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Does prison reform
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By *usie p OP TV/TS 41 weeks ago
taunton |
That poor woman on the news this morning, her former partner was locked away for several years for holding her hostage for eight hours at gun point, there is cctv of him holding a 12 bore shotgun to her chest, had been abusing her mentally for years, I don't think he should ever be free to walk the streets again he surely had to mentally ill to do this and has a spell in prison cured him, I very much doubt it, may have even made him worse. She is going to have to live the rest of her life in fear. |
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Considering he was deemed to not be safe to be out in public, I feel sorry for this poor Woman.
They kept going on about preventative measures but that sounds like someone has to get hurt first before he'll be recalled. x |
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Depends on the crime. It’s difficult because in that sense his thread to the general public might be low but to the victim it’s off the scale. Especially given the time behind bars to build additional resentment |
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By *hoirCouple 41 weeks ago
Clacton/Bury St. Edmunds |
"That poor woman on the news this morning, her former partner was locked away for several years for holding her hostage for eight hours at gun point, there is cctv of him holding a 12 bore shotgun to her chest, had been abusing her mentally for years, I don't think he should ever be free to walk the streets again he surely had to mentally ill to do this and has a spell in prison cured him, I very much doubt it, may have even made him worse. She is going to have to live the rest of her life in fear."
I'm a great believer in rehabilitation in prison but our system is set up to make sure offenders fail time and again as they make money on it happening.
I don't believe anyone should be told they will die behind bars as release is a carrot that can be dangled to bribe people.
C |
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"That poor woman on the news this morning, her former partner was locked away for several years for holding her hostage for eight hours at gun point, there is cctv of him holding a 12 bore shotgun to her chest, had been abusing her mentally for years, I don't think he should ever be free to walk the streets again he surely had to mentally ill to do this and has a spell in prison cured him, I very much doubt it, may have even made him worse. She is going to have to live the rest of her life in fear.
I'm a great believer in rehabilitation in prison but our system is set up to make sure offenders fail time and again as they make money on it happening.
I don't believe anyone should be told they will die behind bars as release is a carrot that can be dangled to bribe people.
C"
See I disagree with murderers they should be told crystal clear they will never leave and see the outside world again functionally.
Then saying that life doesn’t actually been life in UK .
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And that awful minister trying to look sincere. Felt uncomfortable watching her act . And her curn out the usual dribble we've increased funding. By the way not a attack on a political party just felt she was so insincere. Good luck to the poor lady . |
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It's not a simple question.
Locking someone in a room won't reform them.
You need to fund various programmes to train and rehabilitate prisoners like they do in Nordic countries where they're actually closing prisons due to low numbers of prisoners.
It fundamentally comes down to what you want prison to actually do. Punish or reform. The UK government has chosen to focus on punish because it looks cheaper but now they're having to build new prisons (20000 new prison places being built right now) to hold everyone, most of whom are reoffenders or are remanded in custody awaiting trial.
Prison is just one part of the criminal justice system, and the whole system is broken, so it's hardly surprising things don't work. You get what you pay for. |
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By (user no longer on site) 41 weeks ago
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Should do what America does, make them work and use them as a cheap form of labour. Either that or bring back the bloody code and just euthanize them after the third custodial sentencing. |
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Depends on how you view prisons but people like him shouldn't be allowed to roam the streets as he has some mental health issues and prison isn't and has never been a place to treat mental health issues but has been used more and more to do so in the last few years as all the cuts to mental health care provision has been cut to the bone but keep on doing the same things over and over again expecting differents results ?? and those in charge know full well that it's a easy card to play and gets everyone living in fear ( mainly those in low crime area's or those who have never experienced a serious crime ironically ) and so the lock em up throw away the key argument wins ? but now crime is even effecting the leafy suburbs and moving out to the countryside where they fled ?? and no easy answers to any of it to be honest !! so don't believe the next politicians offering them and there are direct links to poverty etc etc with attacks on shop staff and shoplifting having a massive increase an this all happening under the party of law and order ?? add the record low in numbers of police ? the probation service sold off then not and now on the brink of collapse add the near collaspe in any kind of social service provision non existent or stretched to breaking point ??? homeless numbers up ?? all these play into it ? |
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By *inaTitzTV/TS 41 weeks ago
Titz Towers, North Notts |
"We're more interested in punishment than reform. Prison populations are a reflection of how much society is failing. High populations show a badly managed society."
And at an average cost of £40,000 per inmate, per year, possibly not even the most cost effective measure, either. |
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"We're more interested in punishment than reform. Prison populations are a reflection of how much society is failing. High populations show a badly managed society.
And at an average cost of £40,000 per inmate, per year, possibly not even the most cost effective measure, either. "
Prevention offers huge savings but people are generally too mean spirited make it politically relevant |
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Rehabilitation does not work, in the main, in prison.
The majority of prisoners come from poor, ill educated backgrounds and look to crime to 'escape" poverty and view a life of criminality as the only way to achieve this.
Unless society is fixed, then releasing anyone back into this kind of environment will ultimately fail to prevent a return to crime.
Instead of putting resources into rehabilitation it would be better spent on providing opportunities, for employment, decent housing, education and a humane welfare system.
Prison works by keeping the tiny numbers of offenders away from the rest of society. It's no good trying to rehabilitate individuals if the system sets them up to fail upon release.
Mrs x |
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"We're more interested in punishment than reform. Prison populations are a reflection of how much society is failing. High populations show a badly managed society."
Badly managed society generally for sure.
Comparisons with Nordic countries isn't helpful though (which invariably occur in these threads). They have low prison populations but that's due to the fact there's more in the way of social cohesion, social mobility and in terms of the happiness index always features highly (if not the highest). I'm not sure how much this is to do with rehabilitation per se. Here prison populations are symptomatic of a discontented and poorly managed society generally. |
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I read something that said they are three types of violent criminals & killers. They are either mad bad or sad.
Unfortunately only the third category can ever be reformed, No one has any answers for the first two categories which is why in a lot of countries they put them away for decades not years often forever or punish them so badly they are so scared of the consequences of offending again , or even just make them disappear.
How is prison punishment when so many chose 5 or even 10 for those boss knowing they will be out in 3 and promoted |
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"We're more interested in punishment than reform. Prison populations are a reflection of how much society is failing. High populations show a badly managed society.
Badly managed society generally for sure.
Comparisons with Nordic countries isn't helpful though (which invariably occur in these threads). They have low prison populations but that's due to the fact there's more in the way of social cohesion, social mobility and in terms of the happiness index always features highly (if not the highest). I'm not sure how much this is to do with rehabilitation per se. Here prison populations are symptomatic of a discontented and poorly managed society generally. "
Your point about Nordic penal systems and rehabilitation being a poor comparison against the UK system is very valid.
Norway's prisons are upheld as the shining light of prison rehabilitation, with the lowest numbers of reoffenders.
However this is probably because Norway has the highest GNI per capita of all European states. The UK isnt even in the top ten in Europe. Norway obviously value their citizens and give them much better opportunities outside of prison.
When you incentivise people to be valued, contributing members of society, with great opportunities and a nice standard of living, you remove the need to look to nefarious activities to fund your needs. That just seems like common sense.
Mrs x |
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While we send people who don’t pay Tv licence or Council Tax to prison we won’t have reform in prison.
Overfilled with minor offences meaning serious offenders have to be released too due to overcrowding.
Simple solution, no prison sentences less than 12 months should be issued. If it’s a serious enough crime for prison then make it long enough that something can be achieved whilst in there.
For others who are committing other minor offences who are not a threat to public safety find other ways for them to repay their debt and rehabilitate especially if drug/drink related criminality. |
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In my experience of being incarcerated a few times, Prison never offered any form of rehabilitation.
Rehabilitation comes out of a needs to want to change your behaviour, if someone isint willing to do that, no amount of rehabilitation will.work anyway
And if they do there is no obligation for the prisoners to attend any form of rehabilitation group.
Mr |
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By (user no longer on site) 41 weeks ago
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I think it very much depends on the individual, their circumstances, support etc. Some will have that realisation they want to change the direction their life is heading or continue to live that life on the outside.
Whilst inside it may be very difficult to be able to change due to the people around them and the persona they have to wear to survive in order to make life easier.
I don't think our prison service or even our whole system in general provides a decent base to reform the people on the edge let alone properly support the people that do.
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For me a prison sentence has three functions
Punishment
Reform/rehabilitation
Public Protection
Reform is the part that is failing prisoners. We just don't spend enough. Some countries get this but it's not just a problem with the prison service it's a cultural one as well. I think someone above mentioned that offenders find it difficult to gain employment again. As a society do you think we forgive and trust ex-prisoners?
The reform and rehabilitation side is probably the most important part of a prison sentence if we really want a safer society.
I think like all public services are under funded and the prison service serverly so. |
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"Should do what America does, make them work and use them as a cheap form of labour. Either that or bring back the bloody code and just euthanize them after the third custodial sentencing."
Could you imagine the outrage?
All the Gammons are already convinced that immigrants are coming over here and taking their jobs for low pay. What about when the prisoners start doing their jobs for almost nothing! |
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"Should do what America does, make them work and use them as a cheap form of labour. Either that or bring back the bloody code and just euthanize them after the third custodial sentencing."
They do make them work, just not out on chain gangs for people to gawp at like some freak show.
Every prison has purposeful activity targets that are monitored and the have to defend their performance against these targets at very high levels. |
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Problem is there is not enough support in prisons for the reform practice to be continued, lack of staffing at PO level means the initial support stage is often overlooked so people don't get referred properly. Because a lot of transfers happen as well often support given in one prison is not offered in another. Now prisons can't cope prisoners are being released early to make space often being rushed through. |
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Prison does fuck all apart from take time away from you! People will change when they want to, when they feel it's time to grow up.
Not when someone says they have to come on this is the real world if someone tells you. For example don't be out all night do as you're told!! People will do what they want and will change when they want to. prison is a joke they don't help people. They don't give a fuck and if you people think different then you are deluded. As I speak from experience they don't help or change people. Only you can change when you are ready not when you are told to |
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"Prison does fuck all apart from take time away from you! People will change when they want to, when they feel it's time to grow up.
Not when someone says they have to come on this is the real world if someone tells you. For example don't be out all night do as you're told!! People will do what they want and will change when they want to. prison is a joke they don't help people. They don't give a fuck and if you people think different then you are deluded. As I speak from experience they don't help or change people. Only you can change when you are ready not when you are told to "
I agree with this mate, except for prison taking time away, people give there time away through committing crime
Mr |
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"Prison does fuck all apart from take time away from you! People will change when they want to, when they feel it's time to grow up.
Not when someone says they have to come on this is the real world if someone tells you. For example don't be out all night do as you're told!! People will do what they want and will change when they want to. prison is a joke they don't help people. They don't give a fuck and if you people think different then you are deluded. As I speak from experience they don't help or change people. Only you can change when you are ready not when you are told to
I agree with this mate, except for prison taking time away, people give there time away through committing crime
Mr"
you are wright people do |
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Difficult one. Recidivism rates are high, the environment itself can breed more criminal activity and it's often overused when community-based rehabilitation might be a better option in the first instance. There's also a need for post-release support and better-quality programs.
I'm becoming a bit soft, but I think more needs to be done on the first and second strikes instead of the threat of prison |
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Don't think even the judiciary think it does. Their view is it's punishment, a deterrent but most of all it takes the individual of the streets for a period of time.
The most that happens inside to reform a person is you are offered courses relating to behaviour and offending, they arent compulsory, most will do it as it helps towards parole. But if you are doing under 4 years, parole isnt a worry as you won't need it, as automatic release is granted at 50% of the sentence. |
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"That poor woman on the news this morning, her former partner was locked away for several years for holding her hostage for eight hours at gun point, there is cctv of him holding a 12 bore shotgun to her chest, had been abusing her mentally for years, I don't think he should ever be free to walk the streets again he surely had to mentally ill to do this and has a spell in prison cured him, I very much doubt it, may have even made him worse. She is going to have to live the rest of her life in fear.
I'm a great believer in rehabilitation in prison but our system is set up to make sure offenders fail time and again as they make money on it happening.
I don't believe anyone should be told they will die behind bars as release is a carrot that can be dangled to bribe people.
C
See I disagree with murderers they should be told crystal clear they will never leave and see the outside world again functionally.
Then saying that life doesn’t actually been life in UK .
"
Similarly paedophiles and rapists |
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By (user no longer on site) 41 weeks ago
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Abu Dhabi and the uae as a whole offered no reform mind you most people that were there didn’t actually do any incarceration time anywhere else in the world. Depends on one’s mindset also |
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