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£18 Cup of Coffee
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"To top the £14 pint in London story, a cafe (not London) estimates they will need to charge £18+ for a cup of coffee to break even when their energy tariff increases.
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Time to save all my loyalty cards up… |
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By *icketysplits OP Woman
over a year ago
Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound |
"To top the £14 pint in London story, a cafe (not London) estimates they will need to charge £18+ for a cup of coffee to break even when their energy tariff increases.
Time to save all my loyalty cards up…"
The chains will be able to mitigate a bit, but that quirky local cafe may well disappear.
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By *icketysplits OP Woman
over a year ago
Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound |
The Lane spoke to ITV News earlier this week about the "suicidal" energy contract their costs go from £15k a year to £100k. They say they will have to charge £18.70 a cup to survive.
Another cafe say their costs for from £10k p.a. to £55k p.a.
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By *icketysplits OP Woman
over a year ago
Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound |
"What!? WHAT!? 
I'll look for their thread in the break. They talked about surviving the pandemic to face this.
It's awful. I worry for our kids  "
I do too. That barista job is about to disappear and there won't be one to replace it.
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By *bi HaiveMan
over a year ago
Forum Mod Cheeseville, Somerset |
It'll end up with coffee being made round the back using a flask of pre-boiled water and someone stood there making the steam noises like in that old advert......  
https://youtu.be/Squcxdq22nI
A |
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By *icketysplits OP Woman
over a year ago
Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound |
"It'll end up with coffee being made round the back using a flask of pre-boiled water and someone stood there making the steam noises like in that old advert......
https://youtu.be/Squcxdq22nI
A"
With candles providing an intimate ambience.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"The Lane spoke to ITV News earlier this week about the "suicidal" energy contract their costs go from £15k a year to £100k. They say they will have to charge £18.70 a cup to survive.
Another cafe say their costs for from £10k p.a. to £55k p.a.
"
The percentage increases will be the same for all businesses. Bigger businesses will go from £1M a year to £4M a year energy bills.
The government will have to do something or the entire country will be bankrupt. |
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We are indeed living in a crazy world at present
And we thought covid destroyed businesses. This current financially insecure climate, will undoubtedly be the demise of some very long standing and much needed companies
It makes you wonder where it’s going to end |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I know the large supermarkets not hard up but can you imagine how much Tescos electric bill must be and what crazy price will that go to and guess who will end up paying for that. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"The Lane spoke to ITV News earlier this week about the "suicidal" energy contract their costs go from £15k a year to £100k. They say they will have to charge £18.70 a cup to survive.
Another cafe say their costs for from £10k p.a. to £55k p.a.
"
its late, but my geeky spidey senses think something doesn't smell right in the maths here |
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"I know the large supermarkets not hard up but can you imagine how much Tescos electric bill must be and what crazy price will that go to and guess who will end up paying for that. "
Yeah... The idea of basic food jumping *that* much...  |
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By *icketysplits OP Woman
over a year ago
Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound |
"The Lane spoke to ITV News earlier this week about the "suicidal" energy contract their costs go from £15k a year to £100k. They say they will have to charge £18.70 a cup to survive.
Another cafe say their costs for from £10k p.a. to £55k p.a.
its late, but my geeky spidey senses think something doesn't smell right in the maths here"
I have seen a couple of quotes for particular types of small businesses. Their current tariff is ending and the quote for the next year is more than double. Business tariffs are not capped.
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By *bi HaiveMan
over a year ago
Forum Mod Cheeseville, Somerset |
"It'll end up with coffee being made round the back using a flask of pre-boiled water and someone stood there making the steam noises like in that old advert......
https://youtu.be/Squcxdq22nI
A
With candles providing an intimate ambience.
"
Noooooo.
The candles are to replace the heating.
A |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"The Lane spoke to ITV News earlier this week about the "suicidal" energy contract their costs go from £15k a year to £100k. They say they will have to charge £18.70 a cup to survive.
Another cafe say their costs for from £10k p.a. to £55k p.a.
its late, but my geeky spidey senses think something doesn't smell right in the maths here
I have seen a couple of quotes for particular types of small businesses. Their current tariff is ending and the quote for the next year is more than double. Business tariffs are not capped.
"
it's not the energy numbers I'm doubting but the scake it would hot their prices. Either they are charging a lot today. Or not selling much coffee |
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By *icketysplits OP Woman
over a year ago
Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound |
"It'll end up with coffee being made round the back using a flask of pre-boiled water and someone stood there making the steam noises like in that old advert......
https://youtu.be/Squcxdq22nI
A
With candles providing an intimate ambience.
Noooooo.
The candles are to replace the heating.
A"
And hide the colour of the 'coffee'.
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By *icketysplits OP Woman
over a year ago
Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound |
"The Lane spoke to ITV News earlier this week about the "suicidal" energy contract their costs go from £15k a year to £100k. They say they will have to charge £18.70 a cup to survive.
Another cafe say their costs for from £10k p.a. to £55k p.a.
its late, but my geeky spidey senses think something doesn't smell right in the maths here
I have seen a couple of quotes for particular types of small businesses. Their current tariff is ending and the quote for the next year is more than double. Business tariffs are not capped.
it's not the energy numbers I'm doubting but the scake it would hot their prices. Either they are charging a lot today. Or not selling much coffee"
A potential combination of the two for a small local cafe.
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"To top the £14 pint in London story, a cafe (not London) estimates they will need to charge £18+ for a cup of coffee to break even when their energy tariff increases.
"
spat out my coffee reading that. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"The Lane spoke to ITV News earlier this week about the "suicidal" energy contract their costs go from £15k a year to £100k. They say they will have to charge £18.70 a cup to survive.
Another cafe say their costs for from £10k p.a. to £55k p.a.
its late, but my geeky spidey senses think something doesn't smell right in the maths here
I have seen a couple of quotes for particular types of small businesses. Their current tariff is ending and the quote for the next year is more than double. Business tariffs are not capped.
it's not the energy numbers I'm doubting but the scake it would hot their prices. Either they are charging a lot today. Or not selling much coffee
A potential combination of the two for a small local cafe.
"
we're talking 3 cups an hour at a fiver a cup. Or less if the coffees cheaper. Unless my maths is off. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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So the media mafia have moved on to energy prices as their next method of driving mass hysteria then?
There will of course be an element of truth somewhere but a very liberal dose of poetic license added to some blatant exaggeration  |
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"What!? WHAT!?
I'll look for their thread in the break. They talked about surviving the pandemic to face this.
It's awful. I worry for our kids
I do too. That barista job is about to disappear and there won't be one to replace it.
"
|
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"So the media mafia have moved on to energy prices as their next method of driving mass hysteria then?
There will of course be an element of truth somewhere but a very liberal dose of poetic license added to some blatant exaggeration "
If you can withstand an 80% increase in your energy bills, you are more fortunate than many people and many businesses. |
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"So the media mafia have moved on to energy prices as their next method of driving mass hysteria then?
There will of course be an element of truth somewhere but a very liberal dose of poetic license added to some blatant exaggeration "
Tom Kerridge's pub had energy bills of £60,000, they are now £420,000 |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"So the media mafia have moved on to energy prices as their next method of driving mass hysteria then?
There will of course be an element of truth somewhere but a very liberal dose of poetic license added to some blatant exaggeration
Tom Kerridge's pub had energy bills of £60,000, they are now £420,000"
Ah but he hasn't actually shopped around yet nor has he been officially charged any increase yet - but that doesn't fill headlines does it? There's your poetic licence then.
For the record I cannot afford a huge price increase myself, no one can. Looks like if this really does go fully nationwide in every business in every household the entire country will grind to a shut and the only business that will thrive will be debt collection. The only realistic result is hyper inflation - time to buy a wheel barrow to take your dollar to buy a loaf of bread. |
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"So the media mafia have moved on to energy prices as their next method of driving mass hysteria then?
There will of course be an element of truth somewhere but a very liberal dose of poetic license added to some blatant exaggeration
Tom Kerridge's pub had energy bills of £60,000, they are now £420,000
Ah but he hasn't actually shopped around yet nor has he been officially charged any increase yet - but that doesn't fill headlines does it? There's your poetic licence then.
For the record I cannot afford a huge price increase myself, no one can. Looks like if this really does go fully nationwide in every business in every household the entire country will grind to a shut and the only business that will thrive will be debt collection. The only realistic result is hyper inflation - time to buy a wheel barrow to take your dollar to buy a loaf of bread."
The home electricity cap is rising that much in October, more in January, more in April
Businesses are uncapped. There are many stories of businesses closing because of astronomical electric bills |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Ah but here's the flip side - as a result of caps some heavy users have effectively been benefiting from "free" energy as the company's have not been able to levy the costs back on them.
Just because a cap is lifted doesn't mean that everyone automatically gets charged more. Heavier users will hurt the most of course they will and it's often those in poorly insulated homes etc that can least afford it are those users.
The media will show you every example of every extreme case - that's what sells stories. I'm gonna watch my meters and add my meter readings daily in October when my current tarrif expires. Then I'll keep switching everything but my fridge of til I can afford what I am using. |
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"Ah but here's the flip side - as a result of caps some heavy users have effectively been benefiting from "free" energy as the company's have not been able to levy the costs back on them.
Just because a cap is lifted doesn't mean that everyone automatically gets charged more. Heavier users will hurt the most of course they will and it's often those in poorly insulated homes etc that can least afford it are those users.
The media will show you every example of every extreme case - that's what sells stories. I'm gonna watch my meters and add my meter readings daily in October when my current tarrif expires. Then I'll keep switching everything but my fridge of til I can afford what I am using."
The unit price of energy and the standing charge is going up by 80% in October. So, if you use the same amount of units of energy in October this year as last, you will pay significantly more, plus the extra standing charge. The cap is not on how high the Bill can be. It's on the unit charge of energy and the standing charge (for domestic users).
No one is getting free energy. Very heavy users of energy in domestic settings will just pay through the nose for it. Their unit price per kWh will be capped like everyone else, but there's no cap on how many kWh you can be charged for. |
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"Ah but here's the flip side - as a result of caps some heavy users have effectively been benefiting from "free" energy as the company's have not been able to levy the costs back on them.
Just because a cap is lifted doesn't mean that everyone automatically gets charged more. Heavier users will hurt the most of course they will and it's often those in poorly insulated homes etc that can least afford it are those users.
The media will show you every example of every extreme case - that's what sells stories. I'm gonna watch my meters and add my meter readings daily in October when my current tarrif expires. Then I'll keep switching everything but my fridge of til I can afford what I am using."
Ok. I'm going to invest in keeping the heat in my house, because I understand what is happening. |
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The problem is that many businesses have been running on zero profit margin for a long time now. The £3 you currently pay for that coffee has to pay for the coffee itself, the power to heat the water, the power for the fridge to keep the milk cold, the lighting bill for the cafe, the heating bill in the winter, the aircon/fan bill in the summer, washing the cup afterwards, maintenance of the coffee machine, wages for the staff, business rates to the council for the property, vat to the government because it's luxury food, national insurance contributions for the staff, tax on any profit the business does actually make, transport costs when the owner goes to the cash and carry to get the coffee and little biscuits, building maintenance, printing the menu... And on and on. So when the cost of power goes up to five times what it was (no price cap on power for businesses), the cost of the raw foodstuffs has gone up at least 50%, the cost of running the car to the cash&carry has doubled, the staff want more money because they can't afford to live on what they're earning... Suddenly that cup of coffee just cannot be made for £3 any more. It's either put the price up by a ridiculous amount, or make a loss on every cup sold. And nobody can pay the ridiculous amount for the cup of coffee. So the only possible option is for the owner to close down. They're going to go bust anyway, so it's either go bust now, or go further into debt and go bust later.
Story repeated for every single business in the country that is currently running at zero margin. |
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By *eisty LadyWoman
over a year ago
Count Your Blessings Cottage, Gratitude Grove |
"To top the £14 pint in London story, a cafe (not London) estimates they will need to charge £18+ for a cup of coffee to break even when their energy tariff increases.
"
So long as it tastes good and it’s not a take out coffee that’s fine |
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Sooner or later the government will have to come to terms with the reality that allowing run away energy costs will collapse the country. There us precisely one solution, which is for the means of energy production to be regulated by the government at a price point where the country can afford to keep going. Exactly how they do that is up to them, but tax cuts don't do it (which gives exactly zero help to people and businesses that are not paying tax because they're already making no money). And handing out the odd couple of hundred to people doesn't do it when their bills go up by a couple of thousand. And giving grants to people for them to give to the power companies just moves public money into the utility owners revenue stream, it doesn't give any incentive for the power to be reduced to a realistic cost, and it just (in the long term) puts the charge back onto the tax payer.
So... Public ownership of the means of power production, running at zero profit, probably government subsidised but at least not putting public money into the pockets of people who are already billionaires, and making the power using the most economical method. Where "economical" means also including the costs to the environment. And that power needs to be made available pretty damn quick, because having lovely new nuclear plants in 30 years time is no bloody use when (a) the country will have collapsed 29 years before they start providing power, and (b) the coastal locations of them (they need seawater for cooling) will be underwater five years before the plants open... |
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The options are either the UK PLC fixes the short term energy cost problem now, or within 12 months the UK PLC will no longer exist as a trading entity. This will undoubtedly require the government to retrieve much of the billions that is currently being extracted from every single employee of UK PLC into the pockets of non-uk enterprises.
Then over the following five years it must fix the longer term power provision problem, and manage to put the whole country back onto a profitable basis, or within five years the UK PLC will no longer exist. |
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The country needs be led by people that care for others and not just their own pockets. We are increasingly becoming a laughing stock around the world in every possible way. This is not meant to be a political post but there is absolutely nobody I know of in our political system with the guts, exetience and integrity to navigate us through this mess. Some people who have in the past or still blindly support their political party without questioning their morals, well what can I say except that perhaps you should feel some shame.  |
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By *icketysplits OP Woman
over a year ago
Way over Yonder, that's where I'm bound |
"Ah but here's the flip side - as a result of caps some heavy users have effectively been benefiting from "free" energy as the company's have not been able to levy the costs back on them.
Just because a cap is lifted doesn't mean that everyone automatically gets charged more. Heavier users will hurt the most of course they will and it's often those in poorly insulated homes etc that can least afford it are those users.
The media will show you every example of every extreme case - that's what sells stories. I'm gonna watch my meters and add my meter readings daily in October when my current tarrif expires. Then I'll keep switching everything but my fridge of til I can afford what I am using."
What do you switch off if you're a business that requires the lights to be on so people know you're open and so that they can see once inside, the cold storage to remain cold for safety reasons, the heating to remain on for comfort and safety, and your margins were already very low?
There is very little shopping around available for better tariffs. Hospices are being quoted 300% increase. I mean I know most of the people in a hospice will die but the idea they can turn off equipment, shut off the lights, heating and fridge is ridiculous.
The scaremongering extreme cases will become more of a norm as contracts end.
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