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Food Hygiene in the home !!!
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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I have just read an article in which a child baked some cakes to take to sell on the cake stall at school and was told that they couldn't sell them because her mother did not have a 'Health food hygiene Certificate'
What the hell is going on, this is a big insult on parents that encourage their children to bake cakes for schools and parties. We have been doing this for years in our house !!
What are your thoughts on this, are we all going to have to pay to get us through the health and Hygiene system, and how on earth would they endorse this, as it would mean a house to house call every day.
Maybe i am wrong but this is just plain bloody madness at it's best !!! |
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By *yrdwomanWoman
over a year ago
Putting the 'cum' in Eboracum |
I think if you're going to sell them you need some kind of protection, but if you're giving them away then no problem. It also depends on the local council. Some will be strict, some will assume fairy cakes are slightly safer than homebrew. |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"I think if you're going to sell them you need some kind of protection, but if you're giving them away then no problem. It also depends on the local council. Some will be strict, some will assume fairy cakes are slightly safer than homebrew."
All it will do is force parents to buy shop bought ones to re-sell, so they can see the packaging... Ruby |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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we gave the cakes made away but sold them a bag to put them in ,
also gave the cakes then asked for a donation and had a suggested donation price per cake , |
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The clue is in the word 'Sell'
And for good reason
'Little Johnny' takes a plate of cakes to school to sell at the end of year fundraising, when he goes home and tells mum that they all sold out in minutes and everyone loved them, mum then decides the following Sunday to make a bigger batch and sell them at the local Boot Sale to earn some much needed pennies for the family coffers.
The Food Standards Agency launched a ratings system to protect people.
Thankfully |
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"The clue is in the word 'Sell'
And for good reason
'Little Johnny' takes a plate of cakes to school to sell at the end of year fundraising, when he goes home and tells mum that they all sold out in minutes and everyone loved them, mum then decides the following Sunday to make a bigger batch and sell them at the local Boot Sale to earn some much needed pennies for the family coffers.
The Food Standards Agency launched a ratings system to protect people.
Thankfully"
however has mankind managed to remain alive for all this time without the food standards agency and health & safety??
by rights, we should all have died out thousands of years ago  |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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I know a lot of cake makers (wedding cakes etc) that bake from their home and not one of them have a health and hygiene certificate. Their kitchens are built just yours and mine, with work tops that we clean down, chopping boards that we scrub. If they had to have a certificate out would go all the work tops for stainless steel, all wooden chopping boards etc for coloured coded ones, even knives have to be colour coded in a lot of establishments. It would make our lovely cosy homes very clinical and to me that would be a big shame as there would be no individuality.....Ruby |
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"I know a lot of cake makers (wedding cakes etc) that bake from their home and not one of them have a health and hygiene certificate. Their kitchens are built just yours and mine, with work tops that we clean down, chopping boards that we scrub. If they had to have a certificate out would go all the work tops for stainless steel, all wooden chopping boards etc for coloured coded ones, even knives have to be colour coded in a lot of establishments. It would make our lovely cosy homes very clinical and to me that would be a big shame as there would be no individuality.....Ruby "
thought they had to have a hygiene certificate for that. I wouldnt want my wedding cake baked by someone without a certificate
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"I know a lot of cake makers (wedding cakes etc) that bake from their home and not one of them have a health and hygiene certificate. Their kitchens are built just yours and mine, with work tops that we clean down, chopping boards that we scrub. If they had to have a certificate out would go all the work tops for stainless steel, all wooden chopping boards etc for coloured coded ones, even knives have to be colour coded in a lot of establishments. It would make our lovely cosy homes very clinical and to me that would be a big shame as there would be no individuality.....Ruby thought they had to have a hygiene certificate for that. I wouldnt want my wedding cake baked by someone without a certificate"
They do.....and many local authorities also insist on a visit to the premises now, not all do but it's becoming more common. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I think if you're going to sell them you need some kind of protection, but if you're giving them away then no problem. It also depends on the local council. Some will be strict, some will assume fairy cakes are slightly safer than homebrew.
All it will do is force parents to buy shop bought ones to re-sell, so they can see the packaging... Ruby "
Our local school already has to do that  |
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"I know a lot of cake makers (wedding cakes etc) that bake from their home and not one of them have a health and hygiene certificate. Their kitchens are built just yours and mine, with work tops that we clean down, chopping boards that we scrub. If they had to have a certificate out would go all the work tops for stainless steel, all wooden chopping boards etc for coloured coded iones, even knives have to be colour coded in a lot of establishments. It would make our lovely cosy homes very clinical and to me that would be a big shame as there would be no individuality.....Ruby thought they had to have a hygiene certificate for that. I wouldnt want my wedding cake baked by someone without a certificate
They do.....and many local authorities also insist on a visit to the premises now, not all do but it's becoming more common."
I thought so as my ex next door neighbour did cakes |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I think if you're going to sell them you need some kind of protection, but if you're giving them away then no problem. It also depends on the local council. Some will be strict, some will assume fairy cakes are slightly safer than homebrew."
given or selling can carry the same burden
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"thing is you can get a certificate online (as i did for working in a community cafe)no-one ever checked my kitchen so its a farce really!"
A Basic Food Hygiene Certificate that you can qualify for online won't matter a hoot if you get a home visit from a local authority though, they are less concerned about your personal hygiene knowledge, and more interested in the state of the kitchen that you are preparing food for sale in.
We are talking about Two different things here, Food Hygiene Rating is another thing completely.
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"I think if you're going to sell them you need some kind of protection, but if you're giving them away then no problem. It also depends on the local council. Some will be strict, some will assume fairy cakes are slightly safer than homebrew.given or selling can carry the same burden "
Not with food, as there is a public liability factor. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"thing is you can get a certificate online (as i did for working in a community cafe)no-one ever checked my kitchen so its a farce really!
A Basic Food Hygiene Certificate that you can qualify for online won't matter a hoot if you get a home visit from a local authority though, they are less concerned about your personal hygiene knowledge, and more interested in the state of the kitchen that you are preparing food for sale in.
We are talking about Two different things here, Food Hygiene Rating is another thing completely.
"
well the cafe i volunteer with got a food hygene rating standard of 4 stars by being able to answer the questions about hygiene correctly, been trading for 2 years and NEVER had a visit! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Don't say you were not warned when a court summons land on your mat or your house is over run by health officials in white coats wearing face mask and swabbing everything  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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After watching a few of those 'horror documentaries' I wouldn't mind betting that a lot of domestic kitchens will in fact be cleaner and more hygienic than many restaurants who have a 'health & hygiene' certificate. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I think if you're going to sell them you need some kind of protection, but if you're giving them away then no problem. It also depends on the local council. Some will be strict, some will assume fairy cakes are slightly safer than homebrew."
Not really as some people sell them for charity and sometimes use big companies to advertise it. So surely if something went wrong the company would get a bad reputation and they don't ask for food certificates do they  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"thing is you can get a certificate online (as i did for working in a community cafe)no-one ever checked my kitchen so its a farce really!
A Basic Food Hygiene Certificate that you can qualify for online won't matter a hoot if you get a home visit from a local authority though, they are less concerned about your personal hygiene knowledge, and more interested in the state of the kitchen that you are preparing food for sale in.
We are talking about Two different things here, Food Hygiene Rating is another thing completely.
well the cafe i volunteer with got a food hygene rating standard of 4 stars by being able to answer the questions about hygiene correctly, been trading for 2 years and NEVER had a visit!"
famous last words, you will get a visit tomorrow now |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I think if you're going to sell them you need some kind of protection, but if you're giving them away then no problem. It also depends on the local council. Some will be strict, some will assume fairy cakes are slightly safer than homebrew.
Not really as some people sell them for charity and sometimes use big companies to advertise it. So surely if something went wrong the company would get a bad reputation and they don't ask for food certificates do they "
normally if a big company are will to sell your goods
1 they will prob ask for a copy of your food hygiene cert
2 have a planned visit to your premises
That's what the big supermarkets do, they used to visit the company I worked for at least once a year |
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Any food that is sold to private members or the public have to have a hygiene rating from the council. It's the councils way of dotting the I and crossing the t's.
If you went down with food bug I'm sure most would want to see the culprit stopped from cooking? |
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"bit pointless, i like buying homemade cakes, i have never been unwell from eating any."
If you are buying homemade cakes from a business then they will more than likely have had to have had a food standards agency certificate foe their kitchen at home.
I caused quite a stir on Facebook when o asked how many of the people who sell cakes on there had one.
Fact is if you are selling ans making a profit from these things you need to be covered these days. One case of someone having a dodgy stomach and a claim to the environmental health and you are screwed. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I think if you're going to sell them you need some kind of protection, but if you're giving them away then no problem. It also depends on the local council. Some will be strict, some will assume fairy cakes are slightly safer than homebrew.
Not really as some people sell them for charity and sometimes use big companies to advertise it. So surely if something went wrong the company would get a bad reputation and they don't ask for food certificates do they normally if a big company are will to sell your goods
1 they will prob ask for a copy of your food hygiene cert
2 have a planned visit to your premises
That's what the big supermarkets do, they used to visit the company I worked for at least once a year "
So someone in my workplace asked me if I could bake cakes for charity and then sell them in my workplace and all the money collected will go to charity. If I said "yes" to them. I would have to had someone come round my house to see if things were fine and then wait for a certificate?  |
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"thing is you can get a certificate online (as i did for working in a community cafe)no-one ever checked my kitchen so its a farce really!
A Basic Food Hygiene Certificate that you can qualify for online won't matter a hoot if you get a home visit from a local authority though, they are less concerned about your personal hygiene knowledge, and more interested in the state of the kitchen that you are preparing food for sale in.
We are talking about Two different things here, Food Hygiene Rating is another thing completely.
well the cafe i volunteer with got a food hygene rating standard of 4 stars by being able to answer the questions about hygiene correctly, been trading for 2 years and NEVER had a visit!"
Food Hygiene Ratings are carried out by Local Authorities, Basic Food Hygiene Certificates on the other hand are like an NVQ and can be studied and given out using private online companies after doing an online mini course.
Basic Food Hygiene Certificates are not rated on a scale, Food Hygiene Ratings are.
FHR Certificates DO NOT get issued by answering questions, they are issued after, and only after, a local authority site visit.
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"bit pointless, i like buying homemade cakes, i have never been unwell from eating any.
If you are buying homemade cakes from a business then they will more than likely have had to have had a food standards agency certificate foe their kitchen at home.
I caused quite a stir on Facebook when o asked how many of the people who sell cakes on there had one.
Fact is if you are selling ans making a profit from these things you need to be covered these days. One case of someone having a dodgy stomach and a claim to the environmental health and you are screwed. "
Thank you Evie....absolutely spot on!
 |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"bit pointless, i like buying homemade cakes, i have never been unwell from eating any.
If you are buying homemade cakes from a business then they will more than likely have had to have had a food standards agency certificate foe their kitchen at home.
I caused quite a stir on Facebook when o asked how many of the people who sell cakes on there had one.
Fact is if you are selling ans making a profit from these things you need to be covered these days. One case of someone having a dodgy stomach and a claim to the environmental health and you are screwed.
Thank you Evie....absolutely spot on!
"
And the taxman |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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This is ridiculous! The school I work for ask the parents to bake cakes for school fairs. Ive never heard any reports of people being unwell through them either. Actually, when they walk past me with them, they look lush (im the local lollipop lady). |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"thing is you can get a certificate online (as i did for working in a community cafe)no-one ever checked my kitchen so its a farce really!
A Basic Food Hygiene Certificate that you can qualify for online won't matter a hoot if you get a home visit from a local authority though, they are less concerned about your personal hygiene knowledge, and more interested in the state of the kitchen that you are preparing food for sale in.
We are talking about Two different things here, Food Hygiene Rating is another thing completely.
well the cafe i volunteer with got a food hygene rating standard of 4 stars by being able to answer the questions about hygiene correctly, been trading for 2 years and NEVER had a visit!
Food Hygiene Ratings are carried out by Local Authorities, Basic Food Hygiene Certificates on the other hand are like an NVQ and can be studied and given out using private online companies after doing an online mini course.
Basic Food Hygiene Certificates are not rated on a scale, Food Hygiene Ratings are.
FHR Certificates DO NOT get issued by answering questions, they are issued after, and only after, a local authority site visit.
"
well ours was! perhaps its our dodgy local authority!
|
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"This is ridiculous! The school I work for ask the parents to bake cakes for school fairs. Ive never heard any reports of people being unwell through them either. Actually, when they walk past me with them, they look lush (im the local lollipop lady). "
Surprised schools allow that, they are some if the worse for quoting H&S these days |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"This is ridiculous! The school I work for ask the parents to bake cakes for school fairs. Ive never heard any reports of people being unwell through them either. Actually, when they walk past me with them, they look lush (im the local lollipop lady). "
Surprised schools allow that, they are some if the worse for quoting H&S these days |
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"bit pointless, i like buying homemade cakes, i have never been unwell from eating any.
If you are buying homemade cakes from a business then they will more than likely have had to have had a food standards agency certificate foe their kitchen at home.
I caused quite a stir on Facebook when o asked how many of the people who sell cakes on there had one.
Fact is if you are selling ans making a profit from these things you need to be covered these days. One case of someone having a dodgy stomach and a claim to the environmental health and you are screwed.
Thank you Evie....absolutely spot on!
"
This is exactly why I do not have a cake business from home at the moment...I asked my landlord if I could have one from home, he said no so I did not even go any further as to enquire about having the council come round to inspect my kitchen. I would have done it by the book or not at all.Any cakes I do are for friends and family, not to sell. |
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"I know a lot of cake makers (wedding cakes etc) that bake from their home and not one of them have a health and hygiene certificate. Their kitchens are built just yours and mine, with work tops that we clean down, chopping boards that we scrub. If they had to have a certificate out would go all the work tops for stainless steel, all wooden chopping boards etc for coloured coded ones, even knives have to be colour coded in a lot of establishments. It would make our lovely cosy homes very clinical and to me that would be a big shame as there would be no individuality.....Ruby thought they had to have a hygiene certificate for that. I wouldnt want my wedding cake baked by someone without a certificate"
One of my friends makes cakes from home, she made my daughters wedding cake and my Christmas cakes every year. Don't know if she has a certificate or not, never asked.
I've eaten at her house and she's meticulously clean. Outside of a reputable shop I wouldn't buy anything to eat from people I don't know.
Never ate or let my kids eat school fete cakes as the woman who baked them had dogs. I saw the filthy bitch sharing an ice cream with her dog, wouldn't eat anything she touched! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"This is ridiculous! The school I work for ask the parents to bake cakes for school fairs. Ive never heard any reports of people being unwell through them either. Actually, when they walk past me with them, they look lush (im the local lollipop lady).
Surprised schools allow that, they are some if the worse for quoting H&S these days"
we had summer fair recently,noone has been off sick. Also, my other job is a catering assistant, have food hygiene cert, work in a properly equipped school kitchen, so know all the loopholes. the parents that bake the cakes have lovely clean homes |
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A Basic Food Hygiene Certificate that you can qualify for online won't matter a hoot if you get a home visit from a local authority though, they are less concerned about your personal hygiene knowledge, and more interested in the state of the kitchen.
"
this bit is not entirely correct.
a basic food hygiene certificate is not just about personal hygiene, it goes into food temperatures for serving/delivered..cross contamination and so on.
we get a visit from the health authority every 2 years (5 stars) one of the first things checked is the paperwork, i.e. the food safety management pack, record of fridge/freezer temps, record of food delivered/cooked. and that everyones basic food hygiene certificate is up to date and renewed every two years, if we have a new member of staff with no certificate, we have to tell them when they have done the exam and they call back and check. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"
A Basic Food Hygiene Certificate that you can qualify for online won't matter a hoot if you get a home visit from a local authority though, they are less concerned about your personal hygiene knowledge, and more interested in the state of the kitchen.
this bit is not entirely correct.
a basic food hygiene certificate is not just about personal hygiene, it goes into food temperatures for serving/delivered..cross contamination and so on.
we get a visit from the health authority every 2 years (5 stars) one of the first things checked is the paperwork, i.e. the food safety management pack, record of fridge/freezer temps, record of food delivered/cooked. and that everyones basic food hygiene certificate is up to date and renewed every two years, if we have a new member of staff with no certificate, we have to tell them when they have done the exam and they call back and check."
this is same in our kitchen. we have exams and refreshers every 2 years, ditto re certificate - ours got 5 stars too.. well done to your place - they aren't easy to get |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I think if you're going to sell them you need some kind of protection, but if you're giving them away then no problem. It also depends on the local council. Some will be strict, some will assume fairy cakes are slightly safer than homebrew.
All it will do is force parents to buy shop bought ones to re-sell, so they can see the packaging... Ruby "
That's already happening, you can't sell homemade for profit, can get round it by doing a raffle but you need a gambling license from the LA at a cost of £20 per annum . Bonkers!  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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This is pure BS all schools have public liability insurance which I am sure would cover any unexpected accidents which were not as a result of food cooked in the kitchen by the kitchen staff who will of course have a health and safety certificate. It is up to the individual school to use descretion in this type o situation, after working in education for the last ten years I've never heard of anything so ridiculous and if I was the parent I would write to the chair of the board of governors and raise the issue. |
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"This is ridiculous! The school I work for ask the parents to bake cakes for school fairs. Ive never heard any reports of people being unwell through them either. Actually, when they walk past me with them, they look lush (im the local lollipop lady).
Surprised schools allow that, they are some if the worse for quoting H&S these dayswe had summer fair recently,noone has been off sick. Also, my other job is a catering assistant, have food hygiene cert, work in a properly equipped school kitchen, so know all the loopholes. the parents that bake the cakes have lovely clean homes"
You've been to all of them then have you???
And just because np one has been ill it doesn't mean there isn't the potential for them to be. Kitchens in homes could have pet hair around, do they have warnings for food allergies etc?!!
I agree that forcing parents to buy cakes is madness and I think it's a case of over zealous policy makers etc intros instance but there are reasons for people who sell items made at home to have these certificates. |
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You misunderstood me, I never meant 'Personal' hygiene as in smelly armpits or sweaty bollocks, I meant an individuals personal knowledge of food hygiene.
Oh, and it's not 'Stars', they don't use stars, they use a Zero to Five rating.
Zero: Urgent Improvement Necessary
One: Major Improvement Necessary
Two: Improvement Necessary
Three: Generally Satisfactory
Four: Good
Five: Very Good
Regarding it being 'bollocks' with reference to Public Liability Insurance, it's actually Product Liability Insurance regarding food stuffs that are produced for selling to the general public.
All food manufacturers/producers will have Public Liability Insurance
AND Product Liability Insurance if they have half a brain...or they won't be covered in event of a lawsuit. |
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"You misunderstood me, I never meant 'Personal' hygiene as in smelly armpits or sweaty bollocks, I meant an individuals personal knowledge of food hygiene.
Oh, and it's not 'Stars', they don't use stars, they use a Zero to Five rating.
Zero: Urgent Improvement Necessary
One: Major Improvement Necessary
Two: Improvement Necessary
Three: Generally Satisfactory
Four: Good
Five: Very Good
Regarding it being 'bollocks' with reference to Public Liability Insurance, it's actually Product Liability Insurance regarding food stuffs that are produced for selling to the general public.
All food manufacturers/producers will have Public Liability Insurance
AND Product Liability Insurance if they have half a brain...or they won't be covered in event of a lawsuit."
yes, they are numbered one to five now, but the lady who comes to us has never checked my bollox yet am i missing out |
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