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Commons Vote
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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Today members of the house of commons voted on an amendment to a bill on terrorism. The amendment was to discount the rights, of those convicted of a crime to remain a UK citizen and in the country, under article 8 of the Convention of Human Rights. Article 8 is the right to have and maintain a family life.
The amendment was a Tory led back bench attempt to push through what under current law is an illegal piece of legislation. The amendment was defeated as David Cameron ordered his cabinet team to abstain.
I have two concerns with this. Firstly why did Cameron order the abstention other than to appease a group of Tory back benchers. Secondly why are politicians debating issues that contravene the laws of this country.
Is the democracy? |
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By *ee VianteWoman
over a year ago
Somewhere in North Norfolk |
Our government frequently rewrite laws, often retrospectively, to suit themselves.
I think amending things retrospectively is wrong. Debating to change something from how it currently is seems reasonable. If potential changes aren't discussed, how would we make progress?
I'm tired though so I could be missing the point. |
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By *ee VianteWoman
over a year ago
Somewhere in North Norfolk |
"The debate was on an amendment that broke a law of the land!"
They rewrite law all the time.
Work schemes found to be illegal? Change the law to avoid paying compensation.
Coalition government? Make the necessary changes to be able to stay in power rather than hold another election.
They think they are the law. |
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By *imjohnCouple
over a year ago
Clacton on sea, Essex |
If a terrorist not of British nationality plans or attempts harm of defenseless people they should be stripped of a British passport & sent packing.
They are clearly unhappy in this country so why put them through more misery than their warped brains are going through already in keeping them in UK, this is a bill that should have been put in place years ago.
If the terrorist is British sting them for treason & give them a life sentence without parole...better than the death sentence they would have received an 100 years ago. |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"If a terrorist not of British nationality plans or attempts harm of defenseless people they should be stripped of a British passport & sent packing.
They are clearly unhappy in this country so why put them through more misery than their warped brains are going through already in keeping them in UK, this is a bill that should have been put in place years ago.
If the terrorist is British sting them for treason & give them a life sentence without parole...better than the death sentence they would have received an 100 years ago. "
Sent packing to where exactly? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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the only true democracy would be to have a referendum on every single piece of legislation.
and seeings as that is never gonna happen, then you get the next best thing, which is decisions being made in dark rooms and hushed corners, possibly involving suitcases containing incentives, or the kinds of people you wouldnt trust with your kids.
hey ho, its what we have to live with.
it aint ideal, but thats western democracy for you |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"If a terrorist not of British nationality plans or attempts harm of defenseless people they should be stripped of a British passport & sent packing.
They are clearly unhappy in this country so why put them through more misery than their warped brains are going through already in keeping them in UK, this is a bill that should have been put in place years ago.
If the terrorist is British sting them for treason & give them a life sentence without parole...better than the death sentence they would have received an 100 years ago. Sent packing to where exactly?"
would that not be obvious?
their country of origin naturally. |
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By *imjohnCouple
over a year ago
Clacton on sea, Essex |
"If a terrorist not of British nationality plans or attempts harm of defenseless people they should be stripped of a British passport & sent packing.
They are clearly unhappy in this country so why put them through more misery than their warped brains are going through already in keeping them in UK, this is a bill that should have been put in place years ago.
If the terrorist is British sting them for treason & give them a life sentence without parole...better than the death sentence they would have received an 100 years ago. Sent packing to where exactly?"
If the terrorist is not British back to where they come from, sod their feelings when they destroy other peoples lives.
After given a safe haven in this country the terrorist then shits on us from a great height & then expects us to wrap them in cotton wool...why should we.
They play the family card for sympathy but don't think of their family while killing people...no brainer by MP's to want this really is it. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Or the asshole could be removed from office, they are a law onto themselves. They have wrecked the country and are nothing but a bunch if scrounges stealing tax payers money. They blame the people on the dole, how are they any better. If they all took a 50% pay cut and had no expenses budget like the rest of us the country probably would not be in debt. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Our head of state is a monarch, patronage not election, and the second chamber of parliament is populated by the unelected, we do not live in a democracy."
I thought the definition of a democracy was along the lines of voting for folk who make decisions for us. It is certainly not a perfect system but it is a democracy. Folk seem to invoke the word as if it is a panacea. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Or the asshole could be removed from office, they are a law onto themselves. They have wrecked the country and are nothing but a bunch if scrounges stealing tax payers money. They blame the people on the dole, how are they any better. If they all took a 50% pay cut and had no expenses budget like the rest of us the country probably would not be in debt. "
lol, of course it would., you would just have politicians doing more and more secondary directorships to earn more money and have even more input from big business than there already is.
not 1 section of society is to blame for the trouble we are in, however those that dont give anything back into the pot (or never have rather) should be having a long hard look at themselves. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I worked two jobs for nearly 23 years now I have fibromyalgia and am in pain 90% of my day even on strong medication. I have paid more than my fair share into the pot and to watch lazy MPs give getting four times what I earned give the decision about my health to a civil servant overwriting what a doctor has said about my condition makes me more than a bit mad. Politics should be voluntry and then you would get people that actually give a shit. As for second jobs they should be denied any other income if they are a politician now they get enough. And anyone caught taking bribes for anything shod be jailed for treason |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Or the asshole could be removed from office, they are a law onto themselves. They have wrecked the country and are nothing but a bunch if scrounges stealing tax payers money. They blame the people on the dole, how are they any better. If they all took a 50% pay cut and had no expenses budget like the rest of us the country probably would not be in debt.
lol, of course it would., you would just have politicians doing more and more secondary directorships to earn more money and have even more input from big business than there already is.
not 1 section of society is to blame for the trouble we are in, however those that dont give anything back into the pot (or never have rather) should be having a long hard look at themselves."
Half of the people working for the government are just out of uni so they have not paid into the system either. They get taxs breaks, expenses and big bonuses. How is this fair |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Politicians should be barred from office until they have had 10 years working in the private sector. I'm sick of all these useless career politicians.
Also I would deport terrorists in a flash, no rights just removed. If they were born here then I'd transport them to South Georgia to keep the penguins company!  |
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"Our head of state is a monarch, patronage not election, and the second chamber of parliament is populated by the unelected, we do not live in a democracy.
I thought the definition of a democracy was along the lines of voting for folk who make decisions for us. It is certainly not a perfect system but it is a democracy. Folk seem to invoke the word as if it is a panacea."
I would say the lack of an elected head of state amounts to a substantial democratic deficit in itself, however even if we stick to your definition, the House of Lords and it's members are part of both the legislature AND the executive and also contain the Law Lords, meaning that not only do we have unelected individuals making decisions for us but we have cross over between legislature and those who apply the law. A huge democratic deficit in my opinion. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I worked two jobs for nearly 23 years now I have fibromyalgia and am in pain 90% of my day even on strong medication. I have paid more than my fair share into the pot and to watch lazy MPs give getting four times what I earned give the decision about my health to a civil servant overwriting what a doctor has said about my condition makes me more than a bit mad. Politics should be voluntry and then you would get people that actually give a shit. As for second jobs they should be denied any other income if they are a politician now they get enough. And anyone caught taking bribes for anything shod be jailed for treason "
if you think you would get the right people for the job, let alone the wrong people, if being a politician was volountary then i would see your doctor as your medication is too strong.
my old dear worked 3 jobs for 20 years to keep things going. so what, thats what people do.
its the people that have never even held down 1 job throughout their lives which i said need to take a look at themselves.
like i said, if you aint contributing anything, then you dont deserve anything |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Or the asshole could be removed from office, they are a law onto themselves. They have wrecked the country and are nothing but a bunch if scrounges stealing tax payers money. They blame the people on the dole, how are they any better. If they all took a 50% pay cut and had no expenses budget like the rest of us the country probably would not be in debt.
lol, of course it would., you would just have politicians doing more and more secondary directorships to earn more money and have even more input from big business than there already is.
not 1 section of society is to blame for the trouble we are in, however those that dont give anything back into the pot (or never have rather) should be having a long hard look at themselves.
Half of the people working for the government are just out of uni so they have not paid into the system either. They get taxs breaks, expenses and big bonuses. How is this fair"
evidence? |
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By *imjohnCouple
over a year ago
Clacton on sea, Essex |
"these ppl have no rights human rights act is a joke not fit for purpose !!"
Terrorists flaunt our human rights act which don't allow killing people then whine about the same act being taken away, we don't agree with all this government's polices but with all the parties running around like headless chickens at the moment how could say who is the best for the country.
Terrorists don't follow the human rights act so why should we honour them with it when it suit's their needs.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Our head of state is a monarch, patronage not election, and the second chamber of parliament is populated by the unelected, we do not live in a democracy.
I thought the definition of a democracy was along the lines of voting for folk who make decisions for us. It is certainly not a perfect system but it is a democracy. Folk seem to invoke the word as if it is a panacea.
I would say the lack of an elected head of state amounts to a substantial democratic deficit in itself, however even if we stick to your definition, the House of Lords and it's members are part of both the legislature AND the executive and also contain the Law Lords, meaning that not only do we have unelected individuals making decisions for us but we have cross over between legislature and those who apply the law. A huge democratic deficit in my opinion."
Hmmm. Depends on which definition is used. The Cambridge dictionary gives two. Your point applies to the first but not the second. I do think people call upon the word as if it is a magical solution to all issues.
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"Our head of state is a monarch, patronage not election, and the second chamber of parliament is populated by the unelected, we do not live in a democracy.
I thought the definition of a democracy was along the lines of voting for folk who make decisions for us. It is certainly not a perfect system but it is a democracy. Folk seem to invoke the word as if it is a panacea.
I would say the lack of an elected head of state amounts to a substantial democratic deficit in itself, however even if we stick to your definition, the House of Lords and it's members are part of both the legislature AND the executive and also contain the Law Lords, meaning that not only do we have unelected individuals making decisions for us but we have cross over between legislature and those who apply the law. A huge democratic deficit in my opinion.
Hmmm. Depends on which definition is used. The Cambridge dictionary gives two. Your point applies to the first but not the second. I do think people call upon the word as if it is a magical solution to all issues.
"
I agree and even a fully democratic system is unlikely to be free of foibles, money will always talk and humans will always make mistakes at best or be corrupted by greed and power at worst! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Our head of state is a monarch, patronage not election, and the second chamber of parliament is populated by the unelected, we do not live in a democracy.
I thought the definition of a democracy was along the lines of voting for folk who make decisions for us. It is certainly not a perfect system but it is a democracy. Folk seem to invoke the word as if it is a panacea.
I would say the lack of an elected head of state amounts to a substantial democratic deficit in itself, however even if we stick to your definition, the House of Lords and it's members are part of both the legislature AND the executive and also contain the Law Lords, meaning that not only do we have unelected individuals making decisions for us but we have cross over between legislature and those who apply the law. A huge democratic deficit in my opinion.
Hmmm. Depends on which definition is used. The Cambridge dictionary gives two. Your point applies to the first but not the second. I do think people call upon the word as if it is a magical solution to all issues.
I agree and even a fully democratic system is unlikely to be free of foibles, money will always talk and humans will always make mistakes at best or be corrupted by greed and power at worst!"
What we have is better than fascism but by no means perfect. We do at least get the chance to vote. Perhaps folk complaining loudly should propose a workable solution? It is all too easy to complain. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"If a terrorist not of British nationality plans or attempts harm of defenseless people they should be stripped of a British passport & sent packing.
They are clearly unhappy in this country so why put them through more misery than their warped brains are going through already in keeping them in UK, this is a bill that should have been put in place years ago.
If the terrorist is British sting them for treason & give them a life sentence without parole...better than the death sentence they would have received an 100 years ago. "
Nobody should ever be 'sent packing' without due process. We've respected that since the Magna Carta, let's keep some of our values. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"If a terrorist not of British nationality plans or attempts harm of defenseless people they should be stripped of a British passport & sent packing.
They are clearly unhappy in this country so why put them through more misery than their warped brains are going through already in keeping them in UK, this is a bill that should have been put in place years ago.
If the terrorist is British sting them for treason & give them a life sentence without parole...better than the death sentence they would have received an 100 years ago.
Nobody should ever be 'sent packing' without due process. We've respected that since the Magna Carta, let's keep some of our values. "
Although the Magna Carta did not apply to serfs, only to freemen ... And only 3 clauses remain operative in our constitution. |
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By *imjohnCouple
over a year ago
Clacton on sea, Essex |
"If a terrorist not of British nationality plans or attempts harm of defenseless people they should be stripped of a British passport & sent packing.
They are clearly unhappy in this country so why put them through more misery than their warped brains are going through already in keeping them in UK, this is a bill that should have been put in place years ago.
If the terrorist is British sting them for treason & give them a life sentence without parole...better than the death sentence they would have received an 100 years ago.
Nobody should ever be 'sent packing' without due process. We've respected that since the Magna Carta, let's keep some of our values. "
Once proven they have terrorist links then deport them, they go to war on our system then expect to stay...why? to do more atrocities...
How many countries are as easy as us in the first place, we are not talking honest immigrants who have come to England for a better life but scum you wouldn't even wipe your arse with. |
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"Our head of state is a monarch, patronage not election, and the second chamber of parliament is populated by the unelected, we do not live in a democracy.
I thought the definition of a democracy was along the lines of voting for folk who make decisions for us. It is certainly not a perfect system but it is a democracy. Folk seem to invoke the word as if it is a panacea.
I would say the lack of an elected head of state amounts to a substantial democratic deficit in itself, however even if we stick to your definition, the House of Lords and it's members are part of both the legislature AND the executive and also contain the Law Lords, meaning that not only do we have unelected individuals making decisions for us but we have cross over between legislature and those who apply the law. A huge democratic deficit in my opinion.
Hmmm. Depends on which definition is used. The Cambridge dictionary gives two. Your point applies to the first but not the second. I do think people call upon the word as if it is a magical solution to all issues.
I agree and even a fully democratic system is unlikely to be free of foibles, money will always talk and humans will always make mistakes at best or be corrupted by greed and power at worst!
What we have is better than fascism but by no means perfect. We do at least get the chance to vote. Perhaps folk complaining loudly should propose a workable solution? It is all too easy to complain."
Declare a republic, bin the monarchy, disband the House of Lords and have a second chamber elected by proportional representation, remove the Law Lords from the business of government/legislation.
Oh,Give the queen a council house and get her to try and live on a state pension! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I worked two jobs for nearly 23 years now I have fibromyalgia and am in pain 90% of my day even on strong medication. I have paid more than my fair share into the pot and to watch lazy MPs give getting four times what I earned give the decision about my health to a civil servant overwriting what a doctor has said about my condition makes me more than a bit mad. Politics should be voluntry and then you would get people that actually give a shit. As for second jobs they should be denied any other income if they are a politician now they get enough. And anyone caught taking bribes for anything shod be jailed for treason
if you think you would get the right people for the job, let alone the wrong people, if being a politician was volountary then i would see your doctor as your medication is too strong.
my old dear worked 3 jobs for 20 years to keep things going. so what, thats what people do.
its the people that have never even held down 1 job throughout their lives which i said need to take a look at themselves.
like i said, if you aint contributing anything, then you dont deserve anything"
I agree and have always agreed with this. Being on the other side of it now were both my husband and I have worked from we left school,and he was made redundant last April and I had to come out of my job as my health took a downward turn and I collapsed in work. I have been applying weekly for jobs and being turned down because of my health issues, and my husband who applys for jobs daily and doesn't even get replys.
We struggle to make ends meet. And all because of this government. I paid into the system for years and I can't get any thing now. |
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"the amendment was a Tory led back bench attempt to push through what under current law is an illegal piece of legislation. The amendment was defeated as David Cameron ordered his cabinet team to abstain.
I have two concerns with this. Firstly why did Cameron order the abstention other than to appease a group of Tory back benchers. Secondly why are politicians debating issues that contravene the laws of this country.
Is the democracy?"
Cameron is shit scared of anything that makes him look weak within his party which still has a major issue with Europe etc..
chuck in the heffalump in the room eg. ukip and game players within the far right of the tories and its a bit of an interesting situation..
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Our head of state is a monarch, patronage not election, and the second chamber of parliament is populated by the unelected, we do not live in a democracy.
I thought the definition of a democracy was along the lines of voting for folk who make decisions for us. It is certainly not a perfect system but it is a democracy. Folk seem to invoke the word as if it is a panacea.
I would say the lack of an elected head of state amounts to a substantial democratic deficit in itself, however even if we stick to your definition, the House of Lords and it's members are part of both the legislature AND the executive and also contain the Law Lords, meaning that not only do we have unelected individuals making decisions for us but we have cross over between legislature and those who apply the law. A huge democratic deficit in my opinion.
Hmmm. Depends on which definition is used. The Cambridge dictionary gives two. Your point applies to the first but not the second. I do think people call upon the word as if it is a magical solution to all issues.
I agree and even a fully democratic system is unlikely to be free of foibles, money will always talk and humans will always make mistakes at best or be corrupted by greed and power at worst!
What we have is better than fascism but by no means perfect. We do at least get the chance to vote. Perhaps folk complaining loudly should propose a workable solution? It is all too easy to complain.
Declare a republic, bin the monarchy, disband the House of Lords and have a second chamber elected by proportional representation, remove the Law Lords from the business of government/legislation.
Oh,Give the queen a council house and get her to try and live on a state pension!"
The monarchy is not at fault. They bring more money into this country via tourism than anything else. The queen is self suffecient. Yes she gets money out of the coffers but the work for it, what they get is a wage for work rendered. It is not her that sets the rates of pensions or the wages that is the idiots at 10&11 Downing Street. The ones you's elected and don't give a damn what you think. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Our head of state is a monarch, patronage not election, and the second chamber of parliament is populated by the unelected, we do not live in a democracy."
What rubbish. Our monarch is an advisor with no power and is probably one of the few heads of state that pays for herself many times over
The lords has its faults and it can derail policy. But it does and has in the past act as an effective buffer from the primary House. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"If a terrorist not of British nationality plans or attempts harm of defenseless people they should be stripped of a British passport & sent packing.
They are clearly unhappy in this country so why put them through more misery than their warped brains are going through already in keeping them in UK, this is a bill that should have been put in place years ago.
If the terrorist is British sting them for treason & give them a life sentence without parole...better than the death sentence they would have received an 100 years ago.
Nobody should ever be 'sent packing' without due process. We've respected that since the Magna Carta, let's keep some of our values.
Once proven they have terrorist links then deport them, they go to war on our system then expect to stay...why? to do more atrocities...
How many countries are as easy as us in the first place, we are not talking honest immigrants who have come to England for a better life but scum you wouldn't even wipe your arse with. "
Any other country would use the punishment of the country to deal with terrorists and many of them would be put to death, others deported or life inprisonment. And there prisons would not be like ours. I have worked in hotels with less luxuries than they have in jail here. If they don't want to live by the laws of the land deport them. When in Rome do as the Romans do |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Our head of state is a monarch, patronage not election, and the second chamber of parliament is populated by the unelected, we do not live in a democracy.
I thought the definition of a democracy was along the lines of voting for folk who make decisions for us. It is certainly not a perfect system but it is a democracy. Folk seem to invoke the word as if it is a panacea.
I would say the lack of an elected head of state amounts to a substantial democratic deficit in itself, however even if we stick to your definition, the House of Lords and it's members are part of both the legislature AND the executive and also contain the Law Lords, meaning that not only do we have unelected individuals making decisions for us but we have cross over between legislature and those who apply the law. A huge democratic deficit in my opinion.
Hmmm. Depends on which definition is used. The Cambridge dictionary gives two. Your point applies to the first but not the second. I do think people call upon the word as if it is a magical solution to all issues.
I agree and even a fully democratic system is unlikely to be free of foibles, money will always talk and humans will always make mistakes at best or be corrupted by greed and power at worst!
What we have is better than fascism but by no means perfect. We do at least get the chance to vote. Perhaps folk complaining loudly should propose a workable solution? It is all too easy to complain.
Declare a republic, bin the monarchy, disband the House of Lords and have a second chamber elected by proportional representation, remove the Law Lords from the business of government/legislation.
Oh,Give the queen a council house and get her to try and live on a state pension!"
A post drenched with the jealousy culture that seems to pervade so many threads these days.
Putting an 85 year old woman into an environment she's never know will not right ills in your life. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Interesting.
This from a Government ( as did the Nu-Labour Government ) that arms and encourages "rebels" to effect regime change" of those they don't like.
One man's terrorist/rebel/freedom fighter and all that.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Got 3 thoughts from reading this thread completely unrelated but all from the same thread.
1 Half arsed rushed through populist proposal to chuck out legislation written by Winston Churchill and refined over decades without proper thought or review... Should never have got to a vote stage anyway.
2 Democracy by the people? most people have given no more thought to their opinions than the current government do. That's why they twist in the wind doing U Turns constantly let alone researched the implications sufficiently to vote on it.
3 The monarch has only one power, but it is the most democratic and clever power ever devised. Should any PM get so far out of line that the power is implemented... she can force a general election, that's right if we ever get a Hitler in number 10 then she has the power to let us democratically choose. very neat... wonder who wrote that one? |
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We should do what Iceland did and got rid of the poiticians.
Then the people made the decisions laws of the country.
Even sacked the bankers.
Sadly we have the very popular daily mail and sun readers which doesn't give us much hope |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"
Nobody should ever be 'sent packing' without due process. We've respected that since the Magna Carta, let's keep some of our values.
Once proven they have terrorist links then deport them, they go to war on our system then expect to stay...why? to do more atrocities...
How many countries are as easy as us in the first place, we are not talking honest immigrants who have come to England for a better life but scum you wouldn't even wipe your arse with.
Any other country would use the punishment of the country to deal with terrorists and many of them would be put to death, others deported or life inprisonment. And there prisons would not be like ours. I have worked in hotels with less luxuries than they have in jail here. If they don't want to live by the laws of the land deport them. When in Rome do as the Romans do"
' Any other country would use the punishment of the country to deal with terrorists'
That's exactly what we do isn't it?
Do you think we dont? |
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"Our head of state is a monarch, patronage not election, and the second chamber of parliament is populated by the unelected, we do not live in a democracy.
I thought the definition of a democracy was along the lines of voting for folk who make decisions for us. It is certainly not a perfect system but it is a democracy. Folk seem to invoke the word as if it is a panacea.
I would say the lack of an elected head of state amounts to a substantial democratic deficit in itself, however even if we stick to your definition, the House of Lords and it's members are part of both the legislature AND the executive and also contain the Law Lords, meaning that not only do we have unelected individuals making decisions for us but we have cross over between legislature and those who apply the law. A huge democratic deficit in my opinion.
Hmmm. Depends on which definition is used. The Cambridge dictionary gives two. Your point applies to the first but not the second. I do think people call upon the word as if it is a magical solution to all issues.
I agree and even a fully democratic system is unlikely to be free of foibles, money will always talk and humans will always make mistakes at best or be corrupted by greed and power at worst!
What we have is better than fascism but by no means perfect. We do at least get the chance to vote. Perhaps folk complaining loudly should propose a workable solution? It is all too easy to complain.
Declare a republic, bin the monarchy, disband the House of Lords and have a second chamber elected by proportional representation, remove the Law Lords from the business of government/legislation.
Oh,Give the queen a council house and get her to try and live on a state pension!
A post drenched with the jealousy culture that seems to pervade so many threads these days.
Putting an 85 year old woman into an environment she's never know will not right ills in your life. "
Was clearly humorous, lighten up! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"
Nobody should ever be 'sent packing' without due process. We've respected that since the Magna Carta, let's keep some of our values.
Although the Magna Carta did not apply to serfs, only to freemen ... And only 3 clauses remain operative in our constitution."
I'm not sure what point you are making. Chapter 39 of the Magne Carta laid out the concept of 'due process'. It is one of our core values never mind it being law.
It's a value we choose to keep or discard, there is no halfway house.
I suggest those who would even remotely consider discarding it need to think about what other 'groups' within our society would lose their core rights in the future on the whim of a popularist vote. |
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"
Nobody should ever be 'sent packing' without due process. We've respected that since the Magna Carta, let's keep some of our values.
Although the Magna Carta did not apply to serfs, only to freemen ... And only 3 clauses remain operative in our constitution.
I'm not sure what point you are making. Chapter 39 of the Magne Carta laid out the concept of 'due process'. It is one of our core values never mind it being law.
It's a value we choose to keep or discard, there is no halfway house.
I suggest those who would even remotely consider discarding it need to think about what other 'groups' within our society would lose their core rights in the future on the whim of a popularist vote. "
 |
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"
Nobody should ever be 'sent packing' without due process. We've respected that since the Magna Carta, let's keep some of our values.
Although the Magna Carta did not apply to serfs, only to freemen ... And only 3 clauses remain operative in our constitution.
I'm not sure what point you are making. Chapter 39 of the Magne Carta laid out the concept of 'due process'. It is one of our core values never mind it being law.
It's a value we choose to keep or discard, there is no halfway house.
I suggest those who would even remotely consider discarding it need to think about what other 'groups' within our society would lose their core rights in the future on the whim of a popularist vote. "
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By *imjohnCouple
over a year ago
Clacton on sea, Essex |
"
Nobody should ever be 'sent packing' without due process. We've respected that since the Magna Carta, let's keep some of our values.
Once proven they have terrorist links then deport them, they go to war on our system then expect to stay...why? to do more atrocities...
How many countries are as easy as us in the first place, we are not talking honest immigrants who have come to England for a better life but scum you wouldn't even wipe your arse with.
Any other country would use the punishment of the country to deal with terrorists and many of them would be put to death, others deported or life inprisonment. And there prisons would not be like ours. I have worked in hotels with less luxuries than they have in jail here. If they don't want to live by the laws of the land deport them. When in Rome do as the Romans do
' Any other country would use the punishment of the country to deal with terrorists'
That's exactly what we do isn't it?
Do you think we dont?"
These guys abuse their rights in the UK & as they are not British & don't even like Britain, if they go back to their country who mistreats them then that's not our problem.
When terrorists plot to kill/kills you take away their mockery of a UK passport & send them home, it must better where they originated from otherwise they wouldn't be doing terrorist activities against UK people who have helped them would they.
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By *imjohnCouple
over a year ago
Clacton on sea, Essex |
"
Nobody should ever be 'sent packing' without due process. We've respected that since the Magna Carta, let's keep some of our values.
Although the Magna Carta did not apply to serfs, only to freemen ... And only 3 clauses remain operative in our constitution.
I'm not sure what point you are making. Chapter 39 of the Magne Carta laid out the concept of 'due process'. It is one of our core values never mind it being law.
It's a value we choose to keep or discard, there is no halfway house.
I suggest those who would even remotely consider discarding it need to think about what other 'groups' within our society would lose their core rights in the future on the whim of a popularist vote. "
Deciding to rid the UK of known terrorists core rights is a just one & this is one "group" who need to be squashed & deported. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"*sigh*
Does _anyone_ understand the concept of *human* rights ?"
Yes of course! It worked perfectly well in this country before the ECHR when we put the welfare of the whole population first. It is violating MY human rights & everybody else's that criminals are able to commit crimes against us because it is a charter for criminals & bent Lawyers playing the system.  |
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By *at2Couple
over a year ago
north Down |
"It never really is a democracy I think most laws issues are those that have agendas and money to be made.
Corporations and bankers really run the country.
Pms are just puppets "
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By *at2Couple
over a year ago
north Down |
"It never really is a democracy I think most laws issues are those that have agendas and money to be made.
Corporations and bankers really run the country.
Pms are just puppets "
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"
Deciding to rid the UK of known terrorists core rights is a just one & this is one "group" who need to be squashed & deported. "
Maybe we should break this down. Firstly, how should we decide that they are 'known terrorists'?
Should we collect the evidence, arrest them and put them before the courts? |
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