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Men in modern society
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By *r_reus OP Man 47 weeks ago
Coventry |
It's commonly said that a woman's sexual market value is considerably higher than a man's, especially if she's relatively young, and you don't have to do much investigating on a site like this to see the evidence.
This leads me to wonder, what's a man's worth in modern society, really? Jobs aren't particularly physical anymore, the law (theoretically) keeps women safe from harm and the state will pay for her to have a roof over her head in the event that she runs into hard times, so what's left to keep a man attractive is the sexual market, and as this site shows, the odds are very much stacked against us.
Short of a nuclear bomb disrupting the status quo of the modern world, is there a future for men, or will society's value of us continue to dwindle ever further? |
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By (user no longer on site) 47 weeks ago
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If you think jobs aren’t particularly physical these days, you obviously aren’t thinking about the most important ones
The majority of the dirty extremely physical jobs that keep our society running are done by men and for good reason.
Until that changes I don’t think anyone needs to worry about the future of men |
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By (user no longer on site) 47 weeks ago
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Why is this subject occupying your thoughts on Christmas Eve?
I agree with Prey's summation. I know that some men feel this way, but it's faulty thinking in my opinion. |
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Men, like women, have a variety of aptitudes and talents they can bring to the world.
They are also not magically exempt from protection under the law, even if there are additional protections for some groups under some circumstances.
I feel sorry for anyone who thinks that men are only valuable for their brute strength (or bringing in money, but what's in the OP seems to be about strength), or that anyone's worth should be judged on the basis of the very warped version of the world that sites like this provide. |
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By (user no longer on site) 47 weeks ago
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Look good, take care of yourself, sometimes you don't have to be a gym freak as long as you stay well groomed and tidy, well dressed and presented.
On top of that, be thoughtful, be respectful, be funny, and just be pretty well grounded and patient.
These days it's about who you are and how you make her feel, not what you have. Believe me I know this from experience. |
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"It's commonly said that a woman's sexual market value is considerably higher than a man's, especially if she's relatively young, and you don't have to do much investigating on a site like this to see the evidence.
This leads me to wonder, what's a man's worth in modern society, really? Jobs aren't particularly physical anymore, the law (theoretically) keeps women safe from harm and the state will pay for her to have a roof over her head in the event that she runs into hard times, so what's left to keep a man attractive is the sexual market, and as this site shows, the odds are very much stacked against us.
Short of a nuclear bomb disrupting the status quo of the modern world, is there a future for men, or will society's value of us continue to dwindle ever further?"
The world is changing, men need to change with it. The only men who will cease to have value are those who cannot, or will not, change with the times. |
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By (user no longer on site) 47 weeks ago
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"It's commonly said that a woman's sexual market value is considerably higher than a man's, especially if she's relatively young, and you don't have to do much investigating on a site like this to see the evidence.
This leads me to wonder, what's a man's worth in modern society, really? Jobs aren't particularly physical anymore, the law (theoretically) keeps women safe from harm and the state will pay for her to have a roof over her head in the event that she runs into hard times, so what's left to keep a man attractive is the sexual market, and as this site shows, the odds are very much stacked against us.
Short of a nuclear bomb disrupting the status quo of the modern world, is there a future for men, or will society's value of us continue to dwindle ever further?
The world is changing, men need to change with it. The only men who will cease to have value are those who cannot, or will not, change with the times."
Men like things to be in order, men like to put everything into its own specific box, change disrupts that order. Man no like change. |
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Sorry OP this is shit.
Who the fuck do you think does all the roadworks, building work, refuse, mechanical work... Christ every job that has manual work?
I'm guessing that as it's Christmas you assume that magical elves do it all?
I'm not saying blokes are the only ones who do manual labour obviously Many hundreds of thousands of lady women do manual jobs but the majority of heavy manual toil is done by men.
And assigning someone a worth based on their sexual fertility what's this the dark ages? |
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"It's commonly said that a woman's sexual market value is considerably higher than a man's, especially if she's relatively young, and you don't have to do much investigating on a site like this to see the evidence.
This leads me to wonder, what's a man's worth in modern society, really? Jobs aren't particularly physical anymore, the law (theoretically) keeps women safe from harm and the state will pay for her to have a roof over her head in the event that she runs into hard times, so what's left to keep a man attractive is the sexual market, and as this site shows, the odds are very much stacked against us.
Short of a nuclear bomb disrupting the status quo of the modern world, is there a future for men, or will society's value of us continue to dwindle ever further?
The world is changing, men need to change with it. The only men who will cease to have value are those who cannot, or will not, change with the times.
Men like things to be in order, men like to put everything into its own specific box, change disrupts that order. Man no like change."
Autistic people no like change either, and you don't see anyone coddling our arses about it. Change happen. Fucking deal. |
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"Also, it's commonly stated in terms of women's sexual value that it plummets when you hit 30
should all of us decrepit broads despair? 
Or should we ignore that goddamn bullshit?"
I’ve not managed to get even a pity shag in 17 years |
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By (user no longer on site) 47 weeks ago
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"It's commonly said that a woman's sexual market value is considerably higher than a man's, especially if she's relatively young, and you don't have to do much investigating on a site like this to see the evidence.
This leads me to wonder, what's a man's worth in modern society, really? Jobs aren't particularly physical anymore, the law (theoretically) keeps women safe from harm and the state will pay for her to have a roof over her head in the event that she runs into hard times, so what's left to keep a man attractive is the sexual market, and as this site shows, the odds are very much stacked against us.
Short of a nuclear bomb disrupting the status quo of the modern world, is there a future for men, or will society's value of us continue to dwindle ever further?
The world is changing, men need to change with it. The only men who will cease to have value are those who cannot, or will not, change with the times.
Men like things to be in order, men like to put everything into its own specific box, change disrupts that order. Man no like change.
Autistic people no like change either, and you don't see anyone coddling our arses about it. Change happen. Fucking deal."
True, though as we've all seen here, there's quite an obvious trend with the guys who post these threads, or actually, a few similarities that don't need explaining... |
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"It's commonly said that a woman's sexual market value is considerably higher than a man's, especially if she's relatively young, and you don't have to do much investigating on a site like this to see the evidence.
This leads me to wonder, what's a man's worth in modern society, really? Jobs aren't particularly physical anymore, the law (theoretically) keeps women safe from harm and the state will pay for her to have a roof over her head in the event that she runs into hard times, so what's left to keep a man attractive is the sexual market, and as this site shows, the odds are very much stacked against us.
Short of a nuclear bomb disrupting the status quo of the modern world, is there a future for men, or will society's value of us continue to dwindle ever further?
The world is changing, men need to change with it. The only men who will cease to have value are those who cannot, or will not, change with the times.
Men like things to be in order, men like to put everything into its own specific box, change disrupts that order. Man no like change.
Autistic people no like change either, and you don't see anyone coddling our arses about it. Change happen. Fucking deal.
True, though as we've all seen here, there's quite an obvious trend with the guys who post these threads, or actually, a few similarities that don't need explaining..."
If you're suggesting that people who post these threads are autistic, I think that's harmful to both that group and autistic people in general.
Some people are drawn into grievance culture. Some of them may be autistic. Many of them are not. |
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"It's commonly said that a woman's sexual market value is considerably higher than a man's, especially if she's relatively young, and you don't have to do much investigating on a site like this to see the evidence.
This leads me to wonder, what's a man's worth in modern society, really? Jobs aren't particularly physical anymore, the law (theoretically) keeps women safe from harm and the state will pay for her to have a roof over her head in the event that she runs into hard times, so what's left to keep a man attractive is the sexual market, and as this site shows, the odds are very much stacked against us.
Short of a nuclear bomb disrupting the status quo of the modern world, is there a future for men, or will society's value of us continue to dwindle ever further?
The world is changing, men need to change with it. The only men who will cease to have value are those who cannot, or will not, change with the times.
Men like things to be in order, men like to put everything into its own specific box, change disrupts that order. Man no like change.
Autistic people no like change either, and you don't see anyone coddling our arses about it. Change happen. Fucking deal.
True, though as we've all seen here, there's quite an obvious trend with the guys who post these threads, or actually, a few similarities that don't need explaining..."
Alexa? I’m right this time, aren’t I. |
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"It's commonly said that a woman's sexual market value is considerably higher than a man's, especially if she's relatively young, and you don't have to do much investigating on a site like this to see the evidence.
This leads me to wonder, what's a man's worth in modern society, really? Jobs aren't particularly physical anymore, the law (theoretically) keeps women safe from harm and the state will pay for her to have a roof over her head in the event that she runs into hard times, so what's left to keep a man attractive is the sexual market, and as this site shows, the odds are very much stacked against us.
Short of a nuclear bomb disrupting the status quo of the modern world, is there a future for men, or will society's value of us continue to dwindle ever further?
The world is changing, men need to change with it. The only men who will cease to have value are those who cannot, or will not, change with the times.
Men like things to be in order, men like to put everything into its own specific box, change disrupts that order. Man no like change.
Autistic people no like change either, and you don't see anyone coddling our arses about it. Change happen. Fucking deal."
Yep, change is inevitable, you can either deal with it and flourish, or pretend it’s not happening and get left behind. |
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By (user no longer on site) 47 weeks ago
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"It's commonly said that a woman's sexual market value is considerably higher than a man's, especially if she's relatively young, and you don't have to do much investigating on a site like this to see the evidence.
This leads me to wonder, what's a man's worth in modern society, really? Jobs aren't particularly physical anymore, the law (theoretically) keeps women safe from harm and the state will pay for her to have a roof over her head in the event that she runs into hard times, so what's left to keep a man attractive is the sexual market, and as this site shows, the odds are very much stacked against us.
Short of a nuclear bomb disrupting the status quo of the modern world, is there a future for men, or will society's value of us continue to dwindle ever further?
The world is changing, men need to change with it. The only men who will cease to have value are those who cannot, or will not, change with the times.
Men like things to be in order, men like to put everything into its own specific box, change disrupts that order. Man no like change.
Autistic people no like change either, and you don't see anyone coddling our arses about it. Change happen. Fucking deal.
True, though as we've all seen here, there's quite an obvious trend with the guys who post these threads, or actually, a few similarities that don't need explaining...
Alexa? I’m right this time, aren’t I."
Now that's just siri  |
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"Also, it's commonly stated in terms of women's sexual value that it plummets when you hit 30
should all of us decrepit broads despair?
Or should we ignore that goddamn bullshit?
I’ve not managed to get even a pity shag in 17 years "
I've just worked out why manly manly men run fleeing from me in the street. It's not my resting bitch face, it's the horror of a 38 year old woman. Might as well have resurrected an Egyptian mummy. I offend them so with my ancient countenance. |
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By (user no longer on site) 47 weeks ago
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"It's commonly said that a woman's sexual market value is considerably higher than a man's, especially if she's relatively young, and you don't have to do much investigating on a site like this to see the evidence.
This leads me to wonder, what's a man's worth in modern society, really? Jobs aren't particularly physical anymore, the law (theoretically) keeps women safe from harm and the state will pay for her to have a roof over her head in the event that she runs into hard times, so what's left to keep a man attractive is the sexual market, and as this site shows, the odds are very much stacked against us.
Short of a nuclear bomb disrupting the status quo of the modern world, is there a future for men, or will society's value of us continue to dwindle ever further?
The world is changing, men need to change with it. The only men who will cease to have value are those who cannot, or will not, change with the times.
Men like things to be in order, men like to put everything into its own specific box, change disrupts that order. Man no like change.
Autistic people no like change either, and you don't see anyone coddling our arses about it. Change happen. Fucking deal.
Yep, change is inevitable, you can either deal with it and flourish, or pretend it’s not happening and get left behind."
*is happily flourishing*  |
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I do not like the thought of someone who can only see me for my sexual market value rather than as a complete person with humour, kindness, empathy, random knowledge and weirdness. My husband brings so much to our relationship beyond his job, physical strength and sexual market value that I'm not going to insult him by attempting to quantify it.
I actually just don't even know where to begin with this thread and the failure of some people to see each other as actual human beings.
J |
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"And assigning someone a worth based on their sexual fertility what's this the dark ages?"
This one. I'm not a breeder. Someone's fertility is irrelevant to me. The only time it's relevant is if they actively want that whole family nonsense, in which case we have zero relationship value to each other. But that doesn't affect value elsewhere or to anyone else  |
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"It's commonly said that a woman's sexual market value is considerably higher than a man's, especially if she's relatively young, and you don't have to do much investigating on a site like this to see the evidence.
This leads me to wonder, what's a man's worth in modern society, really? Jobs aren't particularly physical anymore, the law (theoretically) keeps women safe from harm and the state will pay for her to have a roof over her head in the event that she runs into hard times, so what's left to keep a man attractive is the sexual market, and as this site shows, the odds are very much stacked against us.
Short of a nuclear bomb disrupting the status quo of the modern world, is there a future for men, or will society's value of us continue to dwindle ever further?
The world is changing, men need to change with it. The only men who will cease to have value are those who cannot, or will not, change with the times.
Men like things to be in order, men like to put everything into its own specific box, change disrupts that order. Man no like change.
Autistic people no like change either, and you don't see anyone coddling our arses about it. Change happen. Fucking deal.
Yep, change is inevitable, you can either deal with it and flourish, or pretend it’s not happening and get left behind."
But somehow when autistic people struggle with change, we're told that we're not cut out for society, unemployable, and need to squash ourselves and not deal with our feelings.
When it's men (is it all men? I doubt it) then they need to have to be catered to or society will collapse. Doom. Doom! Doom I say! |
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By *r_reus OP Man 47 weeks ago
Coventry |
"
Who the fuck do you think does all the roadworks, building work, refuse, mechanical work... Christ every job that has manual work?"
True but how often do you see these people celebrated and appreciated for their efforts?
Seems you can't log onto the internet these days without seeing a media article championing a woman as a stunning and brave goddess for switching to a new brand of coffee, but the guy who keeps your heating working...? |
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"Also, it's commonly stated in terms of women's sexual value that it plummets when you hit 30
should all of us decrepit broads despair?
Or should we ignore that goddamn bullshit?
I’ve not managed to get even a pity shag in 17 years
I've just worked out why manly manly men run fleeing from me in the street. It's not my resting bitch face, it's the horror of a 38 year old woman. Might as well have resurrected an Egyptian mummy. I offend them so with my ancient countenance."
Trust me. It gets worse.
I turned 40 and my va-jay clamped shut never to open again. |
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"
Who the fuck do you think does all the roadworks, building work, refuse, mechanical work... Christ every job that has manual work?
True but how often do you see these people celebrated and appreciated for their efforts?
Seems you can't log onto the internet these days without seeing a media article championing a woman as a stunning and brave goddess for switching to a new brand of coffee, but the guy who keeps your heating working...?"
So men are doomed unless they're lauded in the media for doing their job?
That sounds suspiciously like participation trophy shit.
Do you want a participation trophy? |
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"Also, it's commonly stated in terms of women's sexual value that it plummets when you hit 30
should all of us decrepit broads despair?
Or should we ignore that goddamn bullshit?
I’ve not managed to get even a pity shag in 17 years
I've just worked out why manly manly men run fleeing from me in the street. It's not my resting bitch face, it's the horror of a 38 year old woman. Might as well have resurrected an Egyptian mummy. I offend them so with my ancient countenance.
Trust me. It gets worse.
I turned 40 and my va-jay clamped shut never to open again."
I heard that turning 50 means that your face causes castration within a one mile radius. How misandrist! |
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"I do not like the thought of someone who can only see me for my sexual market value rather than as a complete person with humour, kindness, empathy, random knowledge and weirdness. My husband brings so much to our relationship beyond his job, physical strength and sexual market value that I'm not going to insult him by attempting to quantify it.
I actually just don't even know where to begin with this thread and the failure of some people to see each other as actual human beings.
J"
Now quick! Rate your husband on the 1-10 scale.
That’s a good start point. |
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"Also, it's commonly stated in terms of women's sexual value that it plummets when you hit 30
should all of us decrepit broads despair?
Or should we ignore that goddamn bullshit?
I’ve not managed to get even a pity shag in 17 years
I've just worked out why manly manly men run fleeing from me in the street. It's not my resting bitch face, it's the horror of a 38 year old woman. Might as well have resurrected an Egyptian mummy. I offend them so with my ancient countenance.
Trust me. It gets worse.
I turned 40 and my va-jay clamped shut never to open again."
I'm a trained locksmith I'm sure I can get it to open up again   |
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"True but how often do you see these people celebrated and appreciated for their efforts?
Seems you can't log onto the internet these days without seeing a media article championing a woman as a stunning and brave goddess for switching to a new brand of coffee, but the guy who keeps your heating working...?"
That not something I ever see when I log on to the Internet. These things tend to be based on interactions and choices you make in what to respond to. They know it'll get a reaction from you, and that's where they make their money.
Maybe think about how you feed your own algorithm. |
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By (user no longer on site) 47 weeks ago
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"
Who the fuck do you think does all the roadworks, building work, refuse, mechanical work... Christ every job that has manual work?
True but how often do you see these people celebrated and appreciated for their efforts?
Seems you can't log onto the internet these days without seeing a media article championing a woman as a stunning and brave goddess for switching to a new brand of coffee, but the guy who keeps your heating working...?"
What planet are you on? Can you really not see how women are treated by the media? |
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By (user no longer on site) 47 weeks ago
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"It's commonly said that a woman's sexual market value is considerably higher than a man's, especially if she's relatively young, and you don't have to do much investigating on a site like this to see the evidence.
This leads me to wonder, what's a man's worth in modern society, really? Jobs aren't particularly physical anymore, the law (theoretically) keeps women safe from harm and the state will pay for her to have a roof over her head in the event that she runs into hard times, so what's left to keep a man attractive is the sexual market, and as this site shows, the odds are very much stacked against us.
Short of a nuclear bomb disrupting the status quo of the modern world, is there a future for men, or will society's value of us continue to dwindle ever further?
The world is changing, men need to change with it. The only men who will cease to have value are those who cannot, or will not, change with the times.
Men like things to be in order, men like to put everything into its own specific box, change disrupts that order. Man no like change.
Autistic people no like change either, and you don't see anyone coddling our arses about it. Change happen. Fucking deal.
True, though as we've all seen here, there's quite an obvious trend with the guys who post these threads, or actually, a few similarities that don't need explaining...
If you're suggesting that people who post these threads are autistic, I think that's harmful to both that group and autistic people in general.
Some people are drawn into grievance culture. Some of them may be autistic. Many of them are not."
Nooooo don't be jumping into conclusions now... |
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"True but how often do you see these people celebrated and appreciated for their efforts?
Seems you can't log onto the internet these days without seeing a media article championing a woman as a stunning and brave goddess for switching to a new brand of coffee, but the guy who keeps your heating working...?
That not something I ever see when I log on to the Internet. These things tend to be based on interactions and choices you make in what to respond to. They know it'll get a reaction from you, and that's where they make their money.
Maybe think about how you feed your own algorithm."
Yeah, ditto, that's not shit I see either.
I see men and women getting on with what they're doing, sometimes with emphasis on diversity and inclusion (I work in that field, so no shit) - and diversity and inclusion for people including men. By men, by women, by groups, by trans people. |
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"I do not like the thought of someone who can only see me for my sexual market value rather than as a complete person with humour, kindness, empathy, random knowledge and weirdness. My husband brings so much to our relationship beyond his job, physical strength and sexual market value that I'm not going to insult him by attempting to quantify it.
I actually just don't even know where to begin with this thread and the failure of some people to see each other as actual human beings.
J"
The belief that sexual attraction and intercourse is transactional is a very incel attitude. It’s very, very common on here. Then men wonder why they can’t get laid. |
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Oh who doesn’t love the crap the manosphere spits out. Why pit men against women and use such broad brush strokes which homogenise entire groups. It’s lazy and banal.
All individuals have value to society and each other. But they need to understand their own value and what they bring to the table and look for someone who wants that too.
Xx |
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"
Who the fuck do you think does all the roadworks, building work, refuse, mechanical work... Christ every job that has manual work?
True but how often do you see these people celebrated and appreciated for their efforts?
Seems you can't log onto the internet these days without seeing a media article championing a woman as a stunning and brave goddess for switching to a new brand of coffee, but the guy who keeps your heating working...?
So men are doomed unless they're lauded in the media for doing their job?
That sounds suspiciously like participation trophy shit.
Do you want a participation trophy?"
I will sculpt one for him out of the same substance we use to fertilise crops. |
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"I do not like the thought of someone who can only see me for my sexual market value rather than as a complete person with humour, kindness, empathy, random knowledge and weirdness. My husband brings so much to our relationship beyond his job, physical strength and sexual market value that I'm not going to insult him by attempting to quantify it.
I actually just don't even know where to begin with this thread and the failure of some people to see each other as actual human beings.
J
The belief that sexual attraction and intercourse is transactional is a very incel attitude. It’s very, very common on here. Then men wonder why they can’t get laid."
Most single men profiled join here thinking it’s insta fuck with clunge dribbling sluts running rampant for them … |
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"Also, it's commonly stated in terms of women's sexual value that it plummets when you hit 30
should all of us decrepit broads despair?
Or should we ignore that goddamn bullshit?
I’ve not managed to get even a pity shag in 17 years
I've just worked out why manly manly men run fleeing from me in the street. It's not my resting bitch face, it's the horror of a 38 year old woman. Might as well have resurrected an Egyptian mummy. I offend them so with my ancient countenance.
Trust me. It gets worse.
I turned 40 and my va-jay clamped shut never to open again.
I'm a trained locksmith I'm sure I can get it to open up again "
It’s an American lock. Not British standard. I think you’ll have trouble with this one |
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By (user no longer on site) 47 weeks ago
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You'll just be told you're wrong, and it's faulty thinking.
Just crack on in life, you don't need validation of your opinions. Go be a man in the way you see fit, and to hell with anyone who dislikes it.
|
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"I do not like the thought of someone who can only see me for my sexual market value rather than as a complete person with humour, kindness, empathy, random knowledge and weirdness. My husband brings so much to our relationship beyond his job, physical strength and sexual market value that I'm not going to insult him by attempting to quantify it.
I actually just don't even know where to begin with this thread and the failure of some people to see each other as actual human beings.
J
The belief that sexual attraction and intercourse is transactional is a very incel attitude. It’s very, very common on here. Then men wonder why they can’t get laid."
Having brought up my autism - when I struggled to find romantic attention when I was younger, I was told to work on being someone that people would want to spend time with. Hobbies, interests, anything other than the desperate need I felt at that time and the resentment I felt that no one wanted me.
It's profoundly unsatisfying when you're in that place, but it is true. Be the best version of you. Even if it's not relationship material, you'll be happier, and it removes this idea that anyone is required to be with you, because they're not.
But once again, men (general men, some men, probably not autistic men) believe that if they don't get what they want, society will collapse.
Sorry man, it doesn't work like that. Never will. |
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By (user no longer on site) 47 weeks ago
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This thread is likely to end up explosive, but I think there are some valid points. There are a lot of men struggling in today's society. I was discussing this with someone who attends a regular Andy's man's group. He recognised that many of the guys who attend have this very negative view of their value. And that's a problem for all of us. I just don't agree with the assessment in the OP, which as others have pointed out, is filled with incel talking points. |
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"I do not like the thought of someone who can only see me for my sexual market value rather than as a complete person with humour, kindness, empathy, random knowledge and weirdness. My husband brings so much to our relationship beyond his job, physical strength and sexual market value that I'm not going to insult him by attempting to quantify it.
I actually just don't even know where to begin with this thread and the failure of some people to see each other as actual human beings.
J
The belief that sexual attraction and intercourse is transactional is a very incel attitude. It’s very, very common on here. Then men wonder why they can’t get laid.
Most single men profiled join here thinking it’s insta fuck with clunge dribbling sluts running rampant for them … "
Now I have to write a song called Clunge Dribbling Sluts.
It’s got a ring to it. |
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"I do not like the thought of someone who can only see me for my sexual market value rather than as a complete person with humour, kindness, empathy, random knowledge and weirdness. My husband brings so much to our relationship beyond his job, physical strength and sexual market value that I'm not going to insult him by attempting to quantify it.
I actually just don't even know where to begin with this thread and the failure of some people to see each other as actual human beings.
J
The belief that sexual attraction and intercourse is transactional is a very incel attitude. It’s very, very common on here. Then men wonder why they can’t get laid.
Having brought up my autism - when I struggled to find romantic attention when I was younger, I was told to work on being someone that people would want to spend time with. Hobbies, interests, anything other than the desperate need I felt at that time and the resentment I felt that no one wanted me.
It's profoundly unsatisfying when you're in that place, but it is true. Be the best version of you. Even if it's not relationship material, you'll be happier, and it removes this idea that anyone is required to be with you, because they're not.
But once again, men (general men, some men, probably not autistic men) believe that if they don't get what they want, society will collapse.
Sorry man, it doesn't work like that. Never will."
Dan Savage used to give this advice to young straight guys all the time. It was good advice then and it’s good advice now. |
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"This thread is likely to end up explosive, but I think there are some valid points. There are a lot of men struggling in today's society. I was discussing this with someone who attends a regular Andy's man's group. He recognised that many of the guys who attend have this very negative view of their value. And that's a problem for all of us. I just don't agree with the assessment in the OP, which as others have pointed out, is filled with incel talking points. "
What’s an Andy Man? |
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By *r_reus OP Man 47 weeks ago
Coventry |
"
Who the fuck do you think does all the roadworks, building work, refuse, mechanical work... Christ every job that has manual work?
True but how often do you see these people celebrated and appreciated for their efforts?
Seems you can't log onto the internet these days without seeing a media article championing a woman as a stunning and brave goddess for switching to a new brand of coffee, but the guy who keeps your heating working...?
So men are doomed unless they're lauded in the media for doing their job?
That sounds suspiciously like participation trophy shit.
Do you want a participation trophy?"
Thankyou for that incredible non-sequitur  |
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By (user no longer on site) 47 weeks ago
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"This thread is likely to end up explosive, but I think there are some valid points. There are a lot of men struggling in today's society. I was discussing this with someone who attends a regular Andy's man's group. He recognised that many of the guys who attend have this very negative view of their value. And that's a problem for all of us. I just don't agree with the assessment in the OP, which as others have pointed out, is filled with incel talking points.
What’s an Andy Man?"
"ANDYSMANCLUB are a men’s suicide prevention charity, offering free-to-attend peer-to-peer support groups across the United Kingdom and online. We want to end the stigma surrounding men’s mental health and help men through the power of conversation." |
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"We’re just here to open jars, put the bins out, get rid of spiders and look good doing it."
Well then… you’re obsolete cause I can open jars, don’t mind spiders, and… well you do look good though.  |
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By *r_reus OP Man 47 weeks ago
Coventry |
"This thread is likely to end up explosive, but I think there are some valid points. There are a lot of men struggling in today's society. I was discussing this with someone who attends a regular Andy's man's group. He recognised that many of the guys who attend have this very negative view of their value. And that's a problem for all of us. I just don't agree with the assessment in the OP, which as others have pointed out, is filled with incel talking points. "
'Incel' in the modern online discourse reads to me like 'racist/fascist/white supremacist etc', just a silly phrase to throw out when someone raises a difficult issue you struggle to argue with. |
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"This thread is likely to end up explosive, but I think there are some valid points. There are a lot of men struggling in today's society. I was discussing this with someone who attends a regular Andy's man's group. He recognised that many of the guys who attend have this very negative view of their value. And that's a problem for all of us. I just don't agree with the assessment in the OP, which as others have pointed out, is filled with incel talking points.
What’s an Andy Man?
"ANDYSMANCLUB are a men’s suicide prevention charity, offering free-to-attend peer-to-peer support groups across the United Kingdom and online. We want to end the stigma surrounding men’s mental health and help men through the power of conversation.""
Sounds like a good initiative. |
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"We’re just here to open jars, put the bins out, get rid of spiders and look good doing it.
Well then… you’re obsolete cause I can open jars, don’t mind spiders, and… well you do look good though. "
I’ll just stand here and look pretty then  |
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By (user no longer on site) 47 weeks ago
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"This thread is likely to end up explosive, but I think there are some valid points. There are a lot of men struggling in today's society. I was discussing this with someone who attends a regular Andy's man's group. He recognised that many of the guys who attend have this very negative view of their value. And that's a problem for all of us. I just don't agree with the assessment in the OP, which as others have pointed out, is filled with incel talking points.
'Incel' in the modern online discourse reads to me like 'racist/fascist/white supremacist etc', just a silly phrase to throw out when someone raises a difficult issue you struggle to argue with."
I am happy to engage with the issue as I've said. It's almost as though you didn't read anything other than the word incel?
The issues are real, and important. But you are starting from a perspective straight from the incel playbook. |
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By (user no longer on site) 47 weeks ago
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"This thread is likely to end up explosive, but I think there are some valid points. There are a lot of men struggling in today's society. I was discussing this with someone who attends a regular Andy's man's group. He recognised that many of the guys who attend have this very negative view of their value. And that's a problem for all of us. I just don't agree with the assessment in the OP, which as others have pointed out, is filled with incel talking points.
What’s an Andy Man?
"ANDYSMANCLUB are a men’s suicide prevention charity, offering free-to-attend peer-to-peer support groups across the United Kingdom and online. We want to end the stigma surrounding men’s mental health and help men through the power of conversation."
Sounds like a good initiative. "
It does, doesn't it? There are meetings every week all over the country. The guy I know attends most weeks and has gained a lot from it. |
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"True but how often do you see these people celebrated and appreciated for their efforts?
Seems you can't log onto the internet these days without seeing a media article championing a woman as a stunning and brave goddess for switching to a new brand of coffee, but the guy who keeps your heating working...?
That not something I ever see when I log on to the Internet. These things tend to be based on interactions and choices you make in what to respond to. They know it'll get a reaction from you, and that's where they make their money.
Maybe think about how you feed your own algorithm."
Yes, my insta is filled with the best dogs. And dark humoured cartoons.
And apartments in Gdansk with a St Andrew's Cross 
J |
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"This thread is likely to end up explosive, but I think there are some valid points. There are a lot of men struggling in today's society. I was discussing this with someone who attends a regular Andy's man's group. He recognised that many of the guys who attend have this very negative view of their value. And that's a problem for all of us. I just don't agree with the assessment in the OP, which as others have pointed out, is filled with incel talking points. "
This might sound harsh, But if you’ve grown up sexualising women, watching porn and playing violent games , Idolising the wrong kind of role models, football stars/criminals/rappers etc , Then when women are not throwing themselves at you , and society is not treating you as some kind of powerful superhero, you’re gonna have a crisis of self-esteem.
Unfortunately it’s very hard to fix. I did a lot of mentoring of teenagers And the conclusion is if you don’t get them by the age of 11 or 12 its near impossible. So how you fix adults I have no idea
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A woman’s sexual market value? Fucking hell, when did we become cattle? Anyone who is basing their worth in any way on a sex site really needs to look at other parts of their life.
As humans we are all much more than the bits we are born with. |
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Can't we just agree men and women are of equal value as people, not defined by jobs or sexual needs? A nice person or a good person is just that irrespective of gender, and should be valued as such. |
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Toxic masculinity is probably more to blame for male suicide than the devaluation of masculinity in society.
The building trade has one of the highest suicide rates in males for bad reasons.
Having just completed my 40th year in the trade I can categorically say that toxic masculinity is as rife now as it ever has been " Lads " culture has resulted in a uncaring selfish entitled behaviour that has led to men feeling isolated and alone unable to express feelings and feel ridiculed and victimised for showing weakness.
I've been living with this my entire adult life and whilst companies now put on a good show the truth is we are still treated like hairy arsed builders who shouldn't have feelings.
Even more so in small companies or site workers. |
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By (user no longer on site) 47 weeks ago
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"Can't we just agree men and women are of equal value as people, not defined by jobs or sexual needs? A nice person or a good person is just that irrespective of gender, and should be valued as such."
I agree with that |
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By (user no longer on site) 47 weeks ago
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"We’re just here to open jars, put the bins out, get rid of spiders and look good doing it.
I can do all that. Men be gone.
But can you pee on a target with 8% accuracy?"
BRB |
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By (user no longer on site) 47 weeks ago
|
"My life would be no different if men didn't exist.
Actually no wait, it'd be nicer.
I can put shelves up, I'm good.
Not very helpful  "
I'm fairly sure my views aren't gonna become law so I think it's ok. |
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By (user no longer on site) 47 weeks ago
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"My life would be no different if men didn't exist.
Actually no wait, it'd be nicer.
I can put shelves up, I'm good.
What about your fantasy of 2 men sword fighting? See you need us."
But you never do it!!! Just all bloody talk. |
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By (user no longer on site) 47 weeks ago
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"Toxic masculinity is probably more to blame for male suicide than the devaluation of masculinity in society.
The building trade has one of the highest suicide rates in males for bad reasons.
Having just completed my 40th year in the trade I can categorically say that toxic masculinity is as rife now as it ever has been " Lads " culture has resulted in a uncaring selfish entitled behaviour that has led to men feeling isolated and alone unable to express feelings and feel ridiculed and victimised for showing weakness.
I've been living with this my entire adult life and whilst companies now put on a good show the truth is we are still treated like hairy arsed builders who shouldn't have feelings.
Even more so in small companies or site workers."
Men fucked up their role in society and now are sad about it and blaming women. |
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By (user no longer on site) 47 weeks ago
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"My life would be no different if men didn't exist.
Actually no wait, it'd be nicer.
I can put shelves up, I'm good.
Not very helpful
I'm fairly sure my views aren't gonna become law so I think it's ok."
You do you |
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"My life would be no different if men didn't exist.
Actually no wait, it'd be nicer.
I can put shelves up, I'm good.
What about your fantasy of 2 men sword fighting? See you need us."
...yeah fucksake I haven't gone through seven years of dong swallowing class to miss the exam, goddamnit.
 |
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"Toxic masculinity is probably more to blame for male suicide than the devaluation of masculinity in society.
The building trade has one of the highest suicide rates in males for bad reasons.
Having just completed my 40th year in the trade I can categorically say that toxic masculinity is as rife now as it ever has been " Lads " culture has resulted in a uncaring selfish entitled behaviour that has led to men feeling isolated and alone unable to express feelings and feel ridiculed and victimised for showing weakness.
I've been living with this my entire adult life and whilst companies now put on a good show the truth is we are still treated like hairy arsed builders who shouldn't have feelings.
Even more so in small companies or site workers.
Men fucked up their role in society and now are sad about it and blaming women. "
It’s difficult not to read the thread this way, to be fair. |
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"My life would be no different if men didn't exist.
Actually no wait, it'd be nicer.
I can put shelves up, I'm good.
What about your fantasy of 2 men sword fighting? See you need us.
But you never do it!!! Just all bloody talk. "
Find 2 nerds and give them glow in the dark condoms. Nerds can’t resist a lightsaber fight. |
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"It's commonly said that a woman's sexual market value is considerably higher than a man's, especially if she's relatively young, and you don't have to do much investigating on a site like this to see the evidence.
This leads me to wonder, what's a man's worth in modern society, really? Jobs aren't particularly physical anymore, the law (theoretically) keeps women safe from harm and the state will pay for her to have a roof over her head in the event that she runs into hard times, so what's left to keep a man attractive is the sexual market, and as this site shows, the odds are very much stacked against us.
Short of a nuclear bomb disrupting the status quo of the modern world, is there a future for men, or will society's value of us continue to dwindle ever further?
The world is changing, men need to change with it. The only men who will cease to have value are those who cannot, or will not, change with the times.
Men like things to be in order, men like to put everything into its own specific box, change disrupts that order. Man no like change.
Autistic people no like change either, and you don't see anyone coddling our arses about it. Change happen. Fucking deal."
Autistic men have to cope with change too!!
Change happen. Autistic man (Mr KC) cope.
And the entire OP is such bollocks that we CBA dissecting it! |
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By (user no longer on site) 47 weeks ago
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There are narratives wherever you look that play to different mindsets and groups. Most people are just trying to get on and do their best. Lots of parts of societies demographic have faced prejudice and discrimination. Thankfully there appears to be a very slow shift towards being inclusive and supporting one and other. Every single human on the planet has their own thoughts, difficulties and dreams. The sooner everyone else starts to see people as unique individuals who can contribute and enhance society the better. I applaud everyone who gets through their day. We all have tough times. Be kind and empathetic and others will respond in kind. |
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"There are narratives wherever you look that play to different mindsets and groups. Most people are just trying to get on and do their best. Lots of parts of societies demographic have faced prejudice and discrimination. Thankfully there appears to be a very slow shift towards being inclusive and supporting one and other. Every single human on the planet has their own thoughts, difficulties and dreams. The sooner everyone else starts to see people as unique individuals who can contribute and enhance society the better. I applaud everyone who gets through their day. We all have tough times. Be kind and empathetic and others will respond in kind."
I think switching the internet off for a month would be a good start,stop all this social media pressure and hatred, the spreading of vile behaviour male, female and other categories are all guilty of hatred, spreading misinformation and brainwashing.
Let's start actually talking to others face to face get out from behind a screen,back into public places and seeing people as people not just a faceless entity.
Turn it off for everything bar essential stuff,the internet has been more disruptive in my opinion to world peace than any number of demonstrations. |
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"It's commonly said that a woman's sexual market value is considerably higher than a man's, especially if she's relatively young, and you don't have to do much investigating on a site like this to see the evidence.
This leads me to wonder, what's a man's worth in modern society, really? Jobs aren't particularly physical anymore, the law (theoretically) keeps women safe from harm and the state will pay for her to have a roof over her head in the event that she runs into hard times, so what's left to keep a man attractive is the sexual market, and as this site shows, the odds are very much stacked against us.
Short of a nuclear bomb disrupting the status quo of the modern world, is there a future for men, or will society's value of us continue to dwindle ever further?
The world is changing, men need to change with it. The only men who will cease to have value are those who cannot, or will not, change with the times.
Men like things to be in order, men like to put everything into its own specific box, change disrupts that order. Man no like change.
Autistic people no like change either, and you don't see anyone coddling our arses about it. Change happen. Fucking deal.
Autistic men have to cope with change too!!
Change happen. Autistic man (Mr KC) cope.
And the entire OP is such bollocks that we CBA dissecting it! "
Absolutely. But I think a lot of this is like, men (some men, who identify like the OP, not all men) have this difficulty, therefore society will collapse if we don't fix it for them.
Society didn't collapse when everyone else with that problem was told to suck it the fuck up, you know?
Some stuff sucks. And you gotta deal with it. |
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By (user no longer on site) 47 weeks ago
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"There are narratives wherever you look that play to different mindsets and groups. Most people are just trying to get on and do their best. Lots of parts of societies demographic have faced prejudice and discrimination. Thankfully there appears to be a very slow shift towards being inclusive and supporting one and other. Every single human on the planet has their own thoughts, difficulties and dreams. The sooner everyone else starts to see people as unique individuals who can contribute and enhance society the better. I applaud everyone who gets through their day. We all have tough times. Be kind and empathetic and others will respond in kind.
I think switching the internet off for a month would be a good start,stop all this social media pressure and hatred, the spreading of vile behaviour male, female and other categories are all guilty of hatred, spreading misinformation and brainwashing.
Let's start actually talking to others face to face get out from behind a screen,back into public places and seeing people as people not just a faceless entity.
Turn it off for everything bar essential stuff,the internet has been more disruptive in my opinion to world peace than any number of demonstrations."
|
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"Toxic masculinity is probably more to blame for male suicide than the devaluation of masculinity in society.
The building trade has one of the highest suicide rates in males for bad reasons.
Having just completed my 40th year in the trade I can categorically say that toxic masculinity is as rife now as it ever has been " Lads " culture has resulted in a uncaring selfish entitled behaviour that has led to men feeling isolated and alone unable to express feelings and feel ridiculed and victimised for showing weakness.
I've been living with this my entire adult life and whilst companies now put on a good show the truth is we are still treated like hairy arsed builders who shouldn't have feelings.
Even more so in small companies or site workers.
Men fucked up their role in society and now are sad about it and blaming women.
It’s difficult not to read the thread this way, to be fair."
I think women have had a variety of times where their identities and roles in society were questioned and shaken up, and have had opportunities to learn, grow, and benefit from those growing pains.
I think men need to do the same (and as societies we're divided, angry, and feeling unappreciated) - and unfortunately grifters take advantage. Grievance culture sells extremely well, even if it solves nothing. |
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"Toxic masculinity
A true step on the rake moment."
Did you read the rest of the comment, or are you just reacting to a phrase you don't like?
I thought the comment was very sensitive to men's needs. |
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By (user no longer on site) 47 weeks ago
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"There are narratives wherever you look that play to different mindsets and groups. Most people are just trying to get on and do their best. Lots of parts of societies demographic have faced prejudice and discrimination. Thankfully there appears to be a very slow shift towards being inclusive and supporting one and other. Every single human on the planet has their own thoughts, difficulties and dreams. The sooner everyone else starts to see people as unique individuals who can contribute and enhance society the better. I applaud everyone who gets through their day. We all have tough times. Be kind and empathetic and others will respond in kind.
I think switching the internet off for a month would be a good start,stop all this social media pressure and hatred, the spreading of vile behaviour male, female and other categories are all guilty of hatred, spreading misinformation and brainwashing.
Let's start actually talking to others face to face get out from behind a screen,back into public places and seeing people as people not just a faceless entity.
Turn it off for everything bar essential stuff,the internet has been more disruptive in my opinion to world peace than any number of demonstrations."
Very well said. Technology dehumanises everyone and that’s scary prospect and one that’s been repeated many times. |
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"There are narratives wherever you look that play to different mindsets and groups. Most people are just trying to get on and do their best. Lots of parts of societies demographic have faced prejudice and discrimination. Thankfully there appears to be a very slow shift towards being inclusive and supporting one and other. Every single human on the planet has their own thoughts, difficulties and dreams. The sooner everyone else starts to see people as unique individuals who can contribute and enhance society the better. I applaud everyone who gets through their day. We all have tough times. Be kind and empathetic and others will respond in kind.
I think switching the internet off for a month would be a good start,stop all this social media pressure and hatred, the spreading of vile behaviour male, female and other categories are all guilty of hatred, spreading misinformation and brainwashing.
Let's start actually talking to others face to face get out from behind a screen,back into public places and seeing people as people not just a faceless entity.
Turn it off for everything bar essential stuff,the internet has been more disruptive in my opinion to world peace than any number of demonstrations.
Very well said. Technology dehumanises everyone and that’s scary prospect and one that’s been repeated many times."
I'd add the caveat that it's a necessary accessibility tool for some people... |
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By *ty31Man 47 weeks ago
NW London |
Meh. The role of a man and his place and value in society hasn't changed at all. It's still the same as ever except now that women are (thankfully) more emancipated they are capable and able to take on roles that in the past were basically restricted to males.
I'm sure there are some weak or insecure men who have been threatened or emasculated by this but for most of us life goes on as before. |
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By (user no longer on site) 47 weeks ago
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In 2023 women are working and also 'keeping the house'. When are men going to step up and show their worth?
Babysitting their own kids for 2 hours when their wife has left detailed instructions, snacks and spare clothes... and putting the bins out when nagged.  |
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By (user no longer on site) 47 weeks ago
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The richest people on the planet are men. The majority of business owners, C-suite, senior management, politicians, key decision makers, etc. also (mostly white) men.
In terms of opportunities to make the most out of life in modern society, men on the whole, still hold the most cards. |
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I read an interesting take that feminism was a con to make society think that a household needed two incomes when 30 years ago they could live comfortably on one. Now I’m not for one second saying this is true but it did make me think. |
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By *ty31Man 47 weeks ago
NW London |
"I read an interesting take that feminism was a con to make society think that a household needed two incomes when 30 years ago they could live comfortably on one. Now I’m not for one second saying this is true but it did make me think."
Things have gotten more expensive because people at the top have found a way to make a commodity out of the basics (surging house prices etc) plus we've been sold a dream of luxury (big telly's, designer clothes, new cars etc) which requires a large disposable income to afford |
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"I read an interesting take that feminism was a con to make society think that a household needed two incomes when 30 years ago they could live comfortably on one. Now I’m not for one second saying this is true but it did make me think.
Things have gotten more expensive because people at the top have found a way to make a commodity out of the basics (surging house prices etc) plus we've been sold a dream of luxury (big telly's, designer clothes, new cars etc) which requires a large disposable income to afford "
And it’s only going to get worse but all this is a bit too deep for Christmas Eve. |
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By *ty31Man 47 weeks ago
NW London |
"I read an interesting take that feminism was a con to make society think that a household needed two incomes when 30 years ago they could live comfortably on one. Now I’m not for one second saying this is true but it did make me think.
Things have gotten more expensive because people at the top have found a way to make a commodity out of the basics (surging house prices etc) plus we've been sold a dream of luxury (big telly's, designer clothes, new cars etc) which requires a large disposable income to afford
And it’s only going to get worse but all this is a bit too deep for Christmas Eve."
Of course it is, we've destroyed our export industries (such as manufacturing) so now we rely on commercialism to keep the country going. |
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"I read an interesting take that feminism was a con to make society think that a household needed two incomes when 30 years ago they could live comfortably on one. Now I’m not for one second saying this is true but it did make me think."
This idea of women not working is a weirdly American and European middle class one - it's not the reality for the vast majority of women for the vast majority of history. But we don't talk about that. |
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"It's commonly said that a woman's sexual market value is considerably higher than a man's, especially if she's relatively young, and you don't have to do much investigating on a site like this to see the evidence.
This leads me to wonder, what's a man's worth in modern society, really? Jobs aren't particularly physical anymore, the law (theoretically) keeps women safe from harm and the state will pay for her to have a roof over her head in the event that she runs into hard times, so what's left to keep a man attractive is the sexual market, and as this site shows, the odds are very much stacked against us.
Short of a nuclear bomb disrupting the status quo of the modern world, is there a future for men, or will society's value of us continue to dwindle ever further?"
no women without men so i guess we're here to stay  |
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"I read an interesting take that feminism was a con to make society think that a household needed two incomes when 30 years ago they could live comfortably on one. Now I’m not for one second saying this is true but it did make me think.
This idea of women not working is a weirdly American and European middle class one - it's not the reality for the vast majority of women for the vast majority of history. But we don't talk about that."
I don’t think it was aimed solely at women if I remember rightly. It was more about both parents working but the fact that back then it was more common for the woman to be the stay at home parent meant feminism along with 90s girl power were the buzzwords they used. It was a long time ago I read it so can’t remember the exact details but it was thought provoking. I think the point of it was that households are no better off with two incomes than they were with one back then but I’m not really old enough to remember the time before the mid 90s. |
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By (user no longer on site) 47 weeks ago
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"In 2023 women are working and also 'keeping the house'. When are men going to step up and show their worth?
Babysitting their own kids for 2 hours when their wife has left detailed instructions, snacks and spare clothes... and putting the bins out when nagged. "
I challenge those gender norms by being a househusband. Cooking, cleaning the entire house, laundry, taking care of pets.. and the Mrs too, doing the DIY, garden work, shopping, run errands
And what do I get out of all this?... what DO I get out of all this |
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"Meh. The role of a man and his place and value in society hasn't changed at all. It's still the same as ever except now that women are (thankfully) more emancipated they are capable and able to take on roles that in the past were basically restricted to males.
I'm sure there are some weak or insecure men who have been threatened or emasculated by this but for most of us life goes on as before."
Well said, Sir! |
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