FabSwingers.com > Forums > The Lounge > Are you capable?
Are you capable?
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"Anything Rees Mogg says it's wrong. If he agreed with me then I would be wrong too." So youre in the former category then as opposed to the latter. Why would you not treat each comment on its own merit rather than boxing it off based purely on the mouth it came from? Im curious | |||
"Good question! I’d like to think I am good at separating an opinion, but sometimes I don’t think I do. It’s like there’s a small stain left on them. If that makes sense?" Makes perfect sense, and i think we're all a little guilty of it. The more one becomes entrenched in their overall views, the more they become subject to that tendancy i think | |||
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"Depends on the opinion being expressed. Some things that are said are unforgivable, unacceptable and should never be tolerated. Others are simply opinions. A" Well thats what im asking, are you capable of treating the opinion on its own merits, regardless of who expressed it? So if you agree with the opinion but hate the person, or vice versa, are you capable of acknowledging that and accepting it? | |||
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"Something i have been thinking about recently, which i think is more and more relevant in this increasingly polarised society...are you capable of separating an opinion from the person that expressed the opinion? To expand on that, are you the type of person who will dismiss out of hand something uttered by a person you normally find you vehemently disagree with, even if that utterance in question is actually reasonable in that instance? Or are you able to treat it on its own merits independent of your feelings of the person in question? " I absolutely am and as a result I'm willing to discuss litterally anything with anyone no matter how polarising. Its critical that people are able to do that i think... more so with the global nature of things. Not doing so, and having a niche or tribal (echo chamber) approaches to things begets that which you're standing against and has disastrous consequences usually. | |||
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"Anything Rees Mogg says it's wrong. If he agreed with me then I would be wrong too." This  no question | |||
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" I suppose it can vastly depend on how that individual delivered their opinion? You can see it in the forums probably moreso than real life, where people aren't so quick to express opposing views as they aren't as anonymous." Thats interesting. What do you mean by 'how they delivered it'? Do you mean, for eg, maybe its an opinion you agree with but was delivered in an aggressive manner? | |||
"Keeping it within the bounds of fab and the forums there are many reasons for not liking certain people. If they have a history of expressing ignorant, insulting or belligerent opinions and suddenly come up with one that flies in the face of everything that's gone before, the cynic in me refuses to believe it's a genuine opinion even if it's one I agree with. I won't acknowledge opinions in cases like that. " At what stage then will you acknowledge it? What if the person expresses a second opinion you agree with? Would they have to express several before you might acknowledge one? | |||
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"Depends on the opinion being expressed. Some things that are said are unforgivable, unacceptable and should never be tolerated. Others are simply opinions. A Well thats what im asking, are you capable of treating the opinion on its own merits, regardless of who expressed it? So if you agree with the opinion but hate the person, or vice versa, are you capable of acknowledging that and accepting it? " Some opinions have no merits. Nor the people expressing them. A | |||
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"Keeping it within the bounds of fab and the forums there are many reasons for not liking certain people. If they have a history of expressing ignorant, insulting or belligerent opinions and suddenly come up with one that flies in the face of everything that's gone before, the cynic in me refuses to believe it's a genuine opinion even if it's one I agree with. I won't acknowledge opinions in cases like that. At what stage then will you acknowledge it? What if the person expresses a second opinion you agree with? Would they have to express several before you might acknowledge one? " On here I wouldn't acknowledge any opinions they offer if they have history of trolling or being deliberately incendiary. Then again it's not in my nature to publicly acknowledge views and opinions from people I do actually like. They don't need my validation. | |||
"Depends on the opinion being expressed. Some things that are said are unforgivable, unacceptable and should never be tolerated. Others are simply opinions. A Well thats what im asking, are you capable of treating the opinion on its own merits, regardless of who expressed it? So if you agree with the opinion but hate the person, or vice versa, are you capable of acknowledging that and accepting it? Some opinions have no merits. Nor the people expressing them. A" So i think youre on the side of the fence so that cant separate the person from the opinion? That seems to be more and more prevalent these days i think its fair to say | |||
"Keeping it within the bounds of fab and the forums there are many reasons for not liking certain people. If they have a history of expressing ignorant, insulting or belligerent opinions and suddenly come up with one that flies in the face of everything that's gone before, the cynic in me refuses to believe it's a genuine opinion even if it's one I agree with. I won't acknowledge opinions in cases like that. At what stage then will you acknowledge it? What if the person expresses a second opinion you agree with? Would they have to express several before you might acknowledge one? On here I wouldn't acknowledge any opinions they offer if they have history of trolling or being deliberately incendiary. Then again it's not in my nature to publicly acknowledge views and opinions from people I do actually like. They don't need my validation. " Well not even publicly acknowledge, how about even privately acknowledge and accept? For how long are you coloured by the persons other opinions before you can acknowledge you might agree with a new opinion of theirs? | |||
"Depends on the opinion being expressed. Some things that are said are unforgivable, unacceptable and should never be tolerated. Others are simply opinions. A Well thats what im asking, are you capable of treating the opinion on its own merits, regardless of who expressed it? So if you agree with the opinion but hate the person, or vice versa, are you capable of acknowledging that and accepting it? Some opinions have no merits. Nor the people expressing them. A So i think youre on the side of the fence so that cant separate the person from the opinion? That seems to be more and more prevalent these days i think its fair to say" Nope. Not at all. Everyone is entitled to an opinion whether I agree with it or not and there are people that I'm friends with and very fond of that have wildly differing opinions than me. Nothing wrong with that. There are however people who either through plain ignorance or intolerance, express opinions that are offensive. There's little that can be done to separate the opinion from the arsehole sometimes. It's perfectly possible for it to be situationally dependent much like many aspects of life. A | |||
"Depends on the opinion being expressed. Some things that are said are unforgivable, unacceptable and should never be tolerated. Others are simply opinions. A Well thats what im asking, are you capable of treating the opinion on its own merits, regardless of who expressed it? So if you agree with the opinion but hate the person, or vice versa, are you capable of acknowledging that and accepting it? Some opinions have no merits. Nor the people expressing them. A So i think youre on the side of the fence so that cant separate the person from the opinion? That seems to be more and more prevalent these days i think its fair to say Nope. Not at all. Everyone is entitled to an opinion whether I agree with it or not and there are people that I'm friends with and very fond of that have wildly differing opinions than me. Nothing wrong with that. There are however people who either through plain ignorance or intolerance, express opinions that are offensive. There's little that can be done to separate the opinion from the arsehole sometimes. It's perfectly possible for it to be situationally dependent much like many aspects of life. A" But you said some opinions have no merit, nor the person expressing them. Does that not indicate that even if such a person were to express an opinion you actually agreed with, that you would still dismiss it, because of the person it came from? | |||
"Anything Rees Mogg says it's wrong. If he agreed with me then I would be wrong too. So youre in the former category then as opposed to the latter. Why would you not treat each comment on its own merit rather than boxing it off based purely on the mouth it came from? Im curious" Because of the mouth it came out of. | |||
"Depends on the opinion being expressed. Some things that are said are unforgivable, unacceptable and should never be tolerated. Others are simply opinions. A Well thats what im asking, are you capable of treating the opinion on its own merits, regardless of who expressed it? So if you agree with the opinion but hate the person, or vice versa, are you capable of acknowledging that and accepting it? Some opinions have no merits. Nor the people expressing them. A So i think youre on the side of the fence so that cant separate the person from the opinion? That seems to be more and more prevalent these days i think its fair to say Nope. Not at all. Everyone is entitled to an opinion whether I agree with it or not and there are people that I'm friends with and very fond of that have wildly differing opinions than me. Nothing wrong with that. There are however people who either through plain ignorance or intolerance, express opinions that are offensive. There's little that can be done to separate the opinion from the arsehole sometimes. It's perfectly possible for it to be situationally dependent much like many aspects of life. A But you said some opinions have no merit, nor the person expressing them. Does that not indicate that even if such a person were to express an opinion you actually agreed with, that you would still dismiss it, because of the person it came from? " No. You seem to be trying to twist the words that I've quite clearly typed. I said some opinions have no merit nor the person expressing them. I'll give clear examples. Racists who believe in white supremacy. Incel misogynists who believe women are beneath them, and should be good little housewives serving them and their needs. Homophobes who see anyone not straight as abnormal. I could go on but if you can't grasp the concept I'm trying to display then there's little point. A | |||
"Depends on the opinion being expressed. Some things that are said are unforgivable, unacceptable and should never be tolerated. Others are simply opinions. A Well thats what im asking, are you capable of treating the opinion on its own merits, regardless of who expressed it? So if you agree with the opinion but hate the person, or vice versa, are you capable of acknowledging that and accepting it? Some opinions have no merits. Nor the people expressing them. A So i think youre on the side of the fence so that cant separate the person from the opinion? That seems to be more and more prevalent these days i think its fair to say Nope. Not at all. Everyone is entitled to an opinion whether I agree with it or not and there are people that I'm friends with and very fond of that have wildly differing opinions than me. Nothing wrong with that. There are however people who either through plain ignorance or intolerance, express opinions that are offensive. There's little that can be done to separate the opinion from the arsehole sometimes. It's perfectly possible for it to be situationally dependent much like many aspects of life. A But you said some opinions have no merit, nor the person expressing them. Does that not indicate that even if such a person were to express an opinion you actually agreed with, that you would still dismiss it, because of the person it came from? No. You seem to be trying to twist the words that I've quite clearly typed. I said some opinions have no merit nor the person expressing them. I'll give clear examples. Racists who believe in white supremacy. Incel misogynists who believe women are beneath them, and should be good little housewives serving them and their needs. Homophobes who see anyone not straight as abnormal. I could go on but if you can't grasp the concept I'm trying to display then there's little point. A" Im not trying to twist anything at all, im only exploring peoples views on the subject. So to develop on your example; if a white supremacist expressed a view that you also held, im going to take a guess here, for example that all those suffering with mental health issues should be offered all necessary supports and treatment. Would you be able to acknowledge that you agree with them on that? | |||
"Anything Rees Mogg says it's wrong. If he agreed with me then I would be wrong too. So youre in the former category then as opposed to the latter. Why would you not treat each comment on its own merit rather than boxing it off based purely on the mouth it came from? Im curious Because of the mouth it came out of. " Fair enough. I dont agree but i accept your own position | |||
"Depends on the opinion being expressed. Some things that are said are unforgivable, unacceptable and should never be tolerated. Others are simply opinions. A Well thats what im asking, are you capable of treating the opinion on its own merits, regardless of who expressed it? So if you agree with the opinion but hate the person, or vice versa, are you capable of acknowledging that and accepting it? Some opinions have no merits. Nor the people expressing them. A So i think youre on the side of the fence so that cant separate the person from the opinion? That seems to be more and more prevalent these days i think its fair to say Nope. Not at all. Everyone is entitled to an opinion whether I agree with it or not and there are people that I'm friends with and very fond of that have wildly differing opinions than me. Nothing wrong with that. There are however people who either through plain ignorance or intolerance, express opinions that are offensive. There's little that can be done to separate the opinion from the arsehole sometimes. It's perfectly possible for it to be situationally dependent much like many aspects of life. A But you said some opinions have no merit, nor the person expressing them. Does that not indicate that even if such a person were to express an opinion you actually agreed with, that you would still dismiss it, because of the person it came from? No. You seem to be trying to twist the words that I've quite clearly typed. I said some opinions have no merit nor the person expressing them. I'll give clear examples. Racists who believe in white supremacy. Incel misogynists who believe women are beneath them, and should be good little housewives serving them and their needs. Homophobes who see anyone not straight as abnormal. I could go on but if you can't grasp the concept I'm trying to display then there's little point. A Im not trying to twist anything at all, im only exploring peoples views on the subject. So to develop on your example; if a white supremacist expressed a view that you also held, im going to take a guess here, for example that all those suffering with mental health issues should be offered all necessary supports and treatment. Would you be able to acknowledge that you agree with them on that? " Basically what you want someone to say is that if Hitler said puppies and fluffy kittens are cute then you'd agree with him, thus agreeing with Hitler despite him being, well, a prize cunt. In theory yes - it's possible to agree on a statement made by someone who is fundamentally evil, deserving of hate and who should be buried 100ft underground in a barrel of shit whilst still alive. Theory is one thing. The likelihood of someone you despise for ideological, moral or ethical reasons, saying something important that you agree with is much smaller than them saying something that offends you though. In 'theory' anything is possible. In practice.....? A | |||
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"Depends on the opinion being expressed. Some things that are said are unforgivable, unacceptable and should never be tolerated. Others are simply opinions. A Well thats what im asking, are you capable of treating the opinion on its own merits, regardless of who expressed it? So if you agree with the opinion but hate the person, or vice versa, are you capable of acknowledging that and accepting it? Some opinions have no merits. Nor the people expressing them. A So i think youre on the side of the fence so that cant separate the person from the opinion? That seems to be more and more prevalent these days i think its fair to say Nope. Not at all. Everyone is entitled to an opinion whether I agree with it or not and there are people that I'm friends with and very fond of that have wildly differing opinions than me. Nothing wrong with that. There are however people who either through plain ignorance or intolerance, express opinions that are offensive. There's little that can be done to separate the opinion from the arsehole sometimes. It's perfectly possible for it to be situationally dependent much like many aspects of life. A But you said some opinions have no merit, nor the person expressing them. Does that not indicate that even if such a person were to express an opinion you actually agreed with, that you would still dismiss it, because of the person it came from? No. You seem to be trying to twist the words that I've quite clearly typed. I said some opinions have no merit nor the person expressing them. I'll give clear examples. Racists who believe in white supremacy. Incel misogynists who believe women are beneath them, and should be good little housewives serving them and their needs. Homophobes who see anyone not straight as abnormal. I could go on but if you can't grasp the concept I'm trying to display then there's little point. A Im not trying to twist anything at all, im only exploring peoples views on the subject. So to develop on your example; if a white supremacist expressed a view that you also held, im going to take a guess here, for example that all those suffering with mental health issues should be offered all necessary supports and treatment. Would you be able to acknowledge that you agree with them on that? Basically what you want someone to say is that if Hitler said puppies and fluffy kittens are cute then you'd agree with him, thus agreeing with Hitler despite him being, well, a prize cunt. In theory yes - it's possible to agree on a statement made by someone who is fundamentally evil, deserving of hate and who should be buried 100ft underground in a barrel of shit whilst still alive. Theory is one thing. The likelihood of someone you despise for ideological, moral or ethical reasons, saying something important that you agree with is much smaller than them saying something that offends you though. In 'theory' anything is possible. In practice.....? A " Oh youre most likely correct, when it comes to such extreme examples. Quite often there are people who we just don't like or normally vehemently disagree with, and its moreso those situations im trying to to the heart of, rather than the extreme ones | |||
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"Depends on the opinion being expressed. Some things that are said are unforgivable, unacceptable and should never be tolerated. Others are simply opinions. A Well thats what im asking, are you capable of treating the opinion on its own merits, regardless of who expressed it? So if you agree with the opinion but hate the person, or vice versa, are you capable of acknowledging that and accepting it? Some opinions have no merits. Nor the people expressing them. A So i think youre on the side of the fence so that cant separate the person from the opinion? That seems to be more and more prevalent these days i think its fair to say Nope. Not at all. Everyone is entitled to an opinion whether I agree with it or not and there are people that I'm friends with and very fond of that have wildly differing opinions than me. Nothing wrong with that. There are however people who either through plain ignorance or intolerance, express opinions that are offensive. There's little that can be done to separate the opinion from the arsehole sometimes. It's perfectly possible for it to be situationally dependent much like many aspects of life. A But you said some opinions have no merit, nor the person expressing them. Does that not indicate that even if such a person were to express an opinion you actually agreed with, that you would still dismiss it, because of the person it came from? No. You seem to be trying to twist the words that I've quite clearly typed. I said some opinions have no merit nor the person expressing them. I'll give clear examples. Racists who believe in white supremacy. Incel misogynists who believe women are beneath them, and should be good little housewives serving them and their needs. Homophobes who see anyone not straight as abnormal. I could go on but if you can't grasp the concept I'm trying to display then there's little point. A Im not trying to twist anything at all, im only exploring peoples views on the subject. So to develop on your example; if a white supremacist expressed a view that you also held, im going to take a guess here, for example that all those suffering with mental health issues should be offered all necessary supports and treatment. Would you be able to acknowledge that you agree with them on that? Basically what you want someone to say is that if Hitler said puppies and fluffy kittens are cute then you'd agree with him, thus agreeing with Hitler despite him being, well, a prize cunt. In theory yes - it's possible to agree on a statement made by someone who is fundamentally evil, deserving of hate and who should be buried 100ft underground in a barrel of shit whilst still alive. Theory is one thing. The likelihood of someone you despise for ideological, moral or ethical reasons, saying something important that you agree with is much smaller than them saying something that offends you though. In 'theory' anything is possible. In practice.....? A Oh youre most likely correct, when it comes to such extreme examples. Quite often there are people who we just don't like or normally vehemently disagree with, and its moreso those situations im trying to to the heart of, rather than the extreme ones" Ok. One final word on this from me. Yes. Of course if someone you dislike says something that you agree with of course it's perfectly possible to recognise that on that matter they are correct in your mind. It doesn't necessarily change at all your opinion of them based on previous experiences, views they have expressed or behaviour they have demonstrated. Likewise it's perfectly possible for someone you love to say something you disagree with, yet you don't suddenly start not loving them. And on that note........ A | |||
