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The Black Voice Project
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By *ssex_tom OP Man
over a year ago
Chelmsford |
A poll of 10,000 black Britons says that less than half are proud to be British with reasons cited as unfair immigration, colonialism, racism. Are you black and proud to be British?
Are you white and proud to be British. Tom cares not a jot about nationalism. Tom is just proud to be Tom. |
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By *elloWoman
over a year ago
alpha centauri |
Two years ago I started a university course It was a course with lots of mature students and during one of the lectures about British values the students who were born in Africa said that they tell their teenage/young adult children that they are African but the children insist that because they were born in UK and that's all they knew, that they were in fact British. This seemed to upset the parent because they wanted their children to be proud to be African yet they seemed proud to be British |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I’m proud to see my ethnicity as Black British.
But my feelings are that Britains is not a country that has historically or currently loved and appreciated the Blackness of Black Brits. It hasn’t appreciated or loved the cultural impact of Black Brits. It hasn’t acknowledged or truly considered the impact on the African diaspora the actions of its past. That makes being proud to be British difficult. Loving a place that doesn’t love you of hard. But you have to. I’m too British to be Jamaican. And ultimately I’m made here. My experience is made here. I’m British. That’s an unavoidable fact.
I’m proud when I consider the impact of Black British people. When I think about the cultural icons that inspire. But I feel less proud about the country itself and its history with Black people.
I’m not going to go any further than that because what I’ve already said makes me likely to get hate anyway. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Two years ago I started a university course It was a course with lots of mature students and during one of the lectures about British values the students who were born in Africa said that they tell their teenage/young adult children that they are African but the children insist that because they were born in UK and that's all they knew, that they were in fact British. This seemed to upset the parent because they wanted their children to be proud to be African yet they seemed proud to be British"
Most of my friends born here that are African all say that they’re from where they’re from in Africa unless the question is asked by a White person or is an official question. |
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"
Most of my friends born here that are African all say that they’re from where they’re from in Africa unless the question is asked by a White person or is an official question. "
That’s interesting |
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"I’m proud to see my ethnicity as Black British.
But my feelings are that Britains is not a country that has historically or currently loved and appreciated the Blackness of Black Brits. It hasn’t appreciated or loved the cultural impact of Black Brits. It hasn’t acknowledged or truly considered the impact on the African diaspora the actions of its past. That makes being proud to be British difficult. Loving a place that doesn’t love you of hard. But you have to. I’m too British to be Jamaican. And ultimately I’m made here. My experience is made here. I’m British. That’s an unavoidable fact.
I’m proud when I consider the impact of Black British people. When I think about the cultural icons that inspire. But I feel less proud about the country itself and its history with Black people.
I’m not going to go any further than that because what I’ve already said makes me likely to get hate anyway. "
Only love from me. |
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By *aitonelMan
over a year ago
Away for Christmas |
Pride should be reserved for something you achieve or obtain on your own, not something that happens by accident of birth. Being Irish isn't a skill... it's a fucking genetic accident. You wouldn't say I'm proud to be 5'11"; “I’m proud to have brown hair,” or “I’m proud to be short and stocky.” So why the fuck should you say you’re proud to be Irish? I’m Irish, but I’m not particularly proud of it. Just glad! Goddamn glad to be Irish! - George Carlin |
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I don't really understand the idea of being proud to be British. I think it's vague what exactly that means. There are good and bad things about most countries.
My intention is to be a responsible citizen and I am pleased that I come from and live here over other countries I could name. I don't know if that the same thing as being proud. |
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I'm a person who lives on a tiny speck of rock in the vast expanse of the infinite universe.
When you think on a universal scale they colour of ones skin and where we are born is kind of irrelevant.
Threads like this just create further division. |
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No idea who this Tom is, maybe it's Mr Titt?
These polls get the answers they want, given the state of the country is it relevant separate people on questions like this.
Apparently, 100% of them didn't understand why their view was more or less relevant than anyone else's. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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But I think that people being proud to live in a country is a positive thing. If you don't believe in that, what is negative about it? What is wrong with it?
Aren't you curious why thousands of Black Britons answered the way they did? I am. |
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By *rHotNottsMan
over a year ago
Dubai & Nottingham |
"I don't see what a colonial past has to do with the here and now. I think like nearly everyone else in the UK we hate our government. We should all be joining together to look after our futures."
But I don’t understand why people say, they hate the government, the people chose them. They are the best you have, they are reflective of the people. Anyone can join a political party & stand |
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By *aitonelMan
over a year ago
Away for Christmas |
"I don't see what a colonial past has to do with the here and now. I think like nearly everyone else in the UK we hate our government. We should all be joining together to look after our futures.
But I don’t understand why people say, they hate the government, the people chose them. They are the best you have, they are reflective of the people. Anyone can join a political party & stand"
Indeed.
To yet again quote George Carlin
"Now, there's one thing you might have noticed I don't complain about: politicians. Everybody complains about politicians. Everybody says they suck. Well, where do people think these politicians come from? They don't fall out of the sky. They don't pass through a membrane from another reality. They come from American parents and American families, American homes, American schools, American churches, American businesses and American universities, and they are elected by American citizens. This is the best we can do folks. This is what we have to offer. It's what our system produces: Garbage in, garbage out. If you have selfish, ignorant citizens, you're going to get selfish, ignorant leaders. Term limits ain't going to do any good; you're just going to end up with a brand new bunch of selfish, ignorant Americans. So, maybe, maybe, maybe, it's not the politicians who suck. Maybe something else sucks around here... like, the public. Yeah, the public sucks. There's a nice campaign slogan for somebody: 'The Public Sucks. Fuck Hope." |
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By *abioMan
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
"White and distinctly not proud for much of the reasons stated. But I would be even less proud of being from other countries such as USA."
Thanks for that… I’m a duel national…. 
So how do I feel about being British/American… hmmm
I suppose it’s part of me but doesn’t define me.. if that makes sense… the older I have gotten the more proud of my Caribbean heritage I have gotten, and it’s taken me a while to get there as well….
It’s complicated!!! |
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By *rHotNottsMan
over a year ago
Dubai & Nottingham |
Most of my west African friends in Nigeria, Cameroon and cite d’ivoire think Britain is great, like some world leader on everything that’s good and right. Nigerians often tell me we left too soon.
Yet in recent years they fear coming to London due to violent crime - compared to Lagos - crime capital of the world - |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Two years ago I started a university course It was a course with lots of mature students and during one of the lectures about British values the students who were born in Africa said that they tell their teenage/young adult children that they are African but the children insist that because they were born in UK and that's all they knew, that they were in fact British. This seemed to upset the parent because they wanted their children to be proud to be African yet they seemed proud to be British
Most of my friends born here that are African all say that they’re from where they’re from in Africa unless the question is asked by a White person or is an official question. "
If another black/Asian person asks where I'm from ill say Jamaica but if any other national asks ill say Birmingham, usually when a non poc asks its from a place of ignorance so I'm keen to shut down the conversation as quickly as possible |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Two years ago I started a university course It was a course with lots of mature students and during one of the lectures about British values the students who were born in Africa said that they tell their teenage/young adult children that they are African but the children insist that because they were born in UK and that's all they knew, that they were in fact British. This seemed to upset the parent because they wanted their children to be proud to be African yet they seemed proud to be British"
Being mixed race I often when I was younger would play up my white side in order to fit in, but now as a much older adult, I feel as though I can revel in all my identities as every little part makes me |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Two years ago I started a university course It was a course with lots of mature students and during one of the lectures about British values the students who were born in Africa said that they tell their teenage/young adult children that they are African but the children insist that because they were born in UK and that's all they knew, that they were in fact British. This seemed to upset the parent because they wanted their children to be proud to be African yet they seemed proud to be British"
Someone saying that they are British because they were born and raised in Britain doesn't mean that they are proud to be British |
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"How can we be proud to be black British when some white people refuse to see us as British and often tell us to "go back to where we're from"
"
I use to feel that way until I realised that this is where I was born and we have contributed to this country before the Romans even came here whether its chosen to be taught or not and I won't let anyone deny me of that just because they're white and ancestors most probably came here with the vikings/Germans. I was born here so I am British end of. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Extremely proud
Britain has done some amazing things through history. We’ve done some bad, like all others have, but we’ve been at the forefront of human rights, equality, science and innovation, and not many other countries or cultures can claim that
The world is vastly better off today for Britain’s role in shaping it and I’m extremely proud of that fact |
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By *abioMan
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
"How can we be proud to be black British when some white people refuse to see us as British and often tell us to "go back to where we're from"
"
There is a phrase I haven’t heard in a while…. But I think every black person has heard some form of that |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"How can we be proud to be black British when some white people refuse to see us as British and often tell us to "go back to where we're from"
"
tesstt more like tesstooreal |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"How can we be proud to be black British when some white people refuse to see us as British and often tell us to "go back to where we're from"
"
Someone said that to my bestie once and quick as a flash she said ‘what, to my mums vagina? Don’t think I’d fit now’  |
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I realise this is one of those subjects that is extremely sensitive, and I’m reluctant to say anything because I’m sure there’ll be a backlash.
But I’m always concerned that just as most people (including me) were accepting the fact that everybody is equal, the ‘Black Power’ movement wanted more.
Not just equals, not seeing everyone as ‘people’, but wanting power.
The balance was becoming balance, but now it’s tipping the scales. Let’s just be ‘people’. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I realise this is one of those subjects that is extremely sensitive, and I’m reluctant to say anything because I’m sure there’ll be a backlash.
But I’m always concerned that just as most people (including me) were accepting the fact that everybody is equal, the ‘Black Power’ movement wanted more.
Not just equals, not seeing everyone as ‘people’, but wanting power.
The balance was becoming balance, but now it’s tipping the scales. Let’s just be ‘people’. "
I don’t think we’re close to balance. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"I realise this is one of those subjects that is extremely sensitive, and I’m reluctant to say anything because I’m sure there’ll be a backlash.
But I’m always concerned that just as most people (including me) were accepting the fact that everybody is equal, the ‘Black Power’ movement wanted more.
Not just equals, not seeing everyone as ‘people’, but wanting power.
The balance was becoming balance, but now it’s tipping the scales. Let’s just be ‘people’. "
The Black Power movement wants more. Right. Any receipts for your statement that equality has been achieved in Britain? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"But I think that people being proud to live in a country is a positive thing. If you don't believe in that, what is negative about it? What is wrong with it?
Aren't you curious why thousands of Black Britons answered the way they did? I am. "
Still no answer to my questions. |
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"Two years ago I started a university course It was a course with lots of mature students and during one of the lectures about British values the students who were born in Africa said that they tell their teenage/young adult children that they are African but the children insist that because they were born in UK and that's all they knew, that they were in fact British. This seemed to upset the parent because they wanted their children to be proud to be African yet they seemed proud to be British
Most of my friends born here that are African all say that they’re from where they’re from in Africa unless the question is asked by a White person or is an official question.
If another black/Asian person asks where I'm from ill say Jamaica but if any other national asks ill say Birmingham, usually when a non poc asks its from a place of ignorance so I'm keen to shut down the conversation as quickly as possible "
We're you Born in Birmingham or Jamaica?
Surely that defines what nationality you are?
I guess you could be dual nationality but I'd always go with where I was born, hence I'm Scottish even though the passport says British. |
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By *abioMan
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
"I realise this is one of those subjects that is extremely sensitive, and I’m reluctant to say anything because I’m sure there’ll be a backlash.
But I’m always concerned that just as most people (including me) were accepting the fact that everybody is equal, the ‘Black Power’ movement wanted more.
Not just equals, not seeing everyone as ‘people’, but wanting power.
The balance was becoming balance, but now it’s tipping the scales. Let’s just be ‘people’. "
You think we are at balance…. Really? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"But I think that people being proud to live in a country is a positive thing. If you don't believe in that, what is negative about it? What is wrong with it?
Aren't you curious why thousands of Black Britons answered the way they did? I am.
Still no answer to my questions. "
Nearly every black British person has experienced racial abuse for simply existing in this country
Not sure if that is something to be proud of |
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By *mber81Woman
over a year ago
Chorley, Eng |
Nationalism often feels exclusionary rather than inclusionary to me.
I sometimes describe myself as Scottish but more often as from just outside of Glasgow, from Scotland or from the UK. Those feel like facts rather than a statement of belonging.
I am not ashamed of being white, again that is just fact. But I have never felt proud to be white. A lot of what is done in the name of 'being white' is an affront to me.
Being white with a Scottish accent and a British passport has no doubt been useful for me, allowing me into places and spaces with an ease I often didn't even realise at the time. But being part of a society or a world that allows my whiteness or Britishness to be an asset no matter who I am or what I do? That is fucking embarrassing. |
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As someone who's lived through the rise in breakaway nationalism, I'm certainly happy to be British.
For all it's faults I thinks its the most multicultural place on earth, and always was multicultural by nature. From coracles to the Roman navy to long boats to Windrush we're the island(s) people sailed to, and people could do it from all around us. We don't make a deal of it, but people even settle (back) here from America.
Britain is actually so multifariously multicultural it can easily harbour mono-culturalists who say that they alone truly represent Britain (despite being only a section of their own ethnicity) to even people claiming that multiculturalism doesn't truly exist (I knew a Wikipedia admin who insisted this).
pt
|
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"But I think that people being proud to live in a country is a positive thing. If you don't believe in that, what is negative about it? What is wrong with it?
Aren't you curious why thousands of Black Britons answered the way they did? I am.
Still no answer to my questions.
Nearly every black British person has experienced racial abuse for simply existing in this country
Not sure if that is something to be proud of"
What she said. It's a doubled edge sward. |
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I don't think it's necessarily a bad thing to be proud of where you are from, or proud of your cultural heritage. I am British and white, and I happen to like keeping my cultural identity in this increasingly homogenous world. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Nearly every black British person has experienced racial abuse for simply existing in this country
Not sure if that is something to be proud of"
Hell of a statement right there  |
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"Nearly every black British person has experienced racial abuse for simply existing in this country
Not sure if that is something to be proud of
Hell of a statement right there "
But a true one sadly |
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"Nearly every black British person has experienced racial abuse for simply existing in this country
Not sure if that is something to be proud of
Hell of a statement right there
But a true one sadly
"
I think you could put it as every black person in Britain will experience that.
To me it's just a statistical certainty, essentially a statement of fact.
pt |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Wherever you go in the world you’ll meet locals who claim that the county they happened to be born in is the best in the world (not sure what metric we’re all using!)They can’t all be right!
“Nationalism is an infantile disease” - Einstein. |
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By *mber81Woman
over a year ago
Chorley, Eng |
"As someone who's lived through the rise in breakaway nationalism, I'm certainly happy to be British.
For all it's faults I thinks its the most multicultural place on earth, and always was multicultural by nature. From coracles to the Roman navy to long boats to Windrush we're the island(s) people sailed to, and people could do it from all around us. We don't make a deal of it, but people even settle (back) here from America.
Britain is actually so multifariously multicultural it can easily harbour mono-culturalists who say that they alone truly represent Britain (despite being only a section of their own ethnicity) to even people claiming that multiculturalism doesn't truly exist (I knew a Wikipedia admin who insisted this).
pt
"
The UK has gone out to other countries looking for labour making promises of belonging and a wonderful life. That is exactly what happened with wind rush and then years later sent some of these people or thier families away denying the life they had created and the society they had contributed to.
The phrase Stop The Boats is now also considered a unifying and politically expedite phrase. So whilst the UK may be multicultural it isn't comfortable with it or embracing it. |
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"Wherever you go in the world you’ll meet locals who claim that the county they happened to be born in is the best in the world (not sure what metric we’re all using!)They can’t all be right!
“Nationalism is an infantile disease” - Einstein.
"
I often call nationalism the Achilles' heel of the Left, and sometimes even a cancer of the soul.
The thing about Britain (and British) though, is that it's a union, and one that (though not perfect) is democratic (such as it is) and just makes so much cultural sense. Such unions are my favourite nations, and also my favourite flags (and flags are something I'm not all that keen on too).
pt |
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"As someone who's lived through the rise in breakaway nationalism, I'm certainly happy to be British.
For all it's faults I thinks its the most multicultural place on earth, and always was multicultural by nature. From coracles to the Roman navy to long boats to Windrush we're the island(s) people sailed to, and people could do it from all around us. We don't make a deal of it, but people even settle (back) here from America.
Britain is actually so multifariously multicultural it can easily harbour mono-culturalists who say that they alone truly represent Britain (despite being only a section of their own ethnicity) to even people claiming that multiculturalism doesn't truly exist (I knew a Wikipedia admin who insisted this).
pt
The UK has gone out to other countries looking for labour making promises of belonging and a wonderful life. That is exactly what happened with wind rush and then years later sent some of these people or thier families away denying the life they had created and the society they had contributed to.
The phrase Stop The Boats is now also considered a unifying and politically expedite phrase. So whilst the UK may be multicultural it isn't comfortable with it or embracing it.
"
Some people aren't for sure (too many who are too loud), but those people unwittingly actually add to the whole picture imo. Britain somehow contains it all.
pt |
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By *abioMan
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
"Nearly every black British person has experienced racial abuse for simply existing in this country
Not sure if that is something to be proud of
Hell of a statement right there
But a true one sadly "
What they said…. It’s one of those statements where white people may deny it.. but if they ask most black people they will find that it’s true… |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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WE ARE HUMAN END OF .... colour , religion , sex , where you think you belong , what group you aspire to be part of , the partner you chose and chose what kind of partner to be ...... its all meaningless , WE ARE HUMAN we canoly ever be one thing , the one thing we crave our whole lives .. L.O.V.E. in love there is no devide , no loss , no hate , no dispare yet as a species you hurt , you feel pain , you feel anger , you feel hate ..... YOU ARE ONLY HUMAN and in humanity love will prevail  |
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I don't feel like I'm from anywhere particular. I feel no strong allegiance to anywhere. I struggle to answer the question "where are you from?" because I'm from all over the place. Where I'm originally from, other than my name, I have little connection with (though I'd like to). No-one believes I'm from where I'm originally from. My Great Grandfather was a non Caucasian immigrant yet I am the liliest white "English rose" type complexion.
Meh.
I used to be happy being European, but some people spoiled that. European largely covered all of "me". |
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Only Tom could make a thread titled 'The Black Voice Project' that says in it's OP "are you proud to be white and British?"!
It's like WLM, it's kind of covetous and jealous in my eyes. By demoting the concept of nationalism, and by extension our pride in such (there are many instinctive globalists in modern politics btw - from Blair to Jonson), we must be careful not to also insinuate that racial prejudice, and the black identity that has party come from it, somehow doesn't have importance too (or even actually exist).
And I've said it before and I'll say it again (wherever this crops up), I think that some people just cannot handle the idea that any 'other' people can suffer any more, or in any other way, than they potentially can themselves.
It's like an innate entitlement to everything, including the boundaries of suffering. I've thought quite deeply about the internal elements of general racism for years. It's all about being reared to take and not to give imo. But we cannot properly survive like this.
pt |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"But I think that people being proud to live in a country is a positive thing. If you don't believe in that, what is negative about it? What is wrong with it?
Aren't you curious why thousands of Black Britons answered the way they did? I am.
Still no answer to my questions.
Nearly every black British person has experienced racial abuse for simply existing in this country
Not sure if that is something to be proud of"
I can absolutely see why black Britons replied the way they did. I guess my questions were anyone who doesn't think being proud of your country is positive. If it's not your thing and uoj don't feel it, sure. But why so negative about it?
And I find it strange that people dismiss the valid reasons why many Black Britons aren't proud of their country. |
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By *ssex_tom OP Man
over a year ago
Chelmsford |
"Only Tom could make a thread titled 'The Black Voice Project' that says in it's OP "are you proud to be white and British?"!
It's like WLM, it's kind of covetous and jealous in my eyes. By demoting the concept of nationalism, and by extension our pride in such (there are many instinctive globalists in modern politics btw - from Blair to Jonson), we must be careful not to also insinuate that racial prejudice, and the black identity that has party come from it, somehow doesn't have importance too (or even actually exist).
And I've said it before and I'll say it again (wherever this crops up), I think that some people just cannot handle the idea that any 'other' people can suffer any more, or in any other way, than they potentially can themselves.
It's like an innate entitlement to everything, including the boundaries of suffering. I've thought quite deeply about the internal elements of general racism for years. It's all about being reared to take and not to give imo. But we cannot properly survive like this.
pt "
Thank you for the compliment...
Tom is legend |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"But I think that people being proud to live in a country is a positive thing. If you don't believe in that, what is negative about it? What is wrong with it?
Aren't you curious why thousands of Black Britons answered the way they did? I am.
Still no answer to my questions.
Nearly every black British person has experienced racial abuse for simply existing in this country
Not sure if that is something to be proud of
I can absolutely see why black Britons replied the way they did. I guess my questions were anyone who doesn't think being proud of your country is positive. If it's not your thing and uoj don't feel it, sure. But why so negative about it?
And I find it strange that people dismiss the valid reasons why many Black Britons aren't proud of their country. "
They dismiss them because in their eyes the UK is perfect and any poc who complain about racism are either lying/exaggerating as the UK is "one of the most tolerant places on the planet" and/or we should just go back to where they came from if we don't like it here |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"But I think that people being proud to live in a country is a positive thing. If you don't believe in that, what is negative about it? What is wrong with it?
Aren't you curious why thousands of Black Britons answered the way they did? I am.
Still no answer to my questions.
Nearly every black British person has experienced racial abuse for simply existing in this country
Not sure if that is something to be proud of
I can absolutely see why black Britons replied the way they did. I guess my questions were anyone who doesn't think being proud of your country is positive. If it's not your thing and uoj don't feel it, sure. But why so negative about it?
And I find it strange that people dismiss the valid reasons why many Black Britons aren't proud of their country.
They dismiss them because in their eyes the UK is perfect and any poc who complain about racism are either lying/exaggerating as the UK is "one of the most tolerant places on the planet" and/or we should just go back to where they came from if we don't like it here "
Well, yeah, there is that. And you really need to forget about colonialism cos us white people have.  (sarcasm in case anyone takes me seriously!) |
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Neither proud or ashamed to born in this country, Just like I haven't contributed to anything great about in the UK, I haven't done anything to be embarrassed about either, Every country has past, best to just leave it there and live your life the best you can |
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