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Should the pension age be increased to 72?
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By *hagTonight OP Man
over a year ago
From the land of haribos. |
What do you think of the suggestion from jacon that he wants the pension age to be increased to 72 from 66 years which it currently is.
I think that 72 years old is too long wait. I wonder if it have anything to do with that they want to prolong the time to pay the pension in order of the government to save money? |
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"I think it should be lowered by quite a lot. There’s been talk of there being nothing left by the time our age group get there which is worrying  "
I dread to think what it will be like then when my age group get there 
Basically what they'll soon be saying is, if you can't afford to stop, work till you drop |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I think it should be lowered by quite a lot. There’s been talk of there being nothing left by the time our age group get there which is worrying
I dread to think what it will be like then when my age group get there
Basically what they'll soon be saying is, if you can't afford to stop, work till you drop"
Your age group is my age group you tool  |
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I suspect that most people would disagree with it being raised any further, and would probably be keen to see it lowered slightly.
Depending on your job, working until 66+ is not always practical. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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There's no money left in the pension pot, where do you think all the furlough money and backhanders to Tory mates for non-existent PPE came from during lockdown?
They want us working till we drop and then they don't have to pay out anything.
My state pension age is 67, so I've another 7yrs before can draw it. I'm lucky I have a private pension but if I draw on that now I have to pay tax on it because I'm still working.
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"I think it should be lowered by quite a lot. There’s been talk of there being nothing left by the time our age group get there which is worrying
I dread to think what it will be like then when my age group get there
Basically what they'll soon be saying is, if you can't afford to stop, work till you drop
Your age group is my age group you tool "
In your dreams it is  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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It's like any benefit. They want to make it as hard as possible for people to reach that goal so they don't bother wanting it anymore. There will be penalties in place for people who decide or need to retire earlier than that but who cares about us little people really ay. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I do not support the increase.
It is my view that the future of the economy in 30 to 40 years time will be incredibly bleak if that increase is brought in without other schemes to support increase of entrepreneurs.
If the working population has to retain those people who would have otherwise been in retirement for some 5 years that will impact career progression for the younger members of employees (in some sectors). It will also mean that there are fewer jobs for the rest of the labour market.
Unless the government introduces tax breaks and incentive packages to encourage new businesses to be birthed I can only see that the savings made on pension contributions will be lost in unemployment benefits/sickness benefits for the aging workforce who can’t work and can’t afford to not work.
I struggle to see how this will work out well. |
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By *hagTonight OP Man
over a year ago
From the land of haribos. |
"I think it should be lowered by quite a lot. There’s been talk of there being nothing left by the time our age group get there which is worrying "
Yes. I think the same, that it should be lowered as well and yes that could be a reason, that there might not be any money left by that time. |
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By *orl1971Couple
over a year ago
Glasgow |
Remember reading that the first state pension was at 70 years old when first introduced and on average people only claimed for two years before death.
Now life expectancy is higher and the population is aging so not sure of the economics of how that works. |
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By *arkus1812Man
over a year ago
Lifes departure lounge NN9 Northamptonshire East not West MidlandsMidlands |
I am now into my 18th year as a Pensioner, the retirement age was 65 years when I retired but has now gone up to 67 years.
My state pension is £10600 per annum and the only benefit I get is a 25% discount on my council tax for being a single person.
I am pleased to say that I had the foresight many years ago to take out some private pensions and I am now getting the benefit from that decision.
The idea of pushing the age to 72 is ridiculous, I doubt that no more that 50% of the current workforce would live to that age to reap the benefit. |
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By *TG3Man
over a year ago
Dorchester |
"It's like any benefit. They want to make it as hard as possible for people to reach that goal so they don't bother wanting it anymore. There will be penalties in place for people who decide or need to retire earlier than that but who cares about us little people really ay."
By the time you get to pension age money won't exist anymore it'll be your trackable wrist watch you wont even need to press it up to a machine as soon as you enter the building it will log into your details and take the payment |
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"I think it should be lowered by quite a lot. There’s been talk of there being nothing left by the time our age group get there which is worrying
I dread to think what it will be like then when my age group get there
Basically what they'll soon be saying is, if you can't afford to stop, work till you drop"
I think this will be the situation by the time we get to our 60/70s. |
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My dad continued to work in a manual job until he was 75. He is exceptional in that he was and is extremely fit. I doubt many could do what he did.
I think that things are very different now to when the pension was introduced over 100 years ago and as unfair as it might seem it's necessary to start preparing for older age when you first start working. To be honest though the state pension has never been enough to live on comfortably or even uncomfortably and it's always been a good idea to have back up. How you can do that in the current economic climate or if you've always worked in a lower paid job I do not know. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"It's like any benefit. They want to make it as hard as possible for people to reach that goal so they don't bother wanting it anymore. There will be penalties in place for people who decide or need to retire earlier than that but who cares about us little people really ay."
People should stop being so selfish. The people in big mansions have massive heating bills, the little houses don't need heating. Let the mansion people keep their money.
Little house people would get bored sat at home so it's best they work to stay busy, also no need to put their heating on. Win win.. |
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By *tephanjMan
over a year ago
Kettering |
I'm 69 so I'm past the current retirement age (66) which I believe is going to be 67 soon. I personally think our current retirement age is great and should not increase. I'm already struggling with the hours I work(12hrshifts) if I didn't work not sure what I would do with my time as I have no real hobbies |
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"My dad continued to work in a manual job until he was 75. He is exceptional in that he was and is extremely fit. I doubt many could do what he did.
I think that things are very different now to when the pension was introduced over 100 years ago and as unfair as it might seem it's necessary to start preparing for older age when you first start working. To be honest though the state pension has never been enough to live on comfortably or even uncomfortably and it's always been a good idea to have back up. How you can do that in the current economic climate or if you've always worked in a lower paid job I do not know. "
My Dad worked part-time until he was 80 but he should have stopped sooner. He wanted to carry on after the COVID pandemic but his level of dementia meant he was forgetting too much and couldn't turn up on time/on the right day. |
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Please god no!!!!
I wish I could retire from my full time job now, I've had enough. Jokes aside, I've often spectulated government pension won't be around when I'm retirement age.
I'm planing to retire from my career and go part time. I would like to have accumulated enough to properly retire though, even if I have good health, I'd like the time to do whatever I please. |
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"It's like any benefit. They want to make it as hard as possible for people to reach that goal so they don't bother wanting it anymore. There will be penalties in place for people who decide or need to retire earlier than that but who cares about us little people really ay.
People should stop being so selfish. The people in big mansions have massive heating bills, the little houses don't need heating. Let the mansion people keep their money.
Little house people would get bored sat at home so it's best they work to stay busy, also no need to put their heating on. Win win.."
 problem solved |
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"It's like any benefit. They want to make it as hard as possible for people to reach that goal so they don't bother wanting it anymore. There will be penalties in place for people who decide or need to retire earlier than that but who cares about us little people really ay.
People should stop being so selfish. The people in big mansions have massive heating bills, the little houses don't need heating. Let the mansion people keep their money.
Little house people would get bored sat at home so it's best they work to stay busy, also no need to put their heating on. Win win.."
Also if you don't have to go to work you have time to think. Thinking causes the plebs to have ideas above their station which is very dangerous |
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The issue is that people say ooooh when i retire im going to….. It’s ok to have a plan but also tomorrow isnt guaranteed… how many people planned for a retirement that never came because of COVID ? Plan for the future but live in the now too. You never know what tomorrow will bring or if there will be a tomorrow- I have an eye on the future but my knob is definitely living for today… should I get that on a t-shirt??  |
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"The issue is that people say ooooh when i retire im going to….. It’s ok to have a plan but also tomorrow isnt guaranteed… how many people planned for a retirement that never came because of COVID ? Plan for the future but live in the now too. You never know what tomorrow will bring or if there will be a tomorrow- I have an eye on the future but my knob is definitely living for today… should I get that on a t-shirt?? "
I agree that you shouldn't wait to do things. I don't think you should get the knob quote on a tee shirt though. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"What do you think of the suggestion from jacon that he wants the pension age to be increased to 72 from 66 years which it currently is.
I think that 72 years old is too long wait. I wonder if it have anything to do with that they want to prolong the time to pay the pension in order of the government to save money?"
Life expectancy is decreasing and they want to increase pensionable age. what ever next, stopping people living in tents. |
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It's easy for people who do jobs that require little manual effort, no long shifts, and can "work from home" or indeed sit in Parliament.
I'm glad I paid into an NHS pension, I was able to take it at 55 and, I now work part time. I could not have carried on beyond that. When I started nurse training we lifted people, no equipment then. The nhs fucked my mind and body. I stayed because I needed a decent salary to bring up my children. I can now enjoy life to the full. |
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By *mmmMaybeCouple
over a year ago
West Wales |
Yes it should, I actually think we need to turn the whole education/retirement system on its head.
I think when you hit twenty you should be given £20k in travel vouchers, these would have a ten year expiry.
Some would choose to travel the world possibly learning about other cultures at a point in their lives it could make a difference, some would spunk it all in Benidorm, some would save them till a bit older.
Just my opinion but atm people wait till retirement to do stuff, there’s no guarantee you’ll ever going to get there anyway or in good health or in a financial position to do anything.
So maybe a mechanism to do these things beforehand to try & better the individual which would be better for the country in the long run?
I travelled Europe for three summers by motorcycle in the early 80’s because of money left to me, Tent on the back seat & nowhere in particular to go. It wasn’t enough to travel the world though & at nineteen I probably wasn’t brave enough to do it solo anyway.
It definitely changed me as a person though, I would hope for the better.
Maybe a different way of looking at making our young more “Worldly” would be good?
We have two friends who went to Vietnam as young tourists nearly thirty years ago, they didn't come back & have spent their time moving around the region as English teachers & are currently in Cambodia.
I can’t imagine retiring fully atm though, probably cut my hours some more but being self employed it’s just a mindset that says “You work, you have money - You don’t work, you don’t”.
Stopping working completely is not something that enters my head though.
With our aging population & ergo generally better health I can see 75 as a retirement age, but I’d want more out of the system if I’m putting more in. I’d do 75 if they brought in my idea above & upped the pension to something closer to Germany rather than some third world country.
S |
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"So we’re just gonna work until we die? Men do it anyway but the principle is important "
Men and women do it. Unpaid work in the house is still work, many women are also unpaid carers looking after parents and often children at the same time. They are also clearing up fir adult children who are living at home longer. |
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If we can't afford the welfare costs of pensioners now, being a pensioner won't be economically viable in 20 years.
So I have a solution, I worked it out with a friend. Voluntary euthanasia for depression, accelerated process. When the impoverished pensioners call the NHS Crisis line - brought to you by Brondo (it's got what plants crave) - saying I can't cope anymore. Straight to the narco-pods. Nitrogen cheap, easy, painless.
Then when we have demonstrated the positive effects for the economy. And the statistics demonstrate that age is indeed a cause of depression rather than a correlation - we make it mandatory 1 year after retirement age. Then we don't need pensions at all.
Economic crisis sorted  |
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"What do you think of the suggestion from jacon that he wants the pension age to be increased to 72 from 66 years which it currently is.
I think that 72 years old is too long wait. I wonder if it have anything to do with that they want to prolong the time to pay the pension in order of the government to save money?"
No... What is the pension age in france? We are going backwards rather than forwards in this country. |
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"So we’re just gonna work until we die? Men do it anyway but the principle is important
Men and women do it. Unpaid work in the house is still work, many women are also unpaid carers looking after parents and often children at the same time. They are also clearing up fir adult children who are living at home longer."
Any competent adult children living in my house would be clearing up after themselves or discovering how tricky the rental market is currently  |
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"I don’t think anyone should be entitled to a pension… how can this amazing government be expected to fund a pension for the millions of workshy freeloading old gits and also still afford the meagre bonuses those hard working bankers need to survive just above the poverty line.  "
I agree, a face to face with ones 'accountant' in the Bahamas or the British Virgin Islands to discuss how much one has squirreled away by tax avoidance is a necessary burden every three months and first class travel hasn't gotten any cheaper.. |
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"I don’t think anyone should be entitled to a pension… how can this amazing government be expected to fund a pension for the millions of workshy freeloading old gits and also still afford the meagre bonuses those hard working bankers need to survive just above the poverty line.
I agree, a face to face with ones 'accountant' in the Bahamas or the British Virgin Islands to discuss how much one has squirreled away by tax avoidance is a necessary burden every three months and first class travel hasn't gotten any cheaper.."
At last - the voice of reason !! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Not sure. Queen never retired till her death. Her son just started work at over 60.
No they just want us to die before then no payout.. So wrong.
Bad enough paying their wages £90k and expenses £120k plus.. So wrong when this country has been ruined by politicians. And yonder.
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"Yes it should, I actually think we need to turn the whole education/retirement system on its head.
I think when you hit twenty you should be given £20k in travel vouchers, these would have a ten year expiry.
Some would choose to travel the world possibly learning about other cultures at a point in their lives it could make a difference, some would spunk it all in Benidorm, some would save them till a bit older.
Just my opinion but atm people wait till retirement to do stuff, there’s no guarantee you’ll ever going to get there anyway or in good health or in a financial position to do anything.
So maybe a mechanism to do these things beforehand to try & better the individual which would be better for the country in the long run?
"
This would get my vote |
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By *mmmMaybeCouple
over a year ago
West Wales |
"Not sure. Queen never retired till her death. Her son just started work at over 60.
No they just want us to die before then no payout.. So wrong.
Bad enough paying their wages £90k and expenses £120k plus.. So wrong when this country has been ruined by politicians. And yonder.
"
Yeah, that shit needs knocking on the head. They do their own taxes ergo they are self employed. If I did a job for four years & then list it because I was crap I would not be getting any pension at all, let alone a very decent one.
S |
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If we’re than skint, then we obviously can’t afford final salary pensions for MPs, or their excesses expenses, first class travel, rishi’s helicopter and jets, the ongoing cost of running Chequers, subsidised meals, second home allowance and furnishings budget or the refurbishing of HOPor getting involved in any future wars- time for an independent review of all aspects of government spending I think? |
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Not a good idea! I've just retired was 66 in July! Admittedly I could go on a few more years(even in the very physical job I was doing) but was ready to finish I've worked all my adult life as most people do! Think it's time for a rest from it! Also it frees up jobs for the younger people! If anything lower it but that will never happen x |
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By *avinaTVTV/TS
over a year ago
Transsexual Transylvania |
"Let's face it if you're on a low salary, then you're going work until you drop or face grim poverty. I have got no plans to retire. "
I'm not even on a low salary, and I'm going to have to work until I die. We spent all our money emigrating, and trying to reestablish ourselves in the UK took everything we had. It's only in the last 5 or 6 years that I've been able to pay anything into a pension. Too late. I'll never own a house, and I'll never have the private income to top up any state pension. I have a comfortable, modest standard of living now, but if I stop working I'm fucked. |
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By *batMan
over a year ago
Alicante, Spain. (Sometimes in Wales) |
Sadly, I think anyone who had planned on the state pension being enough for their old age, was very mistaken.
When (if) I get it, it’ll just be a very nice bonus. In the meantime, I’ve taken my healthy (expensive) private pension and live in a cheaper, warmer, friendlier country. A bit of part time work on top of that is just the icing on the cake!
Gbat |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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NO.
The sooner people start to realise that ordinary people are being milked by the millionaires who govern us for the benefit of their friends and themselves the better.
We pay into a pozi system where only those at the top get something back..Westminster, and the likes of Eaton need burning to the ground. |
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By *batMan
over a year ago
Alicante, Spain. (Sometimes in Wales) |
"I'm living solely off the state pension tough going but can b done ! X"
Sorry if my earlier comment seemed a little insensitive. I’m not saying it can’t be done, just that most people wouldn’t want to try it!
Best of luck and happy fabbing,
Gbat. Xx |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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The pension has always been empty, from start up in 1948, as there was not prefunding on start up so relied on taxes collect that week or month to pay pensions…
Also do remember that tax is payable on both state and private pensions if you are, will be receiving over the tax threshold figures , do bear that in mind |
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"I'm living solely off the state pension tough going but can b done ! X
Sorry if my earlier comment seemed a little insensitive. I’m not saying it can’t be done, just that most people wouldn’t want to try it!
Best of luck and happy fabbing,
Gbat. Xx"
No not at all! I did consider staying on longer but decided to give it a try! I'm OK managing at mo! If I find I'm struggling I will have to look for something! I certainly wouldn't want to continue with last job as was very physical plus I don't drive so was cycling to and from leaving at 3 15 in the morning in all weather's! My dad took early retirement at 60 and died at 68 was pleased he had 8 years doing his own thing ! Happy fabbing to u 2! X |
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I don't think it should be raised any more I think that everyone should just work themselves to death .... they should die at work and be dropped in a biffa bin and someone younger slid into their slot |
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"Hell no! Definitely not! At 66, I'll of already worked for 50 years of my life for what, 10 years of retirement if I'm lucky. It's madness."
Absolutely hit the nail on the head! Grim as this may sound, unfortunately not everyone lives on to be a healthy 80 Yr old... |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Sadly governments of all hue don't think about fairness. When the old age pension was introduced in 1909 the age to receive it was 70. Life expectancy in the UK didn't reach that until around 1960, so the government's belief was that not too many would live to claim it.
The retirement age will continue to rise folks, like it or not. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Imo the pension age should be based on an agreed "average number of years left". The role of state pension has changed from effectively an is insurance policy for the very old, to almost a right to allow one to stop working.
(That's where personal pensions come in)
The economics of the state pension ATM just don't work. The number of tax payers to pensioners is taking too much. There's a limit to how much one can tax. Or introduce new workers from abroad.
There are some other ideas that could be introduced here. A shift to an investment based scheme could be interesting. Create a state fund.
But pay as you go state pensions need to be reviewed asap. Likewise care costs. |
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"There's no money left in the pension pot, where do you think all the furlough money and backhanders to Tory mates for non-existent PPE came from during lockdown?
They want us working till we drop and then they don't have to pay out anything.
My state pension age is 67, so I've another 7yrs before can draw it. I'm lucky I have a private pension but if I draw on that now I have to pay tax on it because I'm still working.
"
It has been well known that the pension pots have been screwed since the 1980s - Maggie Thatcher actually tried to make changes then to avert the issues we are now seeing and it went down like a bowl of sick so we are reaping that failure to follow through.
If you are relying on a government pension for your old age then you need a plan B because there will be no pension pots
If they reduce the retirement age then all that means is that the pot will get emptied faster - pushing the retirement age back actually is the one option that might save the system but you can see from this thread how popular that will be. |
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By *orny-DJMan
over a year ago
Leigh-on-Sea |
Changing the pension age won't save 'the government' a penny as governments don't have any money. All money spent by the government comes from taxpayers.
The state pension is provided for by the SERPs element of National Insurance contributions.
The thinking is that you're paying for your own retirement,in reality, those paying NI are providing for the pensions of those currently in receipt of tge state pension.
The problem, for the goverment, is that with people living longer, more people are claiming it than ever before and they need to find ways to fund it. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Personally they can do what they want I won't be working much longer 53 Friday so have 2 yrs min left I'd rather see it lowered to 60 for everyone but if they want to work they should be able to without any penalties. |
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By *arkus1812Man
over a year ago
Lifes departure lounge NN9 Northamptonshire East not West MidlandsMidlands |
Something I have not seen mentioned is whether or not State Pensions should be means tested for people on larger salaries when they reach retirement age.
My sister is a classic case, as a result of her late husbands final salary pension of which she now receives 75% and her own finally salary pension she gets around £24000 a month before tax yet she still gets a state pension based on her N I contributions, which incidentally she donates to charity together with her winter fuel allowance.
I know of some others on gold plated final salary pensions who are also receiving State Pensions. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I think it should be lowered by quite a lot. There’s been talk of there being nothing left by the time our age group get there which is worrying
Our age group? You ain’t far off Fluff "
Pipe down grandpa |
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By *mmmMaybeCouple
over a year ago
West Wales |
"72 is a crazy age and if you’re going to do it you have to have a VERY long lead in time where it is not applicable to anyone alive today imo "
I think the current rules say a one year increase every decade so yes will not be applicable for many of us.
S |
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"We may not even live until 72 with all lifestyle diseases that are around these days.
Cancer, stroke, heart diseases, obesity, diabetes, lung diseases from pollution and so on.
K"
Agreed , keep your
Money in your
Pocket |
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By *hagTonight OP Man
over a year ago
From the land of haribos. |
"My dad continued to work in a manual job until he was 75. He is exceptional in that he was and is extremely fit. I doubt many could do what he did.
I think that things are very different now to when the pension was introduced over 100 years ago and as unfair as it might seem it's necessary to start preparing for older age when you first start working. To be honest though the state pension has never been enough to live on comfortably or even uncomfortably and it's always been a good idea to have back up. How you can do that in the current economic climate or if you've always worked in a lower paid job I do not know. "
That is good how your dad continued to work until he was 75 and yes. I also think that it is a bit different now, as you say there of how the pension was introduced back then too. |
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"No, just means test it on savings/private pensions to give a lower and a higher rate. "
Why on savings ?
Who would save if that was the case ?
Two people who earn the same amount. One lives the high life the other saves. So the one that lived the high life gets a pension and the one who saved gets fuck all ? How is that right ? |
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"No, just means test it on savings/private pensions to give a lower and a higher rate.
Why on savings ?
Who would save if that was the case ?
Two people who earn the same amount. One lives the high life the other saves. So the one that lived the high life gets a pension and the one who saved gets fuck all ? How is that right ?"
Because they have more to live on. Some people have higher savings due to selling property, it's not necessarily living a high life. If I have 100k in savings and a £750 a week pension, why do I need the same pension as someone with no savings and a £200 a week pension? I don't. |
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By *trideMan
over a year ago
Plymouth |
According to the Office For National Statistics:
“In 2017 to 2019, disability free life expectancy (DFLE) in the UK was 62.3 years for males and 61.0 years for females.”
So how much HEALTHY work-free life do we want?
The number of pensioners is increasing, especially the sick ones, because of improvements in medical science.
The number of fit working people who contribute to the “pension pot” to support them is decreasing because of the low birth rate.
BUT – automation and artificial intelligence are reducing the number of working people needed to support our standard of living. So the taxes paid by the ever decreasing working population will have to be increased to support the ever increasing number of people who will be permanently on the dole, i.e. retired early.
Keep an eye on the Japanese. They’re way ahead of us down this road.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"According to the Office For National Statistics:
“In 2017 to 2019, disability free life expectancy (DFLE) in the UK was 62.3 years for males and 61.0 years for females.”
So how much HEALTHY work-free life do we want?
The number of pensioners is increasing, especially the sick ones, because of improvements in medical science.
The number of fit working people who contribute to the “pension pot” to support them is decreasing because of the low birth rate.
BUT – automation and artificial intelligence are reducing the number of working people needed to support our standard of living. So the taxes paid by the ever decreasing working population will have to be increased to support the ever increasing number of people who will be permanently on the dole, i.e. retired early.
Keep an eye on the Japanese. They’re way ahead of us down this road.
"
interest stats !
This is at birth expectancy. Get to 65 and you can expect ten years more years. |
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"According to the Office For National Statistics:
“In 2017 to 2019, disability free life expectancy (DFLE) in the UK was 62.3 years for males and 61.0 years for females.”
So how much HEALTHY work-free life do we want?
The number of pensioners is increasing, especially the sick ones, because of improvements in medical science.
The number of fit working people who contribute to the “pension pot” to support them is decreasing because of the low birth rate.
BUT – automation and artificial intelligence are reducing the number of working people needed to support our standard of living. So the taxes paid by the ever decreasing working population will have to be increased to support the ever increasing number of people who will be permanently on the dole, i.e. retired early.
Keep an eye on the Japanese. They’re way ahead of us down this road.
"
Well. My disability free life ended when I was 31. I still work. I'll still be working as long as I can, until it's completely impossible to do so.
Lots of people work despite disabilities of different kinds, at all sorts of ages. We have the same pension age as everyone else though, the same as "healthy" people.
I don't know what point I'm trying to make, just that if we're basing the pension age on "disability free" years, then I'd have retired almost 7yrs ago! It's not that straightforward. |
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"According to the Office For National Statistics:
“In 2017 to 2019, disability free life expectancy (DFLE) in the UK was 62.3 years for males and 61.0 years for females.”
So how much HEALTHY work-free life do we want?
The number of pensioners is increasing, especially the sick ones, because of improvements in medical science.
The number of fit working people who contribute to the “pension pot” to support them is decreasing because of the low birth rate.
BUT – automation and artificial intelligence are reducing the number of working people needed to support our standard of living. So the taxes paid by the ever decreasing working population will have to be increased to support the ever increasing number of people who will be permanently on the dole, i.e. retired early.
Keep an eye on the Japanese. They’re way ahead of us down this road.
"
Government income comes from many sources and can be used for any expenditure. Income tax doesn't have to notionally be the sole contributor to pensions. It could be AI or wealth taxes, for example, that notionally pay for most |
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By *usie pTV/TS
over a year ago
taunton |
I don't think money has ever been put into a pension pot for the state pension, some of us started paying towards it at 15/ 16 now there are a vast amount of young folks not paying anything in until mid twenties. |
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"I don't think money has ever been put into a pension pot for the state pension, some of us started paying towards it at 15/ 16 now there are a vast amount of young folks not paying anything in until mid twenties."
Today's state pensions are paid for by today's taxpayers. My taxes are not being squirrelled away for my old age, I will rely on my children's taxes and their colleagues, to supply any state pension. My occupational pension should be a more secure thing, but pension investment companies could totally screw it up and gamble it away on the stock market |
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It wouldn't surprise me if in the not too distant future state pensions will be means tested.
The lovely government in power will decide how much we all need each month to live and then they will calculate how much to top you up, or not.
To cover anyone deciding to refuse to pay an occupational pension, it will become compulsory for employers to squirrel money out of your hard earned into a private pension.
I realy, really hope I'm wrong. |
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"No, just means test it on savings/private pensions to give a lower and a higher rate.
Why on savings ?
Who would save if that was the case ?
Two people who earn the same amount. One lives the high life the other saves. So the one that lived the high life gets a pension and the one who saved gets fuck all ? How is that right ?
Because they have more to live on. Some people have higher savings due to selling property, it's not necessarily living a high life. If I have 100k in savings and a £750 a week pension, why do I need the same pension as someone with no savings and a £200 a week pension? I don't. "
They only have more to live on because they saved their money. The other person spent all theirs having what they wanted and THEN get a pension.
Imagine your dad gives you 100,000 and the same to your sister to take you though uni .....
You save like mad but your sister spends every last penny on what ever she wants.
When neither of you have a job your dad says ..... I'm going to give your sister a monthly pay check cos she's got nothing but you don't get anything cos you were careful and saved some of your money ....
Is that right ? fair ? encouraging of saving or spending ?
|
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"No, just means test it on savings/private pensions to give a lower and a higher rate.
Why on savings ?
Who would save if that was the case ?
Two people who earn the same amount. One lives the high life the other saves. So the one that lived the high life gets a pension and the one who saved gets fuck all ? How is that right ?
Because they have more to live on. Some people have higher savings due to selling property, it's not necessarily living a high life. If I have 100k in savings and a £750 a week pension, why do I need the same pension as someone with no savings and a £200 a week pension? I don't.
They only have more to live on because they saved their money. The other person spent all theirs having what they wanted and THEN get a pension.
Imagine your dad gives you 100,000 and the same to your sister to take you though uni .....
You save like mad but your sister spends every last penny on what ever she wants.
When neither of you have a job your dad says ..... I'm going to give your sister a monthly pay check cos she's got nothing but you don't get anything cos you were careful and saved some of your money ....
Is that right ? fair ? encouraging of saving or spending ?
"
The latter is sort of what happened between my mother and my Grandad. She continually peed any money down the drain and he bailed her out. You should see the shit show that went down after his passing and is still ongoing, almost 3yrs later (I can't believe it's that long either ) |
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"No, just means test it on savings/private pensions to give a lower and a higher rate.
Why on savings ?
Who would save if that was the case ?
Two people who earn the same amount. One lives the high life the other saves. So the one that lived the high life gets a pension and the one who saved gets fuck all ? How is that right ?
Because they have more to live on. Some people have higher savings due to selling property, it's not necessarily living a high life. If I have 100k in savings and a £750 a week pension, why do I need the same pension as someone with no savings and a £200 a week pension? I don't.
They only have more to live on because they saved their money. The other person spent all theirs having what they wanted and THEN get a pension.
Imagine your dad gives you 100,000 and the same to your sister to take you though uni .....
You save like mad but your sister spends every last penny on what ever she wants.
When neither of you have a job your dad says ..... I'm going to give your sister a monthly pay check cos she's got nothing but you don't get anything cos you were careful and saved some of your money ....
Is that right ? fair ? encouraging of saving or spending ?
"
Yeah that's fine, I'll still have a better life as I have more money because I saved, the lower rate is irrelevant as I'll be comfortable. |
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"2 simple words
My hole
We ve worked long enough"
Why dose there have to be an age.
It should be years worked.
I started working and paying NI at 14. If you go to university and start much later in life then you retire at a diferant age..
My stamp is all payed up at 55 but have to do 12 more years lol will probably end up on the sick. |
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If retirement ages goes up to 72 but you have worked a hard manual job outdoors all your life in construction or farming and eventually your body just isnt able anymore before the age of 72, what then ? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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There needs to be a static reform of the whole employment system.
I've always suggested that people should do national service, but not as you think.
It can be a full time job for at least 3 or 4 years in hundreds of different industries, not just the armed services.
But jobs that will return an apprenticeship or qualification.
Or I'm turn you get further education paid for you if you want it.
It would require a huge shift in mind set and a high initial cost but the longer term benefits would come through allowing the retirement age to fall.
X |
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"There needs to be a static reform of the whole employment system.
I've always suggested that people should do national service, but not as you think.
It can be a full time job for at least 3 or 4 years in hundreds of different industries, not just the armed services.
But jobs that will return an apprenticeship or qualification.
Or I'm turn you get further education paid for you if you want it.
It would require a huge shift in mind set and a high initial cost but the longer term benefits would come through allowing the retirement age to fall.
X"
How would this allow the pension age to fall? Today's taxpayers pay for today's pensioners. If we increase the youthful workforce to its absolute max, the larger numbers of older people will still be out of whack with the numbers pay tax, especially with longer life expectancy and the triple lock.
Falling birth rates among high life expectancy* is never going to allow the pension age to fall.
*Expectancy dropped a smidge over the past two years but it was a tiny fall overall and the average across the UK is still about 82. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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It’s obvious that people live longer which is a problem for the Government
More medical and pension bills
Think they need a hold on illegal immigration, then getting the idle sods who won’t have work off the dole
Stop chucking money away on people that don’t deserve it |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"There needs to be a static reform of the whole employment system.
I've always suggested that people should do national service, but not as you think.
It can be a full time job for at least 3 or 4 years in hundreds of different industries, not just the armed services.
But jobs that will return an apprenticeship or qualification.
Or I'm turn you get further education paid for you if you want it.
It would require a huge shift in mind set and a high initial cost but the longer term benefits would come through allowing the retirement age to fall.
X
How would this allow the pension age to fall? Today's taxpayers pay for today's pensioners. If we increase the youthful workforce to its absolute max, the larger numbers of older people will still be out of whack with the numbers pay tax, especially with longer life expectancy and the triple lock.
Falling birth rates among high life expectancy* is never going to allow the pension age to fall.
*Expectancy dropped a smidge over the past two years but it was a tiny fall overall and the average across the UK is still about 82. "
Of course I'm no expert and I'm always happy corrected. My thought is that if we can maximise the working age and get everyone into employment, other support budgets would hopefully fall also people's spending power increases as they're is more around.
But it is fanciful thinking. As I completely agree there are difficult times ahead with the falling numbers in working are people compared to everyone living longer. X |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"There needs to be a static reform of the whole employment system.
I've always suggested that people should do national service, but not as you think.
It can be a full time job for at least 3 or 4 years in hundreds of different industries, not just the armed services.
But jobs that will return an apprenticeship or qualification.
Or I'm turn you get further education paid for you if you want it.
It would require a huge shift in mind set and a high initial cost but the longer term benefits would come through allowing the retirement age to fall.
X
How would this allow the pension age to fall? Today's taxpayers pay for today's pensioners. If we increase the youthful workforce to its absolute max, the larger numbers of older people will still be out of whack with the numbers pay tax, especially with longer life expectancy and the triple lock.
Falling birth rates among high life expectancy* is never going to allow the pension age to fall.
*Expectancy dropped a smidge over the past two years but it was a tiny fall overall and the average across the UK is still about 82. "
imo, economies expand to meet supply. The UK pipikqtion has grown over 10m since I've been alive but we don't have 10m extra unemployment. I'm sure there's complexity but it's not a fixed bucket of workers |
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Pension age should be coming down, not going up
Disgraceful that it was raised a couple of years back
Ive seen too many people in the building trade struggling to even walk as they approach their 60s, yet a guy sat behind a desk in London decides they should have to work longer and he then retires on a huge pension |
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By *hagTonight OP Man
over a year ago
From the land of haribos. |
"Will most of us be able to retire unless you are putting a lot into your pension now, I know I can’t at the moment
I'm living solely of the state pension tough going but can b done ! X"
That is good that you can manage to do it too x |
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By *hagTonight OP Man
over a year ago
From the land of haribos. |
"Pension age should be coming down, not going up
Disgraceful that it was raised a couple of years back
Ive seen too many people in the building trade struggling to even walk as they approach their 60s, yet a guy sat behind a desk in London decides they should have to work longer and he then retires on a huge pension"
Yes, it should be coming down too |
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