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british police force
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"at it again, that man who died near the g20 events, the police are not to take further action. The police are there to inforce the law, not make it up, altho it was the cps who are not taking it any further. i feel for Ian Tomlinson's family" i feel for the family as well... but in this case, if they can't determine how he died, then they can't prosecute.... | |||
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"The same as MP's. One rule for them. And Another for the rest of us...." Aren't you overlooking the fact that, after 13 years of NuLabour it is now : One rule for them, and 31,143 rules for us? | |||
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"if the guy had pushed over the copper i'm sure the cps would have had the guy locked up and eating porridge by now.is it any wonder the public has lost faith with the police" the problem with the case is this.... 1st post mortem concluded that the cause of death was a heart attack.... 2nd post mortem concluded he died of internal bleeding...... 3rd post mortem could not conclude that any of the hits the policemen may have made was the cause of any of the internal bleeding...... so he may have been internally bleeding for a while before ..... or the heart attack may have caused it.... or it may have been the policeman hitting him that caused it...... now.... you being the CPS..... how do you go about trying to persue that????? | |||
"The same as MP's. One rule for them. And Another for the rest of us.... Aren't you overlooking the fact that, after 13 years of NuLabour it is now : One rule for them, and 31,143 rules for us?" Bugger forgot about that one..  | |||
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"if the guy had pushed over the copper i'm sure the cps would have had the guy locked up and eating porridge by now.is it any wonder the public has lost faith with the police the problem with the case is this.... 1st post mortem concluded that the cause of death was a heart attack.... 2nd post mortem concluded he died of internal bleeding...... 3rd post mortem could not conclude that any of the hits the policemen may have made was the cause of any of the internal bleeding...... so he may have been internally bleeding for a while before ..... or the heart attack may have caused it.... or it may have been the policeman hitting him that caused it...... now.... you being the CPS..... how do you go about trying to persue that?????" ok i'll turn that on its head and say if the policeman had been hit by the guy and died and the post mortem was the same are you telling me the guy would not have been procecuted.like hell he would have he would have been hung out to dry.its disgusting the footage is discrace to the police force | |||
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"Police "force"???? I don't think so. I think you'll find it's the Police Service not "force". And anyone who argues will have the shit kicked out of them by a team with their ID no's covered with gaffa tape. Evenin' all." i dont think theres any need for this type of post  | |||
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"The police do have such an easy job though - no drug crazed loons, no rapists or murderers, no one driving whilst d*unk, no one carying knives, just a total law abiding society - hang on - thats' not quite right! I feel sorry for the guys family but he wasn't totally blameless in all this and the post mortems weren't conclusive so no further action can be taken. Would everyone like prosecutions to take place without all the facts adding up? Z" Whilst I agree with 90% of your post I don't agree that Mr Tomlinson wasn't totally blameless....the guy was on his way home from work, he wasn't part of any demonstration. | |||
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"The police do have such an easy job though - no drug crazed loons, no rapists or murderers, no one driving whilst d*unk, no one carying knives, just a total law abiding society - hang on - thats' not quite right! I feel sorry for the guys family but he wasn't totally blameless in all this and the post mortems weren't conclusive so no further action can be taken. Would everyone like prosecutions to take place without all the facts adding up? Z Whilst I agree with 90% of your post I don't agree that Mr Tomlinson wasn't totally blameless....the guy was on his way home from work, he wasn't part of any demonstration." Well, from memory and I haven't read about this recently, he was asked not to go through a cordon or was asked to turn around and go another way but became beligerent and argumentative - that in no way gives any one any excuse to be brutal but as I said he wasn't totally blameless in this scenario. Z | |||
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"The police do have such an easy job though - no drug crazed loons, no rapists or murderers, no one driving whilst d*unk, no one carying knives, just a total law abiding society - hang on - thats' not quite right! I feel sorry for the guys family but he wasn't totally blameless in all this and the post mortems weren't conclusive so no further action can be taken. Would everyone like prosecutions to take place without all the facts adding up? Z" as far as i can make out the guy was not part of any demonstrsation but was merely making his way home from work?. he had to take the route that he was on because of the demonstrators and the police had to close certain areas for containment yes?. i cannot see why the policeman had to push from behind as the bloke was ambling along minding his own business with his hands in his pockets!,and did i also see another policeman lash out with a baton at him?. nah this was a bad one and someone in authority at cps should show the way here instead of just dismissing it all. | |||
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"I think it would be upto the Crown prosceution service to decide if charges were to be brought. And im guessing they have decided there is little prospect of a conviction. I would expect the office to still face an internal police disciplinary, as im pretty sure this would have been put on hold until a decision by the CPS on if to charge or not had been made. " Ha Ha Ha ha ha An internal police disciplinary hearing. Ha Ha Ha ha ha best one this week. | |||
"The police got this one wrong and they should face the music for it. It wasn't an accident, and it can't be dismissed as 'unfortunate'. They fucked up, and the officer who hit the guy made a judgement call and got it wrong. For that reason alone he should never wear a police uniform again because if his judgement is so bad that it led to the death of an innocent man it begs the question: who's next to suffer at the hands of a bad officer? Although, having said that, if the Police Federation abandon the officer to his fate it will send a clear message to all officers of the law that they have no protection and when faced with life threatening situations we may find ourselves with policemen and women who are reluctant to put themselves in the firing line. It's a hard one and although his superiors have most likely told him that his days as an officer are numbered they have to present a united front for the long term good of the force. A lot of public relations work to be done I think. " I like many think he should have questions to answer. It would be interesting to see the attitudes of other officers when required for crowd control. I suspect many would refuse to participate as they wouldn't feel they could respond. | |||
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"Whilst in no way condoning what the police officer did, I think the media's reporting of the case has been a little biased. There was loads of evidence that, far from being an "innocent bystander", this guy was in fact a source of trouble, on one occassion earlier in the day having to be moved forceably from the road by a copper because he refused to let a police van past, and had been drinking heavily. Just before the incident that has been filmed, he also nearly knocked down a female police officer. In the media, they say he had a heart attack "a few minutes" after he was knocked down, when in fact I believe it was 40 mins later, and two streets away. None of the above means he deserved what happened, but it does go some way to showing that sometimes the public can form an opinion based on "innaccurate" reporting." I agree with you,the media will only show us what they want us to see and at the moment its the part with the policeman whacking him with a truncheon | |||
"Whilst in no way condoning what the police officer did, I think the media's reporting of the case has been a little biased. There was loads of evidence that, far from being an "innocent bystander", this guy was in fact a source of trouble, on one occassion earlier in the day having to be moved forceably from the road by a copper because he refused to let a police van past, and had been drinking heavily. Just before the incident that has been filmed, he also nearly knocked down a female police officer. In the media, they say he had a heart attack "a few minutes" after he was knocked down, when in fact I believe it was 40 mins later, and two streets away. None of the above means he deserved what happened, but it does go some way to showing that sometimes the public can form an opinion based on "innaccurate" reporting." if he had done something wrong earlier in the day he should have been arrested for it that was in the past , even though it was the recent past the incident in question concerns a man that was walking away ( with his hands in his pockets ) from a group of police officers that were armed with riot gear and truncheons he was shoved in the BACK not the FRONT the police should have AT LEAST been charged with assault they were not because the enquirey took longer than 6 months , in my veiw this delay was intentional if i had assaulted someone in 1965 when i was watching queens park rangers at wembley and they found it on archive video tape THE FUCKERS WOULD CHARGE ME and that was 40 odd years ago | |||
"Whilst in no way condoning what the police officer did, I think the media's reporting of the case has been a little biased. There was loads of evidence that, far from being an "innocent bystander", this guy was in fact a source of trouble, on one occassion earlier in the day having to be moved forceably from the road by a copper because he refused to let a police van past, and had been drinking heavily. Just before the incident that has been filmed, he also nearly knocked down a female police officer. In the media, they say he had a heart attack "a few minutes" after he was knocked down, when in fact I believe it was 40 mins later, and two streets away. None of the above means he deserved what happened, but it does go some way to showing that sometimes the public can form an opinion based on "innaccurate" reporting." Can you point me to the source of this information?, only the full details of the independent inquiry are not being released until next Tuesday? Did you see this on TV or in a newspaper article? | |||
"if the guy had pushed over the copper i'm sure the cps would have had the guy locked up and eating porridge by now.is it any wonder the public has lost faith with the police the problem with the case is this.... 1st post mortem concluded that the cause of death was a heart attack.... 2nd post mortem concluded he died of internal bleeding...... 3rd post mortem could not conclude that any of the hits the policemen may have made was the cause of any of the internal bleeding...... so he may have been internally bleeding for a while before ..... or the heart attack may have caused it.... or it may have been the policeman hitting him that caused it...... now.... you being the CPS..... how do you go about trying to persue that?????" The video evidence taken at the time shows that the police hit him with a baton. If murder/manslaughter could not be pursued then a charge of common assault could have been. The police on that demo (I know cos i was there) were spoiling for a fight. You can tell this because the fuckers were not wearing (or concealed) their id numbers (the little silver flashes on thier shoulders). Policing in this country is by consent, while criminals might not consent to being caught, a law abiding citizen should bear the activities of the police. The police in their turn consent to being identifiable by their provision of a force (IE the met or Avon and Somerset, for example) and thier id number. Neither of these were provided by the vast majority of the police on this demo, which is disgusting. And that is not to go into tactics such as kettling or covert and overt filming or genetic sampling of inocent protestors. The same happened at the demonstrations against the illegal war in Iraq.................. | |||
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"THEY WOULD NEVER PROSEUTE A POLICEMAN, just lok at the backlash theyd get from all the other pc"s it has emerged they are now thinking of action against the patho who first examined the body and ruined this case, because of previous blunders. Free Country..............my ass! " Yawn 
How ever do we manage to live in such a controlled, undemocratic society where we run the risk of being legally murdered by our own government for the slightest thing eh?
I think I'll move to a small country in Africa run by a power mad dictator where I'll be free to call him a cunt and live happily ever after. | |||
"How ever do we manage to live in such a controlled, undemocratic society where we run the risk of being legally murdered by our own government for the slightest thing eh?" You know, I'm sure Dr David Kelly's widow thinks exactly the same thing. | |||
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"How ever do we manage to live in such a controlled, undemocratic society where we run the risk of being legally murdered by our own government for the slightest thing eh? You know, I'm sure Dr David Kelly's widow thinks exactly the same thing." You read too much James Bond. He killed himself with drugs and a knife he'd owned since his youth and had infamously predicted that "I'll probably be found dead in some woods" - which is where, in fact, he was found. He worked for the MoD and you can't go whistleblowing in areas of national security without some form of comeback. He signed the official secrets act, the same as I have in the past, and you are governed by it for the rest of your life. He chose to go public to the press instead of keeping his goddam head below the parapet. So what that there weren't any WMDs in Iraq after all - does that make the war to remove Hussein any less valid? Blair took us into that campaign because he knew the reality of leaving Hussein in control of 1/4 of the world's oil, but Blair also knew that the namby-pamby make love not war brigade over here would never allow our troops to go in just to 'save some oil' - so the story of WMDs was put out and in we went, and justifiably so in my opinion. Kelly forgot who he worked for and should have shut the fuck up. | |||
"if the guy had pushed over the copper i'm sure the cps would have had the guy locked up and eating porridge by now.is it any wonder the public has lost faith with the police the problem with the case is this.... 1st post mortem concluded that the cause of death was a heart attack.... 2nd post mortem concluded he died of internal bleeding...... 3rd post mortem could not conclude that any of the hits the policemen may have made was the cause of any of the internal bleeding...... so he may have been internally bleeding for a while before ..... or the heart attack may have caused it.... or it may have been the policeman hitting him that caused it...... now.... you being the CPS..... how do you go about trying to persue that?????" Thats what a jury is for! Many cases have a difference of opinion by doctors or scientists, but they still go to court! Also the Doctor how did the first post mortem, didn't have all the details, he wasn't told that the man was struck, there is also a problem with this doctor in that he has also been suspended with relation to other post mortems he carried out which have since been questioned. | |||
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"Whilst in no way condoning what the police officer did, I think the media's reporting of the case has been a little biased. There was loads of evidence that, far from being an "innocent bystander", this guy was in fact a source of trouble, on one occassion earlier in the day having to be moved forceably from the road by a copper because he refused to let a police van past, and had been drinking heavily. Just before the incident that has been filmed, he also nearly knocked down a female police officer. In the media, they say he had a heart attack "a few minutes" after he was knocked down, when in fact I believe it was 40 mins later, and two streets away. None of the above means he deserved what happened, but it does go some way to showing that sometimes the public can form an opinion based on "innaccurate" reporting. Can you point me to the source of this information?, only the full details of the independent inquiry are not being released until next Tuesday? Did you see this on TV or in a newspaper article?" Both, and yes, they could have been biased too, except that people who were there were asked to comment etc. Surely I cant be the only one to have seen all this on the TV and in the papers? There was a two page spread in one paper!! | |||
"You read too much James Bond. He killed himself with drugs and a knife he'd owned since his youth and had infamously predicted that "I'll probably be found dead in some woods" - which is where, in fact, he was found." Yeah, and miraculously managed to slit his wrist with that blunt knife (as per the police report) yet leave no traces of blood where he was found. "He worked for the MoD and you can't go whistleblowing in areas of national security without some form of comeback." Hang on a mo, so are you saying now he DIDN'T kill himself as you stated above, that his death WAS a reprisal for speaking out? "He signed the official secrets act, the same as I have in the past, and you are governed by it for the rest of your life. He chose to go public to the press instead of keeping his goddam head below the parapet. " So if you happened to say something apparently innocent one day, and a couple of geezers turn up when you are walking the dog and encourage you to kill yourself (perhaps even giving you the little nudge to help you overcome your reticence) that would be OK, you should have kept quiet? Does it state on the Official Secrets Act that you signed that the penalty for breaking your oath is death, without trial? "So what that there weren't any WMDs in Iraq after all - does that make the war to remove Hussein any less valid? Blair took us into that campaign because he knew the reality of leaving Hussein in control of 1/4 of the world's oil, but Blair also knew that the namby-pamby make love not war brigade over here would never allow our troops to go in just to 'save some oil' - so the story of WMDs was put out and in we went, and justifiably so in my opinion. Kelly forgot who he worked for and should have shut the fuck up." Um yeah, it did make it less valid. Blair lied to Parliament and the country, and IMHO, Dr Kelly was silenced for telling the truth. Sometimes you have to speak out, otherwise you end up going along with crimes against humanity and society. People who don't "forget who they worked for and shut the fuck up" are the ones who try to say "I was only following orders guv" at their War Crimes trials. Oh, and incidentally, if Blair had stood up and told us that we were going to war for control of oil leading to cheaper petrol, I'd have endorsed it fully. Where the fuck IS our cheap petrol? Are we, as a nation, or even part of a coalition, now in control of the oil? Um, nope. Ah well, who are we to question the Great and the Good eh? It's all for our benefit, and we are just minions, we don't need to be informed or asked, we probably wouldn't understand, fucking peasants. Shame about our servicemen casualties. Ah well, fuck 'em eh? They signed up, the Govt can do with them what they wish.... Sheeeesh. | |||
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"You read too much James Bond. He killed himself with drugs and a knife he'd owned since his youth and had infamously predicted that "I'll probably be found dead in some woods" - which is where, in fact, he was found. Yeah, and miraculously managed to slit his wrist with that blunt knife (as per the police report) yet leave no traces of blood where he was found. He worked for the MoD and you can't go whistleblowing in areas of national security without some form of comeback. Hang on a mo, so are you saying now he DIDN'T kill himself as you stated above, that his death WAS a reprisal for speaking out? He signed the official secrets act, the same as I have in the past, and you are governed by it for the rest of your life. He chose to go public to the press instead of keeping his goddam head below the parapet. So if you happened to say something apparently innocent one day, and a couple of geezers turn up when you are walking the dog and encourage you to kill yourself (perhaps even giving you the little nudge to help you overcome your reticence) that would be OK, you should have kept quiet? Does it state on the Official Secrets Act that you signed that the penalty for breaking your oath is death, without trial? So what that there weren't any WMDs in Iraq after all - does that make the war to remove Hussein any less valid? Blair took us into that campaign because he knew the reality of leaving Hussein in control of 1/4 of the world's oil, but Blair also knew that the namby-pamby make love not war brigade over here would never allow our troops to go in just to 'save some oil' - so the story of WMDs was put out and in we went, and justifiably so in my opinion. Kelly forgot who he worked for and should have shut the fuck up. Um yeah, it did make it less valid. Blair lied to Parliament and the country, and IMHO, Dr Kelly was silenced for telling the truth. Sometimes you have to speak out, otherwise you end up going along with crimes against humanity and society. People who don't "forget who they worked for and shut the fuck up" are the ones who try to say "I was only following orders guv" at their War Crimes trials. Oh, and incidentally, if Blair had stood up and told us that we were going to war for control of oil leading to cheaper petrol, I'd have endorsed it fully. Where the fuck IS our cheap petrol? Are we, as a nation, or even part of a coalition, now in control of the oil? Um, nope. Ah well, who are we to question the Great and the Good eh? It's all for our benefit, and we are just minions, we don't need to be informed or asked, we probably wouldn't understand, fucking peasants. Shame about our servicemen casualties. Ah well, fuck 'em eh? They signed up, the Govt can do with them what they wish.... Sheeeesh. " you wanna get real pal. Governments have ALWAYS hidden the truth from the people because the 'people' are like a bunch of children liable to throw their toys out of the pram if they don't like what they're being told. But they still want cheap fuel, food, etc etc .. and they want it all for nothing. Well, here's the news chum, life isn't free and a price has to be paid somewhere, by someone, and if you run with dogs you gotta expect to get fleas. Kelly forgot that. And yes, he killed himself. The official enquiry said so, dontcha know, and we'll never know the truth of it for sure as we'll both be dead in 70 years time. | |||
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" you wanna get real pal. Governments have ALWAYS hidden the truth from the people because the 'people' are like a bunch of children liable to throw their toys out of the pram if they don't like what they're being told. But they still want cheap fuel, food, etc etc .. and they want it all for nothing. Well, here's the news chum, life isn't free and a price has to be paid somewhere, by someone, and if you run with dogs you gotta expect to get fleas. Kelly forgot that. And yes, he killed himself. The official enquiry said so, dontcha know, and we'll never know the truth of it for sure as we'll both be dead in 70 years time." Or sooner, if we say the wrong thing. 
BTW, I've got a Degree in Politics, I know full well how things work, thanks. Hindsight's a wonderful thing. Hey, that Blair geezer's done well for himself hasn't he.......?
If Secret Squirrel is reading this, I know nothing, I say nothing, I criticise no-one, so there's absolutely no reason to bump me off. | |||
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"Whilst in no way condoning what the police officer did, I think the media's reporting of the case has been a little biased. There was loads of evidence that, far from being an "innocent bystander", this guy was in fact a source of trouble, on one occassion earlier in the day having to be moved forceably from the road by a copper because he refused to let a police van past, and had been drinking heavily. Just before the incident that has been filmed, he also nearly knocked down a female police officer. In the media, they say he had a heart attack "a few minutes" after he was knocked down, when in fact I believe it was 40 mins later, and two streets away. None of the above means he deserved what happened, but it does go some way to showing that sometimes the public can form an opinion based on "innaccurate" reporting. Can you point me to the source of this information?, only the full details of the independent inquiry are not being released until next Tuesday? Did you see this on TV or in a newspaper article? Both, and yes, they could have been biased too, except that people who were there were asked to comment etc. Surely I cant be the only one to have seen all this on the TV and in the papers? There was a two page spread in one paper!!" When was this in the newspapers? Only the CPS never released their decision until yesterday lunchtime and the inquest isn't due to take place until November of this year? | |||
"When was this in the newspapers? Only the CPS never released their decision until yesterday lunchtime and the inquest isn't due to take place until November of this year?" It was in the Daily Mail. | |||
"When was this in the newspapers? Only the CPS never released their decision until yesterday lunchtime and the inquest isn't due to take place until November of this year? It was in the Daily Mail. "PMSL | |||
" you wanna get real pal. Governments have ALWAYS hidden the truth from the people because the 'people' are like a bunch of children liable to throw their toys out of the pram if they don't like what they're being told. But they still want cheap fuel, food, etc etc .. and they want it all for nothing. Well, here's the news chum, life isn't free and a price has to be paid somewhere, by someone, and if you run with dogs you gotta expect to get fleas. Kelly forgot that. And yes, he killed himself. The official enquiry said so, dontcha know, and we'll never know the truth of it for sure as we'll both be dead in 70 years time. Or sooner, if we say the wrong thing.
BTW, I've got a Degree in Politics, I know full well how things work, thanks. Hindsight's a wonderful thing. Hey, that Blair geezer's done well for himself hasn't he.......?
If Secret Squirrel is reading this, I know nothing, I say nothing, I criticise no-one, so there's absolutely no reason to bump me off. "...and this thread will self-destruct in ... 10... 9... 8... 7... 6.. hehehe  | |||
