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Fixing the Police

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By *ssex_tom OP Man over a year ago

Chelmsford

The Chief of Police has said that the problem is not just a few bad apples..

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By *rwhowhatwherewhyMan over a year ago

Aylesbury

Sure, teach everybody how to avoid getting caught for crimes. Sounds like a great idea that.

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By *ora the explorerWoman over a year ago

Paradise, Herts

No. I don’t think it would.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Nope, your idea is no good

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Then there would be even more bad apples.

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By *hrista BellendWoman over a year ago

Delightful Bliss

Nope it's not the answer Tom, more education and support for up to 18 years would be better suited. Too any kids are falling through the cracks and ending up getting lost

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By *arkus1812Man over a year ago

Lifes departure lounge NN9 Northamptonshire East not West MidlandsMidlands

National Service ended in 1957 so most people on here would not know what it was.

No. Conscription of police officers is not a good idea.

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By *iamondCougarWoman over a year ago

Norfuck! / Lincolnshire

Great idea in theory Tom but I don’t think it would solve the problem

The police force needs to get its face into every school and teach kids what it means abide by the law

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By *ssex_tom OP Man over a year ago

Chelmsford

"Great idea in theory Tom but I don’t think it would solve the problem

The police force needs to get its face into every school and teach kids what it means abide by the law"

Can't the teachers do that ?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

The bad apples are in number 10 so start your solution there.

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By *aliceWoman over a year ago

Birmingham

The problem is not with the publics understanding of policing. It's with the police understanding of policing.

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By *annaBeStrongMan over a year ago

wokingham

Make the majority of the police force untrained, unpaid, forced labour?

What could go wrong?

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By *inky-MinxWoman over a year ago

Grantham

The police have the highest per capita incidence of domestic violence.

Toxic people can never be fixed.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"The Chief of Police has said that the problem is not just a few bad apples..

sure they should give everyone a shot of Prime Minister too

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By *ssex_tom OP Man over a year ago

Chelmsford

"Make the majority of the police force untrained, unpaid, forced labour?

What could go wrong? "

Could it be worse?

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By *annaBeStrongMan over a year ago

wokingham

"Make the majority of the police force untrained, unpaid, forced labour?

What could go wrong?

Could it be worse?"

Yeah

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By *ssex_tom OP Man over a year ago

Chelmsford

"The problem is not with the publics understanding of policing. It's with the police understanding of policing.

Most profound statement of the week ..

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

I dont want to argue about my thoughts on the legal muppets in this country be it police or courts all il say is its not nearly good enough

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By *annaBeStrongMan over a year ago

wokingham

This is such a terrible idea, on so many levels, it actually makes Johnson’s last 2 years look great

I’m shocked people out there actually think this way.

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By *cotty1376Man over a year ago

PRESTON

there are bad apples everywhere in life and in every institution , i don't think this would solve any of that , it would give criminals with friends serving a chance to take advantage of them in certain ways , i'll say no more as i don't want to sound like i know what i am on about , but it would be quite easy to pay off a friend or bully them for information etc

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

I should imagine you have to do the job before one judges

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By *scobar67Man over a year ago

glasgow

"The Chief of Police has said that the problem is not just a few bad apples..

No this wouldn't work... Ppl need to be trained to become a police officer so how would you find the money to train 99% of Britain??

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By *ad NannaWoman over a year ago

East London

And all the criminally minded people would then be on the inside.

You didn't think this through did you Tom.

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By *akie32Man over a year ago

winchester

what police, cant remember when i last saw one.

and my mum recently got burgled , they didnt come out.

I think less paperwork for them and more time policing would help.

my cousin is a police man and thats what he wants, and like the nhs its to top heavy, not enough boots on the ground

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By *arlomaleMan over a year ago

darlington

The problem with the police is they do a difficult job with one hand tied behind their back to many rites for the criminals Ray Mallon ex Cleveland police chief absolutely went to town on drug dealers and burglars he raided them constantly and in the end he was shoved out you can’t do that ray it’s against their human rites it’s funny that the crime rate at that time in Cleveland was at an all time low

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By *hubby CoupleCouple over a year ago

Essex

Where’s Dianne Abbott when you need here ?

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By *arlomaleMan over a year ago

darlington

"Where’s Dianne Abbott when you need here ?

"
still trying to work out how to fund new officers with £20

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By *inky_couple2020Couple over a year ago

North West

Hmmmm. I think I'll sign up for the riot squad. A spot of armour plating on the ol' wheelchair and what could possibly go wrong?!

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Nope it's not the answer Tom, more education and support for up to 18 years would be better suited. Too any kids are falling through the cracks and ending up getting lost

this more free sports and more youth clubs for under 18s

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By *ictoria_1976TV/TS over a year ago

Launceston

Hmmm - just Google the costs of salary, equipment, pension etc for Met PC's (& officers) - then throw the training costs into the mix - then throw into the equation that when trained a newbie is sent out they also take an experienced cop out of action whilst showing them the ropes so it doesn't take a rocket scientist to work out it's a total non starter

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"The problem is not with the publics understanding of policing. It's with the police understanding of policing.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

So hard not to comment

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By *ictoria_1976TV/TS over a year ago

Launceston

"So hard not to comment "

I think that's the plan!

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By *mma29Couple over a year ago

wirral

“A good idea is a good idea forever.”

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"So hard not to comment "

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"So hard not to comment

I think that's the plan!

"
grrr lol

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By *ersiantugMan over a year ago

Cardiff

"Where’s Dianne Abbott when you need here ?

still trying to work out how to fund new officers with £20

--You will find this impossibly woke (and fwiw I'm not at all) but I genuinely found and still find that whole joke racist.-

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By *rDiscretionXXXMan over a year ago

Gilfach

"The problem is not with the publics understanding of policing. It's with the police understanding of policing."

Absolutely, this.

Someone above stated that it was because the criminals have too many rights. The reason why lawyers have got so good at applying those rights is because so many police officers have relied on breaking them whenever they feel like it.

We need to completely change the way of thinking in the police forces.

Still at least it's not as bad here as it is in the US.

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By *a LunaWoman over a year ago

South Wales

Only if they got rid of the beep test

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By *arlomaleMan over a year ago

darlington

"Where’s Dianne Abbott when you need here ?

still trying to work out how to fund new officers with £20

--You will find this impossibly woke (and fwiw I'm not at all) but I genuinely found and still find that whole joke racist.-"
why because she’s rubbish at maths

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By *ouple in LancashireCouple over a year ago

in Lancashire

"Great idea in theory Tom but I don’t think it would solve the problem

The police force needs to get its face into every school and teach kids what it means abide by the law"

Disagree, that surely is the responsibility of parents and guardians..

And the idea by the OP isn't a good one..

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

I'd consider something more like the Swiss though I would add certain components.

Everyone serves a 2-year period and a 1-year period before they 30th birthday then 1 month per year from the time they are 18.

They serve any of the services, military or domestic. They need not necessarily be placed into combat roles or as surgeons, paramedics or investigating police and the various forces can put them in whatever job they feel suits the individual best.

Still not perfect but a slight improvement.

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By *orny PTMan over a year ago

Peterborough

Cop culture is real and is a major problem, just ask the LSE.

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By *rDiscretionXXXMan over a year ago

Gilfach

"You will find this impossibly woke (and fwiw I'm not at all) but I genuinely found and still find that whole joke racist."

It's perfectly possible to find a person foolish and incapable without looking at the colour of her skin.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"The Chief of Police has said that the problem is not just a few bad apples..

I'd rather shit in my hands and clap tbh

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Where’s Dianne Abbott when you need here ?

What's Dianne Abbott got to do with this?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Great idea in theory Tom but I don’t think it would solve the problem

The police force needs to get its face into every school and teach kids what it means abide by the law

Disagree, that surely is the responsibility of parents and guardians..

And the idea by the OP isn't a good one.."
some kids just rebel it happens from all walks of life regardless of parenting or background sometimes they just need the rush of doing something naughty there not bad kids but they are hero worshipped by there piers for being fearless others its necessity they have nothing to lose

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"You will find this impossibly woke (and fwiw I'm not at all) but I genuinely found and still find that whole joke racist.

It's perfectly possible to find a person foolish and incapable without looking at the colour of her skin."

Tell that to the people who regularly racially abuse her then

Funny that this person brought her into the conversation instead of the actual prime minster?

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By *uperjackMan over a year ago

Bristol

"Where’s Dianne Abbott when you need here ?

still trying to work out how to fund new officers with £20

--You will find this impossibly woke (and fwiw I'm not at all) but I genuinely found and still find that whole joke racist.-"

I don’t find it woke. Just don’t get the connection. At all.

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By *arlomaleMan over a year ago

darlington

"Where’s Dianne Abbott when you need here ?

What's Dianne Abbott got to do with this?"
probably got to do with the car crash interview with nick ferrari about funding the plod it was another spectacular fail on her behalf she’s not fit for her role and it’s got nothing to do with her colour although people have tried to turn it into that sad really

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

It’s easy to look at policing and say that’s where all the problems are. The police can’t fix the root causes of crime.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

anarchy for the uk

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By *ersiantugMan over a year ago

Cardiff

"Where’s Dianne Abbott when you need here ?

still trying to work out how to fund new officers with £20

--You will find this impossibly woke (and fwiw I'm not at all) but I genuinely found and still find that whole joke racist.--

why because she’s rubbish at maths "

----No because of the obsession with it. True racism is obsessive. People who have researched this cannot find any other female politician (possibly male too) who has been so sustainingly attacked in this particular manner. Statistically Abbot stands highly in her work-load, capabilities and general respect for her in parliament.

Look at the background here.

It was a snap election, the Tories under Therese May did next to nothing (and almost lost it consequently), while Labour had to run around everywhere, including in the mosh pit of LBC radio (though I wouldn't have myself).

Abbot was unwell at the time with diabetes (which people have accepted, and that she had to work through it) and slipped her numbers. Which is notoriously easy to do in politics and they range from micro transactions to billions of pounds in existing and non-existing money - and everything in between. It's actually very easy to brain fart with them when you having to rush around discussing everything.

Labour got so close that another week or two and *they* would have been talking to the Northern Irish DUP for support - only a few hundred votes over a few areas was in that election in the end!

Sociologists have tried everything to understand the degree of fixation with Abbot, and at the end of the day

all they are left with for many of them is the petty fear in certain people of black skin.

And it also showed some people's stupidity of course. Some people were discussing her figures like they now had to be in Labour's manifesto.---

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Where’s Dianne Abbott when you need here ?

still trying to work out how to fund new officers with £20

--You will find this impossibly woke (and fwiw I'm not at all) but I genuinely found and still find that whole joke racist.--

why because she’s rubbish at maths

Look at the background here.

Labour got so close that another week or two and *they* would have been talking to the Northern Irish DUP for support - only a few hundred votes over a few areas was in that election in the end!

Sociologists have tried everything to understand the degree of fixation with Abbot, and at the end of the day

all they are left with for many of them is the petty fear in certain people of black skin.

And it also showed some people's stupidity of course. Some people were discussing her figures like they now had to be in Labour's manifesto.---"

They still lost

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By *ersiantugMan over a year ago

Cardiff

"They still lost

Just

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By *ssex_tom OP Man over a year ago

Chelmsford

"Where’s Dianne Abbott when you need here ?

still trying to work out how to fund new officers with £20

--You will find this impossibly woke (and fwiw I'm not at all) but I genuinely found and still find that whole joke racist.--

why because she’s rubbish at maths

Look at the background here.

Labour got so close that another week or two and *they* would have been talking to the Northern Irish DUP for support - only a few hundred votes over a few areas was in that election in the end!

Sociologists have tried everything to understand the degree of fixation with Abbot, and at the end of the day

all they are left with for many of them is the petty fear in certain people of black skin.

And it also showed some people's stupidity of course. Some people were discussing her figures like they now had to be in Labour's manifesto.---"

Did she have two left shoes on that did not match ?.

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By *orny PTMan over a year ago

Peterborough

"Where’s Dianne Abbott when you need here ?

What's Dianne Abbott got to do with this? probably got to do with the car crash interview with nick ferrari about funding the plod it was another spectacular fail on her behalf she’s not fit for her role and it’s got nothing to do with her colour although people have tried to turn it into that sad really "

Cressida Dick is white and useless.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Where’s Dianne Abbott when you need here ?

Cressida Dick is white and useless."

Yet she's only just been mentioned in this topic......

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By *ssex_tom OP Man over a year ago

Chelmsford

Did Cressida have mismatching shoes tho ?

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By *orny PTMan over a year ago

Peterborough

I'd only just found it, so didn't want to disappoint.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Did Cressida have mismatching shoes tho ?"

Do you really believe this?

Do me a favour and put your right foot in your left shoe and tell us if it would be physically possible to spend the day on your feet like that

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By *rDiscretionXXXMan over a year ago

Gilfach

"People who have researched this cannot find any other female politician (possibly male too) who has been so sustainingly attacked in this particular manner."

Diane Abbott gets regularly attacked because she regularly makes gaffes, the most recent being her saying that Russia shouldn't be treated as the aggressor in Ukraine, and that NATO was to blame for it's expansionist policies.

Regardless of whether she deserves it or not, are you really saying that Diane Abbott has had more negative press than Teresa May?

Is she really more vilified than Boris Johnson?

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By *ssex_tom OP Man over a year ago

Chelmsford

"Did Cressida have mismatching shoes tho ?

Do you really believe this?

Do me a favour and put your right foot in your left shoe and tell us if it would be physically possible to spend the day on your feet like that"

Well I saw the video footage...was it doctored ?

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By *ersiantugMan over a year ago

Cardiff

"Where’s Dianne Abbott when you need here ?

What's Dianne Abbott got to do with this?

probably got to do with the car crash interview with nick ferrari about funding the plod it was another spectacular fail on her behalf she’s not fit for her role and it’s got nothing to do with her colour although people have tried to turn it into that sad really

Cressida Dick is white and useless."

---Dick was a HUGE survivor, over all the black people living with policing issues she always claimed there was never a problem with!

No one can compare Dicks inevitable fate with the deal Abbot still has to live with, it's gross.

And Abbot is supposed to have "spectacular fail" after "spectacular fail" - what are these? And how would they compare to OTHER politicians anyway? Ok it's often just the usual 'anti-Left' rhetoric from a google-eyed Right wing perspective. But its also a genuine race-based obsession in my view. Even when people can't seem to see it. ---

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By *ssex_tom OP Man over a year ago

Chelmsford

"Where’s Dianne Abbott when you need here ?

What's Dianne Abbott got to do with this?

Cressida Dick is white and useless.

---Dick was a HUGE survivor, over all the black people living with policing issues she always claimed there was never a problem with!

No one can compare Dicks inevitable fate with the deal Abbot still has to live with, it's gross.

Are fabbers pre disposed to being Tory ?

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By *ersiantugMan over a year ago

Cardiff

"Did Cressida have mismatching shoes tho ?"

-I imagine that was Abbots diabetes, I've been a carer and it's not an uncommon thing to do. Abbot wouldn't care. Really - do you?--

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"The Chief of Police has said that the problem is not just a few bad apples..

No this wouldn't work... Ppl need to be trained to become a police officer so how would you find the money to train 99% of Britain?? "

Most police are thick as pig shit in my experience. They follow a script and don’t know much when challenged about the laws they are meant to enforce. Lower ranks are more paramilitary boot boys these days than law enforcement professionals.

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By *ersiantugMan over a year ago

Cardiff

"Are fabbers pre disposed to being Tory ?"

No idea, why do you ask?-

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By *ssex_tom OP Man over a year ago

Chelmsford

"Did Cressida have mismatching shoes tho ?

-I imagine that was Abbots diabetes, I've been a carer and it's not an uncommon thing to do. Abbot wouldn't care. Really - do you?--"

Well the voters may care...

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By *penbicoupleCouple over a year ago

Northampton

No, it wouldn't work.

A good start would be for the Police to lead by example. We currently have an almost daily stream of Police misdemeanors, or politicians breaking the law.

I would rather that Police officers be those who are actually committed to the job and passionate about the law - not someone in their early 20s forced into the role.

"The Chief of Police has said that the problem is not just a few bad apples..

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By *ssex_tom OP Man over a year ago

Chelmsford

"The Chief of Police has said that the problem is not just a few bad apples..

No this wouldn't work... Ppl need to be trained to become a police officer so how would you find the money to train 99% of Britain??

You pay peanuts...

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Could be completly off giving the fact that I’m in Northern Ireland and policed by the PSNI (who I have the upmost respect for). Over here hatred towards the police is bread into many people on both sides of the divide. The psni itself isent a model police force and any one will admit that but steps need to be taken to move forward.

Saying that any interaction I have had with them has been 100% (most of the time I was getting a bolloxing)

but one time was wrong and made me feel stupid by a few officers, I personally think unless the public perception of the police here in Northern Ireland changes nothing will ever happen

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By *ictoria_1976TV/TS over a year ago

Launceston

"So hard not to comment

I think that's the plan!

grrr lol"

Haha - yes, our favourite troll is on one this evening!

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By *ersiantugMan over a year ago

Cardiff

"In your view would she have been a good Home Secretary if Labour had won the last election ?"

--That's very trollish - what are you laying up?

From my POV she would have made a fantastic one.--

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By *agerMorganMan over a year ago

Canvey Island

No, pressing people into the Police like national service would potentially backfire massively.

You’d want to be there, not because you’ve been pressed into it. What the police deal with does require a strong constitution to deal with some of the really nasty going ons in society (and is part of the reason I was medically let go, PTSD)

Where the police have failed is, in my view, is the required background checks that are carried out, it doesn’t delve anywhere far enough into a persons background to assess their fitness. Nor are character references and interviews done, psychological checks aren’t done either, all of this and more needs to be done because, as we’ve seen in the Sarah Everard incident, excessively rotten & foul fruit are getting through & it’s destroying the trust.

Also, now they’re introducing degree courses for officers. Great, but where’s the life experience coming in? We need officers who can assess a situation and make an informed decision without reading from a script, stuff that a bloody degree doesn’t teach!

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"The Chief of Police has said that the problem is not just a few bad apples..

No, it wouldn't. It would make things far worse.

And which Chief said that?

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By *ucka39Man over a year ago

Newcastle

Only way to abolish corruption is to start within the force to create a reputation that the public sector are able to regain trust thus enforcing the law cuts down criminal activities and justice making society safer far too many bent within the system

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By *ittle_brat_evie!!Woman over a year ago

evesham

"The Chief of Police has said that the problem is not just a few bad apples..

No, it wouldn't. It would make things far worse.

And which Chief said that? "

The acting one. It's on BBC news. Not the mad bit about making everyone be a police officer. That's just Tom.

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By *ssex_tom OP Man over a year ago

Chelmsford

"In your view would she have been a good Home Secretary if Labour had won the last election ?

--That's very trollish - what are you laying up?

From my POV she would have made a fantastic one.--

Enough said...

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By *ssex_tom OP Man over a year ago

Chelmsford

"The Chief of Police has said that the problem is not just a few bad apples..

No, it wouldn't. It would make things far worse.

And which Chief said that?

The acting one. It's on BBC news. Not the mad bit about making everyone be a police officer. That's just Tom. "

Evie

Tom quoted the Chief of Police as saying that it's not just a few rotten apples and then offered a solution..people can then agree or disagree

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"The Chief of Police has said that the problem is not just a few bad apples..

No, it wouldn't. It would make things far worse.

And which Chief said that?

The acting one. It's on BBC news. Not the mad bit about making everyone be a police officer. That's just Tom. "

Oh, House.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"The Chief of Police has said that the problem is not just a few bad apples..

No, it wouldn't. It would make things far worse.

And which Chief said that?

The acting one. It's on BBC news. Not the mad bit about making everyone be a police officer. That's just Tom.

Evie

Tom quoted the Chief of Police as saying that it's not just a few rotten apples and then offered a solution..people can then agree or disagree"

Is the admission that there are many bad apples just a cop out?

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By *ssex_tom OP Man over a year ago

Chelmsford

"The Chief of Police has said that the problem is not just a few bad apples..

No, it wouldn't. It would make things far worse.

And which Chief said that?

The acting one. It's on BBC news. Not the mad bit about making everyone be a police officer. That's just Tom.

Evie

Tom quoted the Chief of Police as saying that it's not just a few rotten apples and then offered a solution..people can then agree or disagree

Is the admission that there are many bad apples just a cop out?"

The Chief of Police said it's more than just a few bad apples

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By *aliceWoman over a year ago

Birmingham

It's a complete cop-out when institutional corruption, misogyny and racism have been the conclusions of numerous investigations into police failings and misconduct

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Anyone seriously interested in these topics should give Stanford prison experiment a watch, the 2015 film was very good.

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By *ssex_tom OP Man over a year ago

Chelmsford

"It's a complete cop-out when institutional corruption, misogyny and racism have been the conclusions of numerous investigations into police failings and misconduct"

So dilute the pool and bring in national service

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"The Chief of Police has said that the problem is not just a few bad apples..

No, it wouldn't. It would make things far worse.

And which Chief said that?

The acting one. It's on BBC news. Not the mad bit about making everyone be a police officer. That's just Tom.

Evie

Tom quoted the Chief of Police as saying that it's not just a few rotten apples and then offered a solution..people can then agree or disagree"

It's more than a 'few bad apples'

Granted alot of police people are amazing, I personally have 50% good experiences and 50% bad

How ever there seems to be a disproportionate amount of negative stories about the police than in any other sectors.

It's hard to trust the police when you hear stories about them strip searching 15 year old without their parents present or they're strip searching women and making comments to them about their body hair/odour

What other sector do you know where people do vile things like that?

Even within health care nurses and doctors see people at their most vulnerable and almost always naked yet you very rarely hear of such stories

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Is there any chance that we could stop calling him the Chief of Police? There is no such rank or title in the UK.

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By *ssex_tom OP Man over a year ago

Chelmsford

"The Chief of Police has said that the problem is not just a few bad apples..

No, it wouldn't. It would make things far worse.

And which Chief said that?

The acting one. It's on BBC news. Not the mad bit about making everyone be a police officer. That's just Tom.

Evie

Tom quoted the Chief of Police as saying that it's not just a few rotten apples and then offered a solution..people can then agree or disagree

It's more than a 'few bad apples'

Granted alot of police people are amazing, I personally have 50% good experiences and 50% bad

How ever there seems to be a disproportionate amount of negative stories about the police than in any other sectors.

What other sector do you know where people do vile things like that?

Even within health care nurses and doctors see people at their most vulnerable and almost always naked yet you very rarely hear of such stories "

There are about 30000 police officers in London alone...one story should not taint all of them.. or five or ten

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By *penbicoupleCouple over a year ago

Northampton

"The abuse may not specially be racist but she defo gets alot more negative press than other people who also make mistakes "

She's a phenomenal politician and has a commendable record of public service.

A tory MP could leave a briefcase full of top secret files on a train, but Ms. Abbott would be slated more for getting some figures wrong on a radio show.

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By *ersiantugMan over a year ago

Cardiff

"I wonder why that is...

--I've just reported you for repetition trolling. It's been a while since I've reported someone for anything, but all you want to do is get under someone's skin with that. No thanks.---

Alternative views are not trolling..

If alternative views are not accepted then free speech is dead.. "

Oh of course! I am now stealing your 'free speech'

If you keep repeating "I wonder why that is..." it's trolling. I don't like trolls. There is speech and there is trolling. And there is trolling to upset someone who is upset be a grievance. It's a sport I do not like. --

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"The abuse may not specially be racist but she defo gets alot more negative press than other people who also make mistakes

She's a phenomenal politician and has a commendable record of public service.

A tory MP could leave a briefcase full of top secret files on a train, but Ms. Abbott would be slated more for getting some figures wrong on a radio show."

Well a Tory MP is indirectly responsible for hundreds of deaths with this whole covid situation and has even been publicly outed as breaking his own rules yet Dianne Abbott is still the name on people's lips

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Is there any chance that we could stop calling him the Chief of Police? There is no such rank or title in the UK."

We’ll just pretend there is. We all know what is meant and the media also refer to “Police Chiefs” so no big deal.

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By *rDiscretionXXXMan over a year ago

Gilfach

"The sheer amount of it is because Abbot is black. Look at this very example! She is hardly the ONLY person to see NATO as an aggressive force (in this case they armed Ukraine instead of negotiating properly)- but she is the principle black one that people can think of. So it's called 'another incompetent gaffe ..."

I respect (though disagree with) her position on NATO. Having a different opinion on something is no reason to criticise someone.

The gaffe is that she publicly said it, knowing that it would go down badly in the press, a few weeks before the UK local elections. Sometimes in politics you need to know when to keep your mouth shut.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"The Chief of Police has said that the problem is not just a few bad apples..

No, it wouldn't. It would make things far worse.

And which Chief said that?

The acting one. It's on BBC news. Not the mad bit about making everyone be a police officer. That's just Tom.

Evie

Tom quoted the Chief of Police as saying that it's not just a few rotten apples and then offered a solution..people can then agree or disagree

It's more than a 'few bad apples'

Granted alot of police people are amazing, I personally have 50% good experiences and 50% bad

How ever there seems to be a disproportionate amount of negative stories about the police than in any other sectors.

What other sector do you know where people do vile things like that?

Even within health care nurses and doctors see people at their most vulnerable and almost always naked yet you very rarely hear of such stories

There are about 30000 police officers in London alone...one story should not taint all of them.. or five or ten"

It's not just 1 story though is it?

It's almost weekly that there is either an article written and/or video footage of Police all over the UK abusing their position

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By *ssex_tom OP Man over a year ago

Chelmsford

"The abuse may not specially be racist but she defo gets alot more negative press than other people who also make mistakes

She's a phenomenal politician and has a commendable record of public service.

A tory MP could leave a briefcase full of top secret files on a train, but Ms. Abbott would be slated more for getting some figures wrong on a radio show.

Not sure she is on anyone's lips..

She is in her twighlight years as a politician and God bless her.. great service and let her live a long and happy life

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Is there any chance that we could stop calling him the Chief of Police? There is no such rank or title in the UK.

We’ll just pretend there is. We all know what is meant and the media also refer to “Police Chiefs” so no big deal. "

We will not. I demand accuracy on Tom's threads... oh, right.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"The abuse may not specially be racist but she defo gets alot more negative press than other people who also make mistakes

She's a phenomenal politician and has a commendable record of public service.

A tory MP could leave a briefcase full of top secret files on a train, but Ms. Abbott would be slated more for getting some figures wrong on a radio show.

Not sure she is on anyone's lips..

She is in her twighlight years as a politician and God bless her.. great service and let her live a long and happy life "

You're not sure she's on anyone's lips?

Yet she's been brought out of the blue in this very discussion?

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By *ssex_tom OP Man over a year ago

Chelmsford

"Is there any chance that we could stop calling him the Chief of Police? There is no such rank or title in the UK.

We’ll just pretend there is. We all know what is meant and the media also refer to “Police Chiefs” so no big deal.

We will not. I demand accuracy on Tom's threads... oh, right. "

Demand away. Tom is not the sharpest. Should he send his posts for approval before posting.. ?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Is there any chance that we could stop calling him the Chief of Police? There is no such rank or title in the UK.

We’ll just pretend there is. We all know what is meant and the media also refer to “Police Chiefs” so no big deal.

We will not. I demand accuracy on Tom's threads... oh, right.

Demand away. Tom is not the sharpest. Should he send his posts for approval before posting.. ?"

That would be marvellous, thanks

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"The abuse may not specially be racist but she defo gets alot more negative press than other people who also make mistakes

She's a phenomenal politician and has a commendable record of public service.

A tory MP could leave a briefcase full of top secret files on a train, but Ms. Abbott would be slated more for getting some figures wrong on a radio show.

Not sure she is on anyone's lips..

She is in her twighlight years as a politician and God bless her.. great service and let her live a long and happy life

You're not sure she's on anyone's lips?

Yet she's been brought out of the blue in this very discussion? "

Out of the blue. Very droll.

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By *ssex_tom OP Man over a year ago

Chelmsford

"Is there any chance that we could stop calling him the Chief of Police? There is no such rank or title in the UK.

We’ll just pretend there is. We all know what is meant and the media also refer to “Police Chiefs” so no big deal.

We will not. I demand accuracy on Tom's threads... oh, right.

Demand away. Tom is not the sharpest. Should he send his posts for approval before posting.. ?

That would be marvellous, thanks

But to whom does be send them?

We have moderators

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"The abuse may not specially be racist but she defo gets alot more negative press than other people who also make mistakes

She's a phenomenal politician and has a commendable record of public service.

A tory MP could leave a briefcase full of top secret files on a train, but Ms. Abbott would be slated more for getting some figures wrong on a radio show.

Not sure she is on anyone's lips..

She is in her twighlight years as a politician and God bless her.. great service and let her live a long and happy life

You're not sure she's on anyone's lips?

Yet she's been brought out of the blue in this very discussion?

Out of the blue. Very droll. "

Yes out of the blue

It would of made sense for either the current MP or Cressida Dick to be the first person to be mentioned on this topic

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By *ssex_tom OP Man over a year ago

Chelmsford

"The abuse may not specially be racist but she defo gets alot more negative press than other people who also make mistakes

She's a phenomenal politician and has a commendable record of public service.

A tory MP could leave a briefcase full of top secret files on a train, but Ms. Abbott would be slated more for getting some figures wrong on a radio show.

Not sure she is on anyone's lips..

She is in her twighlight years as a politician and God bless her.. great service and let her live a long and happy life

You're not sure she's on anyone's lips?

Yet she's been brought out of the blue in this very discussion?

Out of the blue. Very droll.

Yes out of the blue

It would of made sense for either the current MP or Cressida Dick to be the first person to be mentioned on this topic"

The first person mentioned was the Chief of Police

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By *eavenNhellCouple over a year ago

carrbrook stalybridge

"Where’s Dianne Abbott when you need here ?

still trying to work out how to fund new officers with £20

--You will find this impossibly woke (and fwiw I'm not at all) but I genuinely found and still find that whole joke racist.- why because she’s rubbish at maths "
and patel isnt any better but I dont see the cheap lazy jokes and memes about her

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"The abuse may not specially be racist but she defo gets alot more negative press than other people who also make mistakes

She's a phenomenal politician and has a commendable record of public service.

A tory MP could leave a briefcase full of top secret files on a train, but Ms. Abbott would be slated more for getting some figures wrong on a radio show.

Not sure she is on anyone's lips..

She is in her twighlight years as a politician and God bless her.. great service and let her live a long and happy life

You're not sure she's on anyone's lips?

Yet she's been brought out of the blue in this very discussion?

Out of the blue. Very droll.

Yes out of the blue

It would of made sense for either the current MP or Cressida Dick to be the first person to be mentioned on this topic

The first person mentioned was the Chief of Police "

Right you are

Second person then

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By *rDiscretionXXXMan over a year ago

Gilfach

"Out of the blue. Very droll. "

Don't worry, I got it.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Out of the blue. Very droll.

Don't worry, I got it.

glad someone did

Making jokes about colour in this day and age! Not very PC is it!

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Out of the blue. Very droll.

Don't worry, I got it.

glad someone did

Making jokes about colour in this day and age! Not very PC is it! "

Oh you're hilarious

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By *penbicoupleCouple over a year ago

Northampton

"Where’s Dianne Abbott when you need here ?

still trying to work out how to fund new officers with £20

--You will find this impossibly woke (and fwiw I'm not at all) but I genuinely found and still find that whole joke racist.- why because she’s rubbish at maths and patel isnt any better but I dont see the cheap lazy jokes and memes about her "

Patel is a downright nasty person. Doesn't compare to Abbott.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Where’s Dianne Abbott when you need here ?

still trying to work out how to fund new officers with £20

Patel is a downright nasty person. Doesn't compare to Abbott."

Whilst she may not be the most competent mathematically (DA is certainly no mug having been to Cambridge!) might it be that PP gets an easier ride despite being at least equal in terms of gaffes because she is considered attractive by some?

Whilst maybe not the sharpest politician to have ever graced the corridors of power DA always came across as compassionate and caring on that BBC politics show with Portillo. Think she shot herself in the foot as a leftie trying to defend sending her kids to private school.

But can’t blame her for trying her best for her family. She should have just said so. She certainly does not deserve any of the abuse she receives. Mocking yes. All are fair game for that where there are gaffes. But any abuse should not be accepted or tolerated.

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By *ersiantugMan over a year ago

Cardiff

"Where’s Dianne Abbott when you need here ?

still trying to work out how to fund new officers with £20

Patel is a downright nasty person. Doesn't compare to Abbott.

----Few genuine lefties would think badly of a *black* *politician* who made it through state school deciding to send her kids to a private school, esp one who gets so much abuse!! Can you imagine what she felt her kids might go through? And of course she knows her own kids.

NO. It is Right Wing racists who keep going on about how hypocritical it was, and how it was just another 'gaffe' for this terrible politician! There will be white equivalents in the Labour party without any question (even left-wing labour MP), but the racists just aren't interested in them.

Abbott has always been particularly straight talking, and as someone who's followed politics all his life it hasn't always sat well with me. She often shrugs things off like the tough woman she is (she has stopped physical fights between men in her time), when it would be better to spend time spinning them a little. But I accept what she is about. And she's a politician, which means she's not perfect. As politicians go she's simply one of the best. She does a huge amount of work that most people don't see too. Or they just don't care about, which is frankly more to the point. ----

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By *eisty LadyWoman over a year ago

Count Your Blessings Cottage, Gratitude Grove

Sadly too many are egotistical twats who think because they wear a uniform they’re something special - erm no!

If they spent less time chatting up witnesses, colleagues and CPS staff they may actually get some work done

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By *penbicoupleCouple over a year ago

Northampton

100% spot on.

I don't think someone even needs to be left-wing to recognise her enormous contribution and service.

"As politicians go she's simply one of the best. She does a huge amount of work that most people don't see too. Or they just don't care about, which is frankly more to the point. ----"

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Bad Apples is the name of my new band.

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By *penbicoupleCouple over a year ago

Northampton

"Bad Apples is the name of my new band."

OMG! How is this not already a band?!

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By *alandNitaCouple over a year ago

Scunthorpe

It's not "the police" that need fixing, it's society in general. Police officers are just people who do policing as a job, it is the person who has the wrong attitude and not the uniform.

Cal

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

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By *irthandgirthMan over a year ago

Camberley occasionally doncaster

"The Chief of Police has said that the problem is not just a few bad apples..

Absolutely not. Not everyone is suited to it. Not everyone has the psychological profile or fortitude to deal with what the police have to on a regular basis. Additionally training for the police can take up to 3 years depending on previous experience/qualifications.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Where’s Dianne Abbott when you need here ?

What's Dianne Abbott got to do with this?"

You and I both know. Racism is always on time. Never misses an opportunity to turn up.

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By *unkym34Man over a year ago

London

"The Chief of Police has said that the problem is not just a few bad apples..

Tom's solution. Policing should be like National Service. Everyone should have to serve at least two years in the Police by the time they are 25 years old apart from those with serious criminal convictions. It will bring a lot of understanding from the public and those that want to stay on could apply. Would it work.. ?"
national service up to 20 for anyone not in higher education might be the answer teach a few more disciplines and life skills. I’d also not slow anyone under the age of 20 to have children and people on benefits should not be allowed to own Pets

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By *razytimesinloveCouple over a year ago

SW Scotland

Massively disagree with conscription for the police. Could you imagine how much more corruption you’d have ?

I’ve not had many incidents with “bad” police. Had a few arguments when I was younger that definitely didn’t help to sort the situation I was in.

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By *ittle_brat_evie!!Woman over a year ago

evesham

"The Chief of Police has said that the problem is not just a few bad apples..

Tom's solution. Policing should be like National Service. Everyone should have to serve at least two years in the Police by the time they are 25 years old apart from those with serious criminal convictions. It will bring a lot of understanding from the public and those that want to stay on could apply. Would it work.. ?national service up to 20 for anyone not in higher education might be the answer teach a few more disciplines and life skills. I’d also not slow anyone under the age of 20 to have children and people on benefits should not be allowed to own Pets "

Wow

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By *ictoria_1976TV/TS over a year ago

Launceston

"national service up to 20 for anyone not in higher education might be the answer teach a few more disciplines and life skills. I’d also not slow anyone under the age of 20 to have children and people on benefits should not be allowed to own Pets "

You should be running the country - we'll need a new PM soon!

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By *ssex_tom OP Man over a year ago

Chelmsford

"Where’s Dianne Abbott when you need here ?

still trying to work out how to fund new officers with £20

Patel is a downright nasty person. Doesn't compare to Abbott.

Right Wing Racists..? Are there not left wing racists too...

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"It's not "the police" that need fixing, it's society in general. Police officers are just people who do policing as a job, it is the person who has the wrong attitude and not the uniform.

Cal"

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Great idea in theory Tom but I don’t think it would solve the problem

The police force needs to get its face into every school and teach kids what it means abide by the law

Can't the teachers do that ?"

Can’t parents do that? It’s not a teachers job to make a child a decent person. All starts at home.

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By *hristopherd999Man over a year ago

Brentwood

"Great idea in theory Tom but I don’t think it would solve the problem

The police force needs to get its face into every school and teach kids what it means abide by the law

Can't the teachers do that ?

Can’t parents do that? It’s not a teachers job to make a child a decent person. All starts at home."

100%

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Great idea in theory Tom but I don’t think it would solve the problem

The police force needs to get its face into every school and teach kids what it means abide by the law"

Police presence in schools

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

NWA said it best.

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By *pursChick aka ShortieWoman over a year ago

On a mooch

"Great idea in theory Tom but I don’t think it would solve the problem

The police force needs to get its face into every school and teach kids what it means abide by the law

Police presence in schools

It happens here once a term. It is more around knife crime, gangs, drugs etc how to not get dragged into it, what to be aware of.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"NWA said it best."

*chef’s kiss*

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By *annaBeStrongMan over a year ago

wokingham

"Great idea in theory Tom but I don’t think it would solve the problem

The police force needs to get its face into every school and teach kids what it means abide by the law

Can't the teachers do that ?

Can’t parents do that? It’s not a teachers job to make a child a decent person. All starts at home."

They can, but by law you can’t force parents to teach anything. You can force the education system to include topics though

Most people aren’t fit to be parents, so adding stuff like that into school is very effective

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Great idea in theory Tom but I don’t think it would solve the problem

The police force needs to get its face into every school and teach kids what it means abide by the law

Police presence in schools

It happens here once a term. It is more around knife crime, gangs, drugs etc how to not get dragged into it, what to be aware of.

Yeah I know. I used to work in a school.

They also have officers assigned to lots of schools in my local area.

Anyway this reminds me of a gorgeous poem by Caleb Femi called Thirteen. If you fancy, you should read it.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"NWA said it best.

*chef’s kiss* "

At 16 I was arrested for assault and forced to do an identity parade, they came with a warrant, forced their way into my house, pushed my mother out the way and dragged me into a van. The description of the criminal was a 6’ Caucasian male. I’m mixed race and only 5’6”. They’re literally thugs in uniform.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Great idea in theory Tom but I don’t think it would solve the problem

The police force needs to get its face into every school and teach kids what it means abide by the law

Can't the teachers do that ?

Can’t parents do that? It’s not a teachers job to make a child a decent person. All starts at home.

They can, but by law you can’t force parents to teach anything. You can force the education system to include topics though

Most people aren’t fit to be parents, so adding stuff like that into school is very effective "

Most People? That’s some sweeping statement. Do you but your brushes from the same place as ET?

Might agree with “many” but the majority I would say do the best they can and a reasonable job.

Maybe a license should be put in place? Would that be too control freak left wing nanny state?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"NWA said it best.

*chef’s kiss*

I’m sorry man. That’s really awful and definitely an experience nobody should have.

I’ve not had anything as traumatic as that - just being stopped because ‘there’s drug deals in the area and I fit the description’.

Description- IC3.

But of course we all have to love them.

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By *annaBeStrongMan over a year ago

wokingham

"Great idea in theory Tom but I don’t think it would solve the problem

The police force needs to get its face into every school and teach kids what it means abide by the law

Can't the teachers do that ?

Can’t parents do that? It’s not a teachers job to make a child a decent person. All starts at home.

They can, but by law you can’t force parents to teach anything. You can force the education system to include topics though

Most people aren’t fit to be parents, so adding stuff like that into school is very effective

Most People? That’s some sweeping statement. Do you but your brushes from the same place as ET?

Might agree with “many” but the majority I would say do the best they can and a reasonable job.

Maybe a license should be put in place? Would that be too control freak left wing nanny state? "

I’d say the state/education system covers a lot of parenting roles and without it the true inadequacy of most peoples parents skills would truly show

But whether it’s most, some or none, I think adding that kibda stuff into the education system is a great step because, as I said, you can’t force parents to do much these days so the only other option is doing it through school

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By *pursChick aka ShortieWoman over a year ago

On a mooch

"Great idea in theory Tom but I don’t think it would solve the problem

The police force needs to get its face into every school and teach kids what it means abide by the law

Police presence in schools

It happens here once a term. It is more around knife crime, gangs, drugs etc how to not get dragged into it, what to be aware of.

Yeah I know. I used to work in a school.

They also have officers assigned to lots of schools in my local area.

Anyway this reminds me of a gorgeous poem by Caleb Femi called Thirteen. If you fancy, you should read it. "

I know that poem, one of the ones used for discussion in school, around different experiences because of your race.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Tom, For those young people (sometimes *children*) that have had negative experiences with the police, why should they have to work for the police? And why should people be forced to experience racism, misogyny, homophobia etc in on the scale that officers often report, in their place of work, by force?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"NWA said it best.

*chef’s kiss*

I’m sorry man. That’s really awful and definitely an experience nobody should have.

I’ve not had anything as traumatic as that - just being stopped because ‘there’s drug deals in the area and I fit the description’.

Description- IC3.

But of course we all have to love them. "

My house was burgled once and they basically interrogated me for it. I was no angel growing up but I wasn’t exactly a hardened criminal. Just a rebellious teen. I guess like you said, I just matched the description of what they think a criminal looks like.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Great idea in theory Tom but I don’t think it would solve the problem

The police force needs to get its face into every school and teach kids what it means abide by the law

Police presence in schools

It happens here once a term. It is more around knife crime, gangs, drugs etc how to not get dragged into it, what to be aware of.

Yeah I know. I used to work in a school.

They also have officers assigned to lots of schools in my local area.

Anyway this reminds me of a gorgeous poem by Caleb Femi called Thirteen. If you fancy, you should read it.

I know that poem, one of the ones used for discussion in school, around different experiences because of your race. "

Relatable.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Did Cressida have mismatching shoes tho ?

-I imagine that was Abbots diabetes, I've been a carer and it's not an uncommon thing to do. Abbot wouldn't care. Really - do you?--

Well the voters may care..."

The voters in her constituency don't seem to - she's been returned to her seat in each election since 1987 (with 70% of the vote in 2019).

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By *rhugesMan over a year ago

Cardiff

Terrible idea, there are sooo many idiots out there .Can you imagine the chaos?!

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By *ou only live onceMan over a year ago

London

"Great idea in theory Tom but I don’t think it would solve the problem

The police force needs to get its face into every school and teach kids what it means abide by the law

Police presence in schools

It happens here once a term. It is more around knife crime, gangs, drugs etc how to not get dragged into it, what to be aware of.

Yeah I know. I used to work in a school.

They also have officers assigned to lots of schools in my local area.

Anyway this reminds me of a gorgeous poem by Caleb Femi called Thirteen. If you fancy, you should read it. "

I didn't know that poem, but it's beautiful.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"NWA said it best.

*chef’s kiss*

I’m sorry man. That’s really awful and definitely an experience nobody should have.

I’ve not had anything as traumatic as that - just being stopped because ‘there’s drug deals in the area and I fit the description’.

Description- IC3.

But of course we all have to love them.

It’s awful that you and others experience this shit. Solidarity bro. You’re a fabulous person. More than what they expect you to be.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Great idea in theory Tom but I don’t think it would solve the problem

The police force needs to get its face into every school and teach kids what it means abide by the law

Police presence in schools

It happens here once a term. It is more around knife crime, gangs, drugs etc how to not get dragged into it, what to be aware of.

Yeah I know. I used to work in a school.

They also have officers assigned to lots of schools in my local area.

Anyway this reminds me of a gorgeous poem by Caleb Femi called Thirteen. If you fancy, you should read it.

I didn't know that poem, but it's beautiful."

Isn’t it? And the whole collection in the book, Poor, is beautiful. I particularly loved Schrödinger’s Black. That spoke to me. But literally all of it was/ is gorgeous.

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By *ophieslutTV/TS over a year ago

Central

No, an unworkable idea that would make things worse. Have people with the right values and training serving. And effectively supervised. If you are going to force public service, have people doing some of the many other things that can be improved in society. Better for people to be able to work and be employed doing what they really want to do.

If the police needs fixing, do this, rather than dilute them with more ineffective people, including bad apples.

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By *ersiantugMan over a year ago

Cardiff

"Right Wing Racists..? Are there not left wing racists too..."

----The Unthinking Conservative™ way to argue: Scan for a potentially 'woke' meaning or term, singly pick it out and petulantly protest that Oh the opposite is not true then??! It's like watching an entire species dying around you.

There is no greater indication of lack of intelligence than the constant assumption of it in others.----

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By *assie101Woman over a year ago

Kent

"Great idea in theory Tom but I don’t think it would solve the problem

The police force needs to get its face into every school and teach kids what it means abide by the law

Can't the teachers do that ?

Yes because they don't do anything else during their day clearly.

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By *irthandgirthMan over a year ago

Camberley occasionally doncaster

"Great idea in theory Tom but I don’t think it would solve the problem

The police force needs to get its face into every school and teach kids what it means abide by the law

Can't the teachers do that ?

Can’t parents do that? It’s not a teachers job to make a child a decent person. All starts at home.

100%"

For a long time there has been an erosion of consequences for one's actions being taught, both at home and in schools.

Not condoning violence or smacking, but if there are no negative consequences to poor behaviour it doesn't instill any moral courage or self discipline in up and coming generations. There seems to be no feeling among many that respect needs to be earned.

Fuck I sound like an old bugger.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"The Chief of Police has said that the problem is not just a few bad apples..

This is how I feel about pubs and bars. Nobody is allowed to drink until they worked behind one for a year.

The police force should probably vet who is allowed to put the uniform on as opposed to giving everyone a go in my opinion.

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By *host63Man over a year ago

Bedfont Feltham

Woukd not work

Corruption woukd increase and the police force woukd be full of unmotivated coppers.

You want to fix the police, recruitment needs to be better and monitoring also needs to be more rigorous and red flags raised more.

Also the culture of silence needs to be changed so that its not frowned upon to report bad apples at any level.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Dreadful idea. Sorry, but back to the drawing board.

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By *hristopherd999Man over a year ago

Brentwood

"The Chief of Police has said that the problem is not just a few bad apples..

Tom's solution. Policing should be like National Service. Everyone should have to serve at least two years in the Police by the time they are 25 years old apart from those with serious criminal convictions. It will bring a lot of understanding from the public and those that want to stay on could apply. Would it work.. ?national service up to 20 for anyone not in higher education might be the answer teach a few more disciplines and life skills. I’d also not slow anyone under the age of 20 to have children and people on benefits should not be allowed to own Pets "

Or Sky tv

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"national service up to 20 for anyone not in higher education might be the answer teach a few more disciplines and life skills. I’d also not allow anyone under the age of 20 to have children and people on benefits should not be allowed to own Pets "

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By *unkym34Man over a year ago

London

People on benefits get lonely too. Having a dog or cat can make life livable. Some pleasures are necessities too. Stop punching down. The people above you are draining all the resources not the ones below."
I’m not saying they don’t but many are saying they can’t afford to pay rent, bills or feed and cloth their children and yet many go out and get pets which the effectively expect others to pay for. Often they are not kept well. We have created a society of everyone expects everything and a lot expect it for free. Stoping people having children so early, forcing people into later education or a form of service will alter a lot of peoples ways of thinking, their general out look on life and would ultimately create a bit more respect.

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By *penbicoupleCouple over a year ago

Northampton