FabSwingers.com > Forums > The Lounge > The Pope and contraception
The Pope and contraception
Jump to: Newest in thread
| |||
| |||
| |||
| |||
"Should the Catholic church review its stance on contraception? Should sex merely be a means to having children as currently taught. Is there any justification for the current Catholic position? " I like to be able to understand a question is 10 seconds flat. These posts should be banned.... **My head hurts***  | |||
"Should the Catholic church review its stance on contraception? Should sex merely be a means to having children as currently taught. Is there any justification for the current Catholic position? I like to be able to understand a question is 10 seconds flat. These posts should be banned.... **My head hurts*** "Catholics should be banned. There, reduced it to two seconds for you. | |||
"Should the Catholic church review its stance on contraception? Should sex merely be a means to having children as currently taught. Is there any justification for the current Catholic position? I like to be able to understand a question is 10 seconds flat. These posts should be banned.... **My head hurts***
Catholics should be banned.
There, reduced it to two seconds for you. "My nan would promptly batter you if she read that...  | |||
"Should the Catholic church review its stance on contraception? Should sex merely be a means to having children as currently taught. Is there any justification for the current Catholic position? I like to be able to understand a question is 10 seconds flat. These posts should be banned.... **My head hurts***
Catholics should be banned.
There, reduced it to two seconds for you.
My nan would promptly batter you if she read that..."Sorry, never knew your nan was Scottish.  | |||
"Should the Catholic church review its stance on contraception? Should sex merely be a means to having children as currently taught. Is there any justification for the current Catholic position? I like to be able to understand a question is 10 seconds flat. These posts should be banned.... **My head hurts***
Catholics should be banned.
There, reduced it to two seconds for you.
My nan would promptly batter you if she read that...
Sorry, never knew your nan was Scottish. "She is/They are..my Nan and grandad on my mums side live In Edinburgh... Omg! If only I could show my nan this thread but I can't because I'm on a fucking fuck site and that would be so baaaaaad and I'd be so in huge trouble that I can't! GAH!... | |||
| |||
" Is there any justification for the current Catholic position? " Quite partial to a bit missionary myself  | |||
"Not sure the Catholic Church bans condoms but contraception and that's weird and they totally need to do something about that " Not allowed to interfere with the act of procreation, so no contraception. I know loads of catholics who do use contraception though and don't care because they do wanna have sex and don't want any more kids. Not sure about the condoms myself now i remember the new pope said something about them but can't remember what. He seems pretty open minded though so is probably for them. | |||
| |||
| |||
 | |||
| |||
"Shouldn't the real question be: Should people who never have sex be telling people that do have sex how to have sex? "Precisely. The attitude to sex is greatly misunderstood by Catholicism and has caused serious problems for the church. Recruitment for the priesthood is at an all time low. One reason for this is the ban on priests marrying. This is based on part of the bible which something like 'you should only have love in your heart for God'. The original Hebrew had many different words for the translated 'love' and did not confuse sexual love with the love you should have for God. No contraception and 'sex only to make babies' is an example of the control the Catholic Church has tried to exert on the masses. Sex is a wonderful gift from God. | |||
| |||
| |||
"He isn't telling them how to have sex exactly, he's telling them how to behave according to Gods natural law. Sex produces babies, therefore sex is for making babies, God told mankind to multiply. Contraception interrupts that process. Simple really. Bit too simple for these days though." A very good post. Do you think God's natural law indoctrinated 2000 years ago and manipulated throughout the middle ages ever took into account a world population of over 10 billion that is threatening to destroy God's greatest creation? I suspect not! I wonder if the Pope and Catholicism would benefit from some modern thinking, or as the huge numbers attending mass in the Phillipines has shown, maybe a continued hard stance and an advocation of abstinence should continue to be the teaching. | |||
| |||
"Without passing judgement on any religion, bear in mind that all monotheistic religious teachings are considered the word of god, as recorded by man. Human languages, when translated from say Hebrew to latin to English will take on a differing interpretation. Most religions selling point is that they are THE true religion, and you have a better chance of a happy afterlife by following their doctrine. Sex outside of marriage, sex before marriage, recreational sex, homosexuality, all considered sins. Sin and you must repent. Religions have power through numbers. Historically,to marry someone of a chosen faith normally involves conversion to that faith and the assertion that your children will be brought up in that faith. Finally, when a lot of these rules were made, religions held more sway. People died younger and children did not often survive. If you find the teaching of your chosen faith do not suit your needs, either change your faith or abandon it completely. As for the clowns who state I don't use condoms cos I is Catholic, sex outside of a monogamous marriage is a sin so you are off to hell anyway! " There is no doubt that under most religions we are all on here going to a bad place in the afterlife should it exist! At least with Catholicism you get the chance to confess all at the end and get forgiven! Given that maybe the church should think about its stance | |||
| |||
| |||
"I think as a civilised and intelligent species it's about time we abandoned all nonsense and started looking after ourselves and our planet. "  as a Catholic I do find the concept of commiting a mortal sin while being a responsible human being something of a contradiction. | |||
 | |||
"Should the Catholic church review its stance on contraception? Should sex merely be a means to having children as currently taught. Is there any justification for the current Catholic position? I like to be able to understand a question is 10 seconds flat. These posts should be banned.... **My head hurts***
Catholics should be banned.
There, reduced it to two seconds for you. "All religions should be banned. Mankind should have moved way beyond this midaevil mumbo jumbo. | |||
| |||
"I used to have hope for humanity. It was said that there were three ages of man. Magic, religion and science. I thought we were coming out of the religious phase. A large proportion of the world seems intent on staying in it, and trying to drag other people backwards with them." So does that mean Penn and Teller have to hang up their chainsaws?  | |||
"I used to have hope for humanity. It was said that there were three ages of man. Magic, religion and science. I thought we were coming out of the religious phase. A large proportion of the world seems intent on staying in it, and trying to drag other people backwards with them." . I feel your pain.. I'm off to peston, end of the month for the Lancashire council decision. | |||
"I used to have hope for humanity. It was said that there were three ages of man. Magic, religion and science. I thought we were coming out of the religious phase. A large proportion of the world seems intent on staying in it, and trying to drag other people backwards with them. So does that mean Penn and Teller have to hang up their chainsaws? "At least they're atheists! Not like Jesus with that bottle trick that Tommy Cooper did so well. | |||
| |||
"He isn't telling them how to have sex exactly, he's telling them how to behave according to Gods natural law. Sex produces babies, therefore sex is for making babies, God told mankind to multiply. Contraception interrupts that process. Simple really. Bit too simple for these days though. A very good post. Do you think God's natural law indoctrinated 2000 years ago and manipulated throughout the middle ages ever took into account a world population of over 10 billion that is threatening to destroy God's greatest creation? I suspect not! I wonder if the Pope and Catholicism would benefit from some modern thinking, or as the huge numbers attending mass in the Phillipines has shown, maybe a continued hard stance and an advocation of abstinence should continue to be the teaching." We aren't really overpopulated (believe it or not, it's just some of us are using too many resources (mainly the wealthier parts of the world). But i do think it's outdated overall, and there are many counter arguments that also make sense and work under other natural laws. Things can contradict each other can make sense too. I mean it does make perfect sense that you should only have sex with the intention of making a baby because every time you have sex you risk making a baby (if you're fertile) even in this day and age, but contraception works for the majority of people so most people won't make one and you're the unlucky one if you accidently did make one. Do people have sex and think to themselves every time "i might make a baby this time, maybe i shouldn't do it?" nope, if their contraception has been reliable so far then of course they're going go off their own experience that it's unlikely they will, or they won't even think about it all. I almost agree it probably is so that more children are born to that religion, there are more followers, more of an army when needed. Until you see the law says that you should abstain when not wanting to make one. But seeing as wanking is also a sin it does look like they are trying to force people to fulfil their urges with sex. I've no doubt these people do think in modern terms, they just have their morals and beliefs held from a time where morals were being worked out to organise more controllable people. And i do think it has political undertones, which is why churches don't have to pay taxes. | |||
| |||
"He isn't telling them how to have sex exactly, he's telling them how to behave according to Gods natural law. Sex produces babies, therefore sex is for making babies, God told mankind to multiply. Contraception interrupts that process. Simple really. Bit too simple for these days though. A very good post. Do you think God's natural law indoctrinated 2000 years ago and manipulated throughout the middle ages ever took into account a world population of over 10 billion that is threatening to destroy God's greatest creation? I suspect not! I wonder if the Pope and Catholicism would benefit from some modern thinking, or as the huge numbers attending mass in the Phillipines has shown, maybe a continued hard stance and an advocation of abstinence should continue to be the teaching. We aren't really overpopulated (believe it or not, it's just some of us are using too many resources (mainly the wealthier parts of the world). But i do think it's outdated overall, and there are many counter arguments that also make sense and work under other natural laws. Things can contradict each other can make sense too. I mean it does make perfect sense that you should only have sex with the intention of making a baby because every time you have sex you risk making a baby (if you're fertile) even in this day and age, but contraception works for the majority of people so most people won't make one and you're the unlucky one if you accidently did make one. Do people have sex and think to themselves every time "i might make a baby this time, maybe i shouldn't do it?" nope, if their contraception has been reliable so far then of course they're going go off their own experience that it's unlikely they will, or they won't even think about it all. I almost agree it probably is so that more children are born to that religion, there are more followers, more of an army when needed. Until you see the law says that you should abstain when not wanting to make one. But seeing as wanking is also a sin it does look like they are trying to force people to fulfil their urges with sex. I've no doubt these people do think in modern terms, they just have their morals and beliefs held from a time where morals were being worked out to organise more controllable people. And i do think it has political undertones, which is why churches don't have to pay taxes." .. Just one problem with that post. Were completely over populated, and have no sense of controlling it, it's growing exponentially and will until either we control it or outside factors will. The outside factor will not be nice!. | |||
"He isn't telling them how to have sex exactly, he's telling them how to behave according to Gods natural law. Sex produces babies, therefore sex is for making babies, God told mankind to multiply. Contraception interrupts that process. Simple really. Bit too simple for these days though. A very good post. Do you think God's natural law indoctrinated 2000 years ago and manipulated throughout the middle ages ever took into account a world population of over 10 billion that is threatening to destroy God's greatest creation? I suspect not! I wonder if the Pope and Catholicism would benefit from some modern thinking, or as the huge numbers attending mass in the Phillipines has shown, maybe a continued hard stance and an advocation of abstinence should continue to be the teaching. We aren't really overpopulated (believe it or not, it's just some of us are using too many resources (mainly the wealthier parts of the world). But i do think it's outdated overall, and there are many counter arguments that also make sense and work under other natural laws. Things can contradict each other can make sense too. I mean it does make perfect sense that you should only have sex with the intention of making a baby because every time you have sex you risk making a baby (if you're fertile) even in this day and age, but contraception works for the majority of people so most people won't make one and you're the unlucky one if you accidently did make one. Do people have sex and think to themselves every time "i might make a baby this time, maybe i shouldn't do it?" nope, if their contraception has been reliable so far then of course they're going go off their own experience that it's unlikely they will, or they won't even think about it all. I almost agree it probably is so that more children are born to that religion, there are more followers, more of an army when needed. Until you see the law says that you should abstain when not wanting to make one. But seeing as wanking is also a sin it does look like they are trying to force people to fulfil their urges with sex. I've no doubt these people do think in modern terms, they just have their morals and beliefs held from a time where morals were being worked out to organise more controllable people. And i do think it has political undertones, which is why churches don't have to pay taxes... Just one problem with that post. Were completely over populated, and have no sense of controlling it, it's growing exponentially and will until either we control it or outside factors will. The outside factor will not be nice!. " It might not be nice but it will be natural, and therefore, Gods law... We aren't over populated, we can (with the right procedures) sustain all the people alive right now, we just need to get on top of resources, economy, and individual over-consumption. As well as stop certain companies destroying environments and making them uninhabitable. I think we would lose a lot of luxuries in the process and that's why it hasn't happened fully yet. | |||
"He isn't telling them how to have sex exactly, he's telling them how to behave according to Gods natural law. Sex produces babies, therefore sex is for making babies, God told mankind to multiply. Contraception interrupts that process. Simple really. Bit too simple for these days though. A very good post. Do you think God's natural law indoctrinated 2000 years ago and manipulated throughout the middle ages ever took into account a world population of over 10 billion that is threatening to destroy God's greatest creation? I suspect not! I wonder if the Pope and Catholicism would benefit from some modern thinking, or as the huge numbers attending mass in the Phillipines has shown, maybe a continued hard stance and an advocation of abstinence should continue to be the teaching. We aren't really overpopulated (believe it or not, it's just some of us are using too many resources (mainly the wealthier parts of the world). But i do think it's outdated overall, and there are many counter arguments that also make sense and work under other natural laws. Things can contradict each other can make sense too. I mean it does make perfect sense that you should only have sex with the intention of making a baby because every time you have sex you risk making a baby (if you're fertile) even in this day and age, but contraception works for the majority of people so most people won't make one and you're the unlucky one if you accidently did make one. Do people have sex and think to themselves every time "i might make a baby this time, maybe i shouldn't do it?" nope, if their contraception has been reliable so far then of course they're going go off their own experience that it's unlikely they will, or they won't even think about it all. I almost agree it probably is so that more children are born to that religion, there are more followers, more of an army when needed. Until you see the law says that you should abstain when not wanting to make one. But seeing as wanking is also a sin it does look like they are trying to force people to fulfil their urges with sex. I've no doubt these people do think in modern terms, they just have their morals and beliefs held from a time where morals were being worked out to organise more controllable people. And i do think it has political undertones, which is why churches don't have to pay taxes... Just one problem with that post. Were completely over populated, and have no sense of controlling it, it's growing exponentially and will until either we control it or outside factors will. The outside factor will not be nice!. It might not be nice but it will be natural, and therefore, Gods law... We aren't over populated, we can (with the right procedures) sustain all the people alive right now, we just need to get on top of resources, economy, and individual over-consumption. As well as stop certain companies destroying environments and making them uninhabitable. I think we would lose a lot of luxuries in the process and that's why it hasn't happened fully yet." . Depends on your criteria. Do you want to give all 7 billion your standard of living, fridge, car, electric, heating, carpet. Etc etc. If so, there isn't a hope in hell regardless of taking stuff away from wealthy people. Do you happen to know what the difference in birth rate is from 1 billion to 7 billion? How many extra mouths do you have to feed every year!. Natural species decline happens all the time , it's never "gods will" usually humans fault and rarely comes in a nice form. Were great at seeing the reasons for species control unless it's us. | |||
| |||
" The Romans used animal intestines as condoms. " The Greeks used Mars bar wrappers, king-size ones obviously as they liked to show off | |||
"my friend who was in her 60s was a catholic, used to go to church twice a week, she used birth control. she said she couldn't afford to keep having them she had 3 kids." I suspect the vast majority of Catholics in the west use similar common sense, even if the Pope thinks we will suffer eternal damnation as a result!  | |||
"Depends on your criteria. Do you want to give all 7 billion your standard of living, fridge, car, electric, heating, carpet. Etc etc. If so, there isn't a hope in hell regardless of taking stuff away from wealthy people. Do you happen to know what the difference in birth rate is from 1 billion to 7 billion? How many extra mouths do you have to feed every year!. Natural species decline happens all the time , it's never "gods will" usually humans fault and rarely comes in a nice form. Were great at seeing the reasons for species control unless it's us." Lot of claims made here but nothing to back them up? | |||
"Depends on your criteria. Do you want to give all 7 billion your standard of living, fridge, car, electric, heating, carpet. Etc etc. If so, there isn't a hope in hell regardless of taking stuff away from wealthy people. Do you happen to know what the difference in birth rate is from 1 billion to 7 billion? How many extra mouths do you have to feed every year!. Natural species decline happens all the time , it's never "gods will" usually humans fault and rarely comes in a nice form. Were great at seeing the reasons for species control unless it's us. Lot of claims made here but nothing to back them up?" .Lol are you kidding me, there's been shit loads of studies from every reputable university in the world. I certainly ain't spending an hour of my time looking them up for you. http://m.worldometers.info/world-population/ So today just till 2pm were at 140,000 extra mouths.. From January the 1st were at 4 million extra mouths... Have you Any idea about how many extra resources year on year it takes to feed, let alone house... Of course this extra resources would need to be found by humans, unless you can get God to throw a bit of extra copper or wheat down.... | |||
| |||
"Depends on your criteria. Do you want to give all 7 billion your standard of living, fridge, car, electric, heating, carpet. Etc etc. If so, there isn't a hope in hell regardless of taking stuff away from wealthy people. Do you happen to know what the difference in birth rate is from 1 billion to 7 billion? How many extra mouths do you have to feed every year!. Natural species decline happens all the time , it's never "gods will" usually humans fault and rarely comes in a nice form. Were great at seeing the reasons for species control unless it's us. Lot of claims made here but nothing to back them up?.Lol are you kidding me, there's been shit loads of studies from every reputable university in the world. I certainly ain't spending an hour of my time looking them up for you. http://m.worldometers.info/world-population/ So today just till 2pm were at 140,000 extra mouths.. From January the 1st were at 4 million extra mouths... Have you Any idea about how many extra resources year on year it takes to feed, let alone house... Of course this extra resources would need to be found by humans, unless you can get God to throw a bit of extra copper or wheat down.... "Birth rate isn't the issue. Death rate is. In the days before medicine, populations maintained a balance through natural means. Life was short. If famine, drought, or war didn't kill you, disease would. | |||
"Depends on your criteria. Do you want to give all 7 billion your standard of living, fridge, car, electric, heating, carpet. Etc etc. If so, there isn't a hope in hell regardless of taking stuff away from wealthy people. Do you happen to know what the difference in birth rate is from 1 billion to 7 billion? How many extra mouths do you have to feed every year!. Natural species decline happens all the time , it's never "gods will" usually humans fault and rarely comes in a nice form. Were great at seeing the reasons for species control unless it's us. Lot of claims made here but nothing to back them up?.Lol are you kidding me, there's been shit loads of studies from every reputable university in the world. I certainly ain't spending an hour of my time looking them up for you. http://m.worldometers.info/world-population/ So today just till 2pm were at 140,000 extra mouths.. From January the 1st were at 4 million extra mouths... Have you Any idea about how many extra resources year on year it takes to feed, let alone house... Of course this extra resources would need to be found by humans, unless you can get God to throw a bit of extra copper or wheat down....
Birth rate isn't the issue. Death rate is.
In the days before medicine, populations maintained a balance through natural means. Life was short.
If famine, drought, or war didn't kill you, disease would.". That's not birth rate I quoted, that was population growth, it's about 220,000 a day. | |||
"Depends on your criteria. Do you want to give all 7 billion your standard of living, fridge, car, electric, heating, carpet. Etc etc. If so, there isn't a hope in hell regardless of taking stuff away from wealthy people. Do you happen to know what the difference in birth rate is from 1 billion to 7 billion? How many extra mouths do you have to feed every year!. Natural species decline happens all the time , it's never "gods will" usually humans fault and rarely comes in a nice form. Were great at seeing the reasons for species control unless it's us. Lot of claims made here but nothing to back them up?.Lol are you kidding me, there's been shit loads of studies from every reputable university in the world. I certainly ain't spending an hour of my time looking them up for you. http://m.worldometers.info/world-population/ So today just till 2pm were at 140,000 extra mouths.. From January the 1st were at 4 million extra mouths... Have you Any idea about how many extra resources year on year it takes to feed, let alone house... Of course this extra resources would need to be found by humans, unless you can get God to throw a bit of extra copper or wheat down....
Birth rate isn't the issue. Death rate is.
In the days before medicine, populations maintained a balance through natural means. Life was short.
If famine, drought, or war didn't kill you, disease would."Population grew from between 200m-400m in 1AD to about 1.5bn in 1900. So about a 1 billion population growth in nearly 2000 years. Between 1900-2050 the population is forecast to grow from 1.5bn to 9.5bn. So an 8 billion population growth in about 150 years. That is because more people are being born than dying. Simple maths really. | |||
| |||
"my friend who was in her 60s was a catholic, used to go to church twice a week, she used birth control. she said she couldn't afford to keep having them she had 3 kids. I suspect the vast majority of Catholics in the west use similar common sense, even if the Pope thinks we will suffer eternal damnation as a result! "This applies to most of the teachings of the Catholic Church. Go to a Catholic church in Britain and you'll likely find divorced people, people in openly gay relationships and people who use contraception all getting on together just fine and ignoring the pope most of the time. | |||
"my friend who was in her 60s was a catholic, used to go to church twice a week, she used birth control. she said she couldn't afford to keep having them she had 3 kids. I suspect the vast majority of Catholics in the west use similar common sense, even if the Pope thinks we will suffer eternal damnation as a result!
This applies to most of the teachings of the Catholic Church. Go to a Catholic church in Britain and you'll likely find divorced people, people in openly gay relationships and people who use contraception all getting on together just fine and ignoring the pope most of the time. "I tend not to sit next to these people at mass for fear of being struck by lightening. | |||
"Depends on your criteria. Do you want to give all 7 billion your standard of living, fridge, car, electric, heating, carpet. Etc etc. If so, there isn't a hope in hell regardless of taking stuff away from wealthy people. Do you happen to know what the difference in birth rate is from 1 billion to 7 billion? How many extra mouths do you have to feed every year!. Natural species decline happens all the time , it's never "gods will" usually humans fault and rarely comes in a nice form. Were great at seeing the reasons for species control unless it's us. Lot of claims made here but nothing to back them up?. Lol are you kidding me, there's been shit loads of studies from every reputable university in the world. I certainly ain't spending an hour of my time looking them up for you. http://m.worldometers.info/world-population/ So today just till 2pm were at 140,000 extra mouths.. From January the 1st were at 4 million extra mouths... Have you Any idea about how many extra resources year on year it takes to feed, let alone house... Of course this extra resources would need to be found by humans, unless you can get God to throw a bit of extra copper or wheat down.... "I've heard other stuff though, also from reputable sources. But i noticed you might be an environmentalist so did want sources from you because i am leaning towards your sources might be more reasonable. You didn't need to spend an hour, you could have mentioned a few and i could look them up myself. I know how to google. But i would like proper research to form a different opinion from my own right now. Just saying the world population is growing is not enough evidence for me to agree that we haven't got the resources or the means to feed the world, to supply everyone with their basic needs and some. Neither did i claim we have to take from the rich, but i will add they have an unfair advantage when it comes to sharing everything, when it comes to terms of agreements between countries, and when it comes to making the rules. Yes i include all of us who get our bargains off others poorly paid hard work in this too, in a smaller but just as guilty way. We have enough food resources to feed the whole planet apparently, i see this on plenty of websites. From things like millions of tons of food is wasted every year to it's just not distributed properly and economics/poverty means it won't ever be distributed properly either. As well as loads of other things. GMO foods might help in a food shortage as well, which is supposedly why we spend so much money on research in this area (natural disasters affect food supplies andGgMO can counter that). http://www.wfp.org/hunger/causes I see plenty of sites making the claims in the first paragraph as this site. | |||
