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Ashya King
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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its a difficult situation. I personally would trust the docs treating my child so don't understand why they wouldn't if the treatment they are offering is affective. but that's just my opinion |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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but by doing that they could of risked his health further I personally would trust the doctors. maybe I am more inclined to as my aunt is a cancer care nurse so I trust her judgement 100% |
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By *abioMan
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
"Wtf are the police up to hounding a loveing family who just want the best for their sick child , ive never been so pissed off for a long time"
its an awkward one... because if the kid had died and the police had done nothing then they would have been hammered!
they took the kid away from the hospital... and didn't let them know.. what would you have done?
the family want a treatment for their child that would cost the NHS 100,000 pounds..... going to spain isn't going to get that treatment, because it is in the czech republic... |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Sorry, but unless you have a really sick or disabled child, you can't comment on what someone has done. You have NO idea "
I don't have a really sick or disabled child but I have known people going through chemo and my aunt has told me about how different treatment can affect the immune system and how weak patients can be on that alone I wouldn't wanna put anyone threw anything that could make them more ill |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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If it was my son or my dog even I would be worried about moving him in case it made him worst or be in more pain because im not a medical expert and kids aren't so good at telling you how they are feeling. If you are ill I would think the last thing you would want to be doing is traveling. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I have watched the YouTube video of his dad saying why they decided to take him out of hospital. I think that a lot of people would have done the same as this family if they were in the same shoes and able to afford it! However, now that little boy is in a foreign hospital without his mummy and daddy!! I hope his older sibling is able to stay with him |
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And if the police didn't get involved and the child died there would be uproar.
They took the child out of hospital and didn't tell anyone where they where going.
I'm really pleased he is OK but it could of gone the other way.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"And if the police didn't get involved and the child died there would be uproar.
They took the child out of hospital and didn't tell anyone where they where going.
I'm really pleased he is OK but it could of gone the other way.
"
Yes and why couldn't they tell the hospital, because he wasn't meant to be moved? |
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It's a difficult situation really, the parents obviously didn't feel that they were receiving the best care available. They are also legally responsible for their child, so they're not required to seek permission to remove their child from hospital either.
I think that they've stated that they believe that a certain type of treatment (proton therapy) is the best chance for the survival of their son. This treatment is not used for brain tumours in the UK, but is successfully used in other countries.
Also... Although we know that the NHS is fantastic, we also know that they do sometimes need to make decisions based on COST rather than MEDICAL reasoning. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Having 2 kids.... id do whatever it takes to get the best treatment for my children. Id happily go to jail if I could make a difference to their lives. As a worried parent, you would run the risk of going elsewhere if the treatment isn't working. You would try anything. They wouldnt be allowed if they told authority. Its so sad  especially for the kid |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"And if the police didn't get involved and the child died there would be uproar.
They took the child out of hospital and didn't tell anyone where they where going.
I'm really pleased he is OK but it could of gone the other way.
Yes and why couldn't they tell the hospital, because he wasn't meant to be moved?"
Because they're questioning Drs opinions and because they didn't want a situation happening where they wouldn't be allowed to visit him in hospital because of that
Its all very sad and I don't think there are right or wrong answers to the case
I wish them all luck and I hope whatever the outcome it that they're all together sharing their love |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Let's face it, everyone is an expert on everything now that we have the interweb and we all know how accurate that is. They decided to take the child to Spain when the treatment the child needed is in the Czech Republic? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I've been in that position. Believe me....when you are faced with the imminent death of your adored child, you will do anything at all in your power to postpone the moment even when in your heart you know it is inevitable. Of one thing I am sure...that wee boy is deeply loved and cared for. I feel nothing but the deepest sadness for the whole family. |
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"And if the police didn't get involved and the child died there would be uproar.
They took the child out of hospital and didn't tell anyone where they where going.
I'm really pleased he is OK but it could of gone the other way.
Yes and why couldn't they tell the hospital, because he wasn't meant to be moved?"
its not a legal requirement to be treated by the NHS, unless the person is sectioned there is nothing to force someone to stay in hospital.
I dont think the police have hounded the family, they simply looked for a sick child and like others have said, if they had done nothing the public would be baying for blood if it turned out that he had died.
it must be a terrible situation for the family to be in. They want thei child to live but want treatment that the NHS doesnt offer. we dont know what conversations had been had between the hospital and the parents regarding has treatment so its hard to pass any kind of judgment on either party. |
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After watching this and hearing the dad explain exactly why he took him out of hospital, and that how useless the doctor was and being threatened they cant see their son if they continue to ask questions about the treatment.
I think its the doctoer that needs looking into not the parents.
http://youtu.be/14ETQn9ZPwk
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By *abioMan
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
"After watching this and hearing the dad explain exactly why he took him out of hospital, and that how useless the doctor was and being threatened they cant see their son if they continue to ask questions about the treatment.
I think its the doctoer that needs looking into not the parents.
http://youtu.be/14ETQn9ZPwk
"
but we are only hearing one side of the story.... which is unfair, because for the hospital to give there side people would complain they divulged private information.....
all the different youtube videos now coming out.... for example the one from the brother saying they had bought supplies of feeding equipment, a box load online and the stuff to power it...
but the hospital wouldn't have known that... the police wouldn't have known that...
they decided to take him out of care, and they had thought about it long enough to plan.... but didn't tell any of the authorities who would have had the childs best interest at heart |
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By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago
Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound |
It wasn't illegal for the parents to remove their child. There was no court order in place preventing his movement.
The hospital didn't even notice he was gone for several hours.
The parents should have left some kind of explanation of what they were doing but it looks like they suspected they would be prevented from moving their child. They were aware they were discharging their child against medical advice.
The Spanish police have now separated them from their sick son AND the rest of their children. How does that help the situation?
I think moving him with medical assistance would have been a better plan.
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By *iceduoCouple (FF)
over a year ago
manchester |
"It is not illegal to refuse treatment or take self discharge from hospital or discharge by legal guardians. Why were the police involved? "
you don't own your child, its illegal not to seek medical attention for a sick child. |
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By *iceduoCouple (FF)
over a year ago
manchester |
"The parents can do as they want,if the child suffers by there actions it will be on there heads and they have to live with it.
They have,however not commited a crime."
No, if they do that they have committed a criminal offence. |
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"It is not illegal to refuse treatment or take self discharge from hospital or discharge by legal guardians. Why were the police involved?
you don't own your child, its illegal not to seek medical attention for a sick child. "
But they wanted to.seek medical attention, just not the medical.attention the nhs could offer. The man hunt prevented them from reaching that. |
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By *abioMan
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
"It is not illegal to refuse treatment or take self discharge from hospital or discharge by legal guardians. Why were the police involved? "
because if something horrible had happened and the child had died you would be asking "why weren't the police involved!"
there are in a no-win situation....
so it comes out tonight that they went to spain to sell their 2nd home to get the money to get the treatment that isn't available on the NHS because it costs too much, and it doesn't have the success rate to make it viable..
so why did they have to go to spain? surely they could have sold the house from the UK? |
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By *abioMan
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
"It is not illegal to refuse treatment or take self discharge from hospital or discharge by legal guardians. Why were the police involved?
you don't own your child, its illegal not to seek medical attention for a sick child.
But they wanted to.seek medical attention, just not the medical.attention the nhs could offer. The man hunt prevented them from reaching that. "
they went to spain... the treatment is in the czech republic.... now... I'm not master of geography, but........ |
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By *iceduoCouple (FF)
over a year ago
manchester |
"It is not illegal to refuse treatment or take self discharge from hospital or discharge by legal guardians. Why were the police involved?
you don't own your child, its illegal not to seek medical attention for a sick child.
But they wanted to.seek medical attention, just not the medical.attention the nhs could offer. The man hunt prevented them from reaching that. "
A child who had brain surgery seven days ago needs to be in ICU not being dragged across Europe. Sadly Mr King does not know more than the doctors, if you look you will see that the NHS has sent lots of people to other countries for this treatment, sadly he has stage 4 brain cancer, there is no stage 5. He is going to die. surely it would be best to enjoy the time that is left rather than dragging the poor kid across europe. ffs. jen |
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"It is not illegal to refuse treatment or take self discharge from hospital or discharge by legal guardians. Why were the police involved?
you don't own your child, its illegal not to seek medical attention for a sick child.
But they wanted to.seek medical attention, just not the medical.attention the nhs could offer. The man hunt prevented them from reaching that.
they went to spain... the treatment is in the czech republic.... now... I'm not master of geography, but........"
I'm not a master of geography either. I'm also not a parent of a sick child who has allegedly been threatened to have the child taken away from them for asking questions regarding other procedures the nhs doesn't offer so I can't say what would be going through my mind when realising that there is a police hunt going on following my decision to withdraw my child from their treatment.
As you have already said, they had provisions. The child was not on medication. There was no immediate need to take the child to the czech republic. On the news they have said that the boy has been moved from a high dependency unit to a normal ward after just one night. |
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"It is not illegal to refuse treatment or take self discharge from hospital or discharge by legal guardians. Why were the police involved?
you don't own your child, its illegal not to seek medical attention for a sick child.
But they wanted to.seek medical attention, just not the medical.attention the nhs could offer. The man hunt prevented them from reaching that.
A child who had brain surgery seven days ago needs to be in ICU not being dragged across Europe. Sadly Mr King does not know more than the doctors, if you look you will see that the NHS has sent lots of people to other countries for this treatment, sadly he has stage 4 brain cancer, there is no stage 5. He is going to die. surely it would be best to enjoy the time that is left rather than dragging the poor kid across europe. ffs. jen"
Yet Mr king has stated that since leaving hospital his son has been brighter, moved more and smiled more.
If he is going to die should he not be with his family enjoying moments rather than in a hospital staring at the ceiling?
Now he is in a foreign hospital with no one he knows, probably scared and very alone. |
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By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago
Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound |
"It is not illegal to refuse treatment or take self discharge from hospital or discharge by legal guardians. Why were the police involved?
you don't own your child, its illegal not to seek medical attention for a sick child.
But they wanted to.seek medical attention, just not the medical.attention the nhs could offer. The man hunt prevented them from reaching that.
A child who had brain surgery seven days ago needs to be in ICU not being dragged across Europe. Sadly Mr King does not know more than the doctors, if you look you will see that the NHS has sent lots of people to other countries for this treatment, sadly he has stage 4 brain cancer, there is no stage 5. He is going to die. surely it would be best to enjoy the time that is left rather than dragging the poor kid across europe. ffs. jen"
Knowing he has stage four cancer may be what drove them to take such drastic action.
If the child is not in pain, is not unhappy and is being cared for then what is the difference between dying in ICU and dying on an adventure with his family?
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By *iceduoCouple (FF)
over a year ago
manchester |
"It is not illegal to refuse treatment or take self discharge from hospital or discharge by legal guardians. Why were the police involved?
you don't own your child, its illegal not to seek medical attention for a sick child.
But they wanted to.seek medical attention, just not the medical.attention the nhs could offer. The man hunt prevented them from reaching that.
A child who had brain surgery seven days ago needs to be in ICU not being dragged across Europe. Sadly Mr King does not know more than the doctors, if you look you will see that the NHS has sent lots of people to other countries for this treatment, sadly he has stage 4 brain cancer, there is no stage 5. He is going to die. surely it would be best to enjoy the time that is left rather than dragging the poor kid across europe. ffs. jen
Yet Mr king has stated that since leaving hospital his son has been brighter, moved more and smiled more.
If he is going to die should he not be with his family enjoying moments rather than in a hospital staring at the ceiling?
Now he is in a foreign hospital with no one he knows, probably scared and very alone. "
yes but to ensure he does not die in writhing agony he may need some medication only available in a hospital.
This whole event is tragic and very sad i cant see how its going to get much better either. |
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Well we've only got the parents side of the story.
From what I can gather they had there son for a few hours with the consent of the hospital. They could of phoned them and said they weren't taking him back without just disappearing.
But then everyone likes one side of a story that suits them. |
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"Well we've only got the parents side of the story.
From what I can gather they had there son for a few hours with the consent of the hospital. They could of phoned them and said they weren't taking him back without just disappearing.
But then everyone likes one side of a story that suits them."
Until the hospital issue a statement or it goes to trial and they have to give evidence it's all we have.
A lot of this will be assumption and conjecture of course bit isn't that what we do best on here?  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I'm sure it said on the news that the family have property in Spain which they hope to sell to fund the treatment the boy needs, thats why they are there. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I do not get this story at all
they have a seriously ill child, treatment that will help him is not available on the NHS so they took him somewhere where they could get it
surely as the kids parents its upto them where their child is treated and if they feel a hospital in Spain will give their child a better chance of recovery its their rights to move him there
i cant see what they did wrong, or why they have been arrested, just seems like a waste of police time and money to me |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Wtf are the police up to hounding a loveing family who just want the best for their sick child , ive never been so pissed off for a long time"
its been handled badly but on the flips side when the authorities do nothing you get situations like Baby P though this is admittedly different there would be hell to pay if they did nothing and the child died.  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"It is not illegal to refuse treatment or take self discharge from hospital or discharge by legal guardians. Why were the police involved?
you don't own your child, its illegal not to seek medical attention for a sick child.
But they wanted to.seek medical attention, just not the medical.attention the nhs could offer. The man hunt prevented them from reaching that.
A child who had brain surgery seven days ago needs to be in ICU not being dragged across Europe. Sadly Mr King does not know more than the doctors, if you look you will see that the NHS has sent lots of people to other countries for this treatment, sadly he has stage 4 brain cancer, there is no stage 5. He is going to die. surely it would be best to enjoy the time that is left rather than dragging the poor kid across europe. ffs. jen"
That's what I was thinking. They don't seem like very good parents to me. |
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This country is becoming more and more of a nanny state.
Clearly, the parents did not harm their child, they made a decision to seek alternative treatment. They looked well able to look after their child, unfortunately something that does not happen in many of our hospitals just now. What's caring about backing a family into a corner, to the point where they believe they have no other option but to leave.
If I had a child with cancer, I would think twice about going to Southampton for treatment.
There will always be 'difficult' patients/parents, but you cannot go around threatening them with legal action, just because they don't accept what you say as a health professional. Confrontation rarely works. Compassion and helping them to accept is what was needed.
I defy anyone to say, they wouldn't move the earth to save their child. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"It is not illegal to refuse treatment or take self discharge from hospital or discharge by legal guardians. Why were the police involved?
you don't own your child, its illegal not to seek medical attention for a sick child.
But they wanted to.seek medical attention, just not the medical.attention the nhs could offer. The man hunt prevented them from reaching that.
A child who had brain surgery seven days ago needs to be in ICU not being dragged across Europe. Sadly Mr King does not know more than the doctors, if you look you will see that the NHS has sent lots of people to other countries for this treatment, sadly he has stage 4 brain cancer, there is no stage 5. He is going to die. surely it would be best to enjoy the time that is left rather than dragging the poor kid across europe. ffs. jen
Yet Mr king has stated that since leaving hospital his son has been brighter, moved more and smiled more.
If he is going to die should he not be with his family enjoying moments rather than in a hospital staring at the ceiling?
Now he is in a foreign hospital with no one he knows, probably scared and very alone.
yes but to ensure he does not die in writhing agony he may need some medication only available in a hospital.
This whole event is tragic and very sad i cant see how its going to get much better either. "
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I do not get this story at all
they have a seriously ill child, treatment that will help him is not available on the NHS so they took him somewhere where they could get it
surely as the kids parents its upto them where their child is treated and if they feel a hospital in Spain will give their child a better chance of recovery its their rights to move him there
i cant see what they did wrong, or why they have been arrested, just seems like a waste of police time and money to me"
they took the child to Spain, the treatment is in the Czech Republic (opposite direction) it is alleged they went to sell property. It doesn't need the whole family to do that, it could have all been arranged here and they could have flown there and back in a day. without the necessity of all driving down there.
From what I understand, the child is going to die. It seems to me like the parents are in denial and are lashing out looking for someone to blame. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I do not get this story at all
they have a seriously ill child, treatment that will help him is not available on the NHS so they took him somewhere where they could get it
surely as the kids parents its upto them where their child is treated and if they feel a hospital in Spain will give their child a better chance of recovery its their rights to move him there
i cant see what they did wrong, or why they have been arrested, just seems like a waste of police time and money to methey took the child to Spain, the treatment is in the Czech Republic (opposite direction) it is alleged they went to sell property. It doesn't need the whole family to do that, it could have all been arranged here and they could have flown there and back in a day. without the necessity of all driving down there.
From what I understand, the child is going to die. It seems to me like the parents are in denial and are lashing out looking for someone to blame. "
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By *qua vitaeWoman
over a year ago
Shropshire/Midlands |
It's up to the parents whether their children get treated by the NHS, unless the child is a ward of the court/state. Radiotherapy on a small child's brain can result in brain damage, whereas the Protein treatment doesn't. They had every right to seek further treatment.
Doctors only give out advice and it's up to us whether to accept it or not. It's been suggested to give my autistic son Prozac - I'm in no rush to sedate him just to make my life easier. |
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By *iewMan
over a year ago
Forum Mod Angus & Findhorn |
they are in a Spanish Jail tonight, that is so sad....
goodness sake, surely after he slips away is the time for a decision about the rights & wrongs.....
every minute TOGETHER is precious. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"they are in a Spanish Jail tonight, that is so sad....
goodness sake, surely after he slips away is the time for a decision about the rights & wrongs.....
every minute TOGETHER is precious."
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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For those of you judging the parents or calling them bad parents because of the actions they chose, please try and put yourselfs in there shoes. What would you do if you were told your child has this condition??, or another type of cancer. They did what they did for whatever reason right or wrong. But they sure as hell don't deserve to be lock in a Spanish jail. They are going to loose there child, something which really shouldn't happen but sadly does to many people. No one has any right to treat them the way they are being treated, everyone reacts differently to news like this. Some take it in there stride and keep calm etc others panic freak out it's human nature. My heart goes out to them and any parent in the same situation or a patent who's child faces this evil called cancer. It's physical and mental torcher. |
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By *B9 QueenWoman
over a year ago
Over the rainbow, under the bridge |
"The child is going to die. The parents cant handle it, the really sad thing is they will probably never see him again because of ther actions jenx"
Regardless of their actions, removing them from their child is cruelty of the highest degree. How must that child be thinking/feeling? Unconscionable. |
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By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago
Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound |
"they are in a Spanish Jail tonight, that is so sad....
goodness sake, surely after he slips away is the time for a decision about the rights & wrongs.....
every minute TOGETHER is precious."
I have just seen that on the news. I find it incredible that a family that didn't break any law find themselves separated from their sick child by being held in custody.
Ashya's eldest brother got to see him earlier today, concerned that he has no communication now and is being left alone without anyone he knows. It seems unnecessarily cruel to have kept his brothers from seeing him for so long.
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By *iewMan
over a year ago
Forum Mod Angus & Findhorn |
"they are in a Spanish Jail tonight, that is so sad....
goodness sake, surely after he slips away is the time for a decision about the rights & wrongs.....
every minute TOGETHER is precious.
I have just seen that on the news. I find it incredible that a family that didn't break any law find themselves separated from their sick child by being held in custody.
Ashya's eldest brother got to see him earlier today, concerned that he has no communication now and is being left alone without anyone he knows. It seems unnecessarily cruel to have kept his brothers from seeing him for so long.
"
my jaw hit the floor whan I heard that.... that poor wee boy |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"they are in a Spanish Jail tonight, that is so sad....
goodness sake, surely after he slips away is the time for a decision about the rights & wrongs.....
every minute TOGETHER is precious."
Its shocking,Its the parents worst nightmare come true |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"After watching this and hearing the dad explain exactly why he took him out of hospital, and that how useless the doctor was and being threatened they cant see their son if they continue to ask questions about the treatment.
I think its the doctoer that needs looking into not the parents.
http://youtu.be/14ETQn9ZPwk
"
Totally and utterly agree
Doctors think they are god almighty and threaten taking away access to the child if they deign to question. Disgusting
I've seen the vid and the parents look like they only have the good of the child at heart. They have took all medical supplies needed and the child himself was happy until the Spanish arrested the parents.
Only 2 people really know what's good for a child and that's it's parents (as long as they are responsible)
Nanny state gone mad. Mind u it's easier than chasing real criminals isn't it |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Morally they may be right but legally not. The treatment they want is in the Czech republic, they have an apartment in Spain I think that they want to sell to pay for the treatment.
Surely selling the apartment first and then going directly to the Czech republic would have been more in their sons interest.
There must be more to this story.
Did they discuss this treatment with Drs first?
Is the proton treatment approved?
We need more information before casting any judgements.
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"Morally they may be right but legally not. The treatment they want is in the Czech republic, they have an apartment in Spain I think that they want to sell to pay for the treatment.
Surely selling the apartment first and then going directly to the Czech republic would have been more in their sons interest.
There must be more to this story.
Did they discuss this treatment with Drs first?
Is the proton treatment approved?
We need more information before casting any judgements.
"
What law have they broken? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Morally they may be right but legally not. The treatment they want is in the Czech republic, they have an apartment in Spain I think that they want to sell to pay for the treatment.
Surely selling the apartment first and then going directly to the Czech republic would have been more in their sons interest.
There must be more to this story.
Did they discuss this treatment with Drs first?
Is the proton treatment approved?
We need more information before casting any judgements.
"
I don't see how they have broke any laws. Surely it's their right to decide their sons treatment regime
Proton treatment is approved for use in many countries inc USA, France, etc and is sometimes very successful
We don't use it here because of cost not because of clinical reasoning is my understanding |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Morally they may be right but legally not. The treatment they want is in the Czech republic, they have an apartment in Spain I think that they want to sell to pay for the treatment.
Surely selling the apartment first and then going directly to the Czech republic would have been more in their sons interest.
There must be more to this story.
Did they discuss this treatment with Drs first?
Is the proton treatment approved?
We need more information before casting any judgements.
What law have they broken?"
As I understand it the childs parental rights are with the local authority so by taking their son without permission is the offence. Personally I don't know how I feel about that but it's the law |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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How have they broken the law if they still have legal parental responseibility???. They haven't they have done what at that split second they thought was right. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"How have they broken the law if they still have legal parental responseibility???. They haven't they have done what at that split second they thought was right. "
As I understand it parental responsibly was taken away. |
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"Morally they may be right but legally not. The treatment they want is in the Czech republic, they have an apartment in Spain I think that they want to sell to pay for the treatment.
Surely selling the apartment first and then going directly to the Czech republic would have been more in their sons interest.
There must be more to this story.
Did they discuss this treatment with Drs first?
Is the proton treatment approved?
We need more information before casting any judgements.
What law have they broken?
As I understand it the childs parental rights are with the local authority so by taking their son without permission is the offence. Personally I don't know how I feel about that but it's the law "
Is that all parents or just these two? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Personally i think the whole story takes the piss, there are parents that abuse their kids that don't get the media coverage this story has and what is their crime? To try and get the best medical care they can for their son, the uk had already said they could not provide the treatment he needed so they moved him, oh and the authorities are that concerned about this child's health they are adding extra mental pressure to him by keeping his parents away, go figure  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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To have parental rights removed is either done two ways the parents agree and sign a specific section under law, if they refuse it's taken to court and can be with evidence forced. It can take weeks to get into court in this case the child would be placed in a 'place of safety'. If this is the case and his parents no longer had parental responsibility why are the other children still in there care??? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Morally they may be right but legally not. The treatment they want is in the Czech republic, they have an apartment in Spain I think that they want to sell to pay for the treatment.
Surely selling the apartment first and then going directly to the Czech republic would have been more in their sons interest.
There must be more to this story.
Did they discuss this treatment with Drs first?
Is the proton treatment approved?
We need more information before casting any judgements.
What law have they broken?
As I understand it the childs parental rights are with the local authority so by taking their son without permission is the offence. Personally I don't know how I feel about that but it's the law
Is that all parents or just these two?"
These two, I believe that when it looked like they were a flight risk the local authority took over. Though this may have been after it was too late. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Wtf are the police up to hounding a loveing family who just want the best for their sick child , ive never been so pissed off for a long time"
Police get told by medical people who gave been treating the child that his life is in danger and it clearly was what are police to do say hey lets not bother upholding the law forget the parents for a moment childs health more important.
Whether folk agree with parents or not medics are to a degree detached from the emotions and I for one support them and police in this instance.
Suppose the child had died and cops did not react as they did would the o p then jump up shout fucking useless cops why did they do nothing. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"To have parental rights removed is either done two ways the parents agree and sign a specific section under law, if they refuse it's taken to court and can be with evidence forced. It can take weeks to get into court in this case the child would be placed in a 'place of safety'. If this is the case and his parents no longer had parental responsibility why are the other children still in there care??? "
Often families have one child taken but others stay. My mum used to foster kids in these situations and the families would visit on access days. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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The family retained parental responsibikity for this child. The doctor seems to have threatened them because they wanted to explore a different treatment option which is in direct violation of the nhs ethos of patient managed care. You have a right to decide your treatment regime, or that if your child, in this country. The treatment is viable and used in other countries for this cancer, as well as others. The family went to Spain to sell a property to finance their choice of medical treatment privately. Nothing has been done that infringed uk law.
Those criticising them for going to Spain first rather than straight to the treatment facility, there are reasons for doing so, as well. Perhaps they drove because their son had just had surgery and it was safer for him than flying. Perhaps they wanted to give him a few happy days during a very trying time. Perhaps to have a beautiful family memory, just in case. Perhaps they went there in order to finalise the sale and had all hell not needlessly broken out would be gathering to make the next leg of the journey even now.
They've done nothing wrong and deserve to have this situation rectified right now. |
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By *iceduoCouple (FF)
over a year ago
manchester |
"Morally they may be right but legally not. The treatment they want is in the Czech republic, they have an apartment in Spain I think that they want to sell to pay for the treatment.
Surely selling the apartment first and then going directly to the Czech republic would have been more in their sons interest.
There must be more to this story.
Did they discuss this treatment with Drs first?
Is the proton treatment approved?
We need more information before casting any judgements.
I don't see how they have broke any laws. Surely it's their right to decide their sons treatment regime
Proton treatment is approved for use in many countries inc USA, France, etc and is sometimes very successful
We don't use it here because of cost not because of clinical reasoning is my understanding "
the treatment will not work with this child, not hear not in france not anywhere, the nhs would pay to send him if it were. The parents simply cant accept the truth, the truth is that he is going to die. |
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By *iceduoCouple (FF)
over a year ago
manchester |
"For those of you judging the parents or calling them bad parents because of the actions they chose, please try and put yourselfs in there shoes. What would you do if you were told your child has this condition??, or another type of cancer. They did what they did for whatever reason right or wrong. But they sure as hell don't deserve to be lock in a Spanish jail.
They are going to loose there child, something which really shouldn't happen but sadly does to many people. No one has any right to treat them the way they are being treated, everyone reacts differently to news like this. Some take it in there stride and keep calm etc others panic freak out it's human nature. My heart goes out to them and any parent in the same situation or a patent who's child faces this evil called cancer. It's physical and mental torcher. "
if it was my child i wouldn't be dragging the poor kid across europe. sadly the child is going to die, all the money in the world won't change that. if it were my child i would try and enjoy the time that was left. this seems to be the problem the parents just can't handle the fact that he is going to die. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"For those of you judging the parents or calling them bad parents because of the actions they chose, please try and put yourselfs in there shoes. What would you do if you were told your child has this condition??, or another type of cancer. They did what they did for whatever reason right or wrong. But they sure as hell don't deserve to be lock in a Spanish jail.
They are going to loose there child, something which really shouldn't happen but sadly does to many people. No one has any right to treat them the way they are being treated, everyone reacts differently to news like this. Some take it in there stride and keep calm etc others panic freak out it's human nature. My heart goes out to them and any parent in the same situation or a patent who's child faces this evil called cancer. It's physical and mental torcher.
if it was my child i wouldn't be dragging the poor kid across europe. sadly the child is going to die, all the money in the world won't change that. if it were my child i would try and enjoy the time that was left. this seems to be the problem the parents just can't handle the fact that he is going to die. "
. So do all parents handle the fact there child is going to die?? |
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By *iceduoCouple (FF)
over a year ago
manchester |
"For those of you judging the parents or calling them bad parents because of the actions they chose, please try and put yourselfs in there shoes. What would you do if you were told your child has this condition??, or another type of cancer. They did what they did for whatever reason right or wrong. But they sure as hell don't deserve to be lock in a Spanish jail.
They are going to loose there child, something which really shouldn't happen but sadly does to many people. No one has any right to treat them the way they are being treated, everyone reacts differently to news like this. Some take it in there stride and keep calm etc others panic freak out it's human nature. My heart goes out to them and any parent in the same situation or a patent who's child faces this evil called cancer. It's physical and mental torcher.
if it was my child i wouldn't be dragging the poor kid across europe. sadly the child is going to die, all the money in the world won't change that. if it were my child i would try and enjoy the time that was left. this seems to be the problem the parents just can't handle the fact that he is going to die. . So do all parents handle the fact there child is going to die?? "
The 5 Stages of Loss and Grief.
1: Denial and Isolation
2: Anger
3: Bargaining
4: Depression
5: Acceptance
I think they are about stage 3 at the moment |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Morally they may be right but legally not. The treatment they want is in the Czech republic, they have an apartment in Spain I think that they want to sell to pay for the treatment.
Surely selling the apartment first and then going directly to the Czech republic would have been more in their sons interest.
There must be more to this story.
Did they discuss this treatment with Drs first?
Is the proton treatment approved?
We need more information before casting any judgements.
I don't see how they have broke any laws. Surely it's their right to decide their sons treatment regime
Proton treatment is approved for use in many countries inc USA, France, etc and is sometimes very successful
We don't use it here because of cost not because of clinical reasoning is my understanding
the treatment will not work with this child, not hear not in france not anywhere, the nhs would pay to send him if it were. The parents simply cant accept the truth, the truth is that he is going to die. "
The treatment may work four the child. The nhs only uses this treatment in one type of cancer. Other countries successfully use it for others. The fact is there are a great many useful treatments available in other countries which the nhs does not offer in the uk. Many. |
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By *iceduoCouple (FF)
over a year ago
manchester |
"Morally they may be right but legally not. The treatment they want is in the Czech republic, they have an apartment in Spain I think that they want to sell to pay for the treatment.
Surely selling the apartment first and then going directly to the Czech republic would have been more in their sons interest.
There must be more to this story.
Did they discuss this treatment with Drs first?
Is the proton treatment approved?
We need more information before casting any judgements.
I don't see how they have broke any laws. Surely it's their right to decide their sons treatment regime
Proton treatment is approved for use in many countries inc USA, France, etc and is sometimes very successful
We don't use it here because of cost not because of clinical reasoning is my understanding
the treatment will not work with this child, not hear not in france not anywhere, the nhs would pay to send him if it were. The parents simply cant accept the truth, the truth is that he is going to die.
The treatment may work four the child. The nhs only uses this treatment in one type of cancer. Other countries successfully use it for others. The fact is there are a great many useful treatments available in other countries which the nhs does not offer in the uk. Many. "
Thats why the NHS has sent many people for this particular treatment. This treatment will not work on his kind of cancer, it won't work as he has a tumour the size of a small orange in his brain.
nothing can save the poor child, i don't get why people cant except that. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"I still don't understand why the whole family needed to travel to Spain to sell a property?"
No they couldn't of been thinking straight, I mean what if every parent did what they did when there child was ill in hospital just doesn't bare thinking about. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Morally they may be right but legally not. The treatment they want is in the Czech republic, they have an apartment in Spain I think that they want to sell to pay for the treatment.
Surely selling the apartment first and then going directly to the Czech republic would have been more in their sons interest.
There must be more to this story.
Did they discuss this treatment with Drs first?
Is the proton treatment approved?
We need more information before casting any judgements.
I don't see how they have broke any laws. Surely it's their right to decide their sons treatment regime
Proton treatment is approved for use in many countries inc USA, France, etc and is sometimes very successful
We don't use it here because of cost not because of clinical reasoning is my understanding
the treatment will not work with this child, not hear not in france not anywhere, the nhs would pay to send him if it were. The parents simply cant accept the truth, the truth is that he is going to die.
The treatment may work four the child. The nhs only uses this treatment in one type of cancer. Other countries successfully use it for others. The fact is there are a great many useful treatments available in other countries which the nhs does not offer in the uk. Many.
Thats why the NHS has sent many people for this particular treatment. This treatment will not work on his kind of cancer, it won't work as he has a tumour the size of a small orange in his brain.
nothing can save the poor child, i don't get why people cant except that. "
The mayo clinic disagrees with you:
http://www.mayoclinic.org/proton-beam-therapy/about-proton-therapy
As does the American brain tumor association
http://www.abta.org/brain-tumor-treatment/treatments/proton-therapy.html
I've had family in the u.s. treated via this method and it does work, even in late stages, quite often. This poor child may die, yes, bit you treat it as if it's a given when nothing is a given. Sicker children that this one have pulled through. If it were my son i bloody wouldn't give up on him
|
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"I still don't understand why the whole family needed to travel to Spain to sell a property?
No they couldn't of been thinking straight, I mean what if every parent did what they did when there child was ill in hospital just doesn't bare thinking about."
Sarcasm? Gosh, so becoming of you |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Morally they may be right but legally not. The treatment they want is in the Czech republic, they have an apartment in Spain I think that they want to sell to pay for the treatment.
Surely selling the apartment first and then going directly to the Czech republic would have been more in their sons interest.
There must be more to this story.
Did they discuss this treatment with Drs first?
Is the proton treatment approved?
We need more information before casting any judgements.
I don't see how they have broke any laws. Surely it's their right to decide their sons treatment regime
Proton treatment is approved for use in many countries inc USA, France, etc and is sometimes very successful
We don't use it here because of cost not because of clinical reasoning is my understanding
the treatment will not work with this child, not hear not in france not anywhere, the nhs would pay to send him if it were. The parents simply cant accept the truth, the truth is that he is going to die.
The treatment may work four the child. The nhs only uses this treatment in one type of cancer. Other countries successfully use it for others. The fact is there are a great many useful treatments available in other countries which the nhs does not offer in the uk. Many.
Thats why the NHS has sent many people for this particular treatment. This treatment will not work on his kind of cancer, it won't work as he has a tumour the size of a small orange in his brain.
nothing can save the poor child, i don't get why people cant except that. "
. Because for some death is emotional not matter of fact!. Everything for them atm is irrational. We all deal with things differently fact!!!. Have some empathy for them please it can't be a nice feeling |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"I still don't understand why the whole family needed to travel to Spain to sell a property?
No they couldn't of been thinking straight, I mean what if every parent did what they did when there child was ill in hospital just doesn't bare thinking about.
Sarcasm? Gosh, so becoming of you"
I don't do sarcasm not on subjects like this. |
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By *iceduoCouple (FF)
over a year ago
manchester |
"Morally they may be right but legally not. The treatment they want is in the Czech republic, they have an apartment in Spain I think that they want to sell to pay for the treatment.
Surely selling the apartment first and then going directly to the Czech republic would have been more in their sons interest.
There must be more to this story.
Did they discuss this treatment with Drs first?
Is the proton treatment approved?
We need more information before casting any judgements.
I don't see how they have broke any laws. Surely it's their right to decide their sons treatment regime
Proton treatment is approved for use in many countries inc USA, France, etc and is sometimes very successful
We don't use it here because of cost not because of clinical reasoning is my understanding
the treatment will not work with this child, not hear not in france not anywhere, the nhs would pay to send him if it were. The parents simply cant accept the truth, the truth is that he is going to die.
The treatment may work four the child. The nhs only uses this treatment in one type of cancer. Other countries successfully use it for others. The fact is there are a great many useful treatments available in other countries which the nhs does not offer in the uk. Many.
Thats why the NHS has sent many people for this particular treatment. This treatment will not work on his kind of cancer, it won't work as he has a tumour the size of a small orange in his brain.
nothing can save the poor child, i don't get why people cant except that.
The mayo clinic disagrees with you:
http://www.mayoclinic.org/proton-beam-therapy/about-proton-therapy
As does the American brain tumor association
http://www.abta.org/brain-tumor-treatment/treatments/proton-therapy.html
I've had family in the u.s. treated via this method and it does work, even in late stages, quite often. This poor child may die, yes, bit you treat it as if it's a given when nothing is a given. Sicker children that this one have pulled through. If it were my son i bloody wouldn't give up on him
"
Sorry nothing there mentions stage 4 medulloblastoma. The nhs have sent lots of kids of for this treatment, its just to late for him
|
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"For those of you judging the parents or calling them bad parents because of the actions they chose, please try and put yourselfs in there shoes. What would you do if you were told your child has this condition??, or another type of cancer. They did what they did for whatever reason right or wrong. But they sure as hell don't deserve to be lock in a Spanish jail.
They are going to loose there child, something which really shouldn't happen but sadly does to many people. No one has any right to treat them the way they are being treated, everyone reacts differently to news like this. Some take it in there stride and keep calm etc others panic freak out it's human nature. My heart goes out to them and any parent in the same situation or a patent who's child faces this evil called cancer. It's physical and mental torcher.
if it was my child i wouldn't be dragging the poor kid across europe. sadly the child is going to die, all the money in the world won't change that. if it were my child i would try and enjoy the time that was left. this seems to be the problem the parents just can't handle the fact that he is going to die. . So do all parents handle the fact there child is going to die?? "
speaking as someone who has lost a child at 20 months old, if i thought a cure for his condition was available in another country i would have tried to get it
its ok people saying they did wrong and stating how they would do things difference but desperate people do desperate things, its hard to accept your child is dieing, unless you have be faced with their situation i don't think you really know what you would do or how you would handle it, you cling to every chance and even the smallest probability seems worth it, at the end of the day they are people on the edge of mental endurance |
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"Morally they may be right but legally not. The treatment they want is in the Czech republic, they have an apartment in Spain I think that they want to sell to pay for the treatment.
Surely selling the apartment first and then going directly to the Czech republic would have been more in their sons interest.
There must be more to this story.
Did they discuss this treatment with Drs first?
Is the proton treatment approved?
We need more information before casting any judgements.
I don't see how they have broke any laws. Surely it's their right to decide their sons treatment regime
Proton treatment is approved for use in many countries inc USA, France, etc and is sometimes very successful
We don't use it here because of cost not because of clinical reasoning is my understanding
the treatment will not work with this child, not hear not in france not anywhere, the nhs would pay to send him if it were. The parents simply cant accept the truth, the truth is that he is going to die.
The treatment may work four the child. The nhs only uses this treatment in one type of cancer. Other countries successfully use it for others. The fact is there are a great many useful treatments available in other countries which the nhs does not offer in the uk. Many.
Thats why the NHS has sent many people for this particular treatment. This treatment will not work on his kind of cancer, it won't work as he has a tumour the size of a small orange in his brain.
nothing can save the poor child, i don't get why people cant except that.
The mayo clinic disagrees with you:
http://www.mayoclinic.org/proton-beam-therapy/about-proton-therapy
As does the American brain tumor association
http://www.abta.org/brain-tumor-treatment/treatments/proton-therapy.html
I've had family in the u.s. treated via this method and it does work, even in late stages, quite often. This poor child may die, yes, bit you treat it as if it's a given when nothing is a given. Sicker children that this one have pulled through. If it were my son i bloody wouldn't give up on him
"
I have a friend who had half his brain removed because of cancer, doctors said he had 3 months after the surgery, 15 years later he, thankfully he is still with us.
It is dreadful situation to be in for the family, & honestly, I find it poor form for others to slate the parents to try the best for their child without the full facts of the case.
Patients or guardians are free to not accept a doctors advice are they not, unless under a court order? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"For those of you judging the parents or calling them bad parents because of the actions they chose, please try and put yourselfs in there shoes. What would you do if you were told your child has this condition??, or another type of cancer. They did what they did for whatever reason right or wrong. But they sure as hell don't deserve to be lock in a Spanish jail.
They are going to loose there child, something which really shouldn't happen but sadly does to many people. No one has any right to treat them the way they are being treated, everyone reacts differently to news like this. Some take it in there stride and keep calm etc others panic freak out it's human nature. My heart goes out to them and any parent in the same situation or a patent who's child faces this evil called cancer. It's physical and mental torcher.
if it was my child i wouldn't be dragging the poor kid across europe. sadly the child is going to die, all the money in the world won't change that. if it were my child i would try and enjoy the time that was left. this seems to be the problem the parents just can't handle the fact that he is going to die. . So do all parents handle the fact there child is going to die??
speaking as someone who has lost a child at 20 months old, if i thought a cure for his condition was available in another country i would have tried to get it
its ok people saying they did wrong and stating how they would do things difference but desperate people do desperate things, its hard to accept your child is dieing, unless you have be faced with their situation i don't think you really know what you would do or how you would handle it, you cling to every chance and even the smallest probability seems worth it, at the end of the day they are people on the edge of mental endurance "
. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"I still don't understand why the whole family needed to travel to Spain to sell a property?
No they couldn't of been thinking straight, I mean what if every parent did what they did when there child was ill in hospital just doesn't bare thinking about.
Sarcasm? Gosh, so becoming of you
I don't do sarcasm not on subjects like this. "
not fooling me |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Morally they may be right but legally not. The treatment they want is in the Czech republic, they have an apartment in Spain I think that they want to sell to pay for the treatment.
Surely selling the apartment first and then going directly to the Czech republic would have been more in their sons interest.
There must be more to this story.
Did they discuss this treatment with Drs first?
Is the proton treatment approved?
We need more information before casting any judgements.
I don't see how they have broke any laws. Surely it's their right to decide their sons treatment regime
Proton treatment is approved for use in many countries inc USA, France, etc and is sometimes very successful
We don't use it here because of cost not because of clinical reasoning is my understanding
the treatment will not work with this child, not hear not in france not anywhere, the nhs would pay to send him if it were. The parents simply cant accept the truth, the truth is that he is going to die.
The treatment may work four the child. The nhs only uses this treatment in one type of cancer. Other countries successfully use it for others. The fact is there are a great many useful treatments available in other countries which the nhs does not offer in the uk. Many.
Thats why the NHS has sent many people for this particular treatment. This treatment will not work on his kind of cancer, it won't work as he has a tumour the size of a small orange in his brain.
nothing can save the poor child, i don't get why people cant except that.
The mayo clinic disagrees with you:
http://www.mayoclinic.org/proton-beam-therapy/about-proton-therapy
As does the American brain tumor association
http://www.abta.org/brain-tumor-treatment/treatments/proton-therapy.html
I've had family in the u.s. treated via this method and it does work, even in late stages, quite often. This poor child may die, yes, bit you treat it as if it's a given when nothing is a given. Sicker children that this one have pulled through. If it were my son i bloody wouldn't give up on him
Sorry nothing there mentions stage 4 medulloblastoma. The nhs have sent lots of kids of for this treatment, its just to late for him
"
How about a peer re_iewed study specifically on medulloblastoma in young children?
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/23790826/
|
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By *iceduoCouple (FF)
over a year ago
manchester |
Right im out of this one, but one final thought, that Ng tube that they were feeding him with. If its miss positioned the person will drown, as the food mix will be pumped in to his lungs. The tube can become easily dislodged.It position has to be checked before each use. Without a X-ray there is no way to know where it is. Just feeding him outside the hospital was a extremely risky thing to do.
Any way i hope it all sorts itself out for the poor kid. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
Awwwww a 5 year old under police guard in hospital all alone. His parents or his siblings not allowed to see him ?
Its absolutely disgraceful that they're treating the whole family like this.
Instead he's all alone bless him  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Right im out of this one, but one final thought, that Ng tube that they were feeding him with. If its miss positioned the person will drown, as the food mix will be pumped in to his lungs. The tube can become easily dislodged.It position has to be checked before each use. Without a X-ray there is no way to know where it is. Just feeding him outside the hospital was a extremely risky thing to do.
Any way i hope it all sorts itself out for the poor kid. "
. That's why they test the tube prior to every feed with litnus paper, I'm sure his parents would have been taught this as one of the first things. hundreds of children with cancer and other illnesses are sent home from hospital with ng tubes!. As do children with gastrostomys or jegonostomys just as risky and more prone to infection. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"They were threatened with a interim care order there was not one currently in place. Just on the news. "
BBC website says that Portsmouth city council was granted temporary wardship on Friday. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I'm sure the hospital are not allowed to discuss his condition and their treatment because of privacy issues.
When all you hear is one side it is hard to know where to stand.
From what I read there had been no application to have him made a ward of court or anything along those lines and the police were involved because he was at risk from his feeding tube failing and other complications so it only became a child protection issue when it was deemed that he had been put at risk. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"They were threatened with a interim care order there was not one currently in place. Just on the news.
BBC website says that Portsmouth city council was granted temporary wardship on Friday."
. That's after his family left the country on Thursday. Regardless tonight his parents are in jail, and a little boy is on his own scared in a Spanish hospital. To put things into perspective rather than this pointless point scoring proton treatment costs approx 100k per treatment. Man U have spent 200 mil today on football players GO FIGURE!!. Supporters pay for season tickets to pay for idiots to kick a ball and play hurt if tackled, yet a child that's going to die can't see his family or get treatment from our nation. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I do believe it's very wrong the things that have happened but somewhere along the line someone has decided this treatment will not work for this child, money is not the issue as the parents have said they will pay. It seems to have been a clinical decision maybe based on quality of life. It must be agonising for the family and of course we are all sympathetic. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I still don't understand why the whole family needed to travel to Spain to sell a property?
No they couldn't of been thinking straight, I mean what if every parent did what they did when there child was ill in hospital just doesn't bare thinking about.
Sarcasm? Gosh, so becoming of you
I don't do sarcasm not on subjects like this. not fooling me"
ha ha very funny. |
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By *emmefataleWoman
over a year ago
dirtybigbadsgirlville |
"I'm sure the hospital are not allowed to discuss his condition and their treatment because of privacy issues.
When all you hear is one side it is hard to know where to stand.
From what I read there had been no application to have him made a ward of court or anything along those lines and the police were involved because he was at risk from his feeding tube failing and other complications so it only became a child protection issue when it was deemed that he had been put at risk."
Portsmouth City Council were granted temporary wardship on Friday. I think the whole thing is very sad, for this little boy AND his family. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I'm sure the hospital are not allowed to discuss his condition and their treatment because of privacy issues.
When all you hear is one side it is hard to know where to stand.
From what I read there had been no application to have him made a ward of court or anything along those lines and the police were involved because he was at risk from his feeding tube failing and other complications so it only became a child protection issue when it was deemed that he had been put at risk.Portsmouth City Council were granted temporary wardship on Friday. I think the whole thing is very sad, for this little boy AND his family. "
It is sad, he would certainly be better off with his family around him, although he may also have been better off if he hadn't been moved.
He was taken on Thursday and not made a ward of the council until Friday. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I think they deserve to be locked up for what they have done even if to show others its not the right thing to do.What do you think they have done so wrong to deserve a prison sentence?"
read the rest of the posts then you will know. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I think they deserve to be locked up for what they have done even if to show others its not the right thing to do."
Really !!!??? You know these people do you? (Sorry if you have, but do you know what it's like to have a really ill child ?) |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I think they deserve to be locked up for what they have done even if to show others its not the right thing to do.
Really !!!??? You know these people do you? (Sorry if you have, but do you know what it's like to have a really ill child ?)"
I am lucky I have never had a really ill child but have had an ill dog and ill parents, so it doesn't take that much imagination to know what it must be like. I am more worried about the child and other children who might suffer. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I think they deserve to be locked up for what they have done even if to show others its not the right thing to do."
i don't think making an example out of them will achieve anything, most parents would risk a prison sentence to try and save their child's life |
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"I think they deserve to be locked up for what they have done even if to show others its not the right thing to do.
i don't think making an example out of them will achieve anything, most parents would risk a prison sentence to try and save their child's life "
I would have dedicated my life to God if my son had lived and move heaven and earth. I knew my son was dying but I never gave up hope or tell my husband we had about 12 hours of his life left.
My heart goes out to these parents: paedo gangs roam free whilst loving parents are banged up!
Sad, sorry state of affairs. |
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"I think they deserve to be locked up for what they have done even if to show others its not the right thing to do."
they have done what they think right for their son, its a bit early to say whether their actions are in his best interest on a medical basis yet..
the lad is ill and the best place for them now is at his bedside not banged up..
no one benefits from them being separated at this moment, its inhumane.. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I think they deserve to be locked up for what they have done even if to show others its not the right thing to do.
i don't think making an example out of them will achieve anything, most parents would risk a prison sentence to try and save their child's life
I would have dedicated my life to God if my son had lived and move heaven and earth. I knew my son was dying but I never gave up hope or tell my husband we had about 12 hours of his life left.
My heart goes out to these parents: paedo gangs roam free whilst loving parents are banged up!
Sad, sorry state of affairs. "
couldn't have put it better myself x |
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By *iewMan
over a year ago
Forum Mod Angus & Findhorn |
"All charges have been dropped and their free to go back to their son and about bloody time too"
fantastic, I didn't know that and your post has just put the biggest smile on my face....
may they be at peace as a family and help the wee boy on his journey to improved health, or to the angels. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Wtf are the police up to hounding a loveing family who just want the best for their sick child , ive never been so pissed off for a long time
its an awkward one... because if the kid had died and the police had done nothing then they would have been hammered!
they took the kid away from the hospital... and didn't let them know.. what would you have done?
the family want a treatment for their child that would cost the NHS 100,000 pounds..... going to spain isn't going to get that treatment, because it is in the czech republic..."
Seems to me that the family didn't bother to inform the hospital they were going and if that's the case then i feel the police did the right thing as the child's health could have been in danger !
Plus they didn't go to the country offering the treatment ! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"
the lad is ill and the best place for them now is at his bedside not banged up..
no one benefits from them being separated at this moment, its inhumane.. "
Thankfully the authorities agree |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"All charges have been dropped and their free to go back to their son and about bloody time too"
So they should,the whole thing has been absolutely appalling |
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By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago
Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound |
I've been listening to the news most of today. While the arrest warrant has been dropped here there is still a bit of process to go through in Spain.
The CPS here will take no further action. They're not quite there yet.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Now i hope they sue the all the bastards that tried to stop them helping ashya"
You can't say that when you don't know all the facts. There is very likely more to this case than we are aware of. |
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By *abioMan
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
"Now i hope they sue the all the bastards that tried to stop them helping ashya"
and if anything had happened to the kid... the hospial and the police would have gotten it in the neck, I have not issue with them issueing the alerts
once the kid was found, they should have dropped the extradition bit straight away... that is the only bit where I agree with you,
I think they should have told the hospital they were leaving... and that they had supplies.... they never did! that bit only came out after thru members of the family.... who again never told the authorities..
one phone call would have put those fears to rest......
I still dont see why the WHOLE family had to go to spain if the intention was to sell the holiday home to pay for the treatment, and taking the child out of the hospital for a longer roundabout journey... |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Now i hope they sue the all the bastards that tried to stop them helping ashya
and if anything had happened to the kid... the hospial and the police would have gotten it in the neck, I have not issue with them issueing the alerts
once the kid was found, they should have dropped the extradition bit straight away... that is the only bit where I agree with you,
I think they should have told the hospital they were leaving... and that they had supplies.... they never did! that bit only came out after thru members of the family.... who again never told the authorities..
one phone call would have put those fears to rest......
I still dont see why the WHOLE family had to go to spain if the intention was to sell the holiday home to pay for the treatment, and taking the child out of the hospital for a longer roundabout journey..."
Hear hear! Is no-one else bothered by the fact that the parents made emotionally manipulative use of social media rather than just phone someone in authority to let them know Ashya was ok and being cared for?
JW mentality to the core. Propaganda propaganda propaganda.
However, that does not mean I do not feel for the boy and his family. But in my opinion they have gone about this completely the wrong way. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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And if I was being cynical, I would say something like, "and look at how much attention we've got now - this'll help us raise the money we need."
I don't want to believe that is the case, but that's what reason tells me is the case based on their actions. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"There J W
There said and done
Their choices affect their offspring"
Everybody's choices affect their offspring. However, JWs do not have much freedom of thought, so their choices are often made for them, whether they realise it or not. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"There J W
There said and done
Their choices affect their offspring
Everybody's choices affect their offspring. However, JWs do not have much freedom of thought, so their choices are often made for them, whether they realise it or not."
However, that's not to say that that's what happened in this case, as they had apparently already agreed to a blood transfusion. But to understand the JW mentality is to possibly understand their choices. |
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"I think its because they were in the wrong to be taking him out of hospital in the first place poor little boy."
This is a difficult one but they have the health of their son in their mind 24/7 and that is there prime concern. Many people are rightly concerned about the level of care their loved ones receive at the hands of Drs. People don't always receive the care they need and it is their priority as a parent to protect their child.
They didn't need the permission of the hospital to remove him and why should they?
Are we saying that the state knows best and is always right & forget people's choices?
They are trying to do what's best for their son, perhaps they felt the hospital was just doing what was required and not what he actually needed?
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By *abioMan
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
interesting statement from the hospital in the czech republic itself in regards to the proton therepy....
"A spokesman for the Proton Therapy Centre (PTC) in the Czech Republic said it had received additional information concerning the status of Ashya’s health. He said Dr Gary Nicolin, a consultant paediatric oncologist and lead for paediatric neuro-oncology at University Hospital Southampton, had sent complete medical reports, including operation notes, histology reports and imaging reports. He said the PTC medical board re_iewed this documentation at 8am today.
Dr Jiri Kubes, head of proton therapy at Proton Therapy Center Czech, said: “We have agreed that proton therapy is a suitable method of treatment for Ashya. So, Ashya shall go for proton therapy to the Czech Republic. However, prior to this he will need to return to England first.”
The centre said Dr Nicolin had confirmed that Ashya must first undergo two cycles of chemotherapy, which are expected to take several weeks. After that he would be able to travel to Prague for proton therapy, the spokesman said."
so the family got what they wanted... they didn't have to move the kid to spain... it is now all PR......
did the family ever talk to the hospital doing the therepy? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Now i hope they sue the all the bastards that tried to stop them helping ashya
and if anything had happened to the kid... the hospial and the police would have gotten it in the neck, I have not issue with them issueing the alerts
once the kid was found, they should have dropped the extradition bit straight away... that is the only bit where I agree with you,
I think they should have told the hospital they were leaving... and that they had supplies.... they never did! that bit only came out after thru members of the family.... who again never told the authorities..
one phone call would have put those fears to rest......
I still dont see why the WHOLE family had to go to spain if the intention was to sell the holiday home to pay for the treatment, and taking the child out of the hospital for a longer roundabout journey...
Hear hear! Is no-one else bothered by the fact that the parents made emotionally manipulative use of social media rather than just phone someone in authority to let them know Ashya was ok and being cared for?
JW mentality to the core. Propaganda propaganda propaganda.
However, that does not mean I do not feel for the boy and his family. But in my opinion they have gone about this completely the wrong way."
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By *abioMan
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
" Well done
Many were thinking a PR outfit"
my thought is that they are out of prision... and they are having a Press conference in seville whilst the poor kid is in malaga.....
if the kid takes president wouldn't every second count.....
it is now pr spin after pr spin.... |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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" Well done
Many were thinking a PR outfit
my thought is that they are out of prision... and they are having a Press conference in seville whilst the poor kid is in malaga.....
if the kid takes president wouldn't every second count.....
it is now pr spin after pr spin...."
I was thinking the same sort of thing, they seem a bit strange to me. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I as a parent sympathise with any parent with a desperately sick child.
Nevertheless since this story broke the recurring thought that I have is that this is medical tourism and if everyone behaved like this there would be chaos. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I as a parent sympathise with any parent with a desperately sick child.
Nevertheless since this story broke the recurring thought that I have is that this is medical tourism and if everyone behaved like this there would be chaos. "
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Love to see how some of you would react if it was your child in this position. So what if they used the media, good on them they are trying to save there son. So your all aware to get treaent like this it goes to a medical board in the NHS they make the choice not the actual drs treating the child, a case put forward and re_iewed the outcome the child gets it or not. If this was your child how would it make you feel being told no???, they as parents may have made a few bad choices by going overseas but they did what they thought was best. Perhaps if the NHS stopped treating all those that are not entitled to the service or druggies then children with childhood cancers may get the treatment they need. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Love to see how some of you would react if it was your child in this position. So what if they used the media, good on them they are trying to save there son. So your all aware to get treaent like this it goes to a medical board in the NHS they make the choice not the actual drs treating the child, a case put forward and re_iewed the outcome the child gets it or not. If this was your child how would it make you feel being told no???, they as parents may have made a few bad choices by going overseas but they did what they thought was best. Perhaps if the NHS stopped treating all those that are not entitled to the service or druggies then children with childhood cancers may get the treatment they need. "
Considering they are the trained professionals, and I am not, then I would trust them. If I really felt they were wrong, I would get a second opinion. I certainly wouldn't take the child out of hospital without telling anyone, presuming that I could do a better job of looking after them.
As crappy as it is, not everybody can be saved, and we shouldn't expect that they can. We should be grateful we even have medicine. People in the past had no hope.
You may not even realise the relevance, but JWs are brainwashed into believing that everyone is out to get them and to be distrustful of anyone not in "The Truth," which may have had some effect on their decision. They are influenced to forgo higher education, so very few of them would ever become doctors, but expect someone else to so that they can have the best medical care. And then suddenly they know better when it comes to a difficult case.
Now don't get me wrong, this is a horrible situation for all involved, and I'm sure a lot of what's happened is down to their stress and anguish, but of certainly should not be so quick to blame everybody else. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Love to see how some of you would react if it was your child in this position. So what if they used the media, good on them they are trying to save there son. So your all aware to get treaent like this it goes to a medical board in the NHS they make the choice not the actual drs treating the child, a case put forward and re_iewed the outcome the child gets it or not. If this was your child how would it make you feel being told no???, they as parents may have made a few bad choices by going overseas but they did what they thought was best. Perhaps if the NHS stopped treating all those that are not entitled to the service or druggies then children with childhood cancers may get the treatment they need.
Considering they are the trained professionals, and I am not, then I would trust them. If I really felt they were wrong, I would get a second opinion. I certainly wouldn't take the child out of hospital without telling anyone, presuming that I could do a better job of looking after them.
As crappy as it is, not everybody can be saved, and we shouldn't expect that they can. We should be grateful we even have medicine. People in the past had no hope.
You may not even realise the relevance, but JWs are brainwashed into believing that everyone is out to get them and to be distrustful of anyone not in "The Truth," which may have had some effect on their decision. They are influenced to forgo higher education, so very few of them would ever become doctors, but expect someone else to so that they can have the best medical care. And then suddenly they know better when it comes to a difficult case.
Now don't get me wrong, this is a horrible situation for all involved, and I'm sure a lot of what's happened is down to their stress and anguish, but of certainly should not be so quick to blame everybody else."
*we not of |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Love to see how some of you would react if it was your child in this position. So what if they used the media, good on them they are trying to save there son. So your all aware to get treaent like this it goes to a medical board in the NHS they make the choice not the actual drs treating the child, a case put forward and re_iewed the outcome the child gets it or not. If this was your child how would it make you feel being told no???, they as parents may have made a few bad choices by going overseas but they did what they thought was best. Perhaps if the NHS stopped treating all those that are not entitled to the service or druggies then children with childhood cancers may get the treatment they need. "
You are also presuming that the doctors are trying to stop the child get the treatment he needs. I'd be careful there. You're suggesting a rather large conspiracy theory. How do you know know what treatment he needs. All we know is what treatment the parents want. There may be a difference there. We are not the trained professionals and we do not know what has actually gone on, only what we have been told by one side. And I would argue in an emotionally manipulative way. So not necessarily the facts. But a good way to raise interest and money.
Now I wouldn't like to say that was on purpose in this case, but we shouldn't deny that it is a possibility. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Love to see how some of you would react if it was your child in this position. So what if they used the media, good on them they are trying to save there son. So your all aware to get treaent like this it goes to a medical board in the NHS they make the choice not the actual drs treating the child, a case put forward and re_iewed the outcome the child gets it or not. If this was your child how would it make you feel being told no???, they as parents may have made a few bad choices by going overseas but they did what they thought was best. Perhaps if the NHS stopped treating all those that are not entitled to the service or druggies then children with childhood cancers may get the treatment they need.
You are also presuming that the doctors are trying to stop the child get the treatment he needs. I'd be careful there. You're suggesting a rather large conspiracy theory. How do you know know what treatment he needs. All we know is what treatment the parents want. There may be a difference there. We are not the trained professionals and we do not know what has actually gone on, only what we have been told by one side. And I would argue in an emotionally manipulative way. So not necessarily the facts. But a good way to raise interest and money.
Now I wouldn't like to say that was on purpose in this case, but we shouldn't deny that it is a possibility."
. No not everyone is trained however i have more experience than most in this environment. I have not presumed at all, as im in no doubt they have done there up most for this child as they do for every child that comes into a hospital regardless of the illness. The failing is by the NHS not the drs, funding etc, regardless of the age of the person if a drug can prolong life or make it better the funding should be given its simple. Plenty of news reports say women need drugs for breast cancer yet its not funded in the uk, thats not good enough it should be funded life is precious. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Considering that blood transfusions occasionally become necessary after chemotherapy, this could be another reason why they absconded for alternative therapy. Although they are now being offered the treatment, the boy will have to have two rounds of chemo first. This may not be over yet. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Considering that blood transfusions occasionally become necessary after chemotherapy, this could be another reason why they absconded for alternative therapy. Although they are now being offered the treatment, the boy will have to have two rounds of chemo first. This may not be over yet."
. They had agreed to a blood transfusion as far as reports go.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Considering that blood transfusions occasionally become necessary after chemotherapy, this could be another reason why they absconded for alternative therapy. Although they are now being offered the treatment, the boy will have to have two rounds of chemo first. This may not be over yet.. They had agreed to a blood transfusion as far as reports go.
"
But it wasn't necessary in the end for if op. Perhaps they had a change of mind since (or had it changed). Interestingly, the hospital says they were never denying the proton beam therapy, and were in fact helping them down that route, albeit at their own expense. If that is true, then what was the real reason for their flight? Dare I suggest this was all a big ploy to raise money from well-meaning people who would feel for their situation? Because if it was, then it worked.
This gets more intriguing everyday. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Having read tonight's article on the Guardian website, I think it's safe to assume I was right to say I was right that people were being too quick to blame the doctors. It seems clear to me that they were always acting in the child's best interests and that the parents, under their immense stress, just made an error of judgement. Their trip to Prague being agreed is clearly because time is now of the essence to get treatment for Ashya, and nobody wants the parents holding up treatment any more, even though the treatment is not likely to be any more effective than that which he would have gotten in England. |
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I would consider parents who leave their young children unattended in holiday apartments for hours neglectful.
