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Why can't narcissist's let go?
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"Insecurity or control ? " Probably both, but why don't they get it when it's over and past the point of anything coming from it. Most normal people know when that point comes and leave it. Why doesn't a narcissist? | |||
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"You move on then come realise they haven't, but why do they not move on? What is it in their nature that stops them? " Maybe it is because they have developed feeling for the person who has moved on and therefore needs more time to move on themselves. I don't think what you are describing is narcissistic behaviour, more just human. | |||
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"Isn’t the definition of a narcissist someone who has no empathy for others ? The Mythical Narcissus fell in love with his own reflection. " That is correct. | |||
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"Isn’t the definition of a narcissist someone who has no empathy for others ? The Mythical Narcissus fell in love with his own reflection. " But a narcissist will be convinced of what they think the other person feels so much so that empathy has no part at all. | |||
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"It's a control thing, my ex still mentions us rekindling in the future even though he was dating someone else, how he misses what we had etc etc (hell will freeze over before that will happen)" I feel you on this! To the letter | |||
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"Isn’t the definition of a narcissist someone who has no empathy for others ? The Mythical Narcissus fell in love with his own reflection. But a narcissist will be convinced of what they think the other person feels so much so that empathy has no part at all. " Because they assume others must feel what they feel, as they cannot see the world from any viewpoint than their own. That is lack of empathy, no ? | |||
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"They do move so easy i know from experience they drop u like a stone move on the damage they do is 2 hurt u with no thoughts 4 ur feelings ...ad my heart shattered in oct and came so close 2 ending my life x " Oh shit I'm sorry dude , that's awful  As I say to everyone on here , I'm always available to chat . Chin up  | |||
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"A true narcissist will move on only once they have another victim to move to and that you are no longer of any value to them as they have got from you everything they see as value out of you. You can see them isolating their victim from others yet they refuse to see it and fall for their charm, there is almost nothing you can do to help them once they're under the narcissists control. If you find one, run like fuck as they destroy you piece by piece." This. Every single word of this. Sighs* | |||
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"Maybe it is because they have developed feeling for the person who has moved on and therefore needs more time to move on themselves. I don't think what you are describing is narcissistic behaviour, more just human." An inability to move forward is not by itself narcotic behaviour. When a relationship ends, whatever that relationship was, it can often be difficult for one side to move on. If both parties mutually agree on ending things, and each are equally understanding of in an acceptance of the reasons why, then ends can happen with reduced trauma. But in my experience, the equality in ending a relationship isn't usual. In a previous life on fab, I met someone and felt she was the one. If I'm honest with myself, I still do, in as much as nobody ever made me feel the way she did. But, she ended it. To this day, I don't fully understand the reasons why, and if I did it would make accepting the ending easier than it is. I accept her decision, but I don't fully understand it. Does that make me a narcissist? I hope not, as it's an incurable condition. | |||
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"A true narcissist will move on only once they have another victim to move to and that you are no longer of any value to them as they have got from you everything they see as value out of you. You can see them isolating their victim from others yet they refuse to see it and fall for their charm, there is almost nothing you can do to help them once they're under the narcissists control. If you find one, run like fuck as they destroy you piece by piece." 100percent right hit nail on the head .she ad new fella lined up x | |||
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" ...ad my heart shattered in oct and came so close 2 ending my life x " We walk the same road my friend. Been there, and it took me closer to suicide than I ever imagined I could get, and I consider myself fortunate that I was able to stop the clock at a minute to midnight. Suicide ins't just the end of a life, but the end of hope. | |||
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"Vulnerable narcissism reflects a defensive and fragile grandiosity, which functions mainly as a cover for feelings of inadequacy. Vulnerable narcissism characterized by hypersensitivity, defensiveness, and withdrawal and is strongly associated with BPD, which is characterized by the fear of abandonment, interpersonal and affective instability, impulsivity, chronic feelings of emptiness, suicidal ideation, and self-mutilation." I'd never heard of this type of narcissism. I must do more research on it. Helpful info, thank you. | |||
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"Isn’t the definition of a narcissist someone who has no empathy for others ? The Mythical Narcissus fell in love with his own reflection. But a narcissist will be convinced of what they think the other person feels so much so that empathy has no part at all. Because they assume others must feel what they feel, as they cannot see the world from any viewpoint than their own. That is lack of empathy, no ?" To us maybe. But the narcissist believes they have empathy as they believe they see what the other person feels but unknowingly have it completely wrong? | |||
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  ... toxic | |||
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"A true narcissist will move on only once they have another victim to move to and that you are no longer of any value to them as they have got from you everything they see as value out of you. You can see them isolating their victim from others yet they refuse to see it and fall for their charm, there is almost nothing you can do to help them once they're under the narcissists control. If you find one, run like fuck as they destroy you piece by piece." Cannot give this answer enough credit. Mine was cheating on me with his next victim but wouldn't finish things with me because he was trying to convince me to kill myself. He wanted the house and that was the last thing he could take from me and didn't want the blood on his own hands. | |||
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"Maybe it is because they have developed feeling for the person who has moved on and therefore needs more time to move on themselves. I don't think what you are describing is narcissistic behaviour, more just human. An inability to move forward is not by itself narcotic behaviour. When a relationship ends, whatever that relationship was, it can often be difficult for one side to move on. If both parties mutually agree on ending things, and each are equally understanding of in an acceptance of the reasons why, then ends can happen with reduced trauma. But in my experience, the equality in ending a relationship isn't usual. In a previous life on fab, I met someone and felt she was the one. If I'm honest with myself, I still do, in as much as nobody ever made me feel the way she did. But, she ended it. To this day, I don't fully understand the reasons why, and if I did it would make accepting the ending easier than it is. I accept her decision, but I don't fully understand it. Does that make me a narcissist? I hope not, as it's an incurable condition." I wouldn't say that at all. I've been in a similar position and she ended it. I'll never fully understand why.. that's nothing to do with narcissistism its a part of being human. | |||
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"A true narcissist will move on only once they have another victim to move to and that you are no longer of any value to them as they have got from you everything they see as value out of you. You can see them isolating their victim from others yet they refuse to see it and fall for their charm, there is almost nothing you can do to help them once they're under the narcissists control. If you find one, run like fuck as they destroy you piece by piece." If they have another victim then why would they try and rekindle the previous one? I know it happens. | |||
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"To us maybe. But the narcissist believes they have empathy as they believe they see what the other person feels but unknowingly have it completely wrong? " To a narcissist, they are the exception to every rule, so the rules don't apply to them. | |||
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"Isn’t the definition of a narcissist someone who has no empathy for others ? The Mythical Narcissus fell in love with his own reflection. But a narcissist will be convinced of what they think the other person feels so much so that empathy has no part at all. Because they assume others must feel what they feel, as they cannot see the world from any viewpoint than their own. That is lack of empathy, no ? To us maybe. But the narcissist believes they have empathy as they believe they see what the other person feels but unknowingly have it completely wrong? " I understand now and yes, I am sure that is right. | |||
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"Vulnerable narcissism reflects a defensive and fragile grandiosity, which functions mainly as a cover for feelings of inadequacy. Vulnerable narcissism characterized by hypersensitivity, defensiveness, and withdrawal and is strongly associated with BPD, which is characterized by the fear of abandonment, interpersonal and affective instability, impulsivity, chronic feelings of emptiness, suicidal ideation, and self-mutilation. I'd never heard of this type of narcissism. I must do more research on it. Helpful info, thank you." Reading between the lines it translates as “their problems are the only thing that matters” - lack of empathy in any human being is a terrifying trait in my book, the inability to step outside yourself and see things from a different perspective, to be able to put things in perspective. To listen and learn, read and understand. In a way I think modern times promote this. “Look at what I have been doing/saying it’s important” (insta, FB, Twit etc) And the way we communicate via text, you don’t see someone flinch when you text, cruel words are not restrained because we do not react to body language, empathy is lost. | |||
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"Numerous studies (Miller & Campbell, 2008; Russ, Shedler, Bradley, & Westen, 2008; Wink, 1991) have demonstrated that narcissism has two or more variants, grandiose narcissism and vulnerable narcissism. The grandiose variant, which is usually measured using the NPI is strongly linked to the DSM-IV conceptualization and is the variant associated with NPD, a Cluster B personality disorder which reflect traits related to self-importance, entitlement, aggression, and dominance. Vulnerable narcissism reflects a defensive and fragile grandiosity, which functions mainly as a cover for feelings of inadequacy. Vulnerable narcissism characterized by hypersensitivity, defensiveness, and withdrawal and is strongly associated with BPD, which is characterized by the fear of abandonment, interpersonal and affective instability, impulsivity, chronic feelings of emptiness, suicidal ideation, and self-mutilation. Pathological narcissism is when both grandiose and vulnerable narcissism is concurrent, which is linked to poor self-esteem, lack of empathy, feelings of shame, interpersonal distress, aggression, and significant impairments in personality functioning across both clinical and non-clinical samples. Pathological narcissism, as measured by the Pathological Narcissism Inventory (PNI), is embedded within the personality disorders organized at the borderline level, which include antisocial, borderline, narcissistic personality disorders. PNI scales exhibited significant associations with parasuicidal behavior, suicide attempts, homicidal ideation, and several aspects of psychotherapy utilization.[9] Despite the phenomenological and empirical distinction between vulnerable and grandiose narcissism, there is experimental evidence from studies that have employed direct or indirect ego-threat to suggest that grandiose narcissists have also a fragile, vulnerable core" Brilliant comment. The pathological fits so well. Especially the last part. | |||
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"A true narcissist will move on only once they have another victim to move to and that you are no longer of any value to them as they have got from you everything they see as value out of you. You can see them isolating their victim from others yet they refuse to see it and fall for their charm, there is almost nothing you can do to help them once they're under the narcissists control. If you find one, run like fuck as they destroy you piece by piece. If they have another victim then why would they try and rekindle the previous one? I know it happens. " Spot on that .. | |||
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"A true narcissist will move on only once they have another victim to move to and that you are no longer of any value to them as they have got from you everything they see as value out of you. You can see them isolating their victim from others yet they refuse to see it and fall for their charm, there is almost nothing you can do to help them once they're under the narcissists control. If you find one, run like fuck as they destroy you piece by piece. If they have another victim then why would they try and rekindle the previous one? I know it happens. " Because the new victim isn't quite playing ball they way they want them to. A little too much work to do, they're not quite vulnerable enough. | |||
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"Just think it's people in general ... true narcissists are very rare! " Lucky me then  | |||
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"A true narcissist will move on only once they have another victim to move to and that you are no longer of any value to them as they have got from you everything they see as value out of you. You can see them isolating their victim from others yet they refuse to see it and fall for their charm, there is almost nothing you can do to help them once they're under the narcissists control. If you find one, run like fuck as they destroy you piece by piece. If they have another victim then why would they try and rekindle the previous one? I know it happens. Because the new victim isn't quite playing ball they way they want them to. A little too much work to do, they're not quite vulnerable enough. " I think this more likely the answer to my question. | |||
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"They do move so easy i know from experience they drop u like a stone move on the damage they do is 2 hurt u with no thoughts 4 ur feelings ...ad my heart shattered in oct and came so close 2 ending my life x " Sorry to read this. That's awful. My inbox is open if you want to chat anytime. | |||
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"You move on then come realise they haven't, but why do they not move on? What is it in their nature that stops them? " Not all narcissistic people display this nature. And from a psychological / research point of view, some narcissists develop those traits from an insecurity level based upon their own experiences of poor relationship outcomes or attachment challenges. The main thing is for anyone, to move on and have positive reflections upon an ending of relationships, of all kinds, not just intimate / long term. To go back to your question though, I would say that they struggle to regulate themselves in a healthy manner. People will attempt to develop ultra secure communication and boundaries, which can often help avoid that style of relationship. Whereas I think many narcissistic people can have difficulty through emotional insecurities, so things like not letting go, or viewing things through their own lens is common for that level / type of mindset. The lack of accountability from a ‘outside perspective’ is common within that emotional dimension. | |||
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"They do move so easy i know from experience they drop u like a stone move on the damage they do is 2 hurt u with no thoughts 4 ur feelings ...ad my heart shattered in oct and came so close 2 ending my life x " I'm glad you're with us
I agree with that definition of narcissism when they are the one initiating the "break up" . I do think that when it is imposed upon them ... their reaction is the opposite , after all how could you possibly reject them when they are the best thing since sliced bread and they then make it their objective to show you the errors of your way and
Teach you to know better | |||
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"A true narcissist will move on only once they have another victim to move to and that you are no longer of any value to them as they have got from you everything they see as value out of you. You can see them isolating their victim from others yet they refuse to see it and fall for their charm, there is almost nothing you can do to help them once they're under the narcissists control. If you find one, run like fuck as they destroy you piece by piece. If they have another victim then why would they try and rekindle the previous one? I know it happens. " They sometimes see that you've picked yourself up again and once again have value to them and see you as an easier target as they already broke you once and they try to get back in again before you are back to full strength when you ate able to resist them. I changed my job I had been at for 25years, moved to a completely different place and cut all ties with anyone she may be able to probe to find out where I had gone to. It worked. | |||
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"A true narcissist will move on only once they have another victim to move to and that you are no longer of any value to them as they have got from you everything they see as value out of you. You can see them isolating their victim from others yet they refuse to see it and fall for their charm, there is almost nothing you can do to help them once they're under the narcissists control. If you find one, run like fuck as they destroy you piece by piece." This 100%!! Main reason I'm scared to actually get into a relationship again, he's damaged a part of me irreparably and I don't think I'll ever recover from it | |||
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"Maybe it is because they have developed feeling for the person who has moved on and therefore needs more time to move on themselves. I don't think what you are describing is narcissistic behaviour, more just human. An inability to move forward is not by itself narcotic behaviour. When a relationship ends, whatever that relationship was, it can often be difficult for one side to move on. If both parties mutually agree on ending things, and each are equally understanding of in an acceptance of the reasons why, then ends can happen with reduced trauma. But in my experience, the equality in ending a relationship isn't usual. In a previous life on fab, I met someone and felt she was the one. If I'm honest with myself, I still do, in as much as nobody ever made me feel the way she did. But, she ended it. To this day, I don't fully understand the reasons why, and if I did it would make accepting the ending easier than it is. I accept her decision, but I don't fully understand it. Does that make me a narcissist? I hope not, as it's an incurable condition." I say in my reply that what I have described is not narcissistic behaviour, I did not say you were a narcissist. It is the OP who is saying it's narcissistic behaviour not me. | |||
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"I can't answer your question, as I don't think I've had the misfortune to be involved with a narcissist. It seems highly prevalent on here though " I think alot of people on here are under the impression that narcissists love themselves " she wont sleep with me, she is up her own arse" kinda thing True narcissism is often borne out of a deep loathing of themselves. They sort of ' reinvent' themselves to avoid confronting the ugly bits I know to my cost | |||
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"You move on then come realise they haven't, but why do they not move on? What is it in their nature that stops them? " They aren't done with you. The torture, the manipulation and mind games. They have their ways and means of getting to you without being in actual contact, ways of letting you know they are still around, waiting, watching. Not giving up because in the end they think they can break you down enough that the only thing that will make sense to you is to go back to them and then they've truly won. | |||
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"A true narcissist will move on only once they have another victim to move to and that you are no longer of any value to them as they have got from you everything they see as value out of you. You can see them isolating their victim from others yet they refuse to see it and fall for their charm, there is almost nothing you can do to help them once they're under the narcissists control. If you find one, run like fuck as they destroy you piece by piece. This 100%!! Main reason I'm scared to actually get into a relationship again, he's damaged a part of me irreparably and I don't think I'll ever recover from it "And it god damn frustrates me as it's that one last hold he still has and will play to whenever his life is not going his way | |||
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"I can't answer your question, as I don't think I've had the misfortune to be involved with a narcissist. It seems highly prevalent on here though I think alot of people on here are under the impression that narcissists love themselves " she wont sleep with me, she is up her own arse" kinda thing True narcissism is often borne out of a deep loathing of themselves. They sort of ' reinvent' themselves to avoid confronting the ugly bits I know to my cost" These are valid and important points. People often misunderstand narcissism, like gaslighting or what is ‘nice’ behaviour. There are traces / small elements of these traits in the majority of people. Often people throw labels without just resolving their own issues, ironically often not being able to let go of those they feel cannot let go, or the process itself. | |||
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"I can't answer your question, as I don't think I've had the misfortune to be involved with a narcissist. It seems highly prevalent on here though I think alot of people on here are under the impression that narcissists love themselves " she wont sleep with me, she is up her own arse" kinda thing True narcissism is often borne out of a deep loathing of themselves. They sort of ' reinvent' themselves to avoid confronting the ugly bits I know to my cost These are valid and important points. People often misunderstand narcissism, like gaslighting or what is ‘nice’ behaviour. There are traces / small elements of these traits in the majority of people. Often people throw labels without just resolving their own issues, ironically often not being able to let go of those they feel cannot let go, or the process itself. " Indeed Narcissism is hugely misunderstood | |||
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" ...ad my heart shattered in oct and came so close 2 ending my life x We walk the same road my friend. Been there, and it took me closer to suicide than I ever imagined I could get, and I consider myself fortunate that I was able to stop the clock at a minute to midnight. Suicide ins't just the end of a life, but the end of hope." So true my friend | |||
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"A true narcissist will move on only once they have another victim to move to and that you are no longer of any value to them as they have got from you everything they see as value out of you. You can see them isolating their victim from others yet they refuse to see it and fall for their charm, there is almost nothing you can do to help them once they're under the narcissists control. If you find one, run like fuck as they destroy you piece by piece." They do. It's wonderful when one of them is your mother. | |||
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"I can't answer your question, as I don't think I've had the misfortune to be involved with a narcissist. It seems highly prevalent on here though I think alot of people on here are under the impression that narcissists love themselves " she wont sleep with me, she is up her own arse" kinda thing True narcissism is often borne out of a deep loathing of themselves. They sort of ' reinvent' themselves to avoid confronting the ugly bits I know to my cost" I think there's a lot of misinformation flying about around this. People says narcissists are rare which is true for people with actual Narcissistic Personality Disorder but we all have the potential to display narcissistic traits. It's like saying you can't be obsessive or compulsive without actually having OCD. As for the loving themselves thing, it's often a weird contradiction of both a deep self loathing as you say but combined with feelings of entitlement and expectations of special treatment and never being criticised. They can't handle any deviation from treating them as some sort of perfect and divine being. Probably because any small criticism is felt as confirmation of everything negative they've ever thought of themselves I guess. It's weird because most people with insecurities almost expect criticism. I do wonder how you get to the point of believing everybody else should only ever praise you and let you do whatever you want and being immensely angry if they don't. | |||
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"They do move so easy i know from experience they drop u like a stone move on the damage they do is 2 hurt u with no thoughts 4 ur feelings ...ad my heart shattered in oct and came so close 2 ending my life x Sorry to read this. That's awful. My inbox is open if you want to chat anytime. " Thank u x | |||
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"They do move so easy i know from experience they drop u like a stone move on the damage they do is 2 hurt u with no thoughts 4 ur feelings ...ad my heart shattered in oct and came so close 2 ending my life x I'm glad you're with us
I agree with that definition of narcissism when they are the one initiating the "break up" . I do think that when it is imposed upon them ... their reaction is the opposite , after all how could you possibly reject them when they are the best thing since sliced bread and they then make it their objective to show you the errors of your way and
Teach you to know better "Thanks kind words x | |||
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"I can't answer your question, as I don't think I've had the misfortune to be involved with a narcissist. It seems highly prevalent on here though I think alot of people on here are under the impression that narcissists love themselves " she wont sleep with me, she is up her own arse" kinda thing True narcissism is often borne out of a deep loathing of themselves. They sort of ' reinvent' themselves to avoid confronting the ugly bits I know to my cost" I don’t think those two concepts are incompatible. Narcissism may well originate in feelings of insecurity or inadequacy, in fact it’s likely that all major personality flaws are rooted in early childhood experiences of those things. But the expression of narcissism in relation to others does take the form of self love and excessive arrogance and overconfidence. | |||
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"Maybe it is because they have developed feeling for the person who has moved on and therefore needs more time to move on themselves. I don't think what you are describing is narcissistic behaviour, more just human." I agree. I do not view failing to move on as narcissism, nor do I see it as all about “control”. I agree in some instances it is about not wanting to give up, or to loae something they view as theirs, but thats just an abusive relationship. In some instances its about the lack of closure, you may have moved on but they haven’t. Ultimately, block and move on if its on fab. Cut off all contact on social media. You can ask them not to contact you, and if it continues you can go to the police under harassment laws. Or you can do nothing, and feed your own ego by having someone contest for your attention, which sadly some people do. | |||
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"You move on then come realise they haven't, but why do they not move on? What is it in their nature that stops them? " How do you know they’re a narcissist, have they been diagnosed or is it you’re opinion they are?! Im guessing one reason is that they’re not done with you yet, they hate losing their supply of attention, so they don’t let things go easily, but remember if they are finished with you, they will happily drop you like a stone and not think twice about it. So if you’re finishing with a narc, the best course of action is to cut all ties, don’t give them the chance to muscle back in cause they will take any opportunity they can get. | |||
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". I do wonder how you get to the point of believing everybody else should only ever praise you and let you do whatever you want and being immensely angry if they don't. " In the case of my ex, I put it down to being on a pedestal his entire life. You spend your life being told by everything close to you that you can't do anything wrong ever, always having your actions defended and never being called out on them, I suppose you start to believe it. Someone else coming along and calling him out on his behaviour didn't go down well. | |||
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"This 100%!! Main reason I'm scared to actually get into a relationship again, he's damaged a part of me irreparably and I don't think I'll ever recover from it "Unlike a narcissist, you can be fixed. A good counsellor would be able to work with you to resolve the issues damaging you, and enable you to move forward with your life successfully. | |||
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"I can't answer your question, as I don't think I've had the misfortune to be involved with a narcissist. It seems highly prevalent on here though I think alot of people on here are under the impression that narcissists love themselves " she wont sleep with me, she is up her own arse" kinda thing True narcissism is often borne out of a deep loathing of themselves. They sort of ' reinvent' themselves to avoid confronting the ugly bits I know to my cost I think there's a lot of misinformation flying about around this. People says narcissists are rare which is true for people with actual Narcissistic Personality Disorder but we all have the potential to display narcissistic traits. It's like saying you can't be obsessive or compulsive without actually having OCD. As for the loving themselves thing, it's often a weird contradiction of both a deep self loathing as you say but combined with feelings of entitlement and expectations of special treatment and never being criticised. They can't handle any deviation from treating them as some sort of perfect and divine being. Probably because any small criticism is felt as confirmation of everything negative they've ever thought of themselves I guess. It's weird because most people with insecurities almost expect criticism. I do wonder how you get to the point of believing everybody else should only ever praise you and let you do whatever you want and being immensely angry if they don't. " I've told this story lots of times, but its a perfect illustration of narcissism in its purest form. At the time I thought " fuck,thats odd behaviour" but just laughed it off. Years later it all made sense. It really was like the penny dropped My ex husband was making a creme caramel. He was quite a good cook when he put his mind to it. He messed up the recipe, so he didnt have enough sugar. Most people would say " omg I cant believe I did that", and just go to the corner shop and buy more. Not him. As far as he was concerned, Tate and Lyle put the wrong amount of sugar in the packet. There was no possibilty that it was his mistake, see? He is perfect. He doesnt make mistakes. He will argue that black is white. Because if he admits to the smallest of flaws, the game's up. He has to acknowledge that he is fallible And that cant possibly happen. Because his reality is just too terrifying. | |||
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"Maybe it is because they have developed feeling for the person who has moved on and therefore needs more time to move on themselves. I don't think what you are describing is narcissistic behaviour, more just human. I agree. I do not view failing to move on as narcissism, nor do I see it as all about “control”. I agree in some instances it is about not wanting to give up, or to loae something they view as theirs, but thats just an abusive relationship. In some instances its about the lack of closure, you may have moved on but they haven’t. Ultimately, block and move on if its on fab. Cut off all contact on social media. You can ask them not to contact you, and if it continues you can go to the police under harassment laws. Or you can do nothing, and feed your own ego by having someone contest for your attention, which sadly some people do. " Unfortunately going to the police doesn't always help. I did because it didn't matter how much I blocked him, he found new, sneakier ways to contact me. My blocking also removed a lot of the evidence which is why my police report didn't get anywhere. In fact, the advice from the police and the Suzy Lamplugh Trust was not to block for precisely these reasons. | |||
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"Unfortunately going to the police doesn't always help. I did because it didn't matter how much I blocked him, he found new, sneakier ways to contact me. My blocking also removed a lot of the evidence which is why my police report didn't get anywhere. In fact, the advice from the police and the Suzy Lamplugh Trust was not to block for precisely these reasons. " I took out a an injunction to prevent my narcissistic ex-wife contacting or interfering with me or our children. A drastic step, but easily done, and worth it. She now has a criminal record. | |||
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". I do wonder how you get to the point of believing everybody else should only ever praise you and let you do whatever you want and being immensely angry if they don't. In the case of my ex, I put it down to being on a pedestal his entire life. You spend your life being told by everything close to you that you can't do anything wrong ever, always having your actions defended and never being called out on them, I suppose you start to believe it. Someone else coming along and calling him out on his behaviour didn't go down well. " Mine was the opposite. His dad was abusive in ways I can't even begin to imagine. As a result I let a lot of things slide that I shouldn't have. | |||
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"You move on then come realise they haven't, but why do they not move on? What is it in their nature that stops them? How do you know they’re a narcissist, have they been diagnosed or is it you’re opinion they are?! Im guessing one reason is that they’re not done with you yet, they hate losing their supply of attention, so they don’t let things go easily, but remember if they are finished with you, they will happily drop you like a stone and not think twice about it. So if you’re finishing with a narc, the best course of action is to cut all ties, don’t give them the chance to muscle back in cause they will take any opportunity they can get. " Not diagnosed so my opinion and the opinion of friends too. Though one says more a sociapath. I've been mistreated in my lifetime and met some horrid people and not through my own choices. I'd not met anyone like this before. It was truly horrifying to see what someone can be like. I cut all ties. It's months later that they've found ways to get round that. Hence the question why can't they let go. I don't get what the endgame is. | |||
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"I can't answer your question, as I don't think I've had the misfortune to be involved with a narcissist. It seems highly prevalent on here though I think alot of people on here are under the impression that narcissists love themselves " she wont sleep with me, she is up her own arse" kinda thing True narcissism is often borne out of a deep loathing of themselves. They sort of ' reinvent' themselves to avoid confronting the ugly bits I know to my cost I think there's a lot of misinformation flying about around this. People says narcissists are rare which is true for people with actual Narcissistic Personality Disorder but we all have the potential to display narcissistic traits. It's like saying you can't be obsessive or compulsive without actually having OCD. As for the loving themselves thing, it's often a weird contradiction of both a deep self loathing as you say but combined with feelings of entitlement and expectations of special treatment and never being criticised. They can't handle any deviation from treating them as some sort of perfect and divine being. Probably because any small criticism is felt as confirmation of everything negative they've ever thought of themselves I guess. It's weird because most people with insecurities almost expect criticism. I do wonder how you get to the point of believing everybody else should only ever praise you and let you do whatever you want and being immensely angry if they don't. I've told this story lots of times, but its a perfect illustration of narcissism in its purest form. At the time I thought " fuck,thats odd behaviour" but just laughed it off. Years later it all made sense. It really was like the penny dropped My ex husband was making a creme caramel. He was quite a good cook when he put his mind to it. He messed up the recipe, so he didnt have enough sugar. Most people would say " omg I cant believe I did that", and just go to the corner shop and buy more. Not him. As far as he was concerned, Tate and Lyle put the wrong amount of sugar in the packet. There was no possibilty that it was his mistake, see? He is perfect. He doesnt make mistakes. He will argue that black is white. Because if he admits to the smallest of flaws, the game's up. He has to acknowledge that he is fallible And that cant possibly happen. Because his reality is just too terrifying." Relatable. Its so near impossible to have a relationship with someone like that as any minor disagreement is blown immensely out of proportion and eventually you just suck things up when you're not happy about it as it's just not worth even trying to talk to them as they either flip out or the entire conversation is turned onto everything they claim is wrong with you, far beyond the minor thing the conversation started about. | |||
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"Unfortunately going to the police doesn't always help. I did because it didn't matter how much I blocked him, he found new, sneakier ways to contact me. My blocking also removed a lot of the evidence which is why my police report didn't get anywhere. In fact, the advice from the police and the Suzy Lamplugh Trust was not to block for precisely these reasons. I took out a an injunction to prevent my narcissistic ex-wife contacting or interfering with me or our children. A drastic step, but easily done, and worth it. She now has a criminal record." I can't afford a civil one and I need more evidence for a criminal one which I don't have due to my constant efforts to try to block him from contacting me. | |||
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"You move on then come realise they haven't, but why do they not move on? What is it in their nature that stops them? How do you know they’re a narcissist, have they been diagnosed or is it you’re opinion they are?! Im guessing one reason is that they’re not done with you yet, they hate losing their supply of attention, so they don’t let things go easily, but remember if they are finished with you, they will happily drop you like a stone and not think twice about it. So if you’re finishing with a narc, the best course of action is to cut all ties, don’t give them the chance to muscle back in cause they will take any opportunity they can get. Not diagnosed so my opinion and the opinion of friends too. Though one says more a sociapath. I've been mistreated in my lifetime and met some horrid people and not through my own choices. I'd not met anyone like this before. It was truly horrifying to see what someone can be like. I cut all ties. It's months later that they've found ways to get round that. Hence the question why can't they let go. I don't get what the endgame is. " Sorry to hear that, hope you resolve the issue. | |||
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"I can't answer your question, as I don't think I've had the misfortune to be involved with a narcissist. It seems highly prevalent on here though I think alot of people on here are under the impression that narcissists love themselves " she wont sleep with me, she is up her own arse" kinda thing True narcissism is often borne out of a deep loathing of themselves. They sort of ' reinvent' themselves to avoid confronting the ugly bits I know to my cost I think there's a lot of misinformation flying about around this. People says narcissists are rare which is true for people with actual Narcissistic Personality Disorder but we all have the potential to display narcissistic traits. It's like saying you can't be obsessive or compulsive without actually having OCD. As for the loving themselves thing, it's often a weird contradiction of both a deep self loathing as you say but combined with feelings of entitlement and expectations of special treatment and never being criticised. They can't handle any deviation from treating them as some sort of perfect and divine being. Probably because any small criticism is felt as confirmation of everything negative they've ever thought of themselves I guess. It's weird because most people with insecurities almost expect criticism. I do wonder how you get to the point of believing everybody else should only ever praise you and let you do whatever you want and being immensely angry if they don't. I've told this story lots of times, but its a perfect illustration of narcissism in its purest form. At the time I thought " fuck,thats odd behaviour" but just laughed it off. Years later it all made sense. It really was like the penny dropped My ex husband was making a creme caramel. He was quite a good cook when he put his mind to it. He messed up the recipe, so he didnt have enough sugar. Most people would say " omg I cant believe I did that", and just go to the corner shop and buy more. Not him. As far as he was concerned, Tate and Lyle put the wrong amount of sugar in the packet. There was no possibilty that it was his mistake, see? He is perfect. He doesnt make mistakes. He will argue that black is white. Because if he admits to the smallest of flaws, the game's up. He has to acknowledge that he is fallible And that cant possibly happen. Because his reality is just too terrifying. Relatable. Its so near impossible to have a relationship with someone like that as any minor disagreement is blown immensely out of proportion and eventually you just suck things up when you're not happy about it as it's just not worth even trying to talk to them as they either flip out or the entire conversation is turned onto everything they claim is wrong with you, far beyond the minor thing the conversation started about. " Exactly that Any conversation will be 'circular' And end up being about your failings | |||
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"Maybe it is because they have developed feeling for the person who has moved on and therefore needs more time to move on themselves. I don't think what you are describing is narcissistic behaviour, more just human. An inability to move forward is not by itself narcotic behaviour. When a relationship ends, whatever that relationship was, it can often be difficult for one side to move on. If both parties mutually agree on ending things, and each are equally understanding of in an acceptance of the reasons why, then ends can happen with reduced trauma. But in my experience, the equality in ending a relationship isn't usual. In a previous life on fab, I met someone and felt she was the one. If I'm honest with myself, I still do, in as much as nobody ever made me feel the way she did. But, she ended it. To this day, I don't fully understand the reasons why, and if I did it would make accepting the ending easier than it is. I accept her decision, but I don't fully understand it. Does that make me a narcissist? I hope not, as it's an incurable condition." No it doesn't make you one, you simply don't have proper closure, never really got the proper reasons | |||
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"You move on then come realise they haven't, but why do they not move on? What is it in their nature that stops them? " From My own experience. Narcs are completely self absorbed and have no empathy at all. Once they have had power over a person, They can not believe they can't have it any more. So in their own sick minds, its only a matter of time before they can get you back AND god forbid, they realize they can't get you back, they tend to have a need to destroy you. If you are having problems with a narcissist. you have my wholehearted sympathy xxxx | |||
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"I can't afford a civil one and I need more evidence for a criminal one which I don't have due to my constant efforts to try to block him from contacting me. " PM me if you need advice on how to do it, and how much it will / or won't cost! | |||
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"Unfortunately that is just the nature of narcissists. I think it is because they want control and them letting go doesn't give them that. My ex-wife is a narcissist and she has been making the divorce process as elongated and stressful as possible. I think it's the one bit of control she has left. I don't know what she's going to do with herself when it's all settled. She's running out of opportunities to show her hatred for me, which has been one of her most important goals in life for several years. " Join the club. I am trying to separate/divorce him since Sep 18. Delay tactics. Like your ex, I dont know how he will entertain himself when its all done. We have a date in March for it all to be decided by a judge. Mediation doesnt work with a narc: he requested mediation just before Xmas but all he wanted to know is when I might die of cancer & what is in my Will. Nice man! | |||
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"I can't answer your question, as I don't think I've had the misfortune to be involved with a narcissist. It seems highly prevalent on here though I think alot of people on here are under the impression that narcissists love themselves " she wont sleep with me, she is up her own arse" kinda thing True narcissism is often borne out of a deep loathing of themselves. They sort of ' reinvent' themselves to avoid confronting the ugly bits I know to my cost I think there's a lot of misinformation flying about around this. People says narcissists are rare which is true for people with actual Narcissistic Personality Disorder but we all have the potential to display narcissistic traits. It's like saying you can't be obsessive or compulsive without actually having OCD. As for the loving themselves thing, it's often a weird contradiction of both a deep self loathing as you say but combined with feelings of entitlement and expectations of special treatment and never being criticised. They can't handle any deviation from treating them as some sort of perfect and divine being. Probably because any small criticism is felt as confirmation of everything negative they've ever thought of themselves I guess. It's weird because most people with insecurities almost expect criticism. I do wonder how you get to the point of believing everybody else should only ever praise you and let you do whatever you want and being immensely angry if they don't. I've told this story lots of times, but its a perfect illustration of narcissism in its purest form. At the time I thought " fuck,thats odd behaviour" but just laughed it off. Years later it all made sense. It really was like the penny dropped My ex husband was making a creme caramel. He was quite a good cook when he put his mind to it. He messed up the recipe, so he didnt have enough sugar. Most people would say " omg I cant believe I did that", and just go to the corner shop and buy more. Not him. As far as he was concerned, Tate and Lyle put the wrong amount of sugar in the packet. There was no possibilty that it was his mistake, see? He is perfect. He doesnt make mistakes. He will argue that black is white. Because if he admits to the smallest of flaws, the game's up. He has to acknowledge that he is fallible And that cant possibly happen. Because his reality is just too terrifying." You didn't it didn't you? You took some of the sugar out of the packet and re-sealed it to make him look stupid? Why did you do that? What do you mean you didn't? You must have done. Stop lying and just admit it. Wow, you really are a psycho! Think I'm fucking stupid, think I don't know what you're playing at. *Mumbles continuously throughout the night, but just odd words you can make out that sound quite threatening, name calling, belittling but not said loud enough to be recorded and used as evidence* I remember it well. | |||
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"I can't answer your question, as I don't think I've had the misfortune to be involved with a narcissist. It seems highly prevalent on here though I think alot of people on here are under the impression that narcissists love themselves " she wont sleep with me, she is up her own arse" kinda thing True narcissism is often borne out of a deep loathing of themselves. They sort of ' reinvent' themselves to avoid confronting the ugly bits I know to my cost I think there's a lot of misinformation flying about around this. People says narcissists are rare which is true for people with actual Narcissistic Personality Disorder but we all have the potential to display narcissistic traits. It's like saying you can't be obsessive or compulsive without actually having OCD. As for the loving themselves thing, it's often a weird contradiction of both a deep self loathing as you say but combined with feelings of entitlement and expectations of special treatment and never being criticised. They can't handle any deviation from treating them as some sort of perfect and divine being. Probably because any small criticism is felt as confirmation of everything negative they've ever thought of themselves I guess. It's weird because most people with insecurities almost expect criticism. I do wonder how you get to the point of believing everybody else should only ever praise you and let you do whatever you want and being immensely angry if they don't. I've told this story lots of times, but its a perfect illustration of narcissism in its purest form. At the time I thought " fuck,thats odd behaviour" but just laughed it off. Years later it all made sense. It really was like the penny dropped My ex husband was making a creme caramel. He was quite a good cook when he put his mind to it. He messed up the recipe, so he didnt have enough sugar. Most people would say " omg I cant believe I did that", and just go to the corner shop and buy more. Not him. As far as he was concerned, Tate and Lyle put the wrong amount of sugar in the packet. There was no possibilty that it was his mistake, see? He is perfect. He doesnt make mistakes. He will argue that black is white. Because if he admits to the smallest of flaws, the game's up. He has to acknowledge that he is fallible And that cant possibly happen. Because his reality is just too terrifying. You didn't it didn't you? You took some of the sugar out of the packet and re-sealed it to make him look stupid? Why did you do that? What do you mean you didn't? You must have done. Stop lying and just admit it. Wow, you really are a psycho! Think I'm fucking stupid, think I don't know what you're playing at. *Mumbles continuously throughout the night, but just odd words you can make out that sound quite threatening, name calling, belittling but not said loud enough to be recorded and used as evidence* I remember it well." Hahaha, Actually it was usually him that tampered with, moved, broke, hid my things And always. Always. Flatly denied it I dont know what I'm talking about. I make stuff up. I've always been a liar. Everyone knows I'm a liar... You know the rest | |||
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"I can't answer your question, as I don't think I've had the misfortune to be involved with a narcissist. It seems highly prevalent on here though I think alot of people on here are under the impression that narcissists love themselves " she wont sleep with me, she is up her own arse" kinda thing True narcissism is often borne out of a deep loathing of themselves. They sort of ' reinvent' themselves to avoid confronting the ugly bits I know to my cost I think there's a lot of misinformation flying about around this. People says narcissists are rare which is true for people with actual Narcissistic Personality Disorder but we all have the potential to display narcissistic traits. It's like saying you can't be obsessive or compulsive without actually having OCD. As for the loving themselves thing, it's often a weird contradiction of both a deep self loathing as you say but combined with feelings of entitlement and expectations of special treatment and never being criticised. They can't handle any deviation from treating them as some sort of perfect and divine being. Probably because any small criticism is felt as confirmation of everything negative they've ever thought of themselves I guess. It's weird because most people with insecurities almost expect criticism. I do wonder how you get to the point of believing everybody else should only ever praise you and let you do whatever you want and being immensely angry if they don't. I've told this story lots of times, but its a perfect illustration of narcissism in its purest form. At the time I thought " fuck,thats odd behaviour" but just laughed it off. Years later it all made sense. It really was like the penny dropped My ex husband was making a creme caramel. He was quite a good cook when he put his mind to it. He messed up the recipe, so he didnt have enough sugar. Most people would say " omg I cant believe I did that", and just go to the corner shop and buy more. Not him. As far as he was concerned, Tate and Lyle put the wrong amount of sugar in the packet. There was no possibilty that it was his mistake, see? He is perfect. He doesnt make mistakes. He will argue that black is white. Because if he admits to the smallest of flaws, the game's up. He has to acknowledge that he is fallible And that cant possibly happen. Because his reality is just too terrifying. You didn't it didn't you? You took some of the sugar out of the packet and re-sealed it to make him look stupid? Why did you do that? What do you mean you didn't? You must have done. Stop lying and just admit it. Wow, you really are a psycho! Think I'm fucking stupid, think I don't know what you're playing at. *Mumbles continuously throughout the night, but just odd words you can make out that sound quite threatening, name calling, belittling but not said loud enough to be recorded and used as evidence* I remember it well. Hahaha, Actually it was usually him that tampered with, moved, broke, hid my things And always. Always. Flatly denied it I dont know what I'm talking about. I make stuff up. I've always been a liar. Everyone knows I'm a liar... You know the rest" All part of the "make em think they're crazy" process. I'm so glad I started keeping a diary and voice recording things when I realised. Was already too late by then as far as damage goes but definitely helped me process and understand it wasn't me. I believe I'd either be dead by now or in an asylum if I hadn't taken those steps. | |||
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"You move on then come realise they haven't, but why do they not move on? What is it in their nature that stops them? " they need validation, if you give them a response, if good or bad it it's a win in their eyes and they get off on it, you to cut them off completely if it's possible and hopefully with time they should realise you hot their number | |||
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"I can't answer your question, as I don't think I've had the misfortune to be involved with a narcissist. It seems highly prevalent on here though I think alot of people on here are under the impression that narcissists love themselves " she wont sleep with me, she is up her own arse" kinda thing True narcissism is often borne out of a deep loathing of themselves. They sort of ' reinvent' themselves to avoid confronting the ugly bits I know to my cost I think there's a lot of misinformation flying about around this. People says narcissists are rare which is true for people with actual Narcissistic Personality Disorder but we all have the potential to display narcissistic traits. It's like saying you can't be obsessive or compulsive without actually having OCD. As for the loving themselves thing, it's often a weird contradiction of both a deep self loathing as you say but combined with feelings of entitlement and expectations of special treatment and never being criticised. They can't handle any deviation from treating them as some sort of perfect and divine being. Probably because any small criticism is felt as confirmation of everything negative they've ever thought of themselves I guess. It's weird because most people with insecurities almost expect criticism. I do wonder how you get to the point of believing everybody else should only ever praise you and let you do whatever you want and being immensely angry if they don't. I've told this story lots of times, but its a perfect illustration of narcissism in its purest form. At the time I thought " fuck,thats odd behaviour" but just laughed it off. Years later it all made sense. It really was like the penny dropped My ex husband was making a creme caramel. He was quite a good cook when he put his mind to it. He messed up the recipe, so he didnt have enough sugar. Most people would say " omg I cant believe I did that", and just go to the corner shop and buy more. Not him. As far as he was concerned, Tate and Lyle put the wrong amount of sugar in the packet. There was no possibilty that it was his mistake, see? He is perfect. He doesnt make mistakes. He will argue that black is white. Because if he admits to the smallest of flaws, the game's up. He has to acknowledge that he is fallible And that cant possibly happen. Because his reality is just too terrifying. You didn't it didn't you? You took some of the sugar out of the packet and re-sealed it to make him look stupid? Why did you do that? What do you mean you didn't? You must have done. Stop lying and just admit it. Wow, you really are a psycho! Think I'm fucking stupid, think I don't know what you're playing at. *Mumbles continuously throughout the night, but just odd words you can make out that sound quite threatening, name calling, belittling but not said loud enough to be recorded and used as evidence* I remember it well. Hahaha, Actually it was usually him that tampered with, moved, broke, hid my things And always. Always. Flatly denied it I dont know what I'm talking about. I make stuff up. I've always been a liar. Everyone knows I'm a liar... You know the rest All part of the "make em think they're crazy" process. I'm so glad I started keeping a diary and voice recording things when I realised. Was already too late by then as far as damage goes but definitely helped me process and understand it wasn't me. I believe I'd either be dead by now or in an asylum if I hadn't taken those steps." Yup They are fucked up and no mistake | |||
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"Narcissism is an illness stemming from ocd so those who have this illness dont know they are not being normal. The rest of us think they are asshokes and they dont understand why" Exactly and to be honest I find this whole discussing quite distasteful because we wouldn't talk about any other mental health illness in such a way openly. | |||
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"I think people often mix narcissistic traits with a clinically diagnosed narcissist. Not everyone with narcissistic traits are a narcissist. It's very much a term put out quite flippantly now. Also see a lot where some confuse psychopathic behaviour with narcissistic. " Yes they do and I think that is why I have a concern that if somebody behaves in a way but has been described by people in this threat there is clearly something wrong with that person either diagnosed or not. While we do not have to put up with people's unacceptable behaviour I think we do have to bear in mind there is almost certainly mental health conditions at the bottom of this and be careful in our language. | |||
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"Prof Steven Peters says, I think, in The Chimp Paradox that the best way to deal with sociopaths (and I appreciate that we’re talking about narcissism, but the control issues may suggest some overlap) is to avoid! Coincidentally, a friend who’s qualified in the general area of psychology has also said something similar. " Exactly this the more attention you feed (positive or negative) them the more they crave for the most part. | |||
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"I think people often mix narcissistic traits with a clinically diagnosed narcissist. Not everyone with narcissistic traits are a narcissist. It's very much a term put out quite flippantly now. Also see a lot where some confuse psychopathic behaviour with narcissistic. Yes they do and I think that is why I have a concern that if somebody behaves in a way but has been described by people in this threat there is clearly something wrong with that person either diagnosed or not. While we do not have to put up with people's unacceptable behaviour I think we do have to bear in mind there is almost certainly mental health conditions at the bottom of this and be careful in our language." I agree with your sentiments above, but there’s also the point that if I was on the receiving end of such behaviour, I don’t see why other people’s problems should become mine. That’s not why we’re on this site. | |||
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"I think people often mix narcissistic traits with a clinically diagnosed narcissist. Not everyone with narcissistic traits are a narcissist. It's very much a term put out quite flippantly now. Also see a lot where some confuse psychopathic behaviour with narcissistic. Yes they do and I think that is why I have a concern that if somebody behaves in a way but has been described by people in this threat there is clearly something wrong with that person either diagnosed or not. While we do not have to put up with people's unacceptable behaviour I think we do have to bear in mind there is almost certainly mental health conditions at the bottom of this and be careful in our language. I agree with your sentiments above, but there’s also the point that if I was on the receiving end of such behaviour, I don’t see why other people’s problems should become mine. That’s not why we’re on this site. " It's easy to have understanding for there type of people.... Till you're caught in a trap by one. | |||
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"Prof Steven Peters says, I think, in The Chimp Paradox that the best way to deal with sociopaths (and I appreciate that we’re talking about narcissism, but the control issues may suggest some overlap) is to avoid! Coincidentally, a friend who’s qualified in the general area of psychology has also said something similar. " Absolutely the way to go. Ignore them and anything they say or do, cut all ties. | |||
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"I think people often mix narcissistic traits with a clinically diagnosed narcissist. Not everyone with narcissistic traits are a narcissist. It's very much a term put out quite flippantly now. Also see a lot where some confuse psychopathic behaviour with narcissistic. Yes they do and I think that is why I have a concern that if somebody behaves in a way but has been described by people in this threat there is clearly something wrong with that person either diagnosed or not. While we do not have to put up with people's unacceptable behaviour I think we do have to bear in mind there is almost certainly mental health conditions at the bottom of this and be careful in our language. I agree with your sentiments above, but there’s also the point that if I was on the receiving end of such behaviour, I don’t see why other people’s problems should become mine. That’s not why we’re on this site. " If someone on the site is causing you problems with there behaviour then you block them so I don't understand the correlation. It's not a sentiment it's the fact that a lot of what is being discussed and the language being used would be called out if it was being used to describe anybody else with a mental health condition, I just think it's something people need to be mindful of. | |||
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"I think people often mix narcissistic traits with a clinically diagnosed narcissist. Not everyone with narcissistic traits are a narcissist. It's very much a term put out quite flippantly now. Also see a lot where some confuse psychopathic behaviour with narcissistic. Yes they do and I think that is why I have a concern that if somebody behaves in a way but has been described by people in this threat there is clearly something wrong with that person either diagnosed or not. While we do not have to put up with people's unacceptable behaviour I think we do have to bear in mind there is almost certainly mental health conditions at the bottom of this and be careful in our language. I agree with your sentiments above, but there’s also the point that if I was on the receiving end of such behaviour, I don’t see why other people’s problems should become mine. That’s not why we’re on this site. It's easy to have understanding for there type of people.... Till you're caught in a trap by one. " Again I agree but again if we were talking about any other types of mental health condition we would not be using language that has been used in this thread. | |||
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"I think people often mix narcissistic traits with a clinically diagnosed narcissist. Not everyone with narcissistic traits are a narcissist. It's very much a term put out quite flippantly now. Also see a lot where some confuse psychopathic behaviour with narcissistic. Yes they do and I think that is why I have a concern that if somebody behaves in a way but has been described by people in this threat there is clearly something wrong with that person either diagnosed or not. While we do not have to put up with people's unacceptable behaviour I think we do have to bear in mind there is almost certainly mental health conditions at the bottom of this and be careful in our language. I agree with your sentiments above, but there’s also the point that if I was on the receiving end of such behaviour, I don’t see why other people’s problems should become mine. That’s not why we’re on this site. It's easy to have understanding for there type of people.... Till you're caught in a trap by one. Again I agree but again if we were talking about any other types of mental health condition we would not be using language that has been used in this thread." Think that's because of the levels these people will go to in order to destroy others. | |||
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"Unfortunately that is just the nature of narcissists. I think it is because they want control and them letting go doesn't give them that. My ex-wife is a narcissist and she has been making the divorce process as elongated and stressful as possible. I think it's the one bit of control she has left. I don't know what she's going to do with herself when it's all settled. She's running out of opportunities to show her hatred for me, which has been one of her most important goals in life for several years. " I think I was married to her! | |||
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"I think people often mix narcissistic traits with a clinically diagnosed narcissist. Not everyone with narcissistic traits are a narcissist. It's very much a term put out quite flippantly now. Also see a lot where some confuse psychopathic behaviour with narcissistic. Yes they do and I think that is why I have a concern that if somebody behaves in a way but has been described by people in this threat there is clearly something wrong with that person either diagnosed or not. While we do not have to put up with people's unacceptable behaviour I think we do have to bear in mind there is almost certainly mental health conditions at the bottom of this and be careful in our language. I agree with your sentiments above, but there’s also the point that if I was on the receiving end of such behaviour, I don’t see why other people’s problems should become mine. That’s not why we’re on this site. It's easy to have understanding for there type of people.... Till you're caught in a trap by one. Again I agree but again if we were talking about any other types of mental health condition we would not be using language that has been used in this thread. Think that's because of the levels these people will go to in order to destroy others. " "These people" are often severely mentally ill and and no we do not have to put up with their behaviour but we do not have to use the humanising language either. Like you said above it's best to cut them out of your life until they are able to get treatment but I don't see why we are using language that we would not use if it was any other mental health condition. | |||
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"I think people often mix narcissistic traits with a clinically diagnosed narcissist. Not everyone with narcissistic traits are a narcissist. It's very much a term put out quite flippantly now. Also see a lot where some confuse psychopathic behaviour with narcissistic. Yes they do and I think that is why I have a concern that if somebody behaves in a way but has been described by people in this threat there is clearly something wrong with that person either diagnosed or not. While we do not have to put up with people's unacceptable behaviour I think we do have to bear in mind there is almost certainly mental health conditions at the bottom of this and be careful in our language. I agree with your sentiments above, but there’s also the point that if I was on the receiving end of such behaviour, I don’t see why other people’s problems should become mine. That’s not why we’re on this site. It's easy to have understanding for there type of people.... Till you're caught in a trap by one. Again I agree but again if we were talking about any other types of mental health condition we would not be using language that has been used in this thread." What language are you referring to Lorna? While Narcissism may be a mental health condition and I agree we wouldn't necessarily talk about other conditions the same way, I think it depends on the situation involved. There's been many threads about a variety of different issues. Sometimes it's people are reaching out, other times it's people discussing their experiences. I don't think there's anything wrong with that. | |||
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"Because they would have to put the effort into luring someone new. Gosh it takes time to pretend you are someone else and then subtly gaslight you over weeks, months or years. They must enjoy the process but not to that extent. " That's an interesting statement. I'd argue that narcissists don't develop their modes of operation deliberately. They don't generally wake up one morning and think ..... Today I will manipulate and lie and not feel for others.' They are who they are, which in itself accounts for them not being able to let go. | |||
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"I think people often mix narcissistic traits with a clinically diagnosed narcissist. Not everyone with narcissistic traits are a narcissist. It's very much a term put out quite flippantly now. Also see a lot where some confuse psychopathic behaviour with narcissistic. Yes they do and I think that is why I have a concern that if somebody behaves in a way but has been described by people in this threat there is clearly something wrong with that person either diagnosed or not. While we do not have to put up with people's unacceptable behaviour I think we do have to bear in mind there is almost certainly mental health conditions at the bottom of this and be careful in our language. I agree with your sentiments above, but there’s also the point that if I was on the receiving end of such behaviour, I don’t see why other people’s problems should become mine. That’s not why we’re on this site. It's easy to have understanding for there type of people.... Till you're caught in a trap by one. Again I agree but again if we were talking about any other types of mental health condition we would not be using language that has been used in this thread. What language are you referring to Lorna? While Narcissism may be a mental health condition and I agree we wouldn't necessarily talk about other conditions the same way, I think it depends on the situation involved. There's been many threads about a variety of different issues. Sometimes it's people are reaching out, other times it's people discussing their experiences. I don't think there's anything wrong with that. " Phrases like "there type of people and they are fucked up for sure, I have seen mental health threads where people have said Something similar and everyone has jumped on it and called that person out so I am just pointing out we need to be mindful of our language. And use compassion while we are telling our personal stories like people do in every other thread that involves mental health. Narcissism and mental health conditions that fall in this category have a huge stigma surrounding them already and I just think it's important that we don't add to that. | |||
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"Just before I go back to reading, the world is full of fully functioning narcissists and psychopaths who lead fruitful and meaningful lives and make good friends..... There's always a spectrum ..... " Definitely agree. | |||
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"Just before I go back to reading, the world is full of fully functioning narcissists and psychopaths who lead fruitful and meaningful lives and make good friends..... There's always a spectrum ..... Definitely agree. "Agreed. | |||
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"It's their ego & their need to control. They just cannot accept that anyone dare move on from them. " this is bang on, perfect explanation. Was married to one for a long time, nearly 2 years later still at me lol | |||
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"Just before I go back to reading, the world is full of fully functioning narcissists and psychopaths who lead fruitful and meaningful lives and make good friends..... There's always a spectrum ..... " Yep. There was a Forbes article about a high percentage of CEOs having psychopathic traits. | |||
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"Maybe it is because they have developed feeling for the person who has moved on and therefore needs more time to move on themselves. I don't think what you are describing is narcissistic behaviour, more just human. An inability to move forward is not by itself narcotic behaviour. When a relationship ends, whatever that relationship was, it can often be difficult for one side to move on. If both parties mutually agree on ending things, and each are equally understanding of in an acceptance of the reasons why, then ends can happen with reduced trauma. But in my experience, the equality in ending a relationship isn't usual. In a previous life on fab, I met someone and felt she was the one. If I'm honest with myself, I still do, in as much as nobody ever made me feel the way she did. But, she ended it. To this day, I don't fully understand the reasons why, and if I did it would make accepting the ending easier than it is. I accept her decision, but I don't fully understand it. Does that make me a narcissist? I hope not, as it's an incurable condition." Well observed. Buzz words , panaceas , often used as explanations to sooth the sufferer. Happens a lot. It's so easy to label people because you can find all the signs if you look for them. Often when they are not there at all. | |||
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"Just before I go back to reading, the world is full of fully functioning narcissists and psychopaths who lead fruitful and meaningful lives and make good friends..... There's always a spectrum ..... Yep. There was a Forbes article about a high percentage of CEOs having psychopathic traits. " Might make that my bedtime reading fuck all else going on. | |||
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"Just before I go back to reading, the world is full of fully functioning narcissists and psychopaths who lead fruitful and meaningful lives and make good friends..... There's always a spectrum ..... Yep. There was a Forbes article about a high percentage of CEOs having psychopathic traits. Might make that my bedtime reading fuck all else going on. "I was just thinking the same. | |||
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"Narcissism is an illness stemming from ocd so those who have this illness dont know they are not being normal. The rest of us think they are asshokes and they dont understand why Exactly and to be honest I find this whole discussing quite distasteful because we wouldn't talk about any other mental health illness in such a way openly." There are women on this site that have been almost destroyed by narcs Alot have said nothing for years They most certainly SHOULD be talking about it | |||
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"I think people often mix narcissistic traits with a clinically diagnosed narcissist. Not everyone with narcissistic traits are a narcissist. It's very much a term put out quite flippantly now. Also see a lot where some confuse psychopathic behaviour with narcissistic. Yes they do and I think that is why I have a concern that if somebody behaves in a way but has been described by people in this threat there is clearly something wrong with that person either diagnosed or not. While we do not have to put up with people's unacceptable behaviour I think we do have to bear in mind there is almost certainly mental health conditions at the bottom of this and be careful in our language. I agree with your sentiments above, but there’s also the point that if I was on the receiving end of such behaviour, I don’t see why other people’s problems should become mine. That’s not why we’re on this site. It's easy to have understanding for there type of people.... Till you're caught in a trap by one. Again I agree but again if we were talking about any other types of mental health condition we would not be using language that has been used in this thread. Think that's because of the levels these people will go to in order to destroy others. "These people" are often severely mentally ill and and no we do not have to put up with their behaviour but we do not have to use the humanising language either. Like you said above it's best to cut them out of your life until they are able to get treatment but I don't see why we are using language that we would not use if it was any other mental health condition. " Perhaps people feel strongly when their life has been ruined, they have been terrorised or physically assaulted or driven to the brink of suicide by one of them. I understand where you're coming from but people react strongly because of experiences. | |||
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"Narcissism is an illness stemming from ocd so those who have this illness dont know they are not being normal. The rest of us think they are asshokes and they dont understand why Exactly and to be honest I find this whole discussing quite distasteful because we wouldn't talk about any other mental health illness in such a way openly. There are women on this site that have been almost destroyed by narcs Alot have said nothing for years They most certainly SHOULD be talking about it" And men. Before anyone shouts at me | |||
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"Narcissism is an illness stemming from ocd so those who have this illness dont know they are not being normal. The rest of us think they are asshokes and they dont understand why Exactly and to be honest I find this whole discussing quite distasteful because we wouldn't talk about any other mental health illness in such a way openly. There are women on this site that have been almost destroyed by narcs Alot have said nothing for years They most certainly SHOULD be talking about it" Exactly! | |||
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"Narcissism is an illness stemming from ocd so those who have this illness dont know they are not being normal. The rest of us think they are asshokes and they dont understand why Exactly and to be honest I find this whole discussing quite distasteful because we wouldn't talk about any other mental health illness in such a way openly. There are women on this site that have been almost destroyed by narcs Alot have said nothing for years They most certainly SHOULD be talking about it" I am just saying we need to be careful with the language we use when describing people who almost certainly have a mental health condition I am not saying people need to put up with this behaviour in fact I have said several times they shouldn't. But You have just used some of the language I'm referring to by implying that it is only men that are narcissists or treat people this way. | |||
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"You can’t help how some folk are wired. " | |||
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"Narcissism is an illness stemming from ocd so those who have this illness dont know they are not being normal. The rest of us think they are asshokes and they dont understand why Exactly and to be honest I find this whole discussing quite distasteful because we wouldn't talk about any other mental health illness in such a way openly. There are women on this site that have been almost destroyed by narcs Alot have said nothing for years They most certainly SHOULD be talking about it" Anyone who has suffered should be able to discuss it openly. What was being said in the post you quote was that 'it should not be discussed 'in such a way' ........ Not don't discuss but don't discuss in a pejorative manner. | |||
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"It just seems ironic that people are allowed to talk about their experience of being abused by people but no one is allowed to come in with an opposing view at no point what so ever have I said people shouldn't be talking about this." Where has anyone said no one can have an opposing view? Also, you can't tell people how they feel, the experiences they've had or how to deal with it. Talking about bad experiences is actively encouraged to help process them so the ones on the recieving end can start to heal and move on with their lives. | |||
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"You can’t help how some folk are weird. " Bit rude. | |||
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"I think people often mix narcissistic traits with a clinically diagnosed narcissist. Not everyone with narcissistic traits are a narcissist. It's very much a term put out quite flippantly now. Also see a lot where some confuse psychopathic behaviour with narcissistic. Yes they do and I think that is why I have a concern that if somebody behaves in a way but has been described by people in this threat there is clearly something wrong with that person either diagnosed or not. While we do not have to put up with people's unacceptable behaviour I think we do have to bear in mind there is almost certainly mental health conditions at the bottom of this and be careful in our language. I agree with your sentiments above, but there’s also the point that if I was on the receiving end of such behaviour, I don’t see why other people’s problems should become mine. That’s not why we’re on this site. It's easy to have understanding for there type of people.... Till you're caught in a trap by one. Again I agree but again if we were talking about any other types of mental health condition we would not be using language that has been used in this thread. Think that's because of the levels these people will go to in order to destroy others. "These people" are often severely mentally ill and and no we do not have to put up with their behaviour but we do not have to use the humanising language either. Like you said above it's best to cut them out of your life until they are able to get treatment but I don't see why we are using language that we would not use if it was any other mental health condition. Perhaps people feel strongly when their life has been ruined, they have been terrorised or physically assaulted or driven to the brink of suicide by one of them. I understand where you're coming from but people react strongly because of experiences. " Personally I have been through DA and still have some harassment years on due to this. But i wouldnt use the term flippantly for everyone showing narcissistic traits. This particular person I found out later suffers BPD (not clinically narcissistic) yet I wouldn't then automatically assume everyone with BPD acts the same. I understand the personal experiences all may have will differ. And the hurt and anger it can leave behind, I suffered a miscarriage during months of stalking and harassment, so honesty I get it. But Mental health is extremely complex and will differ from person to person not one having the very same experience as the other. It's a very broad spectrum throughout, not matter what the condition . It's quite unfair to label others based on, frequently misinformed notion, or clumping together all suffers of one particular condition the same, rather then seeing different variant amongst them. | |||
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"It just seems ironic that people are allowed to talk about their experience of being abused by people but no one is allowed to come in with an opposing view at no point what so ever have I said people shouldn't be talking about this. Where has anyone said no one can have an opposing view? Also, you can't tell people how they feel, the experiences they've had or how to deal with it. Talking about bad experiences is actively encouraged to help process them so the ones on the recieving end can start to heal and move on with their lives. " I have a done any of the things you have just accused me of. I just said I don't agree with some of the language being used. | |||
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"Narcissism is an illness stemming from ocd so those who have this illness dont know they are not being normal. The rest of us think they are asshokes and they dont understand why" Narcissism doesn’t stem from ocd, also people with ocd are often fully aware that there rituals aren’t rational, but that makes it no more easier to stop. | |||
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"Narcissism is an illness stemming from ocd so those who have this illness dont know they are not being normal. The rest of us think they are asshokes and they dont understand why Exactly and to be honest I find this whole discussing quite distasteful because we wouldn't talk about any other mental health illness in such a way openly. There are women on this site that have been almost destroyed by narcs Alot have said nothing for years They most certainly SHOULD be talking about it I am just saying we need to be careful with the language we use when describing people who almost certainly have a mental health condition I am not saying people need to put up with this behaviour in fact I have said several times they shouldn't. But You have just used some of the language I'm referring to by implying that it is only men that are narcissists or treat people this way." I corrected myself. I certainly didnt mean to imply that women are the only victims. For that I apologise However, I wont apologise for saying my ex husband is a lunatic. I used to think " its like living with a mad man" Thats because he IS a mad man He made my life a hundred kinds of hell. Deliberately. For his own ends, and to appease his own fucked up ego. Treatment? He wont be seeking treatment of any kind, any time soon. My son and I, however, may be in therapy for quite some time | |||
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"Narcissism is an illness stemming from ocd so those who have this illness dont know they are not being normal. The rest of us think they are asshokes and they dont understand why Exactly and to be honest I find this whole discussing quite distasteful because we wouldn't talk about any other mental health illness in such a way openly. There are women on this site that have been almost destroyed by narcs Alot have said nothing for years They most certainly SHOULD be talking about it I am just saying we need to be careful with the language we use when describing people who almost certainly have a mental health condition I am not saying people need to put up with this behaviour in fact I have said several times they shouldn't. But You have just used some of the language I'm referring to by implying that it is only men that are narcissists or treat people this way. I corrected myself. I certainly didnt mean to imply that women are the only victims. For that I apologise However, I wont apologise for saying my ex husband is a lunatic. I used to think " its like living with a mad man" Thats because he IS a mad man He made my life a hundred kinds of hell. Deliberately. For his own ends, and to appease his own fucked up ego. Treatment? He wont be seeking treatment of any kind, any time soon. My son and I, however, may be in therapy for quite some time" And im really not asking you to. The problem is there is a lot of misunderstanding when it comes to mental health conditions and at no point have I said or would i that people cannot discuss the effects of such behaviour. I just think it is important that we are aware mental health conditions come in all kinds of guises and of course we should talk about our personal experience. It is also important to remember not everybody with a personality disorder is manipulative or abusive, it is just something I am passionate about people understanding. My Wording may have been clumsy and others have put it much more eloquently but we just need to be mindful of the language we use. There is a difference between someone being an absolute arsehole out to deliberately hurt people and somebody with a severe mental health condition and I was just trying to get back point across. | |||
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"Narcissism is an illness stemming from ocd so those who have this illness dont know they are not being normal. The rest of us think they are asshokes and they dont understand why Exactly and to be honest I find this whole discussing quite distasteful because we wouldn't talk about any other mental health illness in such a way openly. There are women on this site that have been almost destroyed by narcs Alot have said nothing for years They most certainly SHOULD be talking about it I am just saying we need to be careful with the language we use when describing people who almost certainly have a mental health condition I am not saying people need to put up with this behaviour in fact I have said several times they shouldn't. But You have just used some of the language I'm referring to by implying that it is only men that are narcissists or treat people this way. I corrected myself. I certainly didnt mean to imply that women are the only victims. For that I apologise However, I wont apologise for saying my ex husband is a lunatic. I used to think " its like living with a mad man" Thats because he IS a mad man He made my life a hundred kinds of hell. Deliberately. For his own ends, and to appease his own fucked up ego. Treatment? He wont be seeking treatment of any kind, any time soon. My son and I, however, may be in therapy for quite some time And im really not asking you to. The problem is there is a lot of misunderstanding when it comes to mental health conditions and at no point have I said or would i that people cannot discuss the effects of such behaviour. I just think it is important that we are aware mental health conditions come in all kinds of guises and of course we should talk about our personal experience. It is also important to remember not everybody with a personality disorder is manipulative or abusive, it is just something I am passionate about people understanding. My Wording may have been clumsy and others have put it much more eloquently but we just need to be mindful of the language we use. There is a difference between someone being an absolute arsehole out to deliberately hurt people and somebody with a severe mental health condition and I was just trying to get back point across." I think there is a huge amount of misunderstanding about narcissism in general Almost daily on this site. Its important people know that it isnt about being vain, and loving yourself. Not at all If you've been on the receiving end of narcissistic abuse, you'll know that vain is the last thing they are And whether it can be labelled as a mental health issue or not, getting any kind of help is the last thing they will do | |||
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"I think people often mix narcissistic traits with a clinically diagnosed narcissist. Not everyone with narcissistic traits are a narcissist. It's very much a term put out quite flippantly now. Also see a lot where some confuse psychopathic behaviour with narcissistic. Yes they do and I think that is why I have a concern that if somebody behaves in a way but has been described by people in this threat there is clearly something wrong with that person either diagnosed or not. While we do not have to put up with people's unacceptable behaviour I think we do have to bear in mind there is almost certainly mental health conditions at the bottom of this and be careful in our language. I agree with your sentiments above, but there’s also the point that if I was on the receiving end of such behaviour, I don’t see why other people’s problems should become mine. That’s not why we’re on this site. If someone on the site is causing you problems with there behaviour then you block them so I don't understand the correlation. It's not a sentiment it's the fact that a lot of what is being discussed and the language being used would be called out if it was being used to describe anybody else with a mental health condition, I just think it's something people need to be mindful of." The sentiment, as I interpreted it, was that individuals labelled as narcissistic or sociopath deserve the same respect for the fact that they are suffering from a mental illness as any other mental illnesses and so should be afforded the same level of understanding. I hope I haven’t misunderstood the point you were making. My point, however, is that, when someone’s actions are harmful, to put it crudely their shit should not be my shit. Blocking is all well and good, but the average sociopath is a little more determined than most and will try and get round that obstacle, be it knowing where you live, have your telephone number or other indirect methods. I am not speaking academically, I am speaking from real life experience. It takes a high degree of strength of character, determination and self-confidence to deal with someone intent on damaging your life. Nobody should have to go to extremes, such as seeking a non-mol*station order. The fact that someone is ill does not, in my books condone their actions (and I’m not saying that this is what you are suggesting). Whilst their actions might be a little more understandable, it doesn’t make them more forgivable. | |||
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"I think people often mix narcissistic traits with a clinically diagnosed narcissist. Not everyone with narcissistic traits are a narcissist. It's very much a term put out quite flippantly now. Also see a lot where some confuse psychopathic behaviour with narcissistic. Yes they do and I think that is why I have a concern that if somebody behaves in a way but has been described by people in this threat there is clearly something wrong with that person either diagnosed or not. While we do not have to put up with people's unacceptable behaviour I think we do have to bear in mind there is almost certainly mental health conditions at the bottom of this and be careful in our language. I agree with your sentiments above, but there’s also the point that if I was on the receiving end of such behaviour, I don’t see why other people’s problems should become mine. That’s not why we’re on this site. If someone on the site is causing you problems with there behaviour then you block them so I don't understand the correlation. It's not a sentiment it's the fact that a lot of what is being discussed and the language being used would be called out if it was being used to describe anybody else with a mental health condition, I just think it's something people need to be mindful of. The sentiment, as I interpreted it, was that individuals labelled as narcissistic or sociopath deserve the same respect for the fact that they are suffering from a mental illness as any other mental illnesses and so should be afforded the same level of understanding. I hope I haven’t misunderstood the point you were making. My point, however, is that, when someone’s actions are harmful, to put it crudely their shit should not be my shit. Blocking is all well and good, but the average sociopath is a little more determined than most and will try and get round that obstacle, be it knowing where you live, have your telephone number or other indirect methods. I am not speaking academically, I am speaking from real life experience. It takes a high degree of strength of character, determination and self-confidence to deal with someone intent on damaging your life. Nobody should have to go to extremes, such as seeking a non-mol*station order. The fact that someone is ill does not, in my books condone their actions (and I’m not saying that this is what you are suggesting). Whilst their actions might be a little more understandable, it doesn’t make them more forgivable. " The problem is people often label people narcissistic or sociopath when actually there is other issues going on and as somebody has mentioned above other personality disorders are often misunderstood and people label them narcissistic. I have just locked it up and only 0.5% of the population would be considered a narcissist by a mental health professional. That is less than 350000 people in the UK so it is unlikely most of us will ever come into contact with someone who is a narcissist. | |||
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"'locked it up' ...... Freudian ? Made me smile anyhooooooooo " I will learn to proof Read one day.  | |||
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"I think people often mix narcissistic traits with a clinically diagnosed narcissist. Not everyone with narcissistic traits are a narcissist. It's very much a term put out quite flippantly now. Also see a lot where some confuse psychopathic behaviour with narcissistic. Yes they do and I think that is why I have a concern that if somebody behaves in a way but has been described by people in this threat there is clearly something wrong with that person either diagnosed or not. While we do not have to put up with people's unacceptable behaviour I think we do have to bear in mind there is almost certainly mental health conditions at the bottom of this and be careful in our language. I agree with your sentiments above, but there’s also the point that if I was on the receiving end of such behaviour, I don’t see why other people’s problems should become mine. That’s not why we’re on this site. If someone on the site is causing you problems with there behaviour then you block them so I don't understand the correlation. It's not a sentiment it's the fact that a lot of what is being discussed and the language being used would be called out if it was being used to describe anybody else with a mental health condition, I just think it's something people need to be mindful of. The sentiment, as I interpreted it, was that individuals labelled as narcissistic or sociopath deserve the same respect for the fact that they are suffering from a mental illness as any other mental illnesses and so should be afforded the same level of understanding. I hope I haven’t misunderstood the point you were making. My point, however, is that, when someone’s actions are harmful, to put it crudely their shit should not be my shit. Blocking is all well and good, but the average sociopath is a little more determined than most and will try and get round that obstacle, be it knowing where you live, have your telephone number or other indirect methods. I am not speaking academically, I am speaking from real life experience. It takes a high degree of strength of character, determination and self-confidence to deal with someone intent on damaging your life. Nobody should have to go to extremes, such as seeking a non-mol*station order. The fact that someone is ill does not, in my books condone their actions (and I’m not saying that this is what you are suggesting). Whilst their actions might be a little more understandable, it doesn’t make them more forgivable. The problem is people often label people narcissistic or sociopath when actually there is other issues going on and as somebody has mentioned above other personality disorders are often misunderstood and people label them narcissistic. I have just locked it up and only 0.5% of the population would be considered a narcissist by a mental health professional. That is less than 350000 people in the UK so it is unlikely most of us will ever come into contact with someone who is a narcissist. " if anything that just says to me very few of them have a clinical reason and the rest just enjoy the power kick of being manipulative tw*ts ... even less reason to see their side and sympathise | |||
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"I think people often mix narcissistic traits with a clinically diagnosed narcissist. Not everyone with narcissistic traits are a narcissist. It's very much a term put out quite flippantly now. Also see a lot where some confuse psychopathic behaviour with narcissistic. Yes they do and I think that is why I have a concern that if somebody behaves in a way but has been described by people in this threat there is clearly something wrong with that person either diagnosed or not. While we do not have to put up with people's unacceptable behaviour I think we do have to bear in mind there is almost certainly mental health conditions at the bottom of this and be careful in our language. I agree with your sentiments above, but there’s also the point that if I was on the receiving end of such behaviour, I don’t see why other people’s problems should become mine. That’s not why we’re on this site. If someone on the site is causing you problems with there behaviour then you block them so I don't understand the correlation. It's not a sentiment it's the fact that a lot of what is being discussed and the language being used would be called out if it was being used to describe anybody else with a mental health condition, I just think it's something people need to be mindful of. The sentiment, as I interpreted it, was that individuals labelled as narcissistic or sociopath deserve the same respect for the fact that they are suffering from a mental illness as any other mental illnesses and so should be afforded the same level of understanding. I hope I haven’t misunderstood the point you were making. My point, however, is that, when someone’s actions are harmful, to put it crudely their shit should not be my shit. Blocking is all well and good, but the average sociopath is a little more determined than most and will try and get round that obstacle, be it knowing where you live, have your telephone number or other indirect methods. I am not speaking academically, I am speaking from real life experience. It takes a high degree of strength of character, determination and self-confidence to deal with someone intent on damaging your life. Nobody should have to go to extremes, such as seeking a non-mol*station order. The fact that someone is ill does not, in my books condone their actions (and I’m not saying that this is what you are suggesting). Whilst their actions might be a little more understandable, it doesn’t make them more forgivable. The problem is people often label people narcissistic or sociopath when actually there is other issues going on and as somebody has mentioned above other personality disorders are often misunderstood and people label them narcissistic. I have just locked it up and only 0.5% of the population would be considered a narcissist by a mental health professional. That is less than 350000 people in the UK so it is unlikely most of us will ever come into contact with someone who is a narcissist. if anything that just says to me very few of them have a clinical reason and the rest just enjoy the power kick of being manipulative tw*ts ... even less reason to see their side and sympathise " No it isn't I am saying and as others have said people often misunderstand what narcissism is. Of course you get people who are idiots but you also get people with other personality disorders that are completely treatable so no just because somebody isn't a narcissist doesn't mean they are deliberately out to hurt people either. | |||
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"Funny how everyone’s ex is the narc!  "Uhu........ | |||
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"Funny how everyone’s ex is the narc! "Funny? Whats funny about another person deliberately trying to destroy you? | |||
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"Funny how everyone’s ex is the narc! "That comment gets my goat, I ain't gonna lie. Coz that's the kind of thing they say to belittle and demean you, your experience and you're existence. Dismissive. I appreciate you may not believe it, but you're talking about people who've been mentally abused, physically abused in many cases. Let em have that safe space eh? | |||
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"Funny how everyone’s ex is the narc!
Funny?
Whats funny about another person deliberately trying to destroy you?"i guess they just mean nobody ever sees their own bad behaviour in a breakup - its very rare someone puts their hands up and says i was the dick there and people also rarely have good things to say about their exes (focussing in the bad helps us get over the good) there will be some on this thread that have really suffered at the hands of someone the way you describe and there will be people that were just in a less than perfect relationship with someone a bit selfish ... and they will all be saying they dated a narc | |||
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"I think people often mix narcissistic traits with a clinically diagnosed narcissist. Not everyone with narcissistic traits are a narcissist. It's very much a term put out quite flippantly now. Also see a lot where some confuse psychopathic behaviour with narcissistic. Yes they do and I think that is why I have a concern that if somebody behaves in a way but has been described by people in this threat there is clearly something wrong with that person either diagnosed or not. While we do not have to put up with people's unacceptable behaviour I think we do have to bear in mind there is almost certainly mental health conditions at the bottom of this and be careful in our language. I agree with your sentiments above, but there’s also the point that if I was on the receiving end of such behaviour, I don’t see why other people’s problems should become mine. That’s not why we’re on this site. If someone on the site is causing you problems with there behaviour then you block them so I don't understand the correlation. It's not a sentiment it's the fact that a lot of what is being discussed and the language being used would be called out if it was being used to describe anybody else with a mental health condition, I just think it's something people need to be mindful of. The sentiment, as I interpreted it, was that individuals labelled as narcissistic or sociopath deserve the same respect for the fact that they are suffering from a mental illness as any other mental illnesses and so should be afforded the same level of understanding. I hope I haven’t misunderstood the point you were making. My point, however, is that, when someone’s actions are harmful, to put it crudely their shit should not be my shit. Blocking is all well and good, but the average sociopath is a little more determined than most and will try and get round that obstacle, be it knowing where you live, have your telephone number or other indirect methods. I am not speaking academically, I am speaking from real life experience. It takes a high degree of strength of character, determination and self-confidence to deal with someone intent on damaging your life. Nobody should have to go to extremes, such as seeking a non-mol*station order. The fact that someone is ill does not, in my books condone their actions (and I’m not saying that this is what you are suggesting). Whilst their actions might be a little more understandable, it doesn’t make them more forgivable. The problem is people often label people narcissistic or sociopath when actually there is other issues going on and as somebody has mentioned above other personality disorders are often misunderstood and people label them narcissistic. I have just locked it up and only 0.5% of the population would be considered a narcissist by a mental health professional. That is less than 350000 people in the UK so it is unlikely most of us will ever come into contact with someone who is a narcissist. " A narcissist would be highly unlikely to seek any kind of mental health support Thats kinda the nature of the beast So, Gawd knows where that figure came from | |||
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"Funny how everyone’s ex is the narc!
That comment gets my goat, I ain't gonna lie. Coz that's the kind of thing they say to belittle and demean you, your experience and you're existence. Dismissive.
I appreciate you may not believe it, but you're talking about people who've been mentally abused, physically abused in many cases. Let em have that safe space eh?"I think comments like that are more from the overly used term, rather than it being to cause harm . Narcissist is becoming more popularly used and in most from minimal reason these days. Which is why I think terminally, as said by another, is important. | |||
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"Funny how everyone’s ex is the narc!
Funny?
Whats funny about another person deliberately trying to destroy you?
i guess they just mean nobody ever sees their own bad behaviour in a breakup - its very rare someone puts their hands up and says i was the dick there and people also rarely have good things to say about their exes (focussing in the bad helps us get over the good)
there will be some on this thread that have really suffered at the hands of someone the way you describe and there will be people that were just in a less than perfect relationship with someone a bit selfish ... and they will all be saying they dated a narc"Exactly! | |||
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"They don't want you to move on. They want you to be there everytime they decide to give you their precious attention " | |||
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"Funny how everyone’s ex is the narc!
That comment gets my goat, I ain't gonna lie. Coz that's the kind of thing they say to belittle and demean you, your experience and you're existence. Dismissive.
I appreciate you may not believe it, but you're talking about people who've been mentally abused, physically abused in many cases. Let em have that safe space eh?
I think comments like that are more from the overly used term, rather than it being to cause harm .
Narcissist is becoming more popularly used and in most from minimal reason these days. Which is why I think terminally, as said by another, is important.
"Cptsd trigger for me that was. I do understand your point. | |||
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"Funny how everyone’s ex is the narc!
Funny?
Whats funny about another person deliberately trying to destroy you?
i guess they just mean nobody ever sees their own bad behaviour in a breakup - its very rare someone puts their hands up and says i was the dick there and people also rarely have good things to say about their exes (focussing in the bad helps us get over the good)
there will be some on this thread that have really suffered at the hands of someone the way you describe and there will be people that were just in a less than perfect relationship with someone a bit selfish ... and they will all be saying they dated a narc"Some of my exs are wonderful people. I've also been the dick in a relationship before by dragging out the break up far longer than I should have. To be honest I think most break ups are either nobodies 'fault', just incompatibility or both people have a part to play in it. Abuse is of course a different kettle of fish. | |||
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"I'm supposed to be hoovering... or is it vvaaccuummiinngg ? " Vacuuming unless it’s made by Hoover: Registered trade mark | |||
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"Funny how everyone’s ex is the narc!
Funny?
Whats funny about another person deliberately trying to destroy you?
i guess they just mean nobody ever sees their own bad behaviour in a breakup - its very rare someone puts their hands up and says i was the dick there and people also rarely have good things to say about their exes (focussing in the bad helps us get over the good)
there will be some on this thread that have really suffered at the hands of someone the way you describe and there will be people that were just in a less than perfect relationship with someone a bit selfish ... and they will all be saying they dated a narc
Some of my exs are wonderful people. I've also been the dick in a relationship before by dragging out the break up far longer than I should have. To be honest I think most break ups are either nobodies 'fault', just incompatibility or both people have a part to play in it. Abuse is of course a different kettle of fish. "ive also dated some great people but when the breakups were happening and we were both hurting we become versions of ourselves never seen before , things get said or done and then you walk away from that phase thinking what a dick that person was ive also dated someone who mentally abused me and it continued on for years after we broke up no matter how i tried to remove them from my life , i don’t think he is a narcissist in the classic sense but he does display some of the behaviours and i don’t think he has a mental health problem either, i think he was the product of a very unhealthy environment and probably needs alot of therapy to work on himself , i also wasn’t a perfect person in that relationship but i didn’t deserve what i endured and it took me a long time to learn that i think alot of education has happened over the last decade to wake people up to domestic abuse , that its not just having the crap kicked out of you , awakening people to that behaviour so they know not to put up with it has at the same time led to the a loosening of the purity of the term narcissist so it gets used perhaps too much ... but i think its a small price to pay really | |||
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" My point, however, is that, when someone’s actions are harmful, to put it crudely their shit should not be my shit. Blocking is all well and good, but the average sociopath is a little more determined than most and will try and get round that obstacle, be it knowing where you live, have your telephone number or other indirect methods. I am not speaking academically, I am speaking from real life experience. It takes a high degree of strength of character, determination and self-confidence to deal with someone intent on damaging your life. Nobody should have to go to extremes, such as seeking a non-mol*station order. The fact that someone is ill does not, in my books condone their actions (and I’m not saying that this is what you are suggesting). Whilst their actions might be a little more understandable, it doesn’t make them more forgivable. " | |||
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"Funny how everyone’s ex is the narc!
Funny?
Whats funny about another person deliberately trying to destroy you?
i guess they just mean nobody ever sees their own bad behaviour in a breakup - its very rare someone puts their hands up and says i was the dick there and people also rarely have good things to say about their exes (focussing in the bad helps us get over the good)
there will be some on this thread that have really suffered at the hands of someone the way you describe and there will be people that were just in a less than perfect relationship with someone a bit selfish ... and they will all be saying they dated a narc"Not sure how accurate this is. I’ve heard loads of people take their shame of the blame for breakups as well as fairly civilised splits. I don’t think I’ve heard the term narcissist used much at all. Having read all this thread, which is very interesting and thoughtful, my impression is that the people using that term have had unusually awful experiences. I thought the flippant comment about everything thinking their ex was a ‘narc’ was badly judged and has now thankfully been deleted. | |||
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"Funny how everyone’s ex is the narc!
Funny?
Whats funny about another person deliberately trying to destroy you?
i guess they just mean nobody ever sees their own bad behaviour in a breakup - its very rare someone puts their hands up and says i was the dick there and people also rarely have good things to say about their exes (focussing in the bad helps us get over the good)
there will be some on this thread that have really suffered at the hands of someone the way you describe and there will be people that were just in a less than perfect relationship with someone a bit selfish ... and they will all be saying they dated a narc
Some of my exs are wonderful people. I've also been the dick in a relationship before by dragging out the break up far longer than I should have. To be honest I think most break ups are either nobodies 'fault', just incompatibility or both people have a part to play in it. Abuse is of course a different kettle of fish.
ive also dated some great people but when the breakups were happening and we were both hurting we become versions of ourselves never seen before , things get said or done and then you walk away from that phase thinking what a dick that person was
ive also dated someone who mentally abused me and it continued on for years after we broke up no matter how i tried to remove them from my life , i don’t think he is a narcissist in the classic sense but he does display some of the behaviours and i don’t think he has a mental health problem either, i think he was the product of a very unhealthy environment and probably needs alot of therapy to work on himself , i also wasn’t a perfect person in that relationship but i didn’t deserve what i endured and it took me a long time to learn that
i think alot of education has happened over the last decade to wake people up to domestic abuse , that its not just having the crap kicked out of you , awakening people to that behaviour so they know not to put up with it has at the same time led to the a loosening of the purity of the term narcissist so it gets used perhaps too much ... but i think its a small price to pay really"People can display narcissistic behaviour without having Narcissistic Personality Disorder just as a person can display obsessive behaviour without having Obsessive Compulsive Disorder or a person can be sad without having Depression. We are all capable of such behaviour without it necessarily being pathological. At the end of the day, only a psychiatrist can say if a person does or does not have a particular disorder and even then it takes a long time and one psychiatrist can have a different opinion to the next. Either way, most people in this thread don't seem to be trying to diagnose conditions, just describing behaviour. Even if they are trying to, I just see one armchair psychologist who knew a person being argued against by another armchair psychologist who didn't and in the grand scheme of things, I'm not sure why any of it really matters anyway even if they are wrong. People like to theorize about why other people behave the way they do, it's part of what makes us human. | |||
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"Funny how everyone’s ex is the narc!
Funny?
Whats funny about another person deliberately trying to destroy you?
i guess they just mean nobody ever sees their own bad behaviour in a breakup - its very rare someone puts their hands up and says i was the dick there and people also rarely have good things to say about their exes (focussing in the bad helps us get over the good)
there will be some on this thread that have really suffered at the hands of someone the way you describe and there will be people that were just in a less than perfect relationship with someone a bit selfish ... and they will all be saying they dated a narc
Some of my exs are wonderful people. I've also been the dick in a relationship before by dragging out the break up far longer than I should have. To be honest I think most break ups are either nobodies 'fault', just incompatibility or both people have a part to play in it. Abuse is of course a different kettle of fish.
ive also dated some great people but when the breakups were happening and we were both hurting we become versions of ourselves never seen before , things get said or done and then you walk away from that phase thinking what a dick that person was
ive also dated someone who mentally abused me and it continued on for years after we broke up no matter how i tried to remove them from my life , i don’t think he is a narcissist in the classic sense but he does display some of the behaviours and i don’t think he has a mental health problem either, i think he was the product of a very unhealthy environment and probably needs alot of therapy to work on himself , i also wasn’t a perfect person in that relationship but i didn’t deserve what i endured and it took me a long time to learn that
i think alot of education has happened over the last decade to wake people up to domestic abuse , that its not just having the crap kicked out of you , awakening people to that behaviour so they know not to put up with it has at the same time led to the a loosening of the purity of the term narcissist so it gets used perhaps too much ... but i think its a small price to pay really"And alot of education is still needed! It would be helpful of course if people understood the nature of narcissistic abuse, before they started suggesting that 'compassion' in survivors wording, should be used If anyone would like to understand what its REALLY like. In real life. Not just in text books. Do feel free to contact me I'll tell you my story, then you can tell me all about compassion and making sure I word things correctly | |||
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"I think people often mix narcissistic traits with a clinically diagnosed narcissist. Not everyone with narcissistic traits are a narcissist. It's very much a term put out quite flippantly now. Also see a lot where some confuse psychopathic behaviour with narcissistic. Yes they do and I think that is why I have a concern that if somebody behaves in a way but has been described by people in this threat there is clearly something wrong with that person either diagnosed or not. While we do not have to put up with people's unacceptable behaviour I think we do have to bear in mind there is almost certainly mental health conditions at the bottom of this and be careful in our language. I agree with your sentiments above, but there’s also the point that if I was on the receiving end of such behaviour, I don’t see why other people’s problems should become mine. That’s not why we’re on this site. If someone on the site is causing you problems with there behaviour then you block them so I don't understand the correlation. It's not a sentiment it's the fact that a lot of what is being discussed and the language being used would be called out if it was being used to describe anybody else with a mental health condition, I just think it's something people need to be mindful of. The sentiment, as I interpreted it, was that individuals labelled as narcissistic or sociopath deserve the same respect for the fact that they are suffering from a mental illness as any other mental illnesses and so should be afforded the same level of understanding. I hope I haven’t misunderstood the point you were making. My point, however, is that, when someone’s actions are harmful, to put it crudely their shit should not be my shit. Blocking is all well and good, but the average sociopath is a little more determined than most and will try and get round that obstacle, be it knowing where you live, have your telephone number or other indirect methods. I am not speaking academically, I am speaking from real life experience. It takes a high degree of strength of character, determination and self-confidence to deal with someone intent on damaging your life. Nobody should have to go to extremes, such as seeking a non-mol*station order. The fact that someone is ill does not, in my books condone their actions (and I’m not saying that this is what you are suggesting). Whilst their actions might be a little more understandable, it doesn’t make them more forgivable. " Non mol's don't work. | |||
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"I think people often mix narcissistic traits with a clinically diagnosed narcissist. Not everyone with narcissistic traits are a narcissist. It's very much a term put out quite flippantly now. Also see a lot where some confuse psychopathic behaviour with narcissistic. Yes they do and I think that is why I have a concern that if somebody behaves in a way but has been described by people in this threat there is clearly something wrong with that person either diagnosed or not. While we do not have to put up with people's unacceptable behaviour I think we do have to bear in mind there is almost certainly mental health conditions at the bottom of this and be careful in our language. I agree with your sentiments above, but there’s also the point that if I was on the receiving end of such behaviour, I don’t see why other people’s problems should become mine. That’s not why we’re on this site. If someone on the site is causing you problems with there behaviour then you block them so I don't understand the correlation. It's not a sentiment it's the fact that a lot of what is being discussed and the language being used would be called out if it was being used to describe anybody else with a mental health condition, I just think it's something people need to be mindful of. The sentiment, as I interpreted it, was that individuals labelled as narcissistic or sociopath deserve the same respect for the fact that they are suffering from a mental illness as any other mental illnesses and so should be afforded the same level of understanding. I hope I haven’t misunderstood the point you were making. My point, however, is that, when someone’s actions are harmful, to put it crudely their shit should not be my shit. Blocking is all well and good, but the average sociopath is a little more determined than most and will try and get round that obstacle, be it knowing where you live, have your telephone number or other indirect methods. I am not speaking academically, I am speaking from real life experience. It takes a high degree of strength of character, determination and self-confidence to deal with someone intent on damaging your life. Nobody should have to go to extremes, such as seeking a non-mol*station order. The fact that someone is ill does not, in my books condone their actions (and I’m not saying that this is what you are suggesting). Whilst their actions might be a little more understandable, it doesn’t make them more forgivable. Non mol's don't work." They sometimes don’t, but I don’t think we can generalise. I’m sure many don’t, which is very unfortunate to say the least. It kind of touches on the general point coming through (to me anyway) on this thread, which is abusive behaviour, irrespective of any underlying medical condition, should not be tolerated. It’s illegal. | |||
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"I was married to a narc and dated one a few years back. You’d think I’d learn but they’re soooo charming at the beginning aren’t they. I think of it like being in a cult of two people: one the narc and one is the supply. When I see or speak to either of them, it’s really hard not to fall back into the same patterns as they condition and manipulate you into whatever it is that feeds them. That’s why I imagine they find it hard to let go. " This resonates with me a lot and I love the way you worded it. | |||
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"They don't want you to move on. They want you to be there everytime they decide to give you their precious attention " | |||
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"You move on then come realise they haven't, but why do they not move on? What is it in their nature that stops them? they need validation, if you give them a response, if good or bad it it's a win in their eyes and they get off on it, you to cut them off completely if it's possible and hopefully with time they should realise you hot their number" So true. But the time factor seems to be an issue. | |||
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"what others have quite rightly already expressed, is mental health problem or not if they are on the receiving end of the negative behaviour they are under no moral obligation to try help that person the world is full of people going round hurting others, some as a result of their own pain, or their upbringing, some due to mental health problems and some due to just being arseholes none of us have a responsibility to try heal others , its not our job to go around fixing everyone, particularly when it potentially comes at our own detriment - our number one job is to keep ourselves happy and healthy it doesn’t really matter if someone’s narcissistic behaviours are as a result of truly being a narcissist, having a different mental disorder or just being an arsehole - you owe them nothing and owe it to yourself to get out of that toxic situation fit your own oxygen mask first and all that " | |||
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"Probably because it damages the opinion they hold for themselves. It threatens how they view themselves to encounter someone who views them as disposable and some aspect of their looks, personality isnt perfect enough or at least doesn’t match their assessment. I don’t think it’s control, it’s more a reflection of themselves and having to reanalyse and refine! " I think this is spot on | |||
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"Probably because it damages the opinion they hold for themselves. It threatens how they view themselves to encounter someone who views them as disposable and some aspect of their looks, personality isnt perfect enough or at least doesn’t match their assessment. I don’t think it’s control, it’s more a reflection of themselves and having to reanalyse and refine! " | |||
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"I think a lot of people use the term and don’t really know what it means. They are misusing the term just to describe bad people. There are some good descriptions of narcissism and it’s true meaning on this thread, and a lot of rubbish." I find it fascinating that descriptions of suffering at the hands of another are what gets so much scrutiny. Of all the ill informed rubbish that gets spouted throughout the forum, it's "I've been hurt" that attracts such demands for scientific precision. Maybe we should accept that there are lay, informal definitions of many terms, and people are giving voice to their suffering? People have a right to be heard. It does them good. And it helps root out these behaviours. Hopefully saving others in the future. | |||
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