FabSwingers.com > Forums > The Lounge > Child Benifit !!
Child Benifit !!
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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Come May 7th or the day after the next government are going to want to balance the books!!
Now we already have the high earners not receiving this once universal Benifit should the next government say enough is enough?
If you want to have children it's your responsibility to provide for them and we are scrapping child Benifit for all new claimants after say Aptil 1st 2016 that way the Benifit bill goes down each year for the next 18 years & the money saved could be used for keeping open some of the mental health units ? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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To be honest pensioners are the biggest drain on tge benefits bill. If they didn't have the foresight to plan for old age why should we pick up the bill? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Think the whole benefits system should be completely overhauled. Let's out the feckless and undeserving that hide behind pseudo illness.
Paying benefits to those who are in need of it the most not those who milk it. |
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"I've never understood why it exists. Does anyone know the origin of it? "
think it started in the war.
I do think its a benefit we could do without in comparison to other cut backs.
As for keeping mental health units open, don't even get me started on that.
In fact no I'm not going to start cause I won't stop but they need to provide acute care to acute patients at the bloody time the patient is suffering acute problems whether its in a unit, support workers, cpn but they need to be treated immediately.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"To be honest pensioners are the biggest drain on tge benefits bill. If they didn't have the foresight to plan for old age why should we pick up the bill?"
Isn't that what we pay national insurance for every month out our wages? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I've never understood why it exists. Does anyone know the origin of it? "
it was an incentive for people to have more children (make the population bigger)enabling governments to borrow more money from other countries on the strength of these children reaching 18 and paying tax's and enabling the loans to be payed back.... and of course the government will benefit from each paying tax even if there no outstanding loan... |
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"Think the whole benefits system should be completely overhauled. Let's out the feckless and undeserving that hide behind pseudo illness.
Paying benefits to those who are in need of it the most not those who milk it. "
This is what they are trying to do, but are targeting the genuine claimers, making them even more ill.
I agree with 2wheels.  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I've never understood why it exists. Does anyone know the origin of it?
it was an incentive for people to have more children (make the population bigger)enabling governments to borrow more money from other countries on the strength of these children reaching 18 and paying tax's and enabling the loans to be payed back.... and of course the government will benefit from each paying tax even if there no outstanding loan... "
Thats a "FACT" |
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"I've never understood why it exists. Does anyone know the origin of it? think it started in the war.
I do think its a benefit we could do without in comparison to other cut backs.
As for keeping mental health units open, don't even get me started on that.
In fact no I'm not going to start cause I won't stop but they need to provide acute care to acute patients at the bloody time the patient is suffering acute problems whether its in a unit, support workers, cpn but they need to be treated immediately.
"
Here here! The mental health service is more than useless. It's ok saying there is help out there, but until you are in the situation where you need the help, you see that it barely exists.  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"To be honest pensioners are the biggest drain on tge benefits bill. If they didn't have the foresight to plan for old age why should we pick up the bill?
Isn't that what we pay national insurance for every month out our wages?"
Of course
I was just trying to get in to the spirit of these benefits threads. Have I gone to far? Should I have played it safe and attacked immigrants or the sick? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"To be honest pensioners are the biggest drain on tge benefits bill. If they didn't have the foresight to plan for old age why should we pick up the bill?
Isn't that what we pay national insurance for every month out our wages?
Of course
I was just trying to get in to the spirit of these benefits threads. Have I gone to far? Should I have played it safe and attacked immigrants or the sick? "
Oh gotcha 
You do realise people are genuinely agreeing with you don't you 
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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago
North West |
"To be honest pensioners are the biggest drain on tge benefits bill. If they didn't have the foresight to plan for old age why should we pick up the bill?"
Wow.... Kind of controversial....
I get you and where you are coming from but the population at large is made up of ordinary folk who have never been told that they should make private arrangements, nor have they had the motivation to do so either.
I think that there is something to be said about mandatory pension savings starting in "X" years time but this needs to be introduced by legislation and a good few years ahead. For example, you could say that anyone born after 2020 will at no time in their lifetime qualify for a state pension and mandate the provision of private/workplace pensions from 2038. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"To be honest pensioners are the biggest drain on tge benefits bill. If they didn't have the foresight to plan for old age why should we pick up the bill?"
That's a bit harsh , they have paid in over many years and surely deserve something back ?
Means testing is the solution for many of the benefits out there . So many people receive benefits and don't need them ( young and old alike )
Going back to the op , it's like anything , it's easy to give but difficult to take away . We lost so many good young men during the war , and to encourage repopulation the child benefit was introduced . Certainly no need at all for it now , but imagine any party saying they are going to take it away ! |
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National insurance payments of the past bear no resemblance to what pensions and other pensioner benefits amount to now. Taxpayers today have to pay that inflated difference.
I don't understand how it's fair to ring fence one group, and also guarantee them an increase year on year when other groups are being told tough shit, starve! |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"
Going back to the op , it's like anything , it's easy to give but difficult to take away . We lost so many good young men during the war , and to encourage repopulation the child benefit was introduced . Certainly no need at all for it now , but imagine any party saying they are going to take it away !"
Ohh yes the backlash would be massive from some elements of our society & the Press ..
But I think they would also get a lot of support from ppl who can see it's an out dated Benifit & a drain on the finances.. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"To be honest pensioners are the biggest drain on tge benefits bill. If they didn't have the foresight to plan for old age why should we pick up the bill?
Isn't that what we pay national insurance for every month out our wages?
Of course
I was just trying to get in to the spirit of these benefits threads. Have I gone to far? Should I have played it safe and attacked immigrants or the sick?
Oh gotcha
You do realise people are genuinely agreeing with you don't you
"
Yeah I know
I'm sick of people attacking the poorest and most vulnerable in society on benefits threads. I naively thought tgat some ridicilouslu outrageous comments might detract from the normal hate fuellwd bile no fan the flames |
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Personally I suspect that whoever wins, Child Benefit will be combined with the Universal Credit. This will see it better targeted at the needy, and make savings in administration. The current system is an arse, and goes against the idea of reducing the number of tax returns.
To sugar-coat the pill, the new Married couples allowance will be extended.
Mr ddc |
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By *abioMan
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
"National insurance payments of the past bear no resemblance to what pensions and other pensioner benefits amount to now. Taxpayers today have to pay that inflated difference.
I don't understand how it's fair to ring fence one group, and also guarantee them an increase year on year when other groups are being told tough shit, starve! "
Pppssssssssttttt.... It's because 1 set of people are more likely to vote in elections (those darn pensioners) that another...(youngster)
If young people knew that and bothered to mass.. My God would some policy ideas me scrapped quick smart.....
Me personally.. I wouldn't scrap child benefit... But would stop payment on the after the third occasion someone had children ( saves that what happens if someone had twins/triplets/quads question) |
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Isn't it time to do away with NI and simply increase tax. One deduction and that is it?
Benefits payments in their entirety should not be reduced in total, simply those who properly deserve them should be paid more. These should be compassionate payments to those in need but not to maintain lifestyles of those simply in want. Benefits to support the habits of smokers at £7 per packet or those with Sky TV or any other expensive habit is morally wrong. The "won't do's" should not receive more than a basic benefit.
Benefits for those who genuinely do not have enough income to support themselves due to low wages, low pensions, an inability to work (either due to personal incapacity or a shortage of jobs) or a necessity to care for others is not a privilege but is a basic right and must be maintained.
That's me being serious.....now for the real me.....can a nice lady get her tits out for the forum?  |
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"To be honest pensioners are the biggest drain on tge benefits bill. If they didn't have the foresight to plan for old age why should we pick up the bill?
Isn't that what we pay national insurance for every month out our wages?
Of course
I was just trying to get in to the spirit of these benefits threads. Have I gone to far? Should I have played it safe and attacked immigrants or the sick?
Oh gotcha
You do realise people are genuinely agreeing with you don't you
Yeah I know
I'm sick of people attacking the poorest and most vulnerable in society on benefits threads. I naively thought tgat some ridicilouslu outrageous comments might detract from the normal hate fuellwd bile no fan the flames"
I was thinking that was out of character.
You genuinely had me worried there!! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Think the whole benefits system should be completely overhauled. Let's out the feckless and undeserving that hide behind pseudo illness.
Paying benefits to those who are in need of it the most not those who milk it. "
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By *ENDAROOSCouple
over a year ago
South West London / Surrey |
"To be honest pensioners are the biggest drain on tge benefits bill. If they didn't have the foresight to plan for old age why should we pick up the bill?
Isn't that what we pay national insurance for every month out our wages?
Of course
I was just trying to get in to the spirit of these benefits threads. Have I gone to far? Should I have played it safe and attacked immigrants or the sick?
Oh gotcha
You do realise people are genuinely agreeing with you don't you
Yeah I know
I'm sick of people attacking the poorest and most vulnerable in society on benefits threads. I naively thought tgat some ridicilouslu outrageous comments might detract from the normal hate fuellwd bile no fan the flames
I was thinking that was out of character.
You genuinely had me worried there!! "
I'll admit that I had to look twice to check the poster name. |
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By *abioMan
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
"They should put strong contraceptives in alcopops. "
Ooh I am likely this idea.. Sterilise the people for bad taste in alcohol.....
Can we add lambrini, cheap cider, and own brand beers to the list..... |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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So basically poor people have no rights to a family? I get what you're saying in that people should provide for their kids, but until there is a fair monetary system in place then this just isn't possible.
Plus like it's already been pointed out, pensioners take up over 50% of the welfare bill anyway, they're the ones who would make the biggest difference if they had stuff cut. Sorry old people, you worked all your life for nothing if i was PM, i would be old and rich so it wouldn't affect me.
"I've never understood why it exists. Does anyone know the origin of it? "
http://www.revenuebenefits.org.uk/child-benefit/policy/where_it_all_started/ |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"So basically poor people have no rights to a family? I get what you're saying in that people should provide for their kids, but until there is a fair monetary system in place then this just isn't possible. "
Everyone has a right to start a family!!
Just don't expect the State to supplement you with this Benifit anymore!!!!
As for the "poor" why would you bring a child into poverty? |
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"So basically poor people have no rights to a family? I get what you're saying in that people should provide for their kids, but until there is a fair monetary system in place then this just isn't possible.
Everyone has a right to start a family!!
Just don't expect the State to supplement you with this Benifit anymore!!!!
As for the "poor" why would you bring a child into poverty?"
So only rich people can have children? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"So basically poor people have no rights to a family? I get what you're saying in that people should provide for their kids, but until there is a fair monetary system in place then this just isn't possible.
Everyone has a right to start a family!!
Just don't expect the State to supplement you with this Benifit anymore!!!!
As for the "poor" why would you bring a child into poverty?"
Why does poverty exist when there's no need for it to? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I have no children. I already subsidise parents to educate their kids (which I fully support). It does seem entirely wrong (from my selfish perspective) to pay beyond that. I could understand a means tested system but paying because someone has chosen to bring a child into the world? I like roast beef but do not expect anyone else to pay for it. |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"Well we are self employed working hard but we don't make money and we have kids.. So both of us work for ourselves would you stop our child benefiT??."
The question wasn't about taking benifits away from ppl who already had them..
It was asking should a new government say after a certain date stop all new claims for this Benifit.. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"To be honest pensioners are the biggest drain on tge benefits bill. If they didn't have the foresight to plan for old age why should we pick up the bill?"
Haven't the vast majority of them paid NI for most of their adult life and therefore have prepared for their retirement!!!! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"So basically poor people have no rights to a family? I get what you're saying in that people should provide for their kids, but until there is a fair monetary system in place then this just isn't possible.
Everyone has a right to start a family!!
Just don't expect the State to supplement you with this Benifit anymore!!!!
As for the "poor" why would you bring a child into poverty?"
BenEfit not benifit.
Child benefit is £20 a week for the first child and about £13 for subsequent children. It's already means tested so only families under the threshold will receive it. The people that think it's only £20 a week which is pointless may as well get rid of it, those people obviously haven't been on their arse skint and don't know that little £20 could be the difference between that person having gas or electric that week.
As for bringing a child into poverty, accidents can happen with contraception, should that person then be forced to go through the trauma of an abortion just because they aren't earning mega bucks?
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"To be honest pensioners are the biggest drain on tge benefits bill. If they didn't have the foresight to plan for old age why should we pick up the bill?"
Why not go the whole hog an put us down like a dog when we reach 65yrs of age. |
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"So basically poor people have no rights to a family? I get what you're saying in that people should provide for their kids, but until there is a fair monetary system in place then this just isn't possible.
Everyone has a right to start a family!!
Just don't expect the State to supplement you with this Benifit anymore!!!!
As for the "poor" why would you bring a child into poverty?
BenEfit not benifit.
Child benefit is £20 a week for the first child and about £13 for subsequent children. It's already means tested so only families under the threshold will receive it. The people that think it's only £20 a week which is pointless may as well get rid of it, those people obviously haven't been on their arse skint and don't know that little £20 could be the difference between that person having gas or electric that week.
As for bringing a child into poverty, accidents can happen with contraception, should that person then be forced to go through the trauma of an abortion just because they aren't earning mega bucks?
"
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"To be honest pensioners are the biggest drain on tge benefits bill. If they didn't have the foresight to plan for old age why should we pick up the bill?
Why not go the whole hog an put us down like a dog when we reach 65yrs of age."
Having seen what happens in old age and how the state treats some of the most vulnerable elderly people in our society I might just take that as an option! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Yeah but think about the situation. Later on if say me and sassy had a kid but self employed but not earning enough would you still give us child support
I think people on benefits play the system but it's not fair on the people that actually need it... Xxx |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"Yeah but think about the situation. Later on if say me and sassy had a kid but self employed but not earning enough would you still give us child support
I think people on benefits play the system but it's not fair on the people that actually need it... Xxx"
If you were working but not earning enough then wouldn't you be able to claim something like the working families tax credits?
The thing is why do we still give Billions out a year to ppl for there children when its people's choice to have children & they should be able to support them. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Yeah you do but that's no where near enough to pay the bills and feed kids..I think child benefit should be given to help low income families. I also agree the system needs changing but not to affect people that are unemployed through no fault of there own or those that are self employed... I think child benefit shouldn't be given if your unemployed if you have a child until you work etc then if you get made redundant etc then they should be entitled to it etc... We need to protect the people that deserve it.. I hear of. Whole system socks punishing people for no reason... |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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What I mean is if your unemployed and are not pregnant then if you start a family knowing your unemployed then child benefit shouldn't be given... If your working and start a family then became unemployed through no fault of your own then they should get child benefit...
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Yeah but think about the situation. Later on if say me and sassy had a kid but self employed but not earning enough would you still give us child support
I think people on benefits play the system but it's not fair on the people that actually need it... Xxx
If you were working but not earning enough then wouldn't you be able to claim something like the working families tax credits?
The thing is why do we still give Billions out a year to ppl for there children when its people's choice to have children & they should be able to support them."
So you don't mind child and working tax credit being given out but not child benefit? You do know child tax credit can be around £60 a week for a lone parent, working tax credit for lone parents is meant for single parent families to find part time hours to fit around their children and the working tax credit bumps up their earnings to that of someone working full time. You could get £100 a week or more of working tax credit but that's fine yeah you just object to the £20 a week child benefit?
You would need a child benefit reference number to make a claim to tax credits.
We live in a democratic society that's why we give money to those that need it most, we aren't a third world country where it's acceptable for the poorest people to die in the gutters.
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By *arry247Couple
over a year ago
Wakefield |
"To be honest pensioners are the biggest drain on tge benefits bill. If they didn't have the foresight to plan for old age why should we pick up the bill?"
Perhaps you should have the foresight to see that the standard old age pension is in fact being disbanded.
No government can abolish the pension overnight because those at pension age or near pension age will not have time to make other arrangements.
What instead is happening is employers are having to provide a workplace pension scheme for their employees to ensure they are provided for in the future. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Surely you could find someone less worthy of public money than children? The fact that thousands of children live in poverty in such a rich country is a disgrace to remove child benefit would only make it worse. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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How about some form of spelling 'benifit'?
Just a leg puller, lots of people can't spell. Lots of people don't get some things that others may. I get nothing, I earn reasonably well, but then again I should. I have no issues with people's income being topped up to afford them a reasonable living standard if possible. Although, perhaps they should have made better choices and landed a more financially rewarding career? |
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Yay get rid of all benefits, stop all migrant workers send all the illegals back don't forget about the single mothers daaam they have caused some problems in this country or alternatively get a grip and realise you are been fed a load of crap to stop you thinking of the fact, that the rulers of this country are robbing you blind and using any old story that grabs your attention and fools you to believe you have a choice and that you are a valued member of society. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"What I mean is if your unemployed and are not pregnant then if you start a family knowing your unemployed then child benefit shouldn't be given... If your working and start a family then became unemployed through no fault of your own then they should get child benefit...
"
But then you'd have an even worse problem, a woman would steal from a shop, sell her ass or mug someone to fund a drug habit, imagine what a woman would do to enable the survival or herself and her child? Also as I mentioned earlier, accidents can happen with contraception, you can't make people have abortions, neither should they be penalised because of their employment status. The woman could be unemployed but the partner could be working, that same partner could be controlling or have a drink or drugs problem and be reckless with money, that 20 quid child benefit could be all the woman gets to make sure nappies are bought and milk or whatever. |
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By *iewMan
over a year ago
Forum Mod Angus & Findhorn |
As a single man,the thought of contributing to the success of other people's children is a positive one.... now whether the parents spend the money on the child and it's upbringing, or a packets of fags and a bottle of wine. I don't overly worry about that, it is the parents that need to rationalise that in their minds.....
Many will.....
a select few.: No |
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"Surely you could find someone less worthy of public money than children? The fact that thousands of children live in poverty in such a rich country is a disgrace to remove child benefit would only make it worse. "
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Take it away from the children born here,whose families have paid into the coffers for years and send it overseas. There are lots of people abroad having children in poverty and drought stricken countries who need it. Why should we be allowed to have healthy children and they not. |
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"As a single man,the thought of contributing to the success of other people's children is a positive one.... now whether the parents spend the money on the child and it's upbringing, or a packets of fags and a bottle of wine. I don't overly worry about that, it is the parents that need to rationalise that in their minds.....
Many will.....
a select few.: No"
Takes a community to raise a child. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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The thing is,we are in debt because our banks and government got complacent,greedy or whatever they call it. There must be other ways of reducing our outgoings and increasing our income than taking a tenner a week off families. |
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"The thing is,we are in debt because our banks and government got complacent,greedy or whatever they call it. There must be other ways of reducing our outgoings and increasing our income than taking a tenner a week off families. "
There is. Go after the the super rich and (more importantly) the super rich tax dodgers.
Job done. Everyone's happy! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Looking at it from another angle. Poor people who need benefits could be limited to one child,the child would probably not contribute much to society as it gets older;maybe a job as a cleaner or waitress or other menial jobs. Encourage intelligent,rich people to have 2 or more children and populate the country with intelligent,productive human beings. We get the labour force we need from the poor and the money makers from the rich. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Looking at it from another angle. Poor people who need benefits could be limited to one child,the child would probably not contribute much to society as it gets older;maybe a job as a cleaner or waitress or other menial jobs. Encourage intelligent,rich people to have 2 or more children and populate the country with intelligent,productive human beings. We get the labour force we need from the poor and the money makers from the rich. "
This is a piss take comment isn't it? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Looking at it from another angle. Poor people who need benefits could be limited to one child,the child would probably not contribute much to society as it gets older;maybe a job as a cleaner or waitress or other menial jobs. Encourage intelligent,rich people to have 2 or more children and populate the country with intelligent,productive human beings. We get the labour force we need from the poor and the money makers from the rich. "
That's pretty disgusting to be honest! What a horrible world that would be!  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Put the poor children to work in sweat shops,undercut the overseas companies,make our own trainers,jeans etc and no need for child benefit. "
Please be sarcasm as apposed to stupidity lol
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Looking at it from another angle. Poor people who need benefits could be limited to one child,the child would probably not contribute much to society as it gets older;maybe a job as a cleaner or waitress or other menial jobs. Encourage intelligent,rich people to have 2 or more children and populate the country with intelligent,productive human beings. We get the labour force we need from the poor and the money makers from the rich.
This is a piss take comment isn't it?"
Yes,what if it happens though? China did a similar thing. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Put the poor children to work in sweat shops,undercut the overseas companies,make our own trainers,jeans etc and no need for child benefit.
Please be sarcasm as apposed to stupidity lol
"
Lol I'll stop now |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Looking at it from another angle. Poor people who need benefits could be limited to one child,the child would probably not contribute much to society as it gets older;maybe a job as a cleaner or waitress or other menial jobs. Encourage intelligent,rich people to have 2 or more children and populate the country with intelligent,productive human beings. We get the labour force we need from the poor and the money makers from the rich.
This is a piss take comment isn't it?
Yes,what if it happens though? China did a similar thing. "
Not for those reasons though
You can still only have one child in China if you have a good job |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Looking at it from another angle. Poor people who need benefits could be limited to one child,the child would probably not contribute much to society as it gets older;maybe a job as a cleaner or waitress or other menial jobs. Encourage intelligent,rich people to have 2 or more children and populate the country with intelligent,productive human beings. We get the labour force we need from the poor and the money makers from the rich.
That's pretty disgusting to be honest! What a horrible world that would be! "
For the poor who are,let's face it,sub-intelligent,scrounging low lifes according to some people. People with genetic diseases should be sterilised,don't want them passing on them genes that cost a lot to us in medical care do we? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Looking at it from another angle. Poor people who need benefits could be limited to one child,the child would probably not contribute much to society as it gets older;maybe a job as a cleaner or waitress or other menial jobs. Encourage intelligent,rich people to have 2 or more children and populate the country with intelligent,productive human beings. We get the labour force we need from the poor and the money makers from the rich.
This is a piss take comment isn't it?
Yes,what if it happens though? China did a similar thing.
Not for those reasons though
You can still only have one child in China if you have a good job"
I don't know what financial incentives they got but I was under the impression you just didn't get any financial help if you had more than one child. I'm not really that informed about China I'm afraid. Another thread maybe. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Looking at it from another angle. Poor people who need benefits could be limited to one child,the child would probably not contribute much to society as it gets older;maybe a job as a cleaner or waitress or other menial jobs. Encourage intelligent,rich people to have 2 or more children and populate the country with intelligent,productive human beings. We get the labour force we need from the poor and the money makers from the rich.
That's pretty disgusting to be honest! What a horrible world that would be!
For the poor who are,let's face it,sub-intelligent,scrounging low lifes according to some people. People with genetic diseases should be sterilised,don't want them passing on them genes that cost a lot to us in medical care do we? "
I still can't tell if your being serious?  |
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"To be honest pensioners are the biggest drain on tge benefits bill. If they didn't have the foresight to plan for old age why should we pick up the bill?
Isn't that what we pay national insurance for every month out our wages?"
. Yes but a lot of pensioners are currently receiving pensions which are way in excess of the contributions which they have made . It might be better if the government ring fenced the pension element of National Insurance contributions and made pension payments based on the value of contributions actually made . |
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Why not put every teen from the age of thirteen on birth control so there will be no more teen single parent families straight from school on benefits.. when they are able to keep themselves and a child let them come off it.. (tongue in cheek )
When I had my kids you didnt get help on the first child only those after. Another money saver would be to stop paying benefit after 3 so all the people with a dozen kids need to cope themselves maybe..
As just about the only pensioner here I have studied worked and paid my way. Thankfully I wont have to rely on the state but I will take the pension I have paid for and I will continue working.
Hopefully I wont need too much help from the NHS and the kids aready know I am to go to Switzerland if I lose my faculties.. I dont plan on being a burden to anyone.
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"Come May 7th or the day after the next government are going to want to balance the books!!
Now we already have the high earners not receiving this once universal Benifit should the next government say enough is enough?
If you want to have children it's your responsibility to provide for them and we are scrapping child Benifit for all new claimants after say Aptil 1st 2016 that way the Benifit bill goes down each year for the next 18 years & the money saved could be used for keeping open some of the mental health units ?"
. It should be stopped at a maximum of two children. Those who choose to have more than two should be expected to fund them themselves . |
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"So basically poor people have no rights to a family? I get what you're saying in that people should provide for their kids, but until there is a fair monetary system in place then this just isn't possible.
Everyone has a right to start a family!!
Just don't expect the State to supplement you with this Benifit anymore!!!!
As for the "poor" why would you bring a child into poverty?"
if u want a family provide for them. I'm pregnant with my 3rd and we work our butt's off to provide. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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As a single mum of 3 who works full time child benefit is something I rely on. My childcare costs are almost more than I earn and I don't have the luxury of grandparents or family or friends to look after my boys for free.
I refuse to give up on having a career and I dont feel at all bad for claiming the £47 per week benefit.
I've worked dam hard since I was 15. And I pay plenty in tax and NI to fund what I get out of the system.
There are millions like me and cutting a vital benefit will only make poverty worse.
Clearly another idea from some politician who has never had to struggle a day in his life.
As for pensioners. While I agree people should make provisions not everyone can afford to.
Also so many of our senior citizens have contributed to our generation and others in many ways. Why should they be grudged the basic standards of living or access to care services and other benefits.
Perhaps if we stopped bailing out bankers so they can still have a bonus, funding politicians 2nd homes and staff, giving prisoners luxuries in jail or paying for people to enforce all the red tape for people to access the help and services they need. We might be better off.
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By *D40Couple
over a year ago
Wolverhampton |
"To be honest pensioners are the biggest drain on tge benefits bill. If they didn't have the foresight to plan for old age why should we pick up the bill?
Haven't the vast majority of them paid NI for most of their adult life and therefore have prepared for their retirement!!!!"
My OH retires in 7 years unless i get him to go earlier. He works on average 20 hours a week on top of the usual 37.5h week. He pays a fortune in tax & NI and has earned his pension.
Lets cap the benefits of people who dont work, have a new baby every 18months & never paid for a packet of nappies in their life. Yet they have shiny phones & trendy trainers & arent partial to doing a foreigner but wont sign off for that wage.
Lets out the parasites & help those who need it.
For those thinking pensioners shouldnt have a pension just remember these burdens went to war with death facing them daily. They earned not just our respect they earned our loyalty too
Mrs _d40 |
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"But then you'd have an even worse problem, a woman would steal from a shop, sell her ass or mug someone to fund a drug habit, imagine what a woman would do to enable the survival or herself and her child? Also as I mentioned earlier, accidents can happen with contraception, you can't make people have abortions, neither should they be penalised because of their employment status. The woman could be unemployed but the partner could be working, that same partner could be controlling or have a drink or drugs problem and be reckless with money, that 20 quid child benefit could be all the woman gets to make sure nappies are bought and milk or whatever. "
from what im aware/told is that used to happen a long time ago where the father used to control all the money in the household and therefore the child was sent to school in whatever they was sent in
there was outrage at the schools as the school had to have basic uniforms, mothers made it very clear not in there name so couldnt afford to clothe them as the d*unk father was in the pub with the money
hence the reason why the women are paid the child benefit as they was the homemaker and had to make the children where school uniform for school
further more the women complained that they needed the child payment for the first child no the second as the first child stuff would pass to the second child
hence why it changed in 1977 |
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By *andS66Couple
over a year ago
Derby |
"To be honest pensioners are the biggest drain on tge benefits bill. If they didn't have the foresight to plan for old age why should we pick up the bill?"
Because they've worked and paid into the system all their lives... the people we shouldn't be picking up any bills for are those that have never worked or immigrants that haven't paid enough in. They're the real drain on society. And those in prison should have to do something for their 'keep'. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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A lot of pensioners haven't had it that hard though have they, and there's not many younger generations that will have it as good as the old dears do now. |
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"
For those thinking pensioners shouldnt have a pension just remember these burdens went to war with death facing them daily. They earned not just our respect they earned our loyalty too
Mrs _d40"
Anyone under the age of 85 (as the vast majority of pensioners will be) did not 'go to war with death facing them daily'. |
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"
Because they've worked and paid into the system all their lives... "
But how much have they paid?
In 1980 the average salary was about £6,000.
Most people don't even earn the national average salary.
But if we take the 1980 figure to show average earnings for 10 years between 1975 to 1985 and we factor in 10% NIC then in that 10 years they would pay what they claim now in just 1 year of state pension and benefits.
It is inflated well beyond what the average person would have paid and that difference is paid by taxpayers today.
Whether you think it's right or wrong, most pensioners, pound for pound, get out far more than they've paid in. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Pensioners have worked all their lives paying into NI , this is only them getting back what they put in. Many people that are now pensioners only thought that profesional white collar workers would pay into private pensions. Nowadays I however agree that everyone working should be paying into a private pension so that years to come they do not depend on the state in years to come.
There are too many professional dole hackers out there that think that its their right to get all the benefits they can grab and have a so many kids to add to the problem. Its everyone's human right to have kids BUT its not right having more then say 2 or 3 kids without getting some type of job to support them!!. That's not fair on people that work and have to pay a fortune in child care costs.
I admire people that take up jobs that are maybe not the best paid and getting top ups from the government. At least they are trying.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"
Because they've worked and paid into the system all their lives...
But how much have they paid?
In 1980 the average salary was about £6,000.
Most people don't even earn the national average salary.
But if we take the 1980 figure to show average earnings for 10 years between 1975 to 1985 and we factor in 10% NIC then in that 10 years they would pay what they claim now in just 1 year of state pension and benefits.
It is inflated well beyond what the average person would have paid and that difference is paid by taxpayers today.
Whether you think it's right or wrong, most pensioners, pound for pound, get out far more than they've paid in. "
Let me ask you a question picture this
Your gran aged 80. Didn't work as stayed at home with the children. Your grandad god love him worked but didn't earn a lot . He passed away 5 years ago. Your gran doesn't have savings as they were used for his funeral. She gets her state pension and a little bit of help around her house. However 8th of May she's told it's being taken away.
How do you feel about that?
Where would it leave her?
So many say they drain resources but they are vulnerable and we should be proud to be a country who ensures they are not ignored .
That's the reality. It's life for millions of people all over the UK. Not sure any policy maker or some of the judgemental people on this thread are aware of it. So long as they are okay and seen as right.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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£20..really? Nappies, clothes, the list is endless.
This country needs to get up the arse of runaway fathers that pay fuck all.
I know what comes before my daughter with her father.
Beer 
Her |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"
Because they've worked and paid into the system all their lives...
But how much have they paid?
In 1980 the average salary was about £6,000.
Most people don't even earn the national average salary.
But if we take the 1980 figure to show average earnings for 10 years between 1975 to 1985 and we factor in 10% NIC then in that 10 years they would pay what they claim now in just 1 year of state pension and benefits.
It is inflated well beyond what the average person would have paid and that difference is paid by taxpayers today.
Whether you think it's right or wrong, most pensioners, pound for pound, get out far more than they've paid in.
Let me ask you a question picture this
Your gran aged 80. Didn't work as stayed at home with the children. Your grandad god love him worked but didn't earn a lot . He passed away 5 years ago. Your gran doesn't have savings as they were used for his funeral. She gets her state pension and a little bit of help around her house. However 8th of May she's told it's being taken away.
How do you feel about that?
Where would it leave her?
So many say they drain resources but they are vulnerable and we should be proud to be a country who ensures they are not ignored .
That's the reality. It's life for millions of people all over the UK. Not sure any policy maker or some of the judgemental people on this thread are aware of it. So long as they are okay and seen as right.
"
Bang on there Girl
People seem to forget that the Pension situation was fucked up by the Government and local Authorities being sucked in by high yield hi risk investments..Think Icelandic.
As for Child Benefit yes lets stop it and put the Money to better use such as Propping up the Euro and paying Quangos unfathomable millions to tell us where we are going wrong and wasting the Money.
Yup that will work.
Gimp |
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"
Because they've worked and paid into the system all their lives...
But how much have they paid?
In 1980 the average salary was about £6,000.
Most people don't even earn the national average salary.
But if we take the 1980 figure to show average earnings for 10 years between 1975 to 1985 and we factor in 10% NIC then in that 10 years they would pay what they claim now in just 1 year of state pension and benefits.
It is inflated well beyond what the average person would have paid and that difference is paid by taxpayers today.
Whether you think it's right or wrong, most pensioners, pound for pound, get out far more than they've paid in.
Let me ask you a question picture this
Your gran aged 80. Didn't work as stayed at home with the children. Your grandad god love him worked but didn't earn a lot . He passed away 5 years ago. Your gran doesn't have savings as they were used for his funeral. She gets her state pension and a little bit of help around her house. However 8th of May she's told it's being taken away.
How do you feel about that?
Where would it leave her?
So many say they drain resources but they are vulnerable and we should be proud to be a country who ensures they are not ignored .
That's the reality. It's life for millions of people all over the UK. Not sure any policy maker or some of the judgemental people on this thread are aware of it. So long as they are okay and seen as right.
"
Firstly - you're assuming every pensioner is vulnerable - I don't buy that argument.
Secondly - you're assuming I want to take away the pension of anyone who hasn't contributed, which I didn't say and don't endorse.
Thirdly - my posts were alluding to the double standard currently being used in the discourse around benefits and social security.
If the current thinking is that feckless people are those who have not contributed to the system yet take from it then the pensioner in your example matches that description.
Now populist discussion has revolved around the fact that people who take without not paying in are scroungers and that their benefits should be reduced or stopped altogether.
In what way does that 80 year old granny differ from someone on the sick with mental health issues? Both haven't been paying into the system but receiving from it. Yet one of them is derided and demagogued, had their income reduced and likely reduced further - yet the other keeps getting increases.
Now both are vulnerable, both are taking out more than they've put in, both have bills to pay and food to buy.
So why is one judged to a different standard than the other?
My comments were not that pensioners are the bane of socialism. My point is that it's hard to have a policy described as 'fair' when one group is judged to a different standard, and treated more favourably than another.
And pensioners provide the best evidence of that point for want of a better example.
 |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I've never understood why it exists. Does anyone know the origin of it? "
Because if you don't give it thwm they still get pregnant but then parade through the papers blaming everyone that thier child is starving |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"To be honest pensioners are the biggest drain on tge benefits bill. If they didn't have the foresight to plan for old age why should we pick up the bill?"
They did have the fore sight they planned through the state pension that was promised to them.
The fact that it was unsustainable is not the fault of the pensioners but rhe government for continuing to promise unrealistic things an keep shunting the bill down the line.
One key thing though is pensioners vote young people do not hence pensioners get catered.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Weed out the parasites and immigrants, stop all their payments, don't let anymore in the country, and then introduce Australian rules. Oh, and while I'm ranting, those that want to go and fight for IS, carry on. But take their passport off them as they leave. UKIP!! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Weed out the parasites and immigrants, stop all their payments, don't let anymore in the country, and then introduce Australian rules. Oh, and while I'm ranting, those that want to go and fight for IS, carry on. But take their passport off them as they leave. UKIP!! "
The majority of immigrants are net contributors the majority of people born here are net receivers.
So if you boot out the "parasites" you'll mostly be kicking out the working class British folk. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Final salary pensions,
Student grants not loans,
Zero tuition fees,
Affordable housing for those that bought (and has now tripled in value through no responsibility of the owner)
Secure council tenancies for those that didn't (and available to buy at huge discounts),
Plentiful supply of jobs (before they were all exported to China),
I'm a firm believer in every citizen being able to live in decency but looking back it's hard to see any retirees between 65 and 80 as the sacred cow that should be put on a pedestal.
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"Weed out the parasites and immigrants, stop all their payments, don't let anymore in the country, and then introduce Australian rules. Oh, and while I'm ranting, those that want to go and fight for IS, carry on. But take their passport off them as they leave. UKIP!!
The majority of immigrants are net contributors the majority of people born here are net receivers.
So if you boot out the "parasites" you'll mostly be kicking out the working class British folk."
Some people have a weird morphed version of Stockholm Syndrome - they exist in a different reality. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Weed out the parasites and immigrants, stop all their payments, don't let anymore in the country, and then introduce Australian rules. Oh, and while I'm ranting, those that want to go and fight for IS, carry on. But take their passport off them as they leave. UKIP!!
The majority of immigrants are net contributors the majority of people born here are net receivers.
So if you boot out the "parasites" you'll mostly be kicking out the working class British folk.
Some people have a weird morphed version of Stockholm Syndrome - they exist in a different reality. "
Are you saying immigrants are holding us hostage? |
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"
I'm a firm believer in every citizen being able to live in decency but looking back it's hard to see any retirees between 65 and 80 as the sacred cow that should be put on a pedestal.
"
They're the sacred cows that vote! |
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"Weed out the parasites and immigrants, stop all their payments, don't let anymore in the country, and then introduce Australian rules. Oh, and while I'm ranting, those that want to go and fight for IS, carry on. But take their passport off them as they leave. UKIP!!
The majority of immigrants are net contributors the majority of people born here are net receivers.
So if you boot out the "parasites" you'll mostly be kicking out the working class British folk.
Some people have a weird morphed version of Stockholm Syndrome - they exist in a different reality.
Are you saying immigrants are holding us hostage? "
I think there are those who feel the country is being held hostage or exploited by immigrants yeah.
That's why I said morphed version of SS, not literal SS. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Weed out the parasites and immigrants, stop all their payments, don't let anymore in the country, and then introduce Australian rules. Oh, and while I'm ranting, those that want to go and fight for IS, carry on. But take their passport off them as they leave. UKIP!!
The majority of immigrants are net contributors the majority of people born here are net receivers.
So if you boot out the "parasites" you'll mostly be kicking out the working class British folk.
Some people have a weird morphed version of Stockholm Syndrome - they exist in a different reality.
Are you saying immigrants are holding us hostage?
I think there are those who feel the country is being held hostage or exploited by immigrants yeah.
That's why I said morphed version of SS, not literal SS. "
But if they had Ss or anything like it they'd like the immigrants |
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"Weed out the parasites and immigrants, stop all their payments, don't let anymore in the country, and then introduce Australian rules. Oh, and while I'm ranting, those that want to go and fight for IS, carry on. But take their passport off them as they leave. UKIP!!
The majority of immigrants are net contributors the majority of people born here are net receivers.
So if you boot out the "parasites" you'll mostly be kicking out the working class British folk.
Some people have a weird morphed version of Stockholm Syndrome - they exist in a different reality.
Are you saying immigrants are holding us hostage?
I think there are those who feel the country is being held hostage or exploited by immigrants yeah.
That's why I said morphed version of SS, not literal SS.
But if they had Ss or anything like it they'd like the immigrants"
That's why I said weird and morphed. Loving the extra revenue but hating how it comes to be.
Get illogical Mr. |
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By *andS66Couple
over a year ago
Derby |
"
Because they've worked and paid into the system all their lives...
But how much have they paid?
In 1980 the average salary was about £6,000.
Most people don't even earn the national average salary.
But if we take the 1980 figure to show average earnings for 10 years between 1975 to 1985 and we factor in 10% NIC then in that 10 years they would pay what they claim now in just 1 year of state pension and benefits.
It is inflated well beyond what the average person would have paid and that difference is paid by taxpayers today.
Whether you think it's right or wrong, most pensioners, pound for pound, get out far more than they've paid in. "
I take it you'll be refusing to take your state pension when it's your time then? |
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By *er himWoman
over a year ago
Essex |
Make the minimum wage the living wage then you wouldn't need in work benefits which is a large proportion of the benefits bill. What are in work benefits, just a hidden subsidy for the business owners. If they can't make a business profitable then it should go to the wall. But too many are creaming off millions to line the pockets of a few instead of creating true employment. We can thank Thatcher for starting the widening of the gap of rich and poor. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Take it away from the children born here,whose families have paid into the coffers for years and send it overseas. There are lots of people abroad having children in poverty and drought stricken countries who need it. Why should we be allowed to have healthy children and they not. "
Because there not born in the UK and haven't paid NI. Let there government sort it out!!! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"
Because they've worked and paid into the system all their lives...
But how much have they paid?
In 1980 the average salary was about £6,000.
Most people don't even earn the national average salary.
But if we take the 1980 figure to show average earnings for 10 years between 1975 to 1985 and we factor in 10% NIC then in that 10 years they would pay what they claim now in just 1 year of state pension and benefits.
It is inflated well beyond what the average person would have paid and that difference is paid by taxpayers today.
Whether you think it's right or wrong, most pensioners, pound for pound, get out far more than they've paid in.
I take it you'll be refusing to take your state pension when it's your time then?"
I very much doubt there will be a state pension by the time I can collect it |
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"There are still final salary pensions now..."
. Yes but now very rare in the private sector . Those in the public sector are unfunded and merelypaid ffrom taxes . Most private sector pension schemes are now defined contribution as opposed to defined benefit .
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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There are loads of people with lagitment disabilities physical and mental.These people need government help and that's why the system was set up.
There is another group of people that would love a job but cannot find one. They are proactive trying to get one. Fair enough.
There then is a underclass of professional dole hackers that want to follow in the family tradition of not wanting to work and think the silly people are ones that do work.
These are the type of people that need to be sort out.
I work hard but find it ironic that last 3 second hand cars that I bought are hand me downs from the mobility scheme.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I haven't read the thread because I imagine its full of the usual depressing shit. I think it should be phased out. There is no reason people who can afford to should be given money for having children. And if they can't afford it, they can be supported (if they need it) elsewhere in the benefits system.
If people on decent incomes have come to rely on child benefit, that's clearly a sign that things like childcare costs and housing costs are out of control and bunging people a few quid a week to help them pay an overinflated price seems a ludicrous way of trying to deal with that. |
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"
Because they've worked and paid into the system all their lives...
But how much have they paid?
In 1980 the average salary was about £6,000.
Most people don't even earn the national average salary.
But if we take the 1980 figure to show average earnings for 10 years between 1975 to 1985 and we factor in 10% NIC then in that 10 years they would pay what they claim now in just 1 year of state pension and benefits.
It is inflated well beyond what the average person would have paid and that difference is paid by taxpayers today.
Whether you think it's right or wrong, most pensioners, pound for pound, get out far more than they've paid in.
I take it you'll be refusing to take your state pension when it's your time then?"
If I were suggesting that people should, then of course I'd do the same myself, but I didn't say that, that's just your imagination.
However I would be expecting to take my fair share of the cuts. I wouldn't expect them to touch everyone but not myself. |
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"To be honest pensioners are the biggest drain on tge benefits bill. If they didn't have the foresight to plan for old age why should we pick up the bill?"
excuse me we did plan for old age it is called national insurance which we have paid in to all our working lives, this was set up to provide a pension which is what we are claiming not a free give away by the government |
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