FabSwingers.com > Forums > The Lounge > Douglas Carswell joins UKIP

Douglas Carswell joins UKIP

By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

The conservative MP for Clacton, Douglas Carswell today left the Tory party and defected to UKIP. He now plans to stand for the clacton seat in a by-election for UKIP and i think he will comfortably win and soon become UKIP's first MP in the commons, as he won by quite a large majority in the last election for the conservatives. Then look forward to Nigel Farage winning his seat as an MP for Thanet in kent come the general election.

Just goes to show the conservatives are not convincing anyone on the EU, if Cameron cannot convince his own party members he's going to get tough on europe then how can he convince the public?

Carswell said Cameron is insincere when he says he'll get tough on europe and talks about reform in the EU, i think he deserves applause for taking a stand on this issue and joining UKIP.

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By *himanMan over a year ago

chichester

Great move ukip all the way !!

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By *inaTitzTV/TS over a year ago

Titz Towers, North Notts

I don't know Clacton, but a lot of electorates vote for the party rather than the individual. Here you could put a carrot up for election and it would get in, as long as it wore a red rosette.

It'll be interesting either way.

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"I don't know Clacton, but a lot of electorates vote for the party rather than the individual. Here you could put a carrot up for election and it would get in, as long as it wore a red rosette.

It'll be interesting either way."

I know what you mean, but the conservatives are yet to say who they will be putting forward for the Clacton by-election, i'm not sure who they will come up with?

Douglas Carswell seems well liked and well known in the area, saw on the news earlier inter_iews with the people of Clacton in the street, they seem to like him and he does a lot for the local community. He did win by quite a big majority last time aswel.

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By *oo hotCouple over a year ago

North West

Vote UKIP, get a Labour government.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Vote UKIP, get a Labour government.

Factually that's not correct its a scaremongering Tory tactic and in a single by-election its only one seat and will make no difference. Personally I give the guy some credit for not just moving but standing for re-election to his seat.

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"Vote UKIP, get a Labour government.

Did'nt someone say that before the European elections a few months ago and then UKIP won.

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"Vote UKIP, get a Labour government.

He does deserve credit for standing for re-election to his seat, i think he will win comfortably, i may even pop in the bookies at the weekend and stick a few quid on it.

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By *illionsandbillionsMan over a year ago

Gwent

Am i wrong in thinking he got elected with tory _iews now hes trying a different set of _iews for a diff party? Its just like a salesman changing jobs in my opinion.. Fact is theres good an bad in all parties some group of people somewhere will get hit for the worse whoever is in power

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By *eavenNhellCouple over a year ago

carrbrook stalybridge

He hasn't left the Tory party he's just joined the militant wing

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Great move ukip all the way !!"

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

its just one of the reasons im voting YES in the referendum.

god help the uk or England if that mob of Nazi's gain power

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

tory,labour,ukip who bloody cares they are all liars and very poor ones at that.the channces of the electorate getting an in out vote on europe in 2017 is zero

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

I actually think that if someone defects to another party (be it an MP or local government) a by-election should be a legal necessity and have the upmost respect for him resigning as an MP as well from the Conservative Party.

That said it is a massive fuck up by UKIP that they are already demonstrating a lack of foresight and cohesion with the news that another UKIP member Roger Lord is going to challenge Carswell as he believes that as the previous parliamentary candidate for the constituency he should be UKIPs candidate.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Vote UKIP, get a Labour government.

"
Hope so

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

there can be nothing more depressing than the thought of the next prime minister of engerland still being posh davie and his deputy in the form of the bold farage , i suspect engerland is doomed , when we become a free country come on up north and apply for assylum to escape the madness

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By *an_WoodMan over a year ago

Stafford

"its just one of the reasons im voting YES in the referendum.

god help the uk or England if that mob of Nazi's gain power"

Which is why UKIP got elected in Scotland as well. Nationalism is a poor alternative to facing up to democracy. Good luck with the single party state of the SNP where any dissent is unpatriotic.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"its just one of the reasons im voting YES in the referendum.

god help the uk or England if that mob of Nazi's gain power

Which is why UKIP got elected in Scotland as well. Nationalism is a poor alternative to facing up to democracy. Good luck with the single party state of the SNP where any dissent is unpatriotic. "

utter nonsense

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By *iewMan over a year ago
Forum Mod

Angus & Findhorn

on the Jeremy Vine show the UKIP candidate that was to stand at the general election hadn't even been told face to face that he was being passed over in favour of Carswell.

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple over a year ago

in Lancashire

"on the Jeremy Vine show the UKIP candidate that was to stand at the general election hadn't even been told face to face that he was being passed over in favour of Carswell."

wouldn't it be ironic if he now joined the tories and won the by election..

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By *iewMan over a year ago
Forum Mod

Angus & Findhorn

"on the Jeremy Vine show the UKIP candidate that was to stand at the general election hadn't even been told face to face that he was being passed over in favour of Carswell.

wouldn't it be ironic if he now joined the tories and won the by election..

he was inter_iewed and wasn't happy

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple over a year ago

in Lancashire

"on the Jeremy Vine show the UKIP candidate that was to stand at the general election hadn't even been told face to face that he was being passed over in favour of Carswell.

wouldn't it be ironic if he now joined the tories and won the by election..

he was inter_iewed and wasn't happy"

with just cause..

amateurish is one way to describe it..

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By *iewMan over a year ago
Forum Mod

Angus & Findhorn

"on the Jeremy Vine show the UKIP candidate that was to stand at the general election hadn't even been told face to face that he was being passed over in favour of Carswell.

wouldn't it be ironic if he now joined the tories and won the by election..

he was inter_iewed and wasn't happy

with just cause..

amateurish is one way to describe it.."

their reason was because this was now a by election they were able to revote and select Carswell, the other guy had been selected for a General Election and was still campaigning on the programme

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"its just one of the reasons im voting YES in the referendum.

god help the uk or England if that mob of Nazi's gain power

Which is why UKIP got elected in Scotland as well. Nationalism is a poor alternative to facing up to democracy. Good luck with the single party state of the SNP where any dissent is unpatriotic. "

Yes UKIP did win an MEP's seat in scotland in the european elections.

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"on the Jeremy Vine show the UKIP candidate that was to stand at the general election hadn't even been told face to face that he was being passed over in favour of Carswell.

wouldn't it be ironic if he now joined the tories and won the by election..

he was inter_iewed and wasn't happy

with just cause..

amateurish is one way to describe it..

their reason was because this was now a by election they were able to revote and select Carswell, the other guy had been selected for a General Election and was still campaigning on the programme"

Farage said in the press conference a certain degree of secrecy was needed to keep this defection under wraps, only Douglas Carswell and top ranking UKIP members knew about this beforehand. If they had told Roger Lord about it he may have gone and spilled the beans to the press and media, or the tory party, so i can understand the reasons for keeping it secret until the announcment yesterday. Not amateurish at all, just basic application of certain tactics.

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By *icketysplitsWoman over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

"on the Jeremy Vine show the UKIP candidate that was to stand at the general election hadn't even been told face to face that he was being passed over in favour of Carswell.

wouldn't it be ironic if he now joined the tories and won the by election..

he was inter_iewed and wasn't happy

with just cause..

amateurish is one way to describe it..

their reason was because this was now a by election they were able to revote and select Carswell, the other guy had been selected for a General Election and was still campaigning on the programme

So they can't trust their previous preferred candidate to tow the party line and keep his mouth shut for a few days? Or, as appears, he feels shafted because he was?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"on the Jeremy Vine show the UKIP candidate that was to stand at the general election hadn't even been told face to face that he was being passed over in favour of Carswell.

wouldn't it be ironic if he now joined the tories and won the by election..

he was inter_iewed and wasn't happy

with just cause..

amateurish is one way to describe it..

their reason was because this was now a by election they were able to revote and select Carswell, the other guy had been selected for a General Election and was still campaigning on the programme

You would expect that the previous candidate to be informed out of common decency. And you should be able to exoect him to maintain confidentiality and respect the reasons for this decision.Or is he yet another candidate chosen because he is willing rather than because he is able?

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"on the Jeremy Vine show the UKIP candidate that was to stand at the general election hadn't even been told face to face that he was being passed over in favour of Carswell.

wouldn't it be ironic if he now joined the tories and won the by election..

he was inter_iewed and wasn't happy

with just cause..

amateurish is one way to describe it..

their reason was because this was now a by election they were able to revote and select Carswell, the other guy had been selected for a General Election and was still campaigning on the programme

So they can't trust their previous preferred candidate to tow the party line and keep his mouth shut for a few days? Or, as appears, he feels shafted because he was?

If he had been told beforehand i can't imagine he would have been happy about it. There is every possibility he could have then gone to the press and media or told the tory party, and then the defection of Carswell would have been a shambles. I think it was best to play this on the safe side and i think Farage and Carswell played a blinder.

Besides Roger Lord is a candidate for the general election next year, this will now be a by-election that Douglas Carswell is going in.

I don't think this will be the last MP who defects to UKIP either, its in the rumour-mill that more Tory MP's and possibly some Labour MP's could also defect to UKIP.

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By *icketysplitsWoman over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

"on the Jeremy Vine show the UKIP candidate that was to stand at the general election hadn't even been told face to face that he was being passed over in favour of Carswell.

wouldn't it be ironic if he now joined the tories and won the by election..

he was inter_iewed and wasn't happy

with just cause..

amateurish is one way to describe it..

their reason was because this was now a by election they were able to revote and select Carswell, the other guy had been selected for a General Election and was still campaigning on the programme

So they can't trust their previous preferred candidate to tow the party line and keep his mouth shut for a few days? Or, as appears, he feels shafted because he was?

Besides Roger Lord is a candidate for the general election next year, this will now be a by-election that Douglas Carswell is going in.

I don't think this will be the last MP who defects to UKIP either, its in the rumour-mill that more Tory MP's and possibly some Labour MP's could also defect to UKIP.

If you have a sitting MP, even from a by-election, you are not going to change that candidature at the general unless they are a nightmare for the party. Lord was shafted and he knows it.

All's fair in love and politics though.

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By *iewMan over a year ago
Forum Mod

Angus & Findhorn

" Lord was shafted and he knows it.

All's fair in love and politics though.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Is this another cheating thread?

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"on the Jeremy Vine show the UKIP candidate that was to stand at the general election hadn't even been told face to face that he was being passed over in favour of Carswell.

wouldn't it be ironic if he now joined the tories and won the by election..

he was inter_iewed and wasn't happy

with just cause..

amateurish is one way to describe it..

their reason was because this was now a by election they were able to revote and select Carswell, the other guy had been selected for a General Election and was still campaigning on the programme

So they can't trust their previous preferred candidate to tow the party line and keep his mouth shut for a few days? Or, as appears, he feels shafted because he was?

Besides Roger Lord is a candidate for the general election next year, this will now be a by-election that Douglas Carswell is going in.

I don't think this will be the last MP who defects to UKIP either, its in the rumour-mill that more Tory MP's and possibly some Labour MP's could also defect to UKIP.

If you have a sitting MP, even from a by-election, you are not going to change that candidature at the general unless they are a nightmare for the party. Lord was shafted and he knows it.

All's fair in love and politics though.

He may have "been shafted" as you put it, but i think the vast majority of UKIP voters and supporters are very happy to see Douglas Carswell come onboard with UKIP.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

In this country there is an old saying..

If you always do as you have always done, you will always get as you always got.

Unfortunately the British voting public do exactly that at each election which results in the inevitable cycle of Tory and Labour government.

Until the voting public grow some balls give someone else a chance, fuck all will change.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"on the Jeremy Vine show the UKIP candidate that was to stand at the general election hadn't even been told face to face that he was being passed over in favour of Carswell.

wouldn't it be ironic if he now joined the tories and won the by election..

he was inter_iewed and wasn't happy

with just cause..

amateurish is one way to describe it..

their reason was because this was now a by election they were able to revote and select Carswell, the other guy had been selected for a General Election and was still campaigning on the programme

So they can't trust their previous preferred candidate to tow the party line and keep his mouth shut for a few days? Or, as appears, he feels shafted because he was?

Besides Roger Lord is a candidate for the general election next year, this will now be a by-election that Douglas Carswell is going in.

I don't think this will be the last MP who defects to UKIP either, its in the rumour-mill that more Tory MP's and possibly some Labour MP's could also defect to UKIP.

So basically another UKIP candidate that can't be trusted (even by his own party's leaders) not to inappropriately shoot his mouth off? Certainly his behaviour today is far from beneficial to UKIP

Being honest his deflection could be massively significant for UKIP particularly if he wins as it is likely to lead to further defections and give UKIP significant momentum leading up to the general election. But the handling of this once again demonstrates that regardless of policy at times UKIP are a shambles and organisationally totally out of their depth

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"on the Jeremy Vine show the UKIP candidate that was to stand at the general election hadn't even been told face to face that he was being passed over in favour of Carswell.

wouldn't it be ironic if he now joined the tories and won the by election..

he was inter_iewed and wasn't happy

with just cause..

amateurish is one way to describe it..

their reason was because this was now a by election they were able to revote and select Carswell, the other guy had been selected for a General Election and was still campaigning on the programme

So they can't trust their previous preferred candidate to tow the party line and keep his mouth shut for a few days? Or, as appears, he feels shafted because he was?

Besides Roger Lord is a candidate for the general election next year, this will now be a by-election that Douglas Carswell is going in.

I don't think this will be the last MP who defects to UKIP either, its in the rumour-mill that more Tory MP's and possibly some Labour MP's could also defect to UKIP.

So basically another UKIP candidate that can't be trusted (even by his own party's leaders) not to inappropriately shoot his mouth off? Certainly his behaviour today is far from beneficial to UKIP

So basically what you are saying is they are damned if they do and damned if they don't?

If they had told Roger Lord beforehand and he went to the media with the story and it broke in the news no doubt you'd be on here saying "Ha, look at UKIP, what a shambles, they can't even keep a secret conduct a high profile defection without screwing it up!"?

There will always be those wanting to critisize what ever UKIP do.

Of course we will never know if Roger Lord would have gone to the press and media or not? He was never given the chance, UKIP leaders went with the side of caution and chose to keep it secret, personally i think they made the right choice.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Frankly, from someone who has never voted Tory and never will, it is no great disaster for them....a non-entity leaving the party for a party that has no policies except antagonism to everything European and has not the slightest chance of being anywhere near power after the election...and canm't even get selection processes right.

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"In this country there is an old saying..

If you always do as you have always done, you will always get as you always got.

Unfortunately the British voting public do exactly that at each election which results in the inevitable cycle of Tory and Labour government.

Until the voting public grow some balls give someone else a chance, fuck all will change."

Maybe there is light at the end of the tunnel, with UKIP's victory in the european elections a few months ago, maybe people are finally starting to wake up in this country?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 29/08/14 17:48:24]

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Frankly, from someone who has never voted Tory and never will, it is no great disaster for them....a non-entity leaving the party for a party that has no policies except antagonism to everything European and has not the slightest chance of being anywhere near power after the election...and canm't even get selection processes right."

Some people just like to wax lyrical.

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

It is a disaster for the tory party, if Douglas Carswell wins the by-election it could then lead to many more defections from the conservatives to UKIP, possibly some from Labour aswel?

.....and if UKIP can't get selection processes right how did they manage to win the european elections a few months ago?

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By *dwalu2Couple over a year ago

Bristol

Tory loon jumps ship to join even loonier Tory loons. More news at 10.

The poor little Ukips...are they still crying over the way Stewart Lee nailed Paul Nuttall so squarely?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"...and if UKIP can't get selection processes right how did they manage to win the european elections a few months ago?"

You'd be a fool not to know that is a different thing altogether.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

It is a disaster for the tory party, if Douglas Carswell wins the by-election it could then lead to many more defections from the conservatives to UKIP, possibly some from Labour aswel?

.....and if UKIP can't get selection processes right how did they manage to win the european elections a few months ago?"

While I have already acknowledged that this could be massive for UKIP and that a victory will likely lead to more defections what makes you think they'd be from Labour? Is there any evidence to suggest that is likely?

I already thinl a loss could have a devastating effect on UKIPs candidate. Let's not forget that the BNP were in a similarly optomistic mood a few years ago and once the momentum fell they were very quickly a non-entity

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"on the Jeremy Vine show the UKIP candidate that was to stand at the general election hadn't even been told face to face that he was being passed over in favour of Carswell.

wouldn't it be ironic if he now joined the tories and won the by election..

he was inter_iewed and wasn't happy

with just cause..

amateurish is one way to describe it..

their reason was because this was now a by election they were able to revote and select Carswell, the other guy had been selected for a General Election and was still campaigning on the programme

So they can't trust their previous preferred candidate to tow the party line and keep his mouth shut for a few days? Or, as appears, he feels shafted because he was?

Besides Roger Lord is a candidate for the general election next year, this will now be a by-election that Douglas Carswell is going in.

I don't think this will be the last MP who defects to UKIP either, its in the rumour-mill that more Tory MP's and possibly some Labour MP's could also defect to UKIP.

So basically another UKIP candidate that can't be trusted (even by his own party's leaders) not to inappropriately shoot his mouth off? Certainly his behaviour today is far from beneficial to UKIP

So basically what you are saying is they are damned if they do and damned if they don't?

There will always be those wanting to critisize what ever UKIP do.

No I'm not saying that at all. I'm saying that I'd expect a prospective parliamentary candidate to respect confidentiality. And if he can't be trusted to do so I'd question his suitability for that role.

And I'm saying that I'd expect him to be capable of seeing the bigger picture with regards to his party rather than embaress them like he has today

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

It is a disaster for the tory party, if Douglas Carswell wins the by-election it could then lead to many more defections from the conservatives to UKIP, possibly some from Labour aswel?

.....and if UKIP can't get selection processes right how did they manage to win the european elections a few months ago?

Second paragraph should say:

I also think thatva loss could have a devastating effect on UKIPs future

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By *icketysplitsWoman over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

"...and if UKIP can't get selection processes right how did they manage to win the european elections a few months ago?

You'd be a fool not to know that is a different thing altogether."

Quite different, indeed!

It's not as if UKIP is a new party. They have been around for 20 years.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"And I'm saying that I'd expect him to be capable of seeing the bigger picture with regards to his party rather than embaress them like he has today"

Sounds like a perfect UKIP candidate to me. I bet he feels at home already.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"In this country there is an old saying..

If you always do as you have always done, you will always get as you always got.

Unfortunately the British voting public do exactly that at each election which results in the inevitable cycle of Tory and Labour government.

Until the voting public grow some balls give someone else a chance, fuck all will change.

Maybe there is light at the end of the tunnel, with UKIP's victory in the european elections a few months ago, maybe people are finally starting to wake up in this country?"

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

It's a little amusing seeing the UKIP supporters in this thread and their _iews/replies in other controversial topics.

Nope, not for me.

Good luck though guys!

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

It is a disaster for the tory party, if Douglas Carswell wins the by-election it could then lead to many more defections from the conservatives to UKIP, possibly some from Labour aswel?

.....and if UKIP can't get selection processes right how did they manage to win the european elections a few months ago?

The reason some could defect from Labour is very simple, one it is being reported in the news but if you are one of those people who don't believe everything you hear in the news the 2nd reason is UKIP did very well in many Labour areas during the recent european elections, particularly in places like Rotherham, and some Labour areas in the west midlands, and other seaside towns aswel.

Comparing UKIP to the BNP is nonsense, the BNP won two MEP's at the european elections a few years ago (nothing really to be optmistic about), UKIP won the european elections this year in the UK with more MEP's than Labour, Conservative and the LIb dems, so they have every reason to be optimistic.

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"It's a little amusing seeing the UKIP supporters in this thread and their _iews/replies in other controversial topics.

Nope, not for me.

Good luck though guys!

Equally it always amuses me to see those towing the politically correct line and the _iews they have about UKIP and their _iews/replies on other controversial topics/threads.

Good luck to them, but not for me either.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

It is a disaster for the tory party, if Douglas Carswell wins the by-election it could then lead to many more defections from the conservatives to UKIP, possibly some from Labour aswel?

.....and if UKIP can't get selection processes right how did they manage to win the european elections a few months ago?

Actually what is being reported in the news are UKIP claims that Labour MPs are likely to defect. Correct me if I am wrong but as far as I know there is no evidence to suggest this beyond Farage's optimism and no political commentator has suggested it is likely.

As for the BNP comparison, you conveniently ignore that before there collapse they had a significant presence in local government, arguably comparable to UKIPs.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"It's a little amusing seeing the UKIP supporters in this thread and their _iews/replies in other controversial topics.

Nope, not for me.

Good luck though guys!

Equally it always amuses me to see those towing the politically correct line and the _iews they have about UKIP and their _iews/replies on other controversial topics/threads.

Good luck to them, but not for me either.

It isn't being about PC. The fact you don't realise that is why you support who you do.

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"It's a little amusing seeing the UKIP supporters in this thread and their _iews/replies in other controversial topics.

Nope, not for me.

Good luck though guys!

Equally it always amuses me to see those towing the politically correct line and the _iews they have about UKIP and their _iews/replies on other controversial topics/threads.

Good luck to them, but not for me either.

It isn't being about PC. The fact you don't realise that is why you support who you do."

And how would you have any clue about my reasons for voting UKIP exactly????

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"It's a little amusing seeing the UKIP supporters in this thread and their _iews/replies in other controversial topics.

Nope, not for me.

Good luck though guys!

Equally it always amuses me to see those towing the politically correct line and the _iews they have about UKIP and their _iews/replies on other controversial topics/threads.

Good luck to them, but not for me either.

It isn't being about PC. The fact you don't realise that is why you support who you do.

And how would you have any clue about my reasons for voting UKIP exactly????"

And how would you know I tow the politically correct line and they jsut aren't my actual _iews exactly?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"It's a little amusing seeing the UKIP supporters in this thread and their _iews/replies in other controversial topics.

Nope, not for me.

Good luck though guys!

Equally it always amuses me to see those towing the politically correct line and the _iews they have about UKIP and their _iews/replies on other controversial topics/threads.

Good luck to them, but not for me either.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *icketysplitsWoman over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

"It's a little amusing seeing the UKIP supporters in this thread and their _iews/replies in other controversial topics.

Nope, not for me.

Good luck though guys!

Equally it always amuses me to see those towing the politically correct line and the _iews they have about UKIP and their _iews/replies on other controversial topics/threads.

Good luck to them, but not for me either.

It isn't being about PC. The fact you don't realise that is why you support who you do.

And how would you have any clue about my reasons for voting UKIP exactly????"

You post them on the forum. You may have others you haven't posted but you do post in favour of UKIP a fair amount and with that a reader is able to form a _iew (or gather clues, if you prefer).

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

It is a disaster for the tory party, if Douglas Carswell wins the by-election it could then lead to many more defections from the conservatives to UKIP, possibly some from Labour aswel?

.....and if UKIP can't get selection processes right how did they manage to win the european elections a few months ago?

As for the BNP comparison, you conveniently ignore that before there collapse they had a significant presence in local government, arguably comparable to UKIPs. "

Well as we saw with the Douglas Carswell defection, secrecy is paramount.

Who knows if Farage is telling the truth or just playing mind games with Labour.

BNP may have had councillors as you pointed out, but still only 2 MEP's in Brussels.

UKIP have the largest representation of MEP's in Brussels from any party in the UK currently. European elections also tend to be more high profile than local council elections, so i stick by what i said.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"It's a little amusing seeing the UKIP supporters in this thread and their _iews/replies in other controversial topics.

Nope, not for me.

Good luck though guys!

Equally it always amuses me to see those towing the politically correct line and the _iews they have about UKIP and their _iews/replies on other controversial topics/threads.

Good luck to them, but not for me either.

It isn't being about PC. The fact you don't realise that is why you support who you do.

And how would you have any clue about my reasons for voting UKIP exactly????

And how would you know I tow the politically correct line and they jsut aren't my actual _iews exactly?"

My comment about those towing the politically correct line was not about you personally. I made that comment more generally about "some" forum users.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 29/08/14 19:06:27]

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"It's a little amusing seeing the UKIP supporters in this thread and their _iews/replies in other controversial topics.

Nope, not for me.

Good luck though guys!

Equally it always amuses me to see those towing the politically correct line and the _iews they have about UKIP and their _iews/replies on other controversial topics/threads.

Good luck to them, but not for me either.

It isn't being about PC. The fact you don't realise that is why you support who you do.

And how would you have any clue about my reasons for voting UKIP exactly????

You post them on the forum. You may have others you haven't posted but you do post in favour of UKIP a fair amount and with that a reader is able to form a _iew (or gather clues, if you prefer).

Equally i can gather clues (or form a _iew) about others on the forum who post politically correct comments.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Equally i can gather clues (or form a _iew) about others on the forum who post politically correct comments."

It's really not the same.

The are kind of outing yourself.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"It's a little amusing seeing the UKIP supporters in this thread and their _iews/replies in other controversial topics.

Nope, not for me.

Good luck though guys!

Equally it always amuses me to see those towing the politically correct line and the _iews they have about UKIP and their _iews/replies on other controversial topics/threads.

Good luck to them, but not for me either.

It isn't being about PC. The fact you don't realise that is why you support who you do.

And how would you have any clue about my reasons for voting UKIP exactly????

And how would you know I tow the politically correct line and they jsut aren't my actual _iews exactly?

My comment about those towing the politically correct line was not about you personally. I made that comment more generally about "some" forum users."

I'm not sure why the term has to make an appearance on almost every political thread.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *yrdwomanWoman over a year ago

Putting the 'cum' in Eboracum

"It's a little amusing seeing the UKIP supporters in this thread and their _iews/replies in other controversial topics.

Nope, not for me.

Good luck though guys!

Equally it always amuses me to see those towing the politically correct line and the _iews they have about UKIP and their _iews/replies on other controversial topics/threads.

Good luck to them, but not for me either.

It isn't being about PC. The fact you don't realise that is why you support who you do.

And how would you have any clue about my reasons for voting UKIP exactly????

You post them on the forum. You may have others you haven't posted but you do post in favour of UKIP a fair amount and with that a reader is able to form a _iew (or gather clues, if you prefer).

Equally i can gather clues (or form a _iew) about others on the forum who post politically correct comments."

Like you, we all have voting freedom. Just because we disagree with your political _iews doesn't mean they are wrong. People are allowed to have their own ideological _iews.

By the way, its toeing, not towing.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *icketysplitsWoman over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

"It's a little amusing seeing the UKIP supporters in this thread and their _iews/replies in other controversial topics.

Nope, not for me.

Good luck though guys!

Equally it always amuses me to see those towing the politically correct line and the _iews they have about UKIP and their _iews/replies on other controversial topics/threads.

Good luck to them, but not for me either.

It isn't being about PC. The fact you don't realise that is why you support who you do.

And how would you have any clue about my reasons for voting UKIP exactly????

You post them on the forum. You may have others you haven't posted but you do post in favour of UKIP a fair amount and with that a reader is able to form a _iew (or gather clues, if you prefer).

Equally i can gather clues (or form a _iew) about others on the forum who post politically correct comments."

You form a _iew on what you denote to be politically correct.

I'm very happy for you to form a _iew on what I say and what I believe. I don't hide it. I'm not party political in what I post. I am pro social justice. If that is politically correct then I'm all for it.

However, I argue that the term is not necessary and is used in a derogatory manner. It would be same as me referring to call comments about political _iews held that I don't agree with as bigoted. Not something that I would do because I feel comfortable challenging _iews and having a debate without having to be derogatory to the people with whom I am debating.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"It's a little amusing seeing the UKIP supporters in this thread and their _iews/replies in other controversial topics.

Nope, not for me.

Good luck though guys!

Equally it always amuses me to see those towing the politically correct line and the _iews they have about UKIP and their _iews/replies on other controversial topics/threads.

Good luck to them, but not for me either.

It isn't being about PC. The fact you don't realise that is why you support who you do.

And how would you have any clue about my reasons for voting UKIP exactly????

You post them on the forum. You may have others you haven't posted but you do post in favour of UKIP a fair amount and with that a reader is able to form a _iew (or gather clues, if you prefer).

Equally i can gather clues (or form a _iew) about others on the forum who post politically correct comments.

Like you, we all have voting freedom. Just because we disagree with your political _iews doesn't mean they are wrong. People are allowed to have their own ideological _iews.

By the way, its toeing, not towing."

I'm a firm believer in democracy and so is UKIP, so not sure what you are getting at there with the voting freedom thing?

Also just because i may have different political _iews to you does'nt mean mine are wrong either.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"It's a little amusing seeing the UKIP supporters in this thread and their _iews/replies in other controversial topics.

Nope, not for me.

Good luck though guys!

Equally it always amuses me to see those towing the politically correct line and the _iews they have about UKIP and their _iews/replies on other controversial topics/threads.

Good luck to them, but not for me either.

It isn't being about PC. The fact you don't realise that is why you support who you do.

And how would you have any clue about my reasons for voting UKIP exactly????

And how would you know I tow the politically correct line and they jsut aren't my actual _iews exactly?

My comment about those towing the politically correct line was not about you personally. I made that comment more generally about "some" forum users.

I'm not sure why the term has to make an appearance on almost every political thread.

Maybe because many people feel it has gotten out of hand in British society in the modern era.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *yrdwomanWoman over a year ago

Putting the 'cum' in Eboracum

"It's a little amusing seeing the UKIP supporters in this thread and their _iews/replies in other controversial topics.

Nope, not for me.

Good luck though guys!

Equally it always amuses me to see those towing the politically correct line and the _iews they have about UKIP and their _iews/replies on other controversial topics/threads.

Good luck to them, but not for me either.

It isn't being about PC. The fact you don't realise that is why you support who you do.

And how would you have any clue about my reasons for voting UKIP exactly????

You post them on the forum. You may have others you haven't posted but you do post in favour of UKIP a fair amount and with that a reader is able to form a _iew (or gather clues, if you prefer).

Equally i can gather clues (or form a _iew) about others on the forum who post politically correct comments.

Like you, we all have voting freedom. Just because we disagree with your political _iews doesn't mean they are wrong. People are allowed to have their own ideological _iews.

By the way, its toeing, not towing.

I'm a firm believer in democracy and so is UKIP, so not sure what you are getting at there with the voting freedom thing?

Also just because i may have different political _iews to you does'nt mean mine are wrong either. "

Exactly!

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

It is a disaster for the tory party, if Douglas Carswell wins the by-election it could then lead to many more defections from the conservatives to UKIP, possibly some from Labour aswel?

.....and if UKIP can't get selection processes right how did they manage to win the european elections a few months ago?

As for the BNP comparison, you conveniently ignore that before there collapse they had a significant presence in local government, arguably comparable to UKIPs.

Well as we saw with the Douglas Carswell defection, secrecy is paramount.

Who knows if Farage is telling the truth or just playing mind games with Labour.

BNP may have had councillors as you pointed out, but still only 2 MEP's in Brussels.

So you acknowledge there is actually no evidence that any Labour MPs are likely to defect to UKIP?

And ignoring the irony of UKIPs success being measured solely by European success, there is no escaping that the BNP had a significant political presence just 12 months before their collapse. I totally accept that a win in the by-election will be massive for UKIP but a defeat and particularly a significant one will have a massive negative impact on their credibility

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"It's a little amusing seeing the UKIP supporters in this thread and their _iews/replies in other controversial topics.

Nope, not for me.

Good luck though guys!

Equally it always amuses me to see those towing the politically correct line and the _iews they have about UKIP and their _iews/replies on other controversial topics/threads.

Good luck to them, but not for me either.

It isn't being about PC. The fact you don't realise that is why you support who you do.

And how would you have any clue about my reasons for voting UKIP exactly????

And how would you know I tow the politically correct line and they jsut aren't my actual _iews exactly?

My comment about those towing the politically correct line was not about you personally. I made that comment more generally about "some" forum users.

I'm not sure why the term has to make an appearance on almost every political thread.

Maybe because many people feel it has gotten out of hand in British society in the modern era."

But why use it in a derogatory way at those with opposing _iews on almost every political thread. It's just ca lazy insult and all it does is derail the thread away from the topic and as this thread proves an interesting debate is in danger of being lost

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *ouple in LancashireCouple over a year ago

in Lancashire

for some it their 'default' position when they cant justify their position by any acceptable standards of decency..

its an easy brick bat to throw but usually just indicates a lack of depth within their argument..

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"It's a little amusing seeing the UKIP supporters in this thread and their _iews/replies in other controversial topics.

Nope, not for me.

Good luck though guys!

Equally it always amuses me to see those towing the politically correct line and the _iews they have about UKIP and their _iews/replies on other controversial topics/threads.

Good luck to them, but not for me either.

It isn't being about PC. The fact you don't realise that is why you support who you do.

And how would you have any clue about my reasons for voting UKIP exactly????

You post them on the forum. You may have others you haven't posted but you do post in favour of UKIP a fair amount and with that a reader is able to form a _iew (or gather clues, if you prefer).

Equally i can gather clues (or form a _iew) about others on the forum who post politically correct comments.

You form a _iew on what you denote to be politically correct.

There we have got to the bottom of it, you just admitted you are afraid to speak your mind incase you offend someone. That is political correctness gone mad in this country. I'm not politically correct, i speak my mind and i really could'nt care less what anyone else thinks to be honest.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"There we have got to the bottom of it, you just admitted you are afraid to speak your mind incase you offend someone. That is political correctness gone mad in this country. I'm not politically correct, i speak my mind and i really could'nt care less what anyone else thinks to be honest."

Not really - you seem to take any sign of tolerance a win. That isn't a great outlook.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

It is a disaster for the tory party, if Douglas Carswell wins the by-election it could then lead to many more defections from the conservatives to UKIP, possibly some from Labour aswel?

.....and if UKIP can't get selection processes right how did they manage to win the european elections a few months ago?

As for the BNP comparison, you conveniently ignore that before there collapse they had a significant presence in local government, arguably comparable to UKIPs.

Well as we saw with the Douglas Carswell defection, secrecy is paramount.

Who knows if Farage is telling the truth or just playing mind games with Labour.

BNP may have had councillors as you pointed out, but still only 2 MEP's in Brussels.

So you acknowledge there is actually no evidence that any Labour MPs are likely to defect to UKIP?

We shall both have to wait and see what the results of the by-election will be then. It will also be interesting to watch the campaign from different parties in the run up to the by-election.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"It's a little amusing seeing the UKIP supporters in this thread and their _iews/replies in other controversial topics.

Nope, not for me.

Good luck though guys!

Equally it always amuses me to see those towing the politically correct line and the _iews they have about UKIP and their _iews/replies on other controversial topics/threads.

Good luck to them, but not for me either.

It isn't being about PC. The fact you don't realise that is why you support who you do.

And how would you have any clue about my reasons for voting UKIP exactly????

You post them on the forum. You may have others you haven't posted but you do post in favour of UKIP a fair amount and with that a reader is able to form a _iew (or gather clues, if you prefer).

Equally i can gather clues (or form a _iew) about others on the forum who post politically correct comments.

You form a _iew on what you denote to be politically correct.

I'm pretty sure he didn't say anywhere in that post that he was afraid to speak his mind?

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

for some it their 'default' position when they cant justify their position by any acceptable standards of decency..

its an easy brick bat to throw but usually just indicates a lack of depth within their argument.. "

....and when people who are brave enough to admit they are not politically correct from the left wing of politics and have a lack of depth within their argument they are all too quick to throw the "your a racist/bigot" accusation.

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By *imiUKMan over a year ago

Hereford

Not really - people are free to speak their minds, those who harp on about 'political correctness gone mad' are usually those who have aired their _iews and not got the universal assent they thought they might.

If you excercise your right to air your _iews, I excercise mine to question/mock/verbally attack you for airing them.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *icketysplitsWoman over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

Equally i can gather clues (or form a _iew) about others on the forum who post politically correct comments.

You form a _iew on what you denote to be politically correct.

I think there is rather big difference between offending someone and speaking ones mind. I speak my mind without the need to be offensive or to offend.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *icketysplitsWoman over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

for some it their 'default' position when they cant justify their position by any acceptable standards of decency..

its an easy brick bat to throw but usually just indicates a lack of depth within their argument..

Where has a racist/bigot accusation been thrown at you?

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"It's a little amusing seeing the UKIP supporters in this thread and their _iews/replies in other controversial topics.

Nope, not for me.

Good luck though guys!

Equally it always amuses me to see those towing the politically correct line and the _iews they have about UKIP and their _iews/replies on other controversial topics/threads.

Good luck to them, but not for me either.

It isn't being about PC. The fact you don't realise that is why you support who you do.

And how would you have any clue about my reasons for voting UKIP exactly????

You post them on the forum. You may have others you haven't posted but you do post in favour of UKIP a fair amount and with that a reader is able to form a _iew (or gather clues, if you prefer).

Equally i can gather clues (or form a _iew) about others on the forum who post politically correct comments.

You form a _iew on what you denote to be politically correct.

I'm pretty sure he didn't say anywhere in that post that he was afraid to speak his mind?

I quoted Lickety so that was a "she" and not a "he" i quoted. She did say certain political _iews she does'nt agree with could be called bigoted. If that is the case why not just call them bigoted then and be done with it?

Maybe so tied up with political correctness that she is afraid to say it in case she offends them in some way?

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *icketysplitsWoman over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

"It's a little amusing seeing the UKIP supporters in this thread and their _iews/replies in other controversial topics.

Nope, not for me.

Good luck though guys!

Equally it always amuses me to see those towing the politically correct line and the _iews they have about UKIP and their _iews/replies on other controversial topics/threads.

Good luck to them, but not for me either.

It isn't being about PC. The fact you don't realise that is why you support who you do.

And how would you have any clue about my reasons for voting UKIP exactly????

You post them on the forum. You may have others you haven't posted but you do post in favour of UKIP a fair amount and with that a reader is able to form a _iew (or gather clues, if you prefer).

Equally i can gather clues (or form a _iew) about others on the forum who post politically correct comments.

You form a _iew on what you denote to be politically correct.

I'm pretty sure he didn't say anywhere in that post that he was afraid to speak his mind?

Maybe so tied up with political correctness that she is afraid to say it in case she offends them in some way?"

NOPE! I said calling others _iews politically correct in a derogatory way is equivalent to me using the word bigoted for _iews I don't agree with. I went on to say that is not something I would do. NOWHERE did I say the _iews are bigoted.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

If you excercise your right to air your _iews, I excercise mine to question/mock/verbally attack you for airing them. "

please feel free, i already put it on record in black and white here that i really don't care what anyone else thinks.

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By *imiUKMan over a year ago

Hereford

I'm quite happy to draw parallels with UKIP and '30s Fascism and I'm not concerned in the slightest if it offends them.

Happy to help.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

Equally i can gather clues (or form a _iew) about others on the forum who post politically correct comments.

You form a _iew on what you denote to be politically correct.

I think there is rather big difference between offending someone and speaking ones mind. I speak my mind without the need to be offensive or to offend.

....and that is exactly why you are politically correct.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *nnyMan over a year ago

Glasgow

"its just one of the reasons im voting YES in the referendum.

god help the uk or England if that mob of Nazi's gain power"

Is it better to stay and stop them or run away yet have them as a neighbour with control over over our currency?

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

for some it their 'default' position when they cant justify their position by any acceptable standards of decency..

its an easy brick bat to throw but usually just indicates a lack of depth within their argument..

Where has a racist/bigot accusation been thrown at you?

Not in this thread but it could have happened by private email?

I'm not going to say if it has or not because it is against forum rules to talk of private messages, so will leave that for you to decide.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *icketysplitsWoman over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

Equally i can gather clues (or form a _iew) about others on the forum who post politically correct comments.

You form a _iew on what you denote to be politically correct.

I think there is rather big difference between offending someone and speaking ones mind. I speak my mind without the need to be offensive or to offend.

....and that is exactly why you are politically correct.

And you fail to engage me in a meaningful argument that might change my mind on UKIP or its supporters. Debate the points and present the case without the need to goad and be offensive and you might actually stand a chance of winning the election.

I'll continue to engage with politicians of all parties and form my _iews on their manifestos, actions and behaviours.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"It's a little amusing seeing the UKIP supporters in this thread and their _iews/replies in other controversial topics.

Nope, not for me.

Good luck though guys!

Equally it always amuses me to see those towing the politically correct line and the _iews they have about UKIP and their _iews/replies on other controversial topics/threads.

Good luck to them, but not for me either.

It isn't being about PC. The fact you don't realise that is why you support who you do.

And how would you have any clue about my reasons for voting UKIP exactly????

You post them on the forum. You may have others you haven't posted but you do post in favour of UKIP a fair amount and with that a reader is able to form a _iew (or gather clues, if you prefer).

Equally i can gather clues (or form a _iew) about others on the forum who post politically correct comments.

You form a _iew on what you denote to be politically correct.

I'm pretty sure he didn't say anywhere in that post that he was afraid to speak his mind?

Maybe so tied up with political correctness that she is afraid to say it in case she offends them in some way?

People can read the post you made and make their own mind up about that. To me that is the interpretation of what you were saying.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"I'm quite happy to draw parallels with UKIP and '30s Fascism and I'm not concerned in the slightest if it offends them.

Happy to help. "

At last, someone with left wing _iews who is not politically correct.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *imiUKMan over a year ago

Hereford

"I'm quite happy to draw parallels with UKIP and '30s Fascism and I'm not concerned in the slightest if it offends them.

Happy to help.

At last, someone with left wing _iews who is not politically correct.

Perhaps not, but my _iews are quite far to the left.....

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *icketysplitsWoman over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

for some it their 'default' position when they cant justify their position by any acceptable standards of decency..

its an easy brick bat to throw but usually just indicates a lack of depth within their argument..

Where has a racist/bigot accusation been thrown at you?

Not in this thread but it could have happened by private email?

I'm not going to say if it has or not because it is against forum rules to talk of private messages, so will leave that for you to decide."

Ah well, the abusive private messages I get for my tolerant _iews don't change how I choose to deal with those on a thread. Cowards send the private, rude and abusive messages. My response to them, when they don't block the moment they have sent their abuse, is to ask them to keep it to thread. If I am blocked I post that comments about the thread belong there and not sent to me directly.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *reelove1969Couple over a year ago

bristol

do tell us about the 30's fascism ?

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

for some it their 'default' position when they cant justify their position by any acceptable standards of decency..

its an easy brick bat to throw but usually just indicates a lack of depth within their argument..

Where has a racist/bigot accusation been thrown at you?

Not in this thread but it could have happened by private email?

I'm not going to say if it has or not because it is against forum rules to talk of private messages, so will leave that for you to decide."

I stand corrected, it has now happened in this thread, even though i have not disclosed my reasons for voting UKIP here.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

for some it their 'default' position when they cant justify their position by any acceptable standards of decency..

its an easy brick bat to throw but usually just indicates a lack of depth within their argument..

Where has a racist/bigot accusation been thrown at you?

I don;t think it has. Though politically correct has been used as an insult on this and at least other threads in recent days

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *icketysplitsWoman over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

"It's a little amusing seeing the UKIP supporters in this thread and their _iews/replies in other controversial topics.

Nope, not for me.

Good luck though guys!

Equally it always amuses me to see those towing the politically correct line and the _iews they have about UKIP and their _iews/replies on other controversial topics/threads.

Good luck to them, but not for me either.

It isn't being about PC. The fact you don't realise that is why you support who you do.

And how would you have any clue about my reasons for voting UKIP exactly????

You post them on the forum. You may have others you haven't posted but you do post in favour of UKIP a fair amount and with that a reader is able to form a _iew (or gather clues, if you prefer).

Equally i can gather clues (or form a _iew) about others on the forum who post politically correct comments.

You form a _iew on what you denote to be politically correct.

I'm pretty sure he didn't say anywhere in that post that he was afraid to speak his mind?

Maybe so tied up with political correctness that she is afraid to say it in case she offends them in some way?

People can read the post you made and make their own mind up about that. To me that is the interpretation of what you were saying. "

That is the issue. Interpretation.

I can interpret the Carswell issue as Lord being shafted, you don't. My interpretation is just as valid in the circumstance that neither of us were party to the Farage decision to handle it in the way he did.

Where your interpretation is different to my intention and I seek to clarify that then we are in a slightly different realm. I am able to answer your interpretation. If you choose not to accept the clarification or to re-read what was actually written then there is nothing further I can do.

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By *mmabluTV/TS over a year ago

upton wirral

[Removed by poster at 29/08/14 22:12:13]

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By *imiUKMan over a year ago

Hereford

"do tell us about the 30's fascism ?"

They are there to see in other threads - put simply, uniform and penchant for marching around aside (although the fetishisation of the millitary is still present), since UKIP stopped being a single issue party and were forced to draft a proper manifesto, the parallels between their policies and those of Mussolini especially are quite striking. I'll leave you to do the reading.

Note to the hard of thinking: nowhere have I mentioned Nazism - that is, ideologically quite a distinct beast.

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple over a year ago

in Lancashire

for some it their 'default' position when they cant justify their position by any acceptable standards of decency..

its an easy brick bat to throw but usually just indicates a lack of depth within their argument..

speaking personally I will only use those terms with someone when they show themselves to be so..

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Equally i can gather clues (or form a _iew) about others on the forum who post politically correct comments.

You form a _iew on what you denote to be politically correct.

I think there is rather big difference between offending someone and speaking ones mind. I speak my mind without the need to be offensive or to offend.

....and that is exactly why you are politically correct.

So basically political correct equates to politeness and respect for others?

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By *icketysplitsWoman over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

for some it their 'default' position when they cant justify their position by any acceptable standards of decency..

its an easy brick bat to throw but usually just indicates a lack of depth within their argument..

Where has a racist/bigot accusation been thrown at you?

Not in this thread but it could have happened by private email?

I'm not going to say if it has or not because it is against forum rules to talk of private messages, so will leave that for you to decide.

I stand corrected, it has now happened in this thread, even though i have not disclosed my reasons for voting UKIP here."

Now I am confused. What has happened on the thread?

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By *ozzy87Man over a year ago

Crawley

I hope the zombie apocalypse comes soon.

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

for some it their 'default' position when they cant justify their position by any acceptable standards of decency..

its an easy brick bat to throw but usually just indicates a lack of depth within their argument..

Where has a racist/bigot accusation been thrown at you?

Not in this thread but it could have happened by private email?

I'm not going to say if it has or not because it is against forum rules to talk of private messages, so will leave that for you to decide.

I stand corrected, it has now happened in this thread, even though i have not disclosed my reasons for voting UKIP here.

Now I am confused. What has happened on the thread?"

Someone said UKIP now is the same as 30's fascism, so presumably all UKIP supporters and voters are now fascists?

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *imiUKMan over a year ago

Hereford

for some it their 'default' position when they cant justify their position by any acceptable standards of decency..

its an easy brick bat to throw but usually just indicates a lack of depth within their argument..

Where has a racist/bigot accusation been thrown at you?

Not in this thread but it could have happened by private email?

I'm not going to say if it has or not because it is against forum rules to talk of private messages, so will leave that for you to decide.

I stand corrected, it has now happened in this thread, even though i have not disclosed my reasons for voting UKIP here.

Now I am confused. What has happened on the thread?

Someone said UKIP now is the same as 30's fascism, so presumably all UKIP supporters and voters are now fascists?"

THats quite a lazy conclusion to draw, but I'd expect nothing less than intellectual laziness from a UKIP supporter, to be honest.

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By *icketysplitsWoman over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

for some it their 'default' position when they cant justify their position by any acceptable standards of decency..

its an easy brick bat to throw but usually just indicates a lack of depth within their argument..

Where has a racist/bigot accusation been thrown at you?

Not in this thread but it could have happened by private email?

I'm not going to say if it has or not because it is against forum rules to talk of private messages, so will leave that for you to decide.

I stand corrected, it has now happened in this thread, even though i have not disclosed my reasons for voting UKIP here.

Now I am confused. What has happened on the thread?

Someone said UKIP now is the same as 30's fascism, so presumably all UKIP supporters and voters are now fascists?"

Not at all. That's an extenuated assumption. Many people follow ideologies not fully understanding what they are following because one aspect of it speaks to them.

However, using your own leaps of judgement on what you term political correctness I can see how you get to that conclusion.

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By *imiUKMan over a year ago

Hereford

Someone said UKIP now is the same as 30's fascism, so presumably all UKIP supporters and voters are now fascists?

Not at all. That's an extenuated assumption. Many people follow ideologies not fully understanding what they are following because one aspect of it speaks to them.

However, using your own leaps of judgement on what you term political correctness I can see how you get to that conclusion.

See? You are nicer than me - it's clearly political correctness gone mad....

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple over a year ago

in Lancashire

Someone said UKIP now is the same as 30's fascism, so presumably all UKIP supporters and voters are now fascists?"

read what was actually said..

the poster says that in his opinion there is a similarity in their policies..

yet you choose to go off on tangent and distort what was said..

strange..

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"I'm quite happy to draw parallels with UKIP and '30s Fascism and I'm not concerned in the slightest if it offends them.

Happy to help. "

I fail to see how anyone could read that and not see the link UKIP = Fascists?

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple over a year ago

in Lancashire

"I'm quite happy to draw parallels with UKIP and '30s Fascism and I'm not concerned in the slightest if it offends them.

Happy to help.

I fail to see how anyone could read that and not see the link UKIP = Fascists?"

then debate it..

instead of playing the 'victim'..

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *imiUKMan over a year ago

Hereford

"I'm quite happy to draw parallels with UKIP and '30s Fascism and I'm not concerned in the slightest if it offends them.

Happy to help.

I fail to see how anyone could read that and not see the link UKIP = Fascists?"

I'll make it simpler for you - I said that there were parallels with their manifesto and the policies of Mussolini, especially.

How many voters (be it Lib, Lab, Tory or UKIP) have actually read their parties manifesto? 5%? 10%?

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

for some it their 'default' position when they cant justify their position by any acceptable standards of decency..

its an easy brick bat to throw but usually just indicates a lack of depth within their argument..

Where has a racist/bigot accusation been thrown at you?

Not in this thread but it could have happened by private email?

I'm not going to say if it has or not because it is against forum rules to talk of private messages, so will leave that for you to decide.

I stand corrected, it has now happened in this thread, even though i have not disclosed my reasons for voting UKIP here."

But you have stated your support for UKIP frequently and vocally on many occasions. You have also explained on other threads why you support them.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Someone said UKIP now is the same as 30's fascism, so presumably all UKIP supporters and voters are now fascists?"

No most of them are deluded or disillusioned with an elitist state. If you read your history on 1930s Germany you will see that 'in the beginning' Hitler was basically a Nigel Farage.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *imiUKMan over a year ago

Hereford

Someone said UKIP now is the same as 30's fascism, so presumably all UKIP supporters and voters are now fascists?

No most of them are deluded or disillusioned with an elitist state. If you read your history on 1930s Germany you will see that 'in the beginning' Hitler was basically a Nigel Farage."

To be fair, as much as I despise Hitler, I think he had a tad more about him than Nigel.

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"I'm quite happy to draw parallels with UKIP and '30s Fascism and I'm not concerned in the slightest if it offends them.

Happy to help.

I fail to see how anyone could read that and not see the link UKIP = Fascists?

then debate it..

instead of playing the 'victim'.."

I'm not playing the victim, if that is his opinion he's welcome to say it. People said they failed to see the link so i simply quoted what he said, people are free to make of it what they will.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I'm quite happy to draw parallels with UKIP and '30s Fascism and I'm not concerned in the slightest if it offends them.

Happy to help.

I fail to see how anyone could read that and not see the link UKIP = Fascists?

I'll make it simpler for you - I said that there were parallels with their manifesto and the policies of Mussolini, especially.

How many voters (be it Lib, Lab, Tory or UKIP) have actually read their parties manifesto? 5%? 10%?"

Let's not forget as he once hilariously proved on TV when he was incapable of asking questions on it even Farage hasn't bothered to read UKIP's manifesto.

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"I'm quite happy to draw parallels with UKIP and '30s Fascism and I'm not concerned in the slightest if it offends them.

Happy to help.

I fail to see how anyone could read that and not see the link UKIP = Fascists?

I'll make it simpler for you - I said that there were parallels with their manifesto and the policies of Mussolini, especially.

How many voters (be it Lib, Lab, Tory or UKIP) have actually read their parties manifesto? 5%? 10%?"

So you've read UKIP's manifesto then?

Would be qood if you could share it with us as far as i'm aware UKIP have not yet released their manifesto for next years general election???

Also i'm not sure anyone knows how many voters have read their parties manifestos 5%, 10% your guess is as good as mine.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *icketysplitsWoman over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

"I'm quite happy to draw parallels with UKIP and '30s Fascism and I'm not concerned in the slightest if it offends them.

Happy to help.

I fail to see how anyone could read that and not see the link UKIP = Fascists?"

That's a reductionist _iew and ignores the words actually used. You see it is equals and what was said was parallels.

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By *imiUKMan over a year ago

Hereford

"I'm quite happy to draw parallels with UKIP and '30s Fascism and I'm not concerned in the slightest if it offends them.

Happy to help.

I fail to see how anyone could read that and not see the link UKIP = Fascists?

I'll make it simpler for you - I said that there were parallels with their manifesto and the policies of Mussolini, especially.

How many voters (be it Lib, Lab, Tory or UKIP) have actually read their parties manifesto? 5%? 10%?

So you've read UKIP's manifesto then?

Would be qood if you could share it with us as far as i'm aware UKIP have not yet released their manifesto for next years general election???

Also i'm not sure anyone knows how many voters have read their parties manifestos 5%, 10% your guess is as good as mine."

I read their last one, yes. I think you are clutching at straws now...

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

for some it their 'default' position when they cant justify their position by any acceptable standards of decency..

its an easy brick bat to throw but usually just indicates a lack of depth within their argument..

Where has a racist/bigot accusation been thrown at you?

Not in this thread but it could have happened by private email?

I'm not going to say if it has or not because it is against forum rules to talk of private messages, so will leave that for you to decide.

I stand corrected, it has now happened in this thread, even though i have not disclosed my reasons for voting UKIP here.

But you have stated your support for UKIP frequently and vocally on many occasions. You have also explained on other threads why you support them.

As JimiUK made the comment how exactly could i have been sure he had read those other threads/comments and know why i would chose to vote UKIP in an election? I have not looked at his profile, or clicked the green arrow next to his name, he could've joined the site 2 or 3 hours ago for all i know?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 29/08/14 22:52:09]

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"I'm quite happy to draw parallels with UKIP and '30s Fascism and I'm not concerned in the slightest if it offends them.

Happy to help.

I fail to see how anyone could read that and not see the link UKIP = Fascists?

I'll make it simpler for you - I said that there were parallels with their manifesto and the policies of Mussolini, especially.

How many voters (be it Lib, Lab, Tory or UKIP) have actually read their parties manifesto? 5%? 10%?

So you've read UKIP's manifesto then?

Would be qood if you could share it with us as far as i'm aware UKIP have not yet released their manifesto for next years general election???

Also i'm not sure anyone knows how many voters have read their parties manifestos 5%, 10% your guess is as good as mine.

I read their last one, yes. I think you are clutching at straws now..."

Ah so like the rest of us you hav'nt got a clue what will be in UKIPs 2015 general election manifesto then.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I'm quite happy to draw parallels with UKIP and '30s Fascism and I'm not concerned in the slightest if it offends them.

Happy to help.

I fail to see how anyone could read that and not see the link UKIP = Fascists?

I'll make it simpler for you - I said that there were parallels with their manifesto and the policies of Mussolini, especially.

How many voters (be it Lib, Lab, Tory or UKIP) have actually read their parties manifesto? 5%? 10%?

So you've read UKIP's manifesto then?

Would be qood if you could share it with us as far as i'm aware UKIP have not yet released their manifesto for next years general election???

Also i'm not sure anyone knows how many voters have read their parties manifestos 5%, 10% your guess is as good as mine.

I read their last one, yes. I think you are clutching at straws now...

Ah so like the rest of us you hav'nt got a clue what will be in UKIPs 2015 general election manifesto then.

There are at least 2 manifesto's on the UKIP website

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *imiUKMan over a year ago

Hereford

"I'm quite happy to draw parallels with UKIP and '30s Fascism and I'm not concerned in the slightest if it offends them.

Happy to help.

I fail to see how anyone could read that and not see the link UKIP = Fascists?

I'll make it simpler for you - I said that there were parallels with their manifesto and the policies of Mussolini, especially.

How many voters (be it Lib, Lab, Tory or UKIP) have actually read their parties manifesto? 5%? 10%?

So you've read UKIP's manifesto then?

Would be qood if you could share it with us as far as i'm aware UKIP have not yet released their manifesto for next years general election???

Also i'm not sure anyone knows how many voters have read their parties manifestos 5%, 10% your guess is as good as mine.

I read their last one, yes. I think you are clutching at straws now...

Ah so like the rest of us you hav'nt got a clue what will be in UKIPs 2015 general election manifesto then.

No, because I can't see into the future....

So i'll do what anybody else would and use the last one they published.

Really clutching at straws now, aren't you?

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

Someone said UKIP now is the same as 30's fascism, so presumably all UKIP supporters and voters are now fascists?

No most of them are deluded or disillusioned with an elitist state. If you read your history on 1930s Germany you will see that 'in the beginning' Hitler was basically a Nigel Farage."

So you think Nigel Farage has secret plans for world domination then, Lmao.

Look at the news there are much bigger threats out there to worry about, UKIP and Farage should be the least of your worries.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

To be honest It's pretty pointless debating this on a Swingers forum. You are never going to convince anyone that what they believe is wrong until everything goes to shit.

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

Someone said UKIP now is the same as 30's fascism, so presumably all UKIP supporters and voters are now fascists?

No most of them are deluded or disillusioned with an elitist state. If you read your history on 1930s Germany you will see that 'in the beginning' Hitler was basically a Nigel Farage.

To be fair, as much as I despise Hitler, I think he had a tad more about him than Nigel.

Well despite the media portraying Farage as hating foreigners, he does have a German wife.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Someone said UKIP now is the same as 30's fascism, so presumably all UKIP supporters and voters are now fascists?

No most of them are deluded or disillusioned with an elitist state. If you read your history on 1930s Germany you will see that 'in the beginning' Hitler was basically a Nigel Farage.

So you think Nigel Farage has secret plans for world domination then, Lmao.

Look at the news there are much bigger threats out there to worry about, UKIP and Farage should be the least of your worries."

While I doubt Farage has plans for world domination are you aware of the policies of some of the parties that UKIP align themselves to in Europe?

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By *yrdwomanWoman over a year ago

Putting the 'cum' in Eboracum

"To be honest It's pretty pointless debating this on a Swingers forum. You are never going to convince anyone that what they believe is wrong until everything goes to shit.

I don't understand why people have to be wrong. Political belief is like religious belief - personal. No-one has ever convinced me to change my mind by being disparaging about my choices.

As Adam Hill said on Last Leg tonight, I have an opinion, I'm not trying to make anyone do something they don't want to do.

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By *imiUKMan over a year ago

Hereford

So you think Nigel Farage has secret plans for world domination then, Lmao.

Nope, and nor do I think Mussolini or Franco did.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"I'm quite happy to draw parallels with UKIP and '30s Fascism and I'm not concerned in the slightest if it offends them.

Happy to help.

I fail to see how anyone could read that and not see the link UKIP = Fascists?

I'll make it simpler for you - I said that there were parallels with their manifesto and the policies of Mussolini, especially.

How many voters (be it Lib, Lab, Tory or UKIP) have actually read their parties manifesto? 5%? 10%?

So you've read UKIP's manifesto then?

Would be qood if you could share it with us as far as i'm aware UKIP have not yet released their manifesto for next years general election???

Also i'm not sure anyone knows how many voters have read their parties manifestos 5%, 10% your guess is as good as mine.

I read their last one, yes. I think you are clutching at straws now...

Ah so like the rest of us you hav'nt got a clue what will be in UKIPs 2015 general election manifesto then.

There are at least 2 manifesto's on the UKIP website

If there are 2 then that in itself tells you they are not the final version. There will only be 1 final copy released for next years general election.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I'm quite happy to draw parallels with UKIP and '30s Fascism and I'm not concerned in the slightest if it offends them.

Happy to help.

I fail to see how anyone could read that and not see the link UKIP = Fascists?

I'll make it simpler for you - I said that there were parallels with their manifesto and the policies of Mussolini, especially.

How many voters (be it Lib, Lab, Tory or UKIP) have actually read their parties manifesto? 5%? 10%?

So you've read UKIP's manifesto then?

Would be qood if you could share it with us as far as i'm aware UKIP have not yet released their manifesto for next years general election???

Also i'm not sure anyone knows how many voters have read their parties manifestos 5%, 10% your guess is as good as mine.

I read their last one, yes. I think you are clutching at straws now...

Ah so like the rest of us you hav'nt got a clue what will be in UKIPs 2015 general election manifesto then.

There are at least 2 manifesto's on the UKIP website

If there are 2 then that in itself tells you they are not the final version. There will only be 1 final copy released for next years general election."

Actually, you might be wrong there - one is the 2014 Manifesto and the other is the European Manifesto

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"I'm quite happy to draw parallels with UKIP and '30s Fascism and I'm not concerned in the slightest if it offends them.

Happy to help.

I fail to see how anyone could read that and not see the link UKIP = Fascists?

I'll make it simpler for you - I said that there were parallels with their manifesto and the policies of Mussolini, especially.

How many voters (be it Lib, Lab, Tory or UKIP) have actually read their parties manifesto? 5%? 10%?

So you've read UKIP's manifesto then?

Would be qood if you could share it with us as far as i'm aware UKIP have not yet released their manifesto for next years general election???

Also i'm not sure anyone knows how many voters have read their parties manifestos 5%, 10% your guess is as good as mine.

I read their last one, yes. I think you are clutching at straws now...

Ah so like the rest of us you hav'nt got a clue what will be in UKIPs 2015 general election manifesto then.

No, because I can't see into the future....

So i'll do what anybody else would and use the last one they published.

Really clutching at straws now, aren't you?"

....you appear to be clutching at straws, i attended a UKIP public meeting (why don't Labour or the tories hold public meetings?), and the message from the speakers there was that the new UKIP manifesto for the general election will be radical and different to the old one, with lots of new policies and ideas. Do try to keep up with current events, and not make assumptions based on old manifestos.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *imiUKMan over a year ago

Hereford

"I'm quite happy to draw parallels with UKIP and '30s Fascism and I'm not concerned in the slightest if it offends them.

Happy to help.

I fail to see how anyone could read that and not see the link UKIP = Fascists?

I'll make it simpler for you - I said that there were parallels with their manifesto and the policies of Mussolini, especially.

How many voters (be it Lib, Lab, Tory or UKIP) have actually read their parties manifesto? 5%? 10%?

So you've read UKIP's manifesto then?

Would be qood if you could share it with us as far as i'm aware UKIP have not yet released their manifesto for next years general election???

Also i'm not sure anyone knows how many voters have read their parties manifestos 5%, 10% your guess is as good as mine.

I read their last one, yes. I think you are clutching at straws now...

Ah so like the rest of us you hav'nt got a clue what will be in UKIPs 2015 general election manifesto then.

No, because I can't see into the future....

So i'll do what anybody else would and use the last one they published.

Really clutching at straws now, aren't you?

Vastly different?

Stop digging.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I'm quite happy to draw parallels with UKIP and '30s Fascism and I'm not concerned in the slightest if it offends them.

Happy to help.

I fail to see how anyone could read that and not see the link UKIP = Fascists?

I'll make it simpler for you - I said that there were parallels with their manifesto and the policies of Mussolini, especially.

How many voters (be it Lib, Lab, Tory or UKIP) have actually read their parties manifesto? 5%? 10%?

So you've read UKIP's manifesto then?

Would be qood if you could share it with us as far as i'm aware UKIP have not yet released their manifesto for next years general election???

Also i'm not sure anyone knows how many voters have read their parties manifestos 5%, 10% your guess is as good as mine.

I read their last one, yes. I think you are clutching at straws now...

Ah so like the rest of us you hav'nt got a clue what will be in UKIPs 2015 general election manifesto then.

No, because I can't see into the future....

So i'll do what anybody else would and use the last one they published.

Really clutching at straws now, aren't you?

A quick search on ~Google of the terms 'Labour Public meeting' or 'Conservative Public meeting' gives plenty of evidence that they do

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"I'm quite happy to draw parallels with UKIP and '30s Fascism and I'm not concerned in the slightest if it offends them.

Happy to help.

I fail to see how anyone could read that and not see the link UKIP = Fascists?

I'll make it simpler for you - I said that there were parallels with their manifesto and the policies of Mussolini, especially.

How many voters (be it Lib, Lab, Tory or UKIP) have actually read their parties manifesto? 5%? 10%?

So you've read UKIP's manifesto then?

Would be qood if you could share it with us as far as i'm aware UKIP have not yet released their manifesto for next years general election???

Also i'm not sure anyone knows how many voters have read their parties manifestos 5%, 10% your guess is as good as mine.

I read their last one, yes. I think you are clutching at straws now...

Ah so like the rest of us you hav'nt got a clue what will be in UKIPs 2015 general election manifesto then.

There are at least 2 manifesto's on the UKIP website

If there are 2 then that in itself tells you they are not the final version. There will only be 1 final copy released for next years general election.

Actually, you might be wrong there - one is the 2014 Manifesto and the other is the European Manifesto

Still not the 2015 general election manifestos though are they.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *imiUKMan over a year ago

Hereford

A quick search on ~Google of the terms 'Labour Public meeting' or 'Conservative Public meeting' gives plenty of evidence that they do

Christ!

I couldn't even be bothered to address that point since it was so utterly ridiculous...

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"I'm quite happy to draw parallels with UKIP and '30s Fascism and I'm not concerned in the slightest if it offends them.

Happy to help.

I fail to see how anyone could read that and not see the link UKIP = Fascists?

I'll make it simpler for you - I said that there were parallels with their manifesto and the policies of Mussolini, especially.

How many voters (be it Lib, Lab, Tory or UKIP) have actually read their parties manifesto? 5%? 10%?

So you've read UKIP's manifesto then?

Would be qood if you could share it with us as far as i'm aware UKIP have not yet released their manifesto for next years general election???

Also i'm not sure anyone knows how many voters have read their parties manifestos 5%, 10% your guess is as good as mine.

I read their last one, yes. I think you are clutching at straws now...

Ah so like the rest of us you hav'nt got a clue what will be in UKIPs 2015 general election manifesto then.

No, because I can't see into the future....

So i'll do what anybody else would and use the last one they published.

Really clutching at straws now, aren't you?

Vastly different?

Stop digging. "

I did'nt say "vastly different", the word i used was "radical", and the word the speaker at the UKIP meeting used was radical.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I'm quite happy to draw parallels with UKIP and '30s Fascism and I'm not concerned in the slightest if it offends them.

Happy to help.

I fail to see how anyone could read that and not see the link UKIP = Fascists?

I'll make it simpler for you - I said that there were parallels with their manifesto and the policies of Mussolini, especially.

How many voters (be it Lib, Lab, Tory or UKIP) have actually read their parties manifesto? 5%? 10%?

So you've read UKIP's manifesto then?

Would be qood if you could share it with us as far as i'm aware UKIP have not yet released their manifesto for next years general election???

Also i'm not sure anyone knows how many voters have read their parties manifestos 5%, 10% your guess is as good as mine.

I read their last one, yes. I think you are clutching at straws now...

Ah so like the rest of us you hav'nt got a clue what will be in UKIPs 2015 general election manifesto then.

No, because I can't see into the future....

So i'll do what anybody else would and use the last one they published.

Really clutching at straws now, aren't you?

Vastly different?

Stop digging.

I did'nt say "vastly different", the word i used was "radical", and the word the speaker at the UKIP meeting used was radical."

Is 'vastly different' not just a more concise way of saying 'radical and different to the old one, with lots of new policies and ideas'?

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By *imiUKMan over a year ago

Hereford

Is 'vastly different' not just a more concise way of saying 'radical and different to the old one, with lots of new policies and ideas'?

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"I'm quite happy to draw parallels with UKIP and '30s Fascism and I'm not concerned in the slightest if it offends them.

Happy to help.

I fail to see how anyone could read that and not see the link UKIP = Fascists?

I'll make it simpler for you - I said that there were parallels with their manifesto and the policies of Mussolini, especially.

How many voters (be it Lib, Lab, Tory or UKIP) have actually read their parties manifesto? 5%? 10%?

So you've read UKIP's manifesto then?

Would be qood if you could share it with us as far as i'm aware UKIP have not yet released their manifesto for next years general election???

Also i'm not sure anyone knows how many voters have read their parties manifestos 5%, 10% your guess is as good as mine.

I read their last one, yes. I think you are clutching at straws now...

Ah so like the rest of us you hav'nt got a clue what will be in UKIPs 2015 general election manifesto then.

No, because I can't see into the future....

So i'll do what anybody else would and use the last one they published.

Really clutching at straws now, aren't you?

Vastly different?

Stop digging.

I did'nt say "vastly different", the word i used was "radical", and the word the speaker at the UKIP meeting used was radical.

Is 'vastly different' not just a more concise way of saying 'radical and different to the old one, with lots of new policies and ideas'?

If you say so, still was'nt the exact words i used though but if you want to be pedantic about it please continue amongst yourselves....

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By *icketysplitsWoman over a year ago

Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound

I took a little break.

There are public meetings held by other parties. I have chaired hustings for local and European elections and I make a point of reading national and local manifestos for all the parties taking part in the debates.

I form my _iews by getting information from as many sources as possible, questioning what is being said and being savvy enough to understand the difference between rhetorical spin and electioneering and the bits that are likely to be policy.

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By *an_WoodMan over a year ago

Stafford

"its just one of the reasons im voting YES in the referendum.

god help the uk or England if that mob of Nazi's gain power

Which is why UKIP got elected in Scotland as well. Nationalism is a poor alternative to facing up to democracy. Good luck with the single party state of the SNP where any dissent is unpatriotic.

Yes UKIP did win an MEP's seat in scotland in the european elections.

Yes because some people vote loony regardless.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

I agree, no room in the free world for narrow minded racists.

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"I agree, no room in the free world for narrow minded racists. "

So for example if someone voted UKIP because they believe the EU to be a corrupt and undemocratic organisation, how would that make them racist in your opinion?

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By *abioMan over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

"I agree, no room in the free world for narrow minded racists.

So for example if someone voted UKIP because they believe the EU to be a corrupt and undemocratic organisation, how would that make them racist in your opinion?"

well if there elected representatives say that people should go back to "bongo bongo land".... and even just last week a female ukip elected representative had to apologise to a thai member of the party after people caught calling her a "ting tong"... you can understand why people may think they are narrow minded bigots....

I can bring up other examples if you wish.....

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"I agree, no room in the free world for narrow minded racists.

So for example if someone voted UKIP because they believe the EU to be a corrupt and undemocratic organisation, how would that make them racist in your opinion?

I can bring up other examples if you wish....."

You just totally failed to answer the question i put forward there Fabio.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I agree, no room in the free world for narrow minded racists.

So for example if someone voted UKIP because they believe the EU to be a corrupt and undemocratic organisation, how would that make them racist in your opinion?"

18 month old story but...

http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2013/02/ukip-party-bigots-lets-look-evidence

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I agree, no room in the free world for narrow minded racists.

So for example if someone voted UKIP because they believe the EU to be a corrupt and undemocratic organisation, how would that make them racist in your opinion?

I can bring up other examples if you wish....."

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By *abioMan over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

"I agree, no room in the free world for narrow minded racists.

So for example if someone voted UKIP because they believe the EU to be a corrupt and undemocratic organisation, how would that make them racist in your opinion?

I can bring up other examples if you wish.....

You just totally failed to answer the question i put forward there Fabio."

no... I answered the question as to why people may think ukip is full of narrow minded bigots.... the EU stuff is just a smokescreen....

now... I know you have taken a pasting in this thread.....and you have had to try and counter perfectly reasonable statements from other people on the back foot.... you know they say "quit whilst you are ahead".. I think that now would be one of those times...

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"I agree, no room in the free world for narrow minded racists.

So for example if someone voted UKIP because they believe the EU to be a corrupt and undemocratic organisation, how would that make them racist in your opinion?

18 month old story but...

http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2013/02/ukip-party-bigots-lets-look-evidence"

....and again you failed to give a straight answer to the question that was put forward.

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By *abioMan over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

"I agree, no room in the free world for narrow minded racists.

So for example if someone voted UKIP because they believe the EU to be a corrupt and undemocratic organisation, how would that make them racist in your opinion?

18 month old story but...

http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2013/02/ukip-party-bigots-lets-look-evidence

....and again you failed to give a straight answer to the question that was put forward."

oh you really want to go down this route..... okay then...

1. ‘Businesses should be allowed to refuse services to women and gay people’

that one came from ukip councillor donna edmunds of Lewes.....in the defence of

2. UKIP henley on thames Councillor David Silvester blames UK storms and floods on gay marriage laws

I can keep going.......

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"I agree, no room in the free world for narrow minded racists.

So for example if someone voted UKIP because they believe the EU to be a corrupt and undemocratic organisation, how would that make them racist in your opinion?

I can bring up other examples if you wish.....

You just totally failed to answer the question i put forward there Fabio.

no... I answered the question as to why people may think ukip is full of narrow minded bigots.... the EU stuff is just a smokescreen....

I never asked that question though. You just chose to side step a perfectly straight forward question and went of on a different tangent about "bongo bongo land" and "ting tong". What on earth does that have to do with the question i actually put forward???

The EU thing is not a smoke screen, many people do vote UKIP because they actually do believe the EU is a corrupt and undemocratic organisation with no accountability, and those issues have nothing to do with racism.

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By *abioMan over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

3. UKIP Gerard Batten MEP demanded British Muslims sign a commitment to abstain from violence and extremism.....

4. Nigel Farage: ‘working mothers are worth less than men’..... he said this to explain the pay gap between men and women..... to which UKIP MEP Stuart Agnew couldn’t agree more: ‘Women don’t have the ambition to get to the top because babies get in the way’

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By *abioMan over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

hey.... YOU voted for these people... I think you should know the type of people YOU voted for!!!

you may like to keep it to just the one issue... I like to think individuals are more rounded than that....

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By *abioMan over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

and to think I haven't even gotten to the "send lenny henry to a black country if he doesn't think there are enough black people portrayed on TV stuff" yet!!!!

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

Still failing epicly to answer the perfectly stright forward question i put forward Fabio.

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"3. UKIP Gerard Batten MEP demanded British Muslims sign a commitment to abstain from violence and extremism.."

Give the current problems with radical fundamentalist Muslim extremists in the country and many British Muslims leaving to fight in Syria and Iraq, i would say thats a pretty good idea.

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By *abioMan over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

"Still failing epicly to answer the perfectly stright forward question i put forward Fabio.

and I don't vote for one issue parties.... YOU seem to....

see... we have reached an impassed... I can continue to show you why people may think UKIP is a narrow bigoted organisation.... oh which you go "la la la I'm not listening".....

you want to bring up a single issue....

makes me remember the time a BNP rep turned up on my door asking me for my vote.... it was never going to happen, but we are playing along anyway!!!

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"I agree, no room in the free world for narrow minded racists.

So for example if someone voted UKIP because they believe the EU to be a corrupt and undemocratic organisation, how would that make them racist in your opinion?

18 month old story but...

http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2013/02/ukip-party-bigots-lets-look-evidence

....and again you failed to give a straight answer to the question that was put forward.

oh you really want to go down this route..... okay then...

1. ‘Businesses should be allowed to refuse services to women and gay people’

that one came from ukip councillor donna edmunds of Lewes.....in the defence of

2. UKIP henley on thames Councillor David Silvester blames UK storms and floods on gay marriage laws

The floods and storms thing was not a UKIP party belief and i think you are well aware of that.

It was the personal _iew and opinion of someone who has now been expelled from the UKIP party.

Also on the business right to refuse services, you never been into a nightclub or swingers club and seen the sign...."Management reserve the right to refuse admission".

That law already exists, and it existed under Tory and Labour governments.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Seems we have the opertunity to vote, using a proportional voting system, for our MEP's how is it undemocratic, it's probably more democratic than the uk system... The fact that none of the ukip arses bother to turn up for debates and votes, prefering instead to just claim the expenses probably makes it seem less democratic... The ukip party seems to have lots of nutcases within it's midst, as Fabio has pointed out... It doesn't make all the voters who vote for them, however I would hazard a guess that most of the EDL et all are voting for ukip, basically because they thick as fuck! It's common knowledge that the BNP has lost most of their support and voters to the ukip... So it could be said that no not all ukip voters are racist but enough of them are to tar the rest with the same brush to some. On the subject of EU membership if people actually look at the whole storey of what we get back as well as what we put in then the figures actually stand up quite well to scrutiny. Look at the amount of trade that UK companies are doing in the EU, if you think like the Scots do that you can leave the Union and stop chipping into the system whilst retaining all the benefits of the Union then you may be sadly mistaken.

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By *an_WoodMan over a year ago

Stafford

"3. UKIP Gerard Batten MEP demanded British Muslims sign a commitment to abstain from violence and extremism..

Give the current problems with radical fundamentalist Muslim extremists in the country and many British Muslims leaving to fight in Syria and Iraq, i would say thats a pretty good idea."

Political ploy that does nothing to address the problem. About as effective as asking if you intend to overthrow the US government at US border control.

Fabio is right in saying that the candidates matter as well as the policies. Do UKIP vet anyone before making them a candidate ?

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"hey.... YOU voted for these people... I think you should know the type of people YOU voted for!!!

you may like to keep it to just the one issue... I like to think individuals are more rounded than that....

Yes i voted for them and so did over 30 million other people in a fair and democratic process at the european elections. You have a problem with democracy?

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

Not a single issue party, many people also vote UKIP because they are against HS2. All the other parties are in favour of HS2. Again this has nothing to do with racism/fascism or bigots or any other name you care to pull out the hat.

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By *an_WoodMan over a year ago

Stafford

"hey.... YOU voted for these people... I think you should know the type of people YOU voted for!!!

you may like to keep it to just the one issue... I like to think individuals are more rounded than that....

Yes i voted for them and so did over 30 million other people in a fair and democratic process at the european elections. You have a problem with democracy?"

No approximately 4376000 votes or 27.5 % of the EU poll.

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"Seems we have the opertunity to vote, using a proportional voting system, for our MEP's how is it undemocratic, it's probably more democratic than the uk system... The fact that none of the ukip arses bother to turn up for debates and votes, prefering instead to just claim the expenses probably makes it seem less democratic... The ukip party seems to have lots of nutcases within it's midst, as Fabio has pointed out... It doesn't make all the voters who vote for them, however I would hazard a guess that most of the EDL et all are voting for ukip, basically because they thick as fuck! It's common knowledge that the BNP has lost most of their support and voters to the ukip... So it could be said that no not all ukip voters are racist but enough of them are to tar the rest with the same brush to some. On the subject of EU membership if people actually look at the whole storey of what we get back as well as what we put in then the figures actually stand up quite well to scrutiny. Look at the amount of trade that UK companies are doing in the EU, if you think like the Scots do that you can leave the Union and stop chipping into the system whilst retaining all the benefits of the Union then you may be sadly mistaken. "

The people of europe do not vote for the european president. The common man in the street has no say in it. Also there is no mechanism for the people of europe to remove the european president if they so wished. The EU books and accounts have not been signed off for years, billions of euros have simply vanished into thin air. So yes the EU is an undemocratic and corrupt organisation.

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By *abioMan over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

"hey.... YOU voted for these people... I think you should know the type of people YOU voted for!!!

you may like to keep it to just the one issue... I like to think individuals are more rounded than that....

Yes i voted for them and so did over 30 million other people in a fair and democratic process at the european elections. You have a problem with democracy?"

not at all...

however since you like to remind people that ukip doesn't have a manifesto.. and the only known issue at the time was to leave the EU....

if I ask someone about an issue they are suppose to have an reasoned opinion on... and the answer is "dont know haven't come up with a policy yet"..... I think I'd be rather worried.....

p.s... i know ukip followers are prone to exageration.. but ukip actually got 4.3 million votes (300,000 more than labour, 600,000 more than the conservatives)...the overall turnout was 16.5 million for the uk, so would you like to tell us where you got the "30 miliion voted for UKIP" figure

they actually got 27.5% of the vote of a 34% turnout.......

which means that 90% of the entire voting population didn't vote for UKIP

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"hey.... YOU voted for these people... I think you should know the type of people YOU voted for!!!

you may like to keep it to just the one issue... I like to think individuals are more rounded than that....

Yes i voted for them and so did over 30 million other people in a fair and democratic process at the european elections. You have a problem with democracy?

No approximately 4376000 votes or 27.5 % of the EU poll.

OK so i rounded it up but if you want to be petty and specific, 4376000 people voted UKIP in a fair and democratic process at the european elections.

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"hey.... YOU voted for these people... I think you should know the type of people YOU voted for!!!

you may like to keep it to just the one issue... I like to think individuals are more rounded than that....

Yes i voted for them and so did over 30 million other people in a fair and democratic process at the european elections. You have a problem with democracy?"

I meant to write 3 million in there, sorry as it is late and very tired, but as you pointed out the actual figure is more than 3 million at 4,376,635 approx (figure from wikipedia).

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"Still failing epicly to answer the perfectly stright forward question i put forward Fabio.

and I don't vote for one issue parties.... YOU seem to....

see... we have reached an impassed... I can continue to show you why people may think UKIP is a narrow bigoted organisation.... oh which you go "la la la I'm not listening".....

you want to bring up a single issue....

makes me remember the time a BNP rep turned up on my door asking me for my vote.... it was never going to happen, but we are playing along anyway!!!"

I'm not trying to convince anyone, just defending my position, so play along all you like, you have your opinion and i have mine.

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By *an_WoodMan over a year ago

Stafford

Nothing petty about an error that big

Fits in with the arithmetic for UKIP's economic policies

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"Nothing petty about an error that big

Fits in with the arithmetic for UKIP's economic policies

Yes because Labour managed to make a great job of the economy did'nt they.

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By *tephanie!TV/TS over a year ago

manchester

Very true! UKIP the militant wing of Tory party - Farage made his money as a City trader FFS so cares nothing for ordinary.

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By *an_WoodMan over a year ago

Stafford

If you are worried about Labour voting UKIP is going to work a treat. Posting on UKIP must be deflection from my interest in Swinging. Me bad

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"Very true! UKIP the militant wing of Tory party - Farage made his money as a City trader FFS so cares nothing for ordinary. "

At least Farage has had a job out side of politics, unlike Cameron, Clegg and Miliband.

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

"Very true! UKIP the militant wing of Tory party - Farage made his money as a City trader FFS so cares nothing for ordinary. "

...and do you think Cameron, Clegg or Miliband care for ordinary people?

Miliband wants to tackle the cost of living crisis and he does'nt even know the price of his weekly shopping bill, face it the guy is a joke, hell he can't even eat a bacon sandwich properly!

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Yet several posts above the one I've quoted you have called it a democratic process when ukip meps have been voted in, make yer mind up!!!

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Very true! UKIP the militant wing of Tory party - Farage made his money as a City trader FFS so cares nothing for ordinary.

At least Farage has had a job out side of politics, unlike Cameron, Clegg and Miliband. "

I bet you, like Clegg, would love to be paid 100k a year to say 'yes Dave' 5 times a day...

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By *entaur_UK OP Man over a year ago

Cannock

Yet several posts above the one I've quoted you have called it a democratic process when ukip meps have been voted in, make yer mind up!!!"

Yes the voting of MEPs is democratic because they are selected by the people of europe in the european elections, the EU commision and the EU president are not voted for by the people of europe so that is extremely undemocratic. I'm afraid if you cannot see the simple difference there then i'm unable to help you any further?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Vote UKIP, get a Labour government.

In my opinion, vote ukip & we'll get a Tory party that's even further rght wing!!

What'll be next, - "bring back the workhouses"?

Vote for them at your peril!!

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