FabSwingers.com > Forums > The Lounge > Pre paid benefits cards

Pre paid benefits cards

By *hyllyphylly OP Man over a year ago

Bradford

Ian Duncan Smith announced yesterday, that he would like to see people who have "destructive habits" will receive their benefits on prepaid cards instead of in cash.

Alcoholics and smack heads are being being targeted, but surely this will cause them to find another way to "feed their habit". Should smokers be targeted as well?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

wont they just sell the cards or am i missing summat

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By *ce WingerMan over a year ago

P.O. Box DE1 0NQ

Prepaid for what exactly?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

I am in receipt of some benefits but I also work too. I'm a smoker so I would just be spending my salary on fags.

Why don't they spend money on trying to help the alcoholics, drug addicts, smokers quit. More resources and clinics being available would be a good start.

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By *eavenNhellCouple over a year ago

carrbrook stalybridge

"Ian Duncan Smith announced yesterday, that he would like to see people who have "destructive habits" will receive their benefits on prepaid cards instead of in cash.

"
Maybe the MP should get there own house in order before criticizing others spending habits perhaps put their expenses on a prepaid card might keep that ever growing drain on the tax payer in check

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By *eavenNhellCouple over a year ago

carrbrook stalybridge

"Prepaid for what exactly?"
essentials whatever they maybe ?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Ian Duncan Smith announced yesterday, that he would like to see people who have "destructive habits" will receive their benefits on prepaid cards instead of in cash.

Maybe the MP should get there own house in order before criticizing others spending habits perhaps put their expenses on a prepaid card might keep that ever growing drain on the tax payer in check "

Oh very well said!!!!!!!!!

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

"Ian Duncan Smith announced yesterday, that he would like to see people who have "destructive habits" will receive their benefits on prepaid cards instead of in cash.

Alcoholics and smack heads are being being targeted, but surely this will cause them to find another way to "feed their habit". Should smokers be targeted as well?

No one should be targeted taking one form of money away from people will only make them source it elsewhere. What about over eaters, alcoholics, dangerous sports participants?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

cant see how it would work effectively

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

they already tried that at one point and it failed dramatically

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

No because I buy my bacci in cash only from a bloke down the road, if I got a card I would only get one pouch (his price I get two) I mite have to feed the kids beans on toast for tea every night so I can feed my habit

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By *ce WingerMan over a year ago

P.O. Box DE1 0NQ

"Prepaid for what exactly?essentials whatever they maybe ?

That's my point, what maybe essential to one person will be surplus to another

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

"No because I buy my bacci in cash only from a bloke down the road, if I got a card I would only get one pouch (his price I get two) I mite have to feed the kids beans on toast for tea every night so I can feed my habit

Nicely put!

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

when will this incessant demonising of benefit claimants end?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

The government are constantly victimising the most vulnerable ie. Unemployed, disabled, elderly it's about time they looked in the mirror and sorted their own over spending and deceitfulness out first maybe then they could look elsewhere

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"when will this incessant demonising of benefit claimants end?"

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By *isscheekychopsWoman over a year ago

The land of grey peas and bacon

I hate the term smack head it makes me cringe....in terms of pre payment cards...this is not solving the issues that those with substances misusers have it will only create further issues

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

So called " destructive habits " are not exclusive to those on benefits .

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple over a year ago

in Lancashire

"when will this incessant demonising of benefit claimants end?"

this..

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Ian Duncan Smith announced yesterday, that he would like to see people who have "destructive habits" will receive their benefits on prepaid cards instead of in cash.

Alcoholics and smack heads are being being targeted, but surely this will cause them to find another way to "feed their habit". Should smokers be targeted as well?

Would be interesting to know if implementing this is actually cost worthy, and whether stigmatising claimants will stop them seeking help for alcohol/drug problems so that they can still recieve money.

I see more social problems coming.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

" and whether stigmatising claimants will stop them seeking help for alcohol/drug problems so that they can still recieve money.

Sorry meant drug using claimants, not all claimants.

Nice load of illegal stuff going on in my town thanks to sanctions anyway, got to wonder if the mafia still run in cahoots with the gov...

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"So called " destructive habits " are not exclusive to those on benefits ."

no they are not but they aren't bothered about drug taker who work and fund their habit themselves

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

The way I read it , it's going to have a small scale voluntary trial first. Although I'm thinking the volunteers won't be a true representation of the people who would be affected.

I'm not sure it will work, you can't cure addictions overnight and they will find other means to fund that addiction through desperation.

Although alcohol and drug addiction affects a cross section of society, not just those on benefits. The benefit system is sometimes abused , however it exists to protect the vulnerable.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Prepaid for what exactly?"

The cynic in me suspects to spend in government approved shops. Because that will help local economies. Still I suspect that tax avoiding workfare endorsing multi-nationals will have no problem with that

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

So how would this work anyhow, on a prepaid card do you pay bills, food shopping etc with it (but not at tabacco counter) I dont quite get how it would work.

I work so only entitled to tax credits.but it is still a benefit

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Lets just allow he government to give even more of OUR money away...FFS!!! Another new idea to give it away faster, more efficiently, and without a thought for those who have actually EARNED that money in the first place. Yes, I did use the word EARNED...!!!

You work, you contribute, yet the government gives YOUR money away to whoever it sees fit (often its own corrupt MPs and hangers on), the people who are NOT entitled to it seem to receive it first (immigrants, fraudsters and criminals, overseas aid to fund arms, fleets of Mercedes-Benz, or even a space-programme or two in the sub-continent). And they claim to do it in OUR best interests, and WITH our permission...??? I don't know about anyone else, but I'd like to tell them all to get their thieving hands off my tax money and GIVE US A REFERENDUM to decide on what they can spend our money on and what they can't...!!!

Spend on the NHS, schools, care for the elderly, GENUINE welfare benefits and meaningful projects which reflect the historical culture of our country...DON'T spend a single penny on things that the people who the money belongs to don't want it spent on...!!!

FFS...!!!...we, the people, no longer have a voice that is listened to...!!! The people in power are doing what they want, when they want, and its time for a complete shake up of the system of governance in this country. Take a good look at how Switzerland is run...BY the people, FOR the people.

We need to tell Brussels to fuck right off, regain our sovereign powers, then have fundamental reform to establish a federal system of government where what the people want is what they get, and what they don't want they don't get...!!!

But it'll never happen, as its not in the self-interest of our greedy MPs to reform. It'll never happen unless someone in power grows a pair and MAKES it happen.

Sorry, rant over, feeling better now (even though it'll make not a bit of difference), but this country that I was born in and have called home for 48 years is a joke...no wonder all the immigrants are queuing up in Calais to get in...we're a world-class joke, hidden behind overpaid human-rights lawyers and intellectually-challenged MPs. Sorry, here i go again...am going to shut up now, before MI6 drag me away silently in the night, or sabotage the brakes on my car...

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

I think that it is likely that the amount of benefit money spent on "destructive habits" is a fraction of the total benefits bill but if people are focussed on the bogeyman the powers that be set up for us they wont see the real bad guys.

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By *cenario-xxxMan over a year ago

Salford

The system currently doesn't work. Why not try something new? Personally I cant see why anyone who isnt claiming benefits would be against it. Those that are and misusing the privilege of course will be!

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"when will this incessant demonising of benefit claimants end?"

My father always said, 99% of the wealth of this country belongs to 1% of the population. The rich will always keep their boot across the windpipe of the average man on the street.

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By *its_n_piecesCouple over a year ago

"Lets just allow he government to give even more of OUR money away...FFS!!! Another new idea to give it away faster, more efficiently, and without a thought for those who have actually EARNED that money in the first place. Yes, I did use the word EARNED...!!!

But it'll never happen, as its not in the self-interest of our greedy MPs to reform. It'll never happen unless someone in power grows a pair and MAKES it happen.

..... and breathe

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

"when will this incessant demonising of benefit claimants end?

My father always said, 99% of the wealth of this country belongs to 1% of the population. The rich will always keep their boot across the windpipe of the average man on the street."

Yep! The problem is that many of the average men/women on the street actually buy into the crap they tell us to keep the boot there.

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

"The system currently doesn't work. Why not try something new? Personally I cant see why anyone who isnt claiming benefits would be against it. Those that are and misusing the privilege of course will be!"

I'm against it...are you saying that I must be claiming and misusing benefits?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Lol...feeling better having let that one out there...

Have no problem whatsoever with genuine people in genuine difficulties who need assistance, it's just that what little is left after the government has spent (wasted) most of our taxes, is then insufficient to go around to people in genuine need.And with the tax the government take, that certainly shouldn't be the case!!!

The government have got us by the short and curlies, and don't they just know it. The only person who ever entered parliament with honest intentions was Guy Fawkes...!!!

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By *andS66Couple over a year ago

Derby

I take it the bloke down the road is selling black market baccy..... so not paying tax on the goods that he sells? Doubt he pays tax on the money he makes either... but then again, I guess that's ok because he's not Google, or Amazon, or Starbucks....

But on the other hand, good to see someone putting their smokes ahead of their kids nutrition...

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"when will this incessant demonising of benefit claimants end?

My father always said, 99% of the wealth of this country belongs to 1% of the population. The rich will always keep their boot across the windpipe of the average man on the street."

Correct!!! So what do we do about it...? Ideas on a postcard please.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

In what way is the current system not working?

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By *cenario-xxxMan over a year ago

Salford

I'm against it...are you saying that I must be claiming and misusing benefits?"

No, if you re-read the last sentence it says 'those that are AND misusing the privilege will be!'

I dont know anything about you so how could I comment on you as an individual?

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By *reelove1969Couple over a year ago

bristol

i cant see a problem with it personally ..it has worked fine in other countries

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By *otsoSnowWhiteWoman over a year ago

My Ice Castle! South Wales

There has gotta be a better way forward.

The people that are claiming unnecessarily should be looked at and the ones who struggle to get what they desperately need should be addressed.

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By *cenario-xxxMan over a year ago

Salford

In what way is the current system not working?"

Maybe it would be quicker for you to say how it is working! ! Lol

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"when will this incessant demonising of benefit claimants end?

My father always said, 99% of the wealth of this country belongs to 1% of the population. The rich will always keep their boot across the windpipe of the average man on the street.

Yep! The problem is that many of the average men/women on the street actually buy into the crap they tell us to keep the boot there. "

I hate this bullshit theory that we mustn't over tax the wealthy, or they may take their skills and expertise elsewhere. I say that if that's their attitude, then piss off and be greedy elsewhere. I had a conversation with someone the other day, that made me angry. They were spouting off about people in council accommodation. Saying crap like "why do these people think they have the right to a home". At the end of the day, this is the 21st century. Why the hell shouldn't people expect to be able to afford some kind of accommodation ?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

In what way is the current system not working?

Maybe it would be quicker for you to say how it is working! ! Lol

Does that meanyou can't tell me why the current system of paying benefits in to a bank account isn't working like was claimed?

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By *cenario-xxxMan over a year ago

Salford

"There has gotta be a better way forward.

The people that are claiming unnecessarily should be looked at and the ones who struggle to get what they desperately need should be addressed. "

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By *adystephanieTV/TS over a year ago

glos

Off to fluffy clouds thread me thinks

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By *cenario-xxxMan over a year ago

Salford

In what way is the current system not working?

Maybe it would be quicker for you to say how it is working! ! Lol

Does that meanyou can't tell me why the current system of paying benefits in to a bank account isn't working like was claimed?"

That doesnt really say why its working??

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By *its_n_piecesCouple over a year ago

"Off to fluffy clouds thread me thinks

mind don't lose your way and end up back on the cyclists thread again

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

so paying the same amount of people the same amount of benefits but giving it to those with "destructive habits" in card form will revolutionise the benefits system?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

In what way is the current system not working?

Maybe it would be quicker for you to say how it is working! ! Lol

Does that meanyou can't tell me why the current system of paying benefits in to a bank account isn't working like was claimed?

That doesnt really say why its working??

It works fine. Can you not substantiate your claim that it's not working?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"so paying the same amount of people the same amount of benefits but giving it to those with "destructive habits" in card form will revolutionise the benefits system? "

We all know it won't. But even by discussing it, it will reinforce the fallacy that all claiments are layabouts and scroungers and lead to them being further vilified

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple over a year ago

in Lancashire

"so paying the same amount of people the same amount of benefits but giving it to those with "destructive habits" in card form will revolutionise the benefits system? "

nope..

its another fop to the nasty parties core support to stick with them for next May..

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

What a load of bollocks!!

I take cash out, toddle off to market and get my fruit and veg cheaper than at the supermarket.

I pay my bills by direct debit because its often cheaper. Prepaid cards dont come with that facility. My bills go up, does the amount received go up to match?

How would I pay for a bus ticket??

More unthought out dribble to demonise the poor!

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

"so paying the same amount of people the same amount of benefits but giving it to those with "destructive habits" in card form will revolutionise the benefits system?

nope..

its another fop to the nasty parties core support to stick with them for next May.."

Yep!

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

"so paying the same amount of people the same amount of benefits but giving it to those with "destructive habits" in card form will revolutionise the benefits system?

We all know it won't. But even by discussing it, it will reinforce the fallacy that all claiments are layabouts and scroungers and lead to them being further vilified"

Indeed most of us know it wont but one or two seem to be suggesting that it will bring worthwhile change.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"so paying the same amount of people the same amount of benefits but giving it to those with "destructive habits" in card form will revolutionise the benefits system?

We all know it won't. But even by discussing it, it will reinforce the fallacy that all claiments are layabouts and scroungers and lead to them being further vilified

Indeed most of us know it wont but one or two seem to be suggesting that it will bring worthwhile change."

Yes but noticably they seem incapable of telling us what those benefits will be

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

I'm a reasonably sane person yet although I know the way any benefits thread will go I STILL look

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I'm a reasonably sane person yet although I know the way any benefits thread will go I STILL look

Snap!

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"so paying the same amount of people the same amount of benefits but giving it to those with "destructive habits" in card form will revolutionise the benefits system?

We all know it won't. But even by discussing it, it will reinforce the fallacy that all claiments are layabouts and scroungers and lead to them being further vilified

Indeed most of us know it wont but one or two seem to be suggesting that it will bring worthwhile change.

Yes but noticably they seem incapable of telling us what those benefits will be"

More people ashamed to claim when they need to will make a dent it.

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple over a year ago

in Lancashire

"I'm a reasonably sane person yet although I know the way any benefits thread will go I STILL look

tend to agree except for the reasonably sane bit..

wibble..

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

"I'm a reasonably sane person yet although I know the way any benefits thread will go I STILL look

tend to agree except for the reasonably sane bit..

wibble.."

Shhh.....some people here may think it's true

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I'm a reasonably sane person yet although I know the way any benefits thread will go I STILL look

tend to agree except for the reasonably sane bit..

wibble.."

Have you got pencils stuck up your nose and your undies on your head?!!!

crystal

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple over a year ago

in Lancashire

"I'm a reasonably sane person yet although I know the way any benefits thread will go I STILL look

tend to agree except for the reasonably sane bit..

wibble..

Shhh.....some people here may think it's true

best I ask my mate Harvey..

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple over a year ago

in Lancashire

"I'm a reasonably sane person yet although I know the way any benefits thread will go I STILL look

tend to agree except for the reasonably sane bit..

wibble..

Have you got pencils stuck up your nose and your undies on your head?!!!

crystal"

no but I have a cunning plan..

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

i worked most of my grown up life...due to marriage breakdown n a move 300 miles ...i now surviving on benefits ....have asked at job centre for help getting back into work to be told the retraining i need to get back into either of my previous jobs isnt available to single parents .....had enough of when i have to attend back to work focus inter_iews that my 3 yr old is wearing clothea that someone on benefits shouldnt be wearing .im all for on spot visits to check im not living beyond my means but pre payment cards no way as i buy alot of mine n my kids clothes off selling sites

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

"i worked most of my grown up life...due to marriage breakdown n a move 300 miles ...i now surviving on benefits ....have asked at job centre for help getting back into work to be told the retraining i need to get back into either of my previous jobs isnt available to single parents .....had enough of when i have to attend back to work focus inter_iews that my 3 yr old is wearing clothea that someone on benefits shouldnt be wearing .im all for on spot visits to check im not living beyond my means but pre payment cards no way as i buy alot of mine n my kids clothes off selling sites "

They are saying that the prepaid cards would be for people with destructive habits eg drug users etc not for the ordinary claimant.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

They are saying that the prepaid cards would be for people with destructive habits eg drug users etc not for the ordinary claimant. "
Who's going to categorise those with destructive habits?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

i been at the job centre quite a few times just recently.... the ones with the destructive habits seem to get the better treatment ......just the other day with a 3 yr old who just been toilet trained who crying cus they wanted to go to toilet to been told its half an.mile walk to nearest one by the security guard and in his next breath giving some one who smelt very strongly of booze at 9 in the morning the key to the toilets .....i feel these days too much leeway is given to people who are addictive to substance abuse ....now waiting for the backlash

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Spend on the NHS, schools, care for the elderly, GENUINE welfare benefits and meaningful projects which reflect the historical culture of our country...DON'T spend a single penny on things that the people who the money belongs to don't want it spent on...!!! "

Sorry but I cant follow your logic, you say it's good to spend tax money on people who damage their bodies through the NHS, or those who didn't bother to save, for old age through pensions, or even those who have children but cant afford to educate them. But you have a problem with giving money to stay alive to those who can't find work?

I enjoy living in a country that is good to people, yes that means a few appear to profit on the back of others, but behind the media hype the amount of misappropriated benefits are small compared to the money wasted on many other projects they don't want to talk about.

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

They are saying that the prepaid cards would be for people with destructive habits eg drug users etc not for the ordinary claimant. Who's going to categorise those with destructive habits? "

God only knows. I don't agree with it I was just pointing out that it wouldn't be for what "they" think of as "the deserving poor".

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

"i been at the job centre quite a few times just recently.... the ones with the destructive habits seem to get the better treatment ......just the other day with a 3 yr old who just been toilet trained who crying cus they wanted to go to toilet to been told its half an.mile walk to nearest one by the security guard and in his next breath giving some one who smelt very strongly of booze at 9 in the morning the key to the toilets .....i feel these days too much leeway is given to people who are addictive to substance abuse ....now waiting for the backlash

Do you? On a thread discussing paying them their benefits on a special card.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Pre-paid Friends-with-Benefits?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Tories slogan should read:

Conservatives: We hate poor people...

Sorry for that partly political broadcast... I will head into the shadows again

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By *ratty_DamselWoman over a year ago

Greater London

"Tories slogan should read:

Conservatives: We hate poor people...

Sorry for that partly political broadcast... I will head into the shadows again

I think your speaking perfect sense.

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By *nnyMan over a year ago

Glasgow

"Tories slogan should read:

Conservatives: We hate poor people...

Sorry for that partly political broadcast... I will head into the shadows again

It should read. We hate everyone who doesn't vote Tory.

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

"Tories slogan should read:

Conservatives: We hate poor people...

Sorry for that partly political broadcast... I will head into the shadows again

No it should read

"we hate poor people and we want you to hate them too"

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

whatever system for benefits payment we have is always going to be opened to be abused ....its no point in giving people who abused substances pre payment cards because they will sell them for cash ....and if you take away every legal option they have to have money to buy drugs and alcohol they will resort to criminal activities to gain money to buy what they need .....it going to take a total overhaul of the benefits system to change the way it is and i dont think any politcal party has the balls to do that

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By *ratty_DamselWoman over a year ago

Greater London

What is also a pisser, is some medicine is free regardless of income such a insulin for diabetes. However warfarin has to be paid for regardless of income. Both equally as important when a person has been prescribed them! Grrrr

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Ian Duncan Smith announced yesterday, that he would like to see people who have "destructive habits" will receive their benefits on prepaid cards instead of in cash.

Alcoholics and smack heads are being being targeted, but surely this will cause them to find another way to "feed their habit". Should smokers be targeted as well?

If it helps even one person who is spending money on alcohol rather than buying their kids food it has to be considered.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Tories slogan should read:

Conservatives: We hate poor people...

Sorry for that partly political broadcast... I will head into the shadows again

I think your speaking perfect sense.

There has to be a first for everything haha

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"whatever system for benefits payment we have is always going to be opened to be abused ....its no point in giving people who abused substances pre payment cards because they will sell them for cash ....and if you take away every legal option they have to have money to buy drugs and alcohol they will resort to criminal activities to gain money to buy what they need .....it going to take a total overhaul of the benefits system to change the way it is and i dont think any politcal party has the balls to do that"

How many people on benefits are drink or drug dependant? Does the whole system really need an overhaul?

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By *B9 QueenWoman over a year ago

Over the rainbow, under the bridge

"when will this incessant demonising of benefit claimants end?"

When people stop believing the crap they read in The Mail.

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By *ratty_DamselWoman over a year ago

Greater London

And all the other right wing rags. Including the free so called 'newpapers'.

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By *all-Eddies QosCouple over a year ago

wirral

Smackheads etc will find a way to fund their habits

My mother(estranged from my father) told my dad she was homeless and needed a sofa for the night.....I woke up to the telly and video gone.....

Thanks mum

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By *cenario-xxxMan over a year ago

Salford

"Ian Duncan Smith announced yesterday, that he would like to see people who have "destructive habits" will receive their benefits on prepaid cards instead of in cash.

Alcoholics and smack heads are being being targeted, but surely this will cause them to find another way to "feed their habit". Should smokers be targeted as well?

If it helps even one person who is spending money on alcohol rather than buying their kids food it has to be considered. "

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By *its_n_piecesCouple over a year ago

IDS speaks and the dedicated swallowers of facsim lap it up

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Ian Duncan Smith announced yesterday, that he would like to see people who have "destructive habits" will receive their benefits on prepaid cards instead of in cash.

Alcoholics and smack heads are being being targeted, but surely this will cause them to find another way to "feed their habit". Should smokers be targeted as well?

If it helps even one person who is spending money on alcohol rather than buying their kids food it has to be considered. "

It would cost millions to introduce this system. Or that momey could be spent directly on those struggling with addiction. I suspect the latter idea might have more far reaching and significant results

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

I have to smile at the small windows some look through on this.

It will make it more difficult for people to get booze and fags I am guessing so that’s only a good thing.

People will sell them? Well if it’s a personal card that people get money on every week it would be difficult. Also if people have to present ID that would spoil that. It would however stigmatise people and I don’t know about that though it might push some back to work. And who knows kids who get little to eat because parents spend it on fags might get fed more. And finally shoplifters selling gear would struggle more to be paid. I have to say thinking on it there are more pluses than negatives.

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By *exywheelsCouple over a year ago

inverness

"What is also a pisser, is some medicine is free regardless of income such a insulin for diabetes. However warfarin has to be paid for regardless of income. Both equally as important when a person has been prescribed them! Grrrr

That depends on where you live in the UK. Some areas are more caring for those who are ill.

(G has 11 repeat prescriptions a month)

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By *ratty_DamselWoman over a year ago

Greater London

Another contract for Crapita, I fear.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Another contract for Crapita, I fear.

Or twatos !!! (mr)

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

But on the other hand, good to see someone putting their smokes ahead of their kids nutrition..."

ooops think I was being taken serious then

sorry was at work couldnt reply

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By *ampWithABrainWoman over a year ago

Glasgow

"Ian Duncan Smith announced yesterday, that he would like to see people who have "destructive habits" will receive their benefits on prepaid cards instead of in cash.

Maybe the MP should get there own house in order before criticizing others spending habits perhaps put their expenses on a prepaid card might keep that ever growing drain on the tax payer in check "

Definitely this. If MP's had to spend their salaries the same as everyone else n didn't get expenses I bet the deficit would be cleared quick!!

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By *ampWithABrainWoman over a year ago

Glasgow

"when will this incessant demonising of benefit claimants end?"

This too... Yet again the people who caused the problem (politicians n bankers) not penalised at all!!

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"when will this incessant demonising of benefit claimants end?

This too... Yet again the people who caused the problem (politicians n bankers) not penalised at all!!"

totally agree benefit fraud is 0.7% im sure mps expenses fraud is much more and thats before we take into account the totall waste of mony for the house of commons ,all in all mps are bigger scroungers than those on benefits

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Ian Duncan Smith announced yesterday, that he would like to see people who have "destructive habits" will receive their benefits on prepaid cards instead of in cash.

Maybe the MP should get there own house in order before criticizing others spending habits perhaps put their expenses on a prepaid card might keep that ever growing drain on the tax payer in check

Oh very well said!!!!!!!!!"

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By *B9 QueenWoman over a year ago

Over the rainbow, under the bridge

Next step - the return of the workhouse. Let's treat the poor as the scum that they are.

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By *orneyashell87Couple over a year ago

stockotn on tees

Just scrap the benefit system all together like other countries. England is just a joke xx

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

I should know better than to read these threads and get involved but I guess I'm not one for keeping quiet. So here goes:

We as a country are still spending more than we are earning, with an ageing population and an increasing burden on the NHS etc this is a systemic long term issue. While economic growth will help, ultimately if the burden on the state continues to grow then it either needs to be paid for or the burden needs to be reduced.

The Tories have done a remarkable job with the overall economy over the past few years, the stats relative to other mature economies are outstanding. But as a party they continue to move further and further to the right which may or may not, depending on your point of _iew be a good or bad thing.

Labour through their cost of living focus have a softer side and arguably a more socially acceptable approach which again, depending on your point of _iew may or may not be a good thing.

The Lib Dems are irrelevant as they sold out to the so called devil Tories to secure short term power and UKIP will play on the insecurities of both sides and focus on a couple of key abd easily understood policies.

The election will see a further divide in policy (for years the parties were so similar as to be indistinguishable) so we the electorate will choose what we want. It is by no means perfect but it will be better if we get turnouts similar to what we saw in Scotland. Get out, vote, and have your say and if you feel so strongly and think it is so easy get off your bum and get engaged with whichever party and set of policies you support.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Just scrap the benefit system all together like other countries. England is just a joke xx"

What will happen then though, to those who cannot work? As in they are too physically disabled, Have severe learning difficulties terminally ill, care for a disabled child, care for an elderly parent? The list goes on. The benefit system was set up for a reason. Some of it needs changing, I agree, but you cannot assign groups like those I have mentioned, to living in complete poverty.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

But it'll never happen, as its not in the self-interest of our greedy MPs to reform. It'll never happen unless someone in power grows a pair and MAKES it happen.

..... and breathe"

Are you by any chance a UKIP supporter?

I'm disappointed there wasn't a "hard earned taxes" or a "why oh why", but pretty much all the other staples of foam flecked indignation were there though.

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By *oo hotCouple over a year ago

North West

"Just scrap the benefit system all together like other countries. England is just a joke xx"

Agree. We should be working to consistently reduce the tax burden that we all face so that hard work (at whatever level) is genuinely worthwhile. What kind of society would we be promoting where we expect higher rate tax payers to pay 50% tax and then another 20% VAT. Hand over 70% of what you earn anyone? We can't continue to promote a society where the state supports those on low pay in an attempt to equalise society.

The tax take in this country is outrageous and we need to understand that no matter how much is collected - it is nowhere near enough to pay for what is needed.

The size of the state and its interference in our daily lives should be reduced to zero and society motivated to look after themselves. Get welfare back to what it was intended for - help for those truly in need and not a lifestyle choice.

Personally, I could not give a toss that there may be enormously wealthy people out there. In fact I am grateful that the top 1% of earners pay almost one third of the tax that we collect. The story is not about envy but about those who would expect something for free that others have to work for.

No demonising, no division - just an expectation that we have to rid society of dependency and make work worthwhile.

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By *oo hotCouple over a year ago

North West

"Just scrap the benefit system all together like other countries. England is just a joke xx

Those genuinely in need should get more. Able bodied people of working age should get less. The state should not be paying anyone to have children and the whole tax credit system needs overhauling massively (scrapping?)

Why is it the state's responsibility to look after people who are on low pay? It may sound a bit old fashioned but people need to work hard.

I live in a part of the UK that is a former industrial town and has terrible unemployment statistics and a historically poor level of education. We have had an influx of EU migrants and the two biggest employers locally have a disproportionate number of EU workers compared to local staff. In the meantime there is still a plague of local, long term unemployment and social welfare problems. It is ok to live in a caring, sharing first world country but people have to get motivated to work. If people can travel across this continent and get work why can't a local get out of bed and get on a bus to get that same job?

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

"Just scrap the benefit system all together like other countries. England is just a joke xx

The tax take in this country is outrageous and we need to understand that no matter how much is collected - it is nowhere near enough to pay for what is needed.

No demonising, no division - just an expectation that we have to rid society of dependency and make work worthwhile.

That sounds ideal. How would you suggest that we bring that state of affairs about? For instance if there are 2000 people capable of work and 1000 full time jobs and 750 part time jobs what happens to the 250 with no job and the 750 not able to earn enough to.support their family? I know that is simplifying things but at base that is a large part of the issue and no amount of hard work will solve it.

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By *ifferent69Man over a year ago

BRIGHTON, UK

Ideas like this as usual thought of by those in secure and safe careers.

Equally agreed with by those in similar backgrounds.

We all lose sight that for majority we are only a change in circumstances whether job or health in finding that benefits are all we can depend on.

These people seem to think as easy as it is to falk into, it is equally easy to climb out of.

Blinkered vision comes to mind.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"So called " destructive habits " are not exclusive to those on benefits .

no they are not but they aren't bothered about drug taker who work and fund their habit themselves "

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Just scrap the benefit system all together like other countries. England is just a joke xx"

Is that everyone on benefits? Including pensioners?

Would you be happy for a pensioner to die in poverty?

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By *oo hotCouple over a year ago

North West

"Just scrap the benefit system all together like other countries. England is just a joke xx

Is that everyone on benefits? Including pensioners?

Would you be happy for a pensioner to die in poverty? "

I dont think that is what is being suggested. Remember that when welfare in this country started, there were 9 people working for every 1 that was not. Now there are more people not working than working, people are living longer and the drain on pensions and NHS costs is falling on an ever dwindling percentage of the population.

It is great to hang on to great british institutions but the problem is that we want them to stay the same despite the fact that the world around has changed.

Successive governments have either failed, or been too scared to point out the truth about what an increasingly ageing population is going to mean. This cant go on and anyone under 30 years of age in my opinion needs to be taking care of their own pension and getting private medical insurance because the country will have to take action about this sooner or later.

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By *eavenNhellCouple over a year ago

carrbrook stalybridge

"Next step - the return of the workhouse. Let's treat the poor as the scum that they are. "
the workhouse is already here it's called workfare ! Go to pound shop for six weeks "train to stack shelves " for your benefits or lose them .pound shop gets free employees boosts there profits at you the tax payers expense your off the unemployment register win win for the govt and their cronies

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By *oo hotCouple over a year ago

North West

"Ideas like this as usual thought of by those in secure and safe careers.

Equally agreed with by those in similar backgrounds.

We all lose sight that for majority we are only a change in circumstances whether job or health in finding that benefits are all we can depend on.

These people seem to think as easy as it is to falk into, it is equally easy to climb out of.

Blinkered vision comes to mind."

How have 2 - 3 million people from the EU absorbed into our society? The vast majority are working are working and they travelled across a continent.

We really have forgotten that work is about willingness, desire and positive attitude. We live next door to a massive food factory in an economically deprived part of the country. Half of the employees are Eastern European whilst locally we still have a huge problem with the long term unemployable and state dependency. That is just not right.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Next step - the return of the workhouse. Let's treat the poor as the scum that they are. the workhouse is already here it's called workfare ! Go to pound shop for six weeks "train to stack shelves " for your benefits or lose them .pound shop gets free employees boosts there profits at you the tax payers expense your off the unemployment register win win for the govt and their cronies "

Do you think that is worse than people staying at home and not doing anything? That opportunity may lead to full time employment, training and a career path that may lead to bigger and better things. Most research has shown that active employment increases self esteem and has a positive impact on the individual and society. It is not perfect I am sure but surely a step in the right direction?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Thing is you stop the money source they do have you risk a higher end of crime!

So if this comes in look forward to more burglaries more muggings etc.

Can't threads like these be taken to a politics site!

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple over a year ago

in Lancashire

"I should know better than to read these threads and get involved but I guess I'm not one for keeping quiet. So here goes:

Labour through their cost of living focus have a softer side and arguably a more socially acceptable approach which again, depending on your point of _iew may or may not be a good thing.

generally agree however the national debt under this lot is at a record level of about £1.3 trillion which is a lot of interest in servicing it..

at a time of austerity any householder knows you reign in, the dogmatic stance on eg. Hs2 with its very debateable possible economic benefits when completed is a luxury item which we as a nation cant afford at present and in the time it will take to construct..

stiffing it to some of the most vulnerable in society to save what is a small amount in relation to the bigger picture is another nasty policy from an out of touch bunch..

they are looking after their own and fuck the rest..

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple over a year ago

in Lancashire

"Successive governments have either failed, or been too scared to point out the truth about what an increasingly ageing population is going to mean. This cant go on and anyone under 30 years of age in my opinion needs to be taking care of their own pension and getting private medical insurance because the country will have to take action about this sooner or later."

agreed, and whomever gets in next year I can only see that the grey vote will take a hit in the benefits they currently get in the next parliament..

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I should know better than to read these threads and get involved but I guess I'm not one for keeping quiet. So here goes:

Labour through their cost of living focus have a softer side and arguably a more socially acceptable approach which again, depending on your point of _iew may or may not be a good thing.

generally agree however the national debt under this lot is at a record level of about £1.3 trillion which is a lot of interest in servicing it..

stiffing it to some of the most vulnerable in society to save what is a small amount in relation to the bigger picture is another nasty policy from an out of touch bunch..

they are looking after their own and fuck the rest.. "

I agree that the long term luxury projects may not be the priority right now, but infrastructure spend and borrow is a key element of the alternative. Looking at the news from France and Italy this morning you can see that we have come through the past few years in much better shape overall.

Definitely don't agree with targeting the most vulnerable in society, but do agree that we need a structural change to support the young and long term unemployed who are capable of working back into the work, pay, tax system.

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple over a year ago

in Lancashire

"I should know better than to read thesey threads and get involved but I guess I'm not one for keeping quiet. So here goes:

Labour through their cost of living focus have a softer side and arguably a more socially acceptable approach which again, depending on your point of _iew may or may not be a good thing.

generally agree however the national debt under this lot is at a record level of about £1.3 trillion which is a lot of interest in servicing it..

stiffing it to some of the most vulnerable in society to save what is a small amount in relation to the bigger picture is another nasty policy from an out of touch bunch..

they are looking after their own and fuck the rest..

agree, breaking the cycle that some have taken as a lifestyle choice for generations is part of the solution. Trouble is they usually use a sledgehammer approach to address such things and do and have effected some of our most vulnerable and in need also..

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I should know better than to read thesey threads and get involved but I guess I'm not one for keeping quiet. So here goes:

Labour through their cost of living focus have a softer side and arguably a more socially acceptable approach which again, depending on your point of _iew may or may not be a good thing.

generally agree however the national debt under this lot is at a record level of about £1.3 trillion which is a lot of interest in servicing it..

stiffing it to some of the most vulnerable in society to save what is a small amount in relation to the bigger picture is another nasty policy from an out of touch bunch..

they are looking after their own and fuck the rest..

In a country of 60m unfortunately one size doesn't fit all and no solution will be perfect. Change is needed, both from society and from those in power as to believe that we can keep borrowing into perpetuity to fund our country is madness. However, politics and desire for power will always find a way of messing up what should be common sense

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Crazy idea but how about people are paid for the work they do? Companies involved in workfare are exploiting the unemployed as unpaid labour

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple over a year ago

in Lancashire

"I should know better than to read thesey threads and get involved but I guess I'm not one for keeping quiet. So here goes:

Labour through their cost of living focus have a softer side and arguably a more socially acceptable approach which again, depending on your point of _iew may or may not be a good thing.

generally agree however the national debt under this lot is at a record level of about £1.3 trillion which is a lot of interest in servicing it..

stiffing it to some of the most vulnerable in society to save what is a small amount in relation to the bigger picture is another nasty policy from an out of touch bunch..

they are looking after their own and fuck the rest..

true..

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Just scrap the benefit system all together like other countries. England is just a joke xx

Is that everyone on benefits? Including pensioners?

Would you be happy for a pensioner to die in poverty?

It is great to hang on to great british institutions but the problem is that we want them to stay the same despite the fact that the world around has changed.

The point I was making was that the suggestion as stated is ridulous. And highlighting where most of the benefit bill lies

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By *ifferent69Man over a year ago

BRIGHTON, UK

Could,nt agre more, biggest users of class A drugs and alcohol abuse are those who can afford to fund it......

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By *ifferent69Man over a year ago

BRIGHTON, UK

"Just scrap the benefit system all together like other countries. England is just a joke xx

Is that everyone on benefits? Including pensioners?

Would you be happy for a pensioner to die in poverty? "
Fucking Tories would.. Strip away the idiology they only stand for the survival of the fitest, and let market forces dictate.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Nobody has mentioned the fact that the purchases on these cards will no doubt be recorded and retrievable, no doubt to be used against them, when it needs proving that they are not living a state approved lifestyle. Then it gets roled out to state pensions, working tax credits, child tax credits and child benefit. If you think anything like this is for your benefit, then just follow the history of how our personal privacy has been slowly eroded...all for our own good of course.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Nobody has mentioned the fact that the purchases on these cards will no doubt be recorded and retrievable, no doubt to be used against them, when it needs proving that they are not living a state approved lifestyle. Then it gets roled out to state pensions, working tax credits, child tax credits and child benefit. If you think anything like this is for your benefit, then just follow the history of how our personal privacy has been slowly eroded...all for our own good of course.

You forgot to mention,that all the information collected could be sold to third parties.

Plus the insurance companies would want all of it, to ensure they dont have to pay out on any claims,or increase prices to those THEY judge as a bit risky.

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By *nnyMan over a year ago

Glasgow

Not only recorded but HMG will be looking for a rebate from the stores for the business that has been generated.

A short step from that to govt run shops and having to show your card at food banks.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"So called " destructive habits " are not exclusive to those on benefits ."

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Not only recorded but HMG will be looking for a rebate from the stores for the business that has been generated.

A short step from that to govt run shops and having to show your card at food banks.

Its not just me then, that finds this sort of thing creepy?

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

"Not only recorded but HMG will be looking for a rebate from the stores for the business that has been generated.

A short step from that to govt run shops and having to show your card at food banks.

Its not just me then, that finds this sort of thing creepy?"

You do need to have a voucher from one of the designated agencies at food banks, which is fair enough. No you're not the only one who finds it creepy. Lots of people are very happy to see other people put under these kind of restrictions but where will it lead and who decides where it stops? Over a certain weight? Your benefit card won't work in Greggs, drink more than a certain amount of units a week and your

card will be refused in the supermarket if you try to buy alcohol with it.

We're sleep walking into total government control because the majority believe in this mythical under class.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

But it'll never happen, as its not in the self-interest of our greedy MPs to reform. It'll never happen unless someone in power grows a pair and MAKES it happen.

..... and breathe

Are you by any chance a UKIP supporter?

I'm disappointed there wasn't a "hard earned taxes" or a "why oh why", but pretty much all the other staples of foam flecked indignation were there though. "

Lol...nope, not a UKIP supporter. I'd like to see the whole antiquated and inadequate SYSTEM of government scrapped, and us adopt a federal system of government like the Swiss enjoy...where things get done, or vetoed, actually by the will of the people, from local decisions affecting local people, right throught to national decisions affecting all...decided by the people themselves, and NOT by those who claim to represent the people (grossly enriching themselves in the process) like we have to suffer.

But how the hell is fundamental change like what is really required actually started...??? ...without anarchy in the process.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Crazy idea but how about people are paid for the work they do? Companies involved in workfare are exploiting the unemployed as unpaid labour"

The current Workfair scheme is just that...a scheme. It's designed to enable the bean counters in our current shambles of a governance system to manipulate the statistics and present them to the population as a reduction in unemployment 'triumph' ...but it's all a lie...nothing unusual there then from Westminster.

I have a couple of nieces and nephews who have been subjected to the pressure placed on them by the Workfair 'advisers'...basically work for free in somewhere that we place you, or have your benefit payments stopped. They used to be called Jobcentres, now they want to force the young into effective slavery...something,ironically, they've been recently advertising on telly to stop 'slavery in Britain is closer to home than you think' or some such title...just because it is government-organised as opposed to privately-organised doesn't change the fact that working for a pittance is exactly what it is.

This once great country of ours is being fucked up completely by the people who claim to run it on our behalf. What can we actually DO to begin a process of FUNDAMENTAL change of governance system before we become the laughing stock of the world...and places like Somalia start sending aid packages to us...!!!

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

The last 100 people to _iew me...MI5, MI6, the SAS, and the David Kelly appreciation society...gulp...lol. Anyone got a direct-dial telephone number for the Kremlin's asylum requests department...

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By *lttattoocoupleCouple over a year ago

Worcester

Anybody watched that film 'in time'??

Yea basically that!! Prices go up and living gets harder. But that's the point why try help the poor when nobody cares anyway. The rich get richer and the poor will starve. This world isn't big enough aparantly for all the mouths to feed . So costs will go up to make sure there is room for those lucky enough to have the money to survive

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By *oo hotCouple over a year ago

North West

Crazy idea but how about people are paid for the work they do? Companies involved in workfare are exploiting the unemployed as unpaid labour

Perhaps you missed the bit that the UK is the best performing economy in Europe and is seen by most people from outside this country as a land of great opportunity.

As long as people keep moaning and complaining about how bad it is and how poor they are they will be stuck in a cycle of despair.

Think like an immigrant and look for the opportunity - it is here and that is why our economy is flying compared to the rest of Europe.

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By *B9 QueenWoman over a year ago

Over the rainbow, under the bridge

Interesting all the foaming, spittle laden hatred of those unemployed. I've been unemployed. My daughter was made redundant twice. Think first before you spit out your bile. People on benefits are not all losers. Most WANT to work.

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By *ratty_DamselWoman over a year ago

Greater London

I am a socialist and I believe that a civilised society looks after the weaker when and as needed.

If ALL companies and people paid the tax they should, society as a whole would be better. .

God help some of the posters, when things are not so good for you.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I am a socialist and I believe that a civilised society looks after the weaker when and as needed.

If ALL companies and people paid the tax they should, society as a whole would be better. .

God help some of the posters, when things are not so good for you.

"
So true. Sarah x

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By *ampWithABrainWoman over a year ago

Glasgow

"Just scrap the benefit system all together like other countries. England is just a joke xx"

May be called different things but most if not all developed countries have a welfare system of some kind plus a nationally funded health system

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By *iewMan over a year ago
Forum Mod

Angus & Findhorn

if it was a voluntary scheme and to help people budget

if to control their spend, NO

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By *iceduoCouple (FF) over a year ago

manchester

Im just pissed that the government pays for other peoples drug habits, fuck i have to work for mine.

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By *nnyMan over a year ago

Glasgow

"I am a socialist and I believe that a civilised society looks after the weaker when and as needed.

If ALL companies and people paid the tax they should, society as a whole would be better. .

God help some of the posters, when things are not so good for you.

From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs.

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By *iceduoCouple (FF) over a year ago

manchester

"The trouble with Socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money" — Margaret Thatcher

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By *ampWithABrainWoman over a year ago

Glasgow

"I am a socialist and I believe that a civilised society looks after the weaker when and as needed.

If ALL companies and people paid the tax they should, society as a whole would be better. .

God help some of the posters, when things are not so good for you.

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By *anchestercubMan over a year ago

manchester & NI

""The trouble with Socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money" — Margaret Thatcher

Yet Denmark and Sweden seem to manage just fine.

They were the first countries to balance their books after the recession and are also the most 'socialised' when it comes to welfare and public services.

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

""The trouble with Socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money" — Margaret Thatcher

lol, and that shows how well she understood socialism...or what she wanted the herd to think of it.

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By *icksoneMan over a year ago

oldham

it worries me when some people who are on social are complaining about getting their benefits cut down to £25000.

I have to work a 60+ hour a week for that.

It also worries me when people are going to the food bank in a developed country just to get by.

Some times shit happens and I still believe you should be helped to get by but to what extent??

Not sure what the answer is any more ??

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By *ancadamMan over a year ago

Stockport

"Ian Duncan Smith announced yesterday, that he would like to see people who have "destructive habits" will receive their benefits on prepaid cards instead of in cash.

Maybe the MP should get there own house in order before criticizing others spending habits perhaps put their expenses on a prepaid card might keep that ever growing drain on the tax payer in check "

well said!!

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By *ancadamMan over a year ago

Stockport

"when will this incessant demonising of benefit claimants end?"
it will worsen if the sanctimoneous Tories get another term.perfectly decent people claim benefits because they have to.its our welfare system that they want to bring shame on not pride that there is a safety net for those that have to work.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

But on the other hand, good to see someone putting their smokes ahead of their kids nutrition..."

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By *oo hotCouple over a year ago

North West

""The trouble with Socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money" — Margaret Thatcher

Yet Denmark and Sweden seem to manage just fine.

They were the first countries to balance their books after the recession and are also the most 'socialised' when it comes to welfare and public services. "

Sweden? If you really want 25% VAT, basic rate tax at 31% (no exceptions) and live in a place where a pair of shoes is typically £80, pair of jeans £70 and a bottle of spirits at least £30 .. Well it becomes much easier to balance the books.

No one now in this country would accept the removal of the tax free allowance, increase in basic taxation by another 10% and an extra 5% on VAT. Therefore the analogy is a bit pointless.

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By *oo hotCouple over a year ago

North West

"when will this incessant demonising of benefit claimants end? it will worsen if the sanctimoneous Tories get another term.perfectly decent people claim benefits because they have to.its our welfare system that they want to bring shame on not pride that there is a safety net for those that have to work."

The welfare system is not fit for purpose and needs a complete overhaul. It may have been ok in the 1920's when it came into being but we are now 100 years down the road and we need something suitable for today.

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By *oo hotCouple over a year ago

North West

""The trouble with Socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money" — Margaret Thatcher

lol, and that shows how well she understood socialism...or what she wanted the herd to think of it.

Socialism is big government, no ifs or buts about it. It is credible and creditworthy that we live in a society that is socialist enough to look after those in need. The ideals of true socialism is for the state to take a stake in the lives of everybody - the problem with that is someone has to pay.

Borrowing money to spend on roads, railways and health service is one thing. Borrowing money to give to people because they can't or won't work is madness. Welfare is a great socialist principle but welfare it is not about equalising society it is about helping those who truly need it. It should not be about helping those who adjust their hours and lifestyle so that they don't lose any benefits.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"The government are constantly victimising the most vulnerable ie. Unemployed, disabled, elderly it's about time they looked in the mirror and sorted their own over spending and deceitfulness out first maybe then they could look elsewhere

"
It will Be 800 years in november in this country

Where king john was (forced) to sign or

Seal his approval on the magna carta By a number of powerful knights by Doing this he passed the laws which Were needed but he had to have his arm Literaly Pushed up his back to do this Being the horrible little cretin he was during most of his reign and This Was the turning point in history Eventually where each man was treated As a equal not just a serf or slave Thou it took centurys for things to make a difference enough in society, but even now you can see who ever has That authority of power will use it

In many ways to their own advantage if They can (power and greed) go hand in hand and always have done.....

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Crazy idea but how about people are paid for the work they do? Companies involved in workfare are exploiting the unemployed as unpaid labour

Perhaps you missed the bit that the UK is the best performing economy in Europe and is seen by most people from outside this country as a land of great opportunity.

As long as people keep moaning and complaining about how bad it is and how poor they are they will be stuck in a cycle of despair.

Think like an immigrant and look for the opportunity - it is here and that is why our economy is flying compared to the rest of Europe."

I agree that the economy is performing well IN COMPARISON to the other European economies, but do we want to be the best of a bad bunch or actually really achieve our potential as a country...?

And we're seen as a land of opportunity mainly, but not exclusively, by those seeking to enrich themselves by taking advantage of our good-nature. There DOES come a time though, when that has to stop, before we're dragged back to the depths that some of the other European economies plumb.

In a reasonably well paid profession, know I'm one of the lucky ones, but not prepared to accept injustice and mismanagement when it affects those around me, and when I know that there IS another way that works better. But if I knew WHAT to do, then I'd be doing it...there are others with a far better understanding of how governments work who could chip in...but I don't know if they'd do that on Fabswingers...lol

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By *anchestercubMan over a year ago

manchester & NI

""The trouble with Socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money" — Margaret Thatcher

Yet Denmark and Sweden seem to manage just fine.

They were the first countries to balance their books after the recession and are also the most 'socialised' when it comes to welfare and public services.

No one now in this country would accept the removal of the tax free allowance, increase in basic taxation by another 10% and an extra 5% on VAT. Therefore the analogy is a bit pointless."

Yes I would accept that - the NHS, state education and defence do not have the funding they need. More money is needed.

I want excellent public services, to keep our people healthy, to educate them well and keep us safe - that will be to our benefit in the future.

Denmark has the highest tax rates in the world yet they are polled as the happiest people frequently - I'd rather pay more and see my country have what it needs than pay less and see it crumble around me.

Do you see the Swedes or Danes all jumping ship and abandoning their homelands? No!

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I should know better than to read thesey threads and get involved but I guess I'm not one for keeping quiet. So here goes:

Labour through their cost of living focus have a softer side and arguably a more socially acceptable approach which again, depending on your point of _iew may or may not be a good thing.

generally agree however the national debt under this lot is at a record level of about £1.3 trillion which is a lot of interest in servicing it..

stiffing it to some of the most vulnerable in society to save what is a small amount in relation to the bigger picture is another nasty policy from an out of touch bunch..

they are looking after their own and fuck the rest..

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By *oo hotCouple over a year ago

North West

""The trouble with Socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money" — Margaret Thatcher

Yet Denmark and Sweden seem to manage just fine.

They were the first countries to balance their books after the recession and are also the most 'socialised' when it comes to welfare and public services.

No one now in this country would accept the removal of the tax free allowance, increase in basic taxation by another 10% and an extra 5% on VAT. Therefore the analogy is a bit pointless.

Yes I would accept that - the NHS, state education and defence do not have the funding they need. More money is needed.

I want excellent public services, to keep our people healthy, to educate them well and keep us safe - that will be to our benefit in the future.

Do you see the Swedes or Danes all jumping ship and abandoning their homelands? No! "

No political party in the UK would put forward a proposition of what is effectively a 55% tax rate for EVERYONE. They would become non existant overnight. People here moan about a £10,000 personal tax free allowance and then a 20% rate. How about a £1,500 personal allowance followed by a 31% rate? A real vote winner!

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By *oo hotCouple over a year ago

North West

Crazy idea but how about people are paid for the work they do? Companies involved in workfare are exploiting the unemployed as unpaid labour

Perhaps you missed the bit that the UK is the best performing economy in Europe and is seen by most people from outside this country as a land of great opportunity.

As long as people keep moaning and complaining about how bad it is and how poor they are they will be stuck in a cycle of despair.

Think like an immigrant and look for the opportunity - it is here and that is why our economy is flying compared to the rest of Europe.

I agree that the economy is performing well IN COMPARISON to the other European economies, but do we want to be the best of a bad bunch or actually really achieve our potential as a country...?

If you look into the facts behind the motivation of why immigrants come here, the benefits generosity that you allude to is a myth. The reason people believe that it is true is because we know that it is far too generous by default. By reducing the generosity as you put it for everyone then there would be no perception as to the motivations of immigrants.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

In my opinion it removes human rights signing on ain't easy these days I was claiming jsa for a month and now in a full time job iv had to pay my own travel own crb own dinners as well as having to pay child care privet cause cannot afford registered x

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

And its all fine stop funding a person's hobbit but u watch crime rise I would rather pay taxes than know my house was going to get robbed ever night by the local druggy or alki

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

It's nice and civilized to have a benefits system that works as a safety net, particularly for those who are temporarily in need or those who for not fault of their own need assistance for the long term.

But it cannot make it too easy for ppl to be lazy.

Being a mum, depressed, tired, obese, uneducated should not be an excuse or a justification for a cash hand out,

Have some dignity!

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By *ratty_DamselWoman over a year ago

Greater London

""The trouble with Socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money" — Margaret Thatcher

The trouble with right wingers is that they don't share or indeed pay their way at all. Thats a quote by me, if your interested! !

Talking of which, you know any of the poor bankers who got us into this shit?

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By *nnyMan over a year ago

Glasgow

Talking of which, you know any of the poor bankers who got us into this shit?

Is that rhyming slang?

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By *ratty_DamselWoman over a year ago

Greater London

Oh that reminds me, you guys whinging about the public services etc. Would you like to put your money where your mouth is and pay an extra penny on the pound to make a difference or just rather pay the accountant to advise you how to not to. All legally of course but none the less rotten.

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By *ratty_DamselWoman over a year ago

Greater London

Talking of which, you know any of the poor bankers who got us into this shit?

Is that rhyming slang?"

Err, "no comment"

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By *B9 QueenWoman over a year ago

Over the rainbow, under the bridge

Some genuinely nasty comments on here regarding those on the very lowest rungs of society.

Mostly based on the worst kind of media bullshit and government spin masquerading as real facts.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If a families sole household income is benefits than why couldn't it be a cashless system. If their rent, council tax is being paid (direct to landlord again) utilises to be paid each month and food boxes or pre loaded cards of their choice of supermarket what would be wrong with that?

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By *ratty_DamselWoman over a year ago

Greater London

What people really forget about is the real victims in all this.

The children, who pay the ultimate price but who are entirely blameless.

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By *nnyMan over a year ago

Glasgow

"If a families sole household income is benefits than why couldn't it be a cashless system. If their rent, council tax is being paid (direct to landlord again) utilises to be paid each month and food boxes or pre loaded cards of their choice of supermarket what would be wrong with that?"

IDS has decided rent will not be paid direct to the landlord. It's almost like a ploy to get tenants into rent arrears.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

You can't pay bus fares to get to the jobcentre with benefits cards, you can't use a local food cooperative, or pay a childminder while you go to an inter_iew..all legitimate uses of cash.

Who benefits from demonising the poor?

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

Apart from the costs involved in setting up a system to replace one that's already working ie paying money directly into bank or post office accounts?

The focus is wrong. The method of payment is irrelevant, the root problems need addressing and changing the method of paying benefits to some sections of claimants will not achieve that.

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

"You can't pay bus fares to get to the jobcentre with benefits cards, you can't use a local food cooperative, or pay a childminder while you go to an inter_iew..all legitimate uses of cash.

Who benefits from demonising the poor?"

This isn't about paying all claimants that way only a section of them.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"And its all fine stop funding a person's hobbit but u watch crime rise I would rather pay taxes than know my house was going to get robbed ever night by the local druggy or alki"

it's OK they legalised killing of house robbers when they first got into power, so this is the next step to ensure a cull of the population

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"You can't pay bus fares to get to the jobcentre with benefits cards, you can't use a local food cooperative, or pay a childminder while you go to an inter_iew..all legitimate uses of cash.

Who benefits from demonising the poor?"

Its not demonising the poor just controlling how money given out is spent. I am sure the Government will let people do exactly what they want with monies earned.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"You can't pay bus fares to get to the jobcentre with benefits cards, you can't use a local food cooperative, or pay a childminder while you go to an inter_iew..all legitimate uses of cash.

Who benefits from demonising the poor?"

I understand your points but it is for the people who abuse the money they are given. Nobody is demonising the poor and when all said and done people solely on benefits are not the poorest off people. I know when I first became a single parent I was actually poorer by £75 a month working 18.5 hrs a week with top up benefits than I was my best friend who didn't work and she got free school meals!

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

People should be allowed to spend their money how they want. however that's not the same for money I earned by hard graft in a 60hr week to pay taxes to people who frankly are not working hard. Its fair for a little control by the government on benefits given.

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By *anchestercubMan over a year ago

manchester & NI

Anyone who thinks this is about 'fairness' is kidding themselves.

Why are NHS services not being rationed to be economically fair? Because it would lose votes.

Why are winter fuel payments not stopped when only pensioners get them? Because it would lose votes.

Why isn't child benefit being stopped for everyone? Because it would lose votes.

The Tories have always pitted the working poor against the unemployed poor - they did it in the 80s under Thatcher and they're doing it again now - the worst bit being that people still buy into it!

There is a growing large section of the right wing who revel and salivate over the misery of others. Constant bashing of the workless poor makes them happy, it makes them feel empowered and it makes them willing to vote - that's why the Tories do it.

Rather than fix economic problems they're just happy to blame and shame the people with the least control and influence.

As the Tories try to win back support from UKIP they will continue their onslaught of easy targets and they don't give a fuck who gets hurt in the process because they have never given a damn!

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By *andS66Couple over a year ago

Derby

""The trouble with Socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money" — Margaret Thatcher

Yet Denmark and Sweden seem to manage just fine.

They were the first countries to balance their books after the recession and are also the most 'socialised' when it comes to welfare and public services. "

Maybe we should follow Denmark's example.... beer is 50% more expensive, Cigarettes 20% more, income tax is 55%, and there is no state unemployment benefit - you have to pay an insurance policy for unemployment benefit, have to have had full time employment for 52 weeks over the previous 3 years to claim, and it lasts for a maximum of 2 years. You can't claim if you're under 18 or within 2 years of retiring. And the ceiling for benefit is lower than the national average wage.

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By *andS66Couple over a year ago

Derby

""The trouble with Socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money" — Margaret Thatcher

Yet Denmark and Sweden seem to manage just fine.

They were the first countries to balance their books after the recession and are also the most 'socialised' when it comes to welfare and public services.

No one now in this country would accept the removal of the tax free allowance, increase in basic taxation by another 10% and an extra 5% on VAT. Therefore the analogy is a bit pointless.

Yes I would accept that - the NHS, state education and defence do not have the funding they need. More money is needed.

I want excellent public services, to keep our people healthy, to educate them well and keep us safe - that will be to our benefit in the future.

Do you see the Swedes or Danes all jumping ship and abandoning their homelands? No! "

Wow! You must be on some money if you'd be ok with paying that extra income tax, let alone the VAT and extra duty in beer and cigs. To put into context,if you're in a wage of 25K, the income tax alone would mean your take home pay going down by about £500 per month....

But, if you're happy with that, then why don't you voluntarily give it to the government?

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