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Andrew Mitchell- was he innocent of Pleb-gate?
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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It sounds like the police have stitched him up. Channel4 documentary tomight apparently shows footage that shows he did not say the nasty 'p' word after all! |
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After years of being the self proclaimed political party of Law and Order the Conservatives have left the Police feeling deeply betrayed by the massive cuts in Policing budgets, so nothing would surprise me to be honest. |
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I'm sure the police are called much worse at weekends.
I don't really care whether he said that or not - but I am concerned that the diplomatic  police at the gate felt they were at liberty to share such information with the media.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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This is getting rather messy now,,,,,
Apparently there is reason to believe we now have a fabricated statement supposedly made by a member of the public who now it appears, was actually an off duty police officer, who wasn’t even present at the time of the original incident …
FFS....  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"After years of being the self proclaimed political party of Law and Order the Conservatives have left the Police feeling deeply betrayed by the massive cuts in Policing budgets, so nothing would surprise me to be honest."
Only you could turn it around to somehow be the govt's fault for a blatant police stitch up. 
I hope all those Labour members on the opposite benches will now eat huimble pie and apologise for the remarks they said in the house of commons. I bet they won't though. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"This is getting rather messy now,,,,,
Apparently there is reason to believe we now have a fabricated statement supposedly made by a member of the public who now it appears, was actually an off duty police officer, who wasn’t even present at the time of the original incident …
FFS.... "
Just heard this and the CCTV shows there was no one at the gate at that time , police stitching someone up  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"This is getting rather messy now,,,,,
Apparently there is reason to believe we now have a fabricated statement supposedly made by a member of the public who now it appears, was actually an off duty police officer, who wasn’t even present at the time of the original incident …
FFS....
Just heard this and the CCTV shows there was no one at the gate at that time , police stitching someone up "
What The Met stitching someone up? I would never have thought it!  |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"This is getting rather messy now,,,,,
Apparently there is reason to believe we now have a fabricated statement supposedly made by a member of the public who now it appears, was actually an off duty police officer, who wasn’t even present at the time of the original incident …
FFS....
Just heard this and the CCTV shows there was no one at the gate at that time , police stitching someone up
What The Met stitching someone up? I would never have thought it! "
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"So we have yet another victim of trial by media! Happening way too often these days. "
Gag the Press!! Lying scumbags that they are. We need a totalitarian society where everyone is told what to think, when to think it and about whom.
Smash the machines!!!
er... well, pull the plug maybe.  |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"I think DC should make Mitchell Home Secretary.
Seriously though, is it any wonder that no one believed Andrew Mitchell? He's a politician for fucks sake, lying is what they do. "
In my experience the police are no better. |
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Whilist the CCTV footage shown on Channel 4 last night doesn't enable anyone to make a judgement as to what was actually said, it did cast sufficient doubt on the whole event to more than justify further investigation. On the face of it, it does look like Mitchell was stitched up but the Head of the Met suggested there was no smoke without fire, while saying he couldn't expand further at this time.
Mitchell certainly had time to swear, which he admits he did, and time to make the comments attributed to him, but the fact that an off duty copper alledgedly made a false statement is very serious.
The outcome of this will be interesting, but it does seem mad that any Police Officer would commit such a crime for reasons that seem to make no sence |
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"It sounds like the police have stitched him up. Channel4 documentary tomight apparently shows footage that shows he did not say the nasty 'p' word after all!"
hmm really ? i saw the footage. You couldnt possibly determine what was said by whom from that footage.
whats more the C4 reporter presented the piece in a very biased way that favoured mitchell. He also made massive assumptions about what was actually going on.
On top of that, someone has broken the data protection act. As the man they telephoned who alledgedly sent the email confirmed during the call. |
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By *abioMan
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
"It sounds like the police have stitched him up. Channel4 documentary tomight apparently shows footage that shows he did not say the nasty 'p' word after all!"
actually not quite true....
the accounts of the incidents it looks like may have been incorrect, how mitchell has never denied that he did abuse and swear at the policeman.... |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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i think what we all need to do is think about the impact these sort of allegations have on front line police.
i say this because if the police can (or as it maybe alleged) make false claims about the actions of a very senior politician and ruin his career.
what chance do I or you have of fairness?
we are normal everyday people and not working in the corridors of power so we are at even greater risk.
and i think this,hillsborough and historically allegations of abuse (which later are proved true)
that are dismissed at the time cloud people's judgement and thinking of the police.
it makes their job harder because the public fear a fit up or not getting a fair trial.
im not defending police. just making the point that not all are crooked or corrupt and these events make a difficult job harder.
the police need to look at public relations and the disclosure of information into the public domain better so everything is water tight. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"This is getting rather messy now,,,,,
Apparently there is reason to believe we now have a fabricated statement supposedly made by a member of the public who now it appears, was actually an off duty police officer, who wasn’t even present at the time of the original incident …"
Gets better than that: The 'member of the public' made the statement to his constituency MP...... who, by coincidence, just 'happens' to be..... the deputy chief whip..... and who is known to hate..... Andrew Mitchell.
If you came up with all of this as a storyline for a cop TV show or a novel, it would get rejected as too farcical.... 
 |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I think DC should make Mitchell Home Secretary.
Seriously though, is it any wonder that no one believed Andrew Mitchell? He's a politician for fucks sake, lying is what they do.
In my experience the police are no better. "
You have experience of 100000 plus officers ? Sweeping statement.
If they have lied its disgraceful and they should be disciplined or sacked. Please stop inferring that the actions of bad individuals are representative of the masses. thanks |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"I think DC should make Mitchell Home Secretary.
Seriously though, is it any wonder that no one believed Andrew Mitchell? He's a politician for fucks sake, lying is what they do.
In my experience the police are no better.
You have experience of 100000 plus officers ? Sweeping statement.
If they have lied its disgraceful and they should be disciplined or sacked. Please stop inferring that the actions of bad individuals are representative of the masses. thanks "
Everyone is entitled to their own opinions |
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"I think DC should make Mitchell Home Secretary.
Seriously though, is it any wonder that no one believed Andrew Mitchell? He's a politician for fucks sake, lying is what they do.
In my experience the police are no better.
You have experience of 100000 plus officers ? Sweeping statement.
If they have lied its disgraceful and they should be disciplined or sacked. Please stop inferring that the actions of bad individuals are representative of the masses. thanks "
the sad thing is the facts over decades simply give the impression that corruption, lying to get a conviction
and cover up are common practise for some within the Police service..
clearly not all but how many have turned a blind eye to what they know..
got a lot of respect for what can be a difficult job, a lot of what they attend is totally alien to the vast majority of the UK public..
accountability however is lacking for when feck ups, negligence etc occur..
does'nt instill confidence.. |
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Hillsborough, hacking, political correctness and now this - our police are no longer the best in the world, just a corrupt and badly educated bunch of bully-boys. If you call on them for help chances are they won't do anything positive, but if YOU go a few MPH over the speed limit they'll be on you like Judge Dredd.
If they want the public to look on them positively they ned to clean up their act. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"It's a public order offence to be verbally abusive, especially to policemen from a publi servant. Besides which,
"quis custodiet ipsos custodes?"
springs to mind like zebedee.
"
Indeed. Who watches the watchers.
Who was is that said, "Give a little man a lot of power and watch it go to his head." |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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There's an awful lot of ranting going on here as usual.
Whilst we all like banter, people should look at their own behaviour before they slander everyone else and generalise ? SOME politicians lie, SOME police officers act terribly, and long may they continue to be identified and shamed. Although I reckon most anti police comments are made by people who've been caught breaking the law !
Ultimately pleb is not exactlly most offensive comment ever though is it ? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I think DC should make Mitchell Home Secretary.
Seriously though, is it any wonder that no one believed Andrew Mitchell? He's a politician for fucks sake, lying is what they do.
In my experience the police are no better.
You have experience of 100000 plus officers ? Sweeping statement.
If they have lied its disgraceful and they should be disciplined or sacked. Please stop inferring that the actions of bad individuals are representative of the masses. thanks
Everyone is entitled to their own opinions"
and thankfully the vast majority of politicians and police officers will continue to see to it, that your right to have & express your opinions remains in tact ! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I think DC should make Mitchell Home Secretary.
Seriously though, is it any wonder that no one believed Andrew Mitchell? He's a politician for fucks sake, lying is what they do.
In my experience the police are no better.
You have experience of 100000 plus officers ? Sweeping statement.
If they have lied its disgraceful and they should be disciplined or sacked. Please stop inferring that the actions of bad individuals are representative of the masses. thanks
Everyone is entitled to their own opinions
and thankfully the vast majority of politicians and police officers will continue to see to it, that your right to have & express your opinions remains in tact ! "
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Lets take a step back, the copper was being a bit awkward, the politician was being an arse (he has never denied that, only denied on word that was quoted and attributed to him multiple times).
BUT no criminal charges were brought by an abused policeman, nor any abuse of power charges brought by an inconvenienced politician.
The entire episode in a real world would have been forgotten, and both would have probably apologised on next meeting.
Instead we filled newspapers, discussed it in parliament at whatever the cost per hour is, one man was demoted, and now probably another couple of policemen will also lose theirs completely. Over what? a bad mood... |
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"I think DC should make Mitchell Home Secretary.
Seriously though, is it any wonder that no one believed Andrew Mitchell? He's a politician for fucks sake, lying is what they do.
In my experience the police are no better.
You have experience of 100000 plus officers ? Sweeping statement.
If they have lied its disgraceful and they should be disciplined or sacked. Please stop inferring that the actions of bad individuals are representative of the masses. thanks
Everyone is entitled to their own opinions
and thankfully the vast majority of politicians and police officers will continue to see to it, that your right to have & express your opinions remains in tact ! "
like the introduction and implementation of oppresive ott legislation being used to inhibit and stifle peacefull protest.. |
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"After years of being the self proclaimed political party of Law and Order the Conservatives have left the Police feeling deeply betrayed by the massive cuts in Policing budgets, so nothing would surprise me to be honest.
Only you could turn it around to somehow be the govt's fault for a blatant police stitch up.
I hope all those Labour members on the opposite benches will now eat huimble pie and apologise for the remarks they said in the house of commons. I bet they won't though."
I only stated the facts...
Fact 1....The present (Conservative led) government have drastically cut the Police budgets, their sweeping cuts have resulted in thousands of police officers being cut from our forces.
Fact 2....Theresa May is met at the Chief Constables annual conference with a stony silence, not a SINGLE handclap is heard when she takes to the stage...that has never happened before.
Fact 3.....The Police Federation and the Chief Constables Federation have REPEATEDLY attacked the present governmentover the massive cuts in their budgets,just this very week Devon and Cornwall Constabulary have announced that 200 Police Officer jobs have to be cut in 2013.
And you are surprised that the government is the victim of a Police stich up?......I'm not. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"After years of being the self proclaimed political party of Law and Order the Conservatives have left the Police feeling deeply betrayed by the massive cuts in Policing budgets, so nothing would surprise me to be honest.
Only you could turn it around to somehow be the govt's fault for a blatant police stitch up.
I hope all those Labour members on the opposite benches will now eat huimble pie and apologise for the remarks they said in the house of commons. I bet they won't though.
I only stated the facts...
Fact 1....The present (Conservative led) government have drastically cut the Police budgets, their sweeping cuts have resulted in thousands of police officers being cut from our forces.
Fact 2....Theresa May is met at the Chief Constables annual conference with a stony silence, not a SINGLE handclap is heard when she takes to the stage...that has never happened before.
Fact 3.....The Police Federation and the Chief Constables Federation have REPEATEDLY attacked the present governmentover the massive cuts in their budgets,just this very week Devon and Cornwall Constabulary have announced that 200 Police Officer jobs have to be cut in 2013.
And you are surprised that the government is the victim of a Police stich up?......I'm not."
Not surprised no. Digusted would be a better word. If we can't trust the police who can we trust.
Regardless of whether political policies are put in place to deal with whatever crises the country faces, the police shouldn't be using their position to score political points. Even more so if they are acting illegally to accomplish it.
As for the Chief Constable's annual conference (paid for by the taxpayer I might add), who gives a toss about a bunch of crooks not clapping Mrs Head Crook. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"After years of being the self proclaimed political party of Law and Order the Conservatives have left the Police feeling deeply betrayed by the massive cuts in Policing budgets, so nothing would surprise me to be honest."
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"After years of being the self proclaimed political party of Law and Order the Conservatives have left the Police feeling deeply betrayed by the massive cuts in Policing budgets, so nothing would surprise me to be honest.
Only you could turn it around to somehow be the govt's fault for a blatant police stitch up.
I hope all those Labour members on the opposite benches will now eat huimble pie and apologise for the remarks they said in the house of commons. I bet they won't though.
I only stated the facts...
Fact 1....The present (Conservative led) government have drastically cut the Police budgets, their sweeping cuts have resulted in thousands of police officers being cut from our forces.
Fact 2....Theresa May is met at the Chief Constables annual conference with a stony silence, not a SINGLE handclap is heard when she takes to the stage...that has never happened before.
Fact 3.....The Police Federation and the Chief Constables Federation have REPEATEDLY attacked the present governmentover the massive cuts in their budgets,just this very week Devon and Cornwall Constabulary have announced that 200 Police Officer jobs have to be cut in 2013.
And you are surprised that the government is the victim of a Police stich up?......I'm not."
There is no justification at all for a Police stitch up. If they can do this to a Politician they can do it to you.
We are not in a Police State and the Police do not make up the rules as they go along.
I have been a victim of corrupt Police in France, Mexico and Russia and always felt that our Boys in blue were unimpeachable - not any more. |
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"After years of being the self proclaimed political party of Law and Order the Conservatives have left the Police feeling deeply betrayed by the massive cuts in Policing budgets, so nothing would surprise me to be honest.
Only you could turn it around to somehow be the govt's fault for a blatant police stitch up.
I hope all those Labour members on the opposite benches will now eat huimble pie and apologise for the remarks they said in the house of commons. I bet they won't though.
I only stated the facts...
Fact 1....The present (Conservative led) government have drastically cut the Police budgets, their sweeping cuts have resulted in thousands of police officers being cut from our forces.
Fact 2....Theresa May is met at the Chief Constables annual conference with a stony silence, not a SINGLE handclap is heard when she takes to the stage...that has never happened before.
Fact 3.....The Police Federation and the Chief Constables Federation have REPEATEDLY attacked the present governmentover the massive cuts in their budgets,just this very week Devon and Cornwall Constabulary have announced that 200 Police Officer jobs have to be cut in 2013.
And you are surprised that the government is the victim of a Police stich up?......I'm not."
chuck in the present lot setting up the Winsor report then putting the bloke in the position of HMIC...
can see why the Police feel betrayed by the Conservatives atm, given their role in the miners strike etc..
if it is an attempt to 'stitch up' a member of the cabinet its a pretty piss poor attempt to be honest..
lay down with dogs you might catch fleas... |
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"After years of being the self proclaimed political party of Law and Order the Conservatives have left the Police feeling deeply betrayed by the massive cuts in Policing budgets, so nothing would surprise me to be honest.
Only you could turn it around to somehow be the govt's fault for a blatant police stitch up.
I hope all those Labour members on the opposite benches will now eat huimble pie and apologise for the remarks they said in the house of commons. I bet they won't though.
I only stated the facts...
Fact 1....The present (Conservative led) government have drastically cut the Police budgets, their sweeping cuts have resulted in thousands of police officers being cut from our forces.
Fact 2....Theresa May is met at the Chief Constables annual conference with a stony silence, not a SINGLE handclap is heard when she takes to the stage...that has never happened before.
Fact 3.....The Police Federation and the Chief Constables Federation have REPEATEDLY attacked the present governmentover the massive cuts in their budgets,just this very week Devon and Cornwall Constabulary have announced that 200 Police Officer jobs have to be cut in 2013.
And you are surprised that the government is the victim of a Police stich up?......I'm not.
There is no justification at all for a Police stitch up. If they can do this to a Politician they can do it to you.
We are not in a Police State and the Police do not make up the rules as they go along.
I have been a victim of corrupt Police in France, Mexico and Russia and always felt that our Boys in blue were unimpeachable - not any more."
I beg to differ. we have had a police state for a very long time. when police officers operate in contravention of the oath they swore, and the state is involved in corruption and cover up at the highest levels and starts mass snooping on its citizens, chipping away at basic fundamental human rights and violently attacking and suppressing any form of protest that is against government agenda, then it looks like a police state to me. |
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By *oodmessMan
over a year ago
yumsville |
I think this ratifies exactly why we need cuts in the police.
I MEAN.....
If they dont have the brains to not think 'oh, might we check CCTV footage BEFORE we mail public office?', then it goes to show the intelligence and waste of a salary that goes on in the service!
(If it is true that an off duty copper did mail them that is)
I for one, dont wanna be paying their wage - or their supervisors either!
Idiots.  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"There is no justification at all for a Police stitch up. If they can do this to a Politician they can do it to you.
We are not in a Police State and the Police do not make up the rules as they go along.
I have been a victim of corrupt Police in France, Mexico and Russia and always felt that our Boys in blue were unimpeachable - not any more.
I beg to differ. we have had a police state for a very long time. when police officers operate in contravention of the oath they swore, and the state is involved in corruption and cover up at the highest levels and starts mass snooping on its citizens, chipping away at basic fundamental human rights and violently attacking and suppressing any form of protest that is against government agenda, then it looks like a police state to me."
All done under the altruistic banner of 'if you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to fear'. If you offer voice against the govt (whichever govt) you are labelled a subversive, or a little englander etc etc ..
We are heading towards Orwell's 1984 and the sheep will vote for it. |
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"After years of being the self proclaimed political party of Law and Order the Conservatives have left the Police feeling deeply betrayed by the massive cuts in Policing budgets, so nothing would surprise me to be honest.
Only you could turn it around to somehow be the govt's fault for a blatant police stitch up.
I hope all those Labour members on the opposite benches will now eat huimble pie and apologise for the remarks they said in the house of commons. I bet they won't though.
I only stated the facts...
Fact 1....The present (Conservative led) government have drastically cut the Police budgets, their sweeping cuts have resulted in thousands of police officers being cut from our forces.
Fact 2....Theresa May is met at the Chief Constables annual conference with a stony silence, not a SINGLE handclap is heard when she takes to the stage...that has never happened before.
Fact 3.....The Police Federation and the Chief Constables Federation have REPEATEDLY attacked the present governmentover the massive cuts in their budgets,just this very week Devon and Cornwall Constabulary have announced that 200 Police Officer jobs have to be cut in 2013.
And you are surprised that the government is the victim of a Police stich up?......I'm not.
There is no justification at all for a Police stitch up. If they can do this to a Politician they can do it to you.
We are not in a Police State and the Police do not make up the rules as they go along.
I have been a victim of corrupt Police in France, Mexico and Russia and always felt that our Boys in blue were unimpeachable - not any more.
I beg to differ. we have had a police state for a very long time. when police officers operate in contravention of the oath they swore, and the state is involved in corruption and cover up at the highest levels and starts mass snooping on its citizens, chipping away at basic fundamental human rights and violently attacking and suppressing any form of protest that is against government agenda, then it looks like a police state to me."
You have a point but I could not lock up the burglar who lives down the road and robbed a house I own and 6 others in the same street even with video footage of him doing it....
I eloquently bollocked a senior man from CID rigid about this for about 20 minutes in the Malcolm Tucker style and concluded with "if you don't fkn get round there and give him a good old fashioned squeeze then he's gonna run into somebody a bit further down the food chain and you'll be scraping him up off the fkn pavement which is yet another crime for you to solve......
He went round there and the burglary's stopped: Call me a new age Sweeny...
There's been a good spread of _iews on Mr whippy. Sure the police probably dived in but why did the Government not reposte with this defence at the time and nip it in the bud? I think He had made plenty of enemies who decided he was best gone at that point. Accusations have to stick and that only happens when they seem plausible and the defence isn't robust. Look at Mr Saville for example.... |
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By *icketysplitsWoman
over a year ago
Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound |
I seem to remember this being a "storm in a tea-cup" story and it just keeps running.
He swore - he doesn't deny that. That should be enough to show he didn't comport himself in a dignified manner. |
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By *nnyMan
over a year ago
Glasgow |
BBC
Ex-chief whip Andrew Mitchell probably did call police officers "plebs", a High Court judge has said as he rejected a libel case against the Sun.
Mr Justice Mitting said the Tory MP's behaviour was "childish" and that his version of events was inconsistent with CCTV footage of the row with PC Toby Rowland in Downing Street in 2012.
Mr Mitchell, who may face costs of £2m, said he was "bitterly disappointed". |
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By *oodmessMan
over a year ago
yumsville |
"BBC
Ex-chief whip Andrew Mitchell probably did call police officers "plebs", a High Court judge has said as he rejected a libel case against the Sun.
Mr Justice Mitting said the Tory MP's behaviour was "childish" and that his version of events was inconsistent with CCTV footage of the row with PC Toby Rowland in Downing Street in 2012.
Mr Mitchell, who may face costs of £2m, said he was "bitterly disappointed"."
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I can not believe some much time and money has been spent on this . Its a bloody joke . Its like being back at school . "He said i was a prick " . What ever next ! Someone calling another person names ! Get a grip and get over it . And spend the cash on something worth while . |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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The Judge has considered that in all probability, he did use the 'p' word.
If there is CCTV footage with Audio that can conclusively prove that he did not, then I would ask why it was not presented in court.
This evidence alone would have won him the case against both News International AND the Police Officer who was sueing him. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Giving his ruling, Mr Justice Mitting said: "For the reasons given I am satisfied at least on the balance of probabilities that Mr Mitchell did speak the words alleged or something so close to them as to amount to the same including the politically toxic word 'pleb'."
Balance of probability instead of beyond reasonable doubt that he said something that amounted to?
Not very convincing...
And secondly...
PC Rowland was "not the sort of man who would have had the wit, imagination or inclination to invent on the spur of the moment an account of what a senior politician had said to him in temper".
So the copper is innocent of lying as he is a bit thick? Intelligent enough to get into the police. Enough wit to be trusted to act instinctively in the event of a major terrorist threat to parliament?
Sounds like a fit up to me... |
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What didn't help Mitchell was the que of MP's that gave statements stating that Mitchell was lying....
The police officer that lied about being there was found guilty in court and is now in prison.
The two officers that involved the papers were sacked.
The person who acted reasonably in all of this had his day in court and won!!! |
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He'd already got off criminally so it looked good for him....
But then they get greedy and sue the press,,try to make money of of it...
And look what happened to Johnathon Aiken.....
In these cases you need a lesser burden of proof and they go on the balance of probability .....
So the moral of the story is.....quit when you're ahead...
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I hope that this judgement breaks and bankrupts the bully! I find it amazing that the git and his apologetics have the brass neck to suggest that his conduct should now be laid to rest and that he should be allowed continue in public office. If he had a shred of decency he would have walked out of the High Courts of Justice apologised to those he called liars, announced his retirement from public life and resigned his Parliamentary seat.
He didn't and the Tories haven't forced him out and that speaks volumes about the lot of them! |
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It is/was well known that at the time, the police federation wanted to bring down a minister, pref Theresa May, due to changes in their terms and conditions.
In the end, they got Mitchell, a result for them.
There was clear collusion and fabrication for which some have been sacked already.
Senior fed officers were also caught out lying to the press after a meeting with Mitchell to try and draw a line under things. Mitchell recorded the meeting and the fed officers told blatant lies to the press about what what was said in the meeting.
It's scary to think that a trade union can bring down a minister in this way, whatever you think of Mitchell.
I also think the police on duty were behaving like arrogant plebs. Mitchell was an elected MP, if he wanted the gate open to ride through, then they should have said yes sir, right away - that's what they're paid to do. |
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"It is/was well known that at the time, the police federation wanted to bring down a minister, pref Theresa May, due to changes in their terms and conditions.
In the end, they got Mitchell, a result for them.
There was clear collusion and fabrication for which some have been sacked already.
Senior fed officers were also caught out lying to the press after a meeting with Mitchell to try and draw a line under things. Mitchell recorded the meeting and the fed officers told blatant lies to the press about what what was said in the meeting.
It's scary to think that a trade union can bring down a minister in this way, whatever you think of Mitchell.
I also think the police on duty were behaving like arrogant plebs. Mitchell was an elected MP, if he wanted the gate open to ride through, then they should have said yes sir, right away - that's what they're paid to do."
In your profile you describe yourselves as 'educated' and 'professional' - by virtue of your use of the word pleb for public sector workers you can add snob to that too. This is also odd given that one of your profile pics would indicate that you too are, or have been, an employee paid for by the tax payer. Or does 'officer' status elevate you above that?
The officers that behave terribly have paid the price, one in jail and some dismissed. Rightly so.
However, the judge was satisfied that Mitchell used the word 'pleb'. The toxicity of this word in this context stems from the associated class implications it has. Namely snobbery and a _iew that because you think you're better that someone else the rules don't apply to you. Furthermore, when this is pointed out you have the right to tell the 'plebs' that they should know their place.
No one has come out of the episode smelling of roses. Sounds like the lawyers have a Christmans bonus though.
Mr Mitchell could have apologised, taken the heat for a few days and carried on in government. Also, he didn't have to sue. |
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By *nnyMan
over a year ago
Glasgow |
"
.................
I also think the police on duty were behaving like arrogant plebs. Mitchell was an elected MP, if he wanted the gate open to ride through, then they should have said yes sir, right away - that's what they're paid to do."
They're paid to secure Downing Street and that means controlling entrances and exits as they see fit.
I'm surprised Mitchell's head fitted through the side gate. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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The recent "judgement" that he used the word came in a civil case....on "balance of probability" which probably means the Sun had better lawyers than Mitchell.
Previous investigations....including by the IPCC (the police checking up on themselves) have all found that he didn't use the word. Criminal prosecutions....putting at least one officer behind bars for perjury and others sacked have found the same. These need a much stronger burden of proof...not just one judges opinion of probable.
The whole case stinks of corruption. |
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"
.................
I also think the police on duty were behaving like arrogant plebs. Mitchell was an elected MP, if he wanted the gate open to ride through, then they should have said yes sir, right away - that's what they're paid to do.
They're paid to secure Downing Street and that means controlling entrances and exits as they see fit.
I'm surprised Mitchell's head fitted through the side gate."
|
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"The recent "judgement" that he used the word came in a civil case....on "balance of probability" which probably means the Sun had better lawyers than Mitchell.
Previous investigations....including by the IPCC (the police checking up on themselves) have all found that he didn't use the word. Criminal prosecutions....putting at least one officer behind bars for perjury and others sacked have found the same. These need a much stronger burden of proof...not just one judges opinion of probable.
The whole case stinks of corruption."
Stinks of corruption? So the police have corrupted the Judge?
Previous investigations by the IPCC and others DID NOT establish that the word pleb was not used. They established that there were 'conduct matters' to be addressed by those involved and indeed one criminal matter. The price has been paid by those concerned.
Mr Mitchell chose to sue and he, like the Newspaper, were well 'lawyered up'. It was QC rank all round as well as support teams. It was not Liverpool FC v a pub soccer team from a lawyer point of _iew.
The judge heard all the evidence and made his decision. There there was questionable conduct from other police officers and has been said they were dealt with. Swiftly and robustly. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"It is/was well known that at the time, the police federation wanted to bring down a minister, pref Theresa May, due to changes in their terms and conditions.
In the end, they got Mitchell, a result for them.
There was clear collusion and fabrication for which some have been sacked already.
Senior fed officers were also caught out lying to the press after a meeting with Mitchell to try and draw a line under things. Mitchell recorded the meeting and the fed officers told blatant lies to the press about what what was said in the meeting.
It's scary to think that a trade union can bring down a minister in this way, whatever you think of Mitchell.
I also think the police on duty were behaving like arrogant plebs. Mitchell was an elected MP, if he wanted the gate open to ride through, then they should have said yes sir, right away - that's what they're paid to do.
In your profile you describe yourselves as 'educated' and 'professional' - by virtue of your use of the word pleb for public sector workers you can add snob to that too. This is also odd given that one of your profile pics would indicate that you too are, or have been, an employee paid for by the tax payer. Or does 'officer' status elevate you above that?
The officers that behave terribly have paid the price, one in jail and some dismissed. Rightly so.
However, the judge was satisfied that Mitchell used the word 'pleb'. The toxicity of this word in this context stems from the associated class implications it has. Namely snobbery and a _iew that because you think you're better that someone else the rules don't apply to you. Furthermore, when this is pointed out you have the right to tell the 'plebs' that they should know their place.
No one has come out of the episode smelling of roses. Sounds like the lawyers have a Christmans bonus though.
Mr Mitchell could have apologised, taken the heat for a few days and carried on in government. Also, he didn't have to sue."
I think the pic you mention is nothing short of fancy dress...The shoes certainly aren't service issue and if he'd paraded in number ones like that he should be stuck on !!
Now back to the thread....The wholly amusing part of this is the fact that Mitchell admits being abusive and swearing anyway so in my mind he's guilty end of.
He knows the security price fires, anal as they may seem but those are the rules. Yes the whole event is ridiculous but most passing judgement are doing so out of their prejudiced feelings towards Police or politicians.
The civil court has passed judgement, as has the criminal ones with those who committed perjury. I'm making an assumption that no one else on Fab was there ? Guess we're just making assumptions on other theories then. |
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I also think the police on duty were behaving like arrogant plebs. Mitchell was an elected MP, if he wanted the gate open to ride through, then they should have said yes sir, right away - that's what they're paid to do."
I also had a look at you in uniform. You look like a bag of shit tied up in the middle! The trousers are obviously tailored for someone with 2 or 3 inch longer legs, the shoes you are wearing are wrong as is the belt (if you were a genuine Flt. Lt. your belt buckle would be gold like your buttons). I hope you know that impersonating a Commissioned Officer in HM Armed forces is a serious crime as is wearing decorations that you are not entitled to.
As for your comment about a Police officer opening the gate and saying "yes sir!" I would point out to you that MPs are subject to the law like everyone else and that a Police Officer is duty bound to enforce the law without fear or favour. So actually if the officer was doing his job to the letter of the law he would have arrested the arrogant sod and charged him under Sect 5 of the Public Order Act for a breach of the peace. Hopefully next time an arrogant Tory MP gets uppity with a Police Officer they will get to see the inside of a Police cell and from there the dock of a Magistrates Court! |
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He's the local MP here. Unhelpful, doesn't listen or care about everyday people - an arrogant prick. I hope he drops the seat and am glad he lost his greedy claims. His attitude is much of what is wrong in politics. |
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"It is/was well known that at the time, the police federation wanted to bring down a minister, pref Theresa May, due to changes in their terms and conditions.
In the end, they got Mitchell, a result for them.
There was clear collusion and fabrication for which some have been sacked already.
Senior fed officers were also caught out lying to the press after a meeting with Mitchell to try and draw a line under things. Mitchell recorded the meeting and the fed officers told blatant lies to the press about what what was said in the meeting.
It's scary to think that a trade union can bring down a minister in this way, whatever you think of Mitchell.
I also think the police on duty were behaving like arrogant plebs. Mitchell was an elected MP, if he wanted the gate open to ride through, then they should have said yes sir, right away - that's what they're paid to do."
Sorry, you must be talking about a different pleb gate... Quite clearly not the same one as reported in the news...
"It's well know the police wanted to bring down a minister. " Where apart from your imagination is it well known?
There was no collusion. Yes one numpty wrote a false statement. This was done independently of other officers.
Three were sacked for going to the papers/leaking information... No offences.
The action of these officers did nothing to help the officer at the gate... However his reporting of the event did not alter from the first day to the last... Unlike Mitchell...
The Federation didn't lie but did omitted to tell the whole story of the inter_iew. Again very stupid...
Regarding your comments on the police opening the gates on Mitchell's say so, show you have little or no knowledge of the security industry... In addition I b would go as far as to say that Mitchell should have known better...
I could go on but fear I am wasting my time. You clearly have your own opinion/agenda and mere facts won't change that...
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No they're not paid to be fancy doormen. They are there to protect Downing Street. While the main gate is open the level of security is reduced. There was a perfectly good side gate. Mitchell just thought that dismounting to go through it was beneath him. He's an arse just like MMellor.Over inflated egos, the lot of them. |
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He's guilty as charged. The judge could see through him. .
And his court case was a vain attempt due to his fat ego. Wasting precious court time is almost criminal in my mind.
Hope he disappears from public life and Birmingham for good. |
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