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Trans boxer in Olympics
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"The boxer that won today (Haven't seen it ) was born as female but with higher than normal testosterone according to The IOC Is that not correct " That is correct. | |||
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"No I'm not disgusted. I get disgusted by things which are in my opinion actually disgusting, like the Israeli flag bearer being allowed to complete while he has videos of him signing bombs that are being dropped on children on his insta. I do however thing trans athletes in sport is a very delicate and complicated matter. And someone's you do have to look at the biological advantages someone has received. This to me isn't a gender identity issues rather than a sporting fairness one. I also don't think it has a simplistic answer because I'd like trans athletes to have a way of competing " We have a very simple answer. Don't allow men to compete against women. It's disgusting that we have to watch women who have dedicated their whole lives to a sport, to have it torn away by a man pretending to be a woman. I've 2 kids both box. A girl & A boy, 4 yrs of an age gap, girl been older. The speed and power difference is noticeably even at a young age. So when you see it been supported at the Olympics, it is very worrying for women's sports as a whole. A new trans category needs to be set up | |||
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"No I'm not disgusted. I get disgusted by things which are in my opinion actually disgusting, like the Israeli flag bearer being allowed to complete while he has videos of him signing bombs that are being dropped on children on his insta. I do however thing trans athletes in sport is a very delicate and complicated matter. And someone's you do have to look at the biological advantages someone has received. This to me isn't a gender identity issues rather than a sporting fairness one. I also don't think it has a simplistic answer because I'd like trans athletes to have a way of competing We have a very simple answer. Don't allow men to compete against women. It's disgusting that we have to watch women who have dedicated their whole lives to a sport, to have it torn away by a man pretending to be a woman. I've 2 kids both box. A girl & A boy, 4 yrs of an age gap, girl been older. The speed and power difference is noticeably even at a young age. So when you see it been supported at the Olympics, it is very worrying for women's sports as a whole. A new trans category needs to be set up" Well as we both have proven by not reading enough about this example.. It isn't always that simple. And I'd suggest there are far great issues and obstacles in women's sport than the tiny % of trans athletes who compete. Your whole attitude would actually make more supportive of just lumping them all in together tbh.. But rationale there must be some restrictions or solutions someone smarter than me will come up with | |||
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"Im more disguested that people are still so ignorant that they just cant refer to a trans female as such!! The amount of lads ive blocked today all saying the same shite on the socials but behind closed doors are very happy to be asking me for nudes and videos!! Theres a Dutch peado taking part wheres your outrage!! " 👍 | |||
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" Theres a Dutch peado taking part wheres your outrage!! " ☝️ | |||
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"The boxer that won today (Haven't seen it ) was born as female but with higher than normal testosterone according to The IOC Is that not correct " Same boxer was stripped after the world champions last year for failing the gender fluid test. The medals went to the women that were beat. The amount of testosterone in the body was level par with a man. This means your going into a ring with a massive advantage. Reflexes, punching power is a massive difference in a ring between male and female fighter. We wouldn't let a woman boxer take steroids and fight a natural boxer as we no the advantages they would carry going into a ring. Hence the testing. So my problem is, that they were already stripped and kicked out of the world championship last year, how the hell were they left box's in the Olympics. | |||
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"Im more disguested that people are still so ignorant that they just cant refer to a trans female as such!! The amount of lads ive blocked today all saying the same shite on the socials but behind closed doors are very happy to be asking me for nudes and videos!! Theres a Dutch peado taking part wheres your outrage!! " He shouldn't be alive. He should have been hung from a tree..only cure for pedophilia. | |||
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"Is this khlief,competing since 2017/2018 in womens boxing...also the boxer has been beaten by Amy broadhurst and kellie harrington Harrington won the quarter final in 2020 Broadhurst won a final in 2022 or around that " 100% correct. Was stripped last year at the world champions. They should just create a new category. It's simple..let's trans athletes compete against each other. | |||
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"Is this khlief,competing since 2017/2018 in womens boxing...also the boxer has been beaten by Amy broadhurst and kellie harrington Harrington won the quarter final in 2020 Broadhurst won a final in 2022 or around that 100% correct. Was stripped last year at the world champions. They should just create a new category. It's simple..let's trans athletes compete against each other. " You do realise she is a woman yes? | |||
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"To my understanding, Khelif is not biologically a man. He is one of the rarest cases where a baby born whit not clearly identifiable male or female organs. But her body has benefited from the testosterone level that is usually produced by men that reflect on muscles growth and power, strength a woman can’t achieve. Maybe the right thing to do on such situations should have been to put a limit on the testosterone level, over that level is doping, doesn’t matter if natural doping. Also I think make sense to enforce something like this in sports where power and strength can make a significant difference." This is correct , and the same for the Taiwanese boxer under similar scrutiny , both seen to have above average testosterone levels for women when tested at the World Championships..also , neither are confirmed as biological males or trans , that's just speculation | |||
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"Anyone else disgusted by a male beating a woman in women's boxing. It's an absolute joke that it was allowed to happen. This crazy shit with letting men compete in women's sports needs to stop. We ain't equal (men & women) when it comes to muscle mass, bone density. " There are things I find much less palatable. Things like the language you use when you speak about trans people. Truly distasteful. | |||
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"Are you actually referring to Imane Khelif in the opening post?" I'm confused too because I was under the impression that the other boxer chose not to continue the fight 🤷♀️ | |||
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"Are you actually referring to Imane Khelif in the opening post? I'm confused too because I was under the impression that the other boxer chose not to continue the fight 🤷♀️" For fear of being beaten to a pulp by a biological man. | |||
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"The boxer that won today (Haven't seen it ) was born as female but with higher than normal testosterone according to The IOC Is that not correct Same boxer was stripped after the world champions last year for failing the gender fluid test. The medals went to the women that were beat. The amount of testosterone in the body was level par with a man. This means your going into a ring with a massive advantage. Reflexes, punching power is a massive difference in a ring between male and female fighter. We wouldn't let a woman boxer take steroids and fight a natural boxer as we no the advantages they would carry going into a ring. Hence the testing. So my problem is, that they were already stripped and kicked out of the world championship last year, how the hell were they left box's in the Olympics." What's a gender fluid test? | |||
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"It is disgraceful. The Olympics just endorsed a biological man punching a biological woman in the face and breaking her nose and televising it as sport. In a world where we have a huge problem with male violence against women, this should not be put on TV as an example of sportsmanship. The Olympics should risk assess each sport and has a duty of care to the welfare of all athletes. Trans women should fight other trans women. No biological women or girls should be expected to compete with trans women. Why would any women engage in sport if it is impossible to win and you face the risk of extreme injury because your opponent has a biological advantage that no amount of training will level up. I don't think there is any evidence the Algerian boxer was born female. I think the passport says Female, but other than that there has been no effort to transition. It's really sad that the Italien woman was assaulted today and wasn't protected by the Olympics governing body. It is a disgrace, and anyone not disgusted by it, needs to reassess their values. " 100% I'm using this as an example. We really need to create a new category. Women and men compete in different categories because of the advantages men have over women in the physical aspect. All ya got to do is look at the records in running, swimming, weightlifting, cycling and you can see a massive difference. Now this goes up a notch when it comes to contact sports. Plenty examples out there to prove this. | |||
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"The boxer that won today (Haven't seen it ) was born as female but with higher than normal testosterone according to The IOC Is that not correct Same boxer was stripped after the world champions last year for failing the gender fluid test. The medals went to the women that were beat. The amount of testosterone in the body was level par with a man. This means your going into a ring with a massive advantage. Reflexes, punching power is a massive difference in a ring between male and female fighter. We wouldn't let a woman boxer take steroids and fight a natural boxer as we no the advantages they would carry going into a ring. Hence the testing. So my problem is, that they were already stripped and kicked out of the world championship last year, how the hell were they left box's in the Olympics. What's a gender fluid test? " They were stripped after the boxing world championships, as the testosterone levels were nearly level par with a man. Similar to someone taking steroids before going into a ring. | |||
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"In March 2023, Khelif was disqualified for failing to meet eligibility criteria shortly before her gold medal bout at the 2023 IBA Women's World Boxing Championships. The Algerian Olympic Committee said Khelif was disqualified for medical reasons. It later emerged that the disqualification was due to high levels of testosterone.[6][7] International Boxing Association president Umar Kremlev claimed that the DNA test results of Khelif and other athletes "proved they had XY chromosomes"[8] Khelif made an appeal before the Court of Arbitration for Sport but later withdrew it,[2] making the IBA decision legally binding.[9] In 2024, the IBA said that Khelif and others "did not undergo a testosterone examination but were subject to a separate and recognised test, whereby the specifics remain confidential".[2 So do testosterone levels define gender now? Because you were saying something completely different on the female vs woman thread?" Xy chromosome defines gender | |||
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"In March 2023, Khelif was disqualified for failing to meet eligibility criteria shortly before her gold medal bout at the 2023 IBA Women's World Boxing Championships. The Algerian Olympic Committee said Khelif was disqualified for medical reasons. It later emerged that the disqualification was due to high levels of testosterone.[6][7] International Boxing Association president Umar Kremlev claimed that the DNA test results of Khelif and other athletes "proved they had XY chromosomes"[8] Khelif made an appeal before the Court of Arbitration for Sport but later withdrew it,[2] making the IBA decision legally binding.[9] In 2024, the IBA said that Khelif and others "did not undergo a testosterone examination but were subject to a separate and recognised test, whereby the specifics remain confidential".[2 So do testosterone levels define gender now? Because you were saying something completely different on the female vs woman thread? Xy chromosome defines gender " Biological sex | |||
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"In March 2023, Khelif was disqualified for failing to meet eligibility criteria shortly before her gold medal bout at the 2023 IBA Women's World Boxing Championships. The Algerian Olympic Committee said Khelif was disqualified for medical reasons. It later emerged that the disqualification was due to high levels of testosterone.[6][7] International Boxing Association president Umar Kremlev claimed that the DNA test results of Khelif and other athletes "proved they had XY chromosomes"[8] Khelif made an appeal before the Court of Arbitration for Sport but later withdrew it,[2] making the IBA decision legally binding.[9] In 2024, the IBA said that Khelif and others "did not undergo a testosterone examination but were subject to a separate and recognised test, whereby the specifics remain confidential".[2 So do testosterone levels define gender now? Because you were saying something completely different on the female vs woman thread? Xy chromosome defines gender " I found more in relation to that quote about kremlevs comments: Umar Kremlev claimed that the DNA test results of Khelif and other athletes "proved they had XY chromosomes" however, these supposed results were never published. From this, false rumors have emerged that Khelif is transgender or transsexual. Khelif is a biological woman. | |||
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"On a post yesterday OP you said a woman is a woman and men are men. Men can't ever be women and women can't ever be men. Today, a boxer who is a woman from birth, and is competing against other women, shouldn't be doing so because she's a man. Huh. " Hundred percent women can't be men and men can't be women. No nip & tuck with a boob job or hormones will change your biological make up. He has the xy chromosome, the male chromosome. So he's a man competing against women. It's just down right wrong. Especially in contact sports. We seen what happen to Riley Gaines lose out to Willian Thomas aka lia Thomas. Lost out on gold after dedicating her life to the sport. Thomas was ranked over 400 in the men's category but set records in the women's. Just create a category for trans athletes. It stops the unfairness in women's sports with men competing against them. Let me ask ya a question. How come we so no transmen in the men's category? | |||
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". We seen what happen to Riley Gaines lose out to Willian Thomas aka lia Thomas. Lost out on gold after dedicating her life to the sport. Thomas was ranked over 400 in the men's category but set records in the women's. " Remind me again what gold did Riley Gains lose? | |||
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". We seen what happen to Riley Gaines lose out to Willian Thomas aka lia Thomas. Lost out on gold after dedicating her life to the sport. Thomas was ranked over 400 in the men's category but set records in the women's. Remind me again what gold did Riley Gains lose?" The medals that she would have won in the college swimming championship. Might not so big to us here in Ireland, but it's a massive stepping stone in once career in the US. Just like college basket ball and football. Beaten by a man in a women's category. A man ranked over 400. Again pointing out the differences between men and women physically. | |||
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"So Trans is the completely wrong word to be used in this case Boxing has been removed as an Olympic sport after the next Olympics anyway and this controversial fight will be used by some as the reason why " It's a shame. One of our best categories. Plus I can't understand why they are removing it. Especially when ya see bmx as part of this year's Olympic games. | |||
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"So Trans is the completely wrong word to be used in this case Boxing has been removed as an Olympic sport after the next Olympics anyway and this controversial fight will be used by some as the reason why It's a shame. One of our best categories. Plus I can't understand why they are removing it. Especially when ya see bmx as part of this year's Olympic games." International Boxing Association I think is the problem That and fights being fixed | |||
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". We seen what happen to Riley Gaines lose out to Willian Thomas aka lia Thomas. Lost out on gold after dedicating her life to the sport. Thomas was ranked over 400 in the men's category but set records in the women's. Remind me again what gold did Riley Gains lose? The medals that she would have won in the college swimming championship. Might not so big to us here in Ireland, but it's a massive stepping stone in once career in the US. Just like college basket ball and football. Beaten by a man in a women's category. A man ranked over 400. Again pointing out the differences between men and women physically." No sorry I mean which actual race Because I'm pretty sure she didn't lose any actual medal race or lose a gold to Lia Thomas. They did toe for 5th behind some other cis woman. Open to correction though | |||
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"The boxer that won today (Haven't seen it ) was born as female but with higher than normal testosterone according to The IOC Is that not correct " born with XY chromosomes and has previously been banned by a boxing federation. | |||
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"Perhaps you need to step in and tell everyone in these cases who is a man and who is a woman _arbieandbaldy, because the IOC says one thing and the IBA says another and these professional organisations seem to be struggling to decide about this poor person (who was born female and has a female birth cert and a female passport)." Maybe I should. Since today people can't say what a man or a woman is anymore. Commonsense is gone out the window. Plus the IBA is a professional organisation. Who promotes and runs boxing events all year round. Who has regular testing for the fighters on their register. I'd rather go with that ruling. | |||
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"Perhaps you need to step in and tell everyone in these cases who is a man and who is a woman _arbieandbaldy, because the IOC says one thing and the IBA says another and these professional organisations seem to be struggling to decide about this poor person (who was born female and has a female birth cert and a female passport)." I think this person was born inter-sex and was incorrectly identified as female, which led to the birth cert and passport, but has Xy chromosomes and male levels of testosterone. Giving them a massive advantage in a combat sport. Regulations need to change to protect the xx people. This has nothing to do with trans people (sorry for my ignorance earlier). This is a health condition, and the classification is impacting all of the people involved in the competition. | |||
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"Some of the comments about the boxer in question being trans (she isn't btw) just scream "I saw it on Facebook, it must be true" Any kind of searching will discredit the claims within minutes. Not surprised in the slightest by the people claiming it though. " I know Wikipedia isn't exactly the most reliable resource, but it is literally updating on this topic right now. The content has changed in the last hour. This is a very fast moving news item. | |||
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"Some of the comments about the boxer in question being trans (she isn't btw) just scream "I saw it on Facebook, it must be true" Any kind of searching will discredit the claims within minutes. Not surprised in the slightest by the people claiming it though. I know Wikipedia isn't exactly the most reliable resource, but it is literally updating on this topic right now. The content has changed in the last hour. This is a very fast moving news item. " Which Wikipedia page had changed in the last hour? | |||
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"Perhaps you need to step in and tell everyone in these cases who is a man and who is a woman _arbieandbaldy, because the IOC says one thing and the IBA says another and these professional organisations seem to be struggling to decide about this poor person (who was born female and has a female birth cert and a female passport)." As far as I'm aware, the IOC has an overarching framework which must be adhered to but allows individual sporting bodies to decide based on the principles of that framework | |||
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"Cross dresser myself and I'd never undermine the integrity of women. Man enough to wear a dress as I say. I just do my own thing, it's like cosplay and now and again I get dolled up. Some dude punching women around doesn't go well with my moral compass. He knows he's stronger than her yet he knocks her around the place. I've nothing against people feeling born in the wrong body, it's an issue if that body is primed to knock seven shades of shite out of someone who's not as powerful " She isn't trans. She has never claimed to be trans. She has always competed as a woman. She has a dsd and was assigned as female at birth | |||
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"So Trans is the completely wrong word to be used in this case Boxing has been removed as an Olympic sport after the next Olympics anyway and this controversial fight will be used by some as the reason why It's a shame. One of our best categories. Plus I can't understand why they are removing it. Especially when ya see bmx as part of this year's Olympic games." They are removing boxing because the IOC considers the IBA corrupt beyond repair. | |||
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"Cross dresser myself and I'd never undermine the integrity of women. Man enough to wear a dress as I say. I just do my own thing, it's like cosplay and now and again I get dolled up. Some dude punching women around doesn't go well with my moral compass. He knows he's stronger than her yet he knocks her around the place. I've nothing against people feeling born in the wrong body, it's an issue if that body is primed to knock seven shades of shite out of someone who's not as powerful " Let's presume you are correct that this person has male chromosomes when tested (which may or may not be the case)... she was believed to be a woman at birth by the doctor who signed her birth cert and has lived her life as a woman. Why do you feel the need to refer to this person as a man/dude/him? It feels cruel to me | |||
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" Maybe I should. Since today people can't say what a man or a woman is anymore. Commonsense is gone out the window. Plus the IBA is a professional organisation. Who promotes and runs boxing events all year round. Who has regular testing for the fighters on their register. I'd rather go with that ruling. " Except the IBA doesn’t have any jurisdiction over amateur boxing at the Olympic (Long story that’s not for here.) so unfortunately their policies and decision isn’t relevant. As regards what is or isn’t a woman, it’s not a good idea for Humanity to look at an extreme or one off case for society and use it as proof and evidence to define roles and functions within society as a whole. Hard law, as they say, makes for bad law, and misuse of the law always makes it an ass. | |||
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"Some of the comments about the boxer in question being trans (she isn't btw) just scream "I saw it on Facebook, it must be true" Any kind of searching will discredit the claims within minutes. Not surprised in the slightest by the people claiming it though. I know Wikipedia isn't exactly the most reliable resource, but it is literally updating on this topic right now. The content has changed in the last hour. This is a very fast moving news item. Which Wikipedia page had changed in the last hour? " https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imane_Khelif This page updated from my first post earlier to when I checked it about an hour later. | |||
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"Cross dresser myself and I'd never undermine the integrity of women. Man enough to wear a dress as I say. I just do my own thing, it's like cosplay and now and again I get dolled up. Some dude punching women around doesn't go well with my moral compass. He knows he's stronger than her yet he knocks her around the place. I've nothing against people feeling born in the wrong body, it's an issue if that body is primed to knock seven shades of shite out of someone who's not as powerful She isn't trans. She has never claimed to be trans. She has always competed as a woman. She has a dsd and was assigned as female at birth" She is a woman not trans woman.That's not an issue here. The issue is testosterone levels. She was born with elevated testosterone levels and failed a gender fluid test because of this. So as a woman she should be allowed to compete but due to her elevated testosterone levels she does have an unfair advantage over the rest of the female boxers. I think that if you are over the level, naturally or unnaturally, you shouldn't be allowed to compete. It would be sad for this individual but you need a level playing field in sports. If they made an exception they'd be opening up floodgates to potential abuse. Rules should be applied equally. Mrs x | |||
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"Some of the comments about the boxer in question being trans (she isn't btw) just scream "I saw it on Facebook, it must be true" Any kind of searching will discredit the claims within minutes. Not surprised in the slightest by the people claiming it though. I know Wikipedia isn't exactly the most reliable resource, but it is literally updating on this topic right now. The content has changed in the last hour. This is a very fast moving news item. Which Wikipedia page had changed in the last hour? https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imane_Khelif This page updated from my first post earlier to when I checked it about an hour later. " You can see the edit history of a Wikipedia page and at least 10 different people have edited this page this afternoon alone. | |||
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"Cross dresser myself and I'd never undermine the integrity of women. Man enough to wear a dress as I say. I just do my own thing, it's like cosplay and now and again I get dolled up. Some dude punching women around doesn't go well with my moral compass. He knows he's stronger than her yet he knocks her around the place. I've nothing against people feeling born in the wrong body, it's an issue if that body is primed to knock seven shades of shite out of someone who's not as powerful She isn't trans. She has never claimed to be trans. She has always competed as a woman. She has a dsd and was assigned as female at birthShe is a woman not trans woman.That's not an issue here. The issue is testosterone levels. She was born with elevated testosterone levels and failed a gender fluid test because of this. So as a woman she should be allowed to compete but due to her elevated testosterone levels she does have an unfair advantage over the rest of the female boxers. I think that if you are over the level, naturally or unnaturally, you shouldn't be allowed to compete. It would be sad for this individual but you need a level playing field in sports. If they made an exception they'd be opening up floodgates to potential abuse. Rules should be applied equally. Mrs x" I would generally agree with you. Having women who have had the benefit of high levels of testosterone compete against women who haven't is unfair and potentially dangerous. The rules need to be consistent and unambiguous. | |||
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"Cross dresser myself and I'd never undermine the integrity of women. Man enough to wear a dress as I say. I just do my own thing, it's like cosplay and now and again I get dolled up. Some dude punching women around doesn't go well with my moral compass. He knows he's stronger than her yet he knocks her around the place. I've nothing against people feeling born in the wrong body, it's an issue if that body is primed to knock seven shades of shite out of someone who's not as powerful She isn't trans. She has never claimed to be trans. She has always competed as a woman. She has a dsd and was assigned as female at birthShe is a woman not trans woman.That's not an issue here. The issue is testosterone levels. She was born with elevated testosterone levels and failed a gender fluid test because of this. So as a woman she should be allowed to compete but due to her elevated testosterone levels she does have an unfair advantage over the rest of the female boxers. I think that if you are over the level, naturally or unnaturally, you shouldn't be allowed to compete. It would be sad for this individual but you need a level playing field in sports. If they made an exception they'd be opening up floodgates to potential abuse. Rules should be applied equally. Mrs x I would generally agree with you. Having women who have had the benefit of high levels of testosterone compete against women who haven't is unfair and potentially dangerous. The rules need to be consistent and unambiguous." She had previously been beaten several times. Where would she compete? Or do we exclude her? What about people over 7ft who have a distinct advantage at basketball? I know there are somewhat flippant comments but it is such a loaded and complex topic, that having equal and consistent rules isn't all that simple | |||
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"Cross dresser myself and I'd never undermine the integrity of women. Man enough to wear a dress as I say. I just do my own thing, it's like cosplay and now and again I get dolled up. Some dude punching women around doesn't go well with my moral compass. He knows he's stronger than her yet he knocks her around the place. I've nothing against people feeling born in the wrong body, it's an issue if that body is primed to knock seven shades of shite out of someone who's not as powerful She isn't trans. She has never claimed to be trans. She has always competed as a woman. She has a dsd and was assigned as female at birthShe is a woman not trans woman.That's not an issue here. The issue is testosterone levels. She was born with elevated testosterone levels and failed a gender fluid test because of this. So as a woman she should be allowed to compete but due to her elevated testosterone levels she does have an unfair advantage over the rest of the female boxers. I think that if you are over the level, naturally or unnaturally, you shouldn't be allowed to compete. It would be sad for this individual but you need a level playing field in sports. If they made an exception they'd be opening up floodgates to potential abuse. Rules should be applied equally. Mrs x" I'm mistaken neither woman at the Olympics were disqualified due to testosterone, it wasn't tested for. They did fail a gender fluid test but as yet the reasons for this have not been made public. I'll reserve my opinion until all the facts emerge, if they do. Mrs x | |||
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"Cross dresser myself and I'd never undermine the integrity of women. Man enough to wear a dress as I say. I just do my own thing, it's like cosplay and now and again I get dolled up. Some dude punching women around doesn't go well with my moral compass. He knows he's stronger than her yet he knocks her around the place. I've nothing against people feeling born in the wrong body, it's an issue if that body is primed to knock seven shades of shite out of someone who's not as powerful She isn't trans. She has never claimed to be trans. She has always competed as a woman. She has a dsd and was assigned as female at birthShe is a woman not trans woman.That's not an issue here. The issue is testosterone levels. She was born with elevated testosterone levels and failed a gender fluid test because of this. So as a woman she should be allowed to compete but due to her elevated testosterone levels she does have an unfair advantage over the rest of the female boxers. I think that if you are over the level, naturally or unnaturally, you shouldn't be allowed to compete. It would be sad for this individual but you need a level playing field in sports. If they made an exception they'd be opening up floodgates to potential abuse. Rules should be applied equally. Mrs x I would generally agree with you. Having women who have had the benefit of high levels of testosterone compete against women who haven't is unfair and potentially dangerous. The rules need to be consistent and unambiguous. She had previously been beaten several times. Where would she compete? Or do we exclude her? What about people over 7ft who have a distinct advantage at basketball? I know there are somewhat flippant comments but it is such a loaded and complex topic, that having equal and consistent rules isn't all that simple " in relation to having performance enhancing compounds it's very simple. If you have an agreed level you can compete, if it's above you can't. There's no height restriction in basketball so that's a redundant analogy. Mrs x | |||
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"Cross dresser myself and I'd never undermine the integrity of women. Man enough to wear a dress as I say. I just do my own thing, it's like cosplay and now and again I get dolled up. Some dude punching women around doesn't go well with my moral compass. He knows he's stronger than her yet he knocks her around the place. I've nothing against people feeling born in the wrong body, it's an issue if that body is primed to knock seven shades of shite out of someone who's not as powerful She isn't trans. She has never claimed to be trans. She has always competed as a woman. She has a dsd and was assigned as female at birthShe is a woman not trans woman.That's not an issue here. The issue is testosterone levels. She was born with elevated testosterone levels and failed a gender fluid test because of this. So as a woman she should be allowed to compete but due to her elevated testosterone levels she does have an unfair advantage over the rest of the female boxers. I think that if you are over the level, naturally or unnaturally, you shouldn't be allowed to compete. It would be sad for this individual but you need a level playing field in sports. If they made an exception they'd be opening up floodgates to potential abuse. Rules should be applied equally. Mrs xI'm mistaken neither woman at the Olympics were disqualified due to testosterone, it wasn't tested for. They did fail a gender fluid test but as yet the reasons for this have not been made public. I'll reserve my opinion until all the facts emerge, if they do. Mrs x" I assume you and a previous poster mean a gender eligibility test. Since neither athlete is gender fluid, it'd not be a surprise that they failed a test for that (if one actually existed) 🤔 | |||
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"Cross dresser myself and I'd never undermine the integrity of women. Man enough to wear a dress as I say. I just do my own thing, it's like cosplay and now and again I get dolled up. Some dude punching women around doesn't go well with my moral compass. He knows he's stronger than her yet he knocks her around the place. I've nothing against people feeling born in the wrong body, it's an issue if that body is primed to knock seven shades of shite out of someone who's not as powerful She isn't trans. She has never claimed to be trans. She has always competed as a woman. She has a dsd and was assigned as female at birthShe is a woman not trans woman.That's not an issue here. The issue is testosterone levels. She was born with elevated testosterone levels and failed a gender fluid test because of this. So as a woman she should be allowed to compete but due to her elevated testosterone levels she does have an unfair advantage over the rest of the female boxers. I think that if you are over the level, naturally or unnaturally, you shouldn't be allowed to compete. It would be sad for this individual but you need a level playing field in sports. If they made an exception they'd be opening up floodgates to potential abuse. Rules should be applied equally. Mrs xI'm mistaken neither woman at the Olympics were disqualified due to testosterone, it wasn't tested for. They did fail a gender fluid test but as yet the reasons for this have not been made public. I'll reserve my opinion until all the facts emerge, if they do. Mrs x I assume you and a previous poster mean a gender eligibility test. Since neither athlete is gender fluid, it'd not be a surprise that they failed a test for that (if one actually existed) 🤔 " Sorry you are right I meant eligibility test not fluid. There was a statement given after they were disqualified but no further evidence was provided which muddied the waters a bit. The statement read "the athletes did not undergo a testosterone examination but were subject to a separate and recognised test, whereby the specifics remain confidential. This test conclusively indicated that both athletes did not meet the required necessary eligibility criteria and were found to have competitive advantages over other female competitors." It said the decisions were ratified by the IBA Board of Directors. Apparently it was a chromosome issue, they had XY chromosomes but the actual results were not released and when asked for them the governing no did not reply. There's something going on but not sure we will find out exactly what. Mrs x | |||
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"It's not a redundant analogy. A person with a natural excess of growth hormones in their bodies may grow far taller than most and be able to wipe the floor in basketball. Do we measure growth hormone levels? Maybe it's not SO simple." The GOAT basketball player was Michael zJprdan, he wasn't 7 foot. The GOAT footballer Messi is probably the smallest guy when taking to the pitch. Height may be an advantage it may not. But a performance enhancing compound definitely is. Tallest guy in the world Robert Wadlow, 8ft 11 inches, would have made a shit basketball player. Couldn't walk very well had to wear leg braces and used a wheelchair due to complications from his massive frame. Mrs x | |||
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"Testosterone has a role to play in sex drive for sure. It is sometimes supplemented in menopausal women with abnormally low libidos for example. However the levels found in men are far far far higher than what a "normal" woman would produce in even the horniest day of her life. It has a very pronounced effect on strength and muscle mass and so if a massive advantage physically." Some of the profiles on here raise my testosterone levels to exceptional heights , several couples especially. Only thing is I'm a lover , not s fighter 😜❤️🕺🏻 | |||
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"Testosterone has a role to play in sex drive for sure. It is sometimes supplemented in menopausal women with abnormally low libidos for example. However the levels found in men are far far far higher than what a "normal" woman would produce in even the horniest day of her life. It has a very pronounced effect on strength and muscle mass and so if a massive advantage physically." I was wrong earlier, it wasn't about testosterone. They never even tested for it. It was something to do with chromosomes and they had XY chromosomes but no results from the test that banned them were released. Mrs x | |||
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"It's not a redundant analogy. A person with a natural excess of growth hormones in their bodies may grow far taller than most and be able to wipe the floor in basketball. Do we measure growth hormone levels? Maybe it's not SO simple.The GOAT basketball player was Michael zJprdan, he wasn't 7 foot. The GOAT footballer Messi is probably the smallest guy when taking to the pitch. Height may be an advantage it may not. But a performance enhancing compound definitely is. Tallest guy in the world Robert Wadlow, 8ft 11 inches, would have made a shit basketball player. Couldn't walk very well had to wear leg braces and used a wheelchair due to complications from his massive frame. Mrs x" The GOAT women boxers and women athletes are all cis women with in range testosterone.. so it's a redundant analogy | |||
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"It's not a redundant analogy. A person with a natural excess of growth hormones in their bodies may grow far taller than most and be able to wipe the floor in basketball. Do we measure growth hormone levels? Maybe it's not SO simple.The GOAT basketball player was Michael zJprdan, he wasn't 7 foot. The GOAT footballer Messi is probably the smallest guy when taking to the pitch. Height may be an advantage it may not. But a performance enhancing compound definitely is. Tallest guy in the world Robert Wadlow, 8ft 11 inches, would have made a shit basketball player. Couldn't walk very well had to wear leg braces and used a wheelchair due to complications from his massive frame. Mrs x The GOAT women boxers and women athletes are all cis women with in range testosterone.. so it's a redundant analogy " "Cis women". If I were you I'd jump over the nearest hedge and hide in the ditch in the foetal position  | |||
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"It's not a redundant analogy. A person with a natural excess of growth hormones in their bodies may grow far taller than most and be able to wipe the floor in basketball. Do we measure growth hormone levels? Maybe it's not SO simple.The GOAT basketball player was Michael zJprdan, he wasn't 7 foot. The GOAT footballer Messi is probably the smallest guy when taking to the pitch. Height may be an advantage it may not. But a performance enhancing compound definitely is. Tallest guy in the world Robert Wadlow, 8ft 11 inches, would have made a shit basketball player. Couldn't walk very well had to wear leg braces and used a wheelchair due to complications from his massive frame. Mrs x The GOAT women boxers and women athletes are all cis women with in range testosterone.. so it's a redundant analogy " Cis woman are just woman. Cis is just a made up prefix in 1994, didn't even get into the dictionary until 2015. So the GOAT woman boxers and athletes are woman, not cis women just woman. Mrs x | |||
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"It's not a redundant analogy. A person with a natural excess of growth hormones in their bodies may grow far taller than most and be able to wipe the floor in basketball. Do we measure growth hormone levels? Maybe it's not SO simple.The GOAT basketball player was Michael zJprdan, he wasn't 7 foot. The GOAT footballer Messi is probably the smallest guy when taking to the pitch. Height may be an advantage it may not. But a performance enhancing compound definitely is. Tallest guy in the world Robert Wadlow, 8ft 11 inches, would have made a shit basketball player. Couldn't walk very well had to wear leg braces and used a wheelchair due to complications from his massive frame. Mrs x The GOAT women boxers and women athletes are all cis women with in range testosterone.. so it's a redundant analogy Cis woman are just woman. Cis is just a made up prefix in 1994, didn't even get into the dictionary until 2015. So the GOAT woman boxers and athletes are woman, not cis women just woman. Mrs x" It's in the dictionary though right? Isn't all words just kinda made up. Like your sign off? | |||
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"It's not a redundant analogy. A person with a natural excess of growth hormones in their bodies may grow far taller than most and be able to wipe the floor in basketball. Do we measure growth hormone levels? Maybe it's not SO simple.The GOAT basketball player was Michael zJprdan, he wasn't 7 foot. The GOAT footballer Messi is probably the smallest guy when taking to the pitch. Height may be an advantage it may not. But a performance enhancing compound definitely is. Tallest guy in the world Robert Wadlow, 8ft 11 inches, would have made a shit basketball player. Couldn't walk very well had to wear leg braces and used a wheelchair due to complications from his massive frame. Mrs x The GOAT women boxers and women athletes are all cis women with in range testosterone.. so it's a redundant analogy Cis woman are just woman. Cis is just a made up prefix in 1994, didn't even get into the dictionary until 2015. So the GOAT woman boxers and athletes are woman, not cis women just woman. Mrs x" Merriam Webster only added GOAT in 2018... Language is constantly evolving. It has done since the dawn of time. New words are added to dictionaries year on year | |||
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"It's not a redundant analogy. A person with a natural excess of growth hormones in their bodies may grow far taller than most and be able to wipe the floor in basketball. Do we measure growth hormone levels? Maybe it's not SO simple.The GOAT basketball player was Michael zJprdan, he wasn't 7 foot. The GOAT footballer Messi is probably the smallest guy when taking to the pitch. Height may be an advantage it may not. But a performance enhancing compound definitely is. Tallest guy in the world Robert Wadlow, 8ft 11 inches, would have made a shit basketball player. Couldn't walk very well had to wear leg braces and used a wheelchair due to complications from his massive frame. Mrs x The GOAT women boxers and women athletes are all cis women with in range testosterone.. so it's a redundant analogy Cis woman are just woman. Cis is just a made up prefix in 1994, didn't even get into the dictionary until 2015. So the GOAT woman boxers and athletes are woman, not cis women just woman. Mrs x Merriam Webster only added GOAT in 2018... Language is constantly evolving. It has done since the dawn of time. New words are added to dictionaries year on year" They are I agree, doesn't mean they are right, or wrong. If you can show me how it helps define someone who was born a certain way, remains that way and currently identifies that way better than the original term of man or woman then I might change my views. I've lived almost 50 years, believing I was a woman and now I find out that I might have been wrong, I don't think so. Mrs x | |||
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"So both boxers were beaten in the last Olympics, one of them by Kellie Harrington " Just means they might not be great boxers. They were banned for a reason other than their skill or lack thereof. Mrs x | |||
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"It's not a redundant analogy. A person with a natural excess of growth hormones in their bodies may grow far taller than most and be able to wipe the floor in basketball. Do we measure growth hormone levels? Maybe it's not SO simple.The GOAT basketball player was Michael zJprdan, he wasn't 7 foot. The GOAT footballer Messi is probably the smallest guy when taking to the pitch. Height may be an advantage it may not. But a performance enhancing compound definitely is. Tallest guy in the world Robert Wadlow, 8ft 11 inches, would have made a shit basketball player. Couldn't walk very well had to wear leg braces and used a wheelchair due to complications from his massive frame. Mrs x The GOAT women boxers and women athletes are all cis women with in range testosterone.. so it's a redundant analogy Cis woman are just woman. Cis is just a made up prefix in 1994, didn't even get into the dictionary until 2015. So the GOAT woman boxers and athletes are woman, not cis women just woman. Mrs x It's in the dictionary though right? Isn't all words just kinda made up. Like your sign off? " My sign off? Mrs x | |||
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"It's not a redundant analogy. A person with a natural excess of growth hormones in their bodies may grow far taller than most and be able to wipe the floor in basketball. Do we measure growth hormone levels? Maybe it's not SO simple.The GOAT basketball player was Michael zJprdan, he wasn't 7 foot. The GOAT footballer Messi is probably the smallest guy when taking to the pitch. Height may be an advantage it may not. But a performance enhancing compound definitely is. Tallest guy in the world Robert Wadlow, 8ft 11 inches, would have made a shit basketball player. Couldn't walk very well had to wear leg braces and used a wheelchair due to complications from his massive frame. Mrs x The GOAT women boxers and women athletes are all cis women with in range testosterone.. so it's a redundant analogy Cis woman are just woman. Cis is just a made up prefix in 1994, didn't even get into the dictionary until 2015. So the GOAT woman boxers and athletes are woman, not cis women just woman. Mrs x It's in the dictionary though right? Isn't all words just kinda made up. Like your sign off? My sign off? Mrs x" The "Mrs" ya know how someone at some stage decided to make a shorter way to differentiate between women who were married and not married that didn't have a higher title. But tbh I used cis because it was quicker than saying "not a trans woman and not an intersex woman". You don't like or agree with the phrase fair enough I'd never address you directly or refer you you individually as anything other than a woman. | |||
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"I wonder if she is a female, or a woman? Hmmmm... *ducks behind the sofa*" She is female (adj) and a woman (n)  | |||
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"Cross dresser myself and I'd never undermine the integrity of women. Man enough to wear a dress as I say. I just do my own thing, it's like cosplay and now and again I get dolled up. Some dude punching women around doesn't go well with my moral compass. He knows he's stronger than her yet he knocks her around the place. I've nothing against people feeling born in the wrong body, it's an issue if that body is primed to knock seven shades of shite out of someone who's not as powerful She isn't trans. She has never claimed to be trans. She has always competed as a woman. She has a dsd and was assigned as female at birthShe is a woman not trans woman.That's not an issue here. The issue is testosterone levels. She was born with elevated testosterone levels and failed a gender fluid test because of this. So as a woman she should be allowed to compete but due to her elevated testosterone levels she does have an unfair advantage over the rest of the female boxers. I think that if you are over the level, naturally or unnaturally, you shouldn't be allowed to compete. It would be sad for this individual but you need a level playing field in sports. If they made an exception they'd be opening up floodgates to potential abuse. Rules should be applied equally. Mrs x I would generally agree with you. Having women who have had the benefit of high levels of testosterone compete against women who haven't is unfair and potentially dangerous. The rules need to be consistent and unambiguous. She had previously been beaten several times. Where would she compete? Or do we exclude her? What about people over 7ft who have a distinct advantage at basketball? I know there are somewhat flippant comments but it is such a loaded and complex topic, that having equal and consistent rules isn't all that simple " I know this will sound soooo silly but they should organise an Olympics just for people who have transition to make it more fair - same as the paralympics, we don't expect them to compite with people who have more advantage... But overall this Is a sad scenario, because one is torn, and can only imagine how the boxer is feeling with everyone talking, I heard the commentator of the Mexican fight against her - they weren't saying anything forward but of course what they were saying had double meaning and one knows they were being as**oles to Iman. Lina. | |||
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"It's not a redundant analogy. A person with a natural excess of growth hormones in their bodies may grow far taller than most and be able to wipe the floor in basketball. Do we measure growth hormone levels? Maybe it's not SO simple.The GOAT basketball player was Michael zJprdan, he wasn't 7 foot. The GOAT footballer Messi is probably the smallest guy when taking to the pitch. Height may be an advantage it may not. But a performance enhancing compound definitely is. Tallest guy in the world Robert Wadlow, 8ft 11 inches, would have made a shit basketball player. Couldn't walk very well had to wear leg braces and used a wheelchair due to complications from his massive frame. Mrs x The GOAT women boxers and women athletes are all cis women with in range testosterone.. so it's a redundant analogy Cis woman are just woman. Cis is just a made up prefix in 1994, didn't even get into the dictionary until 2015. So the GOAT woman boxers and athletes are woman, not cis women just woman. Mrs x It's in the dictionary though right? Isn't all words just kinda made up. Like your sign off? My sign off? Mrs x The "Mrs" ya know how someone at some stage decided to make a shorter way to differentiate between women who were married and not married that didn't have a higher title. But tbh I used cis because it was quicker than saying "not a trans woman and not an intersex woman". You don't like or agree with the phrase fair enough I'd never address you directly or refer you you individually as anything other than a woman. " Quicker? Woman is much quicker. Mrs x | |||
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"It's not a redundant analogy. A person with a natural excess of growth hormones in their bodies may grow far taller than most and be able to wipe the floor in basketball. Do we measure growth hormone levels? Maybe it's not SO simple.The GOAT basketball player was Michael zJprdan, he wasn't 7 foot. The GOAT footballer Messi is probably the smallest guy when taking to the pitch. Height may be an advantage it may not. But a performance enhancing compound definitely is. Tallest guy in the world Robert Wadlow, 8ft 11 inches, would have made a shit basketball player. Couldn't walk very well had to wear leg braces and used a wheelchair due to complications from his massive frame. Mrs x The GOAT women boxers and women athletes are all cis women with in range testosterone.. so it's a redundant analogy Cis woman are just woman. Cis is just a made up prefix in 1994, didn't even get into the dictionary until 2015. So the GOAT woman boxers and athletes are woman, not cis women just woman. Mrs x It's in the dictionary though right? Isn't all words just kinda made up. Like your sign off? My sign off? Mrs x The "Mrs" ya know how someone at some stage decided to make a shorter way to differentiate between women who were married and not married that didn't have a higher title. But tbh I used cis because it was quicker than saying "not a trans woman and not an intersex woman". You don't like or agree with the phrase fair enough I'd never address you directly or refer you you individually as anything other than a woman. Quicker? Woman is much quicker. Mrs x" Doesn't make the distinction I was looking for with my statement but thanks | |||
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"Boxing always corrupt here and possibly everywhere which may explain it going to drop out of Olympics " The Olympics no longer recognises the IBA due to corruption. Just look at the last couple of guys that were running the show. | |||
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"Im more disguested that people are still so ignorant that they just cant refer to a trans female as such!! The amount of lads ive blocked today all saying the same shite on the socials but behind closed doors are very happy to be asking me for nudes and videos!! Theres a Dutch peado taking part wheres your outrage!! " Just to say there is still lots of outrage about that!! | |||
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"Question is why are trans women banned from swimming but boxers aren't. " The boxers aren't transwomen but the have failed gender tests previously. It's a ridiculous position the Olympics have taken. Mrs x | |||
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"Question is why are trans women banned from swimming but boxers aren't. " Yeah you think the boxers would find it hard to swim with the gloves on | |||
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"Question is why are trans women banned from swimming but boxers aren't. Yeah you think the boxers would find it hard to swim with the gloves on " Giggle x | |||
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"Question is why are trans women banned from swimming but boxers aren't. Yeah you think the boxers would find it hard to swim with the gloves on " Lol Be an interesting sport crossover | |||
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"I don't see what the issue is here. She's a woman, was born a woman, has lived all her life as a woman and has always competed as a woman. She's not even that good of a boxer and has been beaten by other women boxers on 5 different occasions. Just on this occasion her opponent couldn't handle being hit. It'd be like me getting into a ring with McGregor and then claiming he was using some performance enhancing drug when he beat the shit out of me. And we all know he wouldn't use drugs... "She has benefited from male testosterone levels. She is intersex with predominately male g genetics. Not a fair component for an xx woman. | |||
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"Question is why are trans women banned from swimming but boxers aren't. Yeah you think the boxers would find it hard to swim with the gloves on " | |||
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" She has benefited from male testosterone levels. She is intersex with predominately male g genetics. Not a fair component for an xx woman. " Except there's no proof of any of that. That claim was made by the Russian head of the IBA without releasing proof of any tests being carried out. The IBA was subsequently suspended and banned for corruption. If you want to look into it the minutes of the IBA meeting state that the CEO acted alone in stripping her of her title and did so without following any procedures or due process. | |||
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"Question is why are trans women banned from swimming but boxers aren't. " I already answered that up there somewhere, but the IOC has an overarching framework which must be adhered to by all sporting bodies, but allows individual sporting bodies to decide based on the principles of that framework. Some sporting bodies have opted to decide on a individual case basis rather than a blanket policy. | |||
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" She has benefited from male testosterone levels. She is intersex with predominately male g genetics. Not a fair component for an xx woman. Except there's no proof of any of that. That claim was made by the Russian head of the IBA without releasing proof of any tests being carried out. The IBA was subsequently suspended and banned for corruption. If you want to look into it the minutes of the IBA meeting state that the CEO acted alone in stripping her of her title and did so without following any procedures or due process. " The decision was ratified by the whole board. Mrs x | |||
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"Question is why are trans women banned from swimming but boxers aren't. I already answered that up there somewhere, but the IOC has an overarching framework which must be adhered to by all sporting bodies, but allows individual sporting bodies to decide based on the principles of that framework. Some sporting bodies have opted to decide on a individual case basis rather than a blanket policy." In most cases they have to have transitioned before the age of 12 when the benefits of male puberty start to kick in and have testosterone levels below 25mg (or something like that) for the previous 24 months in the run up to the competition. | |||
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"Question is why are trans women banned from swimming but boxers aren't. I already answered that up there somewhere, but the IOC has an overarching framework which must be adhered to by all sporting bodies, but allows individual sporting bodies to decide based on the principles of that framework. Some sporting bodies have opted to decide on a individual case basis rather than a blanket policy." Testosterone levels are all agreed for all athletes in whatever sport they compete in. That's the basis of how the drugs tests are determined. Her levels are elevated for a female boxer. Its just sad that occurs naturally for her. She shouldn't ba allowed to compete. Mrs x | |||
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"Question is why are trans women banned from swimming but boxers aren't. I already answered that up there somewhere, but the IOC has an overarching framework which must be adhered to by all sporting bodies, but allows individual sporting bodies to decide based on the principles of that framework. Some sporting bodies have opted to decide on a individual case basis rather than a blanket policy. In most cases they have to have transitioned before the age of 12 when the benefits of male puberty start to kick in and have testosterone levels below 25mg (or something like that) for the previous 24 months in the run up to the competition. " She's not a transwoman, she is a woman. She just has a condition that means she has some XY chromosomes but more importantly she has raised testosterone. That's it, nothing else. Mrs x | |||
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" The decision was ratified by the whole board. Mrs x" It was only ratified by the whole board after the fact. They'd already been suspended by the IOC for corruption, they couldn't exactly going against their own CEO and prove how corrupt they were. | |||
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"The Dutch pedo competing is disgusting but it's not like there hasn't been an outrage.. Every news outlet reported on it and called it a disgrace. So the outrage is there and still remains,which is rightly so.. people have just moved on too the next topic. Which is this boxer, she is a she but was born with XY chromosomes, so I do think its unfair for her to compete. In India they have intersex leagues in nearly all sports.. could the western world not follow suit?" Absolutely no proof of her having XY Chromosomes None | |||
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"I don't see what the issue is here. She's a woman, was born a woman, has lived all her life as a woman and has always competed as a woman. She's not even that good of a boxer and has been beaten by other women boxers on 5 different occasions. Just on this occasion her opponent couldn't handle being hit. It'd be like me getting into a ring with McGregor and then claiming he was using some performance enhancing drug when he beat the shit out of me. And we all know he wouldn't use drugs... "I agree she is a woman competing against a woman but it’s like Mike Tyson competing with Ray Sugar Leonard. The power she got because high level of testosterone her body produces, didn’t make it a fair fught | |||
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"I don't see what the issue is here. She's a woman, was born a woman, has lived all her life as a woman and has always competed as a woman. She's not even that good of a boxer and has been beaten by other women boxers on 5 different occasions. Just on this occasion her opponent couldn't handle being hit. It'd be like me getting into a ring with McGregor and then claiming he was using some performance enhancing drug when he beat the shit out of me. And we all know he wouldn't use drugs...
I agree she is a woman competing against a woman but it’s like Mike Tyson competing with Ray Sugar Leonard. The power she got because high level of testosterone her body produces, didn’t make it a fair fught"Any evidence of this? Or are you just assuming? | |||
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"The boxer that won today (Haven't seen it ) was born as female but with higher than normal testosterone according to The IOC Is that not correct " Spot on | |||
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"I don't see what the issue is here. She's a woman, was born a woman, has lived all her life as a woman and has always competed as a woman. She's not even that good of a boxer and has been beaten by other women boxers on 5 different occasions. Just on this occasion her opponent couldn't handle being hit. It'd be like me getting into a ring with McGregor and then claiming he was using some performance enhancing drug when he beat the shit out of me. And we all know he wouldn't use drugs...
I agree she is a woman competing against a woman but it’s like Mike Tyson competing with Ray Sugar Leonard. The power she got because high level of testosterone her body produces, didn’t make it a fair fught
Any evidence of this? Or are you just assuming?"I read it in The Guardian. I don’t know if I can post a link, but here is what they said: In its internal system, which is provided to journalists in Paris, the IOC states that Khelif was “disqualified just hours before her gold medal showdown against Yang Liu at the 2023 world championships in New Delhi, India, after her elevated levels of testosterone failed to meet the eligibility criteria”. | |||
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"Anyone else disgusted by a male beating a woman in women's boxing. It's an absolute joke that it was allowed to happen. This crazy shit with letting men compete in women's sports needs to stop. We ain't equal (men & women) when it comes to muscle mass, bone density. " Christ almighty Where did you get your "facts" from? | |||
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"I'm slightly old fashioned but... A good kick in the groin always always sorted the difference between the ladies and gentlemen. So if in doubt... "This boxer was born with a vagina, so this method isn't as foolproof as you might think | |||
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"On a post yesterday OP you said a woman is a woman and men are men. Men can't ever be women and women can't ever be men. Today, a boxer who is a woman from birth, and is competing against other women, shouldn't be doing so because she's a man. Huh. Hundred percent women can't be men and men can't be women. No nip & tuck with a boob job or hormones will change your biological make up. He has the xy chromosome, the male chromosome. So he's a man competing against women. It's just down right wrong. Especially in contact sports. We seen what happen to Riley Gaines lose out to Willian Thomas aka lia Thomas. Lost out on gold after dedicating her life to the sport. Thomas was ranked over 400 in the men's category but set records in the women's. Just create a category for trans athletes. It stops the unfairness in women's sports with men competing against them. Let me ask ya a question. How come we so no transmen in the men's category? " A trans man competed in the men’s boxing so, shockingly, you’re wrong. But hey, no one gives a shit about him. | |||
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"Has anyone stopped to consider maybe Angela Carini is just shit at boxing 😆 Hope Khelif goes all the way now 🥊" Didn’t protect her face, didn’t try to get out of the way, didn’t use footwork. I mean, she agreed to get in the ring so obviously wasn’t concerned about her safety. She was just a bit shit on the day 🤷🏻♀️ | |||
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"I don't see what the issue is here. She's a woman, was born a woman, has lived all her life as a woman and has always competed as a woman. She's not even that good of a boxer and has been beaten by other women boxers on 5 different occasions. Just on this occasion her opponent couldn't handle being hit. It'd be like me getting into a ring with McGregor and then claiming he was using some performance enhancing drug when he beat the shit out of me. And we all know he wouldn't use drugs...
I agree she is a woman competing against a woman but it’s like Mike Tyson competing with Ray Sugar Leonard. The power she got because high level of testosterone her body produces, didn’t make it a fair fught
Any evidence of this? Or are you just assuming?
I read it in The Guardian. I don’t know if I can post a link, but here is what they said:
In its internal system, which is provided to journalists in Paris, the IOC states that Khelif was “disqualified just hours before her gold medal showdown against Yang Liu at the 2023 world championships in New Delhi, India, after her elevated levels of testosterone failed to meet the eligibility criteria”. "So her elevated levels of testosterone before a fight in 2023 is evidence that she had an advantage yesterday? If we accept that someone who fails to meet the eligibility criteria is not allowed to compete, how then when they DO meet the eligibility criteria (as Khelif does according to the IOC) can we still say they shouldn't be allowed to compete | |||
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"I'm slightly old fashioned but... A good kick in the groin always always sorted the difference between the ladies and gentlemen. So if in doubt...
This boxer was born with a vagina, so this method isn't as foolproof as you might think"I've heard that a kick in the fahgina isnt the most pleasant experience either... apparently | |||
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"No nip & tuck with a boob job or hormones will change your biological make up." Horrible way to talk about us like we're not in the room. 
I take estrogen and regular blood tests show that it has suppressed my testosterone to a range lower than most cis women's. My biological makeup has changed dramatically, including a huge reduction in muscle density. If you put me in a ring with any even remotely trained woman boxer I wouldn't stand a chance (and quite frankly neither would most men!)
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"No I'm not disgusted. I get disgusted by things which are in my opinion actually disgusting, like the Israeli flag bearer being allowed to complete while he has videos of him signing bombs that are being dropped on children on his insta. I do however thing trans athletes in sport is a very delicate and complicated matter. And someone's you do have to look at the biological advantages someone has received. This to me isn't a gender identity issues rather than a sporting fairness one. I also don't think it has a simplistic answer because I'd like trans athletes to have a way of competing " You're 100% regarding the Genocidal Hypocrites that is Israel, yet everyone STILL turns a blind eye!!! 🇵🇸 | |||
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"Anyone else disgusted by a male beating a woman in women's boxing. It's an absolute joke that it was allowed to happen. This crazy shit with letting men compete in women's sports needs to stop. We ain't equal (men & women) when it comes to muscle mass, bone density. " There's a very simple solution. Create a third category so you can only compete within that category man v man, woman v woman, trans female v trans female. Tha does away with all the arguments over physical advantages whilst still allowing anyone who wish to compete take part | |||
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"Is this khlief,competing since 2017/2018 in womens boxing...also the boxer has been beaten by Amy broadhurst and kellie harrington Harrington won the quarter final in 2020 Broadhurst won a final in 2022 or around that 100% correct. Was stripped last year at the world champions. They should just create a new category. It's simple..let's trans athletes compete against each other. You do realise she is a woman yes?" A female with a XY chromosomes; were you not paying attention in biology class in school? Absurd and ridiculous that this individual was allowed in the same ring as other females | |||
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"Anyone else disgusted by a male beating a woman in women's boxing. It's an absolute joke that it was allowed to happen. This crazy shit with letting men compete in women's sports needs to stop. We ain't equal (men & women) when it comes to muscle mass, bone density. There's a very simple solution. Create a third category so you can only compete within that category man v man, woman v woman, trans female v trans female. Tha does away with all the arguments over physical advantages whilst still allowing anyone who wish to compete take part" So where’s the equality then … | |||
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"I don't see what the issue is here. She's a woman, was born a woman, has lived all her life as a woman and has always competed as a woman. She's not even that good of a boxer and has been beaten by other women boxers on 5 different occasions. Just on this occasion her opponent couldn't handle being hit. It'd be like me getting into a ring with McGregor and then claiming he was using some performance enhancing drug when he beat the shit out of me. And we all know he wouldn't use drugs...
I agree she is a woman competing against a woman but it’s like Mike Tyson competing with Ray Sugar Leonard. The power she got because high level of testosterone her body produces, didn’t make it a fair fught
Any evidence of this? Or are you just assuming?
I read it in The Guardian. I don’t know if I can post a link, but here is what they said:
In its internal system, which is provided to journalists in Paris, the IOC states that Khelif was “disqualified just hours before her gold medal showdown against Yang Liu at the 2023 world championships in New Delhi, India, after her elevated levels of testosterone failed to meet the eligibility criteria”.
So her elevated levels of testosterone before a fight in 2023 is evidence that she had an advantage yesterday?
If we accept that someone who fails to meet the eligibility criteria is not allowed to compete, how then when they DO meet the eligibility criteria (as Khelif does according to the IOC) can we still say they shouldn't be allowed to compete"Evidently you don't much about testosterone... https://physoc.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1113/jphysiol.2013.264457 | |||
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"Anyone else disgusted by a male beating a woman in women's boxing. It's an absolute joke that it was allowed to happen. This crazy shit with letting men compete in women's sports needs to stop. We ain't equal (men & women) when it comes to muscle mass, bone density. There's a very simple solution. Create a third category so you can only compete within that category man v man, woman v woman, trans female v trans female. Tha does away with all the arguments over physical advantages whilst still allowing anyone who wish to compete take part" Ah yes "equal but separate"
Wouldn't make any difference in this instance as Imane isn't trans. She's just a better boxer. | |||
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"I in my opinion think that it's more about a Power level than anything 🤷♂️ Now I know nothing about testosterone r estrogen, sorry for my Ignorance not offence intended 🥰" I mean yeah, that's why there are different weight classes in boxing. Imane has been beaten by other women in her weight class plenty of times. | |||
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"THERE ARE NO TRANS ATHLETES COMPETING IN THE 2024 OLYMPICS The people in question are not trans, have never identified as trans, and have always competed as women. The origin of the claim is a apparently from a Russian Telegram post. I believe one of them MAY have at some time had higher testosterone flagged. This is actually common enough in elite athletes. Doing a lot of sports raise a woman's testosterone. and women with naturally higher testosterone may have an advantage in sports. Olympic athletes undergo plenty of blood tests and medical exams. Every single sports agency, and governing body has their own policies and requirements around this. I trust them. THEY are the experts and the ones who decide what criteria matter and whether its fair. They have already done the work to rigorously check what's appropriate. No, I am not disgusted by the idea of a person who transitions wanting to continue playing sport. I don't support any sweeping ban based solely on someone's status as a trans person. Instead I trust sports governing bodies to have their own policies to determine where it is appropriate for them to play or not. This topic is constantly used to justify hostility to the entire trans community. As we've all seen in this thread, transphobic groups spread misinformation around the internet, and people lap it up. If trans athletes were an actual issue we would see them actually dominating competitions, but we don't - they barely exist. The rare handful that exist in the world have never dominated competitions, and have all been beaten many times by cis competitors. There is no justification for the hostility the media directs to that small community. Plenty of people in this thread were all to happy to jump on that bandwagon once they thought they had a good enough excuse with this olympics story. " Whats a transphobe; can you explain to me? | |||
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"Anyone else disgusted by a male beating a woman in women's boxing. It's an absolute joke that it was allowed to happen. This crazy shit with letting men compete in women's sports needs to stop. We ain't equal (men & women) when it comes to muscle mass, bone density. There's a very simple solution. Create a third category so you can only compete within that category man v man, woman v woman, trans female v trans female. Tha does away with all the arguments over physical advantages whilst still allowing anyone who wish to compete take part So where’s the equality then …" Right in front of you if you care to look. Here, I'll spell it out for you: Female Competitor #1 with chromosomes XX vs Female Competitor #2 with chromosomes XX Male Competitor #3 with chromosomes XY vs Male Competitor #4 with chromosomes XY Competitor #5 who identifies as a gender that something other than birth chromosomes* vs Competitor #6 who identifies as a gender that something than birth chromosomes* *birth chromosomes XY and XX are male and female, respectively Can't get more equal than that | |||
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"It's a disgrace this woke bullshit is gone too far its disgusting they couldn't compete in the world championships 2023 any person transitioning thinking it's OK to play a physical sport against women is a fucking dickhead full stop,I see a few here blaming the russians "Sweet baby jesus. She's not trans. | |||
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"She/he has more testosterone than a bull on steroids its totally unfair go identify as cat woke idiots" You're arguing with yourself here Its not a Trans / woke issue PS The cat thing in schools is also fake news | |||
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"It's a disgrace this woke bullshit is gone too far its disgusting they couldn't compete in the world championships 2023 any person transitioning thinking it's OK to play a physical sport against women is a fucking dickhead full stop,I see a few here blaming the russians
Sweet baby jesus. She's not trans."She's not trans but she male dna and produces high levels of chromosomes. She's a woman but those two factors give her an unfair advantage over her competitors and she should be banned. Mrs x | |||
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"It's a disgrace this woke bullshit is gone too far its disgusting they couldn't compete in the world championships 2023 any person transitioning thinking it's OK to play a physical sport against women is a fucking dickhead full stop,I see a few here blaming the russians "What's even more of a disgrace is the amount of people who jump in with an opinion on every click bait story and only get their info from Facebook. She's not a man, she's not transitioning, she was born female, has been competing for years, has been beaten by plenty of other women and it's only becoming an issue now because another woman who probably shouldn't have been in that weight class decided to cry about it. | |||
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"It's a disgrace this woke bullshit is gone too far its disgusting they couldn't compete in the world championships 2023 any person transitioning thinking it's OK to play a physical sport against women is a fucking dickhead full stop,I see a few here blaming the russians
Sweet baby jesus. She's not trans.She's not trans but she male dna and produces high levels of chromosomes.
She's a woman but those two factors give her an unfair advantage over her competitors and she should be banned.
Mrs x"By that argument you'd have to strip Michael Phelps of all his medals and accolades | |||
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" By that argument you'd have to strip Michael Phelps of all his medals and accolades" Should never have been allowed to compete against men. He was clearly born a dolphin. Should be made to compete at Seaworld instead 😂 | |||
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" By that argument you'd have to strip Michael Phelps of all his medals and accolades Should never have been allowed to compete against men. He was clearly born a dolphin. Should be made to compete at Seaworld instead 😂" Thats why Fungi fucked off ...he knew he wouldn't beat him | |||
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"She/he has more testosterone than a bull on steroids its totally unfair go identify as cat woke idiots" Seeking TV/TS. This site never fails to entertain. | |||
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"It's a disgrace this woke bullshit is gone too far its disgusting they couldn't compete in the world championships 2023 any person transitioning thinking it's OK to play a physical sport against women is a fucking dickhead full stop,I see a few here blaming the russians
Sweet baby jesus. She's not trans.She's not trans but she male dna and produces high levels of chromosomes.
She's a woman but those two factors give her an unfair advantage over her competitors and she should be banned.
Mrs x"Except that this claim about "male DNA" came from a boxing organisation that is not recognised by the Olympic Committee, and the claim they made has not been evidenced or even explained. Could we not have a little restraint before we start a witch hunt? This boxer doesn't even have an especially strong record, she's lost plenty of fights, so whatever her advantages might be they obviously aren't that powerful. | |||
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"It's a disgrace this woke bullshit is gone too far its disgusting they couldn't compete in the world championships 2023 any person transitioning thinking it's OK to play a physical sport against women is a fucking dickhead full stop,I see a few here blaming the russians
Sweet baby jesus. She's not trans.She's not trans but she male dna and produces high levels of chromosomes.
She's a woman but those two factors give her an unfair advantage over her competitors and she should be banned.
Mrs x
Except that this claim about "male DNA" came from a boxing organisation that is not recognised by the Olympic Committee, and the claim they made has not been evidenced or even explained.
Could we not have a little restraint before we start a witch hunt?
This boxer doesn't even have an especially strong record, she's lost plenty of fights, so whatever her advantages might be they obviously aren't that powerful."The IOC actually confirmed the IBAs ban of both boxers and gave this out in a press pack to the press at a press meeting, acknowledging the ban. This done despite the IOC hating the IBA. Also the main stream media have reported she has a form of DSD, which must have been fact checked, otherwise would be liable for claims of libel. The boxer herself has not disputed these claims or had an independant test performed to clear her name or used as evidence in an action against such mainstream media. I don't mean the Twitterati, I'm talking Sky news, CNN, Telegraph etc. So until proven otherwise I'll accept their version of the truth. Mrs x | |||
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"There’s a lot of fear mongering by the media. This person was born a female. They have ovaries, and can get pregnant. There was no test into their chromosomes like many were led to believe. The previous ban was due to excess testosterone levels, which they cannot control." She* | |||
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"It's a disgrace this woke bullshit is gone too far its disgusting they couldn't compete in the world championships 2023 any person transitioning thinking it's OK to play a physical sport against women is a fucking dickhead full stop,I see a few here blaming the russians
Sweet baby jesus. She's not trans.She's not trans but she male dna and produces high levels of chromosomes.
She's a woman but those two factors give her an unfair advantage over her competitors and she should be banned.
Mrs x
Except that this claim about "male DNA" came from a boxing organisation that is not recognised by the Olympic Committee, and the claim they made has not been evidenced or even explained.
Could we not have a little restraint before we start a witch hunt?
This boxer doesn't even have an especially strong record, she's lost plenty of fights, so whatever her advantages might be they obviously aren't that powerful.The IOC actually confirmed the IBAs ban of both boxers and gave this out in a press pack to the press at a press meeting, acknowledging the ban. This done despite the IOC hating the IBA.
Also the main stream media have reported she has a form of DSD, which must have been fact checked, otherwise would be liable for claims of libel. The boxer herself has not disputed these claims or had an independant test performed to clear her name or used as evidence in an action against such mainstream media. I don't mean the Twitterati, I'm talking Sky news, CNN, Telegraph etc.
So until proven otherwise I'll accept their version of the truth.
Mrs x"Sky news? Fact check? lmao | |||
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Whatever happened to people doing their own research? | |||
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Out of curiosity, given her supposedly incredible advantages over "Women", even though she is one herself, what's the story with her being beaten nine times by other women? Do we need to start accusing them of being men now as well? | |||
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