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The paradox of choice
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 here's a quick summary, it's a phenomenon where an abundance of options can counterintuitively lead to less happiness, less satisfaction, and hamper the ability to make a decision
This applies to many aspects of life, buying a new car or kitchen appliance, there's a sale on shoes but you only have enough cash to spare for 1 pair, choosing a restaurant etc. etc. the list goes on. However it has been observed in the dating and hookup world, and thus the paradox becomes increasingly problematic when it involves sharing your body, and mind, with another person
What do you think about this? Do you think the existence of this paradox is only going to make people feel worse? I can see that for some people who suffer from anxiety, wherever the anxiety stems from, this paradox can be very difficult to deal with | |||
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"Yes there's a really good RSA animate presentation on the subject, I can't remember the psychologists name. The more options, the greater the sense of loss we experience when we make a choice. I guess that could create an anxiety limbo state for some." Exactly, it's also worth mentioning that when we do make that choice, and the result doesn't live up to expectations it can leave people feeling very frustrated | |||
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"For those of you who haven't heard of it, feel free to Google it but if you're too lazy to do that here's a quick summary, it's a phenomenon where an abundance of options can counterintuitively lead to less happiness, less satisfaction, and hamper the ability to make a decision
This applies to many aspects of life, buying a new car or kitchen appliance, there's a sale on shoes but you only have enough cash to spare for 1 pair, choosing a restaurant etc. etc. the list goes on. However it has been observed in the dating and hookup world, and thus the paradox becomes increasingly problematic when it involves sharing your body, and mind, with another person
What do you think about this? Do you think the existence of this paradox is only going to make people feel worse? I can see that for some people who suffer from anxiety, wherever the anxiety stems from, this paradox can be very difficult to deal with"Interesting, I can only summise that this is a human made paradox. In a sense and with the advances of tecnology, media etc, we have given ourselve the access to more choice and as lots of people have become "consumer zombies", through social media and agian t.v, the phenomenon of celebrities and influencers, this is a problem we have made and is made worse by us. In the world of dating, I suppose one since we have moved away from traditional ways of meeting people to online access, which result in "cat fishing", think this is the term. I think sociol media and cunsumerism in general has made for a more anxious socioty as well as creating mental health problems. A very interesting discussion though point. | |||
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"For those of you who haven't heard of it, feel free to Google it but if you're too lazy to do that here's a quick summary, it's a phenomenon where an abundance of options can counterintuitively lead to less happiness, less satisfaction, and hamper the ability to make a decision
This applies to many aspects of life, buying a new car or kitchen appliance, there's a sale on shoes but you only have enough cash to spare for 1 pair, choosing a restaurant etc. etc. the list goes on. However it has been observed in the dating and hookup world, and thus the paradox becomes increasingly problematic when it involves sharing your body, and mind, with another person
What do you think about this? Do you think the existence of this paradox is only going to make people feel worse? I can see that for some people who suffer from anxiety, wherever the anxiety stems from, this paradox can be very difficult to deal with"The Brain and mind is very complex as it is!! | |||
"For those of you who haven't heard of it, feel free to Google it but if you're too lazy to do that here's a quick summary, it's a phenomenon where an abundance of options can counterintuitively lead to less happiness, less satisfaction, and hamper the ability to make a decision
This applies to many aspects of life, buying a new car or kitchen appliance, there's a sale on shoes but you only have enough cash to spare for 1 pair, choosing a restaurant etc. etc. the list goes on. However it has been observed in the dating and hookup world, and thus the paradox becomes increasingly problematic when it involves sharing your body, and mind, with another person
What do you think about this? Do you think the existence of this paradox is only going to make people feel worse? I can see that for some people who suffer from anxiety, wherever the anxiety stems from, this paradox can be very difficult to deal with Interesting, I can only summise that this is a human made paradox. In a sense and with the advances of tecnology, media etc, we have given ourselve the access to more choice and as lots of people have become "consumer zombies", through social media and agian t.v, the phenomenon of celebrities and influencers, this is a problem we have made and is made worse by us.
In the world of dating, I suppose one since we have moved away from traditional ways of meeting people to online access, which result in "cat fishing", think this is the term.
I think sociol media and cunsumerism in general has made for a more anxious socioty as well as creating mental health problems.
A very interesting discussion though point."It definitely is a human made paradox, and it's only getting worse without proper education in today's schools to address the changes in society As far as dating and hookups go, cat fishing is only one problem, but I feel it's most problematic when people's judgements and ideal preferences come into play. For example, why have sex with 5 women, all different ages, personalities, experience and how attracted you are to them and have varying results from not great to adequate, when you can wait and wait and wait and wait, and keep waiting, until you meet 1 woman who ticks all your boxes and gives you the best sex of your life It's also worth noting that while men and women, especially women, need to be careful about who they meet for obvious reasons, subjecting others to their strict preferences can lead to missed opportunities that do have a positive impact on our lives whether they're short or long term | |||
" Exactly, it's also worth mentioning that when we do make that choice, and the result doesn't live up to expectations it can leave people feeling very frustrated" A valid point sir. I think my way of dealing with it is to go with my intuitions. When that doesn't work out particularly well, I remind myself that it doesn't suggest the other options would have yielded superior outcomes. The weight of expectation itself, can taint an experience. Perhaps the frustration is the body informing the mind that it needs to stop overthinking? | |||
"I remember the ice cream shop idea. You go and choose an I’ve m team from a shop that has 40 plus flavours, and it takes you longer to choose, and your more than likely regret your choice and want to try someone else’s. Or, you choose from a cart that has vanilla, choc, strawberry. You choose quicker and you know it’s your best choice. Is it something like that? " Sort of, yes, but when you add more and more variables into the decision making process, you could walk away without any ice cream at all. Even if you know strawberry is your favourite flavour, you still might not choose strawberry because the blend of the ice cream and the flavour might not be what you're expecting i.e. bland, not sweet or fruity enough etc. | |||
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" Exactly, it's also worth mentioning that when we do make that choice, and the result doesn't live up to expectations it can leave people feeling very frustrated A valid point sir. I think my way of dealing with it is to go with my intuitions. When that doesn't work out particularly well, I remind myself that it doesn't suggest the other options would have yielded superior outcomes. The weight of expectation itself, can taint an experience. Perhaps the frustration is the body informing the mind that it needs to stop overthinking?" Absolutely, everyone knows expectations are not the same as the reality, yet so few manage to really understand that and still fall into that trap And to elaborate on feeling frustration, it's not the body telling the brain to stop overthinking, it comes from a negative experience you may have despite thinking you made every effort in making the best decision You can spend a long time vetting someone because they tick most of your boxes, but when the result doesn't meet your expectations, you just think "what a total waste of time". That can also lead to someone tightening their preferences leading to less options, but that counterintuitively makes it harder to choose because those who will fit your criteria becomes fewer and far between | |||
" You can spend a long time vetting someone because they tick most of your boxes, but when the result doesn't meet your expectations, you just think "what a total waste of time". That can also lead to someone tightening their preferences leading to less options, but that counterintuitively makes it harder to choose because those who will fit your criteria becomes fewer and far between" Hence the feeling of frustration keeps coming back to remind you. An incomplete gestalt cycle. We try to fulfill our needs from the options available to us. Sometimes we get in our own way. Can be past experiences of course. If the source is one's idea about themselves, then those iterations of experiences can lead to them becoming stuck in a cycle of seeking and avoidance or sabotage. Some details are important, but I don't think anything can replace the phenomenological experience of being with a person. One can't do that fully if one is locked in their internal thoughts and anxieties. | |||
" You can spend a long time vetting someone because they tick most of your boxes, but when the result doesn't meet your expectations, you just think "what a total waste of time". That can also lead to someone tightening their preferences leading to less options, but that counterintuitively makes it harder to choose because those who will fit your criteria becomes fewer and far between Hence the feeling of frustration keeps coming back to remind you. An incomplete gestalt cycle. We try to fulfill our needs from the options available to us. Sometimes we get in our own way. Can be past experiences of course. If the source is one's idea about themselves, then those iterations of experiences can lead to them becoming stuck in a cycle of seeking and avoidance or sabotage. Some details are important, but I don't think anything can replace the phenomenological experience of being with a person. One can't do that fully if one is locked in their internal thoughts and anxieties. " Yes past experiences will definitely be the most considered factor when making a decision, especially when it comes to relationships. If someone displays behaviours that were previously undesirable in our previous relationship(s), that'll lead to a deterioration of your perception of that person as an individual, that can lead to all sorts of negativity, and worse, toxicity. That is also compounded by people's mental health, and if they suffer from personality disorders, lack of communication, overreacting etc. but that's an entirely other tangent I feel that there needs to be some level of risk involved in making our decisions, nothing is really gained if you don't venture out of your comfort zone or take risks. It's talked about a lot regarding people who have become very wealthy, sure they put in the hard work, but they also took risks and didn't get too cosy in their comfort zones | |||
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"Solution- try all the flavours "Seems like the way to go | |||
"I remember the ice cream shop idea. You go and choose an I’ve m team from a shop that has 40 plus flavours, and it takes you longer to choose, and your more than likely regret your choice and want to try someone else’s. Or, you choose from a cart that has vanilla, choc, strawberry. You choose quicker and you know it’s your best choice. Is it something like that? Sort of, yes, but when you add more and more variables into the decision making process, you could walk away without any ice cream at all. Even if you know strawberry is your favourite flavour, you still might not choose strawberry because the blend of the ice cream and the flavour might not be what you're expecting i.e. bland, not sweet or fruity enough etc." This is why I ask others to choose for me.  | |||
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" You can spend a long time vetting someone because they tick most of your boxes, but when the result doesn't meet your expectations, you just think "what a total waste of time". That can also lead to someone tightening their preferences leading to less options, but that counterintuitively makes it harder to choose because those who will fit your criteria becomes fewer and far between Hence the feeling of frustration keeps coming back to remind you. An incomplete gestalt cycle. We try to fulfill our needs from the options available to us. Sometimes we get in our own way. Can be past experiences of course. If the source is one's idea about themselves, then those iterations of experiences can lead to them becoming stuck in a cycle of seeking and avoidance or sabotage. Some details are important, but I don't think anything can replace the phenomenological experience of being with a person. One can't do that fully if one is locked in their internal thoughts and anxieties. Yes past experiences will definitely be the most considered factor when making a decision, especially when it comes to relationships. If someone displays behaviours that were previously undesirable in our previous relationship(s), that'll lead to a deterioration of your perception of that person as an individual, that can lead to all sorts of negativity, and worse, toxicity. That is also compounded by people's mental health, and if they suffer from personality disorders, lack of communication, overreacting etc. but that's an entirely other tangent I feel that there needs to be some level of risk involved in making our decisions, nothing is really gained if you don't venture out of your comfort zone or take risks. It's talked about a lot regarding people who have become very wealthy, sure they put in the hard work, but they also took risks and didn't get too cosy in their comfort zones" I agree with all of that... Except I would add that if one is too locked in to looking for the signs of past experiences they can see it when it isn't there. Personally, I can be triggered due to experiences of cPTSD, trauma bypasses the higher brain functions and leads to an irrational fear response. Knowing this doesn't prevent the feeling. So I have to distance myself from people who exhibit certain behaviours in relationships. It can be harmful for me. It isn't necessarily that they have done something wrong. It can be my stuff. | |||
"This is a fascinating topic OP and you are certainly right that it is getting worse and with greater access to things it will just continue. I might be rambling here and going off track a little but I hope that it makes some sense in the end. There are 2 things to remember. 1. Every action causes a reaction 2. You have to understand your goal So as we choose something over everything else that will in itself open up many other options. Going in the example you have of shoes. If you can only afford one pair from a wide selection you have to ask what will be the reaction of this. Obviously missing out on the others but on a positive side that pair will look great with lots of clothes out it will fill a gap in your wardrobe. Knowing what you are trying to achieve will give that choice and you will feel more confident in your decisions. Knowing that taking one option will open up other options will hopefully mean that you don’t return to the other options but in fact move forward Marc" No you're right there and still very relevant to the topic. You make a great observation regarding the result providing more options I feel that many people often try to make decisions in the hopes of recreating the feelings they once felt from a previous experience, rather than trying new things and seeing if that decision yields more and better options for the future, and experiences they'll remember fondly | |||
" You can spend a long time vetting someone because they tick most of your boxes, but when the result doesn't meet your expectations, you just think "what a total waste of time". That can also lead to someone tightening their preferences leading to less options, but that counterintuitively makes it harder to choose because those who will fit your criteria becomes fewer and far between Hence the feeling of frustration keeps coming back to remind you. An incomplete gestalt cycle. We try to fulfill our needs from the options available to us. Sometimes we get in our own way. Can be past experiences of course. If the source is one's idea about themselves, then those iterations of experiences can lead to them becoming stuck in a cycle of seeking and avoidance or sabotage. Some details are important, but I don't think anything can replace the phenomenological experience of being with a person. One can't do that fully if one is locked in their internal thoughts and anxieties. Yes past experiences will definitely be the most considered factor when making a decision, especially when it comes to relationships. If someone displays behaviours that were previously undesirable in our previous relationship(s), that'll lead to a deterioration of your perception of that person as an individual, that can lead to all sorts of negativity, and worse, toxicity. That is also compounded by people's mental health, and if they suffer from personality disorders, lack of communication, overreacting etc. but that's an entirely other tangent I feel that there needs to be some level of risk involved in making our decisions, nothing is really gained if you don't venture out of your comfort zone or take risks. It's talked about a lot regarding people who have become very wealthy, sure they put in the hard work, but they also took risks and didn't get too cosy in their comfort zones I agree with all of that... Except I would add that if one is too locked in to looking for the signs of past experiences they can see it when it isn't there. Personally, I can be triggered due to experiences of cPTSD, trauma bypasses the higher brain functions and leads to an irrational fear response. Knowing this doesn't prevent the feeling. So I have to distance myself from people who exhibit certain behaviours in relationships. It can be harmful for me. It isn't necessarily that they have done something wrong. It can be my stuff. " I know EXACTLY what you're talking about regarding trauma responses, that's another very crucial factor in decision making. I've experienced that first hand while I was with someone and unfortunately it ended disastrously, it's truly upsetting On a side note I hope your receiving proper support for your cPTSD, that's a very difficult thing to live with | |||
" You can spend a long time vetting someone because they tick most of your boxes, but when the result doesn't meet your expectations, you just think "what a total waste of time". That can also lead to someone tightening their preferences leading to less options, but that counterintuitively makes it harder to choose because those who will fit your criteria becomes fewer and far between Hence the feeling of frustration keeps coming back to remind you. An incomplete gestalt cycle. We try to fulfill our needs from the options available to us. Sometimes we get in our own way. Can be past experiences of course. If the source is one's idea about themselves, then those iterations of experiences can lead to them becoming stuck in a cycle of seeking and avoidance or sabotage. Some details are important, but I don't think anything can replace the phenomenological experience of being with a person. One can't do that fully if one is locked in their internal thoughts and anxieties. Yes past experiences will definitely be the most considered factor when making a decision, especially when it comes to relationships. If someone displays behaviours that were previously undesirable in our previous relationship(s), that'll lead to a deterioration of your perception of that person as an individual, that can lead to all sorts of negativity, and worse, toxicity. That is also compounded by people's mental health, and if they suffer from personality disorders, lack of communication, overreacting etc. but that's an entirely other tangent I feel that there needs to be some level of risk involved in making our decisions, nothing is really gained if you don't venture out of your comfort zone or take risks. It's talked about a lot regarding people who have become very wealthy, sure they put in the hard work, but they also took risks and didn't get too cosy in their comfort zones I agree with all of that... Except I would add that if one is too locked in to looking for the signs of past experiences they can see it when it isn't there. Personally, I can be triggered due to experiences of cPTSD, trauma bypasses the higher brain functions and leads to an irrational fear response. Knowing this doesn't prevent the feeling. So I have to distance myself from people who exhibit certain behaviours in relationships. It can be harmful for me. It isn't necessarily that they have done something wrong. It can be my stuff. I know EXACTLY what you're talking about regarding trauma responses, that's another very crucial factor in decision making. I've experienced that first hand while I was with someone and unfortunately it ended disastrously, it's truly upsetting On a side note I hope your receiving proper support for your cPTSD, that's a very difficult thing to live with" I definitely hear that one, I've had similar. Good to share with someone who gets it, thanks man. I appreciate the concern, it's covered. I have very good support. Just got to deal with the after-effects of getting back out there and expanding that comfort zone. | |||
"I definitely hear that one, I've had similar. Good to share with someone who gets it, thanks man. I appreciate the concern, it's covered. I have very good support. Just got to deal with the after-effects of getting back out there and expanding that comfort zone. " Don't mention it, it was an eye opening experience nonetheless, despite the tragic way it ended, so I can wholeheartedly empathize I'm glad to hear it, nothing worse than suffering with cPTSD and not having a proper support structure, all the best to you getting back out there dude  | |||
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"Before I used to satisfiice I would often search loads of flight options , prices, airports , trains, parking costs etc. and get stuck thinking what’s the best option - time , cost, schedule, lounges etc. Now I only ever fly out of Birmingham and always Uber there & back. If it means changing at CDL, that’s okay but I never spend more than a few mins thinking about or booking flights now and the experience is minimal stress as I do it the same every y time. Another example not to read the whole menu ant a restaurant but stop at & order the first thing you like., or just order fish. Or don’t look at menus at all and always ask for chefs recommendation. Steve Jobs only ever wore black T shirts. By making small decisions once you free up a huge amount of time and mental energy for bigger work. " That's good advice, I'll admit I've always been one to look at the whole menu at a restaurant and been sat there for like 10 minutes trying to choose between 2 options, and I do the same thing for the starter, main and dessert  | |||
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"This is linked to 'the grass is greener ' syndrome. Every choice we make for something usually means saying no to several other options. But what if one of the other options would have been better? I think the antidote is to focus on, and be grateful for, all of the positive things we have in our lives. Not to dwell on the things (or choices) we don't have. " What satisficing teaches you that for Nancy decisions, searching for the optimal decision vs one that meets your minimum criteria, overall brings unhappiness, and takes a lot of mental energy and time away from much more important things, that do require tine abs mental energy. When you get this , you experience it and there’s no going back. Procrastinating is mostly a choice because of the fear of making decisions. Make them fast and frequently and you will be cured  | |||
"Before I used to satisfiice I would often search loads of flight options , prices, airports , trains, parking costs etc. and get stuck thinking what’s the best option - time , cost, schedule, lounges etc. Now I only ever fly out of Birmingham and always Uber there & back. If it means changing at CDL, that’s okay but I never spend more than a few mins thinking about or booking flights now and the experience is minimal stress as I do it the same every y time. Another example not to read the whole menu ant a restaurant but stop at & order the first thing you like., or just order fish. Or don’t look at menus at all and always ask for chefs recommendation. Steve Jobs only ever wore black T shirts. By making small decisions once you free up a huge amount of time and mental energy for bigger work. That's good advice, I'll admit I've always been one to look at the whole menu at a restaurant and been sat there for like 10 minutes trying to choose between 2 options, and I do the same thing for the starter, main and dessert "That’s 10-15 mins you could have been getting to know your date , flirting and playing footsie | |||
"Before I used to satisfiice I would often search loads of flight options , prices, airports , trains, parking costs etc. and get stuck thinking what’s the best option - time , cost, schedule, lounges etc. Now I only ever fly out of Birmingham and always Uber there & back. If it means changing at CDL, that’s okay but I never spend more than a few mins thinking about or booking flights now and the experience is minimal stress as I do it the same every y time. Another example not to read the whole menu ant a restaurant but stop at & order the first thing you like., or just order fish. Or don’t look at menus at all and always ask for chefs recommendation. Steve Jobs only ever wore black T shirts. By making small decisions once you free up a huge amount of time and mental energy for bigger work. That's good advice, I'll admit I've always been one to look at the whole menu at a restaurant and been sat there for like 10 minutes trying to choose between 2 options, and I do the same thing for the starter, main and dessert
That’s 10-15 mins you could have been getting to know your date , flirting and playing footsie "Lol don't worry I've never actually had the chance to go on a date to a restaurant with someone new. I think if I was in that situation I would actually make more of an effort not to get stuck on what meal I'll order Last time I was in a restaurant and struggled to choose I was already in a relationship with that person for several months | |||
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