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Hamlet's Ghost
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What better day to bring him into play?
Three things always struck me about it, in the play.
1) It's first seen by two tough, hard-nosed soldiers. Guards of the castle entrance. Such people aren't chosen to guard if they're easily scared.
2) It's then seen, and verified, by the arch-rationalist scholar Horatio. The "new man", piercing beyond superstition into the world of science and thought. For any scientists reading now, have a look at the recent work appearing to show photons appearing before they're sent*. "Horatio" also translates as "Time". Clever stuff Will, very clever ✅️.
3) The ghost is seen a third occasion - Horatio, Hamlet, the guards.
So, good people - what do you think Shakespeare was telling us? I mean, he always tells us loads of things in any one sentence. That's part of his genius that we still struggle to understand, and why he's great.
But there are more things "real" than exist in any of our current, or past philosophies.
Enjoy your ghouls, even though they're not what we think they are 😘😘.
*https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/evidence-of-negative-time-found-in-quantum-physics-experiment/ |
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By *eliWoman 19 hours ago
. |
Oh Nicky. Nicky, Nicky, Nicky.
This is the stuff my wet dreams are made of. But if I comment on this my shagability factor will probably decrease because I'm going to dork out so hard. I don't know if I give enough of a fuck if it does. I'll ponder the question and shagability and come back to this thread. |
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"Did Shakespeare ever live in London or a Hamlet of London ?"
Shakespeare did, and Hamlet is technically a Dane, but an amalgam of real people and imagination (including Shakespeare's son Hammet who died a couple of years before the play was written, and may well be part of Shakespeare's thoughts about death in the play).
But, my good friend and Lounge co-conspirator - I feel there's another question (or statement) behind your question here?
I'm keen to know where your thoughts are going on it if you can share? |
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"Oh Nicky. Nicky, Nicky, Nicky.
This is the stuff my wet dreams are made of. But if I comment on this my shagability factor will probably decrease because I'm going to dork out so hard. I don't know if I give enough of a fuck if it does. I'll ponder the question and shagability and come back to this thread. "
I look forward to it Meli. |
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"Did Shakespeare ever live in London or a Hamlet of London ?
Shakespeare did, and Hamlet is technically a Dane, but an amalgam of real people and imagination (including Shakespeare's son Hammet who died a couple of years before the play was written, and may well be part of Shakespeare's thoughts about death in the play).
But, my good friend and Lounge co-conspirator - I feel there's another question (or statement) behind your question here?
I'm keen to know where your thoughts are going on it if you can share?"
*son Hamnet, not Hammet. Too much ham going on here 🙃🙃🙃. |
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By *8on33Man 19 hours ago
winfrith |
"Did Shakespeare ever live in London or a Hamlet of London ?
Shakespeare did, and Hamlet is technically a Dane, but an amalgam of real people and imagination (including Shakespeare's son Hammet who died a couple of years before the play was written, and may well be part of Shakespeare's thoughts about death in the play).
But, my good friend and Lounge co-conspirator - I feel there's another question (or statement) behind your question here?
I'm keen to know where your thoughts are going on it if you can share?"
Shakespeare hailed from Stratford upon Avon a horse a horse my kingdom for a horse . |
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"Did Shakespeare ever live in London or a Hamlet of London ?
Shakespeare did, and Hamlet is technically a Dane, but an amalgam of real people and imagination (including Shakespeare's son Hammet who died a couple of years before the play was written, and may well be part of Shakespeare's thoughts about death in the play).
But, my good friend and Lounge co-conspirator - I feel there's another question (or statement) behind your question here?
I'm keen to know where your thoughts are going on it if you can share?Shakespeare hailed from Stratford upon Avon a horse a horse my kingdom for a horse ."
That's the one. And moved to London for around 30 years as a young man. |
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"They had a question about the ghost in hamlet at a Halloween pub quiz I did last night. Weird. In might read the play, feels like the universe is telling me to."
Ooohh..I'd bet a couple of quid the universe is doing that for you, especially as one of my favourite quotations is Hamlet, to Horatio:
“There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy”
That's Hamlet, questioning the structure of reality, to "Time" itself (if you read Horatio the scholar as a metaphor for Time, and the unfurling of knowledge through Time's passage. Which is my favourite way of reading the play).
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"Ahhh my Noble Lord Hamlet. Takes me back to my A Level English Literature course.
Easily one of the best works by Shakespeare and a gripping tale of tragedy and a very moral tale."
Interestingly, the head of our English Department was a Mr Teague....
And yup - wot you said. |
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For any total Hamlet nerds out there, if you ever get the chance for Branagh's "Eternity Version" (1996) - 4.5 hours, plus a few hours of behind the scenes stuff if you want it - it's beautifully filmed, acted, directed, paced (one over the top bit that lasts about two minutes...but I'll forgive him that), and extremely faithful to the text (well, there are several original texts, and this uses them intelligently).
I'll stop being a dork now  .
Knob cheese and bumpussies are on their way on other threads - I promise 😘. |
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By *8on33Man 18 hours ago
winfrith |
"Did Shakespeare ever live in London or a Hamlet of London ?
Shakespeare did, and Hamlet is technically a Dane, but an amalgam of real people and imagination (including Shakespeare's son Hammet who died a couple of years before the play was written, and may well be part of Shakespeare's thoughts about death in the play).
But, my good friend and Lounge co-conspirator - I feel there's another question (or statement) behind your question here?
I'm keen to know where your thoughts are going on it if you can share?Shakespeare hailed from Stratford upon Avon a horse a horse my kingdom for a horse .
That's the one. And moved to London for around 30 years as a young man."
Guess he had to for the Thee ate her |
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Before the world knew women could have ADHD, and when having been diagnosed dyslexic at 7 there were no reasonable adjustments or other impact to support my education, I did hamlet at A level.
My English teacher told me that unless I learnt to spell I’d never get an A (supportive), but I actually did some work on this play, writing copious notes, colour coding quotes for themes. And then in the exam it asked me a question I had no answer for, none what so ever. It’s the only exam question I’ve ever been unable to answer at all.
I got a B but fuck knows how, I didn’t even read two of the other texts (Frankenstein and Great Expectations). So I guess the less work I do on a book the better I answer it?
Fuck Hamlet, the guy was a drip and a bully. |
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"Did Shakespeare ever live in London or a Hamlet of London ?
Shakespeare did, and Hamlet is technically a Dane, but an amalgam of real people and imagination (including Shakespeare's son Hammet who died a couple of years before the play was written, and may well be part of Shakespeare's thoughts about death in the play).
But, my good friend and Lounge co-conspirator - I feel there's another question (or statement) behind your question here?
I'm keen to know where your thoughts are going on it if you can share?Shakespeare hailed from Stratford upon Avon a horse a horse my kingdom for a horse .
That's the one. And moved to London for around 30 years as a young man.Guess he had to for the Thee ate her "
Exactly. Most acting troupes were mobile, setting up a stage as they travelled the regions. Fixed location theatres were a very rare thing in the late 1500s, London's Southbank area being an early example around the time Shakespeare arrived.
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"Did Shakespeare ever live in London or a Hamlet of London ?
Shakespeare did, and Hamlet is technically a Dane, but an amalgam of real people and imagination (including Shakespeare's son Hammet who died a couple of years before the play was written, and may well be part of Shakespeare's thoughts about death in the play).
But, my good friend and Lounge co-conspirator - I feel there's another question (or statement) behind your question here?
I'm keen to know where your thoughts are going on it if you can share?
*son Hamnet, not Hammet. Too much ham going on here 🙃🙃🙃."
I *think* I remember hearing that a lady called Hamlet had drowned in Shakespeare’s village the year before and that she could have lent her name and also the unfortunate manner of death to the play (pretty sure I heard that on ‘you’re dead to me’ if anyone fancies checking) |
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By *8on33Man 18 hours ago
winfrith |
"Did Shakespeare ever live in London or a Hamlet of London ?
Shakespeare did, and Hamlet is technically a Dane, but an amalgam of real people and imagination (including Shakespeare's son Hammet who died a couple of years before the play was written, and may well be part of Shakespeare's thoughts about death in the play).
But, my good friend and Lounge co-conspirator - I feel there's another question (or statement) behind your question here?
I'm keen to know where your thoughts are going on it if you can share?Shakespeare hailed from Stratford upon Avon a horse a horse my kingdom for a horse .
That's the one. And moved to London for around 30 years as a young man.Guess he had to for the Thee ate her
Exactly. Most acting troupes were mobile, setting up a stage as they travelled the regions. Fixed location theatres were a very rare thing in the late 1500s, London's Southbank area being an early example around the time Shakespeare arrived.
"
The theater royal Drury lane for example. |
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"Did Shakespeare ever live in London or a Hamlet of London ?
Shakespeare did, and Hamlet is technically a Dane, but an amalgam of real people and imagination (including Shakespeare's son Hammet who died a couple of years before the play was written, and may well be part of Shakespeare's thoughts about death in the play).
But, my good friend and Lounge co-conspirator - I feel there's another question (or statement) behind your question here?
I'm keen to know where your thoughts are going on it if you can share?Shakespeare hailed from Stratford upon Avon a horse a horse my kingdom for a horse .
That's the one. And moved to London for around 30 years as a young man.Guess he had to for the Thee ate her
Exactly. Most acting troupes were mobile, setting up a stage as they travelled the regions. Fixed location theatres were a very rare thing in the late 1500s, London's Southbank area being an early example around the time Shakespeare arrived.
The theater royal Drury lane for example. "
The original one on that site was about 50 years after Shakesepare died (the current one about 200 years after). But, without checking, I think The Rose was the first, and The Globe the second or third to open just before/during Shakespeare's life. |
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"Did Shakespeare ever live in London or a Hamlet of London ?
Shakespeare did, and Hamlet is technically a Dane, but an amalgam of real people and imagination (including Shakespeare's son Hammet who died a couple of years before the play was written, and may well be part of Shakespeare's thoughts about death in the play).
But, my good friend and Lounge co-conspirator - I feel there's another question (or statement) behind your question here?
I'm keen to know where your thoughts are going on it if you can share?
*son Hamnet, not Hammet. Too much ham going on here 🙃🙃🙃.
I *think* I remember hearing that a lady called Hamlet had drowned in Shakespeare’s village the year before and that she could have lent her name and also the unfortunate manner of death to the play (pretty sure I heard that on ‘you’re dead to me’ if anyone fancies checking) "
Thank you - I'd not heard that. |
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By *8on33Man 18 hours ago
winfrith |
"Did Shakespeare ever live in London or a Hamlet of London ?
Shakespeare did, and Hamlet is technically a Dane, but an amalgam of real people and imagination (including Shakespeare's son Hammet who died a couple of years before the play was written, and may well be part of Shakespeare's thoughts about death in the play).
But, my good friend and Lounge co-conspirator - I feel there's another question (or statement) behind your question here?
I'm keen to know where your thoughts are going on it if you can share?Shakespeare hailed from Stratford upon Avon a horse a horse my kingdom for a horse .
That's the one. And moved to London for around 30 years as a young man.Guess he had to for the Thee ate her
Exactly. Most acting troupes were mobile, setting up a stage as they travelled the regions. Fixed location theatres were a very rare thing in the late 1500s, London's Southbank area being an early example around the time Shakespeare arrived.
The theater royal Drury lane for example.
The original one on that site was about 50 years after Shakesepare died (the current one about 200 years after). But, without checking, I think The Rose was the first, and The Globe the second or third to open just before/during Shakespeare's life."
1600s I think . |
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By *8on33Man 17 hours ago
winfrith |
"Did Shakespeare ever live in London or a Hamlet of London ?
Shakespeare did, and Hamlet is technically a Dane, but an amalgam of real people and imagination (including Shakespeare's son Hammet who died a couple of years before the play was written, and may well be part of Shakespeare's thoughts about death in the play).
But, my good friend and Lounge co-conspirator - I feel there's another question (or statement) behind your question here?
I'm keen to know where your thoughts are going on it if you can share?Shakespeare hailed from Stratford upon Avon a horse a horse my kingdom for a horse .
That's the one. And moved to London for around 30 years as a young man.Guess he had to for the Thee ate her
Exactly. Most acting troupes were mobile, setting up a stage as they travelled the regions. Fixed location theatres were a very rare thing in the late 1500s, London's Southbank area being an early example around the time Shakespeare arrived.
The theater royal Drury lane for example.
The original one on that site was about 50 years after Shakesepare died (the current one about 200 years after). But, without checking, I think The Rose was the first, and The Globe the second or third to open just before/during Shakespeare's life.1600s I think ."
ah yes William died 1616 so I guess although his plays may have been performed there he wasn't also poor Yorick I knew him well . |
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By *8on33Man 17 hours ago
winfrith |
"Did Shakespeare ever live in London or a Hamlet of London ?
Shakespeare did, and Hamlet is technically a Dane, but an amalgam of real people and imagination (including Shakespeare's son Hammet who died a couple of years before the play was written, and may well be part of Shakespeare's thoughts about death in the play).
But, my good friend and Lounge co-conspirator - I feel there's another question (or statement) behind your question here?
I'm keen to know where your thoughts are going on it if you can share?Shakespeare hailed from Stratford upon Avon a horse a horse my kingdom for a horse .
That's the one. And moved to London for around 30 years as a young man.Guess he had to for the Thee ate her
Exactly. Most acting troupes were mobile, setting up a stage as they travelled the regions. Fixed location theatres were a very rare thing in the late 1500s, London's Southbank area being an early example around the time Shakespeare arrived.
The theater royal Drury lane for example.
The original one on that site was about 50 years after Shakesepare died (the current one about 200 years after). But, without checking, I think The Rose was the first, and The Globe the second or third to open just before/during Shakespeare's life.1600s I think .ah yes William died 1616 so I guess although his plays may have been performed there he wasn't also poor Yorick I knew him well ."
Alas not also bloody spellcheck |
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"Did Shakespeare ever live in London or a Hamlet of London ?
Shakespeare did, and Hamlet is technically a Dane, but an amalgam of real people and imagination (including Shakespeare's son Hammet who died a couple of years before the play was written, and may well be part of Shakespeare's thoughts about death in the play).
But, my good friend and Lounge co-conspirator - I feel there's another question (or statement) behind your question here?
I'm keen to know where your thoughts are going on it if you can share?Shakespeare hailed from Stratford upon Avon a horse a horse my kingdom for a horse .
That's the one. And moved to London for around 30 years as a young man.Guess he had to for the Thee ate her
Exactly. Most acting troupes were mobile, setting up a stage as they travelled the regions. Fixed location theatres were a very rare thing in the late 1500s, London's Southbank area being an early example around the time Shakespeare arrived.
The theater royal Drury lane for example.
The original one on that site was about 50 years after Shakesepare died (the current one about 200 years after). But, without checking, I think The Rose was the first, and The Globe the second or third to open just before/during Shakespeare's life.1600s I think .ah yes William died 1616 so I guess although his plays may have been performed there he wasn't also poor Yorick I knew him well ."
The Branagh film I mentioned has a brilliant scene with Billy Crystal around the whole Yorick speech - great movie (bloody long though  ). |
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"Did Shakespeare ever live in London or a Hamlet of London ?
Shakespeare did, and Hamlet is technically a Dane, but an amalgam of real people and imagination (including Shakespeare's son Hammet who died a couple of years before the play was written, and may well be part of Shakespeare's thoughts about death in the play).
But, my good friend and Lounge co-conspirator - I feel there's another question (or statement) behind your question here?
I'm keen to know where your thoughts are going on it if you can share?Shakespeare hailed from Stratford upon Avon a horse a horse my kingdom for a horse .
That's the one. And moved to London for around 30 years as a young man.Guess he had to for the Thee ate her
Exactly. Most acting troupes were mobile, setting up a stage as they travelled the regions. Fixed location theatres were a very rare thing in the late 1500s, London's Southbank area being an early example around the time Shakespeare arrived.
The theater royal Drury lane for example.
The original one on that site was about 50 years after Shakesepare died (the current one about 200 years after). But, without checking, I think The Rose was the first, and The Globe the second or third to open just before/during Shakespeare's life.1600s I think .ah yes William died 1616 so I guess although his plays may have been performed there he wasn't also poor Yorick I knew him well .
The Branagh film I mentioned has a brilliant scene with Billy Crystal around the whole Yorick speech - great movie (bloody long though )."
Speaking of that Ken, in case you’d be interested iplayer has his film about the latter days of Shakespeares life atm. It’s beautiful, obviously, but a bit “worthy”. Judi Dench is in it, she’s excellent 👌 |
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"Did Shakespeare ever live in London or a Hamlet of London ?
Shakespeare did, and Hamlet is technically a Dane, but an amalgam of real people and imagination (including Shakespeare's son Hammet who died a couple of years before the play was written, and may well be part of Shakespeare's thoughts about death in the play).
But, my good friend and Lounge co-conspirator - I feel there's another question (or statement) behind your question here?
I'm keen to know where your thoughts are going on it if you can share?Shakespeare hailed from Stratford upon Avon a horse a horse my kingdom for a horse .
That's the one. And moved to London for around 30 years as a young man.Guess he had to for the Thee ate her
Exactly. Most acting troupes were mobile, setting up a stage as they travelled the regions. Fixed location theatres were a very rare thing in the late 1500s, London's Southbank area being an early example around the time Shakespeare arrived.
The theater royal Drury lane for example.
The original one on that site was about 50 years after Shakesepare died (the current one about 200 years after). But, without checking, I think The Rose was the first, and The Globe the second or third to open just before/during Shakespeare's life.1600s I think .ah yes William died 1616 so I guess although his plays may have been performed there he wasn't also poor Yorick I knew him well .
The Branagh film I mentioned has a brilliant scene with Billy Crystal around the whole Yorick speech - great movie (bloody long though ).
Speaking of that Ken, in case you’d be interested iplayer has his film about the latter days of Shakespeares life atm. It’s beautiful, obviously, but a bit “worthy”. Judi Dench is in it, she’s excellent 👌 "
I'm having a quick peruse between things - quite gritty and critical of Puritan England (jeez we became boring as fuck around that time). Good call  xx |
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"Hamlet’s tale is such a sad waste of good dick because he didn’t understand Halloween
Puck? Puck?
Is that you Puck, or is it Kit Marlowe?
Quality thread sabotage - I approve "
All I am saying is we mustn’t forget to address Shakespeare’s hidden sexual urges and perversions |
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"Hamlet’s tale is such a sad waste of good dick because he didn’t understand Halloween
Puck? Puck?
Is that you Puck, or is it Kit Marlowe?
Quality thread sabotage - I approve
All I am saying is we mustn’t forget to address Shakespeare’s hidden sexual urges and perversions "
You said it well - and the less Shakespeare is "The Establishment" the happier I am. The thread is suggesting something about knowledge and dimensions being unbound by "Time" - and I think that's deliberate from Will. Abortion is hovering around Ophelia, there's Oedipus in there, Marx Was inspired by this play. It's subversive and challenging to so many aspects of the proto-bourgeois prudishness developing around the 1600s.
So fill your boots - anything ripping apart the wrong idea that Shakespeare was dull is welcome here.
I'm on a psychic (witch, in the language of that era) quantum Rosicrucian alchemical drive with my bit, and love seeing other bits brought in. Ontology (hauntology?) and epistemology are clashed together in the "To be" lines. Hamlet would be in great company with 20th Century Existentialism and Absurdism, so genuinely - please - bring anything you want to this.
It's welcome.
Great username by the way. |
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"Do you know Rosencrantz and Guildenstern are dead? That's a real mind fuck."
I know Beckett a bit better than Stoppard, but see Shakespeare, Laurence Sterne (Tristram Shandy author), Beckett and Stoppard having similar absurd, existential, even postmodern themes. Slight digression, but Sterne's Shandy (1750s?) is wildly ahead of its time, and a lot of people now see it as the first postmodern novel, almost 200 years before that was even a thing.
Anyway...I digress (as does Tristram Shandy ).
Yeah - R and G are dead/Stoppard is a headfuck, but so is Hamlet, and each adds to the other.
It's difficult to describe with Hamlet (and very specifically Hamlet) - once it gets into your skin (like it did with Marx, Freud, Branagh, Kurt Vonnegut and plenty besides me), the world is always a different place after. It feels different. That ghost is part of a stronger and more real world, which you know you can get close to describing, but it doesn't use this language of four dimensions and standard time. It's a new language that's glimpsed in unusual fragments, but it's a parent language to ours, not a growth from it. And it's an extra skin you can feel around you.
xxxx |
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"Before the world knew women could have ADHD, and when having been diagnosed dyslexic at 7 there were no reasonable adjustments or other impact to support my education, I did hamlet at A level.
My English teacher told me that unless I learnt to spell I’d never get an A (supportive), but I actually did some work on this play, writing copious notes, colour coding quotes for themes. And then in the exam it asked me a question I had no answer for, none what so ever. It’s the only exam question I’ve ever been unable to answer at all.
I got a B but fuck knows how, I didn’t even read two of the other texts (Frankenstein and Great Expectations). So I guess the less work I do on a book the better I answer it?
Fuck Hamlet, the guy was a drip and a bully. "
Sorry - I missed this comment earlier. I wonder if that question you'd never seen before has appeared in any of the themes on this thread?
And Hamlet was a drip and a bully, and a loyal, charismatic friend and hero, and a million other contradictory things.
And then even more things no one can work out, but it's there...pressing on you xx |
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"Speaking of that Ken, in case you’d be interested iplayer has his film about the latter days of Shakespeares life atm. It’s beautiful, obviously, but a bit “worthy”. Judi Dench is in it, she’s excellent 👌 "
You're right Trixie. That's quite some movie. Thank you so much for the pointer.
You could watch it alongside a lot of the plays and say "ah yes - that scene has got Hamlet behind it, or Taming Of The Shrew, or As You Like It", and so on. Cleverly woven.
And it's bloody sad, but "full".
It really made my evening xxxx |
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