already been fired as some, including my boss, already know | |||
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"That is why I don't go to clubs it is to expensive, remember if they didn't charge men thru the roof, who else would pay the rent for them? As I see it, it is thanks to single men swinger clubs exists as they would go bust if they relied on couples and women to pay lol." Shag; I have news for you Swinger's clubs are complaining that your lack of attendance has not only brought them to their knees financially, but most of the women have walked out in protest of you not being there; the couples are now threatening to do the same
xxx | |||
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"That is why I don't go to clubs it is to expensive, remember if they didn't charge men thru the roof, who else would pay the rent for them? As I see it, it is thanks to single men swinger clubs exists as they would go bust if they relied on couples and women to pay lol." We would still go, we only go to couples events anyway and would happily pay more for the good night's out and company we have had | |||
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"I've been thinking of going to a swinging club recently. Now at the moment, due to a massive change in personal circumstance, I'm a bit skint. So I've been looking round for clubs that don't require an extortionate membership fee. However, during my research my mind began to wander. It struck me that I'm being unfairly discriminated against on the grounds of my gender. Now under the equality act of 2010 that, in theory, is illegal. Don't get me wrong, I'm not going to do anything about it, as I'm sure the publicity would blow my quiet world of swinging wide open. But it does seem that the equality act isn't working even at the most basic of levels. Please don't see the as a rant or as me spitting my dummy out. It's just a Wednesday morning muse! Enjoy your Wednesday x" Who cares about the equality act. What about freedom of choice and making your own decisions . How many men would want to go to a club if it was packed with men because the charges were too low . This is a case where men prefer discrimination . | |||
"I can only speak for chams but they increased prices by £3 across the desk, men, women & couples faced the increase. Couples only nights did see higher entrance prices for women & couples. They've always shown admission prices for single women and couples online but never (as far as I am aware) single males annual membership or entry. All clubs, There is also the fact single men generally pay annual membership whereas single women don't. (Don't know about couples) As a single woman, usually attending clubs with other single women I've never yet had to show proof of where I live for any club in Europe " Kestrel, AbFab, OurPlace4Fun, loads of others in London Most clubs in Wiesbaden have the same policy If they don't ask for ID, then they are no longer a member's only club. Then anyone, and that means anyone, can simply walk in from the street. Nobody would know who that bloke came from or where he went, if something went wrong | |||
"That is why I don't go to clubs it is to expensive, remember if they didn't charge men thru the roof, who else would pay the rent for them? As I see it, it is thanks to single men swinger clubs exists as they would go bust if they relied on couples and women to pay lol." But they aren't. Businesses set their prices according to demand and the demand seems to be there. Mr W | |||
"That is why I don't go to clubs it is to expensive, remember if they didn't charge men thru the roof, who else would pay the rent for them? As I see it, it is thanks to single men swinger clubs exists as they would go bust if they relied on couples and women to pay lol. Shag; I have news for you Swinger's clubs are complaining that your lack of attendance has not only brought them to their knees financially, but most of the women have walked out in protest of you not being there; the couples are now threatening to do the same
xxx "Nice one and that is good news as well | |||
"That is why I don't go to clubs it is to expensive, remember if they didn't charge men thru the roof, who else would pay the rent for them? As I see it, it is thanks to single men swinger clubs exists as they would go bust if they relied on couples and women to pay lol. But they aren't. Businesses set their prices according to demand and the demand seems to be there. Mr W " That is right and yes it depends of the ratios as well I recon. | |||
"Members clubs are exempt from the Act as I understand it. However, they have to show that they screen members. If you go to a club that will sign people up as and when they show up willy nilly then that's not in accordance with the exemption and you could take some sort of action I think. " exempt only if they have 25 members or less. The law caught up with this.x | |||
"I've been thinking of going to a swinging club recently. Now at the moment, due to a massive change in personal circumstance, I'm a bit skint. So I've been looking round for clubs that don't require an extortionate membership fee. However, during my research my mind began to wander. It struck me that I'm being unfairly discriminated against on the grounds of my gender. Now under the equality act of 2010 that, in theory, is illegal. Don't get me wrong, I'm not going to do anything about it, as I'm sure the publicity would blow my quiet world of swinging wide open. But it does seem that the equality act isn't working even at the most basic of levels. Please don't see the as a rant or as me spitting my dummy out. It's just a Wednesday morning muse! Enjoy your Wednesday x No it's a private club and as such can price according to who they deem appropriate to that. If you consider it as a reduction for single women and couples then it makes far more sense" No they cant.x | |||
"I think you should sue every single one. " It is being brought in to line as we speak. I go to clubs free for women members, as S transitioning m/f under the law. I have female staus , including all uk documents.x | |||
"Fabio, You raise some good examples, but you cite 'positive discrimination' under the Equality act, not 'positive action'. Positive discrimination is classed as illegal under the act :- Section 158 of the Equality Act 2010 builds on existing legislation on positive action and extends it to include other “protected characteristics” such as age and disability. It allows, but does not require, “any action” to be taken to support those with a protected characteristic, as long as it is a “proportionate means”. Such actions might include training to enable individuals to gain employment, or health services to address their needs. However, it does not permit “anything that is prohibited by or under an enactment other than this Act” – therefore, positive discrimination, such as quotas, continues to be illegal. okay then... so in this case.... what is the difference between "positive action" and "positve discimination"..... because clubs just could rightly argue that dropping the price for those groups who would otherwise be under-represented is a positive action..... " Would love to see that defended in a court case. .x | |||
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"I got a load of money in back pay from the Royal Navy after I left because the men were being paid less than the women and had been for years. Just thought I'd throw that in there "So will you be paying it back now? | |||
"I got a load of money in back pay from the Royal Navy after I left because the men were being paid less than the women and had been for years. Just thought I'd throw that in there
So will you be paying it back now?"Why? Men and women are now paid the same. | |||
"Fabio, You raise some good examples, but you cite 'positive discrimination' under the Equality act, not 'positive action'. Positive discrimination is classed as illegal under the act :- Section 158 of the Equality Act 2010 builds on existing legislation on positive action and extends it to include other “protected characteristics” such as age and disability. It allows, but does not require, “any action” to be taken to support those with a protected characteristic, as long as it is a “proportionate means”. Such actions might include training to enable individuals to gain employment, or health services to address their needs. However, it does not permit “anything that is prohibited by or under an enactment other than this Act” – therefore, positive discrimination, such as quotas, continues to be illegal. okay then... so in this case.... what is the difference between "positive action" and "positve discimination"..... because clubs just could rightly argue that dropping the price for those groups who would otherwise be under-represented is a positive action..... Would love to see that defended in a court case. .x". With reference to these clubs , many people are not bothered about either discrimination or what the courts say..No one is compelled to attend a club. | |||
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