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If Britain was like France..
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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...and declared itself a Republic, what would we lose, and what would we gain?
(this thread is in part a request to leave the Royal Jubliee appreciation thread as an appreciation thread).
I've just been reading an interesting article on the coverage of the Jubilee on French tv, and it really surprised me to discover that 3.6m French people watched a 3-hour live broadcast of the Sunday afternoon proceedings. The article went on to say that French people are fascinated by the British Monarchy and they _iew the Queen as a reassuring constant in a changing world. The article also said that it seems the French have never recovered from chopping the heads off their own royal family and that they don't know much about the Queen but they like the pomp and circumstance and the grandeur of the institution.
The article was written with the authoir's tongue firmly in his cheek but the sentiment was there.
What would we lose if we became a Republic (like France)?
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By *teborahCouple
over a year ago
warrington |
If Britain was like France then maybe we would have better weather to do nice things on bank holidays as we would be able to see that big shiney hot orange ball in the sky  by the way after watching those brave singers on the barge on Saturday do they still have a hose ban down there?  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"If Britain was like France then maybe we would have better weather to do nice things on bank holidays as we would be able to see that big shiney hot orange ball in the sky by the way after watching those brave singers on the barge on Saturday do they still have a hose ban down there? "
don't matter ... water was drawn from the river & squirted straight back in |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Having lived and worked in France for 15 years there are a number of things I miss about the structure of their society and I do wish we had a little of what they have... But they do not have the tradition that we have... Nor are they truly multicultural in spirit...
For all their jokes, they admire the British society... Which I believe is why they tend to be so strongly Nationalist about their own country. |
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Loss ,a link back to who we are ,our values ,our history ,and money as studies show it costs a lot more to have "el presidente" than a monarchy.
Gain: A written bill of rights where we are no longer subjects but citizens with enshrined documented rights.
I have changed over the years from when i was a young kid with inequality on my mind and am now very pro royal ,you mess with the fine balance between state and royalty at your peril it is unique. |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"I have a confession to make. My surname is French and we go all the way back to Normandy. Sorry. 
Wishy la pompadour does have a ring to it  "
La Pompadour was a woman ya narna! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
Forum Mod |
"I have a confession to make. My surname is French and we go all the way back to Normandy. Sorry.
Wishy la pompadour does have a ring to it
La Pompadour was a woman ya narna! "
Hahaha it just rolled off my tongue |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"I have a confession to make. My surname is French and we go all the way back to Normandy. Sorry.
Wishy French??? Do you know Dawn?"
Nooo. Not French, French! |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"I have a confession to make. My surname is French and we go all the way back to Normandy. Sorry.
Wishy la pompadour does have a ring to it
La Pompadour was a woman ya narna!
Hahaha it just rolled off my tongue "
I'd like to see that.   |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"I have a confession to make. My surname is French and we go all the way back to Normandy. Sorry.
Wishy Le Pew??????  "
Aw mon cherie, I make ze luuurve too you! (kisses arm from wrist to shoulder) *mwah* *mwah* *mwah* *mwah* *mwah* *mwah* (how long's ya fookin arm?) *mwah* *mwah* *mwah* *mwah* |
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you would gain an amazing sense of respect from other nations...you would become a nation of people not subjects. you would choose and debate who heads the state. every chid born in britain will then be born with the oppurtunity of heading his or own country it will no longer be a birthrite to those born of priviledge, the head of state woud no longer be dictated by lineage but choosen by the people, |
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"you would gain an amazing sense of respect from other nations...you would become a nation of people not subjects. you would choose and debate who heads the state. every chid born in britain will then be born with the oppurtunity of heading his or own country it will no longer be a birthrite to those born of priviledge, the head of state woud no longer be dictated by lineage but choosen by the
people,"
doubt that very much indeed, just which country would be more respecting of the UK?
Quite a few already are i would imagine..
never _iewed myself as being subject to anyone, even when serving the Crown and the Community for over 36 years..
we already 'choose' the party which chooses the PM, look at the recent uptake on elected Mayors..
the point about every child does not allow for differences in society, earnings and background etc will always give many an advantage..
you really think someone like cameron or blair could do a better job?
at the end of the day what we have even with its faults works for us..
and if it aint broke then dont try and fix it.. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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If we dont have a monarch as head of state then i would rather not have a head of state.
I don't see why we should elevate one person by election to preside over the country, it would cost vast sums, divide opinion even more than politics does already.
If the whole point was just to act a figure head then we have one of those already, if we start to give them executive powers then we end up heading in the direction of the USA. We already elect representatives to govern the country they are our heads of state. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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people on a mass country wide strike.
smashing up things you worked hard for and moaning about losing pensions,jobs and workers rights.
sounds like the french stand up for themselves and fight against poor government.
do we? |
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"Loss ,a link back to who we are ,our values ,our history ,and money as studies show it costs a lot more to have "el presidente" than a monarchy.
Gain: A written bill of rights where we are no longer subjects but citizens with enshrined documented rights.
I have changed over the years from when i was a young kid with inequality on my mind and am now very pro royal ,you mess with the fine balance between state and royalty at your peril it is unique."
The last time I looked my passport said I was a Citizen don't know when it changed tho |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"If we dont have a monarch as head of state then i would rather not have a head of state.
"
We tried that once... No sooner had we taken Charles 1st head... Than we tried to make the Lord Protector into the new monarch...;-) |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Don't know, nor want to find out what it would be like to have a president instead of a monarchy, didn't seem to make the Libians very happy though 
Don't forget that the Queen is also the head of the commonwealth giving us a strong and mostly friendly relationship with 54 countries across the globe... can any president claim that? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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if you dont like the way things are done in this country there are airports and ferry ports we even have a high speed rail link so if you dont like it chose one and leave |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"If we dont have a monarch as head of state then i would rather not have a head of state.
We tried that once... No sooner had we taken Charles 1st head... Than we tried to make the Lord Protector into the new monarch...;-)"
No the lord protector was the head of state that's my point. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Wonder if all those with negative comment shud be sent to the tower for treason ? so many many people from all over the world wanna come here to live in the UK often breaking law to do it....so we must have it pretty good here in comparison to others....and the queens all part of who we are and what we represent to the world.....other wud love to have what we have inc the french and americans too..... God save the queen ! rest off ya hung drawn n quartered I say xxx |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"rest off ya hung drawn n quartered I say xxx"
Don't you know this is a time of cutbacks! hung drawn and HALVED is more than enough
As you say, long live the Queen. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"If we dont have a monarch as head of state then i would rather not have a head of state.
We tried that once... No sooner had we taken Charles 1st head... Than we tried to make the Lord Protector into the new monarch...;-)
No the lord protector was the head of state that's my point."
Cromwell was General of the armies...
The parliament was head of state... Until they lined their own pockets and refused to hold elections...
Cromwell disbanded parliament and held power for a short while only until a new parliament could be sworn in...
In the interim various lords tried to appoint him as monarch...
I was agreeing with your post... With a codicil directed at todays republicans..;-) |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"if you dont like the way things are done in this country there are airports and ferry ports we even have a high speed rail link so if you dont like it chose one and leave"
i'll second that  |
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By *phroditeWoman
over a year ago
(She/ her) in Sensualityland |
I do like France and I have great friends there; having said that their sense of national identity is sometimes accompanied with what appears to other nations as a bit arrogant, a trait that the British do not have in my experience. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"If we dont have a monarch as head of state then i would rather not have a head of state.
We tried that once... No sooner had we taken Charles 1st head... Than we tried to make the Lord Protector into the new monarch...;-)
No the lord protector was the head of state that's my point.
Cromwell was General of the armies...
The parliament was head of state... Until they lined their own pockets and refused to hold elections...
Cromwell disbanded parliament and held power for a short while only until a new parliament could be sworn in...
In the interim various lords tried to appoint him as monarch...
I was agreeing with your post... With a codicil directed at todays republicans..;-)"
As Christopher Hill points out in his various books about the English Revolution, the Levellers, the Diggers, The Seekers and the Ranters were not only opposed to Cromwell, or anyone else becoming king, but urged what we would call a socialist republic long before anyone else did. They failed because they were too disunited.
England will become a republic whether or not the snivelling royalist lackeys like it. No matter what the propaganda in the media, those like myself who are old enough to remember the Silver Jubilee of 77 when there were flags and bunting and street parties everywhere but saw very little for the Golden Jubilee and even less for the Diamond Jubilee can see the signs. The people as a whole are less and less interested in the royal family because they are an anachronism in the 21st century, just like the church, and as a result, like the church, they will just fade into history.
And a recent survey shows that regardless of whether or not they are royalists, 70% of the population believe that Britain will be a republic within 50 years.
My only regret is that I probably won't be around to see it.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"If we dont have a monarch as head of state then i would rather not have a head of state.
We tried that once... No sooner had we taken Charles 1st head... Than we tried to make the Lord Protector into the new monarch...;-)
No the lord protector was the head of state that's my point.
Cromwell was General of the armies...
The parliament was head of state... Until they lined their own pockets and refused to hold elections...
Cromwell disbanded parliament and held power for a short while only until a new parliament could be sworn in...
In the interim various lords tried to appoint him as monarch...
I was agreeing with your post... With a codicil directed at todays republicans..;-)"
When parliament swore him in as lord protector they swore him in as head of state, the aim of parliament at the start of the war was never to create a republic it just ended that way because Charles wouldn't stop trying to start rebellions by dissatisfied groups among the home nations. After they lopped his head off they created a constitutional mess for themselves and they filled it with a lord protector, a monarch in all but name. |
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By *acreadCouple
over a year ago
central scotland |
"France..A great country spoilt only by it's inhabitants"
Why is this an acceptable statement and if the post had said eg Pakistan a great country only spoilt by its inhabitants ok?.
One would be defined as racist and it seems one wouldnt. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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To stick up for the French, having "lived" here for over 20 years. On the vote for the 2012 Olympics all the major TV channels were in our local village, being a Very British village, to film the Bits disappointment when Paris won.
After the bombings in London the following day L'Equipe, the National sports newspaper had a totally Black front page with the writing "WE ARE ALL BEHIND LONDON" on it
Can you imagine the Sun or any other UK paper doing that? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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" When parliament swore him in as lord protector they swore him in as head of state, the aim of parliament at the start of the war was never to create a republic it just ended that way because Charles wouldn't stop trying to start rebellions by dissatisfied groups among the home nations. After they lopped his head off they created a constitutional mess for themselves and they filled it with a lord protector, a monarch in all but name."
True... And Cromwell accepted the post as a temporary stop gap until the state could be returned to a democratically elected republican power....
Britain, ever in need of a constitutional head, tried to offer him the permanent position. Having just taken the head of one sovereign, he refused....
Shortly after the monarchy was restored...
In all, I think we can agree to agree...;-) |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"France..A great country spoilt only by it's inhabitants
Why is this an acceptable statement and if the post had said eg Pakistan a great country only spoilt by its inhabitants ok?.
One would be defined as racist and it seems one wouldnt."
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"If we dont have a monarch as head of state then i would rather not have a head of state.
We tried that once... No sooner had we taken Charles 1st head... Than we tried to make the Lord Protector into the new monarch...;-)
No the lord protector was the head of state that's my point.
Cromwell was General of the armies...
The parliament was head of state... Until they lined their own pockets and refused to hold elections...
Cromwell disbanded parliament and held power for a short while only until a new parliament could be sworn in...
In the interim various lords tried to appoint him as monarch...
I was agreeing with your post... With a codicil directed at todays republicans..;-)
When parliament swore him in as lord protector they swore him in as head of state, the aim of parliament at the start of the war was never to create a republic it just ended that way because Charles wouldn't stop trying to start rebellions by dissatisfied groups among the home nations. After they lopped his head off they created a constitutional mess for themselves and they filled it with a lord protector, a monarch in all but name."
Cromwell is one of a handful people to have been executed posthumously.
His corpse was dug up in 1660 by the Royalists on their return to power and it was hanged in chains at Tyburn. Finally, his disinterred body was thrown into a pit, while his severed head was displayed on a pole outside Westminster Hall until 1685.
His head was finally interred on 25 March 1960, in a secret location near the antechapel of Sidney Sussex College, preserved in the oak box in which it had kept the head since 1815. The box was placed into an airtight container and buried with only a few witnesses, including members of the Wilkinson family who had kept the head since 1815 and representatives of the college. The secret burial was not announced until October 1962.
Cromwell is also known to have conducted what would be deemed genocidal campaigns in Ireland and he is not remembered well in Ireland at all, yet he is continually voted among the Top 10 Britons of all time. |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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" When parliament swore him in as lord protector they swore him in as head of state, the aim of parliament at the start of the war was never to create a republic it just ended that way because Charles wouldn't stop trying to start rebellions by dissatisfied groups among the home nations. After they lopped his head off they created a constitutional mess for themselves and they filled it with a lord protector, a monarch in all but name.
True... And Cromwell accepted the post as a temporary stop gap until the state could be returned to a democratically elected republican power....
Britain, ever in need of a constitutional head, tried to offer him the permanent position. Having just taken the head of one sovereign, he refused....
Shortly after the monarchy was restored...
In all, I think we can agree to agree...;-)"
Cromwell's Commonwealth Government collapsed totally after his death in 1658 and James II was invited back to the throne of England, Scotland, Wales & Ireland in 1660. It was this act that defined the monarchy and the limits of it's power from that point on. A UK monarch can only sit as head of state by the will of the people. |
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france isnt the only repubic in the world...and comparing engish republicanism to cromwell is a poor example. cromwell undertook a genocidal campaign and took his brand of republicanism to ireland and massacred any one loyal to the crown. in drogheda today is is treated with distain...i live near village once visted by cromwell...but alas the village is gone. but genocidal tendencies isnt unique to cromwell...britain can boast its own famine queen, who as head of the most powerful empire at the time say over 2million of her subjects starve to death and displace another 2 million leaving a scar on a national physce for years
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"I have a confession to make. My surname is French and we go all the way back to Normandy. Sorry.
Wishy la pompadour does have a ring to it "
not french norwegan the normans were settled vikings so your ancesters were from france but not french lol |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"I have a confession to make. My surname is French and we go all the way back to Normandy. Sorry.
Wishy la pompadour does have a ring to it
not french norwegan the normans were settled vikings so your ancesters were from france but not french lol "
The Vikings conquered as far down as Italy, hence why you see the occasional blonde one.  |
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"Don't know, nor want to find out what it would be like to have a president instead of a monarchy, didn't seem to make the Libians very happy though
Don't forget that the Queen is also the head of the commonwealth giving us a strong and mostly friendly relationship with 54 countries across the globe... can any president claim that? "
barrak obama is head of 50 states and he was elected..plus i know of some reppublics that have left the commonwealth and are happy to have become constitutional republics] |
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"If we dont have a monarch as head of state then i would rather not have a head of state.
We tried that once... No sooner had we taken Charles 1st head... Than we tried to make the Lord Protector into the new monarch...;-)
No the lord protector was the head of state that's my point.
Cromwell was General of the armies...
The parliament was head of state... Until they lined their own pockets and refused to hold elections...
Cromwell disbanded parliament and held power for a short while only until a new parliament could be sworn in...
In the interim various lords tried to appoint him as monarch...
I was agreeing with your post... With a codicil directed at todays republicans..;-)
As Christopher Hill points out in his various books about the English Revolution, the Levellers, the Diggers, The Seekers and the Ranters were not only opposed to Cromwell, or anyone else becoming king, but urged what we would call a socialist republic long before anyone else did. They failed because they were too disunited.
England will become a republic whether or not the snivelling royalist lackeys like it. No matter what the propaganda in the media, those like myself who are old enough to remember the Silver Jubilee of 77 when there were flags and bunting and street parties everywhere but saw very little for the Golden Jubilee and even less for the Diamond Jubilee can see the signs. The people as a whole are less and less interested in the royal family because they are an anachronism in the 21st century, just like the church, and as a result, like the church, they will just fade into history.
And a recent survey shows that regardless of whether or not they are royalists, 70% of the population believe that Britain will be a republic within 50 years.
My only regret is that I probably won't be around to see it.
"
One of my greatest heroes is John Lilburne - the only man tried for treason by both sides during the Civil Wars!
A man who's treatise "An Agreement Of The People" was the basis of, and the forerunner to the US Constitution and held steadfast to his beliefs and took up arms to uphold them, yet he is almost unknown amongst us..
"We were before ruled by King, Lords and Commons, now by a General, a Court Martial and House of Commons. And we pray you what is the difference?"
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"England will become a republic whether or not the snivelling royalist lackeys like it. No matter what the propaganda in the media, those like myself who are old enough to remember the Silver Jubilee of 77 when there were flags and bunting and street parties everywhere but saw very little for the Golden Jubilee and even less for the Diamond Jubilee can see the signs. The people as a whole are less and less interested in the royal family because they are an anachronism in the 21st century, just like the church, and as a result, like the church, they will just fade into history.
And a recent survey shows that regardless of whether or not they are royalists, 70% of the population believe that Britain will be a republic within 50 years.
My only regret is that I probably won't be around to see it.
"
You couldn't be more wrong. Prince William's marriage just last year proved how popular the Royals are and you're talking about 50 years time when William will be King (if he lives as long as his forebears), and this country will never depose him.
As for less Jubliee parties this year - you can blame The Health & Safety Executive for that as people just couldn't be bothered with the hassle of applying for a licence to put bunting up, having a trained first-aider on hand at every party, applying for licences to close roads, etc etc etc..
I remember '77 too, and none of that stuff was required. All our dad's had to do was get a few cones and block off the road, stick a few flags up and away we went. Bloody good day it was too. I was 12. |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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" barrak obama is head of 50 states and he was elected..plus i know of some reppublics that have left the commonwealth and are happy to have become constitutional republics]"
49 if California has it's way. |
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" barrak obama is head of 50 states and he was elected..plus i know of some reppublics that have left the commonwealth and are happy to have become constitutional republics]
49 if California has it's way."
51 if george bush had his way.. |
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" barrak obama is head of 50 states and he was elected..plus i know of some reppublics that have left the commonwealth and are happy to have become constitutional republics]
49 if California has it's way."
51 if george bush had his way.. |
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