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School absences
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Well here's a scary thought...
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-67893387
More than 1 in 5 school kids are absent from school since the lockdown with parents thinking full time school is no longer necessary... Building exellence for the future generations.
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Unfortunately the lockdown rather undermined the 100% attendance drive they were pushing.
That and the ridiculous increase in the cost of holidays in school holidays has made parents more inclined to withdraw their children for a few days.
Often the cost of the fine, if applied, is way less than the savings they are making.
Evie |
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Personally, in my case - I have an additional needs teenage "refusenik" at home.
The trauma of the school closures during lockdown is certainly a huge part of the reason she refuses to attend school on a regular basis now.
I prefer to support her in the little attendance she does agree to, than risk her taking another attempt on her life.
Until she's old enough to leave school and find something else she can do.
I know others in similar situations.
We've had some support through the system. Plenty who don't.
My heart goes out to those parents who are struggling with their children and school attendance, the lack of support from the system. I'm not surprised at the figures, if they are true.
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"Personally, in my case - I have an additional needs teenage "refusenik" at home.
The trauma of the school closures during lockdown is certainly a huge part of the reason she refuses to attend school on a regular basis now.
I prefer to support her in the little attendance she does agree to, than risk her taking another attempt on her life.
Until she's old enough to leave school and find something else she can do.
I know others in similar situations.
We've had some support through the system. Plenty who don't.
My heart goes out to those parents who are struggling with their children and school attendance, the lack of support from the system. I'm not surprised at the figures, if they are true.
"
Been here too xx Luckily we had a very supportive school but most don’t xx
J x |
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Is it parents thinking school isn't necessary? Or are there other factors going on? I don't see any data listed in the article as to why the children are absent - only speculation.
A listed related article says that children who get free meals and have special needs are affected three times as much as average, which might suggest a connection with deprivation and/ or more supports needed.
I'd want to know why this is happening before I get mad. |
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By *a LunaWoman
over a year ago
South Wales |
Good lord! Lockdown made me realise the patience it must take to be a teacher. No fudging way I could ever homeschool again. Ever. It nearly broke me.
You’re either a Teacher or you’re not. And I’m not.
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By *neforutoMan
over a year ago
Fantasy land in the SW |
"Personally, in my case - I have an additional needs teenage "refusenik" at home.
The trauma of the school closures during lockdown is certainly a huge part of the reason she refuses to attend school on a regular basis now.
I prefer to support her in the little attendance she does agree to, than risk her taking another attempt on her life.
Until she's old enough to leave school and find something else she can do.
I know others in similar situations.
We've had some support through the system. Plenty who don't.
My heart goes out to those parents who are struggling with their children and school attendance, the lack of support from the system. I'm not surprised at the figures, if they are true.
Been here too xx Luckily we had a very supportive school but most don’t xx
J x"
Yup, know this one very well |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Give it a few generations & I predict most schooling will be done remotely via the internet, with teachers being replaced by AI. "
And robots look after kids needs while parents go to work to do the stuff AI can't do yet. Robots would cook the meals, and make sure the preteens are safe. Break times would involve kids getting into remotely driven vehicles to meet up with others in the park, and self regulate their hours to go back home to the AI interface. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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School isn't the be all and end all, and there is so much more to learn in life than what can ever be taught in schools.
Our daughter has left school not even knowing how to write a CV or a covering letter for a job, surely that should of been taught in schools, basic life skills and social skills should be taught.
Our son is wanting to leave now as the career he is wanting to go into... school does not help him. As he says, "what more is school going to teach me in the next couple of years that I don't already know how". He would be better of working in a paid job, ding what he loves.
Having said that, I do feel for a lot of children, that school 5 days a week is the best thing for them. |
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I guess it depends what people want from formal education and what parents and carers can provide.
20% of children aren't in regular school. Of that 20% I wonder how many are learning useful skills that will enable them to live a good life as adults. |
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"School isn't the be all and end all, and there is so much more to learn in life than what can ever be taught in schools.
Our daughter has left school not even knowing how to write a CV or a covering letter for a job, surely that should of been taught in schools, basic life skills and social skills should be taught.
Our son is wanting to leave now as the career he is wanting to go into... school does not help him. As he says, "what more is school going to teach me in the next couple of years that I don't already know how". He would be better of working in a paid job, ding what he loves.
Having said that, I do feel for a lot of children, that school 5 days a week is the best thing for them."
I don't think basic life and social skills should be taught in school. We'd end up with government regulated social skills set against league tables. The number of children starting school with no idea how to put their coat on or use cutlery is shocking. |
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By *lder.Woman
over a year ago
Not Local |
Schooling has lost its way. I will burst into flames if I have to describe the last few years for me and my children concerning schools. They were failed massively but we are nearly out the other side of the 'missing school is going to ruin your life' mantra, and surprise, surprise their life isnt ruined and looks pretty bright. |
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"School isn't the be all and end all, and there is so much more to learn in life than what can ever be taught in schools.
Our daughter has left school not even knowing how to write a CV or a covering letter for a job, surely that should of been taught in schools, basic life skills and social skills should be taught.
Our son is wanting to leave now as the career he is wanting to go into... school does not help him. As he says, "what more is school going to teach me in the next couple of years that I don't already know how". He would be better of working in a paid job, ding what he loves.
Having said that, I do feel for a lot of children, that school 5 days a week is the best thing for them.
I don't think basic life and social skills should be taught in school. We'd end up with government regulated social skills set against league tables. The number of children starting school with no idea how to put their coat on or use cutlery is shocking."
This, along with Children not toilet trained 
I work in a Nursery and we try to teach this stuff, basic table manners lacking, it's a mission getting them to sit at the table and the increase of "baby led weaning" makes it a lot harder to teach cutlery use, children don't have the dexterity or coordination for cutlery and coats.
Parents have a lot of support with toileting needs but they either don't want to deal with the mess or they solely expect us too. Which is fine, but it's not going to work if they don't carry on at home |
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I have skimmed through the thread so may have missed mention of it. Something I think is of value isn’t a subject like maths or a foreign language and cannot be ‘taught’ as such.
The need/ ability to conform to schedules, turn up on time with the appropriate equipment (ie completed homework).
To follow procedures that may no be palatable or convenient for you.
These things are all required an understanding of if you are going to get on in society or work in the ever increasing number of large corporate organisations.
I think not being in a school environment for many means they don’t appreciate the necessity of these things for a functioning society.
Everyone being an individual and doing what’s right for them is all very well but it doesn’t contribute to a successful society.
Just my thoughts, feel free to shoot them down.  |
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"School isn't the be all and end all, and there is so much more to learn in life than what can ever be taught in schools.
Our daughter has left school not even knowing how to write a CV or a covering letter for a job, surely that should of been taught in schools, basic life skills and social skills should be taught.
Our son is wanting to leave now as the career he is wanting to go into... school does not help him. As he says, "what more is school going to teach me in the next couple of years that I don't already know how". He would be better of working in a paid job, ding what he loves.
Having said that, I do feel for a lot of children, that school 5 days a week is the best thing for them."
In PSHE life skills are taught and is statutory. I would be amazed if your daughter wasn't taught how to write a cva t some point. Our students learn across several subjects including PSHE, English and Business. That being said there will always be pupils who have no recollection of doing so. Like in my own subject every year there are pupils answering the wrong questions in the exams booklet even though they've spent 2 years studying a text.
Life skills can be tricky. Listening to radio phone ins and whatnot it is clear often public perception is schools need to do more in terms of preparing pupils for adulthood. Realistically from having taught these subjects in many areas such as wages, taxation, budgeting ect, it seems too remote to them to matter. Their priority is passing exams because that's how success is measured in schools. Things that don't contribute to that are deemed unnecessary. I've had countless conversations with pupils who argue that lessons on consent, finance, mental health aren't important because they don't contribute to exam success.
School IS the be all and end of for those pupils who have zero input from home in helping mould them into well rounded successful adults (I don't just mean career wise). Those conversions with parents where your told "when they leave home in the morning they become your responsibility", says a lot about what some children are battling with at home.
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"There's a woeful lack of support for parents  "
See I don't know whether there is or isn't. But parents have kids. Parents have responsibility for their kids. Discharge that responsibility. They are I believe legally obliged to get their kids in school. |
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"School isn't the be all and end all, and there is so much more to learn in life than what can ever be taught in schools.
Our daughter has left school not even knowing how to write a CV or a covering letter for a job, surely that should of been taught in schools, basic life skills and social skills should be taught.
Our son is wanting to leave now as the career he is wanting to go into... school does not help him. As he says, "what more is school going to teach me in the next couple of years that I don't already know how". He would be better of working in a paid job, ding what he loves.
Having said that, I do feel for a lot of children, that school 5 days a week is the best thing for them."
It's an interesting question, what is school for? Is it to prepare children for the world of work, or is it to give them a good grounding in knowledge and skills? Or, is it a bit of both? |
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"School isn't the be all and end all, and there is so much more to learn in life than what can ever be taught in schools.
Our daughter has left school not even knowing how to write a CV or a covering letter for a job, surely that should of been taught in schools, basic life skills and social skills should be taught.
Our son is wanting to leave now as the career he is wanting to go into... school does not help him. As he says, "what more is school going to teach me in the next couple of years that I don't already know how". He would be better of working in a paid job, ding what he loves.
Having said that, I do feel for a lot of children, that school 5 days a week is the best thing for them.
It's an interesting question, what is school for? Is it to prepare children for the world of work, or is it to give them a good grounding in knowledge and skills? Or, is it a bit of both?"
I think originally it was both social welfare (free education for all) and preparing children for the rigours of factory work.
I think school has a lot of different pulls these days - ensuring parents are free to go to work, social skills, adherence to some sort of collective identity, a safety net for inadequate childrearing, as well as education and skills |
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We've starved all of our public services of cash for the last 13 years and then we wonder why they don't work. If you want better outcomes from any public service then it needs to be paid for. If you aren't prepared to pay for it, don't complain. |
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"We've starved all of our public services of cash for the last 13 years and then we wonder why they don't work. If you want better outcomes from any public service then it needs to be paid for. If you aren't prepared to pay for it, don't complain."
well that's no fun. complaining is the way forward, isn't it?  |
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"We've starved all of our public services of cash for the last 13 years and then we wonder why they don't work. If you want better outcomes from any public service then it needs to be paid for. If you aren't prepared to pay for it, don't complain."
So parents can't get their kids into school because what? In the last 13 years they changed who was responsible for their kids? |
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"We've starved all of our public services of cash for the last 13 years and then we wonder why they don't work. If you want better outcomes from any public service then it needs to be paid for. If you aren't prepared to pay for it, don't complain.
So parents can't get their kids into school because what? In the last 13 years they changed who was responsible for their kids? "
I work in Education and although our school isn't suffering with high absences, we do find that certain parents will just accept their children refusing to attend. The small number of serial absentees we have, appear to do so with the "support" of their parents.
Cal |
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"We've starved all of our public services of cash for the last 13 years and then we wonder why they don't work. If you want better outcomes from any public service then it needs to be paid for. If you aren't prepared to pay for it, don't complain.
So parents can't get their kids into school because what? In the last 13 years they changed who was responsible for their kids? "
Everyone.
Health services are under more strain and are less likely to catch serious health problems that keep kids home from school, or make parents vulnerable in ways that they slip up and stuff with their kids goes unchecked (or the kids stay home and take care of them)
Teachers are more stretched so social problems within school are exacerbated, and children are put under more pressure
etc
It's fun and makes us feel high and mighty to point and say "eww, look at the parents, they suck", but it fixes exactly fuck all. |
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Never ceases to amaze me how many parents think that once a child goes to school their responsibilities end.
A child goes to school to learn to read and write not to be taught how to function in society, that's a parents job.
Children not attending school,one of the reasons is no consequences for lack of attendance.
AND BEFORE ANYONE STARTS THE WHOLE I CAN'T BELIEVE YOU SAID THAT.
I'm NOT talking about children with mental health issues or other various issues.
I'm talking about kids who know that they can not attend and any consequences are going to be minimal.
Who's responsible for this, parents, teachers a system that's hamstrung with rules against any form of discipline that may make the child feel singled out!
Parents aren't allowed to parent, teachers aren't allowed to teach.
Safeguarding and child protection is extremely important but over protecting and not preparing children for the life they are about to enter is Almost as damaging.
I work in school's regularly and the amount of children I witness just walking out of class and doing whatever they want is actually quite disturbing.
Ultimately parents need to take responsibility but how can they when children knowingly exploit the system knowing they are untouchable in terms of any form of discipline (not physical before the mortality police charge in)
If a child refuses to go to school what can actually be done??
Nothing because the parents can't make them either.
They hold too much power and control over adults who are just trying to help and educate them. |
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"Never ceases to amaze me how many parents think that once a child goes to school their responsibilities end.
A child goes to school to learn to read and write not to be taught how to function in society, that's a parents job.
Children not attending school,one of the reasons is no consequences for lack of attendance.
AND BEFORE ANYONE STARTS THE WHOLE I CAN'T BELIEVE YOU SAID THAT.
I'm NOT talking about children with mental health issues or other various issues.
I'm talking about kids who know that they can not attend and any consequences are going to be minimal.
Who's responsible for this, parents, teachers a system that's hamstrung with rules against any form of discipline that may make the child feel singled out!
Parents aren't allowed to parent, teachers aren't allowed to teach.
Safeguarding and child protection is extremely important but over protecting and not preparing children for the life they are about to enter is Almost as damaging.
I work in school's regularly and the amount of children I witness just walking out of class and doing whatever they want is actually quite disturbing.
Ultimately parents need to take responsibility but how can they when children knowingly exploit the system knowing they are untouchable in terms of any form of discipline (not physical before the mortality police charge in)
If a child refuses to go to school what can actually be done??
Nothing because the parents can't make them either.
They hold too much power and control over adults who are just trying to help and educate them."
I'm not a parent, but if it gets to a figure like one in five, my guess is that there are systemic issues, or at least that we should treat it as a systemic issue. Why does this keep happening, and what can we do to stop it from happening?
I know "systemic issues" has become a dirty word, but if they are systemic issues, treating it as individual failings won't actually fix the problems. |
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"Never ceases to amaze me how many parents think that once a child goes to school their responsibilities end.
A child goes to school to learn to read and write not to be taught how to function in society, that's a parents job.
Children not attending school,one of the reasons is no consequences for lack of attendance.
AND BEFORE ANYONE STARTS THE WHOLE I CAN'T BELIEVE YOU SAID THAT.
I'm NOT talking about children with mental health issues or other various issues.
I'm talking about kids who know that they can not attend and any consequences are going to be minimal.
Who's responsible for this, parents, teachers a system that's hamstrung with rules against any form of discipline that may make the child feel singled out!
Parents aren't allowed to parent, teachers aren't allowed to teach.
Safeguarding and child protection is extremely important but over protecting and not preparing children for the life they are about to enter is Almost as damaging.
I work in school's regularly and the amount of children I witness just walking out of class and doing whatever they want is actually quite disturbing.
Ultimately parents need to take responsibility but how can they when children knowingly exploit the system knowing they are untouchable in terms of any form of discipline (not physical before the mortality police charge in)
If a child refuses to go to school what can actually be done??
Nothing because the parents can't make them either.
They hold too much power and control over adults who are just trying to help and educate them.
I'm not a parent, but if it gets to a figure like one in five, my guess is that there are systemic issues, or at least that we should treat it as a systemic issue. Why does this keep happening, and what can we do to stop it from happening?
I know "systemic issues" has become a dirty word, but if they are systemic issues, treating it as individual failings won't actually fix the problems."
Systemic isn't a dirty word. Crevice is a dirty word, but systemic isn't. |
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"We've starved all of our public services of cash for the last 13 years and then we wonder why they don't work. If you want better outcomes from any public service then it needs to be paid for. If you aren't prepared to pay for it, don't complain."
The difference with education is that it's a legal requirement for parents to send their children to school. Considering that children form the basis of our society and are the future, it would seem that it's an area where more research and funding should be spent to fix whatever the problem is when there is a reported 1 in 5 school children absent.
If it's system failure, then it needs investigating, sooner rather than later, so that issues can be addressed accordingly.
If it's lax parenting, then it needs to be investigated if parents are offering alternative adequate homeschooling or they need to be held accountable.
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"We've starved all of our public services of cash for the last 13 years and then we wonder why they don't work. If you want better outcomes from any public service then it needs to be paid for. If you aren't prepared to pay for it, don't complain.
The difference with education is that it's a legal requirement for parents to send their children to school. Considering that children form the basis of our society and are the future, it would seem that it's an area where more research and funding should be spent to fix whatever the problem is when there is a reported 1 in 5 school children absent.
If it's system failure, then it needs investigating, sooner rather than later, so that issues can be addressed accordingly.
If it's lax parenting, then it needs to be investigated if parents are offering alternative adequate homeschooling or they need to be held accountable.
"
I think one of the issues here, as with most complex problems, is that people want a simple cause, and a simple solution. There is never a simple cause to a complex problem. |
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"We've starved all of our public services of cash for the last 13 years and then we wonder why they don't work. If you want better outcomes from any public service then it needs to be paid for. If you aren't prepared to pay for it, don't complain.
The difference with education is that it's a legal requirement for parents to send their children to school. Considering that children form the basis of our society and are the future, it would seem that it's an area where more research and funding should be spent to fix whatever the problem is when there is a reported 1 in 5 school children absent.
If it's system failure, then it needs investigating, sooner rather than later, so that issues can be addressed accordingly.
If it's lax parenting, then it needs to be investigated if parents are offering alternative adequate homeschooling or they need to be held accountable.
I think one of the issues here, as with most complex problems, is that people want a simple cause, and a simple solution. There is never a simple cause to a complex problem."
I'm not sure its a complex problem. Parents are legally obliged to get their kids to school. So be a parent. Simple. No excuses. We spend far to much resource tolerating and encouraging people to handover their responsibilities. Let's see the responsibility squarely where it belongs. And sure... If they need a little help... Let's do that too. |
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By *lder.Woman
over a year ago
Not Local |
"We've starved all of our public services of cash for the last 13 years and then we wonder why they don't work. If you want better outcomes from any public service then it needs to be paid for. If you aren't prepared to pay for it, don't complain.
The difference with education is that it's a legal requirement for parents to send their children to school. Considering that children form the basis of our society and are the future, it would seem that it's an area where more research and funding should be spent to fix whatever the problem is when there is a reported 1 in 5 school children absent.
If it's system failure, then it needs investigating, sooner rather than later, so that issues can be addressed accordingly.
If it's lax parenting, then it needs to be investigated if parents are offering alternative adequate homeschooling or they need to be held accountable.
I think one of the issues here, as with most complex problems, is that people want a simple cause, and a simple solution. There is never a simple cause to a complex problem.
I'm not sure its a complex problem. Parents are legally obliged to get their kids to school. So be a parent. Simple. No excuses. We spend far to much resource tolerating and encouraging people to handover their responsibilities. Let's see the responsibility squarely where it belongs. And sure... If they need a little help... Let's do that too. "
Try asking for that help and see what happens.
Parents are legally required to give their child an education. That doesnt have to be in a school. |
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"We've starved all of our public services of cash for the last 13 years and then we wonder why they don't work. If you want better outcomes from any public service then it needs to be paid for. If you aren't prepared to pay for it, don't complain.
The difference with education is that it's a legal requirement for parents to send their children to school. Considering that children form the basis of our society and are the future, it would seem that it's an area where more research and funding should be spent to fix whatever the problem is when there is a reported 1 in 5 school children absent.
If it's system failure, then it needs investigating, sooner rather than later, so that issues can be addressed accordingly.
If it's lax parenting, then it needs to be investigated if parents are offering alternative adequate homeschooling or they need to be held accountable.
I think one of the issues here, as with most complex problems, is that people want a simple cause, and a simple solution. There is never a simple cause to a complex problem.
I'm not sure its a complex problem. Parents are legally obliged to get their kids to school. So be a parent. Simple. No excuses. We spend far to much resource tolerating and encouraging people to handover their responsibilities. Let's see the responsibility squarely where it belongs. And sure... If they need a little help... Let's do that too. "
Thank you for proving my point. |
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