FabSwingers.com > Forums > The Lounge > food vouchers

food vouchers

By *wingerdelight OP Couple over a year ago

eastliegh

is this a good idea instead of money for benifits? It might help with the "scrounger" problem we seem to have in the uk atm

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By *hyllyphyllyMan over a year ago

Bradford

What about other bills?

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By *isscheekychopsWoman over a year ago

The land of grey peas and bacon

nope....it will not teach budget management....i also think some need some diginty....i mean who the hell would want to pull out food vouchers and have others see they are on benefits...

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By *wingerdelight OP Couple over a year ago

eastliegh

or a credit card that can only be used for certain things?

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By *extoysareusCouple over a year ago

kinky heaven

Scrounger problem???

I see more thieving corporations a problem and massive payrises for politicians and the queen more than anything.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

No it's not a good idea!

How embarrassed would you feel when you get to the check out and have to pull out a good voucher from your purse/wallet?

And how would they pay for other day to day costs?

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By *extoysareusCouple over a year ago

kinky heaven

Another daily mail reader and BBC news watcher I guess

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

*shakes head and leaves post*

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By *wingerdelight OP Couple over a year ago

eastliegh

"Scrounger problem???

I see more thieving corporations a problem and massive payrises for politicians and the queen more than anything.

this is also true but another issue, most would admit that the benifit system needs a shake up, it was just something that i read that this is one of the things beeing talked about

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

oh dear, really?

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By *nnyMan over a year ago

Glasgow

"Scrounger problem???

I see more thieving corporations a problem and massive payrises for politicians and the queen more than anything.

this is also true but another issue, most would admit that the benifit system needs a shake up, it was just something that i read that this is one of the things beeing talked about"

The Tories have been working on and promising a benefit system shake up since they came to office yet only this weekend they've had to concede that universal credit and PIP will not proceed as planned.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"is this a good idea instead of money for benifits? It might help with the "scrounger" problem we seem to have in the uk atm"

Not such a great idea when you take into account all the variables, I mean imagine the printing costs of all those coupons/vouchers, and the distribution costs, after all these people are claiming billions upon billions in benefits, this has to be true because I read it in the press.

Best just give them nothing and give the money to big business in the way of tax breaks, or perhaps an increase in MP's pay, the sorely need it

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

apart from even stigmatising people more than they already are, its a form of punishment to a perceived problem, not every person in receipt of a state benefit a so called scrounger and anyway who are we to pass judgement on others, we would be forcing people to use certain shops and buy certain goods,

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By *nnyMan over a year ago

Glasgow

"apart from even stigmatising people more than they already are, its a form of punishment to a perceived problem, not every person in receipt of a state benefit a so called scrounger and anyway who are we to pass judgement on others, we would be forcing people to use certain shops and buy certain goods, "

Probably the shops which use slave labour staff provided foc by the JobCentres.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

This thread seems very similar to the one that got boring last week.

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By *reelove1969Couple over a year ago

bristol

think its a ludicrous idea

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By *ugby 123Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

O o O oo

So a hard working man/woman loses their job and has to suffer the indignity of having vouchers to pay for things...

I remember part of my childhood and the shame of having free school dinner tickets. I sure wouldn't want that as an adult

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By *nnyMan over a year ago

Glasgow

Foodbanks are just a forerunner for this.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"So a hard working man/woman loses their job and has to suffer the indignity of having vouchers to pay for things...

I remember part of my childhood and the shame of having free school dinner tickets. I sure wouldn't want that as an adult

Correct there is no reason for a social stigma for people who are down on their luck especially children.

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By *wingerdelight OP Couple over a year ago

eastliegh

"So a hard working man/woman loses their job and has to suffer the indignity of having vouchers to pay for things...

I remember part of my childhood and the shame of having free school dinner tickets. I sure wouldn't want that as an adult

Correct there is no reason for a social stigma for people who are down on their luck especially children. "

maybe that stigma would prevent the "life style unemployed"

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By *ichaelangelaCouple over a year ago

notts

"So a hard working man/woman loses their job and has to suffer the indignity of having vouchers to pay for things...

I remember part of my childhood and the shame of having free school dinner tickets. I sure wouldn't want that as an adult

and milk vouchers too, remember how we used to take the piss out of kids at school who had "free" school meals... so sad on reflection

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Its appalling and just another method of treating folk who maybe struggling with disdain and disrespect.

We are going back in time where the have nots are shit on all the time.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Scrounger problem???

I see more thieving corporations a problem and massive payrises for politicians and the queen more than anything.

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By *nnyMan over a year ago

Glasgow

"So a hard working man/woman loses their job and has to suffer the indignity of having vouchers to pay for things...

I remember part of my childhood and the shame of having free school dinner tickets. I sure wouldn't want that as an adult

Correct there is no reason for a social stigma for people who are down on their luck especially children.

maybe that stigma would prevent the "life style unemployed""

I doubt it. Life style unemployed probably don't care what people think about them.

Most folk in normal everyday employment are seldom more than a few weeks away from their P60 and their UB40 (does that still exist?)

A fortnight ago, nobody in Grangemouth thought their jobs were at risk.

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By *nnyMan over a year ago

Glasgow

"So a hard working man/woman loses their job and has to suffer the indignity of having vouchers to pay for things...

I remember part of my childhood and the shame of having free school dinner tickets. I sure wouldn't want that as an adult

and milk vouchers too, remember how we used to take the piss out of kids at school who had "free" school meals... so sad on reflection"

There was a time when ALL primary school kids got free milk mid-morning.

Guess who stopped that?

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By *yrdwomanWoman over a year ago

Putting the 'cum' in Eboracum

As soon as we issued vouchers people would be policing their trolleys and posting on here about how they saw someone buying chocolate with food vouchers.

They have food vouchers in the states and some of the forums I go on post about 'how very dare they eat nice food'. Make good food cheaper and stop blaming the poor for the shit welfare system we have.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"As soon as we issued vouchers people would be policing their trolleys and posting on here about how they saw someone buying chocolate with food vouchers.

It isnt necessarily the poor that are on benefits.

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By *nnyMan over a year ago

Glasgow

"As soon as we issued vouchers people would be policing their trolleys and posting on here about how they saw someone buying chocolate with food vouchers.

It isnt necessarily the poor that are on benefits."

Aye, ye canny move in the buroo fur they ****s in Ermine robes.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

It isnt necessarily the poor that are on benefits."

Nope. A huuuuuge proportion of the welfare spend is on the old age pension.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"As soon as we issued vouchers people would be policing their trolleys and posting on here about how they saw someone buying chocolate with food vouchers.

It isnt necessarily the poor that are on benefits.

Aye, ye canny move in the buroo fur they ****s in Ermine robes."

If i lost my job tomorrow and started claiming job seekers don't mean im poor.

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By *yrdwomanWoman over a year ago

Putting the 'cum' in Eboracum

It isnt necessarily the poor that are on benefits.

Nope. A huuuuuge proportion of the welfare spend is on the old age pension. "

And pensioners drawing only the state pension are among the worst off.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Where have you heard this? Not seen or heard anything on the news or in the papers

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By *et a roomCouple over a year ago

Leeds

One of the intended outcomes of Universal Credit - if it ever rolls out! - is that benefits claimants will learn to budget one salary style payment. Breaking the benefit dependency cycle. Your idea would stigmatise benefit claimants and reinforce the benefit trap. Not a great idea. And who says they're scroungers? A bunch of multi millionaire cabinet members and the right wing press? If rather they sort out tax fraud first!

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By *nnyMan over a year ago

Glasgow

Where have you heard this? Not seen or heard anything on the news or in the papers

I posted about PIP over the weekend. Check the BBC news at 6 re universal credit. Planned rollout scaled back.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Where have you heard this? Not seen or heard anything on the news or in the papers

I posted about PIP over the weekend. Check the BBC news at 6 re universal credit. Planned rollout scaled back."

will do cheers

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By *nnyMan over a year ago

Glasgow

It wasn't announced properly until news on imminent bad weather.

A good day to hide bad news.

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By *wingerdelight OP Couple over a year ago

eastliegh

"As soon as we issued vouchers people would be policing their trolleys and posting on here about how they saw someone buying chocolate with food vouchers.

It isnt necessarily the poor that are on benefits.

Aye, ye canny move in the buroo fur they ****s in Ermine robes.

If i lost my job tomorrow and started claiming job seekers don't mean im poor."

is it not meens tested, if not it should be

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

what next? Those of us who get child tax credits to receive clothing vouchers?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"As soon as we issued vouchers people would be policing their trolleys and posting on here about how they saw someone buying chocolate with food vouchers.

It isnt necessarily the poor that are on benefits.

Aye, ye canny move in the buroo fur they ****s in Ermine robes.

If i lost my job tomorrow and started claiming job seekers don't mean im poor.

is it not meens tested, if not it should be

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By *nnyMan over a year ago

Glasgow

"what next? Those of us who get child tax credits to receive clothing vouchers?"

Maybe even need a voucher before you're allowed to get pregnant.

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By *wingerdelight OP Couple over a year ago

eastliegh

"what next? Those of us who get child tax credits to receive clothing vouchers?"

personaly i dont see a problem with it, a benifit should be spent as intended, i would have no problem recieving a vouvher, and lets face it if everyone got them then the stigma would go.

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By *nnyMan over a year ago

Glasgow

"As soon as we issued vouchers people would be policing their trolleys and posting on here about how they saw someone buying chocolate with food vouchers.

It isnt necessarily the poor that are on benefits.

Aye, ye canny move in the buroo fur they ****s in Ermine robes.

If i lost my job tomorrow and started claiming job seekers don't mean im poor.

is it not meens tested, if not it should be

Maybe he'd had the foresight to take out mortgage protection insurance.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"As soon as we issued vouchers people would be policing their trolleys and posting on here about how they saw someone buying chocolate with food vouchers.

It isnt necessarily the poor that are on benefits.

Aye, ye canny move in the buroo fur they ****s in Ermine robes.

If i lost my job tomorrow and started claiming job seekers don't mean im poor.

is it not meens tested, if not it should be

Maybe he'd had the foresight to take out mortgage protection insurance."

Possibly mate my point is that just because your claiming doesn't mean your poor!!

And likewise not necessarily a scrounged!!

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By *wingerdelight OP Couple over a year ago

eastliegh

"As soon as we issued vouchers people would be policing their trolleys and posting on here about how they saw someone buying chocolate with food vouchers.

It isnt necessarily the poor that are on benefits.

Aye, ye canny move in the buroo fur they ****s in Ermine robes.

If i lost my job tomorrow and started claiming job seekers don't mean im poor.

is it not meens tested, if not it should be

I don't no for sure but the example I could give is a chap who I no and lives in the same village as me lost his job after about 30 years.He finished paying his morgage on a house worth about 300,000.In my opinion that doesn't make him poor but he still went to collect his job seekers."
see that I don't mind. He has obviously worked hard so the state should be there to help. Making him sell his house wouldn't help. Its the people who have never payed into the system we should be looking at

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By *nnyMan over a year ago

Glasgow

"what next? Those of us who get child tax credits to receive clothing vouchers?

personaly i dont see a problem with it, a benifit should be spent as intended, i would have no problem recieving a vouvher, and lets face it if everyone got them then the stigma would go."

That would seem to go against the concept of Universal Credits where one single monthly payment is made to the claimant and its up to them how they spend it.

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By *iss_tressWoman over a year ago

London

"So a hard working man/woman loses their job and has to suffer the indignity of having vouchers to pay for things...

I remember part of my childhood and the shame of having free school dinner tickets. I sure wouldn't want that as an adult

Correct there is no reason for a social stigma for people who are down on their luck especially children.

maybe that stigma would prevent the "life style unemployed""

...and the person who worked for 30 years but has been made redundant?!!

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By *atelotmanMan over a year ago

Chatham

[Removed by poster at 28/10/13 18:29:36]

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By *B9 QueenWoman over a year ago

Over the rainbow, under the bridge

"what next? Those of us who get child tax credits to receive clothing vouchers?

personaly i dont see a problem with it, a benifit should be spent as intended, i would have no problem recieving a vouvher, and lets face it if everyone got them then the stigma would go."

People say such things - 'I would have no problem with ...' - until it actually happens to them. Just thank your lucky stars you are not on benefits and thus judged as scrounging benefit cheats fleecing all those who are hardworking. The reality is very much different. Stop being conned by the right-wing press who make stories about families - how many? They find one or two, put a spin on it and don't tell the complete truth - or even downright LIE about it - and people believe it and hence judge every one in receipt of benefits.

A deeply sad reflection of the ME ME ME ME generation.

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By *nnyMan over a year ago

Glasgow

"......Stop being conned by the right-wing press who make stories about families - ............ "

Some people WANT to be conned by the right-wing press.

They have this overwhelming need to feel better than other people.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"what next? Those of us who get child tax credits to receive clothing vouchers?

personaly i dont see a problem with it, a benifit should be spent as intended, i would have no problem recieving a vouvher, and lets face it if everyone got them then the stigma would go."

But its intended to live. So why give vouchers. What about paying bills. Gas, electic,water, tv licence etc.

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By *atelotmanMan over a year ago

Chatham

Why is it the fact your on benefits,so many people tar you as a scrounger.After 45yrs of working hard for a living, serving in the forces and paying more money then I can count in tax and N.I. Now find myself on benefits does that make me a scrounger as well.I don't bloody think so.

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By *nnyMan over a year ago

Glasgow

"what next? Those of us who get child tax credits to receive clothing vouchers?

personaly i dont see a problem with it, a benifit should be spent as intended, i would have no problem recieving a vouvher, and lets face it if everyone got them then the stigma would go.

But its intended to live. So why give vouchers. What about paying bills. Gas, electic,water, tv licence etc. "

If the Tories had their way unemployed folk wouldn't be allowed a telly. They really don't like you listening to that 'lefty nonsense', as Grant Shaps would have you believe.

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

"......Stop being conned by the right-wing press who make stories about families - ............

Some people WANT to be conned by the right-wing press.

They have this overwhelming need to feel better than other people."

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By *orny69pussyCouple over a year ago

Tonbridge

Couldn't be arsed to read the whole thread.. but thinking swinger clubs won't take the vouchers!!

Therefore even swinging will become elite!!

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By *nnyMan over a year ago

Glasgow

"Why is it the fact your on benefits,so many people tar you as a scrounger.After 45yrs of working hard for a living, serving in the forces and paying more money then I can count in tax and N.I. Now find myself on benefits does that make me a scrounger as well.I don't bloody think so. "

Make sure SSAFA locally know you exist.

Clever folk.

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By *iss_tressWoman over a year ago

London

Makes no difference to some I'm afraid.

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By *wingerdelight OP Couple over a year ago

eastliegh

alot of people have miss understood my op, my fault as i didnt explain very well, by putting the word scrounger in ex marks i was kind of meaning the people looking at claiments as scroungers. i know alot of people on benifits most have and will be again hard working people, i also know alot of people who have never worked and have no intention of doing

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By *obby9incherMan over a year ago

Leamington spa area

drug dealers will start to take food vouchers for there drug deals and spend them, they have no shame !!

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By *nnyMan over a year ago

Glasgow

"alot of people have miss understood my op, my fault as i didnt explain very well, by putting the word scrounger in ex marks i was kind of meaning the people looking at claiments as scroungers. i know alot of people on benifits most have and will be again hard working people, i also know alot of people who have never worked and have no intention of doing"

Is Eastleigh the place which elected a LibDem to replace Chris Huhne?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"is this a good idea instead of money for benifits? It might help with the "scrounger" problem we seem to have in the uk atm"

Stupid idea. Benefits need to pay for more than just food. Like gas, electric, clothes.

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By *wingerdelight OP Couple over a year ago

eastliegh

Is Eastleigh the place which elected a LibDem to replace Chris Huhne?"

yes

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By *nnyMan over a year ago

Glasgow

"drug dealers will start to take food vouchers for there drug deals and spend them, they have no shame !!

Nothing new in that. Milk tokens have been 'currency' for a long time.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"As soon as we issued vouchers people would be policing their trolleys and posting on here about how they saw someone buying chocolate with food vouchers.

It isnt necessarily the poor that are on benefits.

Aye, ye canny move in the buroo fur they ****s in Ermine robes.

If i lost my job tomorrow and started claiming job seekers don't mean im poor.

is it not meens tested, if not it should be

Maybe he'd had the foresight to take out mortgage protection insurance.

Possibly mate my point is that just because your claiming doesn't mean your poor!!"

depends on your definition of poor

if you have over £6000 in the bank you cant get any benefits till your savings fall below that amount

when i split from my ex i had to pack up work as i worked night and as i had become a single parent and no child minding service worked thro the night i was forced to leave my job as i couldn't leave my kids alone all night, firstly i was told that because i gave up my job i couldn't claim for the first 6 weeks and then i got a interview with the job centre asking me to bring certain info including a bank statement, i was told that because of the fact my bank statement showed in had over this amount in the bank i wasn't intituled to a penny, i had to support myself and to make another appointment when my saving had dropped under £6000 and they would re asses mu situation

luckily found a job pretty quick after leaving my last job so didn't affect me that much, but even if your out of work not everyone qualified for benefits regardless of the fact you gave paid into the system all your working life

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By *B9 QueenWoman over a year ago

Over the rainbow, under the bridge

But you did say the following:'personaly i dont see a problem with it, a benifit should be spent as intended, i would have no problem recieving a vouvher, and lets face it if everyone got them then the stigma would go.'

Which is pretty judgemental - why do they have to have vouchers?

I mean - God forbid that, like the rest of us, they might want to spend their money as they like!!

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"As soon as we issued vouchers people would be policing their trolleys and posting on here about how they saw someone buying chocolate with food vouchers.

It isnt necessarily the poor that are on benefits.

Aye, ye canny move in the buroo fur they ****s in Ermine robes.

If i lost my job tomorrow and started claiming job seekers don't mean im poor.

is it not meens tested, if not it should be

Maybe he'd had the foresight to take out mortgage protection insurance.

Possibly mate my point is that just because your claiming doesn't mean your poor!!

depends on your definition of poor

if you have over £6000 in the bank you cant get any benefits till your savings fall below that amount

I hadn't heard about that £6000 limit to be honest but if that is the case people would just take a few quid out and put it somewhere else.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"As soon as we issued vouchers people would be policing their trolleys and posting on here about how they saw someone buying chocolate with food vouchers.

It isnt necessarily the poor that are on benefits.

Aye, ye canny move in the buroo fur they ****s in Ermine robes.

If i lost my job tomorrow and started claiming job seekers don't mean im poor.

is it not meens tested, if not it should be

Maybe he'd had the foresight to take out mortgage protection insurance.

Possibly mate my point is that just because your claiming doesn't mean your poor!!

depends on your definition of poor

if you have over £6000 in the bank you cant get any benefits till your savings fall below that amount

working life "

Some people don't mind using the 'scrounger' word too liberally, do they?

if I was you, I'd have taken your kids out of school & taken them on an 'educational' trip around Asia untill you were down to your last 6k!!

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By *ugby 123Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

O o O oo

So are you saying the ones that have worked would be able to have cash rather than vouchers?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Before the war breaks out,maybe those in favour of such things should read...

First they came.. By Martin Niemöller.

There are several versions of this poem written by the same person.

The same methodology is much like todays benefit scroungers theme.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Everyone falls on unfortunate times, it can happen to any of us, tho i admit people who sit on benefits for years with no intenton of looking for work pee me off, and i know a few like that, i also know lots who have lost their job and work hard at finding a new job, you cant tar everyone out of work the same and i wouldn't like to see anyone resorting payjng for food with vouchers, it seems a little degrading to me

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By *he_original_poloWoman over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester

Why would using vouchers instantly stigmatise someone?

Surely the view that it would says more about how we (society) view the welfare system........ which may be just as much of a problem as the career freeloaders.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Scrounger problem???

I see more thieving corporations a problem and massive payrises for politicians and the queen more than anything.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Everyone falls on unfortunate times, it can happen to any of us, tho i admit people who sit on benefits for years with no intenton of looking for work pee me off, and i know a few like that, i also know lots who have lost their job and work hard at finding a new job, you cant tar everyone out of work the same and i wouldn't like to see anyone resorting payjng for food with vouchers, it seems a little degrading to me"

Well put.

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By *wingerdelight OP Couple over a year ago

eastliegh

So are you saying the ones that have worked would be able to have cash rather than vouchers?"

no im not

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 28/10/13 19:35:05]

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By *wingerdelight OP Couple over a year ago

eastliegh

"Why would using vouchers instantly stigmatise someone?

Surely the view that it would says more about how we (society) view the welfare system........ which may be just as much of a problem as the career freeloaders."

well put

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

Do you mean that issuing vouchers instead of money would remove the stigma associated with claiming benefits? Or somehow stop people calling everyone who is unfortunate enough to either be out of work or too ill to work being called scroungers. How do you think that would work?

I think it would increase the stigma and further marginalise those already being pushed to the edges of society. Benefit claimants aren't some sort of underclass who are unable to work out how to spend the money they get and need to be issued with vouchers in case they spend it on white lightning and fags and I really struggle to understand why otherwise intelligent people seem unable to understand that.

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By *ugby 123Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

O o O oo

So are you saying the ones that have worked would be able to have cash rather than vouchers?

no im not"

All get vouchers?

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

"Why would using vouchers instantly stigmatise someone?

Surely the view that it would says more about how we (society) view the welfare system........ which may be just as much of a problem as the career freeloaders."

because if you paid for your shopping with vouchers you would be instantly identifiable as a benefit claimant and you only need to read these forums to see how many view those people.

My aunt remembers well being made to wait until the shop was empty before they would serve her as a child because she had food stamps, she bore the memory of that stigma until she died last month at 85

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By *leasureDomeMan over a year ago

all over the place

"So a hard working man/woman loses their job and has to suffer the indignity of having vouchers to pay for things...

I remember part of my childhood and the shame of having free school dinner tickets. I sure wouldn't want that as an adult

I agree Ruggers and it does nothing to enhance peoples self esteem already feeling low.

Its amazing how last years working, tax paying member of society, can so easily be stigmatised, branded scroungers and made to feel guilty for needing a helping hand ,the whole purpose of benefits anyway.

I dont care what side of the political line your on ,hungry people in britain is not a place i want to go to.

It really is nothing to be proud of is it,I say lets drop the guilt trip currently being leveraged against people who can not find a job ,its just a divide and conquer exerise anyway IMHO.

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By *he_original_poloWoman over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester

".... Benefit claimants aren't some sort of underclass who are unable to work out how to spend the money they get and need to be issued with vouchers in case they spend it on white lightning and fags and I really struggle to understand why otherwise intelligent people seem unable to understand that. "

Unfortunately 'some' are........ and worse.

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

"So a hard working man/woman loses their job and has to suffer the indignity of having vouchers to pay for things...

I remember part of my childhood and the shame of having free school dinner tickets. I sure wouldn't want that as an adult

I agree Ruggers and it does nothing to enhance peoples self esteem already feeling low.

I dont care what side of the political line your on ,hungry people in britain is not a place i want to go to.

It really is nothing to be proud of is it,I say lets drop the guilt trip currently being leveraged against people who can not find a job ,its just a divide and conquer exerise anyway IMHO."

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By *ingleguy1973Man over a year ago

peterborough

The problem as I see it is how do you differentiate between those who are genuinely in need because they have fallen on hard times and those who have no intention of working and are happy to play the system for every penny.

Even deeper than that is the question of what benefits should provide apart from a roof over your head, food on the table and utilities. Should they provide a lifestyle or an existance?

Who woudn't begrudge someone on benefits enough for a couple of pints or the odd fag? Should they have enough spare cash to smoke 40 a day and go on the piss every night? If the answer is no, then where do you draw the line?

Should those who have paid in to the system through years of working, paying taxesand NI be entitled to more than those who have never worked?

I'll be honest, I don't know the answer but I genuinely believe our current system is no longer fit for purpose.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Why would using vouchers instantly stigmatise someone?

Surely the view that it would says more about how we (society) view the welfare system........ which may be just as much of a problem as the career freeloaders."

I don't think it would with most people it might with the odd one or so but not most.

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

Unfortunately 'some' are........ and worse."

but why would you want all of them to be tarred with the same brush. The some you talk about are a very small minority.

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By *wingerdelight OP Couple over a year ago

eastliegh

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By *ugby 123Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

O o O oo

There but for the grace of God go I springs to mind

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

Ok, you say its a fact, care to back that up with statistics?

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By *wingerdelight OP Couple over a year ago

eastliegh

Unfortunately 'some' are........ and worse.

but why would you want all of them to be tarred with the same brush. The some you talk about are a very small minority."
judging by what i see around here, wich is considered to be an afluent town, then yes its not such a minority

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

"There but for the grace of God go I springs to mind

We have been in this position, it isn't nice and to hear the way that some people talk makes me feel very sad.

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By *he_original_poloWoman over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester

Unfortunately 'some' are........ and worse.

but why would you want all of them to be tarred with the same brush. The some you talk about are a very small minority."

When have I said I am tarring them all?

I'm asking why food vouchers are instantly seen as stigmatising someone..... that view is down to us and we have the power to change that view.

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

Unfortunately 'some' are........ and worse.

but why would you want all of them to be tarred with the same brush. The some you talk about are a very small minority.judging by what i see around here, wich is considered to be an afluent town, then yes its not such a minority"

as I say above, can you back that up with statistics rather than anecdotal evidence?

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By *wingerdelight OP Couple over a year ago

eastliegh

Ok, you say its a fact, care to back that up with statistics?"

i cant, just what i see day to day.

im not having a go at the people that have fallen on hard times, just those that wont help them selves, in my town there are jobs going everywhere, but we have a huge amount of unimployed, there is only one conclusion, those people dont want to work, and i do see them buying fags and cider. and im paying for that, why should i??????/

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By *ugby 123Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

O o O oo

"There but for the grace of God go I springs to mind

We have been in this position, it isn't nice and to hear the way that some people talk makes me feel very sad."

Luckily for us we never have, I have worked most of my working life and the OH has worked all his working life.

I would hate to be in the position where we needed help and people assume we are the same as the few scroungers there are and watch what I am buying with the food vouchers they may hand out if this was for real

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By *wingerdelight OP Couple over a year ago

eastliegh

Unfortunately 'some' are........ and worse.

as I say above, can you back that up with statistics rather than anecdotal evidence?"
statistics can be made to show any argument you like, but im seeing it in real life

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

Unfortunately 'some' are........ and worse.

but why would you want all of them to be tarred with the same brush. The some you talk about are a very small minority.

When have I said I am tarring them all?

I'm asking why food vouchers are instantly seen as stigmatising someone..... that view is down to us and we have the power to change that view."

I think that forcing people to publicly identify that they are claiming benefits by the use of food vouchers will stigmatise them and I do not have the power to change that, I try one person at a time to change opinions but you only need to read the red tops and some of the opinions on these forums to know that it wont happen.

When I say tar with the same brush I mean that by the use of vouchers you identify all benefit claimants

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

Ok, you say its a fact, care to back that up with statistics?

i cant, just what i see day to day.

with respect how do you know that the people you see buying cider and fags are claiming benefits and unemployed?

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By *he_original_poloWoman over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester

"There but for the grace of God go I springs to mind

We have been in this position, it isn't nice and to hear the way that some people talk makes me feel very sad."

I'll tell you what makes me feel sad...... watching someone in their late 20's, who has never worked a day, eat 10-20 packets of mints per day because they have been told if they induce type 2 diabetes they can come off of the mandatory work programme and claim more benefits........... and then if you talk about such moronic scumbags, some fucker wants to jump on you for having a go at everyone who claims benefits.

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

"There but for the grace of God go I springs to mind

We have been in this position, it isn't nice and to hear the way that some people talk makes me feel very sad.

do you mean I'm "some fucker"?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Ok, you say its a fact, care to back that up with statistics?

i cant, just what i see day to day.

with respect how do you know that the people you see buying cider and fags are claiming benefits and unemployed? "

There is 2 that go in the same pub as me and they brag about it!!thing aswell is they work on local farms getting cash in hand!!They have more spare cash than most people grrrrr

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By *he_original_poloWoman over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester

"There but for the grace of God go I springs to mind

We have been in this position, it isn't nice and to hear the way that some people talk makes me feel very sad.

do you mean I'm "some fucker"? "

No... but the 'they must mean me' mentality is very much linked to what I am talking about.

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By *wingerdelight OP Couple over a year ago

eastliegh

alot of people on here view beeing on benifits as ok, its not, its a short term solution for those that really need help, and wanting to get of them is a good thing surely, so any stigma will help motivate people to earn for them selves. and yes ive been skint so i know how it feels, people need to look after them selves more and not depend on others, its the same as the accident lawyer thing, nowdays there is no such thing as an accident, someone is always to blame. well im sorry this isnt true. the world doesnt owe you anything, its up to you to make your life.

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By *wingerdelight OP Couple over a year ago

eastliegh

Ok, you say its a fact, care to back that up with statistics?

i cant, just what i see day to day.

with respect how do you know that the people you see buying cider and fags are claiming benefits and unemployed? "

because unlike some i like to get to know my local comunity

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

"There but for the grace of God go I springs to mind

We have been in this position, it isn't nice and to hear the way that some people talk makes me feel very sad.

do you mean I'm "some fucker"?

No... but the 'they must mean me' mentality is very much linked to what I am talking about."

I see...that's me told then!

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Why dont the state make everyone that claims anykind of state benefit.

Wear a yellow star sewn onto their outer clothing.

Visible to everyone,so no one gets accidently mistaken.

Can then have "spot the scrounger" days out for the school kids.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Vouchers won't make any difference just a waste of more money if you ask me.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"alot of people on here view beeing on benifits as ok, its not, its a short term solution for those that really need help, and wanting to get of them is a good thing surely, so any stigma will help motivate people to earn for them selves. and yes ive been skint so i know how it feels, people need to look after them selves more and not depend on others, its the same as the accident lawyer thing, nowdays there is no such thing as an accident, someone is always to blame. well im sorry this isnt true. the world doesnt owe you anything, its up to you to make your life."
*

So people shouldn't be paid benefits for long term disabilities?

Perhaps they ought have special coloured vouchers, or have bells to hang around their necks?

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

Ok, you say its a fact, care to back that up with statistics?

i cant, just what i see day to day.

with respect how do you know that the people you see buying cider and fags are claiming benefits and unemployed?

because unlike some i like to get to know my local comunity"

But that still isn't enough evidence to back up the introduction of food vouchers instead of money.

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By *wingerdelight OP Couple over a year ago

eastliegh

why not?

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By *he_original_poloWoman over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester

When people go for free treatment at the dentist and are asked to produce proof they are claiming benefits... this isn't seen as stigmatising them.

When people want to pick-up their prescription for free and are asked to produce proof they are claiming benefits... this isn't seen as stigmatising them.

No one is jumping up and down about these are they?

WE (society) decide what does and doesn't carry a stigma.... it is only our views of food vouchers which would stigmatise those who needed to use them.

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By *wingerdelight OP Couple over a year ago

eastliegh

"When people go for free treatment at the dentist and are asked to produce proof they are claiming benefits... this isn't seen as stigmatising them.

When people want to pick-up their prescription for free and are asked to produce proof they are claiming benefits... this isn't seen as stigmatising them.

No one is jumping up and down about these are they?

WE (society) decide what does and doesn't carry a stigma.... it is only our views of food vouchers which would stigmatise those who needed to use them. "
again well said polo

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

I wouldnt mind spending vouchers at a shop till, quite the opposite i'd be very glad to. £20 a week would do very nicely thank you Govt.

Of course you could just reduce my tax by that amount, couldn't you?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"When people go for free treatment at the dentist and are asked to produce proof they are claiming benefits... this isn't seen as stigmatising them.

When people want to pick-up their prescription for free and are asked to produce proof they are claiming benefits... this isn't seen as stigmatising them.

No one is jumping up and down about these are they?

WE (society) decide what does and doesn't carry a stigma.... it is only our views of food vouchers which would stigmatise those who needed to use them. "
What the lady says is quite correct!

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"When people go for free treatment at the dentist and are asked to produce proof they are claiming benefits... this isn't seen as stigmatising them.

When people want to pick-up their prescription for free and are asked to produce proof they are claiming benefits... this isn't seen as stigmatising them.

No one is jumping up and down about these are they?

WE (society) decide what does and doesn't carry a stigma.... it is only our views of food vouchers which would stigmatise those who needed to use them. "

Good point!

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

The card idea is quite good - a payment card that can ony be used for necessities.

By the time they've workd out what 'necessities' are, organised who can accept payments etc. it will finish up costing double what it costs to just hand out the cash though.

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

"why not?"

because you knowing that some people in your local community abuse the system in your opinion isn't enough evidence to introduce a system that would stigmatise (in my opinion) a whole section of society.

I would feel humiliated and ashamed to hand over food vouchers in my local shop knowing that there would be people ready and willing to pass judgement on me

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Given the dereliction often found in areas of high unemployment , deprivation etc, i simply dont understand why the authorities cant help the locals start communal market gardens, more allotments, small holdings etc.

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

"When people go for free treatment at the dentist and are asked to produce proof they are claiming benefits... this isn't seen as stigmatising them.

When people want to pick-up their prescription for free and are asked to produce proof they are claiming benefits... this isn't seen as stigmatising them.

No one is jumping up and down about these are they?

WE (society) decide what does and doesn't carry a stigma.... it is only our views of food vouchers which would stigmatise those who needed to use them. "

yes I agree. But the view persists therefore so does the stigma.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"When people go for free treatment at the dentist and are asked to produce proof they are claiming benefits... this isn't seen as stigmatising them.

When people want to pick-up their prescription for free and are asked to produce proof they are claiming benefits... this isn't seen as stigmatising them.

No one is jumping up and down about these are they?

WE (society) decide what does and doesn't carry a stigma.... it is only our views of food vouchers which would stigmatise those who needed to use them. "

No prescription fees in Wales, and I do believe that someone has to register with a dentist which can be done privately, and negates the need to provide evidence of benefits at every visit. Softening the stigma?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

IMO the card system wouldn't work.

If i had to use one, i'd stand in the queue at Sainsbury's and offer to pay for folks "authorised goods" in return for cash at say a 25% discount for a ( increased to 50% when hungrier).

Human nature, the poor get poorer.

And dont say they're'd be no takers, many would to save a tenner.

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By *wingerdelight OP Couple over a year ago

eastliegh

"The card idea is quite good - a payment card that can ony be used for necessities.

By the time they've workd out what 'necessities' are, organised who can accept payments etc. it will finish up costing double what it costs to just hand out the cash though."

there would be a cost to begin but over the long term?

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

[Removed by poster at 28/10/13 20:15:31]

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By *wingerdelight OP Couple over a year ago

eastliegh

"why not?

I would feel humiliated and ashamed to hand over food vouchers in my local shop knowing that there would be people ready and willing to pass judgement on me"

why are you so worried about what others think of you?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

How about a certain period of time being unemployed - say, 6 months, before vouchers are given? I would find it very hard to believe that somebody who is genuinely looking for employment not to be able to find a job within that time frame.

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By *ugby 123Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

O o O oo

"alot of people on here view beeing on benifits as ok, ."

I am not sure that is true, I see people discussing your OP not saying they think benefits are there to live off because they don't want to work.

Yes, there are scroungers around who must milk the system, but there are also hard working people who lose their job through no fault of their own.

None of us knows what is around the corner and although I hope no one has to go through any hard times, sometimes I think the people with no empathy should have a taste of it to see if it is as cushy as they make out.

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

"The card idea is quite good - a payment card that can ony be used for necessities.

By the time they've workd out what 'necessities' are, organised who can accept payments etc. it will finish up costing double what it costs to just hand out the cash though.

there would be a cost to begin but over the long term?

I pay tax and have as much right as you to an opinion on this subject.

Lots of people claiming benefits have paid tax and will do again they have a right to an opinion too.

Actually having an opinion is a basic human right and nothing to do with paying tax.

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By *nnyMan over a year ago

Glasgow

This takes us back to the Victorian workhouse idea of deserving v undeserving.

Who would decide in 2013?

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By *he_original_poloWoman over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester

"When people go for free treatment at the dentist and are asked to produce proof they are claiming benefits... this isn't seen as stigmatising them.

When people want to pick-up their prescription for free and are asked to produce proof they are claiming benefits... this isn't seen as stigmatising them.

No one is jumping up and down about these are they?

WE (society) decide what does and doesn't carry a stigma.... it is only our views of food vouchers which would stigmatise those who needed to use them.

My apologies for omitting 'with the exception of Wales' to the prescription example.

However (and again unless the system is different in Wales) you should be asked at each and every visit if you pay for your treatment and present proof if you say you do not....... oddly (and possibly ironically) to eliminate people saying they are on benefits and entitled to free treatment when they are not.... so no stigma there then.

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

"alot of people on here view beeing on benifits as ok, .

I am not sure that is true, I see people discussing your OP not saying they think benefits are there to live off because they don't want to work.

Yes, there are scroungers around who must milk the system, but there are also hard working people who lose their job through no fault of their own.

cushy it ain't.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"How about a certain period of time being unemployed - say, 6 months, before vouchers are given? I would find it very hard to believe that somebody who is genuinely looking for employment not to be able to find a job within that time frame."

Some cant there are some people out there that you woudnt trust to butter bread. Lots dont want to work but there are a lot of real thickies out there.

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By *wingerdelight OP Couple over a year ago

eastliegh

"The card idea is quite good - a payment card that can ony be used for necessities.

By the time they've workd out what 'necessities' are, organised who can accept payments etc. it will finish up costing double what it costs to just hand out the cash though.

there would be a cost to begin but over the long term?

I pay tax and have as much right as you to an opinion on this subject.

Lots of people claiming benefits have paid tax and will do again they have a right to an opinion too.

Actually having an opinion is a basic human right and nothing to do with paying tax. "

yes you have a right to an opinion, but unless you pay into the system then you have no right to how the money is spent

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

What a joke I have laid 2 people off this week one of whom as been with the company ten years paying tax and NI he will have to claim benefits till sorted. Not all people on benefits are scrounging so why tarnish all people with the same brush and god help it ever happening to yourself I bet your attitude to welfare would be totally different

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By *nnyMan over a year ago

Glasgow

"The card idea is quite good - a payment card that can ony be used for necessities.

By the time they've workd out what 'necessities' are, organised who can accept payments etc. it will finish up costing double what it costs to just hand out the cash though.

there would be a cost to begin but over the long term?

I pay tax and have as much right as you to an opinion on this subject.

Lots of people claiming benefits have paid tax and will do again they have a right to an opinion too.

Actually having an opinion is a basic human right and nothing to do with paying tax.

yes you have a right to an opinion, but unless you pay into the system then you have no right to how the money is spent"

Does that apply to corporation tax non payers too?

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

"The card idea is quite good - a payment card that can ony be used for necessities.

By the time they've workd out what 'necessities' are, organised who can accept payments etc. it will finish up costing double what it costs to just hand out the cash though.

there would be a cost to begin but over the long term?

I pay tax and have as much right as you to an opinion on this subject.

Lots of people claiming benefits have paid tax and will do again they have a right to an opinion too.

Actually having an opinion is a basic human right and nothing to do with paying tax.

yes you have a right to an opinion, but unless you pay into the system then you have no right to how the money is spent"

So as soon as I claim benefits regardless of how much I have paid into the system up until that point I lose autonomy over how I spend my money?

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By *wingerdelight OP Couple over a year ago

eastliegh

"What a joke I have laid 2 people off this week one of whom as been with the company ten years paying tax and NI he will have to claim benefits till sorted. Not all people on benefits are scrounging so why tarnish all people with the same brush and god help it ever happening to yourself I bet your attitude to welfare would be totally different "

i have been skint, and beeing self employed have had very dry times wondering if i can pay the rent, but there is always work i can do,it might be crap pay but who cares, i would rather do that than sign on. but thats not the point, benifit is just that a benifit, should you be able to spend it on a holiday? or should you be only able to buy food, gas etc, that is my point. i wish people would stop trying to take this thread of subject

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By *he_original_poloWoman over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester

"...

How do you know they haven't?

May be seeing the system from the inside has helped form some less empathetic opinions.

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By *wingerdelight OP Couple over a year ago

eastliegh

"The card idea is quite good - a payment card that can ony be used for necessities.

By the time they've workd out what 'necessities' are, organised who can accept payments etc. it will finish up costing double what it costs to just hand out the cash though.

there would be a cost to begin but over the long term?

I pay tax and have as much right as you to an opinion on this subject.

Lots of people claiming benefits have paid tax and will do again they have a right to an opinion too.

Actually having an opinion is a basic human right and nothing to do with paying tax.

yes you have a right to an opinion, but unless you pay into the system then you have no right to how the money is spent

So as soon as I claim benefits regardless of how much I have paid into the system up until that point I lose autonomy over how I spend my money? "

well its not your money, its the tax payers money, whether you have been one in the past isnt the point.

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple over a year ago

in Lancashire

i cant, just what i see day to day.

so these folk you 'see' day to day are all in your opinion 'scroungers' and are all smokers and all drink cider...?

and on that basis are all fit and able to work, no disabilities etc..?

that's either an amazing example of observation or prejudice..

how do you decide which folk go on vouchers..?

and those afforded the luxury of receiving their benefits in the current form..?

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By *ugby 123Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

O o O oo

"...

How do you know they haven't?

May be seeing the system from the inside has helped form some less empathetic opinions."

I can read

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

"The card idea is quite good - a payment card that can ony be used for necessities.

By the time they've workd out what 'necessities' are, organised who can accept payments etc. it will finish up costing double what it costs to just hand out the cash though.

there would be a cost to begin but over the long term?

I pay tax and have as much right as you to an opinion on this subject.

Lots of people claiming benefits have paid tax and will do again they have a right to an opinion too.

Actually having an opinion is a basic human right and nothing to do with paying tax.

yes you have a right to an opinion, but unless you pay into the system then you have no right to how the money is spent

So as soon as I claim benefits regardless of how much I have paid into the system up until that point I lose autonomy over how I spend my money?

well its not your money, its the tax payers money, whether you have been one in the past isnt the point."

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By *B9 QueenWoman over a year ago

Over the rainbow, under the bridge

Fact? Where did you get that fact? To just say 'a lot' indicates that actually that is an opinion.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

For anyone who is too set against using them should they be put in place, remember this ..

You don't have to accept them, or do so and simply give them away to someone more grateful.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

I have no problem with the hard working man/woman who loses their job, has paid into the system and requires some support whilst they find another job. That could happen to any of us; is what the welfare state was set up for and should remain. What I do have a problem with is the people who see benefits as a career option. What job in society financially rewards you for having another child?? A life on benefits.

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By *he_original_poloWoman over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester

The average annual earnings of full-time workers in the UK is £26,500.

Benefit capping proposal £500 per week (x52 = £26k) or £350 for a single person.

Then bare in mind the working family will need to pay for the dentist, prescription (for the over 16's, unless in further education or in Wales), transport to work and so on.

We have a system which pays out (to those in the know) more than many earn in legitimate jobs, ......... there is something wrong with that in my opinion.

The DWP reported a genuine increase in people actively looking for work after they contacted them about benefit capping...... it is estimated that over 14,000 have now found jobs in the initial contact areas... how odd.

I am proud to live in a country which has a welfare system and do not feel there should be any stigma whatsoever for those who use it as it was intended to be used. We should not view food vouchers as a stigma, we should be proud that we support those who have fallen on unfortunate times.

Equally I believe we cannot continue to allow claiming benefits to be a career choice for those who just don't want to work...legitimately.

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By *wingerdelight OP Couple over a year ago

eastliegh

"The card idea is quite good - a payment card that can ony be used for necessities.

By the time they've workd out what 'necessities' are, organised who can accept payments etc. it will finish up costing double what it costs to just hand out the cash though.

there would be a cost to begin but over the long term?

I pay tax and have as much right as you to an opinion on this subject.

Lots of people claiming benefits have paid tax and will do again they have a right to an opinion too.

Actually having an opinion is a basic human right and nothing to do with paying tax.

yes you have a right to an opinion, but unless you pay into the system then you have no right to how the money is spent

So as soon as I claim benefits regardless of how much I have paid into the system up until that point I lose autonomy over how I spend my money?

well its not your money, its the tax payers money, whether you have been one in the past isnt the point.

but if you have previously paid tax and national insurance you have contributed, it is what part of those payments are for so that if you need to claim benefits for a period of time. By your reasoning old age pensioners should no longer have a say in how they spend their pensions because they no longer contribute. "
no pensions are different, they are mainly people who have payed all their lives to have a pension, alot different than people who refuse to work as the benifits they get prevent themfrom working as they would end up worxe off.

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

"The average annual earnings of full-time workers in the UK is £26,500.

Benefit capping proposal £500 per week (x52 = £26k) or £350 for a single person.

Then bare in mind the working family will need to pay for the dentist, prescription (for the over 16's, unless in further education or in Wales), transport to work and so on.

We have a system which pays out (to those in the know) more than many earn in legitimate jobs, ......... there is something wrong with that in my opinion.

Equally I believe we cannot continue to allow claiming benefits to be a career choice for those who just don't want to work...legitimately. "

I think you and I broadly agree on the basics if not the actual solution

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

No in general I think it is a bad idea, based on my school days when I used to get dinner tokens, and was bullied because of this.

Some people need to eat regularly, and sometimes they cant afford both food and heating, in those cases food tokens may be a usefull idea, ( I am thinking of diabetics and the elderly)

I have neighbours in their 90's and they wont have heating on, in case they get a bill they cant pay.

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By *nnyMan over a year ago

Glasgow

"The average annual earnings of full-time workers in the UK is £26,500.

Benefit capping proposal £500 per week (x52 = £26k) or £350 for a single person.

Then bare in mind the working family will need to pay for the dentist, prescription (for the over 16's, unless in further education or in Wales), transport to work and so on.

We have a system which pays out (to those in the know) more than many earn in legitimate jobs, ......... there is something wrong with that in my opinion.

Equally I believe we cannot continue to allow claiming benefits to be a career choice for those who just don't want to work...legitimately. "

Is that £26500 net or gross?

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

"no pensions are different, they are mainly people who have payed all their lives to have a pension, alot different than people who refuse to work as the benifits they get prevent themfrom working as they would end up worxe off. "

My mum has only worked periodically during her long life, and usually in jobs where she paid little or no tax. She now has a pension, where does this leave her? What I'm trying to say is that the situation isn't as cut and dried as you would have it.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"is this a good idea instead of money for benifits? It might help with the "scrounger" problem we seem to have in the uk atm"
this is not the 1940's

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By *nnyMan over a year ago

Glasgow

".....

I have neighbours in their 90's and they wont have heating on, in case they get a bill they cant pay."

Are they getting Winter Fuel Payment?

They MUST make a claim. It doesn't just happen.

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple over a year ago

in Lancashire

Don't think there is anyone on any side of the debate saying that its ok for anyone to have a lifetime on benefits..

think most of us are pretty au fait with what goes on in our local communities..

there will always be a minority who will take the piss as the system isn't perfect, but as with most things when Politicians 'reform or modernise' they also effect some deserving folk and some seem unable to differentiate between the deserving and the less so ..

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By *ingleguy1973Man over a year ago

peterborough

"I think you and I broadly agree on the basics if not the actual solution

So what is the solution?

It very much depends on your definition of what benefits should fund... a lifestyle or an existance? A way of life as an alternative to work or a safety net for those out of work?

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

"Don't think there is anyone on any side of the debate saying that its ok for anyone to have a lifetime on benefits..

think most of us are pretty au fait with what goes on in our local communities..

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Seriously, can anyone remember the unemployment figures before the banking collapse, compared to today?

Obviously not including government 'work for nothing' schemes. Does anyone know?

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By *he_original_poloWoman over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester

"The average annual earnings of full-time workers in the UK is £26,500.

Benefit capping proposal £500 per week (x52 = £26k) or £350 for a single person.

Then bare in mind the working family will need to pay for the dentist, prescription (for the over 16's, unless in further education or in Wales), transport to work and so on.

We have a system which pays out (to those in the know) more than many earn in legitimate jobs, ......... there is something wrong with that in my opinion.

Equally I believe we cannot continue to allow claiming benefits to be a career choice for those who just don't want to work...legitimately.

Is that £26500 net or gross?"

Gross.

If you'd like the most up to date (August's figures) published by the Office of National Statistics:

"In cash terms, average weekly earnings excluding bonus payments were £447 in August 2013, before taxes and other deductions from gross pay"

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"The card idea is quite good - a payment card that can ony be used for necessities.

By the time they've workd out what 'necessities' are, organised who can accept payments etc. it will finish up costing double what it costs to just hand out the cash though.

there would be a cost to begin but over the long term?

What utter bullshit

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

"I think you and I broadly agree on the basics if not the actual solution

So what is the solution?

It very much depends on your definition of what benefits should fund... a lifestyle or an existance? A way of life as an alternative to work or a safety net for those out of work?"

I don't have a solution, I wish I did.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 28/10/13 21:06:22]

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By *he_original_poloWoman over a year ago

a Primark shoebox in Leicester

".....

I have neighbours in their 90's and they wont have heating on, in case they get a bill they cant pay.

Are they getting Winter Fuel Payment?

They MUST make a claim. It doesn't just happen."

Actually it does..... it gets paid in the pension account.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

".....

I have neighbours in their 90's and they wont have heating on, in case they get a bill they cant pay.

Are they getting Winter Fuel Payment?

They MUST make a claim. It doesn't just happen.

Actually it does..... it gets paid in the pension account."

I thought this was the case, as that's what happened with my parents

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"The average annual earnings of full-time workers in the UK is £26,500.

Benefit capping proposal £500 per week (x52 = £26k) or £350 for a single person.

Then bare in mind the working family will need to pay for the dentist, prescription (for the over 16's, unless in further education or in Wales), transport to work and so on.

We have a system which pays out (to those in the know) more than many earn in legitimate jobs, ......... there is something wrong with that in my opinion.

Equally I believe we cannot continue to allow claiming benefits to be a career choice for those who just don't want to work...legitimately.

Is that £26500 net or gross?"

The average salary quoted is Gross Pay. *

The annual benefit cap is net pay.

So, a workng person or couple would need to earn significantly more, maybe upto £40k to be comparable.

* Gross average pay is for those who get paid obviously, it is not the average pay of those who seek work, nor the new pay, ), of those recently out of work.

So, in theory, the average pay could go up if all the dinner ladies, council gardeners were dismissed tomorrow.

Govt economics eh? who'd have 'em.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

the ) should be a 0, zero. Such pay ought to bring the average down but doesn't.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Judging from the increased uptake at food banks the stigma argument ain't too convincing.

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By *wingerdelight OP Couple over a year ago

eastliegh

"The card idea is quite good - a payment card that can ony be used for necessities.

By the time they've workd out what 'necessities' are, organised who can accept payments etc. it will finish up costing double what it costs to just hand out the cash though.

there would be a cost to begin but over the long term?

What utter bullshit"
explain why I'm not aloud to say where my money is spennt,

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

I think if ALL of the companies pay their fare share of corporation tax, the banking system pays back EVERY PENNY that they took from the public purse PLUS the same exorbitant rate of interest that they would have charged for that kind of loan, then that money can be re-invested in to infrastructure & create jobs again!!

Oh, btw; it was reported today that chief executive (or whoever) of the publicly owned Barclays bank, (£30 billion bailout) today payed himself an extremely modest £2 million bonus - a jolly nice chappy he seemed too!!!

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I think if ALL of the companies pay their fare share of corporation tax, the banking system pays back EVERY PENNY that they took from the public purse PLUS the same exorbitant rate of interest that they would have charged for that kind of loan, then that money can be re-invested in to infrastructure & create jobs again!!

Which has what to do with people squandering benefit money?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"The card idea is quite good - a payment card that can ony be used for necessities.

By the time they've workd out what 'necessities' are, organised who can accept payments etc. it will finish up costing double what it costs to just hand out the cash though.

there would be a cost to begin but over the long term?

What utter bullshit explain why I'm not aloud to say where my money is spennt,"

Once tax and NI is paid, it's no longer YOUR money!

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By *nnyMan over a year ago

Glasgow

".....

I have neighbours in their 90's and they wont have heating on, in case they get a bill they cant pay.

Are they getting Winter Fuel Payment?

They MUST make a claim. It doesn't just happen.

Actually it does..... it gets paid in the pension account.

I thought this was the case, as that's what happened with my parents"

Gov.uk says 'if you qualify but don't get paid automatically, you'll need to make a claim'.

Id rather they claimed and were told it wasn't necessary than didn't claim and froze.

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By *imiUKMan over a year ago

Hereford

"The card idea is quite good - a payment card that can ony be used for necessities.

By the time they've workd out what 'necessities' are, organised who can accept payments etc. it will finish up costing double what it costs to just hand out the cash though.

there would be a cost to begin but over the long term?

And what about those who rape the system for billions of pounds, like...Vodafone say - why is your ire not directed at them, instead of some poor bastard on the dole?

Its easy to kick downwards.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Another daily mail reader and BBC news watcher I guess"

oh no not another paper snob comment. Boring.

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By *ingleguy1973Man over a year ago

peterborough

"And what about those who rape the system for billions of pounds, like...Vodafone say - why is your ire not directed at them, instead of some poor bastard on the dole?

Its easy to kick downwards. "

Maybe because that is not what the thread is about. This country sadly is in a shit state economically. We are massively in debt with over crowded schools, a health service on the brink and crumbling infrastructure. Costs need to be cut including the welfare bill. The thread is about how to encourage people who see welfare as a way of life and an alternative to work to seek employment. Corporate tax avoidance/evasion while it needs to be addressed is an entirely different matter.

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By *imiUKMan over a year ago

Hereford

"And what about those who rape the system for billions of pounds, like...Vodafone say - why is your ire not directed at them, instead of some poor bastard on the dole?

Its easy to kick downwards.

If you think the tiny percentage of revenue that we spend on welfare will make a jot of difference then you are naieve in the extreme.

I'm sure it will play into the hands of those who want to sell off our public infrastructure though as more people become 'burdensome' and the state officially 'cant cope'...

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Which has what to do with people squandering benefit money?"
try reading it again!

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By *eavenNhellCouple over a year ago

carrbrook stalybridge

"The card idea is quite good - a payment card that can ony be used for necessities.

By the time they've workd out what 'necessities' are, organised who can accept payments etc. it will finish up costing double what it costs to just hand out the cash though.

there would be a cost to begin but over the long term?

something has to be done, i pay alot of tax, and have seen my life get worse, roads degrading public transport degrading etc, the rot has to stop, im fed up of supporting people who have no intention of working, other areas need seeing to aswell, but we have to start somewhere. and those that say i have no right to say how you spend your money when your on benifits, well sorry its my money not yours so yes i do have a right"
can you tell me are you just as pissed off that your hard earned wages go to tax and are used to support multi million profit making businesses that pay big dividends to there share holders this doesent happen you say ? oh yes it does every penny of working tax credit paid to members of staff at Tesco Asda Poundland etc is a subsidy on that companys profits as they get away with not paying a living wage meaning more profit for them and more subsidy paid out by the tax payer they are the biggest "scroungers " in my eyes !

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Which has what to do with people squandering benefit money? try reading it again!"

Yeah well I did and it still has fuck all to do with the original question. Why not throw in the royal family or MP's expenses, or the TV license fee too?

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By *nnyMan over a year ago

Glasgow

"............ Corporate tax avoidance/evasion while it needs to be addressed is an entirely different matter.

....."

Why?

Is the fact the multi-nationals are fucking the Exchequer up the arse a good enough excuse for the Exchequer to fuck the poor up the arse?

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