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Amanda Knox
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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Is America going to respect the 'due process' of Italy and send this convicted criminal back to face her sentence?
Or is this 'land of the free and home of the brave' going to disgust many in the free world with it's double standards? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"It would be hypocritical if they didn't given the people they've demanded we hand over to them "
that's the thing about hypocrites, they tend to be hypocritical!  |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"It would be hypocritical if they didn't given the people they've demanded we hand over to them that's the thing about hypocrites, they tend to be hypocritical! "
 |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"They should send her back without a doubt.
Or the Italians should just order a Mafia hit  "
The Italians should not stoop to such lows. A Mafia hit or a drone attack on a citizen residing in another country whilst disregarding that countries sovereignty would be a despicable act.
What country would do such a thing?
I think the Italians are above that. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I'm not up to speed with this case so I may need some help.
Wasn't she convicted , sentenced and sent to prison. Then released and told she could go home. Then they changed their minds and said she shouldn't have been released and now they want her back ?
If I was her I would stay where she is. |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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They were convicted, appealed that conviction which resulted in aquittal.
The case has been reheard, the original conviction has been reinstated.
This is not a 'tin pot' regime making decisions on the whim of some dictator. This is Italy, their due process and courts have arrived at this decision. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"They were convicted, appealed that conviction which resulted in aquittal.
The case has been reheard, the original conviction has been reinstated.
This is not a 'tin pot' regime making decisions on the whim of some dictator. This is Italy, their due process and courts have arrived at this decision. "
I do understand this. But if I was her I'd stay where I was. Are the Italians claiming the best of three rule ? |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"
I do understand this. But if I was her I'd stay where I was. Are the Italians claiming the best of three rule ? "
If you were her, a convicted murderer, the choice would not be yours. The choice would be down to the country that chose to harbour you.
In this case that is the USA. That's why my question is worded the way it is.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"
I do understand this. But if I was her I'd stay where I was. Are the Italians claiming the best of three rule ?
If you were her, a convicted murderer, the choice would not be yours. The choice would be down to the country that chose to harbour you.
In this case that is the USA. That's why my question is worded the way it is.
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But she and the American government may see her as someone who was acquitted of the crime. |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"
But she and the American government may see her as someone who was acquitted of the crime. "
They did, but now they both know that she is someone convicted of murder in a court of law that has heard all the evidence available to it.
Just because someone doesn't like the decision doesn't make it unjust.
Lee Rigby's killers don't like the conviction, so what, they've been found guilty after due process. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"
But she and the American government may see her as someone who was acquitted of the crime.
They did, but now they both know that she is someone convicted of murder in a court of law that has heard all the evidence available to it.
Just because someone doesn't like the decision doesn't make it unjust.
Lee Rigby's killers don't like the conviction, so what, they've been found guilty after due process. "
But maybe it isn't about not liking the decision. Maybe they don't like the way this has all been played out. Before any country extradites someone they have to be sure there will be a fair trial. This was the third time the trial was held , this time in her absence so a large part of evidence was missing, she has been guilty then not guilty then guilty. It's all a bit of a circus really.
I fail to see why you brought Lee Rigby into it. His murderers aren't being extradited anywhere. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"She has been convicted of murder in a court of law, in Italy.
The U.S. has had an extradition treaty with Italy since 1983.
Make up your own minds!"
She has also been aquited. Maybe it's the italian judicial services that should make their minds up. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I only hope that if she is guilty, she's extradited & if truly innocent, stays put.
A simple outlook, maybe - but the fact is that 'justice' isn't always 'just'!! |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"
But she and the American government may see her as someone who was acquitted of the crime.
They did, but now they both know that she is someone convicted of murder in a court of law that has heard all the evidence available to it.
Just because someone doesn't like the decision doesn't make it unjust.
Lee Rigby's killers don't like the conviction, so what, they've been found guilty after due process.
But maybe it isn't about not liking the decision. Maybe they don't like the way this has all been played out. Before any country extradites someone they have to be sure there will be a fair trial. This was the third time the trial was held , this time in her absence so a large part of evidence was missing, she has been guilty then not guilty then guilty. It's all a bit of a circus really.
I fail to see why you brought Lee Rigby into it. His murderers aren't being extradited anywhere. "
I have brought up Lee Rigby's killers because just like Amanda Knox they don't like the decision, they 'don't like the way this has all been played out'. Like Knox they have been convicted as murderers after due process in a legitimate court of law. They have also appealed.
If they happened to be abroad, we would want them here to face justice. Fortunately they're already here. The Italians will have every right to expect the Americans to honour an extradition request if her final appeal fails. |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"She has been convicted of murder in a court of law, in Italy.
The U.S. has had an extradition treaty with Italy since 1983.
Make up your own minds!
She has also been aquited. Maybe it's the italian judicial services that should make their minds up. "
They have. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I think she's guilty myself.
Who the feck sits in court smiling like an idiot while on trial for murder??
I'd be bricking myself personally!! Luckily I've still not been caught  |
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"I think she's guilty myself.
Who the feck sits in court smiling like an idiot while on trial for murder??
I'd be bricking myself personally!! Luckily I've still not been caught "
The facts are that at this point in time she IS guilty, as per the court ruling. If she wants to change that then she must appeal again.
Don't forget that the term guilty, does not mean that you have committed the crime, it only means that you have been rightly or wrongly proved guilty in court. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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We're not the jury. Whether she's innocent or guilty,a flaw on the prosecutors led to her release. This happens every day,and who here can say they would turn down such a loop hole if placed in the same situation? |
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"We're not the jury. Whether she's innocent or guilty,a flaw on the prosecutors led to her release. This happens every day,and who here can say they would turn down such a loop hole if placed in the same situation? "
How very true
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I think she's guilty myself.
Who the feck sits in court smiling like an idiot while on trial for murder??
I'd be bricking myself personally!! Luckily I've still not been caught
The facts are that at this point in time she IS guilty, as per the court ruling. If she wants to change that then she must appeal again.
Don't forget that the term guilty, does not mean that you have committed the crime, it only means that you have been rightly or wrongly proved guilty in court."
A critical fact, well pointed out x |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I think she's guilty myself.
Who the feck sits in court smiling like an idiot while on trial for murder??
I'd be bricking myself personally!! Luckily I've still not been caught
The facts are that at this point in time she IS guilty, as per the court ruling. If she wants to change that then she must appeal again.
Don't forget that the term guilty, does not mean that you have committed the crime, it only means that you have been rightly or wrongly proved guilty in court.
A critical fact, well pointed out x"
Oh I completely agree. I was just saying in my personal opinion from what I've read on the trials, her demeanour through out them, I feel she's guilty.
Also it didn't exactly take her long to agree a book deal and agree a film being put into production. |
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From memory the Italian police made some horrific mistakes re the initial investigation and during the collection of forensic evidence. I would have my doubts about the court's decision...I would like to think that the murderer will be caught but just not sure the true story will ever be told... |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"From memory the Italian police made some horrific mistakes re the initial investigation and during the collection of forensic evidence. I would have my doubts about the court's decision...I would like to think that the murderer will be caught but just not sure the true story will ever be told..."
In my honest opinion, the truth won't ever be told, as it did happen, the only person who knows the whole truth is she.... . |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"From memory the Italian police made some horrific mistakes re the initial investigation and during the collection of forensic evidence. I would have my doubts about the court's decision...I would like to think that the murderer will be caught but just not sure the true story will ever be told..."
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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America should cast it's collective mind back to 2001. A crime was committed back then, they had a suspect who was hiding ( possibly in a cave) in another country, the government refused to hand the suspect over, we all went to war over it.... |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"America should cast it's collective mind back to 2001. A crime was committed back then, they had a suspect who was hiding ( possibly in a cave) in another country, the government refused to hand the suspect over, we all went to war over it...."
Julian Assange is having is breakfast in some embassy where he's stuck with police outside waiting to grab him and extradite him. Unless I'm mistaken, he hasn't been convicted of anything? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"It would be hypocritical if they didn't given the people they've demanded we hand over to them "
How dare you, when have the Americans ever been hypocritical and two faced when it comes to these sort of things??? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"America should cast it's collective mind back to 2001. A crime was committed back then, they had a suspect who was hiding ( possibly in a cave) in another country, the government refused to hand the suspect over, we all went to war over it....
Julian Assange is having is breakfast in some embassy where he's stuck with police outside waiting to grab him and extradite him. Unless I'm mistaken, he hasn't been convicted of anything?"
They want to extradite him for trial in th US. |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"So what happens now does she return to Italy to serve her sentence or will the US hide her in America....?? "
That's basically what I'm asking in the opening post. I imagine she is not going to return of her own accord, so will the USA send her to face her sentence or harbour a murderer. |
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"
But she and the American government may see her as someone who was acquitted of the crime.
They did, but now they both know that she is someone convicted of murder in a court of law that has heard all the evidence available to it.
Just because someone doesn't like the decision doesn't make it unjust.
Lee Rigby's killers don't like the conviction, so what, they've been found guilty after due process.
But maybe it isn't about not liking the decision. Maybe they don't like the way this has all been played out. Before any country extradites someone they have to be sure there will be a fair trial. This was the third time the trial was held , this time in her absence so a large part of evidence was missing, she has been guilty then not guilty then guilty. It's all a bit of a circus really.
I fail to see why you brought Lee Rigby into it. His murderers aren't being extradited anywhere.
I have brought up Lee Rigby's killers because just like Amanda Knox they don't like the decision, they 'don't like the way this has all been played out'. Like Knox they have been convicted as murderers after due process in a legitimate court of law. They have also appealed.
"
And if their appeal is successful they'll be free to fuck off wherever they want.
Doesn't the USA have 'double jeopardy' rules? |
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Total farce of a trial from the start with compromised forensics to the retrial. There is no way the US will extradite her to Italy, the US own judicial system cannot have a retrial for the same crime once aquitted so returning her to the Italians would go against their own laws. I'm not saying it's right but this is what they will use as an excuse in my opinion. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"So what happens now does she return to Italy to serve her sentence or will the US hide her in America....??
That's basically what I'm asking in the opening post. I imagine she is not going to return of her own accord, so will the USA send her to face her sentence or harbour a murderer. "
Correct me if i'm wrong, but hasn't Obama signed more murderous death warrants via drone killings than any other US President in history?
Lol, what makes me sort of laugh is killing, say Pakistani, women and children is fine. Racism at it's finest? |
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By *nnyMan
over a year ago
Glasgow |
"So what happens now does she return to Italy to serve her sentence or will the US hide her in America....??
That's basically what I'm asking in the opening post. I imagine she is not going to return of her own accord, so will the USA send her to face her sentence or harbour a murderer.
Correct me if i'm wrong, but hasn't Obama signed more murderous death warrants via drone killings than any other US President in history?
Lol, what makes me sort of laugh is killing, say Pakistani, women and children is fine. Racism at it's finest?"
In fairness, Uncle Sam is a non discriminatory murderer. Colour, creed and faith don't come into it. |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"
Correct me if i'm wrong, but hasn't Obama signed more murderous death warrants via drone killings than any other US President in history?
Lol, what makes me sort of laugh is killing, say Pakistani, women and children is fine. Racism at it's finest?"
I'm not sure about your racism point, forgive me but that word seems to burrow its way into every thread on these forums.
I certainly agree with the other thrust of your concerns with regards to drone killings. Can you imagine the reaction if another state carried out that type of assassination on American soil. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I take it folks know you can be tried for the same alleged offence twice in Scotland."
And in the rest of the UK if it is a serious crime, double jeopardy laws were changed about 10 years ago I think.
Knox already has a senator speaking out on her behalf, and will probably be fighting extradition through the US courts, probably citing human rights.
Whether the US has double jeopardy laws or not shouldn't matter, as Italy is where the crime was committed Italian law should take precedence. The US likes to extradite people to their country even when the crimes have been committed in another country(McKinnon). They were also trying to get hold of the owners of gambling websites due to their citizens gambling on them which is against us law even, though those people had never set foot in the US.
If Knox ever gets extradited it'll probably be a long time coming.
Unfortunately for the family of the murdered girl this is going to drag on for quite some time yet. |
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"I take it folks know you can be tried for the same alleged offence twice in Scotland.
You can in England and Wales now too."
To be fair, the whole double jeopardy thing exists mostly in Hollywood movies. Most countries allow suspects to be tried for the same offence if any new evidence shows up. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"
Correct me if i'm wrong, but hasn't Obama signed more murderous death warrants via drone killings than any other US President in history?
Lol, what makes me sort of laugh is killing, say Pakistani, women and children is fine. Racism at it's finest?
I'm not sure about your racism point, forgive me but that word seems to burrow its way into every thread on these forums.
I certainly agree with the other thrust of your concerns with regards to drone killings. Can you imagine the reaction if another state carried out that type of assassination on American soil. "
They'd invade another middle eastern country, probably. |
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"I take it folks know you can be tried for the same alleged offence twice in Scotland.
And in the rest of the UK if it is a serious crime, double jeopardy laws were changed about 10 years ago I think.
Knox already has a senator speaking out on her behalf, and will probably be fighting extradition through the US courts, probably citing human rights.
Whether the US has double jeopardy laws or not shouldn't matter, as Italy is where the crime was committed Italian law should take precedence. The US likes to extradite people to their country even when the crimes have been committed in another country(McKinnon). They were also trying to get hold of the owners of gambling websites due to their citizens gambling on them which is against us law even, though those people had never set foot in the US.
If Knox ever gets extradited it'll probably be a long time coming.
Unfortunately for the family of the murdered girl this is going to drag on for quite some time yet."
2003, for a range of 'serious crimes'. There has to be 'new and compelling evidence'; the acceptance of DNA evidence had a lot to do with it. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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For anyone who has absolute faith and trust in "due process" being fair, just and correct then :
a) i hope you're never an alleged victim of something you didn't do, and
b) enjoy your jury service if and when called.
A multitude of cases exist in Britain itself to show otherwise. |
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"
For anyone who has absolute faith and trust in "due process" being fair, just and correct then :
a) i hope you're never an alleged victim of something you didn't do, and
b) enjoy your jury service if and when called.
A multitude of cases exist in Britain itself to show otherwise. "
I think this thread has less to do with due process being fair and more to do with the US's hypocrisy in all things extradition related. From what I've read of the Knox case, yes she's guilty but the police fucked up so badly she'd probably get off on a technicality if the case was heard in the UK and she had a decent brief. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"
For anyone who has absolute faith and trust in "due process" being fair, just and correct then :
a) i hope you're never an alleged victim of something you didn't do, and
b) enjoy your jury service if and when called.
A multitude of cases exist in Britain itself to show otherwise. "
No one has stated that the law of any country is infallible, hence why lots of people do not agree with the death sentence. They probably get it right the majority of the time but there will always be mistakes made. |
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By *iewMan
over a year ago
Forum Mod Angus & Findhorn |
I am so glad I am not asked to be on her jury if they were in the UK, I would excuse myself.
There is just something about her that would not allow be to be balanced.
I am ashamed to say
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"
For anyone who has absolute faith and trust in "due process" being fair, just and correct then :
a) i hope you're never an alleged victim of something you didn't do, and
b) enjoy your jury service if and when called.
A multitude of cases exist in Britain itself to show otherwise.
No one has stated that the law of any country is infallible, hence why lots of people do not agree with the death sentence. They probably get it right the majority of the time but there will always be mistakes made."
I also fail to see what getting called for Jury Service has to do with anything? I've done it twice and enjoyed it twice; narrowly avoiding a long attempted murder case, as I knew the accused (and knew he was as guilty as sin!) |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I am so glad I am not asked to be on her jury if they were in the UK, I would excuse myself.
There is just something about her that would not allow be to be balanced.
I am ashamed to say
"
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No one knows what really happened in Italy, except that tragically a young woman's life was cut violently short, so for her sake, I hope justice is done. Did Knox ( and her co accused ) do it? The Italian legal and police effort seemed to have made a complete hash of the whole matter. To convict her, then on appeal, acquit her, now, to find her guilty "in abscensia" smacks of serious incompetence. If she is guilty and at the moment only she knows this, then she should atone for her crime. If she is innocent and that is what she is saying, rather sat in America, with the legal wranglings that will go on and on, fighting extradition, because, who's to say in another 18 months the guilty charge will be overturned. I just feel for poor Meredith Kerchers' family.  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I have followed this story closely and have spent a lot of time reading various bits of news relating to the case. I have come to the conclusion that I would still love to smash her back doors in  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I have followed this story closely and have spent a lot of time reading various bits of news relating to the case. I have come to the conclusion that I would still love to smash her back doors in "
You'll be fine as long as you hide all the cutlery before she arrives... |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"
But she and the American government may see her as someone who was acquitted of the crime.
They did, but now they both know that she is someone convicted of murder in a court of law that has heard all the evidence available to it.
Just because someone doesn't like the decision doesn't make it unjust.
Lee Rigby's killers don't like the conviction, so what, they've been found guilty after due process.
But maybe it isn't about not liking the decision. Maybe they don't like the way this has all been played out. Before any country extradites someone they have to be sure there will be a fair trial. This was the third time the trial was held , this time in her absence so a large part of evidence was missing, she has been guilty then not guilty then guilty. It's all a bit of a circus really.
I fail to see why you brought Lee Rigby into it. His murderers aren't being extradited anywhere. "
i seem to remember the fella with aspegers, that hacked into the whitehouse computer system, was convicted in his absence and they screamed for him to be sent over for sentencing. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"
But she and the American government may see her as someone who was acquitted of the crime.
They did, but now they both know that she is someone convicted of murder in a court of law that has heard all the evidence available to it.
Just because someone doesn't like the decision doesn't make it unjust.
Lee Rigby's killers don't like the conviction, so what, they've been found guilty after due process.
But maybe it isn't about not liking the decision. Maybe they don't like the way this has all been played out. Before any country extradites someone they have to be sure there will be a fair trial. This was the third time the trial was held , this time in her absence so a large part of evidence was missing, she has been guilty then not guilty then guilty. It's all a bit of a circus really.
I fail to see why you brought Lee Rigby into it. His murderers aren't being extradited anywhere.
i seem to remember the fella with aspegers, that hacked into the whitehouse computer system, was convicted in his absence and they screamed for him to be sent over for sentencing."
Gary McKinnon.
Committed crime in this country not the US. IMO should have been tried in this country if fit to stand trial. If you have never been to the US how can you be tried in the US? It's hard enough to be aware of all the laws in this country without knowing all the laws of every country in the world.
The US were also trying to get hold of the owners of gambling websites as it is against the law for us citizens to gamble on international gambling sites. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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The simple fact she did not go back to for the second trial say a lot. will the USA send her back we will have to wait and see. As right now the USA is lead by a load silly Muppets.
with one case where a man with a number of qualifications in childcare and his wife were found to be unfit for looking after 7 kids all day and night. Just as some case worker decide they were made to. They lost the kids and after a long court battle won them back. The case work said a number of law points that were in error and the *&^&$% judge did not look them up he said later.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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God knows how the behind the scenes rules work. Is she allowed to stay while she appeals? Does she have to be over there for that to happen?
From her point of _iew, she did the right thing staying in the US while the trail went ahead. She would definitely have been advised to stay put as she wold've been locked up again straight away had she been in Italy.
My guess is the US will piddle about for a while and then eventually extradite her. They can't be seen to be fighting extradition for someone who has (rightly or wrongly) been convicted of murder in another country.
The Italian police were shown up as incompetent fools when she was acquitted on appeal and you always got the feeling that this case was always going to go back to trial again at some point. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Did anyone of us attend the trial(s) itself or are we just going by the press reports? How much faith do we put in them?
It wouldn't be beyond the realms of possibility that the Italian Air Force gained a couple of F15's and the whole thing went quiet.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"What confuses me about this case is that someone confessed and was sentenced and yet I've never heard reported what he said happened in his confession?
Did he implicate them?
Ruby x"
Yep Rudy Guede from the Ivory Coast was convicted and sentenced to 16 years in 2008. The verdict in that case does stat that he could not of done the crime on his own. He has never answered the question if he did it on his own or had help and who that was, as far as I remember. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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" As right now the USA is lead by a load silly Muppets.
"
If you class Obama as a Muppet how did you classify Bush? I thought anyone, even Kermit would have been a great improvement on Bush...
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"What confuses me about this case is that someone confessed and was sentenced and yet I've never heard reported what he said happened in his confession?
Did he implicate them?
Ruby x
Yep Rudy Guede from the Ivory Coast was convicted and sentenced to 16 years in 2008. The verdict in that case does stat that he could not of done the crime on his own. He has never answered the question if he did it on his own or had help and who that was, as far as I remember. "
Thanks for your answer, it's intriguing that he didn't give answers |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"
But she and the American government may see her as someone who was acquitted of the crime.
They did, but now they both know that she is someone convicted of murder in a court of law that has heard all the evidence available to it.
Just because someone doesn't like the decision doesn't make it unjust.
Lee Rigby's killers don't like the conviction, so what, they've been found guilty after due process.
But maybe it isn't about not liking the decision. Maybe they don't like the way this has all been played out. Before any country extradites someone they have to be sure there will be a fair trial. This was the third time the trial was held , this time in her absence so a large part of evidence was missing, she has been guilty then not guilty then guilty. It's all a bit of a circus really.
I fail to see why you brought Lee Rigby into it. His murderers aren't being extradited anywhere.
i seem to remember the fella with aspegers, that hacked into the whitehouse computer system, was convicted in his absence and they screamed for him to be sent over for sentencing."
Was he extradited though ? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Whether she or the US govt like it or not, she has been found guilty after due process in a court in a country with which the US has an extradition treaty. She should be arrested and returned to Italy to serve her sentence. Should she wish to appeal she should and if the court finds in her favour she will be released. But do I trust the US to do the right thing.....do I f@"k! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Whether she or the US govt like it or not, she has been found guilty after due process in a court in a country with which the US has an extradition treaty. She should be arrested and returned to Italy to serve her sentence. Should she wish to appeal she should and if the court finds in her favour she will be released. But do I trust the US to do the right thing.....do I f@"k! "
But they may just do the right thing for a citizen of their country. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Whether she or the US govt like it or not, she has been found guilty after due process in a court in a country with which the US has an extradition treaty. She should be arrested and returned to Italy to serve her sentence. Should she wish to appeal she should and if the court finds in her favour she will be released. But do I trust the US to do the right thing.....do I f@"k!
But they may just do the right thing for a citizen of their country. "
She is a convicted murderer, what would you suggest is the right thing? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Whether she or the US govt like it or not, she has been found guilty after due process in a court in a country with which the US has an extradition treaty. She should be arrested and returned to Italy to serve her sentence. Should she wish to appeal she should and if the court finds in her favour she will be released. But do I trust the US to do the right thing.....do I f@"k!
But they may just do the right thing for a citizen of their country. "
No person, group of people or country is above the rule of law.
The crime she has committed is a crime in all countries. She has had two trials as well, So send her back ASAP.
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By *nnyMan
over a year ago
Glasgow |
I have no idea whether either of them committed the crimes they've been convicted of, but as of now they're both guilty.
What surprised me is that the Italian authorities took Sollecitto's passport 'to stop him leaving the country'. Do they really think that will work? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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So they convicted her and sent her to prison
Then declared she was innocent and set her free
Now they've convicted her a second time and want her to return to prison
Good old Italian justice eh |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Whether she or the US govt like it or not, she has been found guilty after due process in a court in a country with which the US has an extradition treaty. She should be arrested and returned to Italy to serve her sentence. Should she wish to appeal she should and if the court finds in her favour she will be released. But do I trust the US to do the right thing.....do I f@"k!
But they may just do the right thing for a citizen of their country.
No person, group of people or country is above the rule of law.
The crime she has committed is a crime in all countries. She has had two trials as well, So send her back ASAP.
"
No she has had three trials. In the middle one she was found not guilty. Maybe she didn't want to play best of three. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Whether she or the US govt like it or not, she has been found guilty after due process in a court in a country with which the US has an extradition treaty. She should be arrested and returned to Italy to serve her sentence. Should she wish to appeal she should and if the court finds in her favour she will be released. But do I trust the US to do the right thing.....do I f@"k!
But they may just do the right thing for a citizen of their country.
She is a convicted murderer, what would you suggest is the right thing?"
To play best of five and hope for the best. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Whether she or the US govt like it or not, she has been found guilty after due process in a court in a country with which the US has an extradition treaty. She should be arrested and returned to Italy to serve her sentence. Should she wish to appeal she should and if the court finds in her favour she will be released. But do I trust the US to do the right thing.....do I f@"k!
But they may just do the right thing for a citizen of their country.
No person, group of people or country is above the rule of law.
The crime she has committed is a crime in all countries. She has had two trials as well, So send her back ASAP.
No she has had three trials. In the middle one she was found not guilty. Maybe she didn't want to play best of three. "
She has been found guilty in a third trial, so by law she is guilty. I don't know the details of the case as I'm sure most people on here don't. She may be innocent but it is not for us to disagree with the legal process in a democratic country which is an ally. Should the US have issues for one of their citizens they should provide support for an appeal without seeking to undermine the legality of the verdict that has been reached. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Whether she or the US govt like it or not, she has been found guilty after due process in a court in a country with which the US has an extradition treaty. She should be arrested and returned to Italy to serve her sentence. Should she wish to appeal she should and if the court finds in her favour she will be released. But do I trust the US to do the right thing.....do I f@"k!
But they may just do the right thing for a citizen of their country.
No person, group of people or country is above the rule of law.
The crime she has committed is a crime in all countries. She has had two trials as well, So send her back ASAP.
No she has had three trials. In the middle one she was found not guilty. Maybe she didn't want to play best of three.
She has been found guilty in a third trial, so by law she is guilty. I don't know the details of the case as I'm sure most people on here don't. She may be innocent but it is not for us to disagree with the legal process in a democratic country which is an ally. Should the US have issues for one of their citizens they should provide support for an appeal without seeking to undermine the legality of the verdict that has been reached."
Maybe they are launching an appeal as we speak. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Whether she or the US govt like it or not, she has been found guilty after due process in a court in a country with which the US has an extradition treaty. She should be arrested and returned to Italy to serve her sentence. Should she wish to appeal she should and if the court finds in her favour she will be released. But do I trust the US to do the right thing.....do I f@"k!
But they may just do the right thing for a citizen of their country.
No person, group of people or country is above the rule of law.
The crime she has committed is a crime in all countries. She has had two trials as well, So send her back ASAP.
No she has had three trials. In the middle one she was found not guilty. Maybe she didn't want to play best of three.
She has been found guilty in a third trial, so by law she is guilty. I don't know the details of the case as I'm sure most people on here don't. She may be innocent but it is not for us to disagree with the legal process in a democratic country which is an ally. Should the US have issues for one of their citizens they should provide support for an appeal without seeking to undermine the legality of the verdict that has been reached.
Maybe they are launching an appeal as we speak. "
I am sure they will and one hopes for the victim's family that the truth emerges. But while the appeal process is ongoing the US should respect Italian law and hand over Ms Knox. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Whether she or the US govt like it or not, she has been found guilty after due process in a court in a country with which the US has an extradition treaty. She should be arrested and returned to Italy to serve her sentence. Should she wish to appeal she should and if the court finds in her favour she will be released. But do I trust the US to do the right thing.....do I f@"k!
But they may just do the right thing for a citizen of their country.
No person, group of people or country is above the rule of law.
The crime she has committed is a crime in all countries. She has had two trials as well, So send her back ASAP.
No she has had three trials. In the middle one she was found not guilty. Maybe she didn't want to play best of three.
She has been found guilty in a third trial, so by law she is guilty. I don't know the details of the case as I'm sure most people on here don't. She may be innocent but it is not for us to disagree with the legal process in a democratic country which is an ally. Should the US have issues for one of their citizens they should provide support for an appeal without seeking to undermine the legality of the verdict that has been reached."
What third trail, the first trial result was set-aside based on short coming of the Italian police at appeal. This does not mean she is innocent or guilty. It means the rule of law and evidence where not followed properly.
The second trail has been conducted with fresh tests on evidence. For the second time she has been found guilty.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Whether she or the US govt like it or not, she has been found guilty after due process in a court in a country with which the US has an extradition treaty. She should be arrested and returned to Italy to serve her sentence. Should she wish to appeal she should and if the court finds in her favour she will be released. But do I trust the US to do the right thing.....do I f@"k!
But they may just do the right thing for a citizen of their country.
No person, group of people or country is above the rule of law.
The crime she has committed is a crime in all countries. She has had two trials as well, So send her back ASAP.
No she has had three trials. In the middle one she was found not guilty. Maybe she didn't want to play best of three.
She has been found guilty in a third trial, so by law she is guilty. I don't know the details of the case as I'm sure most people on here don't. She may be innocent but it is not for us to disagree with the legal process in a democratic country which is an ally. Should the US have issues for one of their citizens they should provide support for an appeal without seeking to undermine the legality of the verdict that has been reached.
Maybe they are launching an appeal as we speak.
I am sure they will and one hopes for the victim's family that the truth emerges. But while the appeal process is ongoing the US should respect Italian law and hand over Ms Knox."
If she can be tried in absence I'm sure she can appeal in absence. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"The italian justice system have made a balls up of this i def wouldnt go back if it was me ."
It is a matter for the US govt, no Amanda Knox, whether we think it is a balls up or not, she has been found guilty and should be extradited. She has her right to appeal again which I am sure she will, and maybe that will be done with her in the US. The detailed case notes will be made public in 90 days and I guess things will be clearer then, but until that point, the US should respect the Italian courts decision. |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"
If she can be tried in absence I'm sure she can appeal in absence. "
Yes I'm sure she can, the appeal is likely to take another year.
If her appeal fails then she will remain a convicted murderer being harboured by the USA.
A British citizen is dead. Her convicted murderer should not be allowed to evade punishment and get rich just because she's American.
If this was any other country in the world with a current extradition treaty with Italy, it wouldn't even be a conversation. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"
If she can be tried in absence I'm sure she can appeal in absence.
Yes I'm sure she can, the appeal is likely to take another year.
If her appeal fails then she will remain a convicted murderer being harboured by the USA.
A British citizen is dead. Her convicted murderer should not be allowed to evade punishment and get rich just because she's American.
If this was any other country in the world with a current extradition treaty with Italy, it wouldn't even be a conversation. "
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When American A-10 fighters accidentally killed British troops in Iraq, the US Government refused to send the pilots to the UK to be cross examined, and yet they rant and rave for the UK to extradite an autistic vulnerable man accused of 'hacking' their systems (UK refused in the end, and the USA indulges in far worse via the NSA). So much for the 'special relationship' |
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"
But she and the American government may see her as someone who was acquitted of the crime.
They did, but now they both know that she is someone convicted of murder in a court of law that has heard all the evidence available to it.
Just because someone doesn't like the decision doesn't make it unjust.
Lee Rigby's killers don't like the conviction, so what, they've been found guilty after due process.
But maybe it isn't about not liking the decision. Maybe they don't like the way this has all been played out. Before any country extradites someone they have to be sure there will be a fair trial. This was the third time the trial was held , this time in her absence so a large part of evidence was missing, she has been guilty then not guilty then guilty. It's all a bit of a circus really.
I fail to see why you brought Lee Rigby into it. His murderers aren't being extradited anywhere.
i seem to remember the fella with aspegers, that hacked into the whitehouse computer system, was convicted in his absence and they screamed for him to be sent over for sentencing.
Was he extradited though ?"
Nope. Not as far as I know. Government did the right thing there |
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"Whether she or the US govt like it or not, she has been found guilty after due process in a court in a country with which the US has an extradition treaty. She should be arrested and returned to Italy to serve her sentence. Should she wish to appeal she should and if the court finds in her favour she will be released. But do I trust the US to do the right thing.....do I f@"k!
But they may just do the right thing for a citizen of their country.
She is a convicted murderer, what would you suggest is the right thing?"
Drone strike. Hey, it works for the US of A!  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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In fairness though the US have made no comment so far that I'm aware of that has specified whether or not they will extradite her.
With their willingness to have foreign nationals extradited to the US it's going to be interesting to see if they do or not. The US does like to try and extradite people who have never even set foot into the US, which implys that they consider their laws to be in effect across the globe...
She will have the right to appeal her extradition in the US courts, we'll have to wait and see what her defence is. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"In fairness though the US have made no comment so far that I'm aware of that has specified whether or not they will extradite her.
With their willingness to have foreign nationals extradited to the US it's going to be interesting to see if they do or not. The US does like to try and extradite people who have never even set foot into the US, which implys that they consider their laws to be in effect across the globe...
She will have the right to appeal her extradition in the US courts, we'll have to wait and see what her defence is. "
But Ms Knox took the opportunity to give a blubbing inter_iew on national TV this morning within minutes of the decision saying she won't go back etc etc and that she needed help to fight. I found it all in quite poor taste. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"In fairness though the US have made no comment so far that I'm aware of that has specified whether or not they will extradite her.
With their willingness to have foreign nationals extradited to the US it's going to be interesting to see if they do or not. The US does like to try and extradite people who have never even set foot into the US, which implys that they consider their laws to be in effect across the globe...
She will have the right to appeal her extradition in the US courts, we'll have to wait and see what her defence is.
But Ms Knox took the opportunity to give a blubbing inter_iew on national TV this morning within minutes of the decision saying she won't go back etc etc and that she needed help to fight. I found it all in quite poor taste."
Haven't seen that, but most people would try and squirm their way out of a life sentence. Iirc Gary McKinnon tried and failed to appeal before Teresa May stopped it, completely different circumstances though, but it shows that even if an appeal fails a senior government official can and will override an appeal courts decision. This could take years to resolve. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"In fairness though the US have made no comment so far that I'm aware of that has specified whether or not they will extradite her.
With their willingness to have foreign nationals extradited to the US it's going to be interesting to see if they do or not. The US does like to try and extradite people who have never even set foot into the US, which implys that they consider their laws to be in effect across the globe...
She will have the right to appeal her extradition in the US courts, we'll have to wait and see what her defence is. "
But it's much for fun to sling mud now. Why wait and see what the US will do when we can poke them now. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"In fairness though the US have made no comment so far that I'm aware of that has specified whether or not they will extradite her.
With their willingness to have foreign nationals extradited to the US it's going to be interesting to see if they do or not. The US does like to try and extradite people who have never even set foot into the US, which implys that they consider their laws to be in effect across the globe...
She will have the right to appeal her extradition in the US courts, we'll have to wait and see what her defence is.
But Ms Knox took the opportunity to give a blubbing inter_iew on national TV this morning within minutes of the decision saying she won't go back etc etc and that she needed help to fight. I found it all in quite poor taste."
Did you find it in poor taste because she's American or do you find all cries for help in bad taste ? |
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By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago
Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound |
I haven't read the thread through.
The US of A should follow through on the process for extradition and she should have her chance to make her case against that.
That said, when a judgement has been made we as a society generally accept that judgement and so we should wait for the reasons for the conviction.
What I find distasteful is that so little of this seems to be about Meredith Kercher and what her family are living with given the rollercoaster that this trial process has been.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"In fairness though the US have made no comment so far that I'm aware of that has specified whether or not they will extradite her.
With their willingness to have foreign nationals extradited to the US it's going to be interesting to see if they do or not. The US does like to try and extradite people who have never even set foot into the US, which implys that they consider their laws to be in effect across the globe...
She will have the right to appeal her extradition in the US courts, we'll have to wait and see what her defence is.
But Ms Knox took the opportunity to give a blubbing inter_iew on national TV this morning within minutes of the decision saying she won't go back etc etc and that she needed help to fight. I found it all in quite poor taste.
Did you find it in poor taste because she's American or do you find all cries for help in bad taste ? "
I found it in poor taste because she was on air within minutes of the judgement so was obviously at the station waiting to give an inter_iew which was all about her and seemed to have no concern for the family of the victim. She may well be innocent and may want to argue her case, but doing so via media rather than through the appropriate channels does not paint her in a very good light. As for the channel, to offer airtime to someone who is a convicted murderer who is evading incarseration was quite shocking. |
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"
But she and the American government may see her as someone who was acquitted of the crime.
They did, but now they both know that she is someone convicted of murder in a court of law that has heard all the evidence available to it.
Just because someone doesn't like the decision doesn't make it unjust.
Lee Rigby's killers don't like the conviction, so what, they've been found guilty after due process.
But maybe it isn't about not liking the decision. Maybe they don't like the way this has all been played out. Before any country extradites someone they have to be sure there will be a fair trial. This was the third time the trial was held , this time in her absence so a large part of evidence was missing, she has been guilty then not guilty then guilty. It's all a bit of a circus really.
I fail to see why you brought Lee Rigby into it. His murderers aren't being extradited anywhere.
I have brought up Lee Rigby's killers because just like Amanda Knox they don't like the decision, they 'don't like the way this has all been played out'. Like Knox they have been convicted as murderers after due process in a legitimate court of law. They have also appealed.
If they happened to be abroad, we would want them here to face justice. Fortunately they're already here. The Italians will have every right to expect the Americans to honour an extradition request if her final appeal fails. "
Im pretty sure that if you ask every person who was found guilty of anything that they wouldnt like the way it was handled, No resemblance to these 2 cases to each other. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Amanda Knox's lawyers will push for a second appeal in the higher appeal court which could take over a year, so can't see her going there just yet anyway. |
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By *rsK69Woman
over a year ago
Neath |
"The italian justice system have made a balls up of this i def wouldnt go back if it was me .
it wouldn't be your choice and it isn't hers. "
Chopping and changing one's decision over such a serious matter numerous times does tend to make one go  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Watched a program recently, most UK police forces employ body language experts who observe the likes of Huntley et all and I'd like to hear some of their appraisals of her inter_iew today.
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The original verdict stands because it was and is a viable conviction. The appeal was overturned because the defence team submitted evidence that was inadmissible & heavily flawed.
The appeal court came to the wrong verdict because of this and so the original verdict was reinstated.
This has all been part of one trial process under Italian Law so the double jeopardy claim does not stand & in any case is irrelevant as the original verdict is and was guilty of murder. |
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Also, think of the political aspect.
Knox is a fairly minor criminal in international terms, if the US refuses to extradite because of public pressure where will that leave the US/Italian treaty?
When a major suspect in a high profile organised crime/mafia case skips off to Italy to avoid US justice how will the Italians respond?
Will the US Justice Dept risk looking impotent and losing control of a high profile, high publicity case because of Knox? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"The original verdict stands because it was and is a viable conviction. The appeal was overturned because the defence team submitted evidence that was inadmissible & heavily flawed.
The appeal court came to the wrong verdict because of this and so the original verdict was reinstated.
This has all been part of one trial process under Italian Law so the double jeopardy claim does not stand & in any case is irrelevant as the original verdict is and was guilty of murder."
Read somewhere (probably this thread) that there are unlimited appeals in the Italian justice system, this could continue as long as the life sentence.
The Italians don't have a double jeopardy law so immaterial. You obey the laws of the country you're in, US laws do not apply in Italy. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Also, think of the political aspect.
Knox is a fairly minor criminal in international terms, if the US refuses to extradite because of public pressure where will that leave the US/Italian treaty?
When a major suspect in a high profile organised crime/mafia case skips off to Italy to avoid US justice how will the Italians respond?
Will the US Justice Dept risk looking impotent and losing control of a high profile, high publicity case because of Knox?"
Maybe go back to like the cold war and do the occasional swap, make it more interesting if they did it like top trumps. |
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"The original verdict stands because it was and is a viable conviction. The appeal was overturned because the defence team submitted evidence that was inadmissible & heavily flawed.
The appeal court came to the wrong verdict because of this and so the original verdict was reinstated.
This has all been part of one trial process under Italian Law so the double jeopardy claim does not stand & in any case is irrelevant as the original verdict is and was guilty of murder.
Read somewhere (probably this thread) that there are unlimited appeals in the Italian justice system, this could continue as long as the life sentence.
The Italians don't have a double jeopardy law so immaterial. You obey the laws of the country you're in, US laws do not apply in Italy."
That was my point, double jeopardy only applies to US law & even were this trial being held in the US it still would not apply because the original verdict was guilty.
The Italian Supreme Court will make the final ruling on this then the extradition process can be started. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"The original verdict stands because it was and is a viable conviction. The appeal was overturned because the defence team submitted evidence that was inadmissible & heavily flawed.
The appeal court came to the wrong verdict because of this and so the original verdict was reinstated.
This has all been part of one trial process under Italian Law so the double jeopardy claim does not stand & in any case is irrelevant as the original verdict is and was guilty of murder.
Read somewhere (probably this thread) that there are unlimited appeals in the Italian justice system, this could continue as long as the life sentence.
The Italians don't have a double jeopardy law so immaterial. You obey the laws of the country you're in, US laws do not apply in Italy.
That was my point, double jeopardy only applies to US law & even were this trial being held in the US it still would not apply because the original verdict was guilty.
The Italian Supreme Court will make the final ruling on this then the extradition process can be started."
Ah misunderstood that bit of your post, sorry 
It'll be a long time before she sees Italy again even if the process goes smoothly. If she doesn't get extradited would it limit her future travel plans to countries that don't have an extradition treaty with Italy? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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" As right now the USA is lead by a load silly Muppets.
If you class Obama as a Muppet how did you classify Bush? I thought anyone, even Kermit would have been a great improvement on Bush...
"
& that particular bunch of Muppets decided to invade Iraq & incredibly, another bunch of muppets followed them!!!
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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So as I understand it at the moment no extradition procedures have began and they are unlikely to for the time being so the land of the free have done absolutely nothing wrong at the moment. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Watched a program recently, most UK police forces employ body language experts who observe the likes of Huntley et all and I'd like to hear some of their appraisals of her inter_iew today.
"
But are they always correct?
That Huntley guy was shaking like a leaf, - even I could have worked that one out!  |
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By *abioMan
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
"She has been convicted of murder in a court of law, in Italy.
The U.S. has had an extradition treaty with Italy since 1983.
Make up your own minds!"
they actually can't extradite her under US law...
under US law you cant be extradited twice for the same crime.... double jeopardy rules apply.....
best hope italy actually has is if she goes voluntarily... or she ends up travelling to a country with an extradition agreement with italy.... |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"She has been convicted of murder in a court of law, in Italy.
The U.S. has had an extradition treaty with Italy since 1983.
Make up your own minds!
they actually can't extradite her under US law...
under US law you cant be extradited twice for the same crime.... double jeopardy rules apply.....
best hope italy actually has is if she goes voluntarily... or she ends up travelling to a country with an extradition agreement with italy...."
If I was either guilty or not guilty, I wouldn't be doing any of the above, would you? |
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By *abioMan
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
"She has been convicted of murder in a court of law, in Italy.
The U.S. has had an extradition treaty with Italy since 1983.
Make up your own minds!
they actually can't extradite her under US law...
under US law you cant be extradited twice for the same crime.... double jeopardy rules apply.....
best hope italy actually has is if she goes voluntarily... or she ends up travelling to a country with an extradition agreement with italy....
If I was either guilty or not guilty, I wouldn't be doing any of the above, would you?"
nope... they caught the boyfriend trying to bolt the country for the Dominican republic.. which again doesn't have an extradition agreement with italy...
but the US government hands are tied with this at the moment.... there is nothing they can do to force her to go....
the italians had one go at it and blew it big time.... |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Agreed.
Despite the fact that a guy has already pleaded guilty & is currently doing time for his crime, I do (& did) feel for the family & friends of the victim, but what if Knox & co are actually innocent?
Personally, I wouldn't give a flying f**k about 'justice' or 'due process', - I'd be in hiding if any bastards tried to extradite me back to a country where I had already served time for the crime that I didn't commit.
I'd well & truly be 'going bush'!! |
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"She has been convicted of murder in a court of law, in Italy.
The U.S. has had an extradition treaty with Italy since 1983.
Make up your own minds!
they actually can't extradite her under US law...
under US law you cant be extradited twice for the same crime.... double jeopardy rules apply.....
best hope italy actually has is if she goes voluntarily... or she ends up travelling to a country with an extradition agreement with italy...."
Fabio, The Double Jeopardy rules do not apply for several reasons :-
A)there has been no separate retrial. This is all part of one ongoing trial process.
B)She was found guilty at that trial.
C)Double Jeopardy only applies to US law, she was tried & convicted under Italian Law.
Under the terms of the treaty the US must agree to extradite a person who has been convicted of a crime that is punishable by more than 1 yr in prison.
As the Italian court handed down a 28.5yr sentence both conditions are met. |
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Here is a link to an over_iew of the evidence against Knox, with further links to more in depth discussion about the evidence. On reading you would be hard pressed to think she is anything but guilty.
http://themurderofmeredithkercher.com/The_Evidence
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"They were convicted, appealed that conviction which resulted in aquittal.
The case has been reheard, the original conviction has been reinstated.
This is not a 'tin pot' regime making decisions on the whim of some dictator. This is Italy, their due process and courts have arrived at this decision.
I do understand this. But if I was her I'd stay where I was. Are the Italians claiming the best of three rule ? "
i dont particulary care about the question of italy due process and hypocritical stance of USA however what does concern me is that a young woman has been murdered and only three other people know what happened that night.
Amanda Knox (refusing to face justice)
Raffeale Sollecito (cannot leave)
Diya 'Patrick' Lumumba (wrongly accused by knox of madeline kercher murder and won €30,000 in damages for slander against knox in 2011 however he refused this and is taking his case to the court of human rights)
Fiat justitia ruat caelum
let justice be done though the heavens fall.
R.I.P Meredith Kercher
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"But Amanda Knox has already faced justice - she served time didn't she?"
4 years I saw a tv inter_iew with her after she was found guilty this time. I found her to be very odd..there is something about her |
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By *ost SockMan
over a year ago
West Wales and Cardiff |
"But Amanda Knox has already faced justice - she served time didn't she?
4 years I saw a tv inter_iew with her after she was found guilty this time. I found her to be very odd..there is something about her "
I found her very strange too and some of her behaviour after the murder was weird and bound to cause raised eyebrows.
Doesn't make her a killer though. In fact, in some ways, the fact she is a bit off the wall generally might explain why she acted the way she did in those circumstances.
We've seen a really good example of this in this country with the Chris Jefferies case recently. Bloke looks a bit weird - must have murdered Joanna Yeates.
Knox certainly did a despicable thing in naming Lumumba, but even that does not make her a murderer. Many people have named innocent parties in interrogations - read about Stephen Miller from the Cardiff Three for one.
It's a deeply weird case - there's no DNA linking her to the scene and it wasn't cleaned, as Guede's DNA was everywhere and his convictions rests on that DNA evidence.
I've seen the sites like the one linked to here, but I dunno. I'm starting to sway towards innocence on this. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"She has been convicted of murder in a court of law, in Italy.
The U.S. has had an extradition treaty with Italy since 1983.
Make up your own minds!
they actually can't extradite her under US law...
under US law you cant be extradited twice for the same crime.... double jeopardy rules apply.....
best hope italy actually has is if she goes voluntarily... or she ends up travelling to a country with an extradition agreement with italy...."
Can't find any reports on her being extradited from the US yet. From what I have read she was arrested in Italy 4 days after the discovery of Merediths body, and was held on what we would call remand until the trial. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"But Amanda Knox has already faced justice - she served time didn't she?
4 years I saw a tv inter_iew with her after she was found guilty this time. I found her to be very odd..there is something about her "
Yes, I too have thought her odd - during the initial trial, at the appeal court & since then - but then again, if I was wrongly accused of murder, I'd be feeling odd, - if then found guilty, devastated, - if then served 4 years, a fucken fruitcake, - & if then found guilty again???????? .........if she is innocent, she'd have to be more than a little mentally unstable to say the least! |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"She has been convicted of murder in a court of law, in Italy.
The U.S. has had an extradition treaty with Italy since 1983.
Make up your own minds!
they actually can't extradite her under US law...
under US law you cant be extradited twice for the same crime.... double jeopardy rules apply.....
best hope italy actually has is if she goes voluntarily... or she ends up travelling to a country with an extradition agreement with italy....
Fabio, The Double Jeopardy rules do not apply for several reasons :-
A)there has been no separate retrial. This is all part of one ongoing trial process.
B)She was found guilty at that trial.
C)Double Jeopardy only applies to US law, she was tried & convicted under Italian Law.
Under the terms of the treaty the US must agree to extradite a person who has been convicted of a crime that is punishable by more than 1 yr in prison.
As the Italian court handed down a 28.5yr sentence both conditions are met."
She wasn't extradited first time round, I believe she was already in Italy.
Besides the only American law that comes into this is the extradition treaty. Lets not forget, the crime happened in Italy. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"So she has been found guilty of murder yet she is free...it is bizarre. I take it she won't have any conditions imposed on her such as house arrest etc. all of this is very strange. "
Even if everything goes smoothly she won't see the inside of an Italian prison for quite a while.
The Italians process requires the sentence to be confirmed before they apply to the US for extradition, she'll then be able to appeal the extradition in the US courts, don't know how many appeals she will get.
Although she may come across as a bit strange, the prospect of spending 28 years in prison is a fairly stressful one and most people would probably feel under a bit of duress if facing that. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"So as I understand it at the moment no extradition procedures have began and they are unlikely to for the time being so the land of the free have done absolutely nothing wrong at the moment. "
well I think they should booty ! I mean they should ass or I mean its up to bubblebutt !! ah shiite I can't concentrate! every time I try read you're posts I end up staring at those juicy cheeks Mrs polk
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"Also, think of the political aspect.
Knox is a fairly minor criminal in international terms, if the US refuses to extradite because of public pressure where will that leave the US/Italian treaty?
When a major suspect in a high profile organised crime/mafia case skips off to Italy to avoid US justice how will the Italians respond?
Will the US Justice Dept risk looking impotent and losing control of a high profile, high publicity case because of Knox?"
Good post. |
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By *B9 QueenWoman
over a year ago
Over the rainbow, under the bridge |
The original conviction has been reinstated. She has the chance to appeal again. Until the outcome of that, she can remain where she is. If the result of the appeal is that the conviction remains then she would be expected to return to Italy and continue her sentence. She will most likely refuse and that is when the issue of extradition will arise.
It will be interesting to see how it pans out. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"In fairness though the US have made no comment so far that I'm aware of that has specified whether or not they will extradite her.
With their willingness to have foreign nationals extradited to the US it's going to be interesting to see if they do or not. The US does like to try and extradite people who have never even set foot into the US, which implys that they consider their laws to be in effect across the globe...
She will have the right to appeal her extradition in the US courts, we'll have to wait and see what her defence is.
But Ms Knox took the opportunity to give a blubbing inter_iew on national TV this morning within minutes of the decision saying she won't go back etc etc and that she needed help to fight. I found it all in quite poor taste.
Did you find it in poor taste because she's American or do you find all cries for help in bad taste ?
I found it in poor taste because she was on air within minutes of the judgement so was obviously at the station waiting to give an inter_iew which was all about her and seemed to have no concern for the family of the victim. She may well be innocent and may want to argue her case, but doing so via media rather than through the appropriate channels does not paint her in a very good light. As for the channel, to offer airtime to someone who is a convicted murderer who is evading incarseration was quite shocking."
She was probably at the station because reporters were camped outside her house. She gave the inter_iew because the public wanted to hear her reaction. The channel gave her airtime because they knew people would be watching. Even you got sucked into watching it. If you found it that shocking you could have turned it off. |
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i could be totally wrong but i do think she and the other guy did kill her..Thats just from watching the documentaries and news and if they did i hope their life just gets shitier til they die . x x X |
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Tell you what, let's follow the US example and as it was a British Citizen who died, insist a trial takes place here.
Oh, and for obvious reasons, anyone who wants to "bash her backdoors in" is probably not going to get a seat on the jury. |
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"They were convicted, appealed that conviction which resulted in aquittal.
The case has been reheard, the original conviction has been reinstated.
This is not a 'tin pot' regime making decisions on the whim of some dictator. This is Italy, their due process and courts have arrived at this decision.
I do understand this. But if I was her I'd stay where I was. Are the Italians claiming the best of three rule ?
i dont particulary care about the question of italy due process and hypocritical stance of USA however what does concern me is that a young woman has been murdered and only three other people know what happened that night.
Amanda Knox (refusing to face justice)
Raffeale Sollecito (cannot leave)
Diya 'Patrick' Lumumba (wrongly accused by knox of madeline kercher murder and won €30,000 in damages for slander against knox in 2011 however he refused this and is taking his case to the court of human rights)
Fiat justitia ruat caelum
let justice be done though the heavens fall.
R.I.P Meredith Kercher
"
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Tell you what, let's follow the US example and as it was a British Citizen who died, insist a trial takes place here.
Oh, and for obvious reasons, anyone who wants to "bash her backdoors in" is probably not going to get a seat on the jury. "
She'd probably walk free due to the complete dogs dinner the police made of handling forensic evidence! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"She has been convicted of murder in a court of law, in Italy.
The U.S. has had an extradition treaty with Italy since 1983.
Make up your own minds!
She has also been aquited. Maybe it's the italian judicial services that should make their minds up. "
But that's the Italian system it will go back to appeal one more time.
So at the moment she has been found guilty and as such should be In a prison.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I'm not up to speed with this case so I may need some help.
Wasn't she convicted , sentenced and sent to prison. Then released and told she could go home. Then they changed their minds and said she shouldn't have been released and now they want her back ?
If I was her I would stay where she is. "
The Italians aren't very good at making their minds up. It's a well known trait. No honestly. Just look at their government which is weak and vacillates over whether their PM is a Corrupt womaniser or not. Let's be realistic and say their Judicial system is a result of a weak vacillating government that makes weak laws so the result is farcical system that just fudges everything. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"In fairness though the US have made no comment so far that I'm aware of that has specified whether or not they will extradite her.
With their willingness to have foreign nationals extradited to the US it's going to be interesting to see if they do or not. The US does like to try and extradite people who have never even set foot into the US, which implys that they consider their laws to be in effect across the globe...
She will have the right to appeal her extradition in the US courts, we'll have to wait and see what her defence is.
But Ms Knox took the opportunity to give a blubbing inter_iew on national TV this morning within minutes of the decision saying she won't go back etc etc and that she needed help to fight. I found it all in quite poor taste.
Did you find it in poor taste because she's American or do you find all cries for help in bad taste ?
I found it in poor taste because she was on air within minutes of the judgement so was obviously at the station waiting to give an inter_iew which was all about her and seemed to have no concern for the family of the victim. She may well be innocent and may want to argue her case, but doing so via media rather than through the appropriate channels does not paint her in a very good light. As for the channel, to offer airtime to someone who is a convicted murderer who is evading incarseration was quite shocking.
She was probably at the station because reporters were camped outside her house. She gave the inter_iew because the public wanted to hear her reaction. The channel gave her airtime because they knew people would be watching. Even you got sucked into watching it. If you found it that shocking you could have turned it off. "
I only saw the highlights on the news. What is clear is that she is using the media to portray herself as the victim, to garner sympathy and support from the US population thus making any judge who hears her extradition case the focus of huge public pressure. All very calculated, just like murdering someone and trying to get away with it one might argue! |
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By *nnyMan
over a year ago
Glasgow |
"I'm not up to speed with this case so I may need some help.
Wasn't she convicted , sentenced and sent to prison. Then released and told she could go home. Then they changed their minds and said she shouldn't have been released and now they want her back ?
If I was her I would stay where she is.
The Italians aren't very good at making their minds up. It's a well known trait. No honestly. Just look at their government which is weak and vacillates over whether their PM is a Corrupt womaniser or not. Let's be realistic and say their Judicial system is a result of a weak vacillating government that makes weak laws so the result is farcical system that just fudges everything."
It isn't about whether their PM is a womaniser or not, it's about whether they care. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Depends on how much publicity she get on morning tv, which by the looks of it is substantial at the moment. Trial by the media, don't you love democracy. |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"
The Italians aren't very good at making their minds up. It's a well known trait. No honestly. Just look at their government which is weak and vacillates over whether their PM is a Corrupt womaniser or not. Let's be realistic and say their Judicial system is a result of a weak vacillating government that makes weak laws so the result is farcical system that just fudges everything."
I disagree with you. Both in your assesment of their character and your suggestion that their judicial system and laws are worse, weaker or in some way inferior to ours. That's arrogant. |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"
I only saw the highlights on the news. What is clear is that she is using the media to portray herself as the victim, to garner sympathy and support from the US population thus making any judge who hears her extradition case the focus of huge public pressure. All very calculated, just like murdering someone and trying to get away with it one might argue!"
She specifically stated that she couldn't fight this on her own which seemed to me to be an appeal for funds, I agree that it did seem calculated, but I believe most people in her position with American public opinion appearing to be on her side, would do the same thing.
In 3 months when the full judgement is released it will be very interesting to see if public opinion alters when details like the fact she changed her story are rerun.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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It's a saga that will not end quickly. Not helped by what appears to have been a botched investigation. Fugitive extradited from USA to Italy as recently as October 2013 !
Spare a thought for the Kerchers though, she looked such a lovely girl, how do you cope with such a needless loss ? My sympathy to them for the enduring heartache this case must bring them ! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"
The Italians aren't very good at making their minds up. It's a well known trait. No honestly. Just look at their government which is weak and vacillates over whether their PM is a Corrupt womaniser or not. Let's be realistic and say their Judicial system is a result of a weak vacillating government that makes weak laws so the result is farcical system that just fudges everything."
Any decent Italian prosecuted probably got bumped off by the Mafia years ago... |
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